seeking refiner for cat material

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whocaresduh

New member
Joined
Sep 1, 2021
Messages
3
hi there

so short background information about myseld - i do work in the gold / silver refining biz since 2006 in germany, i build myself to one
of germanies top 5 - at least for north germany - i did left germany in 2010 and went to thailand and left my biz to my younger brother
to pursue a venture around the production of jewelry.

however - covid quite messed me over the tourist rate dropped, had to close 2 shops and stand here now back to 0 basically

i do now consider since a few months to get into catalytic conv. biz - either in thailand or in germany, i run into against walls everywhere atm
since in asia but far more in germany the market is based on a few players and BASF, DEGUSSA and co (where i have contacts) pretty much all demand
ammounts of 500kg (metal/ceramic all seperated) which even i would have the option to cash in online 200 converters in germany and in thailand aprox 100 a month
an ammount i will have issues to realize, let allone the capital needed to then buy and keep on buying till i get my cheque back from a refiner.

i do read alot into how big players refine them (arc furnace with zink or even zink silver alloys to capture the pgm's)


so now my question -

i seek someone can offer me to buy realistic ammounts of monolith material of me, at fair prices, i would be ok to stay with that person for years ahead even i will get into
areas of 500kg a month - someone reliable (ill grind the material and analyse it myself with my XRF) i can trust in not end up ripping me off (hard to find in europe, everyone just rips of any newbie on the market
so they can keep on buying existing volumes like they did before the new person went into the market) - someone can accept shippments from overseas (the material i buy in thailand) and someone can realize
me % below kitco makes it posisble for me to not just buy off single converters but also buy off people have larger lots.

im well aware of all the scams from leeching out monolith, to cut it out completly, to fill converters with cements - as someone works 15+ years with gold i seen it all and i know how to prevent me getting scammed
while im buying, but i am realy aware that all the larger guys do buy and refine - or just push in huge lots material to BASF and co are real crooks - i know stories of a few people got messed over pretty hard (send in material for 120k usd and they are told that it hardly worth 50k which isnt true, it was analysed after grinded to 300mesh size, humidity was baked all out etc) i know some of them to take bribes to delete new players from the market so middle man and larger players work together here to mess over anyone new.

i wonder if i can find anyone here can give me reliable places i can work with, people accept shippments from thailand or germany, people can offer rpices of at least 85-90% below kitco, prices not have smelting loss, or insane
processing cost. and places do in fact can help with liquidity as in pre pay some part and then refine and pay balance later on after refining or something alike (thats how i work with gold in germany where my brother who owns the company now push 30kg jewelry a month)

looking forward to hearing from you guys
would be happy to get a private message or if possible we can excahange whatsapp/facebook so we can talk a bit.

best wishes
franky

Edited to remove profanity
 
Last edited by a moderator:
ah and - i wonder if anyone know if there is options of small scale arc furnace machines at affortable prices, i wonder if it makes sense to process myself
and then ship metals around since that would cut down cargo cost quite alot
 
I think you may struggle to find a refiner but you may find a fair middleman who will pay on the cats as they are especially if you can provide decent regular amount, once de canned it’s hard to value the powders, an xrf reading will not be that accurate for selling or buying unfortunatel.
 
true middle man exist plenty, issue is they will never pay nice ammounts and i would have moral issues to end up pay 40-50% of the value to make my cut since middle man hardly will pay more than 65-75% and you do have quite intense moves on rhodium market (which accounts for majority of the value) so to be save over 2-4 weeks it is a must to pay less than 20% of what you get or you can actually buy and make a loss - dunno -

im all open if one of you guys know a reliable middle man can pay nice

nearby, crf and humidity analysis get you around 1.5-2.0% to the real value (if grinded to at least 250 mesh size)

generally agree with you, a larger middle man might be the option - question is where to find them - i tried, and i couldnt find anyone is willed to pay fair prices or prices makes me capable to compete with others buy over google position online in germany/thailand
 
Last edited:
Dear,
We are swiss based company and refine large scale of silver.
I think i can help you, but the matter is how many % far from kitco do you want?
The matter with Pd, Rh, etc...is that our refiner give us 95% of what it's analysed ( For gold 99.9% and 99% for silver).
I even dont know if we can import it to switzerland, as weast is sensitive to import, but if you have item in germany we can recive it in France.
But, it's strange that you cant find refiner who accept small batch like you have.
im all open if one of you guys know a reliable middle man can pay nice
 
I have been refining cats for over 15 years as a business named royal precious metal refining llc in Milwaukee, WI. Feel free to contact me at 414-808-4523 or send me an email to ro. I will get back to you immediately and we can discuss how to move forward if the terms are acceptable to you.
 
