ripped off

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snoman701 said:
Shark said:
The problem is if you have posted the same information elsewhere that is posted here, it could make if pretty difficult to find anyone to refine it for you.

A couple days ago, for a brief a moment I thought to myself, "self...you should contact him, there's probably a good amount of gold LEFT that wasn't recovered". Then your point smacked me upside the head.

Yep - "Danger Will Robinson Danger" springs to mind.
 
The guy has been here since 2014. With minimal effort, he should have a better understanding of his materials by now, and where to go with them. To me that is a warning sign in itself. Then with his first dealing with a refiner he is ready to sue, another sign. A simple fix would have been to ask the forum, there are many here who deal with much larger sums of material and some very good ones who deal with lots as small as his. I have all but quit doing boards, and only do a few cherry picked items for myself. One day I might do more for others, but I would not do whole boards, there is just to many variables to be as accurate as some are looking for.
 
You're right Shark. It shows how little value was placed upon the forum and forum advice. Now we're supposed to help pick up the pieces.

I might sound harsh but I always cringe a little when I read "Ive been a lurker here for x years but now I'm going to ask something really basic." :lol:
 
I wasn’t going to respond but this is an educational forum an a dam good one at that.
Mentioning the tax man and social media just showed how the refiners stickup for each other like the cops and the blue wall.
The refiners skim all the time - all weights should be in grams not pounds and ounces.
Assays should be done on every lot.
The only fair way for the customer getting an assay is to be standing there and watching that the refiner doesn’t salt the assay.
For the small guys - learn to refine yourself - you will come out way ahead.
Thanks to everyone for the inputs - thanks for the education - no hard feelings!
 
seaslush said:
I wasn’t going to respond but this is an educational forum an a dam good one at that.
Mentioning the tax man and social media just showed how the refiners stickup for each other like the cops and the blue wall.
The refiners skim all the time - all weights should be in grams not pounds and ounces.
Assays should be done on every lot.
The only fair way for the customer getting an assay is to be standing there and watching that the refiner doesn’t salt the assay.
For the small guys - learn to refine yourself - you will come out way ahead.
Thanks to everyone for the inputs - thanks for the education - no hard feelings!

No. You were not ripped off and it seems that they actually did a good job for you.
Over half of your material was in fact low grade where yield is negligible unless you deal with tons of that kind of material and do have a proper setup for recovery in place. The only thing you had with higher value in that lot was fingers which were roughly 10% of total volume and perhaps some of ceramic cpu which were roughly another 20% of the lot. The rest you had can yield in grams per kilogram in the best case.

I was in the same shoes having collected 14 kilograms of fully plated tiny pins from old laptops. It took years to accumulate and to say that the result was disappointing is an understatement. The result was just 23 gram and that came from about 2000 laptops.
Do I feel ripped off? Absolutely but the only thing I was ripped off was my own time spent collecting that stuff.

Disclaimer.
I am not a refiner or cop and therefore not a part of your "blue wall".
 
last rebuttal

Lie 1
“We have a stringent process in place in which each shipment is weighed in, hand checked to the best of our ability, and then logged into our system. Material then proceeds to melt and undergoes a fire assay, which provides the most precise results in determining precious metals purity. Ultimately this material is introduced into the refining stream. With regard to the final numbers on the fire assay, three samples are utilized for calculation to ensure the utmost accuracy. These are the results that are reported to the customer for which they get paid and typical turnaround time is 24 to 48 hours.”

This was not done.

Lie 2
“Our first obligation at General Refining is client satisfaction. This is why we take any criticism or complaint about our service extremely seriously.”

I am not satisfied and have not heard from them.


I delivered 167 lbs of e scrap.
Lie 3
They processed 181 lbs of e scrap.
They returned 151 lbs of striped e scrap.
Why such large differences and where is it?

Why would GRC lie about the above matters - and not the yield.
You will have a hard time trying to convince me that they fair.

They leave me no choice but to go to social media and let the truth be known .
 
Sigh.

You're still not listening to anyone elses' point of view and you're now winding yourself up into a frenzy. There's no logic in your first point because they returned you all that gold from a small amount of your product which as been explained to you on a number of occasions but you refuse to listen.

You'd rather get wound up and angry and full of victimhood. I let your "blue line" comment pass however it smacks of paranoia.

Look this is just my opinion as I am not a moderator. I don't see how your ranting posts are benefiting the forum.
 
It’s possible they did a poor job of stripping the gold from your material if you post a few pictures perhaps we can shed some light on the situation for you but I would advise you not to keep openly accusing them of theft it might well cost you a lot more than what you think you have lost now.
 
I just deleted my last post. As there were no replies I could do it without disrupting the discussion.

I read "GRF" instead of "GRC" and made a mistake, thinking you were attacking the forum now and responded to that.

I apologize for that post to anyone that read it.

Thanks Nick for spotting that and letting me know.

Göran
 
Yeah however the context was correct Goran, it was just WHO was being insulted. I actually agreed with your post.
 
