# poor mans aqua regia



## Gold Lady

Is there one online now to give me the exact formula for the poor mans aqua regia.
Joyce


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## glorycloud

Most of the formulas can be found in the very first forum: DATA

*2.AR Recipie 2= Poor Man's AR = 8 oz Sodium Nitrate (aka Subzero), 480 ml water, 960 ml Muriatic Acid plus heat. Used to dissolve high karat gold, gold powder, gold foils, dissolves Platinum when hot. Excess nitric must be evaporated off neutralized with Urea to pH 1 +/- 0.4, then drop gold with SMB.

◦The above mentioned recipie makes enough AR to dissolve 160 gm Pins or 32 oz of ceramic cpus.*

Please be careful with all processes and chemicals!!! Read the SAFETY section please!! 8)


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## butcher

gold lady don't forget to get rid of the base metals first.


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## Irons

Add the Sodium Nitrate in increments, not all at once.

If you get Sodium Nitrate prills, it's better to dissolve them in a little hot water first. They have a polymer anti-caking coating that makes them dissolve very slowly.

The other day, I dissolved .22 oz of low carat Gold in poor man's AR a couple of 24/40 erlenmyer flasks connected with silicone tubing. One was the digestor, the other had a frit bubbler in a solution of Sodium Carbonate and Hydrogen Peroxide as a NOx scrubber. It converted the NOx to Sodium Nitrate. Most of the NOx reacted at the frit. The few bubbles that reached the surface reacted with the Oxygen given off by the Hydrogen Peroxide, turning Red than disappearing as the NOx was converted to Nitric Acid and absorbed by the solution.

There were almost no fumes emitted.


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## glorycloud

Any chance you could post a picture of what that set up looks like Irons? 8)


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## Irons

glorycloud said:


> Any chance you could post a picture of what that set up looks like Irons? 8)



I knew someone would ask. I guess I'll have to get out my camera tomorrow. 8)


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## glorycloud

LOL!! 

Muchas gracias amigo!!! 8)


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## butcher

sodium carbonate good choice, for sodium, and carbonate for its insolubility? and peroxide to convert back NO2 gas. thats a smart idea, are you monitoring temperature, keeping it low enough so chlorine does not come over?
what do you call a frit?


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## Anonymous

frit, looks like a aquarium stone.


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## Gold Lady

Thank all of you good guys for your information.
Gold Lady


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## Irons

butcher said:


> sodium carbonate good choice, for sodium, and carbonate for its insolubility? and peroxide to convert back NO2 gas. thats a smart idea, are you monitoring temperature, keeping it low enough so chlorine does not come over?
> what do you call a frit?



Sodium Carbonate because it's quite soluble(220g/l @20deg C.), inexpensive and available in the grocery store as Washing Soda. It reacts with the Nitric Acid to produce Sodium Nitrate and Carbon Dioxide. The Hydrogen peroxide reacts with the NOx to produce Nitric Acid.

Keeping it cool is no problem this time of year. Even if there is a little contamination from Chlorine, the resulting Sodium Nitrate is still usable for making Poor Man's AR.

It's better than breathing NOx and Chlorine.

A frit is just a fancy, expensive and chemical resistant aquarium stone.

I would prefer using Potassium Carbonate to get Potassium Nitrate but the Carbonate is more expensive than the Nitrate. If you burn wood, the ashes can be leached to get Potassium Carbonate.


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## Irons

glorycloud said:


> Any chance you could post a picture of what that set up looks like Irons? 8)


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## gorfman6154

Irons said:


> I knew someone would ask. I guess I'll have to get out my camera tomorrow. 8)



Irons, that is a thing of beauty 8) . Great photograph!!

If you wouldn't mind, could you post the quantity and ratio of Sodium Carbonate to Hydrogen Peroxide, and the ratio of poor man's Aqua Regia to the amount of scrubber that you used.

Also any other tips or pointers on using this for a first time, would be greatly appreciated.

