Oh very sorry to hear, what happened to him ?
IRIDIUM processing ?
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I’m no specialist on lab reports by themselves.
I was more into what kind of lab and tests done?
XRF, fire assays or PGM assays?
I think that was in the information?
Some kind of Platinosis if I’m not mistaken.
I don’t know what method the lab used ..
What I meant was if there was some specific kind of an accident like the one I mentioned ..
Just exposure over time.
He died of idiopathic fibrosis of the lung (complications from working with chemicals, platinum as he told me from misting as it dissolved). They’ve (International Platinum Association) found that Pt(IV) basically is as allergenic as it gets for individuals susceptible to sensitization. We’re talking exposure at the picogram/cu meter scale. Asthma is no fun, and that’s where it starts. Where it can end is the lung fibroses.
The issue with osmium-containing materials is that they’re acutely toxic. That and the risk/reward ratio isn’t very good. So toxic is it, if you can smell it and get a few good breaths of it, it will kill you by suffocation—it plates a layer of OsO2 inside of your lungs. There is no antidote. The smell is off putting enough (a weird ozone-like smell similar to RuO4) to flee but if you can smell it, you’re already above the harm threshold. When I deal with osmium containing iridium feeds, Os and Ru I endeavor to get out of the way first quantitatively and the setup for that is redundancy on redundancy.
Indeed, the reason why poisonings are so rare is it is well known to be acutely toxic, unforgiving AND it is a rare substance, particularly osmiridium. As such, only a few firms ever mess with it. Processors include a few labs of mercenaries in China, the S African refiners and Russia and of course Colonial here stateside (the latter probably the best known of anyone messing with osmium intentionally as they have the grip on OsO4 for microscopy stain). Even firms like JM and Heraeus and Furuya avoid the OsIr material as there’s not much interest in Os and it’s a dog to purify it. Nevertheless, every so often some uneducated fool gets ahold of it, thinking it worth more trouble that it is, and unwittingly and permanently danages his corneas and alveoli in his lungs.
I know a gent in China that I can point you toward for help…
The issue with osmium-containing materials is that they’re acutely toxic. That and the risk/reward ratio isn’t very good. So toxic is it, if you can smell it and get a few good breaths of it, it will kill you by suffocation—it plates a layer of OsO2 inside of your lungs. There is no antidote. The smell is off putting enough (a weird ozone-like smell similar to RuO4) to flee but if you can smell it, you’re already above the harm threshold. When I deal with osmium containing iridium feeds, Os and Ru I endeavor to get out of the way first quantitatively and the setup for that is redundancy on redundancy.
Indeed, the reason why poisonings are so rare is it is well known to be acutely toxic, unforgiving AND it is a rare substance, particularly osmiridium. As such, only a few firms ever mess with it. Processors include a few labs of mercenaries in China, the S African refiners and Russia and of course Colonial here stateside (the latter probably the best known of anyone messing with osmium intentionally as they have the grip on OsO4 for microscopy stain). Even firms like JM and Heraeus and Furuya avoid the OsIr material as there’s not much interest in Os and it’s a dog to purify it. Nevertheless, every so often some uneducated fool gets ahold of it, thinking it worth more trouble that it is, and unwittingly and permanently danages his corneas and alveoli in his lungs.
I know a gent in China that I can point you toward for help…
For general Heavy metal poisoning a blood test will do it I believe.
For Os poisoning it is a totally different story, it reduces back to metal and stay put in the position it is.
I do not believe it can be picked up by blood tests and the amount will be far less than any normal scanner would pick up.
MRI, PET and so on.
kurtak
Well-known member
Lou already answered that question for you
Per the bold print in that quote the answer is -----------
YES !!!
If you are not working in a VERY well controlled lab setting with ALL proper equipment specific to working with Os/Ru/Ir you are putting yourself at risk ether over time risk &/or one time first time risk
For that matter - ALL PGM chemistry puts you at risk of PGM TOXIC exposure if ALL safety procedures/protocols are not followed when working with PGMs
Kurt
kurtak
Well-known member
Is there a reason you can't just post that report here in this thread ?
It would help us better understand your situation & therefore help you with the help you are asking for
You don't need to post company name(s) - (you can block that out) we just need to know "type" assay done (fire assay - ICP - XRF - etc.) & the results
The report "should" have that information
Kurt
kurtak
Well-known member
Lou also answered that question
The other part of your question
That I have no idea of other then IF you think you have been exposed you need to talk to your doctor
Kurt
Hello Friends, I think that if Lou wants to help us, he can put the basic security measures to deal with Osmium and Ruthenium, where there is iridium there is always Osmium and Ruthenium? what is the best way to process iridium in large quantity?
The main problem is buying the damn stuff from S. America is looked at less than favorably because the money probably goes back to human trafficking, extrajudicial kidnappings and murders, and very rarely to the poor devil who dug it out of the creek in the jungle that they polluted with mercury.
Rutheniosmiridium has been making the circuit here lately in US and in Switzerland. A lot of the big refiners are a flat no on it because of its provenance and the major sourcing issues associated with it. It's functionally worthless to the people trying to sell it, and even if you do manage to find someone to buy it, the return isn't great and the time frame is long.
Rutheniosmiridium has been making the circuit here lately in US and in Switzerland. A lot of the big refiners are a flat no on it because of its provenance and the major sourcing issues associated with it. It's functionally worthless to the people trying to sell it, and even if you do manage to find someone to buy it, the return isn't great and the time frame is long.
You cannot establish safe facility with few hundred bucks in hand. Dangerous compounds of Os and Ru are volatile. So you need to have good fume extraction with scrubbing - not to just vent the toxic junk to outside air and poisoning your whole neighborhood.
Platinum salts espetially are toxic and very allergenic. Follow the material stream - it´s actually pretty easy said - if that stuff does not come into you, or onto you, you are OK. Now the tough part - you need to prevent that happening. Aside of touching the stuff or getting it anyhow onto your skin, your eyes, hair, clothes etc... You also need to assure you does not breathe any.
Perfect. Now we know what shouldn´t happen. How we do it ? Wear full PPE - goggles, suit, long gloves. That way we assure nothing will get onto your skin and clothes. You will need to eliminate any contact of contamined gloves or protective equipment with anything that contacts your skin. So no answering the phone call when you are suited up - you will transfer the toxic stuff onto your phone. No eating or drinking, and no smoking. Diligently cleaning all things you have touched with contamined gloves.... Etc, etc...
Now, how we assure we do not breath any toxic salts ? Well, simple answer is we work in fumehood which will pull contaminants out. Beware of any kind of process that create aerosols - such as dissolution of the metals in acids - as bubbles collapse, they create aerosol, that goes OUT of the vessel together with gasses. ALWAYS. So be prepared for that. Covering the beaker does not stop the aerosols from getting out of it. It cuts good portion of them, but nearly not all. All dry samples upon manipulation creates dust. This dust is floating in the air and you can inhale it. So no manipulation with solid toxic salts outside fumehood. Thermal decomposition of the ammonium chloroplatinate can also cause the complex to sublime = even more dangerous than aerosols from the reaction outgas. Etc, etc...
Follow the compound you does not want to come into contact with. In principle it is very easy. In reality, you need to think about EVERYTHING at least twice.
