# The bad snow storms in the USA



## nickvc (Nov 21, 2014)

My thoughts are with all our members who are suffering this bad snow storm and I hope it all ends quickly and safely for all.


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## kurtak (Nov 21, 2014)

We haven't been hit as bad as some (only about a foot & a half of snow) but that snow is "way early" & temps are running 30 to 40 degrees below normal - have already had below zero temps & we should not be seeing that till January :x 

Crazy :!: 

could sure use some of that global warming about now :lol: looks like we are headed the other way - the next ice age :shock: 

Kurt


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## g_axelsson (Nov 21, 2014)

The heat is hitting us here in Sweden. 8) 

Late November and no snow in sight. I'm still doing experiments outside!
And I'm living at the same latitude as Fairbanks, Alaska!

Göran


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## Irons (Nov 21, 2014)

kurtak said:


> We haven't been hit as bad as some (only about a foot & a half of snow) but that snow is "way early" & temps are running 30 to 40 degrees below normal - have already had below zero temps & we should not be seeing that till January :x
> 
> Crazy :!:
> 
> ...



It's Global Warming that has increased the amount of 'Lake Effect Snow' in the Northeast. Hot weather during the Summer and Fall cause the Water in the Lakes to heat-up. Think of the Water as a very large Heat Battery. When the temperatures drop below freezing, the Water continues to give off heat, and Evaporation of the water, combined with Cold Air, produces Snow. The Warmer the Water, the more the Evaporation, thus, more Snow.


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## Smack (Nov 21, 2014)

Was in no way a warm summer here, my A/C ran very little.


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## g_axelsson (Nov 21, 2014)

It looks like you guys are in one of the few cold spaces on Earth (compared to average years) and I'm smack in the middle of one of the largest hot zones on land.

http://www.livescience.com/48841-2014-predicted-warmest-year-ever.html




Göran


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## shaftsinkerawc (Nov 21, 2014)

I agree with their color chart but it's still only 15* F here in Fairbanks. Problem is we have very little snow, we need the insulating cover to keep the septics from freezing when it does go colder.


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## kurtak (Nov 22, 2014)

Irons said:


> kurtak said:
> 
> 
> > We haven't been hit as bad as some (only about a foot & a half of snow) but that snow is "way early" & temps are running 30 to 40 degrees below normal - have already had below zero temps & we should not be seeing that till January :x
> ...



Irons 

My comment about global warming was just a joking response to the crazy cold/snow we are getting here in the great lakes area

How ever as Smack pointed out we had a cooler (& wetter) spring/summer/fall this year - also last winter was colder - we had a "record" number of days "below zero" last winter & the spring/summer/fall before that was also a colder/wetter year --- the corn growers in the area have now had 2 bad years in a row due to the colder/wetter growing seasons

Last winter the cold & heavy snow was very hard on the deer & wild turkeys - turkeys were freezing & falling out of their trees dead & the deer got yarded up in the snow & starved - enough so that they made some major harvesting laws

A high school buddy of mine lives in Fairbanks & he told me that they had a Wisconsin winter last year (warmer then normal) while we had a Fairbanks winter (colder then normal)

Here is my opinion on the matter --- as much as I believe there is "some" merit to global warming (man induced) I don't believe it is "the sky is falling" answer to global climate change - the earth has been experiencing global climate charge, large & small, extreme & not so extreme as long as it has existed volcano's (changing air quality or warming oceans) plate shifting (changing ocean currents) earth core activity (shifting of the earth as a whole) moon positioning (gravity pull) sun spot activity (solar radiation) planet alignment (gravity again)

All of these things can & do affect climate change - the only one that we can (& should) control is the one in which what we do to impact our environment - other then that we have no control

Kurt


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## heliman4141 (Nov 22, 2014)