You're awesome, Irons.

Thanks, Gorfman


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## butcher

I have been looking into potash potassium carbonate K2CO3 from wood ash leach, trying to understand the chemistry involved, in the leaching process, Having used it for many things I never understood its chemistry, the other chemical combinations also in wood ash, and how it reacted with other substances, 

like calcium hydroxide Ca(OH)2 slaked lime mixed with Potassium carbonate K2CO3 from wood ash leach to get potassium hydroxide in solution, calcium carbonate CaCO3 precipitant and caustic potash potassium hydroxide KOH in solution
K2CO3 + Ca(OH)2 --> CaCO3 (s) + 2KOH (aq)

and also trying the chemistry involved it compost of animal dung and urea potato leaves etc.. to obtain calcium nitrate CaNO3 and using KOH potassium hydroxide from above reaction to get products of calcium hydroxide CaOH and potassium nitrate KNO3
CaNO3 + KOH --> CaOH (s) + KNO3 (aq)

this was for a project I would like to post on if I can get all this confusing chemistry straight in my scrambled brain,

project I will call caveman or backwoods gold refining

hopefully to include making sulfuric acid, hydrochloric acid, potasium nitrate, and other chemicals we use in recovery of these metals. from things we have here in the backwoods.

Irons could probably write this in one afternoon, but I would not get the understanding unless I do the research, and get all these confusing chemicals and equations straight in my head, 

this I started after a challenge from Manuel in mexico to come up with a formula, this may take me awhile as I confuse easily when I begin learning something but when I do understand it the light comes on,

I was getting some of these chimicals mixed up in my head when I asked Irons if he chose sodium carbonate for its solubility , as I did not look up its solubility (as I should have before asking that), I did remember soda ash Na2CO3 has a wide range of solubility depending on temperature, I can't find the data again but from memory something like 20 times more soluble Hot than cold, were table salt NaCL solubility does not change very much at all with temperature.

pottasium would definitatly be the thing to use, making your byproduct more useful, dont you burn wood for heat Irons?


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## Irons

gorfman6154 said:


> Irons said:
> 
> 
> 
> I knew someone would ask. I guess I'll have to get out my camera tomorrow. 8)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Irons, that is a thing of beauty 8) . Great photograph!!
> 
> If you wouldn't mind, could you post the quantity and ratio of Sodium Carbonate to Hydrogen Peroxide, and the ratio of poor man's Aqua Regia to the amount of scrubber that you used.
> 
> Also any other tips or pointers on using this for a first time, would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> You're awesome, Irons.
> 
> Thanks, Gorfman
Click to expand...


My wife doesn't think so. but then, she knows me better. :mrgreen: 

calculate how many equivalents of Nitrate you have in your reactor and use an equal amount of H2O2 in the scrubber
You should not see any red fumes in your reactor. NO is clear. When it reacts with the Hydrogen peroxide, it forms red NO2 and the peroxide gives off an Oxygen atom. The Red NO2 is absorbed by the water, the reaction producing Nitric Acid (clear). If you see bubbles coming off of the frit, rising to the surface, either your frit has too small surface area, or your reaction is going too fast. When the bubbles pop, they react with Oxygen given off by the scrubber solution, turn red and then slowly turn clear.
The output of the scrubber to the bottom of a container filled with crushed Marble (Calcium Carbonate). I use WallyWorld play sand which is a Marble grit. It only costs a few dollars a 50lb bag.

If everything is working perfectly, the output of the scrubber should be Carbon Dioxide and a little Oxygen.


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## goldsilverpro

Richard,

The solubilities of anhydrous sodium carbonate in water is 71 g/l at 32F and 455 g/l at 212F. Some of the other forms of sodium carbonate have different solubility ranges.

