# Gold from black sands



## mu50stang (Oct 23, 2011)

I do alot of dredging during the year and have black sand with real small gold in it. Does anyone have a chemical method to extract it from the black sand. Thanks.


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## philddreamer (Oct 24, 2011)

Mu50stang, look up "black sands" in the search box in the upper right corner, there has been lots of discussion on subject. Also, check out the Rick the Rock Man thread for some great stuff on geology in general.

Take care! 

Phil


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## blueduck (Oct 24, 2011)

i recommend first in looking into a Gold Cube, not just because i sell them but because they are great for reducing the concentrates to a level that is real easy to pan out reducing a five gallon buckets in minutes to about a cup and a half to 3 cups of super cons.

ive been pulling micron gold out of beach sand here on the clearwater river this year, and pulled gold out of cons that i had wondered about that i had ran through other devices...... once you get it reduced then you can spend the money on chemicals, to do so before would probably not net enough back to warrant the expense of the chemicals and their disposal in that large of volume!

If yer interested and wanna talk more about it, email me or message here...... ive got a couple videos of it and my kids feeding one this past summer around someplace.

William
Digg It Prospecting Supply


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## mu50stang (Oct 25, 2011)

I used hcl and clorox method on my first batch. I let it sit for about two hours and the filtered, the liquid was yellow which i then poured some smb in it. After 24 hours the liquid is a lighter yellow with some brown sludge on the bottom. Does this mean i need more smb. Also what do i do after this step? I did run a second batch which ended up turning a rust looking color, i let that one sit for 24 hours befor filtering. Is there something wrong with the 2nd batch. Thanks.


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## Geo (Oct 25, 2011)

gold dropped or precipitated with SMB will look like brown mud. take a small portion of this mud(just a couple of grains) and add a few drops of hcl and then add a drop of cl. test with stannous and see if you get a purple stain.


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## mu50stang (Oct 25, 2011)

How about the brownish color liquid? Should I add more smb to the first batch that still is light yellow? Thanks.


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## Geo (Oct 25, 2011)

there are other metals that will color your solution yellow. did you test with stannous chloride to see if you have gold or not? and too, too much SMB with hold precipitated gold in suspension by SO2 gas floating the gold, it will settle but it will take it a couple of days until all the SO2 gases off. you can warm it till it starts steaming and keep it at that temperature for ten minutes or so and it will settle faster (if it is gold).


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## Elfs (Oct 28, 2011)

I recommend you classify you cons to several mesh like 100 to 400 etc. Put cons in pan with water and use a super magnet to remove the magnetite, once the magnetite is pulled off rube the magnet directly on the cons to pull off the hematite, then pan the stuff and use your snuffer bottle to remover the heaviest.

I did this with a gallon of cons. A friend in Oregon had given me his cons that where already classified to 100 mesh and run through a spiral wheel and blue bowl. After doing what i told you to do I found (by panning) what must be about a table spoon of flour gold coated in mercury. Form this gallon of black sand all but one cup was magnetite. Have still to burn off the mercury.


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## philddreamer (Oct 28, 2011)

Mustang wrote:
"How about the brownish color liquid? Should I add more smb to the first batch that still is light yellow? Thanks."

No, brother. Like Geo suggested, test with stannous. You can't process PM's & not stannous test. It's like flying blind folded. It's simple to make some.

Phil


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## bluestone (Dec 16, 2011)

i have a question about micron gold, does it settle out of the black sand? i have black sand and it looks like there is pieces of gold in it smaller then the black sand. could this be gold or is it cholcal pyrite.


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## jimmydolittle (Dec 16, 2011)

http://www.nextstepmining.com/store.html They have a DVD I bought and am in the process of buying the equipment to do the sepparation. Nice picture!


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## shaftsinkerawc (Dec 17, 2011)

How did you concentrate/collect this material?
Did you crush and then try and re-pan the material?
Any other photo's available?
Are there gemmy blues grains in the photo or is it just out of focus grains?
There's a lot of white in the photo which indicates not a very good concentration, but it could be scheelite in which case it would be.
Did you remove the magnetics from this with a magnet?
Is this from your Blue Clay open cut?
Keep experimenting/trying.


