# IC chips



## worker0 (Jan 17, 2020)

Heloo,

Few days ago I got about 1 KG IC chips from RAM memory.
Today I put chips in glass baking pot and cover with H2SO4 about 2 inches from chips.

Ignite fire under ( wood stove ) and boil for 2 hours for now.

1 hour afer boiling ammount of H2SO4 allmost evaporated and I add 1 more liter of accid. Before I added acid there is some H2SO4 but it did not want to boil even higher temparature. Then I added 1 moere liter and wait. It boils slowly for now, but chips looks allmost same when I added them in acid. How long they need to lay in boiling acid until achieveing desired change? H2SO4 is 34%

Thanks


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## FrugalRefiner (Jan 17, 2020)

Please tell me you're not doing this in an enclosed space!

Sulfuric acid is dangerous. Concentrated, boiling sulfuric acid is extraordinarily hazardous!

Since you're starting with 34% acid, you probably boiled away all the water and perhaps some of the acid.

What "desired change" are you expecting?

Dave


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## worker0 (Jan 17, 2020)

I buy 34% and it declared on the bottle as 34% H2SO4.

No Im doing this outside  ( dont worry )

Waht I expect? I expect to remove plastic or resin which cover golden wires.

EDIT: Boiling for 2 hours and 30 minutes. Top of dish is full of black foam, but not yet visible wires. I removed foam with piece of wood and put in barell for waste disposal company. After foam removing I added abot 0,5dL of acid and it reacted vigorously. What is wrong?

EDIT: 4 hours cooking. I get only black plastic foam but still no wires visible. Decided to dispose acid in disposal barrel and put new acid. In link is picture afrer disposing acid and before putting new one. What Im doing wrong ?
https://ibb.co/PNSbynJ


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## rickbb (Jan 17, 2020)

worker0 said:


> What Im doing wrong ?
> https://ibb.co/PNSbynJ



You are using acid, that's what you are doing wrong. 

The standard processing for chips is to incinerate, use a magnet to remove iron/steel then use water flotation, (panning), to recover any gold.

Assuming of course you are trying to recover gold.


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## worker0 (Jan 17, 2020)

Yes, gold...

I seen people using acid to dissolve resin/plastic. With success.

I ended batch. Put acid in barell for disposal and wash and collect IC chips. Some if them get opened and I extracted nice gold plate from it.they are much softer now and I can brake it with finger.

I dont understend why is this way wrong when people use it. I assume that acid was too weak or strong or ammount of 1L 34% for 1 KG of chips is insufficient?


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## FrugalRefiner (Jan 17, 2020)

I believe what you're trying to do is known as wet ashing. It is an extremely dangerous process. Since I've never attempted it, I am not qualified to give any advice on the process.

Dave


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## worker0 (Jan 17, 2020)

Yes wet ashing. Is someone try this method so we can discuss bout it and point me to mistakes?


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## FrugalRefiner (Jan 17, 2020)

Worker, in my opinion your mistake is in attempting this process without having a complete understanding of it and the hazards. I'm not trying to be mean. It's just that the process is probably one of the most dangerous ever discussed on the forum. Sulfuric acid is dangerous. Concentrated sulfuric acid is very dangerous. Boiling, concentrated sulfuric acid is unbelievably dangerous.

I've seen videos of people doing this with no protective equipment at all, just as you probably have. I've also seen photos of people who have been burned by sulfuric acid. They are horribly disfigured, if they survive at all.

My advice would be to find a different process that is less dangerous.

Dave


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## worker0 (Jan 17, 2020)

I weared all protective gear and read all safety instructions, even prepared base solution if something go wrong. Equiepment and protective gear - lab grade. 
Yes very dangerous and definitely most dangerous process.
Thank you


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## galenrog (Jan 17, 2020)

I would consider grabbing the popcorn for this thread, but I have the feeling this comedy will end in tragedy. Wet ashing? Really? 

Just to start, can you please detail how, step by step, you will mitigate fumes from boiling sulphuric acid, such that you do not destroy your lungs, the health, and the property of those around you. Simply doing this outside shows you have no idea how to mitigate dangers of your process, and likely do not have experience enough to understand what wastes you are creating and how to process these wastes for disposal.

Then, again, I am only four days post-op, and am still on pain medication. So perhaps I am understanding this wrong. If Dave would chime in again, I will check in again after a short nap.

Time for more coffee. Sorry, no rum with the oxycodone. Will put that back in the coffee in a few weeks.


