• If you have bought, sold or gained information from our Classifieds, please donate to Gold Refining Forum and give back.

    You can become a Supporting Member or just click here to donate.

Start Up Business Plan Template

Gold Refining Forum

Help Support Gold Refining Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

kevin faust

Active member
Joined
Jul 26, 2010
Messages
25
Location
Lompoc, CA
I have been having a real problem finding any type of steady work here in California for the last couple of years, I am beginning to think it is age related (can’t prove though, by saying that I sound crazy); maybe what my previous wages were is also part of the problem (made to much money).

I have been thinking about starting a business with this local Asset Liquidation Auction House, which deals with e-waste. I was thinking of starting a precious metal recovery/refining service with the owner. I already talked about it with the owner who is interested, but would like to see a business plan first, which is completely logical.

Therefore, I was wondering if anyone on this site could help me save on research time and money, by letting me use their business plan if they have one, I would only use as a reference guide only to get started. I realize that every state has different rules, laws and regulations especially here in good old California, I cannot reiterate enough how I would only use it as a guide to write my own business plan.

I have a friend who has a degree in environmental science, who I am hoping will also, give me some advice. However, I first need to come up with a business plan, which is a real pain in that protrusion three feet below our heads, especially when starting from scratch.

If this is acceptable, please contact me through my email so we can discuss any concerns, you may have. You can find my email me through my profile. Any help is truly appreciated.

And thank you.

Kevin
 
I would expect that in this business plan he will want to know your experience,and want to see some of the precious metals that you have recovered.You should get all that figured out first,so you know what your capabilities will be,and be able to prove it.I think it is a good idea,but looking at your few posts,I am wondering if you are ready for a deal like this.I am not trying to talk you out of your plan,just saying that you may have some smaller steps to take before making a big step.

Jim
 
You make a very good point Jim, however any good business plan can take months to complete, especially when you are dealing with the state and federal EPA rules and regulations. This does not mean that you should stop working towards that goal. Many pieces of the puzzle need to be considered when starting a business and the business plan is the heart and brain of that business.

So it is important to create goals, these goals are very important in life, they give us something to work towards, and they help us get up in the morning when we feel like life has taken a wrong turn. Life’s goals help drive us, they give us confidence and self respect, they also help us to imagine what it will be like when we reach that goal.

Albert Einstein once said, “Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited to all we now know and understand, while imagination embraces the entire world, and all there ever will be to know and understand.”

For me life is about forward motion, that forward motion can travel in several different directions at the same time, especially when you have a lot of free time on hand because you cannot find work. With proper time management, anything can be accomplished with the right attitude.

You just need to believe and trust in yourself.

Thank you Jim for the advice, any advice is better no advice.

Kevin
 
kevin faust said:
Albert Einstein once said, “Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited to all we now know and understand, while imagination embraces the entire world, and all there ever will be to know and understand.”


Kevin

He also said: The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits.
 
Someone also once said’

“Keep your dreams alive. Understand to achieve anything requires faith and belief in yourself, vision, hard work, determination, and dedication. Remember all things are possible for those who believe.”

I suppose we can throw quotes back and forth forever, but it comes down to is my belief in myself, and I have a lot of faith in myself. So if anyone out there would like to give me a hand. Well then thank you, if not well that is ok as well.

It will just take me a little longer to make it happen but it will.

Kevin
 
kevin faust said:
Someone also once said’

“Keep your dreams alive. Understand to achieve anything requires faith and belief in yourself, vision, hard work, determination, and dedication. Remember all things are possible for those who believe.”

I suppose we can throw quotes back and forth forever, but it comes down to is my belief in myself, and I have a lot of faith in myself. So if anyone out there would like to give me a hand. Well then thank you, if not well that is ok as well.

It will just take me a little longer to make it happen but it will.

Kevin

I don't think anyone is not willing to help you. You are asking such a broad question.

What type of material are you going to be processing?

E-waste can be from military surplus to just printers and everything in between. You need to question the gentelman you are working with and get an idea of what type of material you will be working with.

