# No gold at Fort Knox?



## travis86 (Oct 9, 2011)

Anyone see the latest episode of Brad Meltzer's Decoded on the History channel? They go on to investigating the rumor of Fort Knox being an empty gold reserve with it being heavily guarded so nobody knows the secret. It's interesting and you can watch it for free from the History channel website streaming.


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## Claudie (Oct 9, 2011)

Did you see or hear about all of the Gold that was in a vault under the twin towers of the world trade center?


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## micronationcreation (Oct 9, 2011)

Fort Knox decoded? What did they decode?

I am still none the wiser. :|


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## macfixer01 (Oct 9, 2011)

travis86 said:


> Anyone see the latest episode of Brad Meltzer's Decoded on the History channel? They go on to investigating the rumor of Fort Knox being an empty gold reserve with it being heavily guarded so nobody knows the secret. It's interesting and you can watch it for free from the History channel website streaming.




Yeah I've heard that theory too. A lot of the conspiracy nuts, also the occult and fringe science bunch seem to believe it. It's been said the soldiers there don't even carry real guns. How would we ever know? They've had a movement afoot to try to get the US government to conduct an audit, yeah good luck with that. Anyway how would we know whether we could trust the auditors?

macfixer01


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## travis86 (Oct 9, 2011)

What gold under the twin towers? And yes they might carry fake weapons considering they talk to a guy who was a guard at Fort Know in the 70's and he claimed that he and other carried guns with no ammo.


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## Geo (Oct 9, 2011)

wanna know the best way to keep a secret? (whispering) "dont tell any one about it". you can bet that if it was on tv its not much of a secret. besides, after Nixon took the US out the gold standard in 1971, the gold reserves at fort Knox became a moot subject. the united states maintains a gold supply for a number of reasons such as mintage and research and military consumption. to disclose any details about the reserves would be a national security risk. i understand its bought and paid for by the taxpayers but so is a $4,000 claw hammer or a $500 toilet seat. instead of worrying about what they are saving, id be more worried about what they are spending.


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## travis86 (Oct 9, 2011)

Well most of the gold originally was taken from the American people in the 1930's when they made it illegal for American citizens to own gold.


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## Claudie (Oct 9, 2011)

Gold has no monetary value, they only keep it because of tradition.


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## glondor (Oct 9, 2011)

Yeah, traditionally it has great and unshakable value.


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## Claudie (Oct 9, 2011)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Dj9v9s9buk

See it for yourself....


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## Geo (Oct 10, 2011)

check this one out. FDR gave an executive order (his first act as president) to have all gold coinage turned over to the IRS in 1933 and to reimburse people with US currency at $20.67 per ounce and gold stayed at that price for the next 97 years. http://www.forties.net . go to Memories : the great depression, go to the last link on the left. Gold recall in the U.S.A.


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## Harold_V (Oct 10, 2011)

Geo said:


> check this one out. FDR gave an executive order (his first act as president) to have all gold coinage turned over to the IRS in 1933 and to reimburse people with US currency at $20.67 per ounce and gold stayed at that price for the next 97 years.


Uhhhhh, no, it didn't. For one, it hasn't been 97 years since the gold reserve act was signed. Further, while gold was valued @ $20.67 per ounce when recalled, it was then revalued to $35/oz, effectively cutting the buying power of the dollar by almost 50% (although people saw it as gold going up in price, not the dollar going down in value). That price remained steady for quite some time, but eventually was raised at least twice--- until the US went off the gold standard. That's not to say that gold, as a commodity, didn't sell for more money. It did. However, nations demanded settlement of debt at the official valuation, which was clearly not a good thing for the US citizens, as their reserve gold was being traded off for less than full value. Going off the gold standard eliminated the chance that other nations could demand payment in gold, and if they did, it opened the door for trade at commodity value. 

Please correct me if I'm wrong. 

Harold


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## Geo (Oct 10, 2011)

i was citing a website that deals in monetary conspiracies. it gives two versions of the cause and effect of the great depression, one being historical record and the other consisting of unproven speculation. im not saying any of its true but it is interesting to read the theories, thats why i placed the link in my post. i just checked to make sure of what it said, "In this act of theft, the citizens of the United States of America were compensated at the "Official" price of $20.67 an ounce. That was the "Official" price of gold for 97 years. Following the confiscation, the dollar was devalued by 40% and the price of gold was revalued upwards to $35 an ounce". maybe he was saying the Official price was the price paid for the gold coins when they were found and confiscated regardless of what the actual price of gold was.


