Question about running cells in series

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Alright, just an observation.

I started helping my father, uncles, and grandfather do electric work when I was literally 9 years old. It's about all I've ever done.

Any of the theory and math aside, maybe there was some confusion with the term "electrocuted".

For me and Webster's that implies serious injury or death. I've never been electrocuted. I have been "shocked" countless times. From low voltage AC and DC up to 480AC. I've yet to be injured. My worst was getting hung up on a 277VAC lighting circuit, but the 20A breaker thankfully did its job an tripped after a couple or three seconds. Yep, it hurt. I was sore for days but I still consider that as getting shocked. No burns, torn ligaments or muscles, still alive.

There is a big difference between getting a tingle, getting shocked and being electrocuted. For me personally, despite what I already know, if the very intelligent and highly qualified members here say there is no risk of dieing from coming into contact with the conductors of an electro-refining cell then I'm going to take that as gospel.
 
I agree- I was always brought up to believe that being electrocuted was to be killed with electrickery 8) 8)

Jon
 
UncleBenBen said:
Alright, just an observation.

I started helping my father, uncles, and grandfather do electric work when I was literally 9 years old. It's about all I've ever done.

Any of the theory and math aside, maybe there was some confusion with the term "electrocuted".

For me and Webster's that implies serious injury or death. I've never been electrocuted. I have been "shocked" countless times. From low voltage AC and DC up to 480AC. I've yet to be injured. My worst was getting hung up on a 277VAC lighting circuit, but the 20A breaker thankfully did its job an tripped after a couple or three seconds. Yep, it hurt. I was sore for days but I still consider that as getting shocked. No burns, torn ligaments or muscles, still alive.

There is a big difference between getting a tingle, getting shocked and being electrocuted. For me personally, despite what I already know, if the very intelligent and highly qualified members here say there is no risk of dieing from coming into contact with the conductors of an electro-refining cell then I'm going to take that as gospel.
Click to expand...

That is absolutely correct & was another point I was going to bring up just have not had time to post the last couple days & for what it's worth is another point where "Mr. I am right" is SO VERY WRONG

The FACT is that the rectifiers I posted about which are capable of delivering as much as 10,000 amps would only give you a "tingle" equal to a bit more then putting a 9 volt battery on your tonge & then ONLY if you grabbed ahold of the bus bars with "soaking wet" hands while standing in a pool of water

If your hands were dry & with shoes on your feet you would feel next to nothing if you felt anything at all

So not even a real shock much let alone eletrocuted

Kurt
 
Thipdar said:
kurtak said:
Aluminum Anodizing rectifiers

AC input side = three phase 480 volts 1,000 amps

DC output side = 18 volts 10,000 amps for 1,000 square foot of cathode

No time to post more right now have to head for work

Kurt
Click to expand...

18 VDC potential.
Click to expand...

Hmmm - what about the - "potential" - 10,000 amps

after all you are the one that has been pushing all this B.S. (with all your GREAT KNOWLEDGE) that it only takes a tenth of an amp to kill you & therefore setting up a cell run by a DC output rectifier will "require" a great deal of safety protocols including but limited to a faraday cage around the rectifier

FACT - even with an potential output of 10,000 amp --- at 18 volts - there is NO risk of electric shock (maybe a tingle) let alone electrocution & you certainly don't need to build a faraday cage around the rectifier

Bottom line --- your entire narrative here has been WRONG from the beginning and is STILL WRONG

So why don't you just - "man up" - & admit it

Kurt
 
Although it is important to iron out differences in opinion and such, I feel this is getting out of hand.
Since this is an online community, such attributes as skills, age, education and general mood/behaviour is all but invisible to the other parties. Some are very precise and correct in language, some are not, and there can be a plethora of reasons for that.
But that means that we have to give the other side the benfit of doubt and assume what is said/written is in best of intentions.

Would it be possible for the Admins to create a "FightClub" thread, where theese matters can be moved and solved, without utterly destroying the meaning and usefullness of the original intent of the thread?

Or even better, take theese things over PM.
It should not be neccessary to do the laundry in public.
 
