# Help my gold will not percipitate out



## Scheele35 (Sep 25, 2011)

I have deplated 52 oz of gold plated, some gold filled jewelry. In small amounts( a few pieces at a time) put jewelry in aplastic srainer so no jewelry fell into poor mans AR. approx 1litre. once gold plate removed from jewelry i pull out strainer and remove jewelry. repeated steps until all 52 0z was deplated. I couldn't access Urea and read online Urine may be used as a substitute. and then added storm precipitant and no change gold didn't drop. Please I needed help do I wait until I have some Urea? I tested with Stannous and gold is in solution.


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## qst42know (Sep 25, 2011)

Wipe a few pieces of the remaining jewelry metals with a clean paper towel. Any dark smut on the paper may be some of your gold cementing to the base metals. AR is a poor way to process plated materials. 

There are better ways to be found here on the forum.


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## butcher (Sep 25, 2011)

Scheele35, your way of processing would cost you alot of values lost in the process.

Urea is not needed.

qst42know, a very wise man here on the forum has given you a wise answer.
"There are better ways to be found here on the forum."

If I were you I would take his advice put down the chemistry set for a while and study, you would gain so much from it, not only in metal value but it would also open a whole lot more posibillity's for you.


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## Scheele35 (Sep 25, 2011)

I realize now that this process is the worst for plated jewelry plan to do Hcl/peroxide method next time. As for the wiping with a cloth, I put jewelry strait into water bucket and yes some gold is in there, but most is still in AR solution have tested both with stannous and AR solution quickly turned deep dark purple black, while rinse water bucket and slowly turned a purple brown. Is there a way to percipitate the gold with Urine and water instead of Urea, if so how mush of each is needed?


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## qst42know (Sep 25, 2011)

Put some of your base metals back in, a couple of pieces at a time, until your stannous test shows negative for gold. The result won't be pure but it's as good as any to start over with.

Then you can use an incremental approach when adding the nitric acid so you don't need urea.


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## Scheele35 (Sep 25, 2011)

The result of putting pieces of jewelry is the gold in solution will be the gold plating back on the pieces correct? Then I can put the jewelry in HCl/peroxide this method seems to be one of the correct ways removing gold plate. Am I close?


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## Claudie (Sep 25, 2011)

They are trying to tell you to search the forum for other methods. I think many people use a cell for plated material. You need to do your part and SEARCH the forum and read, read, read. Understand the process you choose to use BEFORE you start it. It will save you time and a headache.


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## qst42know (Sep 25, 2011)

As I understand it sodium metabisulfite (SMB) does not precipitate gold from HCL/peroxide well. 

Using an Ishor kit you likely used too much of everything.

You could use HCL/clorox bleach, clorox in small additions until everything is digested and heat a bit to destroy any surplus chlorine that remains, or HCL/sodium nitrate with evaporation at the end. 

Still you need more study but you are in the right place for that. :mrgreen:


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## Scheele35 (Sep 25, 2011)

Thank you for your advise as far as reading more that is part of my problem on this forum their are many ways to do things. And many giving inadequate info on quite a few posts. Yes I am a new member to the post, but I have been reading the thread and obtaining as much info as possible for the last several months before even attempting Shor,s process on refining with Aqua Regia. I don,t need people to belittle me just help me with the process. I am asking The professionals for help along the way.


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## qst42know (Sep 25, 2011)

No one is picking on you.

In your time here haven't you seen many posts asking the same question you did?

Sort and save your material to process separately. Search the types of items individually keeping in mind there are sometimes several techniques for each type. Ask before you get stuck and someone will point you in a good direction and then you can get better step-wise help.

Read Hoke, watch the many videos, and before you know it things will become clearer.


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## butcher (Sep 25, 2011)

Scheele35 
Here let me help you nobody here will belittle you, the answer's they give will be very useful if you take the advice, the reason they have experience is because the learned. And they are trying to help you learn.

Yes there are many processes and sometimes different ways someone may handle a process, yes the posts are usually not just a book on how to refine or a step by step process of a whole process. as we get a lot of new people wanting to learn and asking really silly questions, there also is so much to this the post would be as big as a book, and also non of us I know of make our living writing books so we do not normally do that.

