# Processing bga chips



## Mitch2580 (Jul 21, 2016)

Hi guys as the title says this will be my first time processing anything and I have learned so much from this site it and the people on it are a wealth of knowledge so I'm going to put a link to a video that I'm going to be following to the letter in about 3 weeks if someone can watch it and get back to me if its 100% the right way as I hold the opinions of members here very high 

http://youtu.be/sXyvpICimmo

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

Hi guys 

I'm guessing by the high number of viewers of this post and no replies that people just don't have the time to watch the hour + long video and I completely understand 
Thank you for taking the time to look 

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## kernels (Jul 22, 2016)

Hi Mitch,

That process pretty much aligns with the standard practice for that type of material on this forum. General issues I've had are:

Make sure you don't burn through the metal container when you do the initial pyrolization and end up with all your chips in the fire. 

Shaking the chips in a can leaves you with longer (more visible) bond wires and internal gold plated wires that are nice to see like you can see in that video, smashing the chips up in other ways leads to smaller particles, the gold is still there, but not as easy to see.

Make sure you remove all the tin beforehand by heating the chips in concentrated HCl

Be careful that you don't lose gold when initially washing the powder, but do try to minimize your material before moving onto using acids. The lower volume you can get your material, the less acid you will use and the less waste you will create. Panning the material with a gold pan works well, but if you are not experienced in this, then just washing as per the video will work reasonably well.

You will find with any youtube video than minor details can be left out because they seem natural to the person doing it for the tenth time, so when you get stuck and am not sure what to do, ask a question here!

Good Luck and most of all, BE SAFE


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## kernels (Jul 22, 2016)

Here is a long thread that also covers the same process: 

http://www.goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=11827

The nice thing about BGA chips in general is that they do not have any/many magnetic parts that have to separated out. That thread deals with regular chips with 'legs', but similar process.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

kernels said:


> Here is a long thread that also covers the same process:
> 
> http://www.goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=11827
> 
> The nice thing about BGA chips in general is that they do not have any/many magnetic parts that have to separated out. That thread deals with regular chips with 'legs', but similar process.



Hi kernels 
Thank you for the reply and the advice I really appreciate it and I will ask if I get stuck on anything I'm going to use coal and a cast iron pot like PATNOR and put some holes in the lid 

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

Sorry I also should of explained I'm doing gold corner bga I think they called north-south 
So as I understand that there is no tin legs 


Mitch


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## kernels (Jul 22, 2016)

That's great, those chips should return even better results than the RAM chips in the video. Did you break the black tops off the green bases ? I think that is pretty standard practice, but I've never tried those myself. Not sure what happens when you burn the green bases (fibreglass)


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## jason_recliner (Jul 22, 2016)

Mitch2580 said:


> I'm guessing by the high number of viewers of this post and no replies that people just don't have the time to watch the hour + long video and I completely understand


Pretty much. I started skipping through bits of it but no one in their right mind will sign off on something without watching the lot. As I said earlier, there's nothing that's not well covered in Patnor's document.
The more time you spend in physical separation and base metal removal, the better. Of course that goes for ALL recovery.



> I think they called north-south


Yes, those are them. I think Pat refers to them as S/N chips, which confused me at first but is obviously the same thing once I realised what he meant. Of course, they're all upside down in that half of the planet. :mrgreen:


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## jason_recliner (Jul 22, 2016)

kernels said:


> That's great, those chips should return even better results than the RAM chips in the video. Did you break the black tops off the green bases ? I think that is pretty standard practice, but I've never tried those myself. Not sure what happens when you burn the green bases (fibreglass)


I've tried that. It's a mess.
They are difficult to incinerate cleanly and completely. They have *very *little gold compared to the black chip.
Just break them off, toss them in AP and forget them for a while.


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## kernels (Jul 22, 2016)

jason_recliner said:


> kernels said:
> 
> 
> > That's great, those chips should return even better results than the RAM chips in the video. Did you break the black tops off the green bases ? I think that is pretty standard practice, but I've never tried those myself. Not sure what happens when you burn the green bases (fibreglass)
> ...



Yep, that's pretty much my plan one day when I have enough of them gathered up. I've heard Chinese whispers that those N/S black tops are good for up to 10g/kg. So work carefully and methodically! You don't want to lose any of those!


