# I had it wrong about ebay



## rusty (Feb 16, 2013)

Over a period of 14 years selling on ebay I've only had 6 cases filed against me, in this past week three. Good thing I only had three auctions, but three out of three filing a dispute - come on now there's something wrong with this picture.

On this most recent dispute Paypal grabbed what little cash I had then did not seek funds from my outside sources bank or credit card, but rather put my paypal account into the Red. My guess is those folks claiming their PP account is frozen owe $$$ on an unresolved dispute choosing not to restore their balance. IMHO good choice.


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## jeneje (Feb 16, 2013)

Wow, that hurts!  Hope you get this resolved soon in your favor.
Ken


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## rusty (Feb 16, 2013)

What an incentive to move on.


What you should know:

PayPal has placed a hold on this transaction.
 If you issue a full refund to the buyer before the case is escalated, you will automatically receive your final value fee back.
If you don't work things out, the buyer can escalate this case to eBay Customer Support for a final decision.


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## Anonymous (Feb 16, 2013)

PayPal does NOT go into your other accounts to bring your balance out of the negative. I've been in the red a many of times and still had money in other accounts and to this day, they were never a victim of PayPal garnishments. They simply don't do it. They use your other accounts if you don't have enough in your PayPal account to pay for things, not if you go into the negative. So, don't worry about that part, as it has never happened to me as of 9 years using PayPal.

On another note: To keep PayPal from taking any of my money, whenever I know money has been paid to me, I simply ride to the nearest ATM and withdraw what they sent me or upto $400 per day until all the money is gone from my PayPal account. I then put the money on one of my debit cards, (that I just don't have on file with them) and I don't have to worry about them at all.

But, again, PayPal doesn't go into bank or other accounts to get you out of the red. If you're in the red, you're in the red, and any monies coming in, they'll take that until you're out of the red.

Kevin


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## rusty (Feb 16, 2013)

testerman said:


> PayPal does NOT go into your other accounts to bring your balance out of the negative. I've been in the red a many of times and still had money in other accounts and to this day, they were never a victim of PayPal garnishments. They simply don't do it. They use your other accounts if you don't have enough in your PayPal account to pay for things, not if you go into the negative. So, don't worry about that part, as it has never happened to me as of 9 years using PayPal.
> 
> On another note: To keep PayPal from taking any of my money, whenever I know money has been paid to me, I simply ride to the nearest ATM and withdraw what they sent me or upto $400 per day until all the money is gone from my PayPal account. I then put the money on one of my debit cards, (that I just don't have on file with them) and I don't have to worry about them at all.
> 
> ...



Thanks, here is an interesting tid bit for our UK friends who use PAYPAL.

Safety and protection policies

The PayPal Buyer Protection Policy states that the customer may file a buyer complaint within 45 days if they did not receive an item or if the item they purchased was significantly not as described. If the buyer used a credit card, they might get a refund via chargeback from their credit-card company. However, in the UK, where such a purchaser is entitled to specific statutory protections (that the credit card company is a second party to the purchase and is therefore equally liable in law if the other party defaults or goes into liquidation) under Section 75 Consumer Credit Act 1979, the purchaser loses this legal protection if the card payment is processed via PayPal.[66]

According to PayPal, it protects sellers in a limited fashion via the Seller Protection Policy.[67] In general the Seller Protection Policy is intended to protect the seller from certain kinds of chargebacks or complaints if seller meets certain conditions including proof of delivery to the buyer. PayPal states the Seller Protection Policy is "designed to protect sellers against claims by buyers of unauthorized payments and against claims of non-receipt of any merchandise". The policy includes a list of "Exclusions" which itself includes "Intangible goods", "Claims for receipt of goods 'not as described'" and "Total reversals over the annual limit". There are also other restrictions in terms of the sale itself, the payment method and the destination country the item is shipped to (simply having a tracking mechanism is not sufficient to guarantee the Seller Protection Policy is in effect).[68] The PayPal Seller Protection Policy does not provide the additional consumer protection afforded by UK consumer legislation (e.g., Sale of Goods Act) and in addition it cannot be enforced in the Courts because PayPal operates from Luxembourg, outside all three of the UK legal jurisdictions.


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## Noxx (Feb 16, 2013)

This happened to me once.

