# Quotation Help



## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 7, 2017)

Dears,

Have anyone dealt with material like the below ?

They are pins/connectors and other stuff extracted from telecomm boards.

The lot is about 15Kg of such material.

Need your help for quoting this lot


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## geedigity (Dec 7, 2017)

Hard to say based on the random mix of materials in it. I think Topher toll refined some items that look similar. Maybe he will chime in if he sees this post?


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## everydayisalesson (Dec 7, 2017)

Make sure you have a real good idea of whats in the middle of the pile, and whats at the bottom of the pile. Remember that looks are deceiving and everyone likes to think they have more than what they do.

Mike


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## Lino1406 (Dec 7, 2017)

The gold here is very very thin, may not be worth the effort


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## anachronism (Dec 8, 2017)

Lino1406 said:


> The gold here is very very thin, may not be worth the effort



Hi Lino

On this equipment it's not thin at all Sir. It's far thicker than that on normal IT.


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 8, 2017)

anachronism said:


> Lino1406 said:
> 
> 
> > The gold here is very very thin, may not be worth the effort
> ...



So what do you think they might worth per KG ?


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## anachronism (Dec 8, 2017)

You have a wide range of gear there- it's actually difficult to give a definitive answer to that question.


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 8, 2017)

anachronism said:


> You have a wide range of gear there- it's actually difficult to give a definitive answer to that question.



If I have the price range then I can average the whole lot ?

So is there any price range for stuff like this ?


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## g_axelsson (Dec 8, 2017)

There is so large span of that scrap, ceramic CPU:s, fingers down to gold plated aluminium. Without knowing how much of each grade / class of scrap there is any number given will be wild guesses. Even simple things like CPU:s could range between 30-40 g/kg down to less than a gram.

There are only two ways to get a decent approximation without refining the whole lot and that is by sampling and assaying or calculate the surface area of all pieces.

Faced with a lot like this I would only buy it at a low price (basically no more than what I could guarantee to get from the pieces I know the yield of) or offer a toll refining deal. There is a lot of work, sorting through the scrap and processing different parts in different ways.

It takes time and money to build up the experience to be able to spot a good deal. If you make a bid, look at it not as something to earn money off, rather look at it as paying for an education. Then the next time you will have a better feeling for which pieces are scrap and which are worth your time and money.

Göran


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 8, 2017)

Yes exactly, I realized that there are many things.

However, I can segregate the whole lot into 3 categories:

1- Gold plated connectors/pins
2- Mixed Ceramic CPUs (w/ gold caps and w/o)
3- Gold plated amlumnuim

Fingers are very small amount of the lot

So is it now ok to get prices or even price range for each category per KG or lb ?


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## nickvc (Dec 8, 2017)

It might be better for you and us if you could ask the seller what he wants for it, if the price is way over the top you will be told if it is under the true value again you will be told but they will be gut feeling guesses but from people who know.


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## Topher_osAUrus (Dec 8, 2017)

Why dont you tell us what he is asking for everything (as well as how much of everything there is) and we can tell you to either run away as fast as you can, or buy it. Seems like its usually the first, because people like to get the most money they can out of their scrap. ...its only human nature..

I did in fact run stuff similar to a couple different items in the pictures you posted earlier. But, I cant give you exact numbers on the things I ran, mainly because I threw it in with the rest of the toll martial once the process line progress was on an even keel. I have a ballpark idea, and thats good enough for me, but I can't relay them on to you, because then I will be the jerk who lied to you and manipulated you into a failed scrap venture. Can't do it, wont do it. Sorry

Had this typed this morning and got side tracked. I agree with nick, completely


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## snoman701 (Dec 8, 2017)

I imagine there is no asking price, because the seller has no clue how much it's worth, or the offers he has gotten haven't been what he's thought it was worth.

Ie, he's looking for a sucker.

BUT...

When I see a box like that, I expect bottom could be full of litter that their cat gave a :G shower to...and nobody wants that.

Seriously...ambiguity can be the sellers friend or the buyers friend, but not both. 

As for some numbers, they are all on the forum. 

You can use pentium processors, pentium pro processors for the ceramic chips.