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

jason_recliner said:


> Mitch2580 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm guessing by the high number of viewers of this post and no replies that people just don't have the time to watch the hour + long video and I completely understand
> ...



Haha  so true but I love our upside down brothers 

I have separated the green fibre from black tops and my plan was to soak in AP with a bubbler for a few weeks


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

kernels said:


> jason_recliner said:
> 
> 
> > kernels said:
> ...



Wow 10gms a kg I will be happy with 5 for my first time and I've got 2kgs to do I will document it with photos and post my journey on here I don't know if the experienced will want to know but maybe they can creatique my method 

As I don't think I could ever learn everything that this hobby requires 

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## jason_recliner (Jul 22, 2016)

> my plan was to soak in AP with a bubbler for a few weeks


I'm not sure they're even worth the 8c/day for aquarium pump electricity. Maybe if you have a squillion of them. Otherwise I'd toss them in and forget them.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

jason_recliner said:


> > my plan was to soak in AP with a bubbler for a few weeks
> 
> 
> I'm not sure they're even worth the 8c/day for aquarium pump electricity. Maybe if you have a squillion of them. Otherwise I'd toss them in and forget them.


 
Ok I'll keep that in mind I think I'm about to buy 10pounds of the N-S chips of a member for $800 including freight is that a good deal ?


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## kernels (Jul 22, 2016)

Mitch2580 said:


> jason_recliner said:
> 
> 
> > > my plan was to soak in AP with a bubbler for a few weeks
> ...



800 USD or AUD ?


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## jason_recliner (Jul 22, 2016)

Mitch2580 said:


> jason_recliner said:
> 
> 
> > > my plan was to soak in AP with a bubbler for a few weeks
> ...


Without knowing who that member is, nor making any comment on the soundness or prudence of any deal, my advice to ANYONE would be to develop your own technique and find your yield figures before laying out some pretty serious coin on bulk material.

Once you have your own yield values, you wouldn't need to ask the question.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

jason_recliner said:


> Mitch2580 said:
> 
> 
> > jason_recliner said:
> ...



You are right that's not a question I should be asking on an open forum and I think I'll do this 2kgs b4 I buy anything


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## kernels (Jul 22, 2016)

Good idea, the reward is reasonable, but you will be surprised at how much work will be involved in processing 2kg.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 22, 2016)

kernels said:


> Good idea, the reward is reasonable, but you will be surprised at how much work will be involved in processing 2kg.



That's why I love this forum so much common sense and knowledge.  well my next post should be my photos and out come of my process 
Once again thank you guys for everything 

Kind regards 

Mitch


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## upcyclist (Jul 22, 2016)

jason_recliner said:


> my advice to ANYONE would be to develop your own technique and find your yield figures before laying out some pretty serious coin on bulk material.
> 
> Once you have your own yield values, you wouldn't need to ask the question.


DING DING DING! Give that man a prize! :G


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## jason_recliner (Jul 23, 2016)

upcyclist said:


> DING DING DING! Give that man a prize! :G


Ooh, thanks. My very own melted pins ingot!


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## jason_recliner (Jul 23, 2016)

Ok, I've had a bit more of a watch of the video.

I found it painfully slow and still couldn't refrain from skipping little chunks. I don't wish to be ungracious as this gentleman has been kind enough to make a video while I have not. But I think it could be condensed to maybe a third its length.

The pyrolizing, incineration and sieving processes were covered well.

The first AR refine (AR recovery) process was explained comprehensively. But in my opinion he wastes a lot of acid. Even though briefly evaporated down to maybe 80ml or so, he ends up dropping powder from a whopping 700ml or so of solution. All that waste needs to be dealt with.

I'd have evaporated it down slightly thicker to denox, and then only added a touch of HCl based on how much it fizzes up. Not 200ml.
A few drops of sulphuric (or equiv. dash of battery acid) would be good before adding the ice. This helps precipitate lead to a solid sulphate form before the filtering. Or for that matter, it can even help denox. Refer Hoke section V.

I may have skipped over him saying this, but he obviously refined this more than once. You won't get such a shiny button (with pipe) from that single refine and simply melting the black powder it returned.