I had sold some e-Gold on ebay and the buyer was a hacker who used a stolen PP account. One week after the sale was completed, the PP account was reported stolen and the funds were withdrawn from my account. I left it in the red but two months later I received a letter and they wanted the funds otherwise they would take legal issues. So I had to pay them. Since egold is not a tangible item, I was not covered and lot my money twice.


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## Anonymous (Feb 16, 2013)

*Rusty* and *Knoxx*,

You both make excellent points. 

To *Rusty*, that basically states that all laws are governed differently according to, and from the locations each account is in. It still doesn't state that they will go into your other accounts.

To *Knoxx*, think about this.... since they told you about taking legal action against you already lets you know that they don't have a right to access your other accounts, because if they had that right, they wouldn't threaten you with legal action... they would simply take the money... and just maybe, they'll tell you that they did so.

I've been selling headstones for over 13 years now online and using PayPal for about 9 years or so. I've had problems and my biggest complaint was for an order for over $7K for a headstone. It wasn't my fault, yet, they held my money. After the customer received his headstone, they told me that it can still take 90 days before they release the money back to your account. I reminded them of the *RICO Act*, (a form of extortion) (look it up)... and I complained for almost 4 days to them..... guess what? ... they released my money back to my account. My account was *THOUSANDS* of dollars in the *RED*. They never touched any of my other accounts.

Point is, if you have any issues with PayPal due to disputes, I wouldn't worry about them taking money from my other accounts, because they simply don't do it. Not saying they wont try that in the future, but as of right now, they don't do it. I'm living proof of that too.

Kevin


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## Smack (Feb 17, 2013)

No one has or could have the right to take money from say your bank. They would need a judgement in their favor first, then would have to show that you have made no attempt to satisfy the judgement, then file a petition for garnishment.


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## Palladium (Feb 17, 2013)

It scares me when i sell gold and silver on ebay. I cringe to think that if the buyer wanted to they could get me. I use ebay mainly as a advertising mechanism.


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## Anonymous (Feb 17, 2013)

Palladium said:


> It scares me when i sell gold and silver on ebay. I cringe to think that if the buyer wanted to they could get me. I use ebay mainly as a advertising mechanism.


It just so happens that a buyer filed a dispute against me, eBay gave him his money back, now I'm waiting for my gold back. They also locked me out from putting up any more items because I have an outstanding bill. They should be taking their cut once I make my sales, and not wanting to do it once per month. I have things to do with my money, and if they don't want it right then and there, oh well.

Kevin


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## rusty (Feb 17, 2013)

testerman said:


> Palladium said:
> 
> 
> > It scares me when i sell gold and silver on ebay. I cringe to think that if the buyer wanted to they could get me. I use ebay mainly as a advertising mechanism.
> ...



Keven let us hope the you do not receive an ebay infamous gold drop as a substitute for your gold. Once you sign for delivery confirmation, your signature is the trigger for paypal to release funds to the buyer. Could leave you holding a worthless package without any recourse.


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## joem (Feb 17, 2013)

I have been burned in the past with a gold buy and ebay, I only sell to members here and 1 buyer I have offline.
No exceptions


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## Anonymous (Feb 18, 2013)

rusty said:


> testerman said:
> 
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> > Palladium said:
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well, since I took pictures of my items and they were posted on eBay and I still have them, if I need to sign for it, or even when it arrives, I'm going to video the package while it hasn't been touch, and on video I'm going to open it. If I have any problems from that, then there will be some problems that eBay and PayPal will have to fix.... immediately. Like I said before, they had my account held hostage for over $7K in 2012, but I didn't let up on them and in 4 days they put my money back in my account.

If that buyer pulls a fast one on me, I'm not going to go down without a fight. That's a fact.

Kevin


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## tek4g63 (Feb 18, 2013)

Kevin, 
I was burned once on eBay and I will never sell or buy on there ever again!

I use to buy and sell on eBay all the time many years ago, way before PayPal. And never had an issue, not even once. Then many years later I thought I might get back to using my account. Well in order to use my account I had to setup a PayPal account. That was strike one, I don't like being forced to use a middle man to buy and sell things. 