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## Harold_V (Oct 10, 2011)

Thanks for clearing that up for me! I couldn't understand how anyone could be so misguided as to think that gold was held @ $20.67. Now it makes sense. 

I'm typically less than impressed with conspiracy theories in just about everything. Seems the truth is not good enough, some clown with a vivid imagination must make things complicated, and, as in this case, absurd. 

Harold


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## travis86 (Oct 10, 2011)

Lol! That Ron Paul youtube link brings up a good point on why does banks hold gold and not diamonds.


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## Anonymous (Oct 10, 2011)

I do not subscribe to conspiracy theories.....that's my wifes job.However there is one question that continues to play in my head,and has for many years.Since the government knows that society as a whole is concerned about the gold(or lack thereof) in the Ft.Knox vaults,then why not prove it is in there....if it really is there.Ft.Knox is one of the safest places on planet earth.It's not like crazy uncle joe is going in there with a 12 gauge shotgun to rob them.


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## kuma (Oct 10, 2011)

Claudie said:


> Did you see or hear about all of the Gold that was in a vault under the twin towers of the world trade center?



Hi all , how are things ?
I hope all are well!!  
On reading Claudie's post I had a look on Google as I'd not heard mention of this before. Below is a link that I thought that I'd share to an interesting article on the subject.

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/01/nyregion/a-nation-challenged-the-vault-below-ground-zero-silver-and-gold.html?pagewanted=all

All the best and kind regards,
Chris


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## Geo (Oct 10, 2011)

the largest repository of gold in the US is the federal reserve bank in New York city 100 feet below street level only a couple of blocks from ground zero. it holds gold from private holdings to crown jewels from other countries, princes, sultans and monarchs keep their gold their. its public record its holdings are over a trillion dollars in metal. there 12 main federal reserve banks across the country, you can check the bank thats over the district you live in and see the amount in gold is in the public record for that bank.


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## RESET (Oct 10, 2011)

Isn't someone minting special collector coins that are clad in 9999 gold supposedly recovered from ground zero? I swear I have seen that infomercial several times when staying up way too late watching TV.


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## glondor (Oct 10, 2011)

travis86 said:


> Lol! That Ron Paul youtube link brings up a good point on why does banks hold gold and not diamonds.



In my opinion that was a stupid question on Ron Pauls part. Gold and diamonds are apples and oranges. 

There is way more involved in assessing the worth of any given diamond. 

Diamonds can be man made.

The diamond market is controlled by a single corporation. DeBeers.

Diamond values are artificially inflated.

The common man could not trade in diamonds for survival, as the value is open to question to the receiving party. 

Gold is Gold. In most cases its purity is stamped right on it. If not it is easy to determine. 

Gold can not be man made as far as I know.

The gold market is a bid/ask system

The market demands sets the gold price

Gold is a very easy trade good. It is what it is. That is why it really is money. 

Just my opinion. 8)


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## Geo (Oct 10, 2011)

i feel that currency is a trade commodity and should be held as such. what difference is there if you pay two dollars currency for a chicken or sell two dollars worth of gold and pay the same two dollars for the same chicken. cut out the middle man and pay for the chicken with gold. this sounds like bartering and the way the system is now thats exactly what it would be because gold cant be used for money.if the banks turned in paper currency until the amount was reached where the paper could be backed by PM's and not necessarily gold the value of the dollar would go back up, either that or inflation would have to go down but im betting it would be the dollar that would recover.


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## Claudie (Oct 10, 2011)

glondor said:


> travis86 said:
> 
> 
> > Lol! That Ron Paul youtube link brings up a good point on why does banks hold gold and not diamonds.
> ...




Paul was using diamonds as an example, he could just as easily have said oil, gas, corn, or any number of things. The point he was trying to make was, if Gold is not money, why do they keep it as a reserve.


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## travis86 (Oct 10, 2011)

Because gold is beautiful to look at?


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## Claudie (Oct 10, 2011)

He said it was because of tradition.


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## travis86 (Oct 10, 2011)

I know he said tradition im just saying its beautiful to look at. Theirs conspiracy's on everything. Did we land on the moon, 911 staged by the government, Fort Knox being empty, Lazer Steve having 11 toes etc.