Overall, very good. He is well set up, knows what he's doing, finished with quality product, and gives good consideration to safety throughout.


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## patnor1011 (Jul 23, 2016)

Few thoughts about value. While mixed and I mean well mixed lots made from many types and sizes of BGA may contain 5g+ of gold in kilogram I have processed BGA S/N IC which returned less than 1g/kilogram. Hence the emphasis on "mixed".
10g/kilogram sound like you are talking about black top part only. I have yet to see or hear about whole BGA S/N IC which do have yield of 10g from kilogram so as I said that number is a yield from black top part only.

- 10 pounds which is 4,5 kilogram of material which may be worth about 950$ bought for 800$ is not a bad deal if they are well mixed variety but as it was mentioned - it is a lot of work :wink: . If you try to speed it up you may get less than expected. If they are of good variety this may be a way to get gold with some small discount providing you do it as hobby and have a lot of free time.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 23, 2016)

patnor1011 said:


> Few thoughts about value. While mixed and I mean well mixed lots made from many types and sizes of BGA may contain 5g+ of gold in kilogram I have processed BGA S/N IC which returned less than 1g/kilogram. Hence the emphasis on "mixed".
> 10g/kilogram sound like you are talking about black top part only. I have yet to see or hear about whole BGA S/N IC which do have yield of 10g from kilogram so as I said that number is a yield from black top part only.
> 
> - 10 pounds which is 4,5 kilogram of material which may be worth about 950$ bought for 800$ is not a bad deal if they are well mixed variety but as it was mentioned - it is a lot of work :wink: . If you try to speed it up you may get less than expected. If they are of good variety this may be a way to get gold with some small discount providing you do it as hobby and have a lot of free time.



Hi patnor 

Thank you for the advice . I've read your thread about 100 times and with that knowledge and the video I think I'm ready for processing the 2.1kg I have they all came off wyse terminals . 
I plain to take my time and if I get stuck b4 I go ahead I will ask you guys on here as you are a wealth of knowledge . I don't think I'm going to buy chips until I know that I can complete the process with results that are on par with people on this site . I'm going to document every thing and post it all when I'm finished . 
im in fact using your coal and castiron pot .
Method .

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 23, 2016)

We have a coal power station near me and I was sitting at a set of lights watching this train pass and I noticed stuff falling off later that arvo it struck me and I went back to the crossing and walked up the track and 20kg free coal


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## kernels (Jul 23, 2016)

Wise words there from Patnor, good luck Mitch, sounds like you have your head screwed on right, just be careful and work safely with the heat and chemicals. Looking forward to hearing your results.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 23, 2016)

kernels said:


> Wise words there from Patnor, good luck Mitch, sounds like you have your head screwed on right, just be careful and work safely with the heat and chemicals. Looking forward to hearing your results.




Thank you kernels I'm at the moment trying to get my fume hood built and find a cost effective filter packing to neutralise everything but if I can't find anything I'm just going ahead with out the filter . Really sorry if my terminology is wrong but as you all know I'm still very green . 
I all so have PPE and respect for the chemicals I'm using so I should be safe 

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 23, 2016)

jason_recliner said:


> Ok, I've had a bit more of a watch of the video.
> 
> I found it painfully slow and still couldn't refrain from skipping little chunks. I don't wish to be ungracious as this gentleman has been kind enough to make a video while I have not. But I think it could be condensed to maybe a third its length.
> 
> ...




Thank you very much Jason for spending 1 hour of your time to watch that video just to help a fellow refiner . 
He has another video about filtering through 3 coffee filters from one beaker to another x10 to get the aqua Rega a crystal clear is this what your talking about and I will use what you say just b4 I add my ice 

Once again thank you 

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## FrugalRefiner (Jul 23, 2016)

Mitch, please do not use text lingo like b4. It does not translate well for our members who do not speak English as their first language.

Dave


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 23, 2016)

FrugalRefiner said:


> Mitch, please do not use text lingo like b4. It does not translate well for our members who do not speak English as their first language.
> 
> Dave



No problem mate


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## jason_recliner (Jul 23, 2016)

Mitch2580 said:


> jason_recliner said:
> 
> 
> > A few drops of sulphuric (or equiv. dash of battery acid) would be good before adding the ice. This helps precipitate lead to a solid sulphate form before the filtering. Or for that matter, it can even help denox. Refer Hoke section V.
> ...