salut

si brèves informations de fond sur moi-même - je travaille dans le secteur de l'affinage de l'or / de l'argent depuis 2006 en Allemagne, je m'en construit un
du top 5 des allemagnes - au moins pour l'allemagne du nord - j'ai quitté l'allemagne en 2010 et je suis allé en thaïlande et j'ai laissé mon entreprise à mon jeune frère
pour poursuivre une aventure autour de la production de bijoux.

cependant - covid m'a assez dérangé à cause de la baisse du taux de touristes, j'ai dû fermer 2 magasins et revenir ici maintenant à 0 essentiellement

j'envisage maintenant depuis quelques mois de me lancer dans la conv catalytique. biz - que ce soit en thaïlande ou en allemagne, je me heurte à des murs partout atm
car en asie mais beaucoup plus en allemagne le marché est basé sur quelques acteurs et BASF, DEGUSSA et co (où j'ai des contacts) à peu près tous demandé
des quantités de 500 kg (métal/céramique tous séparés) que même j'aurais la possibilité d'encaisser en ligne 200 convertisseurs en allemagne et en thaïlande environ 100 par mois
un montant que j'aurai des problèmes à réaliser, sans parler du capital nécessaire pour ensuite acheter et continuer à acheter jusqu'à ce que je récupère mon chèque d'un raffineur.

je lis beaucoup sur la façon dont les grands acteurs les affinent (four à arc avec du zinc ou même des alliages d'argent zinc pour capturer les pgm)


alors maintenant ma question -

je cherche quelqu'un qui peut me proposer d'acheter des quantités réalistes de matériel monolithique de moi, à des prix équitables, je serais d'accord pour rester avec cette personne pendant des années, même si je vais entrer dans
des zones de 500 kg par mois - quelqu'un de fiable (je vais broyer le matériau et l'analyser moi-même avec mon XRF) je peux faire confiance pour ne pas finir par m'arnaquer (difficile à trouver en Europe, tout le monde déchire n'importe quel débutant sur le marché
afin qu'ils puissent continuer à acheter des volumes existants comme ils le feront avant que la nouvelle personne n'entre sur le marché) - quelqu'un peut accepter des expéditions d'outre-mer (le matériel que j'achète en Thaïlande) et quelqu'un peut réaliser
moi% en dessous de kitco me permet non seulement d'acheter des convertisseurs simples, mais aussi d'acheter des personnes ayant des lots plus importants.

Je suis bien au courant de toutes les escroqueries consistant à extraire le monolithe, à le découper complètement, à remplir les convertisseurs de ciments - comme quelqu'un travaille depuis plus de 15 ans avec de l'or, j'ai tout vu et je dit comment m'empêcher de me faire arnaquer
pendant que j'achète, mais je suis vraiment conscient que tous les gros gars achètent et affinent - ou envoient simplement d'énormes lots de matériel à BASF et co sont de vrais escrocs - je connais des histoires de quelques personnes qui ont été gâchées assez durement (envoyer du matériel pour 120 000 USD et on leur dit que cela ne vaut peut-être 50 000, ce qui n'est pas vrai, il a été analysé après avoir été broyé à 300 mailles, l'humidité a été entièrement cuite, etc .) et les plus grands joueurs travaillent ensemble ici pour déranger tous les nouveaux.

je me demande si je peux trouver quelqu'un ici qui peut me donner des endroits compétents avec lesquels je peux travailler, les gens acceptent les expéditions de thaïlande ou d'allemagne, les gens peuvent offrir des prix d'au moins 85 à 90 % en dessous de kitco, les prix n'ont pas de perte de fusion ou de folie
coût de traitement. et les endroits peuvent en fait aider à la liquidité car en prépayant une partie, puis en affinant et en payant le solde plus tard après le raffinage ou quelque chose de similaire (c'est comme ça que je travaille avec de l'or en Allemagne où mon frère qui possède la société pousse maintenant 30 kg de bijoux par mois )

hâte d'avoir de vos nouvelles les gars
serait heureux de recevoir un message privé ou si possible, nous pourrions échanger WhatsApp/facebook afin que nous puissions parler un peu.

Meilleurs vœux
franc

Modifié pour supprimer les grossièretés
hello friend I'm in Belgium I'm trying to deposit my state hallmark for refining, I'm French I live in Liege, I'm setting up my company in refining, I'm already getting for gold 9985, 999 with electrolysis and 999 for silver, palladium ok, a little more complicated, pt rh ok too

you can mp me if you want and if you are in Germany we can meet one day.



here are some of my finished products sal alloy place.

order pictures

1)2 xrf spectro results of the last refining without electrolysis 1,2

2) at 99.85 no electrolysis

3) ingot ag 2 kg

4) palladium ingot

5) and 6) electrolyzed Ag.



see you soon

Vincent.