Yggdrasil said:
Would it be possible for the Admins to create a "FightClub" thread, where theese matters can be moved and solved, without utterly destroying the meaning and usefullness of the original intent of the thread?
Click to expand...

Thats why Dave decided to move it here (to debate it)

The fact is that "Mr. I am right" is WRONG - meaning he is posting mis-information - Goran, my self & others have tried to correct that with FACTS

That is in the best interest of the OP &/or the forum - so that the OP & forum can get to the bottom of answering the question asked by the OP

Heading out the door right now to go ice fishing

Kurt
 
I rarely way in on any "controversy".

In this case I feel compelled. Since I began reading this forum I really like the fact that misinformation was rooted out with a passion. Especially where personal and public safety was concerned.

Most of the internet is full of theory, opinions and sometimes outright lies that can cause harm be it safety, financial or otherwise.

The experts on this forum are relentless in the pursuit of real world, NO B.S. information.

The correction starts with little jabs and sometime escalates into a full on brawl and sometimes people's feeling are injured.

I would be willing to bet that this format produces some of the best information on the internet or anywhere on precious metal refining. (Or anywhere else for that matter)

Keep the correction dialect going. Like it or not it is the layman's best shot at truthfully accurate information that is fully vetted.



Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


 
I concur with that Rick.
But still the intent of the thread has been drowned with this brawl.
Maybe the Admins could move the refining bit of this thread to a new one with links to the
controvercy, because the brawl may still give a good bit of education, just not in the original intent of the thread.
I'll leave that bit to the Admins :)
 
The original thread can be found here. It is found in the Electrolysis section.

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=86&t=28652

This is the debate/discussion section just for these types issues. The argumentative posts were moved here from the the original thread to keep that section in better order.

Years ago I worked in a plant that ran subsystems on 16volts at 3amp. The real danger with those systems weren't being electrocuted but the in hurting yourself from the knee jerk reaction of being "bit" by the next system being plugged in backwards. That was back in the day before we had these new "only plugs in one way" plugins. I used to check them about once a month (there were 360 individual units) by touching two of them, if I got bit, reverse the polarity of the second one and move on down to numbers 2 and 3. If that isn't bad enough I done it that way for almost 14 years. Looking back I now know better ways to do it, but it was quick and worked.
 
I'm surprised that nobody has pointed out that these are welding voltages...actually a little low for welding, but still, react the same.

I can hold on to the electrode while standing on the steel plate that is grounded.

And anybody who has TIG welded knows that it's the high frequency arc starter that gets you.

Either way, it's all fine and dandy til there is a dead short...and the human body has too much resistance to cause that. Even sopping wet. Been there on some portable jobs.
 
Aah, that was right Shark :)
I remember now, by just reading the new posts one can easily forget what has happened in the past :lol:
I'm quite familiar with HF jolts from Tig welding, quite energizing one can say.

But still, every now and then strange things happen even with familiar things like this.
Once the welding gun exploded and ripped the threads off the clamping device for the tungsten electrode.
The inside was covered in carbon soot like if it had been subjected to a pure acetylene flame.
Never found out what it was, changed the clamping device and pushed on.

Maybe it should be noted in the Top text that this is the FightClub :lol: :wink: :roll:
 
Progress simply cannot be made without conflict. History shows this time over.

Whether that be ideas or ethos the same thing applies. Stifling conflict is the way to stifle progress. A group of people sitting around agreeing with one another gains nothing, but that's the narrative of the left who do this publicly whilst bullying dissenters into silence behind the scenes. They dont WANT progress. They want control.

So let's do this- have a "fight club" area where people can say what they need. If someone isn't mature enough to remain objective then smack them down hard.

It often frustrates me with US forums because they are not the same as European forums. Over here we go for it and say what we mean whereas over there it's all about buttering people up and being "nice" whilst stabbing them in the back.

That's just counterproductive. Yes it makes some people feel better because their knife was delivered with a sugar coating but guys.....