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## jarlowski1 (Jan 17, 2020)

I really hate how people see things on youtube and automatically assume just because one fool/idiot does something that makes it safe.

WORKER stop trying to do this process. If so much as just 1 drop of water gets into that boiling sulfuric acid it will erupt/explode causing boiling sulfuric acid to go everywhere. Even moisture in the air can cause this. It can dissolve the clothing that you are wearing in less time than it would take you to realize what happened. I had a friend that had this happen with a full pot of molten lead ( we are plumbers) he is permanently scarred. He is lucky it didn't splash on his face.


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## FrugalRefiner (Jan 17, 2020)

galenrog said:


> Then, again, I am only four days post-op, and am still on pain medication. So perhaps I am understanding this wrong. If Dave would chime in again, I will check in again after a short nap.



Galen, I don't want to leave you hanging, but I think I've already said what I can here. Even on meds, I think you have a solid grasp on the dangers. I just want others who may read this thread in the future to understand this is not a good idea.

Dave


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## archeonist (Jan 17, 2020)

I have done wet ashing once in a fume hood and a protective glass window, on small scale. It was scary and I will never do this again. Doing this outside is just too dangerous, if you inheale just a tiny bit of the fumes, you create sulfuric acid deep inside your lungs. A lab coat and gloves do not protect you from hot sulfuric acid.


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## galenrog (Jan 17, 2020)

FrugalRefiner said:


> galenrog said:
> 
> 
> > Then, again, I am only four days post-op, and am still on pain medication. So perhaps I am understanding this wrong. If Dave would chime in again, I will check in again after a short nap.
> ...



Thank you, Dave. I noted several years ago that you are a lot smarter, and far more experienced in precious metal recovery than I will ever be. Just wanted to ensure my drug influenced post was not far off the mark.

The best thing I ever did regarding precious metal recovery was to learn my limitations. Due to these limitations, including regulatory, waste management, time, space, equipment, and a myriad of other limitations, I do little beyond recovery. If I can not set up a proper illustrated flow chart for a procedure, from beginning to end, including all anticipated problems, then I can not do it at this time. Don’t have proper equipment? Set idea aside. Watching trains with my grandson it more important than any of this.

Two significant surgeries in three weeks. Damn, I hate getting older. At least right now I do.


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## worker0 (Jan 17, 2020)

Ok friends. No more wet ahing. To be honest I saw 4 or 5 videos "detailed explained". People did not have any protective gear or anything. It does not mean that I dont need. They treated acid like it is water, but whatever.

I chosse wet ashing because when I was in one discussion somebody ( here on forum ) told that incinerating can damage gold. It was disscussion about 0,5 x 0,5 pin in 200 rows. Connector from SATA controller for SAN network. Pin is very sharp and have protection from extracting when pulled or pushed, and I ask another member how to do it, they said use hammer. Plastic is so hard that hammer cant do anything to it and asked for incineration. Answer was that incineration can damadge gold and black "tar" (black trace of evoparated plastic. and that I dont know how to use hammer. ...... ) destroyed my gold plating. Is it true at all???

For fumes I used Fans from same server - high speed high pressure fans 4 of them ( 2 in each PSU ) and put on hood to suck all gases and "inject" into second stove in which I kept really big and hot flame. Something like afterburner,but different. I did not want to ignite and waste acetilene for this batch which is first and obviously last for me.

Can we just analyse next things:
Incineration of gold plated pins in that connector will damage gold?
Incineration of SIM cards will destroy gold?
And Ireally would like to knowwhere I made mistake, even I will never again use thiss process? IT is HAOTiC REALLY. Even when boiling and add etc0,2dL of acid it react vigorously, so would like to know how this messy process work even I will never use it agin, chemist making youtube videos in which they finish in 20 minutes.. does anyone have enough time/ 7 minutes to watch and say what is wrong with process from video/ to elabprate this and help other members and me? 

Thanks in advance.


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## snoman701 (Jan 17, 2020)

You have to pyrolize first, then incinerate. 

Direct Incineration will result in losses of gold. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## worker0 (Jan 17, 2020)

Pirolysation here will prepare materail for incineration since T


snoman701 said:


> You have to pyrolize first, then incinerate.
> 
> Direct Incineration will result in losses of gold.
> 
> ...



incineration will make tempareature higher than gold boiling point you mean or it will get lost etc smelt to small invisible pieces. What to you mean under that?