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## Claudie (Oct 11, 2011)

Who told you about Lazer Steve having 11 toes?


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## Claudie (Oct 11, 2011)

I really don't think Ron Paul is a conspiracy theorist, I think he knows what is going on, but he just can't seem to stop it. Everyone knows there can't be enough Gold in this country to back every dollar they have printed. Not only do we have printed money, but we also have "online" money that doesn't really exist anywhere but online.


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## Geo (Oct 11, 2011)

i watched a documentary called "yes men save the world" and it was said that if china called in all debt owed by the US, it would take the entire GDP for twenty years to pay it all off. there isn't enough gold in circulation on the whole earth to cover the amount of paper money the US has printed in the last six years.


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## travis86 (Oct 11, 2011)

Thats crazy


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## TXWolfie (Oct 11, 2011)

1 question that comes to mind if the value of the dollar goes down because of inflation then it should theoretically go down because of over printing. For example when something becomes scarce the price of it goes up because of its rarity, and when there is a new found supply the price goes down. So if they would stop making paper money and settle all debts. And stop going to war with other countries over mindless reasons and unsubstantial thoughts and beliefs, I think this country would go back to being the super power it once was. The price of the dollar would drastically rise more then it ever was.

Rich


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## Claudie (Oct 11, 2011)

Right, like that's ever gonna happen....


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## TXWolfie (Oct 11, 2011)

Well I didnt say it would cause we all know it wouldnt.


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## patnor1011 (Oct 11, 2011)

Guys keep politics off this forum.


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## travis86 (Oct 11, 2011)

Nobody told me Lazer Steve had 11 toes. I was just using it as a example on how there theories on everything.


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## Claudie (Oct 11, 2011)

My apologies, I didn't even realize we were talking about politics.


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## TXWolfie (Oct 11, 2011)

Thats ok I didnt know there was a conspiracy against steve's 11th toe, and how it was on the grassy knoll.


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## Geo (Oct 11, 2011)

my eleventh toe is nowhere near my foot. :shock: should i be concerned?


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## TXWolfie (Oct 12, 2011)

Geo said:


> my eleventh toe is nowhere near my foot. :shock: should i be concerned?


Only if it wants eat at Red Lobster and orders the slipper crab


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## notch (Oct 12, 2011)

Look at the good side:

If there's no more Gold in Fort Knox, those who have it will be that much richer.


If you want a Chicken, pay in Turnips and keep your Gold.


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## Geo (Oct 12, 2011)

TXWolfie said:


> 1 question that comes to mind if the value of the dollar goes down because of inflation then it should theoretically go down because of over printing.
> 
> Rich


 this is absolutely the truth. creating money from thin air is what has weakened the dollar. the value of the dollar falls every time a bill is printed. US currency is backed by the assurance that the US will be able to repay debt, at first it was backed by metal (gold and silver), then it was backed by GDP (gross domestic product), now the Fed is using US buying power to back US currency. but this is like a huge pyramid scheme where you borrow money to pay off investors while taking a small percentage for yourself, if the pyramid is large enough a small percentage can be huge amounts. as the pyramid gets bigger you need to borrow more and more to pay off investors using new investors money. it finally reaches a point where the cash flow coming in can not support the debt of the initial investors so you have to default on investments. kind of like the US going into default with foreign countries, sound familiar?


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## travis86 (Oct 12, 2011)

I wonder if I'll ever see the usa debt free in my life time. Last I checked were in debt $14,867,602,941,980.31. The National Debt has continued to increase an average of
$3.97 billion per day since September 28, 2007


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## Geo (Oct 12, 2011)

this may not be a popular thing to make a comment about but the last time the US was run without a deficit was under the Clinton administration. people say Clinton was riding Reagans wave but if memory serves me right (big if) it wasnt until Clintons second term that the deficit hit zero. that was the same year Clinton forced the IRS to conduct the first (and only) audit of the entire branch of the IRS.

i will edit showing text to read "run without a deficit"


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## micronationcreation (Oct 12, 2011)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOLQoraeVOg&feature=player_detailpage :shock:


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## itmtrading123 (Nov 9, 2011)

glondor said:


> travis86 said:
> 
> 
> > Lol! That Ron Paul youtube link brings up a good point on why does banks hold gold and not diamonds.
> ...



Thanks i agree with you............