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## Reno Chris (Dec 17, 2011)

You wont be seeing micron sized gold with that level of magnification - micron gold cannot be concentrated by panning - its just too small.


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## ayeyou (Dec 17, 2011)

Hello to all,
I am just new to this forum but definitely not new to placer mining. We recently discovered a new placer deposit and have tested it and ready to mine in May.Here is my dilemma. As part of our testing on our claims we sent a sample of our black sand concentrates in for assay which i will post below. The assay came back at 188 grams per ton gold.This is after all recoverable gold was taken out with gold wheel. According to our calculations based on what we recovered during testing we will be producing about 5 tons of these concentrates per week of mining. There is quite a lot of pyrites in the concentrates and it is possible that some of the assayed values are locked up in sulphides.What should my approach be in handling these concentrates? Any help you folks could offer would be appreciated.Thanks in advance for your replies.


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## bluestone (Dec 18, 2011)

Reno Chris said:


> You wont be seeing micron sized gold with that level of magnification - micron gold cannot be concentrated by panning - its just too small.


i guess my question was about gold particles half the size of black sand particles. you can see one in the picture, in the upper left. 
to get a better idea about what i am showing, it is material floating on the water. see photo

shaftsinkerawc
yes we did take the magnetite out with a magnite and it was panned concentrates. 
it is from 300 feet below the blue hole , down hill where the road cut into the blue ground . 
yes there are gemmy blue grains in he photo.
i have other photos, i panned out 25 pounds today and we got some big pieces of magnetite with what looks like copper. 1cm wide and 2mm thick. ill get some good pictures and post them. 
this picture is of what looks like lead. we got it under the clay layer. see picture.


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## Reno Chris (Dec 18, 2011)

> The assay came back at 188 grams per ton gold.This is after all recoverable gold was taken out with gold wheel.


First, I suggest you contact the assayer and ask what procedure was involved in the pan assay. He may not have done anything that would see the gold in any pyrites - it may just be a free gold assay. 

Second, you probably need a shaker table - wheels are OK for processing but are not the best for getting the smallest placer gold. It may cost you several thousand to get set up with a good table, but if you have the potential for 25 ounces of gold per month, the table will pay for itself very quickly!



> i guess my question was about gold particles half the size of black sand particles.


All I can say is the photo is kind of blurry and I cant say reliably of that is gold or not. With a good 10X hand lens, you should be able to see for yourself in the sunlight. Don't know how much of this you may have, but if it is gold, you may be interested in the shaker table as mentioned above.


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## ayeyou (Dec 18, 2011)

Hey Chris,
Thanks for your reply to my dilemma. It was a fire assay so it would have included any recoverable sulphide bound gold and I suspect that a fair amount of the valu may be there . However when viewed thru microscope at 150x there is a large amount of free micron gold visible. My thoughts are that if a gold wheel couldnt recover it I am not sure a shaker table would do much better.Not only that but the thought of spending hour after hour feedin a shaker table with tons of concentrates after a hard day or season mining is just not that appealing to me. Call me lazy but I like to think I am pratical.But really it goes back to recovery and I dont think gravity is the answer. Perhaps I will be relegated to do monthly 20 ton shipments to a local refinery and hope they dont screw me silly on the payout.Not sure how that works but I imagine if you assay each shipment they cant hurt you to bad.
I was hopin that maybe there was a heap leach type method that i could do during the winter at home in my barn and recover 90 - 95 % of contained gold that way.Indications are that we will produce about 100 tons per season so thats 500 ounces of gold. Needless to say I would be willing to spend a little capital to make that happen. including putting in leach vats or pads and buying required chemicals which I am not sure of what works best other than cyanide. Any tips in that direction would be appreciated.Again thanks Chris


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## Reno Chris (Dec 18, 2011)

> My thoughts are that if a gold wheel couldn't recover it I am not sure a shaker table would do much better.



