# Ph Down



## AztekShine (Mar 4, 2012)

I've searched and search the forum. I found totaly contradicting views. Now I'm really confused.
I don't see a difference between SMB and sodium bisulfite except 1 molecule. 
Havent been back to wallyworld yet but I see Lazersteve useing it for cold nitric production.

Does anybody use ph down to drop gold?

Edit:Any input at all would be much apreciated


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## butcher (Mar 4, 2012)

(SMB) sodium metabisulfite or sodium bisulfite will precipitate gold from chloride solutions.


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## qst42know (Mar 8, 2012)

"PH down" is sodium bisulf_ate_, I don't believe it will precipitate gold.


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## kurt (Mar 8, 2012)

You should be able to get SMB (bisulfite) where ever they sell home brewing beer & wine supplies

Kurt


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## Acid_Bath76 (Mar 8, 2012)

Aztekshine, 

I see that you're in NC like myself. Here's a list of most of what you need, and where you can get it in NC. Most can be found at either True Value Hardware, Lowes, or Home Depot. Hope this helps.

Spectracide Stump Removal, Lowes, Potassium Nitrate (states contents on bottle, and will work for poor man's AR)
HCL, Lowes, 32% HCL
Sodium Pyrosulfite, True Value Hardware, Bonide Stump Remover (this brand/bottle does not state it's contents. You have to google the MSDS). 

Cardinal Chemical supply has a bunch of stuff for sale too. They are located in Aberdeen, and have a really friendly and helpful staff. 

Hope this helps a little. Have a good one. 

-AB


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## dtectr (Mar 8, 2012)

Ph down is, as stated above, sodium bisulFATE. It can't be used to drop gold, but it CAN be used to CLEAN it of flux residue. Jewelers know it as "Sparex 2", a safer alternative to hot sulfuric acid. You dissolve as much of it in very hot water as you can (a saturated solution) and keep it hot and covered. Many just use a crockpot. NEVER use steel utensils in the solution as will contaminate both the solution and the gold placed in it. If this happens, it must be discarded and a fresh batch made. 
Just my dos centavos 
Dtectr


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## Platdigger (Mar 9, 2012)

It should be noted as well that some PH Down is sufuric acid and some is even phosphoric acid.
Check the labels well, or the MSDS sheet.


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## butcher (Mar 9, 2012)

Some Pool chemical

(Bioguard brand) name Chem Out is 94% sodium sulfite, it should work to precipitate gold from solution.

Note the ending in the name ITE not ATE (this ending in the name tells how many oxygen’s) this ending is important in chemical names, as the chemicals with different names work different in solutions.

Here is some other pool chemicals, I only search this one brand, there were many other chemicals like cyanuric acid 100%, also bromating solutions, or trichloro-s-triaznetrone, even copper sulfate solutions, or fancy names for baking soda, and many others here are a few.


(Bioguard brand) name Otimizer Plus, or Inhibit Optimizer Plus, is borax 99% (disodium biborate pentahydrate), or sodium tetraborate pentahydrate).

(Bioguard brand) name Soft Swim Clarrifier C is 27.5% (H2O2) hydrogen peroxide.


(Bioguard brand) name Soft Swim Assist is 20% sodium chlorite and 8% dichloro-s-triazinetrione dihydrate.

(Bioguard brand) name CLC-2 is calcium hypochlorite 47%.

(Bioguard brand) name balancer 200, or pH-Up is sodium carbonate 93%.

(Bioguard brand) name LO-N-SLO is sodium bisulfate.

(Bioguard brand) name Chem-Out is 94% sodium sulfite 




For people who have a hard time finding a chemical reagent to use to precipitate gold if you can get dilute sulfuric acid you can make FeSO4 called copperas an old name =(nothing to do with copper), or also called ferrous sulfate, or Iron sulfate, you can make it with soft iron steel laminates from a transformer, or electric motor (the soft iron plates) that the copper wire of the transformer or motor is wound around, (do not use the steel case), cut iron laminates (welds) separate laminates, burn of shellac, wash, (then I cut them to small pieces) and heat in 10% sulfuric acid, the green ferrous sulfate solution can be crystallized, to nice light green crystals, store damp in a few drops of the acidic solution keep from air, because if they oxidize to brown they will not work, a HDPE plastic bottle will work, (I would not use any bottle with steel lid to store these).

These ferrous sulfate crystals are also handy to test for gold in solution in a spot test (brown ring as gold precipitates on ferrous sulfate crystal), or to remove gold from spot plate test so that you can test for Pt or Pd, in this now gold barren solution that gold may have masked the reaction of the Platinum or palladium in the (stannous chloride test).


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## kurt (Mar 9, 2012)

butcher - you wrote - (Bioguard brand) name Otimizer Plus, or Inhibit Optimizer Plus, is borax 99% (disodium biborate pentahydrate), or sodium tetraborate pentahydrate).

do you know if this is an anhydrous borax or the same as 20 mule team borax

Kurt


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## AztekShine (Mar 9, 2012)

qst42know said:


> "PH down" is sodium bisulf_ate_, I don't believe it will precipitate gold.



I was researching the MSDS for aqua chem and it sent me to the site and I didn't get any info. But every time I search bisulfite ph down would pop up. 

I find out after going to wally world that it's sulfate!  

So last night I pay 400% on SMB  $5 for 2oz!


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## AztekShine (Mar 9, 2012)

And thanks butcher! Awesome post!


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## butcher (Mar 10, 2012)

Kurt I cannot say but I would suspect that the borax comes from the same mine that mule team uses for the borax soap.

After searching this brands MSDS sheets it looks like they like to do like most manufactures today give common chemicals fancy names and call them trade secrets, (some companies will take a common chemical like 99% table salt and add a dash of pepper and call it there secret recipe, they will even keep the information of it being salt out of the MSDS as it is a trade secret and someone may just add regular salt to their soup instead of buying the special new and improved recipe, so now you will pay big bucks for this secret recipe whenever you need some salt, you may even forget that soup uses salt, because all you know is the secret recipe is what makes it good),

This practice seems common nowadays, and seems to help to make the company money, or at least keep them in business, (what is sad is as a culture we are forgetting what common chemical does what and we are relying on these proprietary chemicals, 

I noticed this brand have some chemicals that they either changed name for the chemical or sell the same chemical under two names, they also do not have the MSDS sheets on their web site, you have to request them by phone, but I did find a pool company that had them.


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