jake phelps
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- Aug 16, 2017
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How I get unprocessed silver containing American coins refined, smelted, poured and stamped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oY6Tax2Mnfc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oY6Tax2Mnfc
Complete Silver Refining Process Video
- Thread starter jake phelps
- Start date
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Topher_osAUrus
Well-known member
Just cementing on copper doesnt really make silver that pure.
Especially without multiple washing cycles. Sure, it raises the purity from 90% up quite a bit, but 98-99% is about the cap.
I dont think I would feel comfortable stamping any silver unless it went through a silver cell.
And even then, I would probably double check myself, by dissolving some of the crystals and making sure the silver nitrate is crystal clear.
Especially without multiple washing cycles. Sure, it raises the purity from 90% up quite a bit, but 98-99% is about the cap.
I dont think I would feel comfortable stamping any silver unless it went through a silver cell.
And even then, I would probably double check myself, by dissolving some of the crystals and making sure the silver nitrate is crystal clear.
jimdoc
Well-known member
Your stamp means nothing. The coins were more easily identified in a trusted state, and currently sell at a premium before your little project.
Where are you doing this?
Where are you doing this?
Topher_osAUrus
Well-known member
Okay
So, I actually watched all (thats a lie,I couldnt make it through half of it) the video now that I had time.
And, I feel a few things *MUST* be said.
**DON'T refine in your home!!!
Don't use mason jars, (Im sure some will argue you can)
-they just dont take change in temperature well, so eventually one will break and you will have acid all over your house! (For 30 grams of coin silver, yeah, my wife would kill me!)
2ounces of nitric sounds like a pretty big excess
1.22mL/g HNO3(nitric) + 1.22mL distilled H2O per gram
-this does not dissipate the copper from the coinage, it dissolves it, oxidizing the copper and silver.
Its not a liquid pure silver concentrate, it is a solution of copper ions and silver ions
-pure silver nitrate is clear
You dont need to "hurry here" and add all your nitric at once, wise men add small additions and let it work all it will before adding more
Again, its not pure in the solution, its mixed ions, nor is it pure silver concentrate..
Your coffee filters arent doing a lot.. Maybe removing course stuff, but the fines are undoubtedly going through it, which in turn is contaminating your "pure silver" that much more.
You shouldn't start cementing until its crystal clear (from filtration or letting it settle and siphoning off)
Your silver cement, needs to be washed and washed and washed again. Until the rinses are clear (with your poor practices, Im hesitant to tell you how to qualitatively test for copper ions, as you are an explosion waiting to happen)
When you "cleaned this" (your dissolution vessel) and dumped it down the sink, you probably tossed some silver down the drain.. Killing the good bacteria in your water treatment plant, same when you rinse your filtrate vessel out..
You notice how when you added all that tap water, your solution gained more turbidity? That is silver chloride being formed. You cant straight melt that..
You need to have your coil fully submerged, but not on the bottom. Copper oxide will flake off and contaminate your "pure silver" even more
How are you treating your waste solutions?
....im not even going to finish the video, this post is already of biblical length.. And I doubt you came here to learn, probably just spam your video to show off.
There are plenty of poor videos out on youtube as is, you should watch a couple that ARE GOOD, like from aquillarefining or sreetips, before trying to show your mad refining skillz to the world of people who want instant/quick results and even quicker gratification.. (Ergo, they will blindly follow you, the blind)
But first, you should stop hurting yourself and your house from the horrible fumes, and study the forum.. ...a lot...
This video should probably be removed to prevent people from getting hurt.
So, I actually watched all (thats a lie,I couldnt make it through half of it) the video now that I had time.
And, I feel a few things *MUST* be said.
**DON'T refine in your home!!!
Don't use mason jars, (Im sure some will argue you can)
-they just dont take change in temperature well, so eventually one will break and you will have acid all over your house! (For 30 grams of coin silver, yeah, my wife would kill me!)
2ounces of nitric sounds like a pretty big excess
1.22mL/g HNO3(nitric) + 1.22mL distilled H2O per gram
-this does not dissipate the copper from the coinage, it dissolves it, oxidizing the copper and silver.
Its not a liquid pure silver concentrate, it is a solution of copper ions and silver ions
-pure silver nitrate is clear
You dont need to "hurry here" and add all your nitric at once, wise men add small additions and let it work all it will before adding more
Again, its not pure in the solution, its mixed ions, nor is it pure silver concentrate..
Your coffee filters arent doing a lot.. Maybe removing course stuff, but the fines are undoubtedly going through it, which in turn is contaminating your "pure silver" that much more.
