barren cellfone boards

[arthur kierski]

i took 24 barren cell fone boards without the gold traces on the boards(it was eliminated with gold stripper------)
these 24boards was incinerated(260grams) and the result was 200grams of incinerated material (not magnetic) but the copper layer have some gold brilliance---- i made a powder of this 200grams and put it in nitric(35%)----the result was a blue solution of copper nitrate without silver or pd---i tested for both metals----and 70grams of powder-----to obtain this powder from the nitric solution by filtration i had to wait 4hours------this pwder was incinerated again and then put into ar-----the ar solution resulted green(yellowish)----it was hard to filtrate again----- to the ar solution i did a stanous chloride test and the result was a pale blue collor which became pale pink after a few minutes-------i deduced that no gold came out yet from these boards----
the powder left after the ar treatment,i think that is stanic acid paste with the glass fiber and (i hope some gold traces)---
i need help of what to do with the powder left after the ar treatment and which i suspect(hope) of having some gold in it-------
thanks in advance for advice and comments
Arthur

 

[arthur kierski]

an adendo to my previous post: i did not eliminated what i suspect of being tin in the boards, and not only copper with pms because i realized the problem only when i did the nitric solution filtration----even so i continued with ar (a big mistake)
if i knew previously that the barren boards contained tin i would make a hcl tratment before initiating the wholle proceess

 

[leavemealone]

Hi arthur.After dissolving in nitric,you should have tried to percipitate Ag with salt.Then you could have checked for Pd and dropped as normal.If it tested negative for gold,then there is no gold,plain and simple.If you try harder to extract Au from something that has tested negative for Au,then you are just going to end up with a mess,and make it harded to drop anything else from the solution.
Johnny

 

[arthur kierski]

Leave me alone------i tested for silver and then pd in the nitric solution-----the ar solution i tested for gold and it did not have gold------the powder left from the ar leach ,you simply is telling me to throw away---even after i explained to you the circunstances of the experiment-------i will not throw away and will pursue for the gold which i think was collected or precipitated in the powder containing tin(paste -------i asked help for how to extract this gold(if it exist)-----i do not give up so easily,especially because i saw gold brilliance with the copper foils after the incineration of the boards
just a remainder:when i did not have the expertise from our magnificent forum(members),i processed a material containing gold and iron and other base metals directly with ar:the result for gold in the solution was nill-----all the gold was cemented in the powder that the ar did not dissolve----i took the powder and did the proper treatments learned here(in the forum) and thus obtained the gold that seemed not to exist or lost------- i think that in this case(the boards) i made a similar mistake

 

[leavemealone]

Good morning arthur.No I am not telling you to throw away.By what you said,I was to understand you thought there was gold in a solution that tested "pale blue collor which became pale pink after a few minutes".That means there is no gold in that solution.I did not see any sense in trying to exratc gold from a solution that clearly had no gold.If you have seperated powder that you have not tested,then I understand.But you did not say that.
Johnny

 

[Platdigger]

Actually he did Johnny, read the last line or so of his first post.

 

[leavemealone]

Hi plat,how have you been? Cold up there?.....lol.It's like 40 here and I am acting like Im freezing to death..lol.Steve got snow yesterday.
As far as his post,I think the language barrier is confusing me.I will stay out of this one.No worries,I know you guys that know what he is trying to convey,will get him straightened out.
Johnny

 

[Platdigger]

Real good Johnny, how bout yourself? It has been a mild winter up here ever since that first cold spell broke. In fact it has been in the 40s for some time now. 40 feels real good up here in the winter... 8)

As for Arthur, I supose if you still think you have tin...an hcl bath, after another incineration?

Could be if there was enough tin the gold would have cemented out of your ar. I believe this is what you are thinking.

 

[4metals]

Arthur,

I do not know if you are equipped to perform a fire assay. If you are, a sample of the solids should be fused in a litharge based flux, and cupelled. With a little experimentation you will find the proper flux to get a good fusion. This way you know for sure if there is gold or not. You process a wide variety of materials and often question whether or not some material is worth processing. The fusion / cupellation method will give you good answers without generating un-necessary wastes.

If you need them I can post some assaying techniques and fluxing formulations so you can perfect the fusion assay technique. An investment in assaying technology will pay you back with a lifetime of results.