OK so here is what went down. I listed a hardness tester made by a company called Fowler. I won it at a give away thing at work. So I paid nothing. New it priced out for $3200 with the bench top press that I also had for it. It worked and had all accessory's, even it's wooden box. So I listed it with .99¢ starting bid, no reserve. A guy won the auction for $250. So he was getting a great deal in my opinion. His payment posted, I shipped the item and thought all was well. 3 weeks later I get a notice that there is a dispute on the purchase. I fought and fought because I knew his claim of it not working was a lie. He stated that the diamond contact tip was broken. I knew for a fact that it wasn't. Then he had price quotes for a replacement tip and said that he would retract the dispute if I paid for a new tip $600! So because he had more positive feed back than I did, they sided with him and put my account in the negative.

When I received the item back, guess what? The tip was missing along with the special tool to change it!

I can't help but think that this guy bought the item with full intentions of removing the tip and replacing it in a checker he already had then file the dispute and get his money back. Needless to say I lost money and was stuck with a useless harness tester. And eBay's official reason for the refund was " The purchaser has more positive feedback and more eBay activity " , although all my feed back was positive (112) at the time. 

I shut down both my eBay and PayPal after that. I was done!

I hope that you don't get the ol' switch-a-roo!


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## rusty (Feb 18, 2013)

tek4g63 said:


> Kevin,
> I was burned once on eBay and I will never sell or buy on there ever again!
> 
> I use to buy and sell on eBay all the time many years ago, way before PayPal. And never had an issue, not even once. Then many years later I thought I might get back to using my account. Well in order to use my account I had to setup a PayPal account. That was strike one, I don't like being forced to use a middle man to buy and sell things.
> ...



From communications i had previous the buyer winning my megavsion digital camera back i suspect the buyer also owned one needing parts as he had particular interest in the PCI card and cabling used to tether the back to the computer.

The megavison like your hardness tester not an everyday item for the average person to own, I have decided to write the item off by not sighing confirmation delivery which would trigger the refund to the buyer. If I'm right the buyer will have his parts without the refund and I'll forfeit the package to canada post as undeliverable to auctioned off at a later date. 

On another note, I recently purchased a 5000 ml jacketed reactor flask, from ebays advanced search got the sellers telephone number and gave them a call this morning, glad i did. Paypal has every civic and email address I've ever had stored in their data base, in the past they have used an email address no longer active in mu auction invoices. This of course delays payment and takes a lot of effort on my part to correct.

Well a new Paypal trick this time, they issued a shipping address to the seller which I no longer reside at, Item shipped last Friday via UPS the seller is going to try and have UPS re-route the package to my new address which I have been at for the past year and a half, my primary Paypal shipping address..

IMHO, Paypal not so dumb, most people transfer their paypal balance to a bank account immediately, In order to take advance of millions of added cash to apply to the money market Paypal throws a stick into the wheel by issuing a defunct email or civic address from the paypal holders account that had been previously used which prolongs the time Payapl have that money in their greedy little paws. Calling it a computer glitch lets them off the hook, but it involves millions of dollars of consumer funds being illegally held.

In addition the new set of buyer protection rules had nothing to do with buyer protection, its about how much money Paypal can defer to the money markets while these disputes play themselves out between buyer and seller.

You can bet the farm there's some very attractive currency trading which coincides with the most recent paypal computer glitch which is now allowing PP to shore up that money market account to take advantage of the huge profits to made while the market is trading heavily. Once trading returns to normal the Paypal computer glitch will be retired until its needed once again.

In other words what I'm saying is that these paypal computer glitches are triggered intentionally. By activating a computer bug papal may acquire millions of dollars in an interest free loan at our expense, like they should worry over the grief they're causing people over their actions.

It is the perfect situation, anger blindsides the rational from seeing the truth.


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## rusty (Feb 19, 2013)

Paypal got my name and box number correct, how is it they screwed up on town and postal code when my primary shipping address states Elphinstone R0J0N0 as my address. Birnie is our previous home of which we have not resided at for over a year.

I have four auctions purchased going to the wrong address, for most this would have ended in a claim for goods not delivered. Fortunately I caught the mistake and made arrangements for the Post Mistress at Birnie to forward the packages.

This is cash paypal would have held while the dispute played itself out.


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## Anonymous (Feb 19, 2013)

rusty said:


> Paypal got my name and box number correct, how is it they screwed up on town and postal code when my primary shipping address states Elphinstone R0J0N0 as my address. Birnie is our previous home of which we have not resided at for over a year.
> 
> I have four auctions purchased going to the wrong address, for most this would have ended in a claim for goods not delivered. Fortunately I caught the mistake and made arrangements for the Post Mistress at Birnie to forward the packages.
> 
> This is cash paypal would have held while the dispute played itself out.


