Need advice & Questions (Beginner)

Hello everyone,

Firstly, I would like to introduce myself, I'm Evrim, 19 years old born and raised in Holland . I want to start soon with recovering golds from CPU pins, I did a investigation for how can I do this work, so it will be my first time. Therefore you will make me very happy if you can give some short advices about this work. I have some questions in my mind, really it will be good if you can help me. As some questions that I will ask you:

- How many milliliters should I use for Hydrogen Peroxide (3%) and Muriatic Acid 20 Be (31%)? Can we understand with 3:1 ratio that it is 300 ml Muriatic acid and 100 ml Hydrogen acid/ peroxide?

- Is it required to use Hot plate after adding the pins to the flask? If so, how long will I have to wait with hot plate? What can I later do with flask on hot plate when it’s finished with waiting?

- What type of water should I use for a wash bottle? Can I use tap water?

- Is Urea needed for neutralize the remaining nitric acid? If so, how much should I add Urea in the flask?

Please forgive me if I did bother you.

Thanks so much in advance.

Evrim said:

Hello everyone,

Firstly, I would like to introduce myself, I'm Evrim, 19 years old born and raised in Holland . I want to start soon with recovering golds from CPU pins, I did a investigation for how can I do this work, so it will be my first time. Therefore you will make me very happy if you can give some short advices about this work. I have some questions in my mind, really it will be good if you can help me. As some questions that I will ask you:

- How many milliliters should I use for Hydrogen Peroxide (3%) and Muriatic Acid 20 Be (31%)? Can we understand with 3:1 ratio that it is 300 ml Muriatic acid and 100 ml Hydrogen acid/ peroxide?

- Is it required to use Hot plate after adding the pins to the flask? If so, how long will I have to wait with hot plate? What can I later do with flask on hot plate when it’s finished with waiting?

- What type of water should I use for a wash bottle? Can I use tap water?

- Is Urea needed for neutralize the remaining nitric acid? If so, how much should I add Urea in the flask?

Please forgive me if I did bother you.

Thanks so much in advance.

Click to expand...

would be more like 300 ml Muriatic acid and 10 ml Hydrogen acid/ peroxide
heat can be used but very low heat (aquarium heater)

hot plate is fine when using AR

tap water is not a problem working with AP (Acid/ Peroxide). distilled water for use with nitric acid or AR (Aqua Regia)

here on the forum we do not suggest using urea in any way. sulfamic acid is the preferred neutraliser for nitric acid

hope this helps.

it's also suggested that you read this if you have not already done so. http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=19074

Dave C.

EDIT: added link and suggestion to follow link.

Hello Evrim and welcome to the forum.

From the question you ask I can tell that you have only scattered pieces of knowledge. You need to study more before you do any experimenting.

A few important things first...
Never put a bottle directly on a heat source, you can break it from thermal stresses. Always use a heat spreader or a sand bath to lessen the shock.
Never use acids inside, any metal will rust and you can damage your or others lungs. Always work in a fume hood or outside with the wind from the side to keep fumes away.

What method you should use for recovery and refining depends on the scrap you have. Acid-peroxide is good for copper based scrap as fingers. There isn't a set ratio for it and the method should really be called copper chloride process as that is what the active ingredient is. Peroxide isn't even needed, use a bubbler and air instead.

When working with silver nitrate you probably need distilled water for washing and diluting, in other cases tap water usually works.

Urea isn't needed. Read up on denoxing solutions if you are working with nitric acid and aqua regia. But you can get away without nitric acid too, using chlorine and HCl. It's all on the forum but it will take some work to find it. While you are researching you will find a lot more information that you didn't know you would need but later on it will help you out.

As a basic course you should read Hoke, "Refining Precious Metal Wastes", you'll find it on the forum as a download.
Read it, it will help you understand our answers next time you need help.

I see Necromancer beat me to the answer but I'm posting this as well.