Do you know what process you are going to be useing on your material?
Do you know how much per lb or your chemcal will cost?
Do you know how much chemical it takes to process a fiber chip versus a Pentium Pro?
What are you going to process your material in?
How are you going to move your material from one process to another?
Are you going to use air pump's, impeler type pump's, vacume pump's?
Where you are located what type of electrical service do you have?
Can it handle the operation?
How will you handle the waste?
How will you handle the fumes?
How much space are you going to need?
What type of building are you going to use?
Are you going to rent, lease or buy?
Then you have insurance on the building. Theft, liability, fire
What about workers?
Then you will have to deal with social security, unemplyment tax state & federal(and if I'm correct if you are self employed and you go belly up you can't go draw unemplayement), IRS, state, workmans comp, general liability ins.
What requirement's does your local city code, state code, federal have for what you are doing?
Property taxes?
Utilities and other daily expenses.


This just barely touches the surface of what you will want to look at in your buisness plan.

Now once you put this on paper can you look the man in the eye and say I can do this.

The only person that will know the answer to that you look at in the mirror in the morning.

Just because you put something on paper dose not mean you can acomplish it!
 
Barren, you have some relevant questions. I do not believe this to be a broad question. If anyone out there has started a precious metals recycling business for themselves. They would have had to answer these types of questions in their business plan. This is why I posted the question.

I never said that no one is unwilling to help me; I only posted this quarry today. If no one has the information, I am looking for and wishes not to provide that information then so be it, I understand peoples need for privacy. However, this is a good source to try first nevertheless.


Just because you put something on paper dose not mean you can acomplish it!

Also the above quote, is this a normal quote that is added to your replies when you post, or was it a direct response to my post? If so, I do not believe it to be an accurate statement, if someone puts something on paper, than it should be considered a binding agreement or contract for that person, by suggesting that it is not would be misleading, and should not have been put there to begin with.

I believe this to be the number one flaw with today’s economy; too many businesses are saying one thing yet doing something else. If you are going to start a business in today’s economy more businesses need to say what they do, and do what you say.


Kevin
 
Kevin,
The question you asked is broad, because all those questions posted by Barren
will have different answers for everybody.Your answers to those questions are
all that is important for you at this time and what you should post so that maybe someone can offer you better advice.Somebody else's answers to those questions
cannot be adapted for your business plan.It may help you build your own plan.
But you should answer all the questions in a post here,so people can understand
your needs in business plan.

Jim
 
The statement was to mean that just because you put it on paper does not mean you can acomplish it.

Have you done any refining?
Have you messed with any of these chemicals?
Have you seen any of the run away reactions that can take place when you do not know what you are doing?

Have you ever run a business?

You can get help here you just need to be a little more direct in what you want to know.
 
Jim,
Thank you for your response.

I am a firm believer in the KIS (Keep It Simple) process. I have worked in Quality Assurance for twenty years now as a mechanical and electrical senior inspector, and have discovered in all that time that things do not need to be so complicated.

I did not say I was going to use this business plan to start my own business. I was only asking for a business plan so I could use it as a reference document.

This is not a broad or difficult request, I do not want to spend hours on any forum asking and answering long drawn out questions so that a quorum can be held on the topic.

You are right Barren has a good point, but I do not think answering 19 questions on this forum would be an effiecnt use of time. If I am unable to get the information I need here, I will utilize his suggested questions as a good starting point for my business plan and just go on researching my idea, it will take longer but patience is a virtue.

If someone wishes to have a one on one conversation with me as a mentor, I would certainly welcome the opportunity.

Again thank you all for your help and advice.

Kevin
 
The questions I pointed out was for your consideration in what you need to put into your buisness plan.

A business paln is not that difficult to do I just gave you a lot of the stuff you need to include in it.

Your plan should include:
What you are processing.
How much over a given period of time you are processing.
What your startup cost will be.
What your expected income will be.
Where will you get your product.
How will you market your final product.
What are your expenses.
What is your expected profit.

