# What I got,Need Guidance,



## bomer (Oct 3, 2013)

We all know I got ahead of myself I trimmed the fingers to 65 lbs of Ram and processed with AP.Now I am really confuses about what to do next.I have a bunch of filters that have brownish green powder from filtering AP,I have some that have blue green,and some with black grey.I have a waste container with water,hcl/cl,and hcl waste from my washes of Fingers and boards.It also probably has some gold that wouldn't drop.So I placed a piece of copper pipe flattened out in it like I was advised to.Please I know I should do more studying but can anyone tell me what's ,in the filters,and how do I process this big pile of e waste .I seperated all the lids off cpus and how should I process gold lids,and what should i do with lids that aren't gold.thank you any help would be a lifesaver because ,I appreciate any help so very much. Can I process black powders with hcl/cl or do I need Nitric to make AR?


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## glondor (Oct 4, 2013)

WOW OK You need to PICK a material and learn how to process it. Pins are not fingers are not cpu's are not memory chips. You don't bake a cake with roast beef and tea bags. All materials and processes are different, unique to the material. You can not batch processes or material until you know what is what and what it takes. You need the proper recipe. 

Other wise you get a mess, with filters full of who knows what......... Stop. Decide what your next step should be AFTER you.......

Read. 


There are literally 10's of thousands words written on how to do what you want right here on this forum. Every process, procedure, and issue is addressed here.

I suggest you start with the search box and key words like "help" or "i messed up" or "how do I " and go from there. Tell us what you think you should do next. Don't do it, just tell us about it. You will get the guidence you need. 

You have not "lost" any thing yet, but you can gain the knowledge to recover from your error. Try it.


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## bomer (Oct 4, 2013)

I want to process the filters but from what I read I have to incerate and use nitric .I am kinda short on money because I spent a fair amount on this e waste and I just paid rent.I am kinda hoping to maybe get some advice based on my pictures on what I can process next with just AP and hcl/cl,the next money I get from this I plan on purchasing Nitric to make AR. I have gotten so ahead of myself because I have so much e waste. Instead of not doing nothing I have been doing little things like seperating the caps from cpus ,collecting mcc of mobo,etc. Please help any advice is appreciated.thanks


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

Why do people start with large batches, when they don't know the processes. :shock: 

Store your materials a save place and set your focus on only one process at a time. Start with small batches, whenever you are doing something new.


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

Everything you have in the filters should be washed well. You could start with boiling water. Then HCl. Or the other way round. There should only be black powders and goldfoils left in the filters then.

All well washed black powders you have now can be treated with HCl/Cl. 

If you try all this, use a small(!) batch first. Depending on your material, you have to incinerate first. Then wash again.

Forget the lids and all the other stuff for now and read first. Don't start a new mess.



> I am kinda short on money



Every education costs money. If you need money, sell some of the good stuff. You will probably get more money for it, than you are able to recover from it at this point.


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## butcher (Oct 4, 2013)

bomer,

How are you going to get anywhere? your horse and your cart are hitched backwards, that ole mare cant push the cart, she needs to hitched up to pull it. :lol: 

I can understand the need for money, but you will not get it, by losing your gold, especially if you are spending your money on the scrap, now you are losing cash you spent for gold and your gold both.

I would like to help , but I do not think I can, You are jumping out of the airplane before you have learn how to use a parachute, I hope you can hear me on your way to the ground yelling (study Hokes and the forum).

I also need money now, and I have gold and know how to process it and understand the basics and how to get out of trouble if it should arise in a process, but I do not turn to my gold for money. what I turn to is my skills and hard work with labor, (I still have my gold to process).
What I suggest you do is work with skills you have and labor to get you money, save your gold scrap and study to get the understanding you need first, hitch the mare in front of your cart, then when the time comes you can go to town getting gold.


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## bomer (Oct 4, 2013)

Ok so I should wash my filters with hcl,then hot water , then I can process the black powders in hcl/cl.I am familiar with the hcl/cl process. I've started putting the CPU lids up in storage for now.I just want to be able to process the filters. I have one more question do I save the washes in my stock pot?thank you so much I realize I bit off more than I can chew and I appreciate the advice it is very helpful.