1. If its a fire assay, have your assayer do a screen assay for free gold and see how much free gold you really have. This will give you an idea of the split between free gold and that in the sulfides. 
2. You dont need to hand feed the table - you buy a feeder and hopper system, then load it up every couple hours (Only process cons once per week or so). If you are hand feeding your wheels, you need a feeder before you step up to a larger production rate. 
3. Properly set up, tables really are significantly better than wheels. Its a fact, long established, you can get much more of your free gold with a table. Your statement above is just not true. You may well find through testing that you can get enough of the free gold and sulfide with a table that any leaching afterward would be pointless.
4. I wouldn't consider leaching unless you were making more than a ton a day of cons - and then you will need a place to do it (not your home). I dont know where you are located, but go to your local county office and tell whoever runs the planning department (or equivalent) you want to install a cyanide leach plant in your barn to process 100 tons per year of material, and want to know what are all of the permits (local, state and federal) you will need to do that legally. You will be stunned, and I'd guess the bottom line will be that you cant do it legally in your barn at all. Getting permits (if you can get them) will take months and cost many thousands and stir up a hornet's nest of controversy, anger and fear among your neighbors. Do it illegally and you will loose all your profits and perhaps the property as well. 
5. Non cyanide leaches are less effective, more expensive and still toxic and poisonous, just not as toxic as cyanide. You'd still need a barrel full of permits to leach with non-cyanide methods. There is no safe, non-toxic, environmentally friendly way to leach gold. 
6. There are people who can do tests for you and see what you will get with various methods including tables, and they can design a system for you. Although consultants and assays can cost thousands of dollars in total, you are talking about 300 to 500 ounces of recoverable gold (you're never going to get 100%) per year, so using a consultant to get it right from the start will be well worth the money invested. A table would produce a free gold concentrate and a sulfide middling that you'd probably save to eventually ship to a smelter when you had enough of it (smelter is in Mexico). Use the consulting expertise that is available to help your project - don't be penny wise and pound foolish (way to many guys do that).


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## ayeyou (Dec 18, 2011)

Hey Chris, 
Thanks for input. After reading thru the chemical leaching forum here and studying elsewhere on net I have come to decision just to ship the 20 tons a month of cons to a Cominco smelter in Trail B.C. which is only 200 miles or so from my mine and let them deal with it. Cominco is a huge company that is known for being very fair with customers and frankly reading what some of these guys play with to get a few bucks worth of gold is just plain scary.
I wont be able to enjoy the riches of my placer deposit if I am dead or in bed with burnt out lungs.I will focus my time on mining which I know and leave the refining to the refiners. I ask myself now why I considered any other route.I wouldnt want an assay lab tech running my mine and I have no more buisiness trying to refine my own concentrates.My time saving alone shipping the concentrates to Trail will more than pay for any refining fees.They have been refining ore concentrates at cominco both from their own mines and from outside customers for over 70 years so the probably know how to do it.Thanks for your input , I appreciate it.


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## Geraldo (Dec 20, 2011)

ayeyou said:


> Hey Chris,
> Thanks for input. After reading thru the chemical leaching forum here and studying elsewhere on net I have come to decision just to ship the 20 tons a month of cons to a Cominco smelter in Trail B.C. which is only 200 miles or so from my mine and let them deal with it. Cominco is a huge company that is known for being very fair with customers and frankly reading what some of these guys play with to get a few bucks worth of gold is just plain scary.
> I wont be able to enjoy the riches of my placer deposit if I am dead or in bed with burnt out lungs.I will focus my time on mining which I know and leave the refining to the refiners. I ask myself now why I considered any other route.I wouldnt want an assay lab tech running my mine and I have no more buisiness trying to refine my own concentrates.My time saving alone shipping the concentrates to Trail will more than pay for any refining fees.They have been refining ore concentrates at cominco both from their own mines and from outside customers for over 70 years so the probably know how to do it.Thanks for your input , I appreciate it.



Actually, they have been at it over 100 years...

My bet is they will refine it by just sending it through the Lead Smelter (that is what I would do if I were still working there). Gold will report to lead "bullion" and the silica will go to the slag. Since they feed over 60 tph to the Lead Smelter, your 20 tons won't be too significant...and yes, all that stuff like sulfur capture, dust capture, slag disposal etc. is already there, which is a pretty big advantage over trying to DIY.

Typically, they will look at your con and assign values to the pay metals, and penalties to the other stuff in there (like arsenic, tellurium, silica, etc.).