One way around that part is to go to the Post Office or go online and make sure you have a "Change of Address" filled out with them for that address. Unless it's a credit card or some other Federal/State document, it'll get forwarded to you... even packages.

Kevin


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## rusty (Feb 19, 2013)

testerman said:


> rusty said:
> 
> 
> > Paypal got my name and box number correct, how is it they screwed up on town and postal code when my primary shipping address states Elphinstone R0J0N0 as my address. Birnie is our previous home of which we have not resided at for over a year.
> ...



You missed my point, everything in the past year I have ordered from ebay has been successfully shipped to my Elphinstone address.

The majority of people rely on paypal to give the correct shipping address just as I have in the past, why the paypal glitch all of a sudden.

I see it as one of two possibility's,the shipping address glitch was intentional by paypal in order to give them advantage to recoup the deficit on my paypal account or a cash grab for the money market.

The image below is how my PP primary shipping address show on their site, why was the seller sent the wrong address. All my previous home and gift address's had been removed ages ago.


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## eeTHr (Feb 19, 2013)

Although I'm not a computer expert, I've done a little programing in my time, and it seems to me that a computer "glitch" would be highly unlikely as the cause of this. The word "glitch" can cover a large amount of error types, from actual programing errors to spikes in the data bytes caused by power surges, induced interference or intermittantly malfunctioning components. Glitches from spikes in the data would be random, and would not be specific to any part of the resultant output. Programming errors would cause a sudden increase in wrong addresses, which would alert the programers to debug whatever thay had just changed. Failure to update to changed addresses would be a more likely type of bug than mixing old and new addresses would be less common, but possible. Either way, it would be detected quickly and corrected, unless several people are really snoozing on the job.

What is obvious to me about PayPal holding money for interest purposes, is their notification that they have transferred money to your bank, and it will take 3 or 4 days, "depending on your bank." That's just nuts. Electronic transfers take no more than a couple minutes. Several years ago I was almost late on a utility payment, so I took it down to their office and paid it in person. I dropped off a check there, then went to the bank to cover it with a deposit, because I had some shopping to do near the bank---I figured the check wouldn't make it to the bank until the next day, anyway. Wrong! They had immediately done an electronic withdrawal, and I got an overdraft charge a few days later!

I later found out that banks "posted" all their transactions for the day at midnight, or within a couple hours after. And that they would process all withdrawals and checks first, so they could collect overdraft charges, then add the deposits after they had already claimed the overdraft. They were caught at this a couple years later, and have since quit doing it, as far as I know. But any electronic transfer should show up in your account by the next day.

The "3 or 4 days" for the withdrawal transfer is total baloney.


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## Palladium (Feb 19, 2013)

I had paypal hold money on an electronic check i was paid with here a couple of weeks ago. I waited for 3 day just because i didn't need the money. Then i just decided i wanted to be difficult and i was bored so i called paypal up and we went round and round. They had me on hold for over two hours. I had nothing better to do so while in the lab i just put the phone on speaker and walked around working. I must have went through 4-5 people. I always ask for their supervisor after each one would tell me that they couldn't help me. I use to work customer service. :mrgreen: 

They keep saying it takes time to process sir. I kept saying " Your not talking to an idiot, i use to do work for the Federal reserve and i know how electronic funds transfers work." The money had left the clients bank 2 days before and paypal was just sitting on it. Eft"s can be done in 24 hours without any problems, and even faster when given priority. It was funny hearing them give me excuses and me telling them where they was wrong at. While i was on the phone and looking at my paypal screen the money cleared. I mean literally right then! The guy on the phone said he didn't do anything or had nothing to do with it clearing. I said to my self hummm...... Yeah right! Someone needs to class action law suit their ass!


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## eeTHr (Feb 19, 2013)

Palladium said:



> They keep saying it takes time to process sir.



I get a mental picture of a computer sitting there eating a sandwich, saying, "Yeah, the processing forms are piling up on my desk, but I'm on lunch break!"

Update to my prior post: I just got back from the Post Office, with a check for $14.00 from a class action settlement with our bank (which I didn't even know about) for manipulating their overdraft algorithms against their customers. :shock:


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## rusty (Feb 19, 2013)

Paypal along with many large banks and other financial institution use Oracle Exadata, Perhaps Oracle should be included in any class action suite to help explain the data errors dispensed from the paypal Exadata Server Cluster.

