Recommended setup to process 350oz of scrap jewery per week

[HAuCl4]

Nah. My lightbulb is perfectly fine, and that's the correct approach for low karat scrap as the OP has stated his material is. That you guys don't like it isn't my problem. :lol:

 

[Anonymous]

He can evaporate the copper/zinc nitrate solution in the sun in a closed container

:idea: Now theres the idea of the century.........you must work for the U.S. congress.

 

[HAuCl4]

Right. Or start with scrap copper or zinc or brass as the added metal for inquartation till he accumulates enough silver from the karat scrap. Silver is currently too expensive (IMO) to be buying it just for inquartation purposes. :idea:

He can evaporate the copper/zinc nitrate solution in the sun in a closed container, and when all the water is gone distill/recover the nitric acid from the crystals with some wood borrowed from the frogs. :lol:

Evaporate in a closed container. Now that is a novel idea. :roll:

Obviously you are out to get me. You'll need to try harder Watson. Obviously I meant a closed system.:lol:

 

[Anonymous]

and that's the correct approach for low karat scrap as the OP has stated his material is

700 ounces of silver = 3 gallons of solution for the silver
700 ounces of copper = 11 gallons?
Dude go back to bed or something.
And no einstein I am not out to get you.This is a perfect example of why it is IMPERATIVE that you write what you mean!And don't ASSUME that others will automatically know what you are insinuating.

 

[HAuCl4]

I'm sure you 2 geniuses prefer to spend $20,000 in the 700 Oz of silver to inquart that stuff. If I had your money, I'd burn mine!. Next!. :lol:

 

[Barren Realms 007]

?

 

[dtectr]

These last comments [edited: except for the last 8 or 9] address something that's called "The E Myth", "E" standing for "entrepreneur". Many people believe that a successful entrepreneur is a person with a good business idea & the ability to carry it out. MYTH

The fellow who wrote the book of the same name said every successful business is made up of 4 parts:
1) craftsman
2) manager
3) accountant/bookkeeping
4) marketing professional.

Many GREAT businesses fail because the owner is personally lacking in one or more of the above. A wise entrepreneur will take a realistic self-analysis & to learn his own strengths & weaknesses (and be honest with yourself - If you suck at bookkeeping, telling yourself that you will learn once the biz gets rolling is unrealistic). He will also be working 80-90 hrs/week to make things happen - developing new abilities just won't happen.

The solution is do what you're good at, and hire (or find) someone else to do the others. For example, my wife is a sweetie, but with bookkeeping she's a Nazi, which is good, since wasting money is deadly to a new business.

From a guy who learned the hard way. FWIW

 

[HAuCl4]

Right. Or start with scrap copper or zinc or brass as the added metal for inquartation till he accumulates enough silver from the karat scrap. Silver is currently too expensive (IMO) to be buying it just for inquartation purposes. :idea:

He can evaporate the copper/zinc nitrate solution in the sun in a closed container, and when all the water is gone distill/recover the nitric acid from the crystals with some wood borrowed from the frogs. :lol:

Evaporate in a closed container. Now that is a novel idea. :roll:

Obviously you are out to get me. You'll need to try harder Watson. Obviously I meant a closed system.:lol:

No one is out to get you. But to do this in a closed system and let the sunlight evaporate. Come on. Oh wait I see you perspective a solar oven... 8)

I takes exactly one day in the Costa Rican sun to get a crust of crystals, and several buckets of near distilled water. You must use the right super simple setup though, which I don't plan to describe to you now!. 8)

 

[Barren Realms 007]

?

 

[Anonymous]

I'm sure you 2 geniuses prefer to spend $20,000 in the 700 Oz of silver to inquart that stuff.

Big difference........I can recover the gold PLUS THE 20K ...If you cannot then that is your problem.That fact remains,that using copper or ANY other base metal to inquart with is frowned apon....reguardless of how much it costs to inquart it.
If you do not have the capabilities to do this(as dtectr has stated) then send it to someone who can.