Your in luck we know someone who will (HOKE's ) she wrote a book for you, explains every detail step by step, she even walks you through some very important experiments, and explains testing. it is a proven fact that someone can become a professional refiner from reading that book (he is a moderator on the forum) and I am sure his advice to teach you to refine would be (read the book).

Here is the best advice I can give, cement all solutions you now have on copper (I do not even know what you have, or care what you have done or learned up till this point), save all powders neutralize them with caustic soda (sodium hydroxide), rinse boiling hot water letting settle while still warm to hot, decant dry powders and store, add iron to your solution and cement copper, decant powders, then add hydroxide to solution to bring PH to about 9 this will form a salt water solution that you can dispose of safely.

forget anything to do with recovery or refining, read Hokes, follow her instructions and experiments, practice making small amounts of solutions to test, run into a problem you do not understand come to the forum and ask one of these fine gentlemen for help, do not take their answer as an insult, consider they have been there and very likely know what they are talking about, and if they do not someone else here will darn sure let them know and set you on the right path, we are only here to learn ourselves and to help others to learn in the mean time, some here no longer refine but spend countless of hours answering the same old stupid questions over and over and over, this takes away from the forum as a whole as it slows all meaningful discussions answering the same ole bull, and wears out those who could help us the most, even to the point that they wonder if spending their time on the forum is worth it to them all they are doing is trying to help people who many just slap them in the face and say they know better they just want a simple answer tell me where my gold is why should I read a stupid book just tell me a simple answer how to refine and make it simple I do not have much time and want to know in ten sentences or less, hurry dag nab it I already dissolved my gold or what i thought was gold and this bank teller here is expecting me to hand her the money from my refined gold (which I do not know if is in solution or powders or if I flushed it, do I just pee on it to neutralize it ).

To learn to fly it takes some study and practice, but putting yourself in the pilot seat with neither is foolish,.

This post I made is not to belittle you on the contrary my intent is to help you understand, there is a lot to learning this, it is confusing when you first start, but like anything of this nature you have to be willing to do your homework and it will always be challenging so do not give up when things get tough.


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## Scheele35 (Sep 25, 2011)

Thank you Butcher, I realize I have more reading of Hoke,s book on refining. Have been getting steps from Shor and followed to a T . Also getting advice from someone who claimed to be doing the same process as I am for several years and has been successful. I am starting to question this? I will do as you say and cement out with copper. I have read Hokes book obviously not enough because I still chose to process this way. I really appreciate everyone's time answering my questions.


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## butcher (Sep 25, 2011)

Scheele35, You are smart man, and your going to be adding refining to your education, and gold to your poke, Hoke's will walk you through experiments with acids and metals, doing these will help you to get some lab work in and besides sometimes that is the funniest part of refining is seeing the acids change beautiful colors, and discovering what it is composed of. Really your making a good choice, and you are not wasting your time studying (to not study you would have not only wasted much time but valuable metals to boot).

Ask question when you do not understand something, keep us posted on how your doing, soon you will be helping the new guy (and telling him to read HOKE).

Also the post welcoming the new guy, it has some things to get you started like the general reaction list, and of course you know about laser Steve's web site and video's, or GSP's electronic book on silver refining.


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## Palladium (Sep 26, 2011)

The best piece of advice i would give you besides read Hoke would be to lose Shor's phone number and throw anything away they sent you. 

Welcome to the forum.


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## Harold_V (Sep 26, 2011)

Scheele35 said:


> I will do as you say and cement out with copper. I have read Hokes book obviously not enough because I still chose to process this way. I really appreciate everyone's time answering my questions.


You are not alone. It is common for those that hope to recover gold to seek a shortcut---but there are none. You will come to understand that you have been duped by these people. In many cases, they'd rather see you fail than admit they don't know, themselves. It's a human type of reaction, generally from people of questionable character. I've known many in my years. 

What you've done, thus far, is, in effect, look for your lost wallet where the light was strongest, not where it was lost. You also have appeared to seek support of an ill-thought concept instead of accepting the fact that you are mislead. 

My advice? Do as butcher has advised. He is amongst the most logical people on this forum and has nothing in mind but your best interest. Cement the values with copper, then learn proper techniques before venturing forth again. Also, lose the notion that you can recover plated values by dissolution in AR---because the problems created by base metals will be no end to grief. You would be far better served to study a sulfuric stripping cell if you intend to stick with non-ferrous plated materials. 

Harold


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