If oracle was prone to dishing out errant data banks and financial institutions would not be using it.


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## Anonymous (Feb 19, 2013)

rusty said:


> testerman said:
> 
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> > rusty said:
> ...


I see what you're saying. eBay had a wrong address for me when I bought something, and come to find out PayPal somehow had my old address on file, even though I updated my address. I simply went into PayPal and deleted that address from my profile and that fixed it. You should check and possibly do the same.

Also, if that P.O. Box is accurate, it's possible the seller don't ship to P.O. Boxes and they (eBay) used another address you have in PayPal. Either way, it shouldn't have happened. Make sure to check your PayPal account and delete any old information. PayPal at one point was sending emails to my current email address, then all of a sudden, they were sending them to one of my old email addresses, which kept bouncing back to them. Again, delete any and all outdated information so there are no discrepancies.

Kevin


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## MMFJ (Feb 19, 2013)

testerman said:


> delete any and all outdated information so there are no discrepancies.


Not only the addresses, etc. that you might still have 'dangling around', but if you have had paypal and ebay awhile, you had best check the 'agreements' that they have forced you to set in motion over the years.

What happened to me was that, after years of not being on eBay, we started back again in earnest and had several shipments go out. I was thrilled at my paypal account - seemed the fees weren't all that bad as I remembered, etc. as my account was growing all the time.

Until one day, I got a notification from my bank that my account was overdrawn! What??? 

The thing that happened is that my other business account with paypal (that we had used nearly 10 years before....) still had an 'agreement' to be charged ebay shipping fees! And, since that account didn't have much in it, paypal was pulling the money from my bank account (again, under the long-since-forgotten 'agreement'.....).

Well, I finally got that cleared up, and used paypal/ebay without issue (other than the crazy fees, the horrible customer service at ebay and their constant tightening of 'buyer' (and NEVER 'seller') protection.....) - until I recently got fed up with the negative feedback of one idiot destroying my hard work on a hundred or more good sales - but then, I got another bill from Paypal on a transaction (don't recall the exact issue - the thing is, it was tied to that same 'agreement' stuff and I lost another $180!).

Of course, even with thousands of transactions, they don't want to work with you on this - "it is in your agreements...." and such (sorry, I'm getting frustrated and angry about this again - even though it has been weeks and I've tried to stay off of the topic!).

Well, here's what you have to do as well as the address removals and such..... (I ran across a video somewhere and it helped me find it - certainly Paypal doesn't make it simple to find!)

1. Log in to your Paypal account
2. Mouse over Profile and go down to My Money
3. Click on "My preapproved payments"
4. Be ready to be shocked......... :shock: (I still am, at how many items are listed, even after turning them off!)
5. Get rid of (deactivate) as many of them as you can - certainly all the eBay ones (IMHO)

If you remove one that you need, next time you need it, you will be asked to 'agree' again, so it doesn't hurt to turn them all off (I think). Of course, there are a couple on there that I left (for my domain hosting, etc.), but I no longer have any eBay stuff floating around.

Do this for all your Paypal accounts or you may wind up like I did and have your bank account emptied!


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## rusty (Feb 19, 2013)

testerman said:


> rusty said:
> 
> 
> > testerman said:
> ...



If that be the case, my registered paypal gift address would be receiving all my parcels.

For those folks that will not ship to a P.O. box I have my goods shipped to the store in our village, which is not a registered address in my Paypal.

All my old email and civic adress's have been deleted from PP years ago, Paypal requires an address current to where your credit card billing is mailed to. 

In order to have a verified PP account my bank is verified by two small PP deposits then my credit card billing address is cross referenced with my registered Paypal home address. How is it they keep getting it wrong using a top performing data base such as Oracle.

Why is corrupt data sent from Paypal to the seller, because it is intentionally done to spark a dispute, while these disputes play themselves out Paypal has the funds invested. I'm beginning to sound like a broken record.

Paypal is more concerned in pleasing the share holders, 

Paypal had recored 2nd quarter earnings, now you know how they accomplished this.


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## rusty (Feb 19, 2013)

End of January I had $3.00 ebay bucks, to get rid of them logged into Pats ebay account then created a bogus buy it now for $3.00 with free shipping, then I logged back into my own account and made the BIN paid for with my free ebay bucks.

Paypal took half for their transaction fee, Pat ended up with $1.50 hardly worth the effort.