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

> do I save the washes in my stock pot?



For a solid answer I would advise to search Hoke and the forum for "stock pot". As a short quick help: Test with SnCL2 (and if pgms are involved additionally with DMG). Store everything you aren't sure about. Probably your filtrates will not contain gold, since you have cemented by adding copper. Now they contain a lot of copper which still has some value. Better is to reuse the more concentrated filtrates. Butcher has made some great posts about that: use advanced search, read all butcher's posts about CuCl2 or copper II chloride


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## butcher (Oct 4, 2013)

You may not see this advise as helpful, but that is my intention.

In your filters I see salts of copper iron, and I would say they contain many other metals in a toxic form, what I see is just a big mess with gold tied up in this mess.

No matter how many questions you ask at this point you cannot get enough answers to help you, you are going like a blind man lost in the wilderness, even if we give you a compass and told you how to read it you would not be able to see how to get out of this wilderness much less be able to see the magnetic needle on the compass.

When you are headed for a train wreck it is best to switch tracks.
but You also need to know the best track to get on (you have been on the forum long enough to know which track, but being blinded by gold fever you refuse to get on it. How in the world can we help you?

bomer, 
Keeping going down this track is a mistake, you asked for guidance, all we can do is warn you, it is up to you to switch tracks or decide if which track you are on is the right one, what I see ahead of you is a wreck, if you stay on this track, I say put a loose lid on this waste save it for when you know what to do, and get a good book, and the forum, get your train back on the track of understanding first.

Store this mess safely, and get to reading Hokes book, forget about processing messes and trying to figure out how to get back out of these messes, study and learn how to recover and refine precious metals.

I cannot give you guidance out of this mess (although I would know what to do if I had it), I cannot in good conscious guide you out of this mess and into your next mess misleading you on this track headed for a train wreck, but what I can do is try to guide you towards the better track, where you can learn how to recover and refine metals, but you have to be willing to get on that track.

What do you do next? incinerate because of the tin involved, or store this and go read Hokes?


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

read butcher's post: http://goldrefiningforum.com/~goldrefi/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=65


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## Pantherlikher (Oct 4, 2013)

*Wow!*

All I can say is wow

Here is what to do next:

Put everything, including any money you have.
Put it in a bucket and take it to the hazzardous waste facility.

B.S.
...Here's your sign...


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## bomer (Oct 4, 2013)

Pantherlikher thats too funny! Seriously though thats what it feels like i should do the only person trying to give me any direction is you and solar.I just want to know can i wash my filters in my AP solution then gather any remaing powders tht dont reduce in that solution since the majority of the powders are copper.If i have to incinerate and use nitric is there something else I can do that is beneficial financially for me .For instance can i process the ceramics ,or I have seen a video on youtube before that shows boiling of cpu pins in hcl then after a few hours the foils are collected and I assume since there foils I should be able to process with hcl/cl!


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

You have got a lot of valid answers to your questions. If you don't understand them, the only thing you should do now, is listen to butcher's advice. Your questions are not clear,because of the lack of knowledge and the right terms. Read Hoke, - the questions, which then are left over, will be better to understand, because then we talk the same language. Right now, every answer will lead you to 10 new questions.

Everyone here is offering the best help to you, even if it right now doesn't feel like that to you.


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## Pantherlikher (Oct 4, 2013)

bomer

You are not reading anything.
You are not taking any advice from anyone.
You need to take everything to the hazzardous waste facility to let someone that knows how to handle it deal with it properly!!!

"Pantherlikher thats too funny! Seriously though thats what it feels like i should do the only person trying to give me any direction is you and solar.I just want to know can i wash my filters in my AP solution then gather any remaing powders tht dont reduce in that solution since the majority of the powders are copper.If i have to incinerate and use nitric is there something else I can do that is beneficial financially for me .For instance can i process the ceramics ,or I have seen a video on youtube before that shows boiling of cpu pins in hcl then after a few hours the foils are collected and I assume since there foils I should be able to process with hcl/cl!"

Take special note to your question about washing your filters in your AP solution then gathering remaining powders that don't reduce as they are copper. 
This statement alone is enough for us to ban you from posting anything again on the forum. AP and copper go hand in hand with that process. There should be no copper in your filters, there are, let alone that many filters to begin with.