You shouldn't start cementing until its crystal clear (from filtration or letting it settle and siphoning off)
Your silver cement, needs to be washed and washed and washed again. Until the rinses are clear (with your poor practices, Im hesitant to tell you how to qualitatively test for copper ions, as you are an explosion waiting to happen)
When you "cleaned this" (your dissolution vessel) and dumped it down the sink, you probably tossed some silver down the drain.. Killing the good bacteria in your water treatment plant, same when you rinse your filtrate vessel out..
You notice how when you added all that tap water, your solution gained more turbidity? That is silver chloride being formed. You cant straight melt that..
You need to have your coil fully submerged, but not on the bottom. Copper oxide will flake off and contaminate your "pure silver" even more
How are you treating your waste solutions?
....im not even going to finish the video, this post is already of biblical length.. And I doubt you came here to learn, probably just spam your video to show off.
There are plenty of poor videos out on youtube as is, you should watch a couple that ARE GOOD, like from aquillarefining or sreetips, before trying to show your mad refining skillz to the world of people who want instant/quick results and even quicker gratification.. (Ergo, they will blindly follow you, the blind)
But first, you should stop hurting yourself and your house from the horrible fumes, and study the forum.. ...a lot...
This video should probably be removed to prevent people from getting hurt.
Jake,
I watched only the first few minutes of the video and turned it off, no disrespect Sir, but you have no clue of what your doing or the dangers involved. it is not worth my time to struggle through the rest of it. the terms used in your explanation were very confusing to me, as you were using terms that had nothing to do with what you were doing, or were completely different types of reactions...
Do not do this in your apartment or home.
If your using scientific terms, to try and explain something you are doing, you should at least understand what the words mean.
Those are the type of videos people watch and then come to the forum with nothing but misinformation, and who are poisoning themselves and others trying what someone on the internet claims they know how and attempt to teach it, then come here for us to deal with, or attempt to re-educate them, or that is giving our field of work a bad name, or worse could put all hobby refiners out of business....
Jake please put up the acid, before you harm yourself and your family, and learn to do it properly, you have a great opportunity here on the forum.
study the forum our new friend learn to do it right and safe.
I watched only the first few minutes of the video and turned it off, no disrespect Sir, but you have no clue of what your doing or the dangers involved. it is not worth my time to struggle through the rest of it. the terms used in your explanation were very confusing to me, as you were using terms that had nothing to do with what you were doing, or were completely different types of reactions...
Do not do this in your apartment or home.
If your using scientific terms, to try and explain something you are doing, you should at least understand what the words mean.
Those are the type of videos people watch and then come to the forum with nothing but misinformation, and who are poisoning themselves and others trying what someone on the internet claims they know how and attempt to teach it, then come here for us to deal with, or attempt to re-educate them, or that is giving our field of work a bad name, or worse could put all hobby refiners out of business....
Jake please put up the acid, before you harm yourself and your family, and learn to do it properly, you have a great opportunity here on the forum.
study the forum our new friend learn to do it right and safe.
rickbb
Well-known member
Topher_osAUrus said:
I second that, I only made it 10 seconds into the video. This is the Bernstein Bears way of how NOT to do things.
Doing acid and metal reactions in what looks like a 1 bedroom apartment? In the bathroom sink? No gloves? No protection or fume controls at all? Really?
Waste acid down the drain in an old building that has iron pipes? Your landlord is going to love you when your waste dumping eats through all the drain pipes and floods the whole building with sewer gases and worse.
Not to mention what will happen to you when the EPA or your local water plant people are going to do when they find out you are dumping dissolved heavy metals into the waste water stream. And they will find out, after all you did just put the only evidence they need on the internet for the whole world to see, and report you.
jake phelps
New member
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2017
- Messages
- 3
It DOES test darn near pure. No environment etc. was affected any more then when u start ur car in the am. Your right... no 1 should do this at home and theres a reason... not only is it dangerous if your not me but there is no way many could do it with the time and resources I didnt invest into it. (Not to mention It is my method) stop hating
[THREAD CLOSED]
[THREAD CLOSED]
jimdoc
Well-known member
jake phelps said:
Wow.
jimdoc
Well-known member
Why does Jake remind me of the guy who tested a bullet proof vest by having his girlfriend shoot him while he was wearing it? Youtube is so full of genius'.
It has nothing to do with hate, and everything to do with doing it correctly and safely.
Sorry, Jake, but your video does not pass on either front.
If you want to learn how to do things safely and correctly, this is the place for you. Leave your ego at the login screen. It will waiting when you log out.
Sorry, Jake, but your video does not pass on either front.