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## rusty (Feb 19, 2013)

I would strongly suggest any and all Canadian Paypal account holders take the time to read their TOS

https://cms.paypal.com/ca/cgi-bin/?...ntent_ID=ua/UserAgreement_full&locale.x=en_US


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## rusty (Feb 27, 2013)

Case closed read the red ink.

eBay Customer Support has reviewed the case and made a final decision.

We issued a full refund of $332.00 on Feb 27, 2013 to the buyer. As described in the eBay Buyer Protection program, the refund includes the purchase price, plus original shipping. 

This amount will be deducted from your PayPal account or charged to your preferred reimbursement payment method. The hold on this PayPal transaction has been removed. This case is closed.

Preferred reimbursement, interprets as back up funding to paypal - bank and credit card.


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## Palladium (Feb 27, 2013)

I just had another opportunity where paypal saved my bacon again and screwed ebay in the process. I didn't know it but their seems to be two divisions to paypal. One is the ebay side where somehow they are considered just a regular business. The other side is considered a bank and must follow federal guidelines for consumer protection when they lend money or offer credit. Here's how i found out. I use to use my bank account for back up funding. I applied for the paypal credit card and was approved. I used the paypal credit card as my backup funding source for funding on ebay. So when paypal wants to charge my account if the money is not in there then they just charge my card instead which is a credit source and not a debit source like a regular paypal account. I put paypal in a loop by doing this. Well ebay double billed me for my invoice last month. I used a one time payment to pay it and then 2 weeks later ebay decided to take it again. When i call ebay they told me it was my fault because i paid the bill early and should have waited until it was deducted. That pissed me off in more ways that i could tell you. I said so it's my fault that you people took my money because i paid it early and even over paid the invoice so i would have a credit on next months bill. They said yes. I told them i wanted my money back because what they were doing was wrong. They said we can give you part of it back. I said part of it ?????? They not only wanted to take money that wasn't theirs but then when ask to return it they said well you owe money on this next coming invoice. I said so now you want to bill me for something that ain't even due for another 30 days. Didn't you just tell me it was my fault for paying early and now you want me to do it again? Make a long story short i politely said screw you and called paypal. I opened a case and paypal snatched my money back from ebay. Not only did i get back what i didn't owe them but i took back what i paid last moth as well. Then yesterday ebay refunded my money to. I know i will have to give them their money back but now it's them asking for their money back and not me. I just wanted to show them that it could be done.


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## Anonymous (Feb 28, 2013)

rusty said:


> Case closed read the red ink.
> 
> eBay Customer Support has reviewed the case and made a final decision.
> 
> ...


That means one or two things.

*1.* eBay will take the money out of your PayPal account if the money is there. Even if it isn't there, they'll deduct it from that account and any monies going into that account will be scooped up by them until they're paid in full and you're out of the red.

*2.* If you have a backup payment (other credit/bank accounts) added into your PayPal account, they will take the money from one or more of them until they get the amount they're after, if you don't have it in your PayPal account, or enough to cover the charge back.

*No# 2 is easily avoidable.* Simply delete all other backup accounts and then they can't go into your other accounts at all. 

If eBay issues a full refund to the buyer, the buyer IS obligated to return your merchandise. I talked to a buyer who they refunded monies back to from my account and I still haven't received my items back, and he agreed to send me my money because he told me (today) that eBay does not issue partial refunds. They simply refunded his full amount.

Kevin


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## Anonymous (Feb 28, 2013)

Palladium said:


> I just had another opportunity where paypal saved my bacon again and screwed ebay in the process. I didn't know it but their seems to be two divisions to paypal. One is the ebay side where somehow they are considered just a regular business. The other side is considered a bank and must follow federal guidelines for consumer protection when they lend money or offer credit. Here's how i found out. I use to use my bank account for back up funding. I applied for the paypal credit card and was approved. I used the paypal credit card as my backup funding source for funding on ebay. So when paypal wants to charge my account if the money is not in there then they just charge my card instead which is a credit source and not a debit source like a regular paypal account. I put paypal in a loop by doing this. Well ebay double billed me for my invoice last month. I used a one time payment to pay it and then 2 weeks later ebay decided to take it again. When i call ebay they told me it was my fault because i paid the bill early and should have waited until it was deducted. That pissed me off in more ways that i could tell you. I said so it's my fault that you people took my money because i paid it early and even over paid the invoice so i would have a credit on next months bill. They said yes. I told them i wanted my money back because what they were doing was wrong. They said we can give you part of it back. I said part of it ?????? They not only wanted to take money that wasn't theirs but then when ask to return it they said well you owe money on this next coming invoice. I said so now you want to bill me for something that ain't even due for another 30 days. Didn't you just tell me it was my fault for paying early and now you want me to do it again? Make a long story short i politely said screw you and called paypal. I opened a case and paypal snatched my money back from ebay. Not only did i get back what i didn't owe them but i took back what i paid last moth as well. Then yesterday ebay refunded my money to. I know i will have to give them their money back but now it's them asking for their money back and not me. I just wanted to show them that it could be done.