Let's have at it. 8) 8)
 
I like this section the way it is. While I somewhat agree with Jon, I am not in full support of his idea. Conflict does not settle an issue. Open and honest discussion does. The conflict (name calling and such) surrounding the disagreeing opinions is a waste of time and effort that could have been applied towards the subject at hand. For two people, knowledgeable in the subject at hand, to discuss a subject with mutual respect will bring about a beneficial settlement for both, especially if they can part ways and maintain that respectful attitude towards one another. As for the forum, not only do the ones in disagreement benefit this way, so do those who are just learning the subject, maybe at a much later time. Those new people can also learn about said subject in a comfortable, non BS atmosphere. This thread is a good example of thinning the excess BS and letting the subject matter of the original OP to continue respectfully. Conflict settlement of differing opinions only allows the winner to subjugate the looser. True conflict settlement is beneficial for all parties involved.
 
I read my post back this morning and whilst the context was what I meant, the actual message was not clear.

By conflict I mean the ability to disagree vociferously and come to some kind of consensus without the requirement to constantly kiss someones' butt for fear of offending them. It's this feeling of having to dance around things that prevents a lot of progress because people don't feel empowered to make a point and defend it in case they upset the apple cart.

As such an awful lot doesn't get done.
 
Yesterday I closed out my last post by saying I was head out the door to go ice fishing

It was a GREAT day out on the ice - sun was shining & it got up to about 50 degrees F - there was 5 of us out on the ice & we hauled in a total of 25 trout (rainbows) between 14 - 18 inches which means with a 5 trout limit per person we all limited out --- actually caught a few more but anything under 14 inches went back in the hole & of course there is always those few the come off the hook before you get them pulled up though the hole & onto the ice --- what a great day with good friends :!: 8) :mrgreen:

Anyway - concerning name calling - that would be me - I am the one That has referred to Thidar as an ass & Mr. I am right --- & I stand by those assessments of this man because that is EXACTLY what he has SHOWN himself to be & I will be dammed if I am going to sugar coat what he has "in fact" proven himself to be through a multitude of long winded post on EVERY level of what has been discussed here

In the very beginning - I did not have a problem with his posting a reply to the OP voicing a concern "to be careful" because of the potential high amp output of the system (copper refining cell) the OP was asking about & his pointing out that it only takes one tenth of an amp to kill you

However - once Goran (& others) pointed out that he IS flat out wrong when it comes to such a systems (LOW voltage HIGH amp DC output power supplies/rectifiers) he not only continued to argue with Goran (& others) with a "multitude" of post of ABSOLUTE mis-information in order to prove his point that he is right when "in fact" he is wrong has IMO - earned - him the title of being - "MR. I am right - simply in the FACT that he has insisted on being right - even though he is ABSOLUTELY WRONG

Then - not only did he prove himself to be "absolutely" wrong but "insist" on being Mr. I am right he moved on to challenge the integrity of Goran's knowledge concerning (different) electrical systems because Goran could not possibly have the VAST knowledge/experience he has in the field of electrical systems

This attitude that Mr. I am right took ( after being here for a VERY short time) was a TOTAL assumption on the part of Mr. I am right --- in other words - this "assumption" he made which "in fact" became a direct attack on Goran's knowledge &/or integrity (and for that matter others that have been here FAR longer then he) makes him an "ass"

He is an ass in that not only does he insist on being right when in FACT he is wrong - but as well his being a "new member" he comes here & calls out the knowledge &/or integrity of "long time" contributing members

Let me put it this way - as far as I am concerned - he has "doubled down" on being an ass & by his own hand has earned himself the title of being an ass

Now then - I am going to go as far as calling him another name --- he is also a "liar" - all this B.S. about his vast experience working with electrical systems is in fact just that - B.S. --- in the multitude of post - loaded with mis-information clearly show that he has little if any real experience "working" with electrical systems --- at best he has spent time on the internet reading articles &/or watching you tube & maybe he has taken some college classes & maybe played with some home experiments

So I am sorry - but the multitude of mis-information posted here "in his own words" not only makes him an ass that insists on being MR. I am right - but he has sat here & lied to us about his vast experience in order to attempt to prove himself as right when in fact he has been nothing but wrong

The part I don't get is - what the hell is going on here with the politics to allow this to continue --- there was a time when such politics where not tolerated