If you want to learn how to do things safely and correctly, this is the place for you. Leave your ego at the login screen. It will waiting when you log out.
Topher_osAUrus
Well-known member
jake phelps said:
Your method eh?
Pretty sure displacement reactions have been around for longer than the earth has been round..
And your other video, where you have to "hurry" because of the NO2 gasses formed.. You know what nitrocellulose is?
...you know how its made?
Your house is becoming a tinderbox soaked in accelerant.
Hating? No, far from it.. We here actually respect the science, those that dont, quickly find that she is a cruel unforgiving mistress. So that "hate" you think you are picking up, is more concern for your well being.
I would be willing to bet your "pure" silver is barely purer than the 90% you started with.
How are you testing it?
Are you just basing it off weight? Because with your practices, probably 10 grams is lost in the shuffle.
....I cant believe gsp hasnt replied to this sad silver recovery.
Topher_osAUrus
Well-known member
jimdoc said:
Ah, the "hold my beer and watch this" scientific approach.
A classic.
How many nines is "darn near"? Just curious.
Does this mean it isn't dangerous for you? Are you immune to the ill's that would befall anyone else using your process in the bathroom sink?
So you're saying that if you put next to no money into the procedure, then the environmental and safety issues shouldn't be of any concern?
This is true, it is your method because you chose to ignore a few minor details which would have improved your process. But Hey! it is your procedure!
If we were hating, we would have very little concern for your obvious lack of concern for your own safety or the impact your process has on your health and the environment. I think it is quite the opposite.
upcyclist
Well-known member
I'm not sure if we'll see you here again, but if you do return, consider this: Safe practices will also make you more efficient. You'll use less acid, pay more attention to your procedures, etc.
You started out with about 30g of .900 silver coinage. That means you should have finished with 27g of silver. You ended up with about 20g, or a 26% loss. Don't you want to minimize those losses, for no other reason than to make more money? Then by all means, stick around and learn.
You started out with about 30g of .900 silver coinage. That means you should have finished with 27g of silver. You ended up with about 20g, or a 26% loss. Don't you want to minimize those losses, for no other reason than to make more money? Then by all means, stick around and learn.
jimdoc
Well-known member
upcyclist said:
I don't think I could stand the presence of this Youtube genius here.
I can't believe I watched as much of his video as I did.
Do you really think he would last long here anyway?
upcyclist
Well-known member
Not really--but it's worth a shot to attempt to save his girlfriend and neighbors from his mad sciencejimdoc said:
jimdoc
Well-known member
upcyclist said:Not really--but it's worth a shot to attempt to save his girlfriend and neighbors from his mad sciencejimdoc said:
And all the people on Youtube that stumble across his "tutorial".
He thinks we are jealous haters, and has probably already dismissed our comments.
jake phelps
New member
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2017
- Messages
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You started out with about 30g of .900 silver coinage. That means you should have finished with 27g of silver. You ended up with about 20g, or a 26% loss. Don't you want to minimize those losses, for no other reason than to make more money? Then by all means, stick around and learn.
yes! finally!... buggs the crap out of me! Thought was because... just the rag tag operation... trying to minimize that... by changing very little... if possible...
yes! finally!... buggs the crap out of me! Thought was because... just the rag tag operation... trying to minimize that... by changing very little... if possible...
Topher_osAUrus
Well-known member
jake phelps said:
A lot needs to be changed.
Your losses come from silver chloride during dilution.
Melting it causes volatization of more silver.
It also may not have all cemented out of solution on your "helix coil". I usually let mine cement a few hours, clean up that bit of silver. Then let the rest cement for a couple days. (the last part is what will have the pgms, if any)
Your flux you are using, if it has a nitrate in it, you could be oxidizing some silver and getting it caught in the slag as well.
You also dumped silver down the drain, there is some.
upcyclist
Well-known member
You have the basic reactions down for cementing on copper, but there are some tweaks you'll need to do. You also have some major safety issues to look at--like moving all of your operations out of your living space, with the exception of the stamping, which was ironically the only thing you did outdoors.jake phelps said:
Some of your silver was also left behind in your filter paper and on your gloves--instead of trying to pick up globs of silver cement, you can just let the silver dry in the filter paper, then put it all in the crucible. The flux (all you need is a pinch of boric acid, really) will take care of the filter paper. Letting it dry also keeps some of the silver from flying off your crucible when you superheat the water that was there.
Edit to add: Alternately, after rinsing your cemented silver extremely well in the beaker and letting it settle ("rinse, repeat"), you could put it in a drying dish. Then from the dish to the crucible, never using any filter paper.