One word of caution: be very clear on the terms of your contract. Settlement is often based on when the con is actually run, not when it is received. They could put your stuff in a pile in the back forty and not run it for a year - and you wouldn't see a penny until they actually treat it. Sometimes they will stick in a "recovery" clause, and given the in-process inventories, that could add several more months until you receive a check. Also, make sure about the payment term - all the smelters love "stretching" the time when they actually pay their bills. Cominco (or Teck as it is now called) used to take 3 months to pay a "net 30 days" bill. Their settlement times often stretched even longer. Make sure that stuff is in your agreement.

Good luck!

Best Regards, Gerald


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## ayeyou (Dec 20, 2011)

Hey Gerald,
Thanks for that info on Teck/Cominco. I put a call in to them today and left my info with them for a call back on rates and terms etc.My plans in that regard would be to just stockpile the cons up at the mine and then do a end of season shipment of the 100 or so tons of cons to the smelter in open box ore trucks and then just wait till they get done at smelter for settlement.As this contained value black sand concentrate has not been taken into consideration in regards to the mine operating budget the settlement time frame is not a huge concern. In effect the values recieved would be a "bonus" to the years production figures and the grades at the mine exclusive of those numbers is very profitable on their rights the waiting for settlement would be fine.
I have owever done a little research in the meantime on the Knelson centrifical concentrators and I am beginning to think that they will do the job nicely.All reports are that if gold is present the Knelson concentrators will recover 90-95% of gold to 400 microns. With those kind of numbers I would be happy just settling for that.That is a piece of equipment I could set up in my barn and just run the cons at my leisure during the off season for a little extra monthly income while waiting for the next thaw.
I came across a report done by Colorado School of Mines Research Institute which I will post below that indicates the Knelson Concentrators can recover 10 times the gold of regular gravity methods and that is worthy of at least running a test to check the results prior to making a decision. The people at Knelson here in Langley B.C. will run your concentrates on a test basis in their lab and give you a full report on pre run assays,Post run assay and gold recovered and will do it with you there to watch and learn the operation of the centrifuge.These units are not cheap by any stretch but quality never is.They are world renowned and used by 70% or more of gravity recovery mines all over the globe.The smaller units will do 8-10 tons an hour that would be all I would need to just run my cons.They run at about $25,000. so with my assay it would only take 5 tons worth of concentrates to pay for it and to me thats a no brainer.If the test work out at 80% or better of assay valu that is a firm go for me.The sulphides may be an issue but there are high arsenic levels in other assays i have done there so Teck would penalize for that and eat up any potential extra recovery any way.
I now have a definite direction to follow and one of these two possibilities is way I will go.Thanks for your assistance on this and have a great Christmas season Gerald . The best to one and all.
here is excerpt from the csmri report....clik to enlarge....


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## Geraldo (Dec 20, 2011)

Yup, the Knelson folks are pretty nice, and know what they are doing. I have had a bunch of stuff run though their test rig in the past, and the results are always interesting. 

They are easy to run once set up - the only thing you need to remember is that it is essentially a centrifuge, which means you have to be scrupulous about maintenance, lubrication etc. as well as ensuring that feed is well screened (and no hard lumps!). Chances are, if you are buying it yourself and running it yourself, you probably will be careful. Properly maintained, they last for years and years. The small unit has a pretty large throughput too, compared to your production levels. Most mines that use them run 100s of tons per day...albeit through some pretty big units.

You might also check out Falcon. They produce a similar device to the Knelson, and are also in the Vancity area.

Best Regards, Gerald


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## ayeyou (Dec 23, 2011)

Hey Gerald, 
I just got some great news from the good people at acme analytical labs here in Vancouver. I sent another sample of m,y black sands in for assay and they came back great.. The minus 150 mesh sample contained 788.4 grams per ton AU and the +150 mesh came back at 2.45 gm ton so the average by weight worked out at 83.53 gm per ton AU. And this sample of black sand came right off the surface of the ground up there from some 5 gallon pails of material we shoveled in from right on top of bench. 
The best news of all was that the gold was micron free gold not in sulphides so the knelson concentrator should be all we need to capture it.No smelting or such required. Needless to say I got an early Christmas present cause those assays were not supposed to be done til Jan 2 2012.
Only question I have now is after I run it all thru the concentrator how do I finish it ready for melting into dore.I suppose as long as most of black sand is taken out with a magnet and rest fine panned it should be able to right into crucible or am I wrong?