Hope this helps.

http://www.myownbusiness.org/course_list.html
 
Kevin you seem to have found a good start for your business having a possible partner who can supply the material to refine and or trade. Refining isn't for everyone and in e scrap it can be really hard to make money from unless you have huge volumes and even then it might well be better to grade and sell the scrap as is,check out e bay. IMHO the first thing for you to do is find out what's happening to the scrap at present and see if there's a more profitable way to dispose of it, cut the fingers off the boards , remove any visible gold pins contacts and the CPUs , bulk the balance and sell direct to a large refiner and go watch the processing or pay a company to do so,there was a really good post on sampling by 4metals or GSP some time ago ( apologies if I accredit the wrong member ). This is a huge question you have asked and everyone will have a different approach as many members are home / hobby refiners their approach might not apply to a commercial set up. If the volumes are really large enough you might well be better off approaching one of our professional members and paying for their help/advice to set up processing and recovery methods. The 2 above members leap to mind if this is going to be your approach. Hope this helps , but if you read all the posts about e scrap you will realise it's a huge learning curve and I doubt if anyone can give you a definitive way to proceed.
 
Barren,
The responses I have been receiving since this initial post has not been very encouraging. This I believe to be a prime example of my earlier post “Just an Observation”. The way some members have initially responded to this post might appear to some as disparaging and negative.

I saw throughout this site when reading some other new members posts, this same type of communicative behavior. It is not that way with most of them, but there does seem to be a form of annoyance with the questions some new members appear to ask. I believe it is better to give the new members some much-needed latitude and patience, until they are better acquainted with this site and some of the more dangerous processes.

However, this is not what I have read in some of these posts, including the current post of mine. When I go back and review some of the responses, none of them is addressing my initial inquiry. Except maybe yours, it appears they are more interested in my qualifications than anything else, I get the impression they are assuming that I am a complete idiot, who has no idea or experience of what I am trying to accomplish.

Did you know that they treated Henry Ford that same way when he first came up with his production line idea to build cars. They also thought that way about Thomas Edison; he only had to try his light bulb out how many numerous times before he got that one right. We also must not forget Abraham Lincoln and his Emancipation Proclamation; well they do say that is partially the reason for his assassination.

So my point being why do people want to automatically assume that just maybe I’m trying to do something that might just be beyond my experience and training, when they don’t know me from Adam.

As to some of your questions, yes, I am quite aware of the safety concerns when working with any type of dangerous chemical. Working in the Missile, Aerospace, and Aircraft industries. As well as the Manufacturing industry for over twenty years, on such programs as the Atlas II, IIAS, IIAR, III and IV, and the Titan II, III & IV rockets with their hyperbolic fuels. Which are very dangerous and nasty to work with, which included Liquid Nitrogen (N2), Liquid Oxygen (LO2), liquid Hydrazine (N2H2), Hydrogen and RP-1 rocket fuels, you learn to respect these types of chemicals and fuels real fast or you die from cancer like my dad who worked with them for 35 years.

I also spent ten years in the US Navy working on the flight deck of Aircraft Carriers. Working with aircraft fuels, LOX and some of the Navy’s other wonderful chemicals like Polyurethane, Alodine, Freon,Touline, MEK and Trichlorofluoroethane to name a few. Our all time favorite was mixing dry Alodine with polyurethane thinner which by the way can make a really hot and fast burning fire if you’re not careful, magnesium fires are the worst though, we had to get them off the ship fast or it could burn a hole right through the deck, to the bottom of the ocean.

We had one sailor who loved to play with the LOX; we would always find dead frogs in our desk drawers, which is disgusting. We also used to like to step on the little bubbles that roll around in the bottom of the drip pan we used when we serviced the aircraft arto bottles, which held the pilots oxygen. Until I saw “Man from LOX”, after that video, I had a completely new respect for that stuff.


Oh and for those of you, who might find this navy training film upsetting I wouldn’t watch it.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ob98v2dEL_s[/youtube]

Enough of my ramblings, until tomorrow.

Kevin
 
I do like his resolve. 8)

We’re not trying to single you out or anything Kevin we are just trying to make sure that you understand the overwhelming scope of what you are suggesting. Your right a business plan might be your first step, but after that comes so much more. You mentioned that you were unemployed or something like that i think. In the state of Cal. the EPA permits alone will run you thousands and let’s not even talk paperwork to get there. The point i'm trying to make is for the time and large capital investment that it would take just to start to even get your idea to materialize, that you might be better off doing something like brokering the scrap for him at first. Taking a cut to fund your future research into this field while you get a feel for this business and make some contacts. You got all the buyers you need right here for your funding and education.
 