Next you ask that if you have to incinerate and... is there something else beneficial financially you can do...
Yes there is...
Take everything to the waste facility and find another means to make money!
Period.
You refuse to take advice and guidance given and simply dive into another mess, losing all your gold because you are rushing and getting frustrated and just tossing it into the waste bucket.

I'm still new here and I've been reading for months on the right way to do things. I would not attempt anything you have done...Anything you have done!!

I have processed fingers in AP. Not even close to a half pound though! Only enough to see and watch what happens. When a problem arose, which it did, I came onto the forum and searched untill I found the exact cause and effect.

You refuse to do any of the required reading the Forum expects of any member.
You watched a couple Youtube will kill! videos and think it's that easy.
IT AINT THAT EASY!!!

The only financial advice anyone can give you is to sell what you have not destroyed and take everything else to someone that has learned how to handle and deal with the mess.

That's it. Nothing more.

B.S.


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## ericrm (Oct 4, 2013)

maybe i have missed it but i didnt read anything about STANNOUS CHLORIDE. so before i offer my (i did the same thing as you advice) do you have stannous chloride ???


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## bomer (Oct 4, 2013)

the only thing in those filters are from the processing of fingers in AP solution. I cant see why anyone would bother to post a reply when it in know way is helpful.I have used the search in this forum and it shows a bit of everything.It does not use any kind of relevance.It often leads me to something off topic.So if your saying that whats in those filters is so toxic its the result of our tap water and finely trimmed fingers with absoluetly no solder visible then I better start buying bottled water. The majority of whats in those filters has to be copper. So that leaves again with the question what should i do with the filters? I am not concerned with anything you have processed ,thats you .It doesnt take from the fact that I am not going to throw my money away ,If I was going to do that I would not of saved everything.I am just hoping to get a sense of what to do next ,I have read over and over the same responses in almost every post.Read Hokes book,put the chemicals away,. This is what fills the majority of the replys and it wastes alot of time and energy reading the same thing.I cant believe how much time those who reply with these same things waste,do you just copy and paste the same answers from a clipboard because I have read these same replys in 80% of the posts. It would be different if the forum was more condensed but its not . So once again you see where I am at.I have processed foils ,So what should I do next ? My question is this I have 40 lbs of cpus , I have a bunch of filters i am gonna just forget those. I am not worried about my waste pot any more ,I will continue to add to that the hcl from cpu washes. Any help would be great , what would be easiest to process next .I have 30 lbs of cpu lids Ive already removed that are gold brazed. I have already begun boiling cpu pins in hcl,I plan on gathering the foils and processing with hcl/cl.With the cpu lids that arent gold brazed can i soak in hcl and sell them as scrap copper.Any help is appreciated thanks.Yes I have tested with stannous chloride .The second batch of foils 
I processed I dropped 5 grams with smb . Later the next day I noticed about 1/4 cup of gold liquid in the dish I used to dissolve the gold with hcl/cl.So I tested it with stannous and it was purple so I poured through coffee filter and tested it again.Again the q tip turned black. So I used SMB and nothing dropped,I know I used way too much SMB but still nothing.


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## Arlea (Oct 4, 2013)

WOW this really re-enforces what I read my first few days here..... What I would do and I think the members are telling you is to STOP, put everything away in a safe place and start reading! When feeling comfortableI would then start with small batches and work out what you need to do before you lose anything. Looks to me like you have a lot to lose...

Good Luck


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## ericrm (Oct 4, 2013)

you have taken out of me the pleasur to help you with that big frustrated answer. and to quote yourself


bomer said:


> I have read over and over the same responses in almost every post.Read Hokes book,put the chemicals away,. This is what fills the majority of the replys and it wastes alot of time and energy reading the same thing.I cant believe how much time those who reply with these same things waste,do you just copy and paste the same answers


 do you realy think that the poeple here havent read a f...g million time your question from a million newb(i was one of those newb too, help me im stuck i dont know what i did)..............
do you think poeple here owe you anything , you wanna be spoon fed and it is the worst thing you can express here .lol you would have been better serve writting im a racist who torture baby you would have loss less.

