General question from a newbie

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Aunderwood458

Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2020
Messages
19
Out of curiosity when you scrap a metal or “aqua regia” does the remaining metal that is left considered 2020/2021 “Gold”.

When I go to sell it to a scrapper what do they traditionally pay for it? 8k,10k 24k. Also how do they generally test the “gold”. Do people have good success with generating profits on this method?
 
Dr.xyz said:
Did someone understand any of that above? I didn't.


When I process a metal through the “aqua regia” metal conversion/extraction or whatever the term is. Are the proceeds considered gold.

Say I put in one ounce of USSR Kopeks that aren’t considered spendable currency into the nitric acid and hydrochloric acid and say 4 grams are left over. Are those 4 grams considered “gold”
 
Aqua regia dissolves gold.
Acid peroxide or nitric acid is used to remove base metals and leave any gold behind.
(Edited for not reading source material response)
 
Hi.
There are some materials that do not (easily) dissolve in AR. Amongst that solid gold need hot AR.
Silver do not dissolve much and so on.

You do need to study more before you start using dangerous chemicals. And try to get the terminology right, since there are many users that have to rely on translaters to understand.

AR --> Aqua Regia are an acid combination of HCl and HNO3 Nitric acid.
This do dissolve gold, so what is left is most likely Silver with Gold.

Anything from reclaiming and refining are not ever considered anything. We test with stannous, xrf or what we have avaialble to verify what we have. Underways we assume out of experience and testing what we have at hand and treat it accordingly to end up with something we know what is. The road is long and twisty to get there.
The good thing is, if there was gold there it will still be there as long as you do not throw it away. Something that leads to the most important. Study waste treatment and disposal first.

Edit
Sorry did not see the post from Martijn before replying.
There are plenty of plated and fake things out there so there may not be gold at all.
 
Yggdrasil said:
Hi.
There are some materials that do not (easily) dissolve in AR. Amongst that solid gold need hot AR.
Silver do not dissolve much and so on.

You do need to study more before you start using dangerous chemicals. And try to get the terminology right, since there are many users that have to rely on translaters to understand.

AR --> Aqua Regia are an acid combination of HCl and HNO3 Nitric acid.
This do dissolve gold, so what is left is most likely Silver with Gold.

Anything from reclaiming and refining are not ever considered anything. We test with stannous, xrf or what we have avaialble to verify what we have. Underways we assume out of experience and testing what we have at hand and treat it accordingly to end up with something we know what is. The road is long and twisty to get there.
The good thing is, if there was gold there it will still be there as long as you do not throw it away. Something that leads to the most important. Study waste treatment and disposal first.

Edit
Sorry did not see the post from Martijn before replying.
There are plenty of plated and fake things out there so there may not be gold at all.


Is there a walk through on the process from start to finish. I wasn’t able to find it.
 
I am unfamiliar with Russian money.

I googled these:
The 10-kopeck coin was struck in brass-plated steel, the 50-kopeck coin, and 1- and 5-ruble coins were in cupro-nickel and the 10-ruble coin was bimetallic with an aluminum-bronze center and a cupro-nickel-zinc ring. The series depicts an image of the Kremlin on the obverse rather than the Soviet state emblem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_ruble

Normally coins are worth more as they are, or can be more easily recognized for their value as a coin (as opposed to an unrecognizable hunk of melted metal, and can normally be more easily traded for other goods of value (as always there are exceptions)...

For example on exception, copper metal in the american penny is worth more than the coin (to date), and being illegal to melt, it can be sold as-is for a higher value than the denomination of the coin, it too (the copper penny may one day be worth more as a coin in the future than its metal content value.

Recovering a metal (such as gold or silver) from scrap material or ore consists of separating the metal from other the other metals involved and or separating the gangue material as much as possible from the desired metal, this is done using many different kinds of processes depending on materials you are recovering the gold or other metal from.

Aqua regia is a refining process, normally used on refining the recovered gold or platinum group metals, not normally used on silver or high silver alloys, aqua regia will dissolve almost all metals, using it in a recovery process normally just makes a toxic mess of metals in solution (making it even harder to recover the gold). For this and other reasons, aqua regia is normally reserved for use on a fairly clean recovered gold from the previous recovery processes, here we can take a dirty gold and remove even more of those other metals to bring the gold to a higher state of purity (and finally to a higher karat content or value when completed) up to almost pure metal.

One problem with refining gold, say recognizable coins, karat stamped rings or jewelry, is that it can become harder to sell the gold for its full value (normally buyers can only test gold up to 22 karats {22/24} and will not pay for a higher % than they can test for) where they may have paid for all the gold if you took them the rings (minus a small refining or handling fee, or their profit...

From your question I will say you will profit more by selling your scrap or coins as they are to the highest bidder or honest scrap dealer, I think I would just forget about trying to recover metal from them and then trying to refine that metal in aqua regia...

I think if I lived there, I would trade the coins for Russian electronic trash (scrap) it can contain gold as well as PGM, spend years collecting it (while studying), and then I would spend several years learning how to recover the desired metals from the scrap, and then spend another few years learning how to refine the gold successfully with aqua regia or some other process, melt the recovered PGM with silver...
 
Please add the proper location to your profile.

US is usually interpreted as United States but you aren't from USA, are you?

I don't think any Russian kopek has ever been made with precious metals for the last 100 years. The alloy of common coins are often well documented and easy to find by searching the net. https://en.numista.com/vous/index.php for example contains a lot of information, but there are more sites.

There are a lot of reasons why something didn't dissolve in aqua regia and it's too big a subject to go into it now and here. You should read the book by Hoke, look for any post by Frugal and he has links in his signature. There you will learn the proper terminology and a basic understanding of the chemical reactions you run into in this hobby.

Edit : My bad, it seems there were kopecks minted in silver as late as 1931, so 89 years it is.
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/index.php?e=ancienne_urss&r=&ct=coin&tb=y&tc=y&tn=y&tp=y&tt=y&cat=y&ru=&ca=3&no=&v=&d=&i=&a=&dg=&m=p&f=&t=&w=&u=&g=&se=&c=&wi=&sw=

Göran
 
In this case I think chemistry will fail.
Maybe something similar to the Large Hadron Collider may be closer to the truth? :shock: :D :mrgreen:
 
Aunderwood458 said:
Yggdrasil said:
Hi.
There are some materials that do not (easily) dissolve in AR. Amongst that solid gold need hot AR.
Silver do not dissolve much and so on.

You do need to study more before you start using dangerous chemicals. And try to get the terminology right, since there are many users that have to rely on translaters to understand.

AR --> Aqua Regia are an acid combination of HCl and HNO3 Nitric acid.
This do dissolve gold, so what is left is most likely Silver with Gold.

Anything from reclaiming and refining are not ever considered anything. We test with stannous, xrf or what we have avaialble to verify what we have. Underways we assume out of experience and testing what we have at hand and treat it accordingly to end up with something we know what is. The road is long and twisty to get there.
The good thing is, if there was gold there it will still be there as long as you do not throw it away. Something that leads to the most important. Study waste treatment and disposal first.

Edit
Sorry did not see the post from Martijn before replying.
There are plenty of plated and fake things out there so there may not be gold at all.


Is there a walk through on the process from start to finish. I wasn’t able to find it.

To start, you have to know what the coins are made of.
Then you can decide which process is best suitable.
 
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