"Nothing is lost, nothing is created, everything is transformed" LAVOISIER

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
 

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hello friend I'm in Belgium I'm trying to deposit my state hallmark for refining, I'm French I live in Liege, I'm setting up my company in refining, I'm already getting for gold 9985, 999 with electrolysis and 999 for silver, palladium ok, a little more complicated, pt rh ok too

you can mp me if you want and if you are in Germany we can meet one day.



here are some of my finished products sal alloy place.

order pictures

1)2 xrf spectro results of the last refining without electrolysis 1,2

2) at 99.85 no electrolysis

3) ingot ag 2 kg

4) palladium ingot

5) and 6) electrolyzed Ag.



see you soon

Vincent.



"Nothing is lost, nothing is created, everything is transformed" LAVOISIER

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
Hello Vincent,
Does your XRF of the Ag right? I see some Pd...i speak french as well...
 
hi there

so short background information about myseld - i do work in the gold / silver refining biz since 2006 in germany, i build myself to one
of germanies top 5 - at least for north germany - i did left germany in 2010 and went to thailand and left my biz to my younger brother
to pursue a venture around the production of jewelry.

however - covid quite messed me over the tourist rate dropped, had to close 2 shops and stand here now back to 0 basically

i do now consider since a few months to get into catalytic conv. biz - either in thailand or in germany, i run into against walls everywhere atm
since in asia but far more in germany the market is based on a few players and BASF, DEGUSSA and co (where i have contacts) pretty much all demand
ammounts of 500kg (metal/ceramic all seperated) which even i would have the option to cash in online 200 converters in germany and in thailand aprox 100 a month
an ammount i will have issues to realize, let allone the capital needed to then buy and keep on buying till i get my cheque back from a refiner.

i do read alot into how big players refine them (arc furnace with zink or even zink silver alloys to capture the pgm's)


so now my question -

i seek someone can offer me to buy realistic ammounts of monolith material of me, at fair prices, i would be ok to stay with that person for years ahead even i will get into
areas of 500kg a month - someone reliable (ill grind the material and analyse it myself with my XRF) i can trust in not end up ripping me off (hard to find in europe, everyone just rips of any newbie on the market
so they can keep on buying existing volumes like they did before the new person went into the market) - someone can accept shippments from overseas (the material i buy in thailand) and someone can realize
me % below kitco makes it posisble for me to not just buy off single converters but also buy off people have larger lots.

im well aware of all the scams from leeching out monolith, to cut it out completly, to fill converters with cements - as someone works 15+ years with gold i seen it all and i know how to prevent me getting scammed
while im buying, but i am realy aware that all the larger guys do buy and refine - or just push in huge lots material to BASF and co are real crooks - i know stories of a few people got messed over pretty hard (send in material for 120k usd and they are told that it hardly worth 50k which isnt true, it was analysed after grinded to 300mesh size, humidity was baked all out etc) i know some of them to take bribes to delete new players from the market so middle man and larger players work together here to mess over anyone new.

i wonder if i can find anyone here can give me reliable places i can work with, people accept shippments from thailand or germany, people can offer rpices of at least 85-90% below kitco, prices not have smelting loss, or insane
processing cost. and places do in fact can help with liquidity as in pre pay some part and then refine and pay balance later on after refining or something alike (thats how i work with gold in germany where my brother who owns the company now push 30kg jewelry a month)

looking forward to hearing from you guys
would be happy to get a private message or if possible we can excahange whatsapp/facebook so we can talk a bit.

best wishes
franky

Edited to remove profanity

Hello Vincent,
Does your XRF of the Ag right? I see some Pd...i speak french as well...
hello yes as put in mp for you here we see 0.23 %, in general the spectrum of palladium and silver can be confused with XRF of some percent, what assures me my metal repurchase, to verify, but it is true on the graph, the curves overlap.

but here there was a presence of palladium.
sometimes on old silverware, you can find palladium (parasitic alloy to silver)
always good for the refiner.
 
hi there

so short background information about myseld - i do work in the gold / silver refining biz since 2006 in germany, i build myself to one
of germanies top 5 - at least for north germany - i did left germany in 2010 and went to thailand and left my biz to my younger brother
to pursue a venture around the production of jewelry.