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## Geraldo (Dec 23, 2011)

Congratulations Ayeyou!

It's good you don't have to deal with chemical gold. Saves you some grief.

As for post-processing after the Knelson - it depends. As with all concentration processes, you won't end up with just "gold" but rather a paste that contains all sorts of heavy items (lead, tellurium, tungsten minerals etc.). If you try to just recover gold, you will lose some. If you ensure that you don't lose any gold, you will of course have other impurities. Even then, the placer gold itself likely has impurities.

So, assuming you can further concentrate the Knelson paste to remove most other heavy items, you then have to dry it before melting. You could then melt it with a suitable flux to try to capture some of the impurities (a "slag" layer). You will then have to skim and save that slag, since it will contain some gold as well, and will need further processing for gold recovery. BTW, in practice a lot of places reuse a portion of that skim or slag to reduce the volume of slag ultimately produced and to partially recover gold that is physically entrained in the slag during previous skimming.

A lot of small placer-dominated mines DO melt their super-concentrate and cast bars or plates. This is so they can ship it to refineries, as fine powder is very difficult to package and ship, and difficult for the refineries to handle.

Ultimately - it depends on what you want to do with your gold. If you are selling to a refinery, they will be able to tell you what they need and want. If you need to purify this material and sell to end users, or to refineries that pay higher $ for higher purity, then you may want to get into your own refining operations (and I assume many members here will have mostly hydrometallurgical/acid based suggestions for refining your gold).

Based on your location and potential tonnage, you might see if Johnson Mathey is interested. They have a large refinery in the Spokane area, and are the refinery of choice for Teck and a bunch of the regional operators around here.

Just my random thoughts.

Best Regards, Gerald


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## ayeyou (Dec 27, 2011)

Hey Gerald ,
I hope you had a wonderful Christmas and all the best to all of you out there in 2012!
Re our discussion on black sand values and how to retrieve them....
Just a little side note that I found extremely interesting. As I was doing my research on black sands etc in past week I came across a goverment gold commissioners report of Placer activity in B.C. This report blew my mind because in it he states that on a river , that shall remain nameless for now because I have yet to stake my claims,he inspected a placer operation that was working strictly the fine sands to recover black sand and in answer to his querys they showed him assays that came back at more than 5 times what the assay i just posted did.Way more actually. Sorry cant say to much more right now till I claim up what I want there.
As far as being a skeptic as to the values of black sands, well that is over for me me. I am a believer.


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## Geraldo (Dec 27, 2011)

So you are saying I should start prospecting? 

I have actually thought about that - I am surrounded by 100's of historic gold mines, many within walking distance of town here. One of my neighbors had a large sink hole develop in his back yard due to a collapsed underground shaft that nobody knew about - - most of the gold mining here was in the 1800's and early 1900's, and records aren't perfect. Actually, most of the houses here in town are renovated miner's shacks. It would seem to me that while all those miners might have mined out the easily found gold veins, the area must still be well mineralized and erosion should be liberating fine gold that none of the people 100+ years ago were able to detect, let alone recover.

Let the gold fever begin...

Best Regards, Gerald


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## ayeyou (Dec 28, 2011)

Hey Gerald,
Hope you and yours are well. I tell you what Gerald if you live in a gold district and are not doing at least a little sniffin around then you are doing yourself a diservice. Back in the $1850 s and early 1900 s the technology and price of gold just didnt allow for room to really work out a lot of good ground.One thing I have found is that if the orebody was a sulphide one then there is a lot of gold left in tailings. That info would be easy enough for you to find out. Just an example of what I mean is this story from the minister of mines reports that were done every year here in B.C. since 1852.