For the gold plated pins, they start at 0.1 grams Au / lb and I just posted an assay that was 1.4% Au which was much much higher than pins ever come out at. Recovery difficulty for gold plated aluminum and stainless tends to go up as well, or at least the time it takes.


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## g_axelsson (Dec 8, 2017)

Take a look at boardsort or similar site, they advertise their buy prices so there is an average that leaves some profit.
Well characterized scrap like pentium pro CPU:s is easy, but when it comes to random connectors or plated aluminium there can be big variations.

For the aluminium you could calculate the area of the gold plating and use some of the plating calculators on the net or just use math to calculate a reasonable volume of gold. An eraser could be used as a rough tool to check the thickness of the plating.

Just as Topher, I won't give you any numbers. I don't have any yield numbers on that type of scrap, and even if I had I wouldn't want to take the risk to give too high an estimate and then you loose a lot of money.

I get scrap like that but often for free in the form of unsorted equipment, I just have to haul everything away. Anything I get for free I just throw in a common bucket. Larger pieces are processed when I get too much accumulated and need the space back or if it is a decent amount to start up the sulfuric cell. In the end I just accumulate the gold powder.  

Göran


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## anachronism (Dec 8, 2017)

All of that equipment is from one source. Nortel enterprise telecoms. It's a grade of equipment that very few people on here have had the chance to refine in any quantity and using plating calculators and the analogies that work with other IT equipment just will not work. 

Two people have suggested the best course of action. Break it down by group, and tell us what you can pick it up for and I'll tell you whether its a good deal or not. 

Jon


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## snoman701 (Dec 8, 2017)

anachronism said:


> All of that equipment is from one source. Nortel enterprise telecoms. It's a grade of equipment that very few people on here have had the chance to refine in any quantity and using plating calculators and the analogies that work with other IT equipment just will not work.
> Jon



Hey Jon....the backplanes on these, about 6mm thick, is that still high yield even with the added plastic weight?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## anachronism (Dec 8, 2017)

Yes.


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 8, 2017)

Thanks a lot dears for trying to help me 

The seller asked for almost 112 US$ per kg for the whole lot without segregation.

However, I'm the one who asked him to segregation as I think that they are different things that needs different prices with stuff that should be less than he asked for.

For example, I think that the gold plated aluminum should be bought for less as it weights much more than gold plated pins/connectors.

The same goes for ceramic CPUs that should be bought for less than he asked for.

Am I correct in my thoughts ?

And is it a fair price or what ?


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## 4metals (Dec 8, 2017)

It comes down to what thickness the gold plating is. If it is mil spec it is at least 100 microinches. then it's a matter of the surface area. It's a lot of calculating and GSP has done it many times explaining the math. 

If you want someone to do all the work so you can bid on this you are barking up the wrong tree. 

At best someone with experience with telecom or other high end gear can tell you what the plating spec's run in terms of thickness of the gold plating.


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## anachronism (Dec 9, 2017)

$112 per Kg unseparated is unrealistic as a general buy price. Walk away.


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## g_axelsson (Dec 9, 2017)

Second that, way too high price. Just walk away as the seller has a too high expectation to even make it possible to do a deal with reasonable prices.

The only way I would pay something like that is if I could cherry-pick the scrap I want and only pick the high yield components.

Göran


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 16, 2017)

Many thanks dears 

Still don't know what is the reasonable price for such lot.

I managed to get 1 piece of the gold plated aluminum and it was 15g .. the gold yield out of this piece was 0.11g of gold .. so 1 kg of such material would yield something around 7g.

So if i managed to segregate this lot into 3 groups:

1- Gold plated connectors/pins
2- Mixed Ceramic CPUs (w/ gold caps and w/o)
3- Gold plated amlumnuim

How much should i pay for each group ?!


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## Lino1406 (Dec 16, 2017)

It seems there's no need to hurry. The main considerations are: How I deal with it, how to dispose what remains


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 21, 2017)

Finally, and after long debates, I bought this lot for 70 US$ per KG.

I tested some items and it was +ve for gold but of course don't know how much.

These are the photos for some some segregated items:












Now what do you think .. do they worth ?

Also, what is the best process for them is it the sulfuric stripping cell or something else ?