No, that's not it. No matter how many filters are used, they only restrict solids. If you have lead in solution it will go right through, just like gold chloride. The presence of lead is plausible, given the source material. Sulfuric acid can force it out of solution as lead sulphate (solid).

I'll leave you to research that one further; it's scattered all over the forum. Butcher, for one, has made many detailed posts on the subject.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 23, 2016)

Jason 

This is the process I will be following and I will practice a few times to get it down pat 



g_axelsson said:


> Spaceships suggested that I would copy his tutorial from the other forum...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## butcher (Jul 28, 2016)

Mitch,
I enjoyed your video, well done, I look forward to seeing more of your experiments.
I can see you have a fairly good understanding of the process and have been doing your homework, I can see some small details which can be improved upon. Details which will come with more experience. 
Welcome to the forum, I believe you will make a good addition to the Gold Refining Forum, sharing our interest to improve our education, recovering and refining those precious metals.


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## Topher_osAUrus (Jul 28, 2016)

butcher said:


> Mitch,
> I enjoyed your video, well done, I look forward to seeing more of your experiments.
> I can see you have a fairly good understanding of the process and have been doing your homework, I can see some small details which can be improved upon. Details which will come with more experience.
> Welcome to the forum, I believe you will make a good addition to the Gold Refining Forum, sharing our interest to improve our education, recovering and refining those precious metals.



Butcher, its good to see you posting. Its been awhile it seems. Where have you been hiding? Enjoying some nice weather/working?


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## butcher (Jul 28, 2016)

I have been reading the forum as often as I can.

I have been busy lately, Running a hog fuel boiler at a lumber mill, drying lumber and making electricity, until the mill shut down for lack of being able to get lumber out of our woods, which are becoming tinder boxes.
Since the lumber mill has shut down, I have been going to college to get an ASME certificate to weld on pressure vessels (boilers and steam piping), while waiting for the mill to reopen.

I do have trouble with the prerequisite classes like writing and English. I have been spending my nights doing homework in these subjects. Thanks to the forum and in particularly Harold who jumped my case about my terrible writing (my first posts on the forum) where Harold said he could not, or would not read what I wrote, Thank goodness I did not quit the forum because of a bruised ego, and spent my time on the forum trying to improve. I have worked here on the forum over the years to improve my writing, now with schooling maybe I can get more help in that area.

I have also been so busy, I have not been able to recover or refine. I have had a few moments to study some things that interest me but have had no time to any practical experiments with their chemistry (making cyanide is one I have been researching lately) I guess urea can be used for something besides fertilizing my lawn after all.

Topher_osAUrus, I have been reading you posts with interest, you and many of our other fine members have come such a long way. Isn't it wonderful we all have a place like our forum where we can all come together and share what we learn, and help each other with such a fascinating subject?
Take care my friend I have been around, I just have not had much that I can comment on. I guess it is as As Harold's signature line said "Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something."
Well, I am not that wise,I just haven't felt I had much of anything worth saying, or that can be helpful...

Take care, my friend.


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## Topher_osAUrus (Jul 28, 2016)

Thats good to hear butcher. Its sad to hear about your job shutting down, but a good thing that you are a man who's always eager to learn and grow. I myself am getting ready to enroll back into college after a very long sabbatical, only science and math classes, but still a bit intimidating. 

You will most certainly do well at your classes, your english and grammar has developed exponentially over your tenure at this fine forum. Your first posts very much took after your username, but became elegant and well thought out, and that growth didn't take long at all it seemed.

Im glad you are doing well, and hopefully you can try out your new studies soon. I too have been thinking of trying the eco-goldex process, but that will be a while down the road, still a great deal to learn about the subject.

Sorry this derailed the thread a bit, but to fix that-
I just got done doing some incineration of bga's and dip's. Began concentrating them today. They are a lot of work, but any recovered gold is good gold, and to me it is always worth the effort. Nothing good ever came easily.