A well known gold mine not thirty miles from my placer mine Was called The Bobbie Burns Mine.When the vein of copper and Gold ore was found the surface area of the vein had oxidized and eroded leaving visible free gold exposed on top of the deeper non oxidized ore. Samples were taken and sent for assay and came back at 1.2 ounces per ton Gold. The discovery was staked and for two years they worked on drifting out some ore from the vein, hauling a big 5 stamp mill up there and since the mine is at over 7000 ft elevation they had to cut there own mule trail in to get all the required equipment in place. Eventually they got all set up and began milling the ore they had stockpiled over two years of drifting on the pay veins.

ok so now the mill fired up and they started processing ore.Of couse now all the ore is sulphide ore they brought out from underground,loaded with pyrite and some copper but they knew the assays said 1.2 ounce a ton so they continued. After running for a few days and having processed 70 tons of ore
they checked the recovery of Gold and found that they had only recovered
.2 ounce gold per ton of ore. They had assays done on the tailings pile and found that the tailings assayed 1.3 ounce per ton. They simply were not able to process those sulphide ores in a gravity mill system and after all their expense they went belly up. That mine with its 1.2 ounce per ton gold and 70 tons of tailings sits to this day never have been worked.
The claim on it expires in mid January and I aim to claim it if it does.As a member of this forum I am sure that if you found a tailings dump of sulphide based gold ore you would know what to do with it and how to profit from it. Gold is $1600 an ounce my friend , its not hard to make money at recovering it from mother earth.
The placer claims I am going to mine come spring have only had two attempts made to mine them in the last 150 years. Once in the 1890 s and then again in 1939 -40. The 1890 s fellas got beat by the fact that the ground was heavy with clay and with just shovels and a sluice box they couldnt make it pay. They moved on when new strikes were made in Northern B.C. at Dease Lake and Atlin. The 1939 crew spent most of the summer of 1939 digging ditches and whipsawing lumber to build flumes for their hydraulic operation they had planned with witchto beat the clay. They wound up the last twenty three days of 1939 season shovelling into their big hydraulic flume sluice box cause due to late summer early fall being low water time they didnt have enough water to Hydraulic with. Even so they averaged just under an ounce a day per man with shovel!!!. In 1940 they were served with court papers because a logging company called Columbia Timber filed an injunction to stop them from dumping the tailings into the creek. The miners lost the case and that was the end of mining on Porcupine Creek. Until NOW :lol: ! The budget for my placer mine this season is based on the proven test pit assays and level of production our machinery is rated for and shows us pulling 490 grams per day out of that ground at a cost of only $ 18.80 per gram all in. Current price is $52.30 gram so we should pull little over 25k a day net profit out of ground that has been known to carry gold for 150 years.
So in short Gerald yes you should be prospecting. LOL
I will say that the 1890 s assay on the black sands from my new "mystery" creek were over 200 ounces per ton!!! Thats just an idea of what may be in your backyard , so to speak. There is over 5 million cubic meters of material on the claims I am going to mine come May so I dont know why I even bother looking any more cause I wont mine that in my lifetime thats for sure but after thirty years of prospecting I just cant seem to stop.
I screened another sample of black sand to 150- for assay so when I get it back I will post it. Should be interesting to see if last assay of 788 gms per ton in 150- holds up. Til then take care my friend and start doin a little research into your local gold mining history and let me know what you find.
Or alternatively if you are not into research I have nothing but time on my hands till April so since I see you are in Canada let me know what area you live in and I will research the area for you and send you any info that may be of interest to you. Since you said most of the mining in your area was in 1800s and early 1900s I am thinking you may be in the Cariboo or Okanogan/Similkameen area?
I will send you my email on PM if you wish to let me know and take me up on my offer.I Just do it for the hobby by the way . I have reference material out the hula hoop.LOL

Regards , Ernie


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## Geraldo (Dec 28, 2011)

Hi Ernie! Thanks for your note (and very interesting story - history is fun, isn't it?).

Yeah, there is a LOT of placer stuff in the Similkameen. I don't live there.

I actually live in the West Kootenays (in Rossland). The Trail Refinery exists because of all the gold mines that were up here in Rossland. They used to cart ore down the old Wagon Trail (with horses) to Trail Landing (afterwards, just "Trail") and smelt the ore in giant open piles. Eventually they built copper reverb furnaces since there was so much copper in the tails. Then they started custom smelting copper ores as the gold ores gradually wound down, then on to lead, then also zinc (since it used to be a major contaminant of lead ore). Of course now they do the whole dog's breakfast related to lead and zinc.