Get a copy of Lange's Handbook of Chemistry
http://www.filestube.com/f4a41010ba0441b403e9,g/lange-s-handbook-of-chemistry.html

and/or the CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics
http://fileshunt.com/rapidshare.php?file=crc+handbook+chemistry+physics+89+th+edition

I got the above data from the 52nd edition of the CRC Handbook (I bought it for $1), which I use daily. I see them a lot in used book stores. For most purposes, an old one is as good as a new one. The old ones were smaller but much thicker. I think they went to the larger format sometime in the 1960s. The smaller ones had more stuff in them. I especially liked the section on Laboratory Recipes, which doesn't exist in the larger format.


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## Irons

goldsilverpro said:


> Richard,
> 
> The solubilities of anhydrous sodium carbonate in water is 71 g/l at 32F and 455 g/l at 212F. Some of the other forms of sodium carbonate have different solubility ranges.
> 
> Get a copy of Lange's Handbook of Chemistry
> http://www.filestube.com/f4a41010ba0441b403e9,g/lange-s-handbook-of-chemistry.html
> 
> and/or the CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics
> http://fileshunt.com/rapidshare.php?file=crc+handbook+chemistry+physics+89+th+edition
> 
> I got the above data from the 52nd edition of the CRC Handbook (I bought it for $1), which I use daily. I see them a lot in used book stores. For most purposes, an old one is as good as a new one. The old ones were smaller but much thicker. I think they went to the larger format sometime in the 1960s. The smaller ones had more stuff in them. I especially liked the section on Laboratory Recipes, which doesn't exist in the larger format.


I have a couple from 1919. They're much handier. I used Wiki for my value. A saturated solution at whatever temperature works. You can use less if you choose.


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## Irons

butcher said:


> dont you burn wood for heat Irons?



Not yet, but I have a stove. I just need to pick it up.

We have a grove of Ash trees on the property. They produce quite a bit of ash, thus the name. They tend to shed branches, so I have several piles ready and waiting to be burned.

An interesting trait that I noticed about Ash, at least the variety we have, is that they are very late in leafing out in the Spring and one of the first to drop leaves in the Fall, thus my garden doesn't get shade until the soil has warmed and in the Fall, we get much needed sunshine when the weather gets cold.


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## butcher

there is nothing like a wood stove for heat, you get warm twice, warmth and exercize getting the wood, it is great for arthritis, and soo nice to come in from the cold and get warmth down to them ole bones, with a glass window being able to see the fire is also soothing, and it helps to keep my woods cleaned up and the forest fire danger down, and can heat my coffee on it. I grew up on wood so there is also warm memory's there, and even the ash has useful property, what else could I ask for in heating my home? what else can be more natural?


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## goldnugget77

In the first flask with the lever you place your 
.22 oz of low carat Gold 
Sodium Nitrate 
water 
HCL

In the other flask you place Sodium Carbonate and Hydrogen peroxide

I would like to know if this is correct 
If it is than I would like to how much quantity of Sodium Nitrate, 
water, HCLis needed


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## Irons

goldnugget77 said:


> In the first flask with the lever you place your
> .22 oz of low carat Gold
> Sodium Nitrate
> water
> HCL
> 
> In the other flask you place Sodium Carbonate and Hydrogen peroxide
> 
> I would like to know if this is correct
> If it is than I would like to how much quantity of Sodium Nitrate,
> water, HCLis needed



I started out with about 25 ml of HCL and a half level teaspoon of NaNO3.
You can always add more later.

I didn't add any water is the only difference. The rest is ok. 

It's not required to use fancy glassware. You can adapt the idea to your own needs.

The glass frits are quite expensive to buy new but some HDPE tubing with a lot of tiny holes will do the same thing quite inexpensively. The key is to make the bubbles tiny so that they will react quickly and not reach the surface of the scrubber solution.


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## PreciousMexpert

> HDPE tubing with a lot of tiny holes will do the same thing quite inexpensively. The key is to make the bubbles tiny so that they will react quickly and not reach the surface of the scrubber solution.