first off stop what you are doing . your not helping yourself
do a serach on false positive stannous chloride
do a search on copper chloride and vegetable life 
do a search on fiber cpu
do a search on ap
do a search on hcl/cl
do a search on forums must read
do a search on cementation
do a search sulfuric cell
do a search on properly disposing of waste

also you have about 1or 2 g Au, so dont worry too much about that big pile


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## bomer (Oct 4, 2013)

ok so if 40 lbs of cpus is 1-2 grams.I have 65 lbs of RAM .There should be as much gold in the IC on these RAM as on the fingers I processed ,so after I incerate till there white,remove anything magnetic,filter all the ash,can I process with AP.I have seen these chips processed with AR but I havent read anything about using AP.I dont think anyone owes me anything but if I was in a positon to help someone accomplish something,I wouldnt hesitate to help.I appreciate any kind of help I get.


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## bomer (Oct 4, 2013)

Also I have like 30lbs of lids w/o gold brazing ,can I soak those in hcl and recycle for scrap copper.Will hcl remove nickel plating.just wondering?


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

> So I tested it with stannous and it was purple so I poured through coffee filter and tested it again.Again the q tip turned black. So I used SMB and nothing dropped,I know I used way too much SMB but still nothing.



First you say it's purple,then you say it's AGAIN black. Has it been black before? 

After it tested purple and before you added tons of SMB, it didn't drop, - what does that tell you?

Then added "way too much" SMB. What will happen to the next stannous test? (edit: Try to dissolve some SMB in water and test it, maybe your SMB is full of gold and pgm!)

What will happen to your gold and the still dissolved basemetals when you add "way too much" SMB?


From those your two sentences alone, you show a couple of *BASICS* you don't know.


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

> ,so after I incerate till there white,remove anything magnetic,filter all the ash,can I process with AP



This dimension of ignorance is kind of amazing....some more bad kind of amazing. :shock:


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## ericrm (Oct 4, 2013)

bomer said:


> ok so if 40 lbs of cpus is 1-2 grams.I have 65 lbs of RAM .There should be as much gold in the IC on these RAM as on the fingers I processed ,so after I incerate till there white,remove anything magnetic,filter all the ash,can I process with AP.I have seen these chips processed with AR but I havent read anything about using AP.I dont think anyone owes me anything but if I was in a positon to help someone accomplish something,I wouldnt hesitate to help.I appreciate any kind of help I get.



sorry i didnt see your 40lbs of cpu in the picture... i doubt that your had the time to read anything that i strongly suggested you read ,which means you still trying to be spoon fed ...


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## Pantherlikher (Oct 4, 2013)

Dude!!! 
You are not listening!!!
You processed pounds of fingers and have what to show for that? How much gold?
I've processed maybe 1/4lb. if that and have an educated guess at....ready for this...a bunch of shinny gold flakes sitting next to my mouse as incentive for me to stay here and search and read through the forum. Skipping the million Dumbazzes that refuse to heed the advice and learn!.

There is a google custom search box up top here that you can search for anything. Like... How to process CPU lids.
Sure, you will find this post thread there as well as alot of crap. Look for older posts and you will find a wealth of information you have not even touched upon yet.

Like.... Give SMB time to work! I have had a solution sit for 3 weeks untill it finally dropped gold mud. 3 weeks because I got impatient and added to much of something and had to find the cause and effect and how to fix! I did not ask. That's counter productive of me learning how to do it the right way to get the most gold(PMs) from what ever it is I do.

Do a search on "Treating waste solutions" You will find out that there is gold sitting in that bucket you keep adding to and find out why it's important to process that bucket as soon as you can so you don't lose Gold.
Gold
Gold!
Dammit Gold!
The very thing you are blinded by trying to get to.!

B.S.
...The sooner you realize how much we all are tying to help, the sooner you will hold a very nice shinny button to really blind you...


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## Pantherlikher (Oct 4, 2013)

This is from a PM just sent me...



nthawk52 said:


> Panther, I have discovered that there is another forum called "Refinement of Precious Metals" and the members are more than willing to sincerely help you without the redundant answers of "read Hoke's" and "you haven't studied", etc., etc. Reading some of the posts on this forum makes me think some of the replies are from a bunch of Psudo-Einstine's, with delusions of genius
> 
> I don't know how to post a link, but I'm sure you can find it..