You must use the right super simple setup though, which I don't plan to describe to you now!.

Seriously dude......check that lightbulb.

 

[HAuCl4]

These last comments [edited: except for the last 8 or 9] address something that's called "The E Myth", "E" standing for "entrepreneur". Many people believe that a successful entrepreneur is a person with a good business idea & the ability to carry it out. MYTH

The fellow who wrote the book of the same name said every successful business is made up of 4 parts:
1) craftsman
2) manager
3) accountant/bookkeeping
4) marketing professional.

Many GREAT businesses fail because the owner is personally lacking in one or more of the above. A wise entrepreneur will take a realistic self-analysis & to learn his own strengths & weaknesses (and be honest with yourself - If you suck at bookkeeping, telling yourself that you will learn once the biz gets rolling is unrealistic). He will also be working 80-90 hrs/week to make things happen - developing new abilities just won't happen.

The solution is do what you're good at, and hire (or find) someone else to do the others. For example, my wife is a sweetie, but with bookkeeping she's a Nazi, which is good, since wasting money is deadly to a new business.

From a guy who learned the hard way. FWIW

Finally a serious post!. Welcome to the jungle. 8)

 

[Barren Realms 007]

?

 

[HAuCl4]

I'm sure you 2 geniuses prefer to spend $20,000 in the 700 Oz of silver to inquart that stuff.

Big difference........I can recover the gold PLUS THE 20K ...If you cannot then that is your problem.That fact remains,that using copper or ANY other base metal to inquart with is frowned apon....reguardless of how much it costs to inquart it.
If you do not have the capabilities to do this(as dtectr has stated) then send it to someone who can.

You must use the right super simple setup though, which I don't plan to describe to you now!.

Seriously dude......check that lightbulb.

You are funny. I'll give you that much. I don't need the 20k to begin with!. And I don't care how much anyone frowns upon anything. Dude!. :lol:

 

[Anonymous]

Listen HAuCl4,
I am NOT going to do this all day.What you are doing is childish and counterproductive.I am pretty sure that dtectr's post was not backing you up.I know dtectr and I doubt that post was in your favor.The bottom line is this......If you cannot process the material the correct way,then you need to find someone that can(AS STATED IN DTECTRS POST).There are many different ways to process it,but inquarting with copper is not one of them.If you insist on thinking that way,then I suggest you keep those suggestions to yourself.It is disheartening to spend time helping others only to see another member making such suggestions,and then insisting that "that's the correct approach for low karat scrap".This conversation needs to end here,until a moderator can get here.Until then it needs to stop.

 

[HAuCl4]

Listen HAuCl4,
I am NOT going to do this all day.What you are doing is childish and counterproductive.I am pretty sure that dtectr's post was not backing you up.I know dtectr and I doubt that post was in your favor.The bottom line is this......If you cannot process the material the correct way,then you need to find someone that can(AS STATED IN DTECTRS POST).There are many different ways to process it,but inquarting with copper is not one of them.If you insist on thinking that way,then I suggest you keep those suggestions to yourself.It is disheartening to spend time helping others only to see another member making such suggestions,and then insisting that "that's the correct approach for low karat scrap".This conversation needs to end here,until a moderator can get here.Until then it needs to stop.

You drew first blood. And you are wrong too!. I (and several clients of mine) have inquarted with copper/copper scrap and refined more gold in 2 years than you are likely to see in a lifetime. If I had to do it over, I'd use zinc. It's cheaper. I'm tired of bowing down to morons like you in this forum. I know a lot less than people like 4metals or Harold or Lou. But definitely I'm not taking any more crap from aggressive idiots such as you.

 

[4metals]

Why don't we just try and answer this guy's question?

Gold Chloride is right, the silver to inquart 350 ounces of roughly 50% assay (or less) material is upwards of $15,000. That's more than his equipment budget. But if he does process individual lots (and we are assuming 25 lots) 350/24 = 14 ounces per lot so he only needs enough silver for the first lot. Much cheaper. As his silver inventory builds up he can process bigger lots.