Hi Irons
What you have in your picture is silicone tubing

tiny holes and bubbles tiny is something I dont understand
Would a plastic tube be OK 
Thanks


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## PreciousMexpert

Hi Irons 
In Your picture the experiment looks like 2flasks attacked by a tube.
Is there anyplace where air is coming out or is it completely closed.
If I do this and I make it so that there is no air being realsed from any part of the setup 
Will there be any kind of danger
Thanks


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## jimdoc

You have to let air out somewhere or it will let itself out. The idea is to neutralize the hazardous fumes before they are released.
Jim


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## Irons

PreciousMexpert said:


> HDPE tubing with a lot of tiny holes will do the same thing quite inexpensively. The key is to make the bubbles tiny so that they will react quickly and not reach the surface of the scrubber solution.
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Irons
> What you have in your picture is silicone tubing
> 
> tiny holes and bubbles tiny is something I dont understand
> Would a plastic tube be OK
> Thanks
Click to expand...


Use HDPE tubing inside the scrubber to disperse the fumes into tiny bubbles. The Silicone tubing just lets the fumes get from the reactor to the scrubber. You need a lot of holes in the HDPE tubing to limit back-pressure. 
The fumes go down the center tube in the scrubber where they are dispersed by the frit into the Sodium Carbonate/Hydrogen Peroxide solution. The vent is on the top right of the scrubber.







If you're not familiar with the Chemistry and chemical apparatus, I suggest sticking with the procedures outlined by Harold and others. This is more for the advanced student of the craft.


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## PreciousMexpert

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://biorealis.com/digester/images/3_hoopintank.jpg&imgrefurl=http://biorealis.com/digester/construction.html&usg=__y11kgGnDitVi33MtxrE9C2TrHVQ=&h=327&w=400&sz=11&hl=en&start=15&tbnid=0ScTnyH7cE6SDM:&tbnh=101&tbnw=124&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dinside%2Bof%2BHDPE%2Btubing%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG

Hi Irons 
Is this the idea


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## Irons

PreciousMexpert said:


> http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://biorealis.com/digester/images/3_hoopintank.jpg&imgrefurl=http://biorealis.com/digester/construction.html&usg=__y11kgGnDitVi33MtxrE9C2TrHVQ=&h=327&w=400&sz=11&hl=en&start=15&tbnid=0ScTnyH7cE6SDM:&tbnh=101&tbnw=124&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dinside%2Bof%2BHDPE%2Btubing%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG
> 
> Hi Irons
> Is this the idea



That could be modified to do the trick. I would use more tubing and make several turns around the bottom and make the holes a lot smaller. Smaller than a straight pin. The best I've found are the lancets that diabetics use to prick their finger. Heat the tip with a match then push it through the side of the tubing and leave it until it's cool. Insert one after another, shoulder to shoulder and repeat until you just say bugger it.


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## PreciousMexpert

Hi Irons
Thanks for your good ideas
I made a drawing it looks awful but I think it gives a better idea of what I have in my mind.
http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/7043/61294310.jpg
1) The reactor
I thought about using a coffee pot and fixing the cover so that it has a valve.


2) The scrubber
I said maybe I can use a 
7x7x7 inch plastic container so that it looks like that.


3) In the scrubber I will have a tube with tiny holes made with lancets that diabetics use 
I guess I will have to make lots of the


4) In the scrubber I think you said you places Marbles


> The output of the scrubber to the bottom of a container filled with crushed Marble (Calcium Carbonate).
> I use WallyWorld play sand which is a Marble grit. It only costs a few dollars a 50lb bag.


Should I do the same.