Wow again. I am dumbfounded on how people are so needing to have everyone else do thier work instead of learning.

Good luck with that...

B.S.
...You can't fix stupid... The number 1 rule


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## nthawk52 (Oct 4, 2013)

WOW!!! thanks for the slam! what I PRIVATELY sent you were my opinions --- to YOU (i.e. private). Iguess I can now count you in with some of the other posters.

I do my own work, my own research, and yes, I am literate, formally educated, and can understand what I read.

Stupid is unknowing, an Idiot is unteachable!


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## Pantherlikher (Oct 4, 2013)

It wasn't a slam on you personally. Sorry if you took it that way.

It was an excelent example of all of us trying to find the easiest way nto do anything. Most times it's the wrong way.

And please, by all means, count me with the members here that have and continue to help those willing to be helped.

B.S.


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

nthawk52 wrote:


> Iguess I can now count you in with some of the other posters.



I hope you count me in with them, too. Otherwise, I have to become more clear in my future posts. :lol:


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

Since some of you guys (I still respect you!) feel the need to advertise this new forum over there, I feel the need to say, what I think of it. My personal opinion is, if GRF is like a highschool, then this other forum is like a kindergarten. Maybe the right thing for some.


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## AndyWilliams (Oct 4, 2013)

Yes, this board has said it millions of times, "Read Hoke." But it's because it's exactly the right advice. Two words that cannot be improved upon. That's the only advice a refining newb needs. Asking repeated questions without making sincere efforts to find the answers yourself, actually makes finding the answer even more difficult! That is where the clutter comes from. And having the temerity to ignore the advice given is disrespectful. Chances are, your answer is already posted on this site, just not where you want it to be posted. Bomer, it may be that you know the advice is right (please, at least admit that), but, you don't want to follow it because you want this board to serve your needs. Unfortunately, you continue to place this board in a position of having to cater to you, or to stand on its principles. So here's a question for you, why should the board cater to you?

You may be better off on the other board. When you ask your questions over there, they will answer to the best of their ability, and when they can't, they will come here and do your research for you. Personally, I would find no pride in that sequence of events. But, maybe that's not high on your priority list.


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## jimdoc (Oct 4, 2013)

Why is it this thread doesn't surprise me one bit?

Jim


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## AndyWilliams (Oct 4, 2013)

jimdoc said:


> Why is it this thread doesn't surprise me one bit?
> 
> Jim


Because the guys who are too smart for the right advice, still need to ask questions?


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## butcher (Oct 4, 2013)

Actually, we are giving you a chance to learn, trying to convince you of how, and where to begin. 

You need at least a basic understanding.
Otherwise you will get no where.
Without this basic understanding you will not know how to work on your own, and the answers you would get every time you run into a problem from tying things you do not understand, would not make any sense to you, even if you followed them out of this mess, you would just wind up in the next mess.

Bomer, 
Cement your solutions with copper, decant and save the powders from this process (they could contain values, dry them and store them in a jar (label it). dry and store your filters (label them), dry and save any solid material clearly labeling where it came from.

The liquid after the above process is now a mix of copper and other metals, add a sheet of Iron or clean steel, to this to cement the copper, after decanting this solution from the powdered copper, bring the pH up to 9.5, allow the metal sludge to settle, decant solution, and bring its pH back to 7, let it settle again, and decant salt water, dry all of the sludge, both of these can be labeled and taken to your hazardous waste facility.

Now go and study the basics read Hoke's book until you understand clearly what it is showing you.
Go back and study the forum (weeding through those topics like this one here, trying to get you started learning in the right direction).

Get a basic education before you begin again.

If you want to learn to become a gold refiner, study.

If not you are just wasting our time trying to help you.

We can help someone who works to learn, but for a deadbeat who refuses to do the necessary work, there is nothing that can help him learn. no amount of good answers could keep him from losing his gold, and putting others in danger.

Work to become a gold refiner, or sell your scrap, and find another hobby.
Stop wasting your time, and resources, and the time and resources of the forum.