 

[arthur kierski]

platdigger, exactly what i am thinking---i will do what you sugested and then let you know the results---thanks
4metals ,i will as you sugest begin to do some fire assay----not only for this particular problem,but for other problems that arises--
if you could send me some flux formulations i would be very glad----very kind of you and platdigger ......
thanks god that the language barrier did not prevent your tentative to help me
Arthur

 

[arthur kierski]

the barren cellfone boards gave so little gold that after 3 diferrent trials i came to the conclusion that one spends more time and acids than the gold obtained------i will monday incinerate a new batch and try with cianide leach---i am insisting on this because i have already over a hundred kilos of barren cellfone boards----

 

[4metals]

Sorry for the delay I've been all over the country on business and needed some info at my office to answer this post.

I feel you can put a lot of labor into this material for little or no return. The only way to proceed is to sample the materials and process it into a metallic sample and a powdered sample.

Here are some procedures to follow;

Sampling and assaying low grade residues

Randomly sample the material from different drums to obtain a sample of material to process into a sample capable of being fire assayed. The bigger the sample the more representative it will be but try to start with at least 1 pound. (454 grams)

Incinerate the material and break it up in a mortar and pestle to break up the large pieces as small as possible (if available, a ball mill does this well)

Sieve this material through a fine mesh screen (40 to 60 mesh) to separate the larger oversize chunks from the powder. Re grind the oversize to create as much of the material in the powder pile as possible.

Now you have 2 fractions, a powder sample and an oversize sample.

Starting with the oversize fraction, weigh it and add 5 times its weight of metallic copper to it and melt it with a flux made of 1 part borax, 1 part soda ash, and ¼ part flourospar. Let it stay at melting temperatures for ½ hour to allow all of the metal in the material to settle into the copper pool and be collected. Stir the melt well and pour into a cone mold. Examine the slag for beads and if necessary thin the flux and re-melt the bar, old flux and additional thinners together. The goal here is to get all of the metal into a copper base bar to fire assay.

Drill the bar and take a .5 gram sample and add 1.5 grams of silver wrap it in lead foil and cupel it in an assay furnace. Part the bead in 33% nitric acid (1/3 nitric 2/3 water) followed by a second parting in 66% nitric acid (2/3 nitric 1/3 water)
If there’s gold in the sample it will be on the bottom. Dry it, anneal it, and weigh it.

This is just to give you a good idea about how much gold is there. If there are values, run multiple samples as well as dore samples to get exact numbers.

Now we have to assay the pile of fine powder. First you have to blend the powder so it is homogenous. This can be as simple as placing the powder in a clean dry round jar and rolling it around on the table for 10 minutes or so. Weigh out a .5 gram sample for a fusion assay in flux made up as follows;


50 pounds Litharge (1 full can)
4.662 pounds Soda Ash (2116.5 g)
5.488 pounds Borax (10 waters) 2942 g
1.925 pounds Flour (873.9 g)
1.645 pounds Carbon (746.8 g)
1.372 pounds Silica (622.9 g)

Use this flux mixture in a 30 gram crucible

4 tablespoons standard flux
1 teaspoon Litharge
¼ teaspoon Flour (or standard addition for batch)
Stir to mix and add 3 gram sample
Add Silver 3 grams (no Silver for dore)
Mix completely
Sprinkle 1 tablespoon Litharge on top
Sprinkle 1 tablespoon Borax on top
Fuse at 1800 degrees Fahrenheit for 45 minutes
Remove from furnace and swirl to mix
Continue fusion for another 30 to 45 minutes
Pour into cone molds

Cupel the cleaned lead cone from the fusion and part the bead as above.

Once you know for sure that this material has economically recoverable values you can better determine a plan to either process them and recover the values or to ship them to someone who is equipped to process this material and can pay you for the values.

I hope GSP will add to this post as he has performed these procedures on many types of electronic materials.

 

[arthur kierski]

thanks 4 metals for passing the formulae and method of fire assaying---- i will try to digest all that you wrote and then make a decision on how to act or not------as i told you ,i never did fire assayng and cuppeling ----but i have a friend that have some experience and will ask him if he can help me,since he have furnace,cupels etc ----- thanks again and i will tell you what will be done-----------------------------------------------------as i told in the last post, i will do an cyanide leach with a batch and hope that i will get some results ---