Yeah, but as I'm not a party in the case, I can't state if something is a lie or not.

I still have the post in my cache...
All I've seen is people trying to help you and you just insult us. That is not civic behavior.

It's an effective way to drive off anyone trying to help you, we are sharing experience and time for free.

Many of the people trying to help you are not even on the same continent, why would we lie to you?

I removed three lines that were based on my faulty reading. I still think there is a lesson learned here for other people. Here we can see how taking on a deal that isn't suitable for the refinery created a lot of grievance, both for the original poster and for the refinery.

Who's to blame and how much blame each party should take is nothing I can say. We have only seen one side of this story so far.

Göran
 
Without pictures of what you sent in, and what was returned, it just leaves a lot of guessing. If you want some better answers, you will need to show some pics.
You must have pictures if you planned on going to court, right?
 
June 20, 2017
GRC had a complaint about being short changed on yields.

September 11, 2018
GRC again had a complaint about being short changed on yields.

February 2019
GRC now has a third complaint about being short changed on yields.

Do you see a patten here?

And what business adds almost 20 lbs of gold plated material to the job lot?
Thats a sign of skimming to me.

You just can’t admit that there is a bad apple here.
 
seaslush said:
June 20, 2017
GRC had a complaint about being short changed on yields.

September 11, 2018
GRC again had a complaint about being short changed on yields.

February 2019
GRC now has a third complaint about being short changed on yields.

Do you see a patten here?
Yes, I see a pattern of about one complaint per year. That's pretty good no matter what business you're in.


You just can’t admit that there is a bad apple here.
What do you mean by a bad apple here? Are you saying that someone from GRC is a member here? Do you believe that our forum is somehow affiliated with GRC?

Dave
 
Now I am really confused. By adding material to your lot they are skimming? How is giving you a small amount of material skimming? I thought skimming was taking away from your material.

One complaint a year is nothing. Many large and reputable companies see many times that. The real question is how many of those complaints ended up in them loosing? How many even ended up in court? How many times have people had good things to say about them? If I could average 2.7 ounces for every 167 pounds of material I sent to a refiner I would be collecting a lot more boards than I do now. Even those numbers sound strange... over 13 years you collected 167 pounds of materials. That really sounds pretty low, even if it was all higher grades stuff. I took nearly that from a local scrap yard in one day. And I am no refiner, I am just a guy that wanted to try to get the gold from a truck load of trash. I am no cop, although there are a couple in my family. Most of all I just want to get better at this. Most of these people make a living at this, I am just happy to get a piece of gold now and then and take pride in the quality of it.

Oh well, time for the evening relax time.......
 
seaslush said:
June 20, 2017
GRC had a complaint about being short changed on yields.

September 11, 2018
GRC again had a complaint about being short changed on yields.

February 2019
GRC now has a third complaint about being short changed on yields.

Do you see a patten here?

And what business adds almost 20 lbs of gold plated material to the job lot?
Thats a sign of skimming to me.

You just can’t admit that there is a bad apple here.
Yes, I can see a pattern here. You are trying to get us to all agree with your view. At the same time you just ignore any request for pictures or more details.

Göran
 
"Yes, I can see a pattern here. You are trying to get us to all agree with your view. "

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Nice one Goran!
 
Because GRC said 181 lbs and I saw 167 lbs
I am going to use the returned material weight at 151+ lbs

15+ lbs of trimmed fingers
44 + lbs of printed circuit boards
32 + lbs of cpu 20 lbs high grade 12 lbs low grade
7 + lbs of misalliances
53 + lbs of pins and connectors
5 lbs of gold plate contact points

32 lbs of cpu (20 lbs high grade 12 lbs low grade) and 15 lbs of trimmed fingers leaves more then 100 lbs of material left, including 5 lbs of gold plated contact points, as well as the difference of total true weight I sent in.

Look at the guide and do the math….on the lowest yield.

Before I sent my material out, I did my own stripping of fingers using AP and refined it with vinegar and bleach and I got 1 ounce of gold with only 10 lbs fingers. This tells me that there is more then 2.7 ounces
When I use the Gold Mining Guide (at the lowest yield) I should have lot more than 2.7 ounces. And don’t count the Gold Mining Guide out. It was published to help the forum members. I watched more then 5 different videos on each of the cpus, fingers and pins striping and refining and they matched the yields of the guide. I would like to see the proof from the naysayers as to why the guide should not be used as a reference.

Remember that this was high grade e waste (high grade because of old industrial and commercial electronics as well as old cncs, telecommunications equipment, old industrial computers). and this is why I got the high yield.

For those that still say that 2.7 is fair - educate me. No one has yet.
I have given you my side of the story. Enough of me, and my experience, lets move on.

The forum was started to help fellow refiners and I came here to inform others about my experience with GRC.

Who else has had a experience of being cheated and how did you handle it?
 
Still no pictures? At least pics of what you are calling high grade and low grade cpu's.
And of this stuff; (high grade because of old industrial and commercial electronics as well as old cncs, telecommunications equipment, old industrial computers)
 
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