I have to note that there are no mines in this area any longer (that I know of), partly because of the difficulty with permits and partly because most of the rich deposits have likely already been mined out. Besides Rossland's historic gold mining, there were gold mines in Salmo, Slocan Valley (Silverton), Nelson and Ainsworth that I am aware of. There is a sign showing where there used to be a gold placer mine in the Ainsworth area that I saw some years ago - I think that was last mined in the 50's. I don't think placer mining is allowed anywhere in this region any longer. Hard rock mining - a permit would probably take 5-10 years (actually, no one has had any success the last 25 years or so, so maybe the correct time frame is "never"). It is also very difficult to find a tailings pile or pond - they have gradually been remediated (often at taxpayer expense). Downtown Trail is actually built on copper slag from the old smelter, and for a while people were actually talking about bulldozing downtown, tearing up the concrete and mining the old slag for copper, zinc, silver and gold - the historic slag has higher value than new concentrates being produced today. Of course that won't happen...

I wonder whether miner's felt in a creek is considered placer mining?

BTW, I really like the numbers you were quoting for your own mine ($25K/day) - most small placer miners scrape by or starve, and it is nice to hear of someone actually having success!

Best Regards, Gerald


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## ayeyou (Dec 29, 2011)

Hey Gerald ,
Good to hear from you. There is indeed placer mining allowed in your area and I attach a map below to show you the current valid placer claims in your area.The amount of old historic mines in the Rossland area shocked me. You live on top of a huge orebody apparently. I have a few ideas but they will need a little investigative time so I will do up a file for you with all the best areas and approaches to use on each . There are many interesting looking smaller creeks there that I will investigate for you as to the history of gold in them etc. I am trying to kill next three months til I can go mining again so it will help me pass the time.Do you have a gps unit? If so I can give you exact gps cords for each prospect if you like. Getting out in Nature has its own rewards exclusive of finding any gold but I am sure we can find spots that will do both for you.

Regards , Ernie.


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## ayeyou (Dec 29, 2011)




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## ayeyou (Dec 29, 2011)

This is an exciting area Gerald . I just had to post you this little snippet of just one of the mines near you on Little Sheep Creek. It is an old mine but has had ore shipped out of it off and on for many years now.

HISTORY OF PRODUCTIONIHISTORIQUE DE LA PRODUCTION
From 1927 to 1952, 4,085 tons of ore were shipped from t h i s
property. From t h i s ore 6,501 ounces of gold, and 3,777 ounces
of silver were recovered.
In 1968, 789 tons of ore were shipped. From this ore 340
ounces of gold, 247 ounces of s i l v e r , 2,414 pounds of lead, and
1,710 pounds of zinc were recovered.
From 219 tons of crude ore shipped i n 1973, 131 ounces of
gold, 77 ounces of silver, 879 pounds of lead, and 855 pounds
of zinc were recovered.
From 327 tons o f crude ore shipped i n 1974, 99 ozs gold,
145 ozs s i l v e r , 137 l b s copper, 1 330 l b s lead, and 654 l b s
zinc w e r e recovered. From 822 tonnes shipped by Sand Mines L.
i n 1975-76, 17.356 kg gold, 20.186 kg s i l v e r , 425 kg copper,
1 305 kg lead, and 583 kg zinc were recovered. From 42 tonnes
shipped by Carnelian Mines i n 1979, 5.319 kg gold, 3.764 kg
s i l v e r , 183 kg copper, 144 kg lead, and 42 kg zinc w e r e
recovered.
See what I mean this ones just keeps giving and giving. 1975-76 17.3 kg of gold. probably just from higradeing a rich pocket or two. Very interesting.

This is the first one I looked at so it seems highly likely with grades like that in the hardrock mines that the creeks of your area must have at least a few that are good placer streams.


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## nickvc (Dec 29, 2011)

Yet more proof that the tag line underneath the forum banner is in operation.
Well done and may I say thank you even if it doesn't benefit me it sure does the forum.