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 29, 2016)

butcher said:


> Mitch,
> I enjoyed your video, well done, I look forward to seeing more of your experiments.
> I can see you have a fairly good understanding of the process and have been doing your homework, I can see some small details which can be improved upon. Details which will come with more experience.
> Welcome to the forum, I believe you will make a good addition to the Gold Refining Forum, sharing our interest to improve our education, recovering and refining those precious metals.



Hi butcher 

I love to clam that video but it is one I found on youtube and as a new guy to all this it is one I'm using to do my processing from . With all the stuff I have learned in the GRF . I will be documenting my first attempt at recovery and refining though and will video it so that the fine people here can pull me up on any mistakes and also so maybe that some can be proud that I asked questions and read before I started and didn't put a "help just blew up the shed" post hahahahaha .

So in about 2 weeks I hope you say that about my own video  

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 29, 2016)

Topher what are DIP'S ? 
Please forgive my lack of knowledge 

Kind regards 
Mitch


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## rewalston (Jul 29, 2016)

Mitch2580 said:


> Topher what are DIP'S ?
> Please forgive my lack of knowledge
> 
> Kind regards
> Mitch


those are the chips with pins on two sides DIP is Dual Inline Pins.
Rusty


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## Shark (Jul 29, 2016)

DIP or dual inline package. Using "dual inline package" for a search term finds a lot of information. This was one of the first questions I ask.

Edited for clarity


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## Mitch2580 (Jul 30, 2016)

Shark said:


> DIP or dual inline package. Using "dual inline package" for a search term finds a lot of information. This was one of the first questions I ask.
> 
> Edited for clarity



Thank you guys for the info


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## kjavanb123 (Jul 24, 2019)

Hi

I tried the method described here by spaceships and might add the following to it.

I had a 100ml hcl added to some gold foils from relays and added 1ml when it was hot not boiling just hot.

It dissolved the gold and got this orange solution which I kept at the same temperature.

Prepared saturated sulfamic acid solution per instruction in his post, also kept this hot and not boiling.

Added 1ml using a dropper to AR solution and got no reaction, repeated it and still no foaming or any reaction.

So thinking I didnt have excessive nitric acid in my gold solution I let solution on hot plate for 20 minutes then cool to room temperature.

Added half a teaspoon SMB and got the red foams which is an indication of excessive nitiric acid.

I put the gold solution on hot plate and got it to near boiling, added a ml of saturated sulfamic solution, only then I got the foaming up.

So I guess the right temperature as it was once mentioned by Geo is near boiling


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## anachronism (Jul 24, 2019)

Did you add the sulphamic solution to the pregnant solution when the pregnant solution was hot? Sorry I couldn't work that out from what you typed.


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## anachronism (Jul 24, 2019)

Spaceships said:


> Here's a process I have learned and modified to get the best results for denoxing AR solutions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Spaceships *cough cough* did say hot 8) 8) 8)


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## kjavanb123 (Jul 24, 2019)

Yes hot saturated sulfamic acid solution was added first to hot AR solution and nothing happened.

So I added SMB and since it indicated excessive nitric (red foams), I got the AR which now SMB also added to near boil, then addee saturated sulfamic solution and could see bubbling and foaming only at this state.

Best regards
Kj


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## Shark (Jul 24, 2019)

Just curious, but how dirty was your AR? 

It seems to be more of a problem to me when the AR is heavily contaminated with copper. I read somewhere that copper in solution could, under the right conditions, rejuvenate the nitric acid. Wish I had kept that as link as I can't seem to find it now.


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## kernels (Jul 24, 2019)

I think I may generally accidentally avoid this problem since I always cement Gold out of very dirty solutions, Sulfamic is only used for the final clean(ish) solution and I always just add it in powder form (slowly). You also want to add it to a less concentrated solution, so I usually just add some boiling water to my solution before I add the Sulfamic. I aim for a temperature around 90deg C when adding the Sulfamic (slowly)


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## anachronism (Jul 25, 2019)

kernels said:


> I think I may generally accidentally avoid this problem since I always cement Gold out of very dirty solutions, Sulfamic is only used for the final clean(ish) solution and I always just add it in powder form (slowly). You also want to add it to a less concentrated solution, so I usually just add some boiling water to my solution before I add the Sulfamic. I aim for a temperature around 90deg C when adding the Sulfamic (slowly)



It was written for people who were getting started and like you Kernels I use now the solid form too.


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