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## Dr. Poe (Nov 30, 2011)

In the army, I did my AIT training at fort Knox, Kentucky. One Friday night, coming back to the barracks slightly drunk, I walked too close, took a short cut, by the depository. A minute later I was surrounded by the MP's (4 jeeps-8 MP's) who scolded me severely. That was 1969. Oh, if you've ever seen films on De Beers or other South African diamond mines, you know that diamonds are not really as rare as one is led to think. It's the cartel that closely guards the mining and distribution
to keep prices up. They likely had a cow when the Canadian mine started up and charged less. The buying power of gold never really changes. When gold goes up, the value of paper money soon comes down. That's life.
Yes gold can be man made. It cost way too much to bombard an alloy of tin and lead with protons (I think thousands per gram)
It's probably radio-active and therefore worthless anyway.
Dr. Poe


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## philddreamer (Nov 30, 2011)

Dr. Poe, I read some time ago, that gold can be made by bombarding Pt, but the cost was also tooooo high. 

Phil


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## Harold_V (Dec 1, 2011)

Dr. Poe said:


> The buying power of gold never really changes. When gold goes up, the value of paper money soon comes down.


We're certainly in lock-step with that notion, although I have a different way of expressing my belief. The price of gold is directly reflected by the loss of buying power of the dollar. Hard to say which comes first----sort of a chicken and egg issue---but there's little doubt in my mind that, regardless of the order, it's true. 

I have long considered that the value of the dollar is inexplicably tied to the price of oil, too. I'm old enough to recall 25¢ gasoline, and the beginning of the end of cheap energy. It all began with the artificial oil crisis in the early 70's, as did the rapid decline in the purchasing power of the dollar. 



> That's life.


Sadly, yes, it is, but I don't have to like it! :lol: 

Harold


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## Dr. Poe (Dec 1, 2011)

In the King James version of the Christian Holy Bible is written; "I counsel of thee to buy of me, gold tried in the fire seven times that thou mayest be rich." I believe that He's inferring that people with our obsession may be the smartest people in the world, in the end times. Just my opinion. :roll: 
Dr. Poe


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## Harold_V (Dec 2, 2011)

Heh! I'll have to take your word for it, Doc. I'm as close to an atheist you can come and not have an open admission. Interestingly, it's my people (Greeks) that wrote the King James Bible, although I am not a follower. 

All said, to hold precious metals in a time of catastrophe can't hurt! I have tried to encourage readers to set aside the metal they recover----for their retirement years, if nothing else. 

Harold


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## TBarrow (Dec 2, 2011)

Harold_V said:


> The price of gold is directly reflected by the loss of buying power of the dollar. Hard to say which comes first----sort of a chicken and egg issue---but there's little doubt in my mind that, regardless of the order, it's true.



My vote is that gold price reacts to the perceived future value of the dollar (in terms of buying power). Seems like stock prices react first, then everyone bails out and buys gold. I guess it depends on the reason for the change in stock prices - i.e. whether reacting to inflationary news, or some other event.



Harold_V said:


> It all began with the artificial oil crisis in the early 70's, as did the rapid decline in the purchasing power of the dollar.



I consider today's oil price an artificially inflated price through restriction of domestic supply.


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## TBarrow (Dec 2, 2011)

Geo said:


> this may not be a popular thing to make a comment about but the last time the US was run without a deficit was under the Clinton administration. people say Clinton was riding Reagans wave but if memory serves me right (big if) it wasnt until Clintons second term that the deficit hit zero. that was the same year Clinton forced the IRS to conduct the first (and only) audit of the entire branch of the IRS.



Talk about opening a can of worms!...

(edited out my own politcal analysis) 
Todd


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## Geo (Dec 2, 2011)

Political views have been know to cause fights. :shock: :lol: I feel that the corruption in the two major parties is making it impossible for anyone to straighten it out. But, if you look at the financial climate today as apposed to four years ago, the jobless rate is down, gas prices is going down, the economy is on the upswing, and our troops are coming home which is all good signs for struggling families. Most of the animosity directed at Obama may not be bacause of his race but at some level the average white layman still cant trust him because of his race. If Obama loses his re-election bid and a republican replaces him I feel we will go right back down the path we were on to begin with before Obama came to office. Four more years of military spending and war with the entire world calling for american blood. How can one man make the whole world so mad? Take a good ol boy from texas with chip on his shoulder and a point to prove and give him the keys to the safe tell him he can declare war on anyone he wants to for any reason. I believe that after the first four years people were begining to see the kind of person he was but after 9/11 america would have re-elected daffy duck if he said "lets bomb Iraq". 