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## moose7802 (Oct 4, 2013)

Bomer, 

I am also new to this forum but let me give you a piece of advise. DO NOT I mean DO NOT reply with a smarta** answer on here if you want anyone to help you!!!! Also theses people tell you to read Hoke's because it is the basis of refining and has everything in it to help you understand why the things happen in these processes the way they do. Now to try and help I would put everything other than trimmed fingers away and process these then refine. This is the absolute EASIST thing to process. Learn that then read up on pins and how to remove them and then process them. I am also a newbie to this but one of the things I have learned in my short time here is give respect to the people on here and you will get the respected and help you want. 


Tyler

P.S. seriously READ on here, just type in a few key words and the processes will pop up and once you have read it re read it until you understand it.


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## AndyWilliams (Oct 4, 2013)

nthawk52 said:


> WOW!!! thanks for the slam! what I PRIVATELY sent you were my opinions --- to YOU (i.e. private). Iguess I can now count you in with some of the other posters.
> 
> I do my own work, my own research, and yes, I am literate, formally educated, and can understand what I read.
> 
> Stupid is unknowing, an Idiot is unteachable!



There's no need to hide your contempt for the folks on this board. It's hypocritical to attempt to be on the two sides of this fence. And attempting to sow discord through PM, shows you are of low character. If you don't like the answers you get here, go there. If they don't know the answer, they'll research it here. That is all you should need to know about which board has the answers. That the members of the other board know they can SEARCH for the answer here, shows the laziness of the people they are willing to "help."

If you do your own research, you'll easily meet the standards of this board. All that is being asked is that someone asking a question, has attempted to research the issue, and maybe even has a potential answer. It is a more rigorous process than just saying, "gimmee," but that's unlikely to be appreciated by those who just want to say, "gimmee!"


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## solar_plasma (Oct 4, 2013)

After all what I observed on this board, it is okay to ask one stupid question, something you read a couple of times, but just have misunderstood or didn't get to knot the right strings together. Also the second or third dumb question is mostly treated with respect and patience. I myself couldn't avoid asking some dumb questions. It's just when people go on and on asking without doing any effort, the tone may become more harsh, - not to belittle people, but in order to try to get them open their ears. 

Don't be scared asking dumb questions, if you have done some effort! I am often not the fastest to understand what I read and I still got good answers everytime I asked anything, which shortly after turned out to be a dumb question. I talk about those, who just have come to the board and ask 10 dumb questions the first day, - even get good valid answers and still carry on saying nobody gives them the right answer.

Brothers, it is just not true, that newbs are treated bad in any kind on this board. I can still call myself a newb. I believe, if you feel it this way, it is probably mostly your own cognitive behaviour, the way you process, what you read in other's visible behaviour, that makes you feel that way. That can happen to all of us. Just get aware of this and communicate it.


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## Harold_V (Oct 4, 2013)

Bomer--

I have received complaints (via PM) from two readers. Their comments amount to the simple fact that you refuse to follow advice that has been tendered, and demand answers to your questions ---answers that most likely will mean little to nothing to you, because you simply do not understand what you're doing. 

I take offense to your comment about the advice you've been given to read. That's exactly what you need. When you take exception to that advice, you are directly telling me that you refuse to cooperate. You, apparently, don't understand that I have no patience for those who do not heel, and that I have the power to terminate your presence on this board. That's a power I exercise gladly when folks have no respect for our operational procedures. Here, we demand that you do your homework and become knowledgeable. You are not excepted from our expectations. 

Be advised---I am through coddling you. Your presence on this forum, thus far, has been less than pleasant. I have no intentions of permitting that to continue. I expect that you will cease asking questions immediately, and start reading---both the forum and Hoke's book. By doing so, you'll uncover answers to many of your questions, but most importantly, you'll gain an understanding of how and why these things work. Only then will answers you demand have meaning, as all they will do is lead to more questions. If you don't stop asking the same questions over and over, and get on with learning the basics, your time here will be over. There will be no further warnings or discussion. _Do as you've been advised, or quietly leave the board. _

Harold


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## maynman1751 (Oct 4, 2013)

Thank You, Harold!


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