CO2 emissions have spiked radicly way,way, way, beyond anything the Earth has ever seen, going back hundreds of millions of yrs. in just the last 100 yrs. due to the industrial revolution taking place. Since emissions were first checked to now the spike is unbelievable, no volcano has ever even came close to what we have done in just 100yrs. ever since man stepped on the Planet.
The data on this is profound & there for anyone to see. The graph of it is off the charts & scary. Core samples of ice from millions of yrs. ago prove this. Anyone who think a lil Planet wobbling, or Sunspots, or a cycle of some sort etc.. is the cause of our weather change needs to take a good hard look at the carbons emissions we have & still are emmitting Planet wide & compare them with any cycle known to man & the facts are obvious from a purely sound scientific point of view, no guessing here just plain hard data. Another issue is all the frozen locked up methane in the Oceans, as they warm up that methane will begin to be released further making the cycle increase at a substancial rate far beyond just CO2 issues. The unusual melting of the North Artic & the non re-freezing again is proof of this onging delemia we will be facing eventually. The trees & grass take in CO2 & produce Oxygen but the folks in 3rd World Countrys are burning the forests down to make coal, the only way they can legally make any money to survive, or the forests are destroyed to be replaced with palm trees for the oil they produce again, for money at the expense of the Planet down the rd.
I laugh everytime I read about how anyone is going to come up with a viable new energy source that is cheaper then coal & crude that is sustainable & cheaper, never going to happen.
We are addicted to oil & all its products, its in everything. Solar & wind will never compete & nuclear well.............look at Japan now.
Irons is correct, I live 20mi. South of the tip of Lake Michigan & in 56 yrs. I have seen a HUGH change in the weather patterns here & have seen it accelerating in the past 2 decades.
With population growth uncontrolled emissions will only skyrocket till we reach a point where even the wealthy hard headed will have to concede that if they want to survive then they too will have to finally move onto a cleaner fuel source even if it means loosing profit if they want to be able to breath outside air. 
Im always hearing folks complain about everything coming from China BUT I remind them to go online & look at the horrific air quality they have there due to the endless factorys & coal burning plants & then they don't quite feel so bad about our situation since we don't have to wear masks to go for a walk ...................yet.
The data speaks volumes......all people have to do is see the charts & believe the obvious. Im an amature Astronomer and have owned a scope most all my life & ive seen no strange Solar cycles or changes of the Earths Solar orbit in the last 50yrs. all ive seen is rising CO2 & population growth & more industry. Simple chemistry at work converting one compound (in the ground) to another in the atmosphere as a result in progress.

Dave


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## kurtak (Nov 23, 2014)

heliman4141 said:


> Im an amature Astronomer and have owned a scope most all my life
> 
> Dave



Dave 

You might enjoy this web site then - its an astro-photography web site done by my brother - He just finished building a new observatory a couple weeks ago

http://www.willowberry.net/keithnk_m42/

Kurt


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## Lou (Nov 23, 2014)

All it take is going out west to Glacier Natl park as a boy, and then going back as a man.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/23/us/climate-change-threatens-to-strip-the-identity-of-glacier-national-park.html?_r=0


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## heliman4141 (Nov 23, 2014)

kurtak said:


> heliman4141 said:
> 
> 
> > Im an amature Astronomer and have owned a scope most all my life
> ...





Hi Kurt,
Yes, I visit a lot of Astrophotography sites, never ceases to amaze me the patience & equipment used to do it. I love the pics.
I tried my hand at it & have many nice pics of Comets & easy targets like the Sun & moon & Planets but the DSOs are out of my league big time. 
Decided to leave that facet to the boys with the big money equipment, endless patience, & observatorys & I went back to just observing. 8) 
Polar alignment by hand every session was a nightmare for anything over a 1 min. exposure for me ............so a permenant observatory is a must have for any serious AP.
If I lived in the country in a dark sky region id probably build me one but im surrounded by tall Oaks so must travel to do any observing.
Thanks for the link.

Dave


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## heliman4141 (Nov 23, 2014)

Lou said:


> All it take is going out west to Glacier Natl park as a boy, and then going back as a man.
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/23/us/climate-change-threatens-to-strip-the-identity-of-glacier-national-park.html?_r=0




Yep,
The obvious is glaring back at us in just one lifetime, scary. 
Wish id be around to see what the Planet will be like in 100yrs.....................I can imagine it pretty well tho, from what ive already witnessed & its accelerating.

Dave


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## Harold_V (Nov 24, 2014)

heliman4141 said:


> CO2 emissions have spiked radicly way,way, way, beyond anything the Earth has ever seen, going back hundreds of millions of yrs. in just the last 100 yrs. due to the industrial revolution taking place. Since emissions were first checked to now the spike is unbelievable, no volcano has ever even came close to what we have done in just 100yrs. ever since man stepped on the Planet.


Interestingly, politically inclined people of the republican party, here in the US, refuse to acknowledge what has occurred, and is occurring. Look hard enough and you'll find claims of the arctic ice pack growing, not shrinking, for example. The spin they're able to apply to hard facts boggles the mind. They are oriented towards making money, damned the cost to the environment. As long as that attitude prevails, I see nothing good coming from efforts to control what is happening at our hand. The very idea that one can "purchase" carbon credits defeats the purpose entirely, as if to suggest that enough money changes hands, things will be fine. 

Enough said about the political nature of this problem. I probably shouldn't have even made mention, but some folks refuse to acknowledge the obvious. 

Harold


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## g_axelsson (Nov 24, 2014)

This is a fascinating movie that shows carbon dioxide in the atmosphere during a year.
http://www.nasa.gov/press/goddard/2014/november/nasa-computer-model-provides-a-new-portrait-of-carbon-dioxide/#.VGqQ1PTF-LG

Göran


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