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## patnor1011 (Jan 18, 2020)

I suggest you read my post in my signature line. All you need to know about the method you can use. 
Wet ashing - just forget about that. I am not going to tell you what you did wrong and do not take this in a bad way - I just do not trust that you will not be tempted to try it again. 
From what you said you did till now you are simply not prepared, equipped and experienced enough to do it safely so just forget about it. 
I can say that I recovered quite a bit of gold and do have some knowledge and experience after many years yet to this day I steer clear from sulfuric acid and do not go within 2 meters to hot sulfuric acid even while it is in a fume hood with the hood window closed. I am THAT careful as hot concentrated sulfuric is outright deadly stuff.


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## worker0 (Jan 18, 2020)

Hmm but what is problem if they are burned? I see 1 refiner burned 2 or 3 batches wothout any problems?

Im not interested for wet ashing anyore, it is copmlicated, more expensive, and more dangerous in comparasion to burning/pyrolising.

Really I dont even think anymore about H2SO4. Pyrolising is way easyer, at least for me. Just willing to learn from mistakes.


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## kurtak (Jan 18, 2020)

worker0 said:


> Hmm but what is problem if they are burned? I see 1 refiner burned 2 or 3 batches wothout any problems?



worker0

Improper burning of E-waste produces "VERY toxic" fumes, gasses & vapors (which is what most if not all back yard "you tube" refiners are doing) 

there are "proper" ways to do this - BUT - it "requires" setting it up with "proper" equipment &/or place to do it 

Read what I just posted in the Safety section with the tread titled "What about beryllium in IC chips"

then read the threads I suggest in that post

It is IMPORTANT that you understand that ALL processes for processing E-waste are "toxic & hazardous" to you & the environment around you & "require" that you set up to do this with PROPER equipment to deal with the "toxic" by products you product when processing E-waste -- just because you see people doing it in their back yard does not mean it is safe - in FACT - most of them are slowly but surely POISONING them selves that will lead to serious health problems - including but not limited to early death (shorten their normal life span) 

To do this safely & properly you need to start by doing A LOT of research - starting with researching "Safety" & "Equipment" & "dealing with waste" 

Kurt


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## lanfear (Jan 18, 2020)

The reason your reaction reacted violently was because you took 37% H2SO4 and boiled it to a consentrate. Then you poured a solution with 63% H2O into hot consentrated sulfuric acid. Does this sound like a good idea? You were lucky..


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## worker0 (Jan 18, 2020)

I agree with you completely. In this batch I burned evaporated gases.

I get upset when see how "youtubers" doing it. Specially guys which boiled 150 KG of IC chips. Even watching that is poisonus.

Fumes from acid I reburned in another stove, on about 800º C ( thermometer says ), and rest of leftover acid is in barell for waste disposal company.

I look to save environment and be environmental friendly  

Wet ashing is terrible, and to be honest pirolysis is easyer and more friendly. I just wanted to know where I made mistake. I suspect on acid, it is car battery acid. Maybe too weak. Concentrated H2SO4 is very dangerous and water hungry. Long sleeves, and full body cover... Again says just wanted to know where I made mistake. I dont touch it never again... 




lanfear said:


> The reason your reaction reacted violently was because you took 37% H2SO4 and boiled it to a consentrate. Then you poured a solution with 63% H2O into hot consentrated sulfuric acid. Does this sound like a good idea? You were lucky..



I know. Violent reaction when adding it again was because of water. It must be done in one batch and is this acid too weak or strong for this?

PS: to dont open new thread: I have some connectors which is very hard to dissmantle. Is it possible to use pyrolisis process on them? Wired material hard and elastic plastic. I know it sounds crazy. If i pirolyse this material to make plastic crispy and crush with hammer, will I damadfe gold? Example if plastic leave color on plated fingers?


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## lanfear (Jan 18, 2020)

Youtuber "999 Dusan" tried this with battery acid, and it was not possible. Please take some time and learn before you attempt stuff. Also ask questions insted of experimenting.


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## worker0 (Jan 18, 2020)

lanfear said:


> Youtuber "999 Dusan" tried this with battery acid, and it was not possible. Please take some time and learn before you attempt stuff. Also ask questions insted of experimenting.



Watched him maybe 2 weeks ago and they did wet ashing with success. I did not find video with battery acid. In video which do it with sucess, they dont mention strenght of acid. Only reason I conclude is my acis was too weak. Right?