5) How much of these chemicals should I use for refining .22 oz of 10K Gold 
Sodium Nitrate 
HCL
Sodium Carbonate 
Hydrogen peroxide


6) Once the reaction is complete than I have 
Nitric acid 
in the Scrubber.
What will be the strength of this nitric acid

Thanks again for your help


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## butcher

I am not sure what you mean by a valve? 
a check valve (one way valve) may be ok letting gas leave your reaction vessel.
but you do not want to accumulate a pressure in your reaction (boiling) vessel by having a valve that if shut would build pressure, unless this pressure would relieve before glass burst, even if pressure built up in reaction vessel and it pops its cork your solution may foam over, I would just keep your reaction vessel hotter thus more pressure than your reciever,(temperature and pressure has a direct relationship), and remove the tube to your reciever (scrubber), before lowering temperature or pressure on the reaction flask (boiler), so as not to suck siphion back cooler solution into your reaction flask, do away with valve, another method is to have a empty flask in between the two ( reaction flask and reciever flask) this center empty flask both tubes just into the top and only gas passes through it, and if the pressure in your reaction flask goes into a vacuum because of lower pressure (temperature) then the cooler liquid from your reciver will just fill this center flask (gas flask) and not go back into your reaction flask holding your gold and possibly thermally shocking and busting the glass.


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## Irons

butcher said:


> I am not sure what you mean by a valve?
> a check valve (one way valve) may be ok letting gas leave your reaction vessel.
> but you do not want to accumulate a pressure in your reaction (boiling) vessel by having a valve that if shut would build pressure, unless this pressure would relieve before glass burst, even if pressure built up in reaction vessel and it pops its cork your solution may foam over, I would just keep your reaction vessel hotter thus more pressure than your reciever,(temperature and pressure has a direct relationship), and remove the tube to your reciever (scrubber), before lowering temperature or pressure on the reaction flask (boiler), so as not to suck siphion back cooler solution into your reaction flask, do away with valve, another method is to have a empty flask in between the two ( reaction flask and reciever flask) this center empty flask both tubes just into the top and only gas passes through it, and if the pressure in your reaction flask goes into a vacuum because of lower pressure (temperature) then the cooler liquid from your reciver will just fill this center flask (gas flask) and not go back into your reaction flask holding your gold and possibly thermally shocking and busting the glass.



Good point.

I used the valve in case I needed to disconnect the hose for some reason and this allowed me to temporarily stop the NOX from escaping and then it is opened again once the hose is reconnected. When the reaction is complete, the valve can be closed to keep any scrubber solution from backing up into the reactor.


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## butcher

I noticed your valve Irons and had no concern with it as I knew you know how to use it safely, but others may not understand the dangers involved when distilling with glass, most us hillbillys dont use glass. :lol:

And I have to say how much I love your approach to chemistry it is so practical, and easy to understand. It has been a great resource for many of us, Thanks.


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## golddie

If you look in the part that says scrubber,you have a tube that has many very smal holes made with a needle
In that container you fill sand or marbles 
Irons said fill it with sand in that case wont the holes get blocked


http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/7043/61294310.jpg


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## Irons

golddie said:


> If you look in the part that says scrubber,you have a tube that has many very smal holes made with a needle
> In that container you fill sand or marbles
> Irons said fill it with sand in that case wont the holes get blocked
> 
> 
> http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/7043/61294310.jpg



The scrubber contains Sodium Carbonate and Hydrogen Peroxide. The vent from the scrubber goes to another container containing Calcium Carbonate (Marble chips) to absorb any fumes that might escape the scrubber. Using chips or coarsely ground Marble prevents clogging and the resulting back pressure. The Walmart play sand works well and is quite inexpensive.


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## golddie

Hi Irons
I didnt know that you needed a third container
Then what happens to the chemical in that container.
Do I follow the steps in dealing with waste by 4metals 

or do I treat it in a different way
or can I use this as dilute AR
Thanks


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## Irons

golddie said:


> Hi Irons
> I didnt know that you needed a third container
> Then what happens to the chemical in that container.
> Do I follow the steps in dealing with waste by 4metals
> 
> or do I treat it in a different way
> or can I use this as dilute AR
> Thanks



You don't 'need' the third container as long as the reaction is going well, otherwise it will save you from dealing with a shopfull of NO2.