Palladium said:
I do like his resolve. 8)
Having personally experienced the illegal, but still VERY common age discrimination issue, I can understand kevin's resolve
but also his frustration. A few beliefs we grew up with that were true then but are NOT today - "My Dad always used to say..."
1. if you want to work, you can always find a job." Not true anymore, as unemployment figures rise
2. A lower price (or younger employyee) may turn their heads at first, but they will always come back to experience & quality." One word - "Walmart".
And the list could go on, ad infinitum ad nauseum.
When it seems you've been knocked around & disrespected at every turn, you can get a little hypervigilant to prevent it happening again. Then, seeing what's available on this site for free gives a person hope.

I did learn, though, that hope & resolve are not, in themselves enough, Kevin, which is why so many here, I believe, are in their ways, trying to cut out thru the Tony Robbins to get to the Lee Iacocca (does that date me?). He took what he knew & put it with what he needed to learn & then set himself to it, and turned GM around.

We’re not trying to single you out or anything Kevin we are just trying to make sure that you understand the overwhelming scope of what you are suggesting. Your right a business plan might be your first step, but after that comes so much more. You mentioned that you were unemployed or something like that i think. In the state of Cal. the EPA permits alone will run you thousands and let’s not even talk paperwork to get there. The point i'm trying to make is for the time and large capital investment that it would take just to start to even get your idea to materialize, that you might be better off doing something like brokering the scrap for him at first. Taking a cut to fund your future research into this field while you get a feel for this business and make some contacts. You got all the buyers you need right here for your funding and education.

That being said, I would reccommend caution in going into business with anyone, in this game. If this guy needs an outlet for his waste, it shouldn't make that much difference to him how you go about it ("I just want to make sure my junk is being nurtured & respected!") & a look at your business plan may be his way of cutting out the middleman (You). Start with each process here, start small & ask a lot of questions, & then do it till you know the reactions inside & out, good & bad. You may find that the designation "hobbyist" (depends on the state, sometimes) may be enough to care for your needs without all the headaches my fellow members are pointing out to you.

hang in there & good luck.

just my dos centavos.
jordan
 
If I were writing up a business plan it would not be for actually refining the e-waste as I truly believe the majority of the methods used by forum members on e-scrap are not cost effective on the larger scale of things. Sure it is smart to pick off the high grade circuitry and produce a pile which can be refined in a cost effective manner but that will only include the older hybrid circuits and computer boards. Most of the newer scrap, contains far less precious metals and wet processing is not cost effective.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't get involved in the process, but if it were me I would concentrate on preparing the material for processing and sampling at a large refinery and witnessing the entire process to assure you are receiving a fair shake. The value of this forum for you in the sampling scenario is that many members process small quantities of boards and post the yields. You can develop an accurate system of valuing the material before you ship it to be processed. If you break the materials down into materials that will behave well in stream sampling, you will be able to get a cost effective return for your material. Most refiners today either do the repping method or incinerate and produce a refiners bar of copper based bullion for outside refining combined with a low grade powdered "pulp" again for outside refining.

The key to profitability is sampling and the ability to quantify your yields, it is a service you can provide and profit from as well. Over a year ago I posted on the forum the guidelines for witnessing material at an outside refinery, if you find and read that posting it details what you will be up against. There is an entire industry set up just to do what I'm talking about, witnessing other peoples material at refiners, usually they bill $400 to $500 per day for their services. That could be you Kevin, all you have to do is learn the rules.

As far as a business plan, you should tout your ability to segregate the materials in a fashon to maximize his payout. As the money rolls in from the outside refiners you can begin to do some of the pre processing such as granulating and shredding with equipment you purchase from the larger profits you make because you go to watch the processing. I would sell your ability to prevent him from being duped by whomever is processing his scrap and parlay that into a pre refining operation with sorting and separation of the non or low paying components as the cash from your talents begin to pay off.
 
Kevin,
Here is your post from Sept 1st,just a few days ago;
Steve,
Thank you for the information, I have been unable to produce any nitric acid so for, I am new at this, so I am taking things very careful. Maybe I am being a little too careful. I am someone who needs to be comfortable with the process before I get too far in over my head. I read some of these posts and get confused sometimes due to all the different processes that can be used to extract the gold. I am trying to determine the best method for me, which is taking some time. I hope to have some results soon. Right now, I am building up some stock and stripping down electronic components so I know what is good for gold extraction and what trash.