Evaporating in the sun is a good cost effective method, I know of guys in Texas that do it. Costa Rica has to be hotter down near the equator. I wouldn't evaporate the acid though, I'd drop the precious metals with copper, then raise the pH to 2 and drop the copper with iron. Then the sun could do its thing. We're only talking 15 gallons to evaporate a week. A solar drier can handle that easily. I live in the wrong place, no tree frogs and hardly any sun all winter.

 

[HAuCl4]

Why don't we just try and answer this guy's question?

Gold Chloride is right, the silver to inquart 350 ounces of roughly 50% assay (or less) material is upwards of $15,000. That's more than his equipment budget. But if he does process individual lots (and we are assuming 25 lots) 350/24 = 14 ounces per lot so he only needs enough silver for the first lot. Much cheaper. As his silver inventory builds up he can process bigger lots.

Evaporating in the sun is a good cost effective method, I know of guys in Texas that do it. Costa Rica has to be hotter down near the equator. I wouldn't evaporate the acid though, I'd drop the precious metals with copper, then raise the pH to 2 and drop the copper with iron. Then the sun could do its thing. We're only talking 15 gallons to evaporate a week. A solar drier can handle that easily. I live in the wrong place, no tree frogs and hardly any sun all winter.

Thanks 4metals. You tell them.

 

[4metals]

There are 2 sides to every argument, until I became active on this forum I never imagined how hard it can be to get nitric acid in some locations. I've always ordered it in multiple 55 gallon drums. Then I come here and read how guys are making their own because they can't get it.
That was a surprise to me.

So to be fair to both sides, and to help our refining friend in Costa Rica make a better decision, inquarting with copper uses up a lot more nitric so if that is an issue in his neck of the woods than silver inquarting makes sense. If it is plentiful than copper makes sense. (With the understanding that life will get easier and chemical costs will go down when he accumulates enough silver to inquart with his own silver.)

If a few members who process gold filled scrap would speak up here we would hear that their feedstock is pre diluted with copper and zinc and they have no choice but to use nitric.

But the current price of gold seems to heal all wounds.

 

[Oz]

I was typing this (slow as I am) and noticed that 4metals has replied similarly. My reply is enough different that I still thought it worthwhile to post. I apologize for my slow typing skills.

OK, this thread has become about being right and petty arguments. There is seldom only one “right” answer.

Right. Or start with scrap copper or zinc or brass as the added metal for inquartation till he accumulates enough silver from the karat scrap. Silver is currently too expensive (IMO) to be buying it just for inquartation purposes.

Perhaps I read this wrong but HAuCl4 was suggesting only to start with base metals other than silver until the required silver was accumulated through processing, not as a permanent solution.

I've seen low karat without high silver. If the karat was lowered with CuZn alloy inquarting may not be required. As is so important in running batch lots in this business, you have to know what you are starting with, for that reason a small fire assay capability will pay off.

Now if 4metals is correct here little if any added metal may be required for inquartation.

I would stay away from zinc or zinc alloys in inquarting for toxicity reasons. Copper is a heavy consumer of nitric (3.4 times greater than silver) so I prefer silver for inquartation. However I can see circumstances where the cost of buying silver for inquartation is greater than the cost of consuming excess nitric by using copper. As soon as you have accumulated enough silver from processing, of course it would be expedient to switch to using the silver instead.

Having said that, if 4metals speculation is correct that this may be a low silver karat gold alloyed with Cu and or Zn, you cannot avoid the need to remove them. I would do my best not to add to that problem though.

Just one mans opinion.

 

[Oz]

If a few members who process gold filled scrap would speak up here we would hear that their feedstock is pre diluted with copper and zinc and they have no choice but to use nitric.

If accountability on lots was not an issue, then using gold fill scrap for inquartation is ideal! You get twice the work done for the same nitric consumption.