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## golddie

Hi Irons
Sorry for being a pest
I am confused 
Do I place the 


> The Walmart play sand


inside the container that says scrubber

where does this go 
Calcium Carbonate


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## Barren Realms 007

Here is the post that Iron's explains how the Sodium Carbonate is used in the recieving flask.



Irons said:


> Add the Sodium Nitrate in increments, not all at once.
> 
> If you get Sodium Nitrate prills, it's better to dissolve them in a little hot water first. They have a polymer anti-caking coating that makes them dissolve very slowly.
> 
> The other day, I dissolved .22 oz of low carat Gold in poor man's AR a couple of 24/40 erlenmyer flasks connected with silicone tubing. One was the digestor, the other had a frit bubbler in a solution of Sodium Carbonate and Hydrogen Peroxide as a NOx scrubber. It converted the NOx to Sodium Nitrate. Most of the NOx reacted at the frit. The few bubbles that reached the surface reacted with the Oxygen given off by the Hydrogen Peroxide, turning Red than disappearing as the NOx was converted to Nitric Acid and absorbed by the solution.
> 
> There were almost no fumes emitted.




If you will go back on this thread (2nd page 5th post) you will see the picture Iron's posted with 2 flasks not 3. The recieving flask has a vent opening in the neck to let the incoming gasses escape after going thru the bubbler. 



> Hi Irons
> I didnt know that you needed a third container




The answer to this is no. This is used in a 3rd container if it is necessary.



> I am confused
> Do I place the
> 
> Quote:
> The Walmart play sand
> 
> inside the container that says scrubber






> _*Quote by Irons
> You don't 'need' the third container as long as the reaction is going well, otherwise it will save you from dealing with a shopfull of NO2.*_




Start at the beginning and read this thead again.


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## prospector pete

as far as im aware , its the same as normal aqua regia except you use bleach instead of nitric.
i make my mix , 2/3 hcl and 1/3 household bleach .


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## nickvc

prospector pete said:


> as far as im aware , its the same as normal aqua regia except you use bleach instead of nitric.
> i make my mix , 2/3 hcl and 1/3 household bleach .



No that’s not poor mans AR, to make poormans you use Hcl and a nitrate instead of nitric.


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## FrugalRefiner

prospector pete said:


> as far as im aware , its the same as normal aqua regia except you use bleach instead of nitric.


Poor man's AR uses sodium nitrate or potassium nitrate in place of nitric acid. For most people, nitric acid has become very expensive, so using the sodium or potassium nitrate is a less costly alternative.



> i make my mix , 2/3 hcl and 1/3 household bleach .


It is best to add you bleach (or other oxidizer) in small increments. The bleach reacts with the acid to release chlorine which oxidizes the gold. If too much is added at one time, much of the chlorine is simply lost as gas to the atmosphere instead of dissolving gold.

Dave


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## prospector pete

nickvc said:


> prospector pete said:
> 
> 
> 
> as far as im aware , its the same as normal aqua regia except you use bleach instead of nitric.
> i make my mix , 2/3 hcl and 1/3 household bleach .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No that’s not poor mans AR, to make poormans you use Hcl and a nitrate instead of nitric.
Click to expand...



well actually bleach or nitrate can be used.....
iuse bleach and never have any probs. there are also lots of videos of people using bleach


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## FrugalRefiner

Pete, yes HCl and bleach can be used to dissolve gold. So can HCl and H2O2, HCl and chlorate, etc., but they are not poor man's AR. It's like calling a chicken sandwich a hamburger. You can eat them both and they'll both fill your belly, but only the hamburger is a hamburger. Only HCl and a nitrate source is poor man's AR. We try hard to keep the information on this site accurate, despite what you may see on youtube.