Thanks for the help.


Kevin
Saftey Always Comes First


So how is anybody wrong for assuming you are rushing things a bit,you had 14 posts when this thread started.You were looking for a shortcut to save time and money,which usually brings problems.This post said that you couldn't find nitric,and now you are ready to start a precious metals recovery business with somebody.You need to open your eyes and ears to the advice you are being given,and stop acting like everybody is against you.
I wish you luck in your venture.I was just saying this is not an easy hobby for most of us.It is fun,but when you consider all the work and cost of equipment and safety concerns,it is not for everybody.Now talking on a business scale,it is much more
difficult.It can be done,but it takes time and money,both of the things you were trying to save at the beginning of this post.
And most of all it takes experience.You can take a shortcut to that experience by learning what all the experts have shared here,as well as everybody who shared their mistakes.
That is all my advice,that you can take or not.I didn't mean to insult you,or make it sound like you can't do what you want to do.I am just trying to give a heads up to how many problems you could run into by rushing things,not put an end to your dream.

Jim
.
 
Palladian, Jordan, 4metals, Jim and others,

I want to thank you all for your advice and suggestions, this gives me a lot to think about and consider. The person I talked to about going into business is currently a state certified e-collector with permits from the EPA, which takes care of that aspect.

Palladium and 4metals make an interesting suggestion about focusing on preparing and processing the scrap material for him, which could interim increase profits and give me some added experience, skill and a job. Therefore, maybe it’s not about a business plan, and more about a contracted position.

When I was pitching my initial idea, the owner told me this story about how he placed a bid at this auction, on a particular piece of equipment and was a little upset when he was out bid. The winning bidder noticed his discomfort and explained to him why he bid on this item so vigorously. It turned out that object in question was loaded with over $25,000 worth of platinum wire.

This is a prime example of the type of service I could offer this owner. This would require less training and capital to start. I already have quite a bit of experience verifying material manufacturing processes. I might even be able to convince the business owner to cover a metal testing kit or I could even make my own kit if possible (need to do more research on that aspect) and contract myself out to other customers.

With my years of experience in sampling and quantifying the type of materials used in the manufacturing process, I could help maximize his profits and get compensation in the form of bonuses. Also what do you all think might be considered a reasonable percentage to request, or is it best to not broach such an idea?

I have started reviewing some items which would come in handy to provide this type of service, like metal identification test kits. Is here anyone out there who has used this type of equipment in the past and can recommend something? I believe a kit like this could help verify metal content for a particular scrap item.

I knew you all could help; it just took a little patience and swallowing my ego. I do apologize if I insulted or stepped on anyone’s toes in my responses. I am not one who expects to get something without first investigating all the steps needed to get there.

I believe my initial post was more of a prospecting approach, to see where that gold might be hiding, just like when you survey a river to see where the best place is to start panning.

Well thank you all for some great ideas and advice it is deeply appreciated.

Kevin
 
Kevin, you did not mention what form or sort of material you will be getting from that your future partner. If that will be in form of pins, plated items, CPU we can call that say high graded material then recovery might be focused on some processes and we can say whole operation will be simpler to accomplish. If you are going to receive escrap in form of whole units of say computers, tv, fridges etc... - Then this require whole different approach where bulk of profit is created by selling separated materials where gold or silver recovered are considered as perks not main source of income. This operations however require investment in machinery and people and creates some type of waste which you will not be able to sell but will have to pay to get rid of like lead glass from tv sets, freon gas and oil from AC units or fridges...
I have friend who started 10 years ago driving around county waste disposal sites, people houses, companies asking for escrap. We all can imagine how they look at him. He hauled everything in to small warehouse where he did all work separating and sorting everything with his two sons. That warehouse just got bigger and bigger every year.
Now he own several buildings and businesses in his town, his recycling business is one of biggest in state, he employs lots of people. Most of his money comes from iron, aluminum, copper, plastics...
Anyone can take shortcut and accomplish in one-two years what he was building 10-12. The only thing is to invest huge amounts of money on start in machinery, technology and hire people with experience. Without that kind of money you still can grow but slower and safer by learning your ways, building up trust and business connections.
 
Back
Top