however - covid quite messed me over the tourist rate dropped, had to close 2 shops and stand here now back to 0 basically

i do now consider since a few months to get into catalytic conv. biz - either in thailand or in germany, i run into against walls everywhere atm
since in asia but far more in germany the market is based on a few players and BASF, DEGUSSA and co (where i have contacts) pretty much all demand
ammounts of 500kg (metal/ceramic all seperated) which even i would have the option to cash in online 200 converters in germany and in thailand aprox 100 a month
an ammount i will have issues to realize, let allone the capital needed to then buy and keep on buying till i get my cheque back from a refiner.

i do read alot into how big players refine them (arc furnace with zink or even zink silver alloys to capture the pgm's)


so now my question -

i seek someone can offer me to buy realistic ammounts of monolith material of me, at fair prices, i would be ok to stay with that person for years ahead even i will get into
areas of 500kg a month - someone reliable (ill grind the material and analyse it myself with my XRF) i can trust in not end up ripping me off (hard to find in europe, everyone just rips of any newbie on the market
so they can keep on buying existing volumes like they did before the new person went into the market) - someone can accept shippments from overseas (the material i buy in thailand) and someone can realize
me % below kitco makes it posisble for me to not just buy off single converters but also buy off people have larger lots.

im well aware of all the scams from leeching out monolith, to cut it out completly, to fill converters with cements - as someone works 15+ years with gold i seen it all and i know how to prevent me getting scammed
while im buying, but i am realy aware that all the larger guys do buy and refine - or just push in huge lots material to BASF and co are real crooks - i know stories of a few people got messed over pretty hard (send in material for 120k usd and they are told that it hardly worth 50k which isnt true, it was analysed after grinded to 300mesh size, humidity was baked all out etc) i know some of them to take bribes to delete new players from the market so middle man and larger players work together here to mess over anyone new.

i wonder if i can find anyone here can give me reliable places i can work with, people accept shippments from thailand or germany, people can offer rpices of at least 85-90% below kitco, prices not have smelting loss, or insane
processing cost. and places do in fact can help with liquidity as in pre pay some part and then refine and pay balance later on after refining or something alike (thats how i work with gold in germany where my brother who owns the company now push 30kg jewelry a month)

looking forward to hearing from you guys
would be happy to get a private message or if possible we can excahange whatsapp/facebook so we can talk a bit.

best wishes
franky

Edited to remove profanity
true middle man exist plenty, issue is they will never pay nice ammounts and i would have moral issues to end up pay 40-50% of the value to make my cut since middle man hardly will pay more than 65-75% and you do have quite intense moves on rhodium market (which accounts for majority of the value) so to be save over 2-4 weeks it is a must to pay less than 20% of what you get or you can actually buy and make a loss - dunno -

im all open if one of you guys know a reliable middle man can pay nice

nearby, crf and humidity analysis get you around 1.5-2.0% to the real value (if grinded to at least 250 mesh size)

generally agree with you, a larger middle man might be the option - question is where to find them - i tried, and i couldnt find anyone is willed to pay fair prices or prices makes me capable to compete with others buy over google position online in germany/thailand
Hello my name is Philip Garner I've been on a form for a little bit now I just recently opened a business for precious Metals refining here in the states and North Dakota we take or nuggets e-scrap and other precious metals jewelry things of that nature that can be processed by fire and chemically purified and certified for the market business name is MDG refining LLC you can find me on this forum if you want to talk more you can send me a message thank you.
 
Ok
Hello my name is Philip Garner I've been on a form for a little bit now I just recently opened a business for precious Metals refining here in the states and North Dakota we take or nuggets e-scrap and other precious metals jewelry things of that nature that can be processed by fire and chemically purified and certified for the market business name is MDG refining LLC you can find me on this forum if you want to talk more you can send me a message thank you.
Hi my name is Michelle and I have a auto dismantled yard and junk yard I'm interested in selling some converters I have but am a little Leary about going about it with all the scams iv heard about lately. I live in Redding California. Any ideas or places to refer me to around my location
 
Ok

Hi my name is Michelle and I have a auto dismantled yard and junk yard I'm interested in selling some converters I have but am a little Leary about going about it with all the scams iv heard about lately. I live in Redding California. Any ideas or places to refer me to around my location

If you are a legal business you shouldn't have a problem finding a Cat buyer in Ca. If you're not a registered business you will have problems selling large numbers of converters. Converter theft's have skyrocketed in the last few years and people are cautious who they buy Cat's from. I will not buy converters from anyone I don't know and trust.
 
I won't buy or sell converters now, and I was doing pretty good pre-pandemic. Get pulled over with twenty converters in your car and you are going to jail and making the news. Yeah, your lawyer will get you out, but you're name will be toast.

XRF is only going to get you close. There's lots of guys buying loose catalyst now, but you better plan on witnessing the mixing, sampling and getting your own independent assay.
 
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