And what about using chemicals Nitric/CuCL2 .. etc ?


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## jimdoc (Dec 21, 2017)

ahmadbayoumi said:


> Now what do you think .. do they worth ?




I guess now it is up to you to prove that it is worth more than you paid for it.
I think you paid too much.


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## anachronism (Dec 21, 2017)

If you bought it as a test sample to learn your processes for recovering gold then whilst a high price, you have plenty of good grade gear to learn from. 

If you bought it to make a quick profit without the knowledge of HOW to recover the gold then you've paid too much as Jim says. The dichotomy here is that you do need to burn money initially in order to learn processes and yields. As an aside I have a lot of this equipment and it originally gathered dust for over 2 years before I learned the best way to process it. There are many members on here with much more experience than you currently have who would give their eye teeth for a batch like this. 

It's not what I would recommend starting your learning journey on but you've done it now, so it is what it is, and you now have a good supply of gear to begin your journey.


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 22, 2017)

The main reason for buying these stuff is learning in terms of the process used for this kind of stuff and for future use to be able to qualify and quantify them later.

But of course, i don't mind to get profit out of them.

So now, i need your help to determine the best or the most suitable process for them ?

Is it the sulforuric stripping cell ?

Or should I use normal processes Nitric, Cl/H202 and CuCl2 ?

Or CN should be my best option here ?


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## Topher_osAUrus (Dec 22, 2017)

Theres no one process to run all your loot.

That stuff will have to seperated and each segregated lot will be ran in one of multiple ways.

Dont throw it all in one batch and run it all, you will lose half or more of what little gold is there.


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## ahmadbayoumi (Dec 22, 2017)

Thanks Topher .. This is exactly what I'm intending to do.

Will share with you the segregated groups.

Thank you very much all for helping me


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## snoman701 (Dec 22, 2017)

anachronism said:


> If you bought it as a test sample to learn your processes for recovering gold then whilst a high price, you have plenty of good grade gear to learn from.
> 
> If you bought it to make a quick profit without the knowledge of HOW to recover the gold then you've paid too much as Jim says. The dichotomy here is that you do need to burn money initially in order to learn processes and yields. As an aside I have a lot of this equipment and it originally gathered dust for over 2 years before I learned the best way to process it. There are many members on here with much more experience than you currently have who would give their eye teeth for a batch like this.
> 
> It's not what I would recommend starting your learning journey on but you've done it now, so it is what it is, and you now have a good supply of gear to begin your journey.



This is the best advice you have received. I too have a reasonable amount of this, and after a year I'm just now starting to process it. 




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## modtheworld44 (Dec 22, 2017)

ahmadbayoumi

If you bought the whole 15kg lot of what you showed in your first picture of this post,then you did great!!!!

I have never been disappointed by that kind of material and I've been processing that kind for the past 5-6 years.

Search and read my posts for some good yield data on that kind of material.Thanks in advance.



modtheworld44


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## ahmadbayoumi (Jan 13, 2018)

modtheworld44 said:


> ahmadbayoumi
> 
> If you bought the whole 15kg lot of what you showed in your first picture of this post,then you did great!!!!
> 
> ...




Seems you are correct modtheworld44 

I ran a 2 tests for about 320g and 420g of 2 different items and the results was amazing for me ... 3g (after washing) out of 740g mixed materials so 1k should yield at least 4g of pure gold.

This is while ignoring the remaining gold in the cell that would be added to the next patch.

So for me it seems it was a very good bargain .. at least for now.


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## ahmadbayoumi (Jan 13, 2018)

I need to thank every one in this forum .. I really like it very much as you helped me a lot dears.

Big thank you for all of you  you are really a treasure :G


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## modtheworld44 (Jan 13, 2018)

ahmadbayoumi said:


> modtheworld44 said:
> 
> 
> > ahmadbayoumi
> ...



ahmadbayoumi


At the 35+/-USD price per pound you should come out looking like a nice Golden Bar!!!!
1k=4grams gold
15k=60grams gold
15k=70USD x 15=1050USD
and some of that material will yield 4+grams of gold per 1k so it's a win-win situation.Nortel IT equipment will never disappoint you.Thanks in advance.



modtheworld44


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