I mean really - since when did it become OK for a new member to come here - post mis-information - insist that the mis-information is right - then call out the integrity of long time member & lie about his experience to prove his point --- I want to know when did such B.S. become "politically correct" to the point of becoming expectable without consequence

To be more blunt - Dave - I want an explanation of why this is being allowed without consequence - when others have been dealt consequence for the same &/or even less - & you know who/what I am talking about

Kurt
 
I had a plan to say a few words, refreshed by Kurts steaming post,
but found that he probably said it all.
Still a bit envious of your day on the ice :mrgreen: :D
Edited a typing error :roll:
 
kurtak said:
To be more blunt - Dave - I want an explanation of why this is being allowed without consequence - when others have been dealt consequence for the same &/or even less - & you know who/what I am talking about
Click to expand...

You want an explanation. Fine. I have reviewed this thread, and unless I've missed it, Thipdar has not violated any of our forum rules. If you feel he has, perhaps you can point out which rule and which post.

You, on the other hand have just, again, violated several.

furum rules said:
We expect readers to be on their best behavior, thus avoiding confrontations that take energy away from the topics at hand, and to avoid losing good and valuable members. This includes not posting about religion, politics, explosives, potentially illegal activities, or other subjects that could divide members of the forum. They simply create unnecessary and unwanted distractions away from the purpose of this forum - the recovery and refining of precious metals. Understand that accessing the forum is a privilege, not a right, and can be terminated for failure to adhere to board policy.

Profanity, racism, sexism, bad taste, and violent, vulgar, or foul language have no place on this forum. We are intelligent individuals who have the ability to converse without the use of offensive language. We are visited by people of all ages, genders, races, and religions, so please keep your comments clean. Post as if your mother, child or grandchild might read what you say.

Be sympathetic to other members. There will be zero tolerance for personal attacks on the board. If you are at odds with another, feel free to have a polite debate, but temper your words with wisdom. Post your position, doing so by sticking to the subject at hand. Do not make your comments personal in nature. Flaming is not permitted. No one will be allowed to attack the character of another. If you find yourself involved with another reader, and things don't work out as you hope, do NOT make mention in such a way that it can't be addressed by the accused.
Click to expand...

Thipdar hasn't posted on this thread in three days. You've made four posts since then. Now, do you really want me to start swinging the ban hammer more freely?

Dave
 
FrugalRefiner said:
kurtak said:
Thipdar hasn't posted on this thread in three days. You've made four posts since then. Now, do you really want me to start swinging the ban hammer more freely?

Dave
Click to expand...

Thipdar not posting on this thread in three days is a good thing, maybe he learned something. haha

Banning long time members isn't cool when they are addressing a problem. A very real problem.

Putting new members with an attitude problem on notice right from the start would be a good thing. And yes, this guy has, or had an attitude problem.
Click to expand...
 
OK, I need to clarify my post as well. I was speaking in general, not at you Kurt, Jon or anyone else. In fact, I was thinking ahead to any future debates. As far I as I am concerned, this debacle is dead. I have known sources that I can rely on for proper guidance here and many have spoken on the subject. I have made an effort to point other new people into trying to figure out for themselves how to learn who to pay attention to until they build their own relationships with other members (which promptly had a shot taken at it as well). If the original question was mine, I would already be applying what I had learned, and like many still be scratching my head about others. I did say that I am somewhat in agreement with Jon's idea, but that doesn't mean anyone has to participate in a given debate. That person who decides not to participate may well be the person with the answer to the issue, new membership or old.

And:
I am glad Goran showed some restraint and did not immediately ban Thipdar, it shows his credibility as a moderator. I also study his posts as I have learned he is one of the very knowledgeable members and would not debate with him without some very long and hard study...even then I would be unsure. Where it should go from Goran's last post until now I am not sure. Compared to a few years ago, the whole situation seems to have turned to the opposite extreme.

Glad you had a great time fishing, I am very jealous! I haven't seen a live trout in many years.

I just saw some new posts since I started this one but will let stand.
I did edit to correct grammar and spelling.
 

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