Do like I do... whenever I get money posted into my PayPal account, I go to my nearest ATM and withdraw it out, or you can simply transfer it all to another account. But the problem with that is that, while PayPal says "Once you initiate a transfer it cannot be reversed" is a bold faced lie. I had an upcoming issue, so I decided to get my money out before they snatch it up, and as soon as I did my transfer into my bank account, 2 days later I received an email message from PayPal stating that they reversed the money and put it back into my PayPal account until the matter I had was resolved. That's when I knew that they CAN and DO reverse money back when they state that once you initiate it , it can't be reversed. The money never reached my bank account either once I checked my statement online.

Kevin


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## rusty (Feb 28, 2013)

The buyer returned the package C.O.D. I refused delivery, this did not stop paypal from releasing funds to the buyer.

The reason Paypal favors the buyer is that they were getting to many charge backs, the credit card companies threatened to pull Paypal as an acceptable merchant unless they were able to cut down on the number of charge backs they were receiving.

Great system this new buyer protection, Paypal gets to manipulate seller and buyer funds for profit while these disputes play themselves which generally take 3 to 4 weeks to resolve then to top it off paypal is avoiding those nasty charge backs which threaten their ability to accept credit card transactions on our behalf.

Under the current system anyone using ebay to sell their goods is doomed to failure, we sellers are playing against a stacked deck.


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## resabed01 (Feb 28, 2013)

testerman said:


> Do like I do... whenever I get money posted into my PayPal account, I go to my nearest ATM and withdraw it out, or you can simply transfer it all to another account. But the problem with that is that, while PayPal says "Once you initiate a transfer it cannot be reversed" is a bold faced lie. I had an upcoming issue, so I decided to get my money out before they snatch it up, and as soon as I did my transfer into my bank account, 2 days later I received an email message from PayPal stating that they reversed the money and put it back into my PayPal account until the matter I had was resolved. That's when I knew that they CAN and DO reverse money back when they state that once you initiate it , it can't be reversed. The money never reached my bank account either once I checked my statement online.
> 
> Kevin



Paypal knows people will do this. This is why the money sits in limbo-land for so many days before they release it.

Oh look! Fees for Canadians to transfer out less than $150!

I guess one need to transfer in money to build the balance up to $150.00 before transfering out. What a scam.


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## rusty (Feb 28, 2013)

resabed01 said:


> testerman said:
> 
> 
> > Do like I do... whenever I get money posted into my PayPal account, I go to my nearest ATM and withdraw it out, or you can simply transfer it all to another account. But the problem with that is that, while PayPal says "Once you initiate a transfer it cannot be reversed" is a bold faced lie. I had an upcoming issue, so I decided to get my money out before they snatch it up, and as soon as I did my transfer into my bank account, 2 days later I received an email message from PayPal stating that they reversed the money and put it back into my PayPal account until the matter I had was resolved. That's when I knew that they CAN and DO reverse money back when they state that once you initiate it , it can't be reversed. The money never reached my bank account either once I checked my statement online.
> ...



Good catch. even if the Canadian dollar is at par or above the U.S.D. Paypal will find a way to fleece you on the conversion.


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## rusty (Mar 9, 2013)

Now I'm really confused, ebay decided in the buyers favor ( buyers protection ) but refunded me the money for this transaction :lol: Yes the buyer returned the package complete with tracking.

Paypal balance now sitting at a comfortable $199.39 USD

eBay Customer Support has reviewed the case and made a final decision.
Decision:
This case was decided in the buyer's favor. Although you won't have to reimburse your buyer for this transaction, the case will still be counted when determining your seller standing.


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## Palladium (Mar 10, 2013)

Sounds like a happy ending!


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