Dave


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## Alondro

Irons said:


> Add the Sodium Nitrate in increments, not all at once.
> 
> If you get Sodium Nitrate prills, it's better to dissolve them in a little hot water first. They have a polymer anti-caking coating that makes them dissolve very slowly.
> 
> The other day, I dissolved .22 oz of low carat Gold in poor man's AR a couple of 24/40 erlenmyer flasks connected with silicone tubing. One was the digestor, the other had a frit bubbler in a solution of Sodium Carbonate and Hydrogen Peroxide as a NOx scrubber. It converted the NOx to Sodium Nitrate. Most of the NOx reacted at the frit. The few bubbles that reached the surface reacted with the Oxygen given off by the Hydrogen Peroxide, turning Red than disappearing as the NOx was converted to Nitric Acid and absorbed by the solution.
> 
> There were almost no fumes emitted.


Ooo! Now that looks like an ever better method for re-capturing the NO2 than simply reforming nitric acid. Thinking about it, making the neutral sodium nitrate should push the reaction equilibrium even further towards making more nitrate.

What amounts of peroxide (at which concentration) and sodium carbonate do you use per liter of water?


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## FrugalRefiner

Alondro, if you're directing your question to Irons, you may be waiting for an answer. When responding / quoting old posts, it is useful to move your cursor over the member's name or avatar. You can see when they joined, and when they last visited. In this case, Irons hasn't been here since Sept. 26, 2016.

I miss our old friend.

Dave


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## Alondro

FrugalRefiner said:


> Alondro, if you're directing your question to Irons, you may be waiting for an answer. When responding / quoting old posts, it is useful to move your cursor over the member's name or avatar. You can see when they joined, and when they last visited. In this case, Irons hasn't been here since Sept. 26, 2016.
> 
> I miss our old friend.
> 
> Dave


Ah, well it looks like from the rest of the thread I basically need to dissolve as much sodium carbonate as possible into the peroxide and use the solution until bubbles of NO2 start to make it to the surface, at which point it's saturated with sodium nitrate.


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## FrugalRefiner

It's OK to ask questions, and I'm glad you're studying through old threads. Someone else may provide an answer. Just didn't want you to be waiting for an answer from a particular member.

Dave


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## Racoon

FrugalRefiner said:


> Pete, yes HCl and bleach can be used to dissolve gold. So can HCl and H2O2, HCl and chlorate, etc., but they are not poor man's AR. It's like calling a chicken sandwich a hamburger. You can eat them both and they'll both fill your belly, but only the hamburger is a hamburger. Only HCl and a nitrate source is poor man's AR. We try hard to keep the information on this site accurate, despite what you may see on youtube.
> 
> Dave


Bleach will drop gold, but it won’t drop all the gold. One of the people on you tube tried it and less than half was dropped.


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## orvi

Racoon said:


> Bleach will drop gold, but it won’t drop all the gold. One of the people on you tube tried it and less than half was dropped.


Bleach is hypochlorite. In acidic media, it evolves chlorine, which is strong oxidizing agent. Hypochlorite alone is strong oxidizer, and I doubt it could reduce elemental gold from solution.


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## Yggdrasil

As far as I know, bleach do not drop gold.
But added in sufficient amount it may increase the ph enough to drop all salts as hydroxides.
But it is not gold, silver or copper.
It is just a other salt, a hydroxide of said metal.


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## waampoi

Irons said:


> Sodium Carbonate because it's quite soluble(220g/l @20deg C.), inexpensive and available in the grocery store as Washing Soda. It reacts with the Nitric Acid to produce Sodium Nitrate and Carbon Dioxide. The Hydrogen peroxide reacts with the NOx to produce Nitric Acid.
> 
> Keeping it cool is no problem this time of year. Even if there is a little contamination from Chlorine, the resulting Sodium Nitrate is still usable for making Poor Man's AR.
> 
> It's better than breathing NOx and Chlorine.
> 
> A frit is just a fancy, expensive and chemical resistant aquarium stone.
> 
> I would prefer using Potassium Carbonate to get Potassium Nitrate but the Carbonate is more expensive than the Nitrate. If you burn wood, the ashes can be leached to get Potassium Carbonate.


can I have more detail on leaching ashes?


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