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## ayeyou (Dec 29, 2011)

Hello nicvc ,
I thank you sir for that kind remark. You took the time to post that even tho as you say it does not benefit you. That to me is reward enough for any time I may spend helping others so again Thank You.
Prospecting is what I do and if I can help someone along the way to get interested in what has been a very enjoyable and rewarding past time for me then thats just giving a little back for all that prospecting has given me.

Regards , Ernie


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## Geraldo (Jan 1, 2012)

Hey Ernie!

Thanks for the info about my area, and that placer mining is ok...and for your encouragement!

I know there is a lot of historic sulfide gold around here that has been recovered by hard rock mining, but I don't know that recovering chemical gold from underground deposits is within a newbie's (my) grasp. I will need to educate myself on this side of things a lot more!

I also wonder about tailings - they are tough to find/spot, because they don't look like tailings any more, but of course recovery technology has advanced over the last 100 years. Even if they don't have placer gold, they might still be very rich in mineral gold, and folks are probably so jaded they just drive by them and don't ever give them a second thought (I know I assumed that some geologist would have already checked them out and found them to be barren - a big assumption, really).

As for "Sheep Creek" you hit on a little local joke. There are probably 10 or 15 creeks that I have seen that are called "Sheep Creek." They don't have the same headwaters, nor flow to the same places - they are truly independent little creeks. Some are "Big Sheep Creek" and others are "Little Sheep Creek." Anytime someone says they were doing X in "Sheep Creek" they have to specify exactly where they were e.g. "the Big Sheep Creek just north of Salmo..." I am not sure about the early settlers to this region - they seemed to love sheep just a little too much!

Thanks again for your interesting posts, Ernie!

Best Regards, Gerald


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## ayeyou (Jan 3, 2012)

Hey gerald,
Hope you had a enjoyable holiday season. I am actually over visiting my brother right now. i have a ton of info for you but it is all my computer at home safely saved there for you. There is info on a dozen or so mines within 8 km of Rossland. Grades ,gps co-ords and history. When I get home tyomorrow or next day I will get them to you.
There is some excellent placer ground ground open right near you. With in a 10 km radius and right on main roads. The sheep creek i referred to is the one on the hiway to the states to the SW of Rossland. Its an easy 10 minute drive from your house is my bet. Any way as I said all that info is at home so I will get it to you soon. There is a fair volume of info so perhaps if you send me a PM with your email addy it would be much more efficient and private a means of me just sending it direct as an attachment to an email. I have a couple of wonderful photos of a mine near you with tons and tons of tailings in plain site so I know they havent cleaned them all up. An interesting fact is that after these tailings have been laying out in the air and weather they oxidize quickly so the sulphides break down and after a time the area below them can become quite a rich little pocket of pannable placer gold. There is some real oppurtunity in your area to realize a nice little second income if you decide that spending the odd weekend prospecting is something you might be interested in. I tell ya what my friend if it were not for the excellent placer property I already have to work , I woulod be on my way there now!! LOL
Good to Hear you survived the holidays and we will talk soon. 

Regards , Ernie


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## Dr. Poe (Jan 3, 2012)

Congratulations! Looking at the picture of your black sand concentrates was more fun than the 'Seek and Find' games on my computer. I recognized the candy apple red of 18k (75% gold/25% copper), the bluish purple of gold alloyed with iron, the steel gray of calaverite (gold ditelluride), and the black monoclinic crystals of sylvanite (exposed to too much light), crystal of quartz and of barite. If the refiner that you posted of is as honest and as capable as you have stated, you and your partners will be very happy men. :mrgreen: Dr. Poe


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## FlyingEagleLode (Jan 30, 2012)

I don't know how many hours I spent using small systems micro sluices gold wheels.
The blue bowl works good but the best way I found is fire assay using lead litharidge.


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## ayeyou (Jan 31, 2012)

After much consideration I have decided to go with the extruder shaker table sold by MSI mining equipment. It is pricey at 25k but there is nothing like it for recovering ultra fine gold. The last assay I got back a couple weeks ago was 306 grams per ton of black sand. With those kinds of values I would be a fool not to spend a few dollars on a good table. It will pay for itself with the first couple tons I run on it and after that its all gravy!
Here is a video of table in action....

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gY7VELbF1ew&feature=related[/youtube]


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