Ok, I'll stop ranting now. :lol:


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## TBarrow (Dec 3, 2011)

Geo said:


> Political views have been know to cause fights. :shock: :lol:


Exactly why I decided to edit out my expertly crafted political commentary (that was a joke). I prefer to think that I am writing in an unbiased way, but I always tend to tick somebody off! Sometimes it is better for me to just let it go.

Todd


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## macfixer01 (Dec 3, 2011)

Geo said:


> Political views have been know to cause fights. :shock: :lol: I feel that the corruption in the two major parties is making it impossible for anyone to straighten it out. But, if you look at the financial climate today as apposed to four years ago, the jobless rate is down, gas prices is going down, the economy is on the upswing, and our troops are coming home which is all good signs for struggling families. Most of the animosity directed at Obama may not be bacause of his race but at some level the average white layman still cant trust him because of his race. If Obama loses his re-election bid and a republican replaces him I feel we will go right back down the path we were on to begin with before Obama came to office. Four more years of military spending and war with the entire world calling for american blood. How can one man make the whole world so mad? Take a good ol boy from texas with chip on his shoulder and a point to prove and give him the keys to the safe tell him he can declare war on anyone he wants to for any reason. I believe that after the first four years people were begining to see the kind of person he was but after 9/11 america would have re-elected daffy duck if he said "lets bomb Iraq".
> 
> Ok, I'll stop ranting now. :lol:




Since this conversation has drifted into gas prices also, how about this? We have more oil reserves in just the Dakotas and Montana alone than all of the middle east (see the link). It's been known for years but little has been done to extract it and help stop our dependence on foreign oil. Too many in the oil industry and government have a vested interest in the status quo or are on the payroll of OPEC. If fact the middle east is likely funding a lot of the eco-fascist groups here in the US intent on preventing all US drilling and keeping us at the mercy of foreign oil. Makes you wonder if the current low oil prices aren't meant to dissuade the recent "gold rush" of oil development finally beginning in North Dakota?

http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1911

macfixer01


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## TBarrow (Dec 3, 2011)

macfixer01 said:


> Since this conversation has drifted into gas prices also, how about this? We have more oil reserves in just the Dakotas and Montana alone than all of the middle east (see the link). It's been known for years but little has been done to extract it and help stop our dependence on foreign oil. Too many in the oil industry and government have a vested interest in the status quo or are on the payroll of OPEC. If fact the middle east is likely funding a lot of the eco-fascist groups here in the US intent on preventing all US drilling and keeping us at the mercy of foreign oil. Makes you wonder if the current low oil prices aren't meant to dissuade the recent "gold rush" of oil development finally beginning in North Dakota?
> 
> http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1911
> 
> macfixer01



It does make you wonder...

Although it was my understanding that the oil industry has been pleading for access to these reserves for a while now (Alaska as well). Also, I think it is funny that today's oil prices are considered low! 

Thanks for the link.

Todd


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## kurt (Dec 3, 2011)

I like what my uncle has to say about politics --- “it doesn’t much matter which party a politician is affiliated with because when they are running for office they all promise that if you elect them there is nothing they wont do for you – then when they are elected, that’s just what they do --- nothing for you

Kurt


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## Harold_V (Dec 4, 2011)

TBarrow said:


> I think it is funny that today's oil prices are considered low!


Likely due to the buying power of the dollar. A recent report, when gold was running around $1,900/ounce, suggested that in order for the price, today, to be the equal of the $875 high back in '80, it would have to hit about $2,500. That speaks volumes about how little the dollar buys, today. So then, as much as it pains me to say so, yeah, the price of fuel, today, isn't all that bad, considering it reflects the loss of value of the dollar. 

Is that sad enough?  

Harold


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## TBarrow (Dec 4, 2011)

Harold_V said:


> A recent report, when gold was running around $1,900/ounce, suggested that in order for the price, today, to be the equal of the $875 high back in '80, it would have to hit about $2,500.



I guess inflation has a way of sneaking up on you!!


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## butcher (Dec 7, 2011)

I will not talk of my political veiw, because some may not agree with my veiws.
And I (da :twisted: mn) sure do not believe is some peoples veiw of politics.
our country and world is on a spiral downward because of these beliefs.


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