Göran

Hello Evrim!
Welcome to our forum! Before you open chemicals and start trying to recover gold there are some things that are nessesary. You must spend some time here educating yourself so that you can understand what you are about to do, why you are doing it and what is actually going on in the flask, And, how to do it safely. You must understand what to do when things go wrong or if an accident happens and how to treat the wastes/ left overs to make them safe for disposal.
You can't watch a youtube video and then start recovering gold! That can end in loosing your health or your life! A lung full of Chlorine or the fumes from nitric acid will kill you!
We can tell by the questions that you asked that you are not ready yet. You can begin by downloading a free copy of C.M.Hoke's book here on the forum. Study her book. You can also take the tour of the forum to learn how things work here. and one of the most important is to go to our safety section. After you do your part educating yourself in the basics and safety you will have the understanding you need to begin. We will be here to help you along the way when you need it.
For an example; you don't premix AR or the HCl and H2O2. Doing that will cause problems that you don't know about yet and your work will end in failure.
As you do your reading and learning keep collecting more scrap.
I am looking forward to seeing your first gold!
Good luck!
artart47

My Friends!
I must be a very slow keyboarder! When I went to respond to his post, there were no others and by the time I hit the submit you beat me to it. Wasen't trying to cover what you guys said! HaHa!
artart47

To me you are confusing AR with AP, you mention muriatic acid and hydrogen peroxide + hot plate + urea to neutralize...

Hello everyone ,

I am very grateful for all of you. i will take your advice seriously.

artart47 said:

Hello Evrim!

For an example; you don't premix AR or the HCl and H2O2. Doing that will cause problems that you don't know about yet and your work will end in failure.

artart47

Click to expand...

Dear Artart47, thank you for your response

But if I don't premix AR with HCl and H2O2, but only HCI and H2O2 with each other. Is that enough? If not so, how can I make an aqua regia for resolve golds ?

Please take some more time reading. Many of your questions and statements don,t make sens.
You don't mix AR with HCl and hidrogen peroxide.
When you use HCl and H2O2 you don't have any remaining nitric acid to neutralize.
You do not RESOLVE gold
...

Evrim,
You are confused here. (AP) is Hydrochloric Acid plus Hydrogen Peroxide - (AR) is Hydrochloric Acid plus Nitric Acid. Use the search function to research each one of these. They are two different processes used in different ways, for different material.
Ken

Evrim

Here is a link to the down loadable book by C.M. Hokes that Goran said to read

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=19798 (the book is provided ether screen readable or print friendly at the bottom of FrugalRefiners post)

This book is a "must" read for beginners that want to get into refining

Kurt

jeneje said:

Evrim,
You are confused here. (AP) is Hydrochloric Acid plus Hydrogen Peroxide - (AR) is Hydrochloric Acid plus Nitric Acid. Use the search function to research each one of these. They are two different processes used in different ways, for different material.
Ken

Click to expand...

Ooh I see
Indeed I'm still a beginner, therefore please forgive me if I did bother you all. Thanks so much guys. Of course I should take some more time reading about this work.
Evrim

Evrim said:

jeneje said:

Evrim,
You are confused here. (AP) is Hydrochloric Acid plus Hydrogen Peroxide - (AR) is Hydrochloric Acid plus Nitric Acid. Use the search function to research each one of these. They are two different processes used in different ways, for different material.
Ken

Click to expand...

Ooh I see
Indeed I'm still a beginner, therefore please forgive me if I did bother you all. Thanks so much guys. Of course I should take some more time reading about this work.
Evrim

Click to expand...

Evrim, it is no bother, we all want you to learn, the best way here at GRF is to read threads about what you are trying to do. AP is more for recovery an AR is a refining process. HNO3 (Nitric) is used to remove base metals so is AP, what i am getting at here is different chemicals weather mixed or not are used for different things in the recovery and refining of precious metals. I did not mean to insult you in any way. Just trying to point you in the right direction.

Good luck,
Ken
edited to add Not, i have got to start proof reading. :roll:

jeneje said:

the best way here at GRF is to read threads about what you are trying to do.

Click to expand...

Yes but I'd also suggest to use keywords search along author search. I'd suggest you reading what freechemist, Lou, Harold_V, butcher, goldsilverpro, Palladium, lazersteve ... have to say about it. On the same thread you will also find g_axelsson, solar, Frugal, Irons, Geo, patnor101 and many other knowledgeable members' replies.

P.S.: Apologies if I've forgotten other great members.

Edit: added PS.