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## lanfear (Jan 18, 2020)

Find his video and see for your self. He is one of the better refining youtubers


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## Geo (Jan 24, 2020)

I don't allow discussion of wet ashing on anything I moderate. I understand the need to know what not to do but to give a detailed process to people with no real experience is as close as you can get to assisting someone to destroy their health and perhaps maim themselves. One slip, or trip, or act of god and it could trigger a life altering event that a person will never fully heal from. Just to say that it is bad and dangerous is not really as dramatic as it should be. People watch a ten minute video and think that it must be very simple.


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## Geo (Jan 24, 2020)

I believe you are talking about Mr. Iqbal. I would warn anyone not to repeat what you may see on his videos. Just the over inflated yields from starting material to, presumably, final product alone should give people a reason to doubt the veracity of the whole video.


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## DarkspARCS (Jul 9, 2020)

worker0 said:


> Heloo,
> 
> Few days ago I got about 1 KG IC chips from RAM memory.
> Today I put chips in glass baking pot and cover with H2SO4 about 2 inches from chips.
> ...



Worker.....

Please review this thread for more details

http://www.goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=11827


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## Geo (Jul 21, 2020)

snoman701 said:


> You have to pyrolize first, then incinerate.
> 
> Direct Incineration will result in losses of gold.
> 
> ...



How does direct incineration equate to gold loss? The boiling point of gold is 5378°F. Incineration occurs at 1,560°F. Much lower than the boiling point of gold.


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## galenrog (Jul 21, 2020)

Incineration, to some, evokes images of lots of flame and lots of smoke. I would think that if an incineration method that generated a lot of smoke was used, a small amount of gold, perhaps immeasurable, may escape with smoke. Of course, I could be wrong in this assumption. If so, then if I remember long enough to add to my notes, then I will have learned something.

Before I dismantled the lab, leaving only silver recovery stations, I followed a procedure that first involved pyrolysis. It may have been based on the thread darkspARCS provided the link to.

Time for more coffee.


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## Yggdrasil (Jul 21, 2020)

If I'm not mistaken the losses will appear during the recovery part.
The pyrolysing removes most of the volatiles and the incineration if done correct, will convert all the carbon residue to CO2 so it doesn't load up with your gold during leaching.
That is my understanding at least. :wink:


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## sena (Jul 21, 2020)

I have done wet ashing several times some time 25 kg to 30 kg , this method only works better for square chips , flat pacs ,thinner one in ram slots and it doesn’t fit for rectangular chips as the yield will be low and due to thick epoxy 
The best way I found is to incernate the chips grind in ball mill , filter in steel mesh to separate the metallic pins and run through shaking table 
After attempted several times the yield is better in incernation and safer was avoiding wet ashing 

Thanks 
Sena


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## snoman701 (Jul 24, 2020)

Geo said:


> snoman701 said:
> 
> 
> > You have to pyrolize first, then incinerate.
> ...



It's not the boiling point of gold, it's the boiling point of gold chloride/bromide.

There's all kinds of nasties in that plastic including halogenated compounds that complex gold. A combination of halogen gas and heat will oxidize and complex gold. Add the violent atmosphere of incineration and that gold goes away in fume. 

You are reminded of the smelting process for silver chloride. Mix silver chloride with soda ash, heat slowly, covered. Losses are still severe. 

In pyrolysis the chlorine is still released, but the slow movement of the gasses because of the more gentle process allows the gold to be reduced back to metallic, adsorbed upon the carbon. When you get to the incineration stage following pyrolisis, no halogens remain, so your carbon is oxidized to CO2, leaving only ash and the adsorbed gold.


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## Geo (Jul 25, 2020)

That would still be lost. If it's not heavy enough for the gold wheel or the blue bowl, it's lost in the ash. I did a refine of chips for lazersteve and sent a sample of the left over ash and silica to have analyzed. He said there was some silver but no gold. If there are losses, it will have to be considered acceptable losses. I haven't figured out any better way so far.


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## vbrabble (Aug 16, 2020)

I just want to thank everyone here because I considered wet ashing (very briefly) because I didn't want to incinerate ic chips either. 

I am trying to learn and as a person who hasn't refined one gram via any process, I'm going to put the IC chips in a jar and let them sit awhile ... a long while.

I believe I have enough fingers to practice using other methods.

I just want to say thanks!


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## jarlowski1 (Aug 17, 2020)

Thank you Vbrabble, I am glad you chose to be safe. Study the processes that are used for each different type of material you have and stick to the tried and true methods and you will do just fine. Remember to read up on how to dispose of your waste properly.


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