Questions about AP

Hello everyone. I have started some pins in acid peroxide. I got a batch in a 5 gallon bucket with a lid on loosely. My question lies in the understanding I keep it at room temp. I only have a open carport that I intend to close in, and a shed with gets hotter than hell. I put the bucket in the open carport so it at least has shade. But by chance it does dissolve some gold and I test w/ positive results, can I percipitate it out w/ sodium metabisulfate. Does the addition of peroxide add any challanges for filtering. Thanks yall, DAN

Dan,

Just be sure to filter the solution good before you percipitate. SMB works just the same. Test a small sample to get the feel of it.

Steve

Test a small sample to get the feel of it.

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Does this mean that the amount SMB used is different or does the peroxide affect the way the reaction works?

This way you learn things that you don't anticipate without screwing up your whole batch. The solution may need to be diluted or maybe it needs more acid. Look before you leap... Don't put all your eggs in one basket... etc..

Steve

Where can I get your thinking cap from? :wink:

firedan525 said:

Where can I get your thinking cap from? :wink:

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:lol: I've been wondering the same thing! (I come up with some stupid thoughts on here, Steve's quick to get me back in line though.. )

Well I used 2 big bottles of peroxide, and 1 gallon of HCL. I checked on it a few minutes ago. It has been 1 day and flake is coming off by the truckload and the pins are dissolving nicely, base metal turning black, but no fizzing. Is this just a slow process and how do I know if I need to amp up my solution w/ more juice? Thanks alot, DAN

Dan,

If the solution forms a colored salt on the surface like this:



Add 2 cups of muriatic acid. The bubbles are because I just agitated the batch.

If the solution darkens to a near black add 2 cups of peroxide to make it lighten up. This will produce heat and some more bubbles. The bubbles are just the peroxide and are not necessarily an indication of the reaction in this situation.

If you are using the proper 3 gallon semi-transparent reaction vessel you can lift it up (don't spill it on your head or drop it!!) and look thru the bottom at your mash of gold flake and foils. You will most likely see a lot of off white powder as well.

Steve

I drilled the holes as specified into the bottom of the 3 gallon bucket. I placed the bucket into a five gallon bucket, and added the pins to the 3 gallon. Added AP and now a day later its black and cannot see bottom. There is however a huge amount of flake floating around that you can't miss. I will add 2 cups peroxide and see if that clears it up. Question, is the 3 gallon bucket allowed to rest on the bottom of the 5 gallon bucket? And what is the make up of the off white powder you spoke of in the last post? Thanks alot? I get this done right the first time and understand the reaction taking place and I'm good. Thanks alot , DAN

Yes the bucket can rest in the bottom of the other. The black is really a dark green that's okay. I would only add a cup not two. The reason is because the extra peroxide may cause the gold to dissolve into the solution. The object is not to dissolve the gold, but to recovery the nearly pure foils to be processed in the refining step.

The off-white powder is typically base metal compounds (copper chloride mostly). It will all dissolve when you do the final HCl washes. You know it's all out when the HCl rinse no longer turns dark green or black. Lastly you follow up with several tap water rinses until the last one comes out perfectly clear.

Steve

Thanks, you know i'm sure you have run across stubborn flake that seems like it doest want to settle. Kinda suspended or floats. I pulled the inside bucket out slowly and I noticed that I still have alot of flake that wont go through the strainer and or getting caught on the gob of pins. Should I rinse what may be left over w/ HCL to get all the flake when I'm done, and how should I go aboutdropping all the floating or suspended flakes? Thanks again, DAN

Dan,

Here's the cleanup routine:

Cleanup

Here's another point to remember:

Additional Notes

You should also become familiar with the information in this thread:

Basic Information

Let me know if you get lost.

Steve

WOW, thats great. I print out information like that and put it in a folder with the highlighted topic for future reference. Thanks again, DAN

Hey Steve I wonder if you could reconnect the links in this thread? Thanks Mike

Cleanup

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=3263&highlight=#3263

Additional Notes

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=3363&highlight=#3363

Basic Information

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=2782&highlight=#2782

This process really seems like a pain, so why doesn't everyone just use the sulfuric cell?

Thanks Palladium.

lasereyes said:

This process really seems like a pain, so why doesn't everyone just use the sulfuric cell?

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Perhaps you have not dealt with the hassles of electric with anodes and cathodes, not to mention concentrated sulfuric acid and the gold clean-up from it. Short of cheap nitric acid I prefer AP to a sulfuric acid de-plating cell if you are to judge the 2 on labor needs alone.

Make no mistake, refining is work. There is no free ride.

Sorry about that.

I fixed the originals.


Steve

Oz said:

lasereyes said:

This process really seems like a pain, so why doesn't everyone just use the sulfuric cell?

Click to expand...

Perhaps you have not dealt with the hassles of electric with anodes and cathodes, not to mention concentrated sulfuric acid and the gold clean-up from it. Short of cheap nitric acid I prefer AP to a sulfuric acid de-plating cell if you are to judge the 2 on labor needs alone.

Make no mistake, refining is work. There is no free ride.

Click to expand...

I still think that sulfuric acid is better when you take into waste management into account. It is also probably more economical, considering that you can reuse most of the acid...