# Complete Silver Refining Process Video



## jake phelps (Aug 16, 2017)

How I get unprocessed silver containing American coins refined, smelted, poured and stamped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oY6Tax2Mnfc


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## Topher_osAUrus (Aug 16, 2017)

Just cementing on copper doesnt really make silver that pure.
Especially without multiple washing cycles. Sure, it raises the purity from 90% up quite a bit, but 98-99% is about the cap.

I dont think I would feel comfortable stamping any silver unless it went through a silver cell.
And even then, I would probably double check myself, by dissolving some of the crystals and making sure the silver nitrate is crystal clear.


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## jimdoc (Aug 16, 2017)

Your stamp means nothing. The coins were more easily identified in a trusted state, and currently sell at a premium before your little project.

Where are you doing this?


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## Topher_osAUrus (Aug 16, 2017)

Okay
So, I actually watched all (thats a lie,I couldnt make it through half of it) the video now that I had time.
And, I feel a few things *MUST* be said.

**_*DON'T refine in your home*_!!!
Don't use mason jars, (Im sure some will argue you can)
-they just dont take change in temperature well, so eventually one will break and you will have acid all over your house! (For 30 grams of coin silver, yeah, my wife would kill me!)

2ounces of nitric sounds like a pretty big excess
1.22mL/g HNO3(nitric) + 1.22mL distilled H2O per gram
-this does not dissipate the copper from the coinage, it dissolves it, oxidizing the copper and silver.
Its not a liquid pure silver concentrate, it is a solution of copper ions and silver ions
-pure silver nitrate is clear

You dont need to "hurry here" and add all your nitric at once, wise men add small additions and let it work all it will before adding more

Again, its not pure in the solution, its mixed ions, nor is it pure silver concentrate..

Your coffee filters arent doing a lot.. Maybe removing course stuff, but the fines are undoubtedly going through it, which in turn is contaminating your "pure silver" that much more.

You shouldn't start cementing until its crystal clear (from filtration or letting it settle and siphoning off)

Your silver cement, needs to be washed and washed and washed again. Until the rinses are clear (with your poor practices, Im hesitant to tell you how to qualitatively test for copper ions, as you are an explosion waiting to happen)

When you "cleaned this" (your dissolution vessel) and dumped it down the sink, you probably tossed some silver down the drain.. Killing the good bacteria in your water treatment plant, same when you rinse your filtrate vessel out..

You notice how when you added all that tap water, your solution gained more turbidity? That is silver chloride being formed. You cant straight melt that..

You need to have your coil fully submerged, but not on the bottom. Copper oxide will flake off and contaminate your "pure silver" even more

How are you treating your waste solutions?

....im not even going to finish the video, this post is already of biblical length.. And I doubt you came here to learn, probably just spam your video to show off.

There are plenty of poor videos out on youtube as is, you should watch a couple that ARE GOOD, like from aquillarefining or sreetips, before trying to show your mad refining skillz to the world of people who want instant/quick results and even quicker gratification.. (Ergo, they will blindly follow you, the blind) 
But first, you should stop hurting yourself and your house from the horrible fumes, and study the forum.. ...a lot...

This video should probably be removed to prevent people from getting hurt.


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## butcher (Aug 16, 2017)

Jake, 
I watched only the first few minutes of the video and turned it off, no disrespect Sir, but you have no clue of what your doing or the dangers involved. it is not worth my time to struggle through the rest of it. the terms used in your explanation were very confusing to me, as you were using terms that had nothing to do with what you were doing, or were completely different types of reactions...

Do not do this in your apartment or home.

If your using scientific terms, to try and explain something you are doing, you should at least understand what the words mean.

Those are the type of videos people watch and then come to the forum with nothing but misinformation, and who are poisoning themselves and others trying what someone on the internet claims they know how and attempt to teach it, then come here for us to deal with, or attempt to re-educate them, or that is giving our field of work a bad name, or worse could put all hobby refiners out of business....

Jake please put up the acid, before you harm yourself and your family, and learn to do it properly, you have a great opportunity here on the forum.

study the forum our new friend learn to do it right and safe.


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## rickbb (Aug 17, 2017)

Topher_osAUrus said:


> This video should probably be removed to prevent people from getting hurt.



I second that, I only made it 10 seconds into the video. This is the Bernstein Bears way of how NOT to do things.

Doing acid and metal reactions in what looks like a 1 bedroom apartment? In the bathroom sink? No gloves? No protection or fume controls at all? Really? 

Waste acid down the drain in an old building that has iron pipes? Your landlord is going to love you when your waste dumping eats through all the drain pipes and floods the whole building with sewer gases and worse. 

Not to mention what will happen to you when the EPA or your local water plant people are going to do when they find out you are dumping dissolved heavy metals into the waste water stream. And they will find out, after all you did just put the only evidence they need on the internet for the whole world to see, and report you.


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## jake phelps (Aug 17, 2017)

It DOES test darn near pure. No environment etc. was affected any more then when u start ur car in the am. Your right... no 1 should do this at home and theres a reason... not only is it dangerous if your not me but there is no way many could do it with the time and resources I didnt invest into it. (Not to mention It is my method) stop hating

[THREAD CLOSED]


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## jimdoc (Aug 17, 2017)

jake phelps said:


> It DOES test darn near pure. No environment etc. was affected any more then when u start ur car in the am. Your right... no 1 should do this at home and theres a reason... not only is it dangerous if your not me but there is no way many could do it with the time and resources I didnt invest into it. (Not to mention It is my method) stop hating
> 
> [THREAD CLOSED]



Wow.


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## jimdoc (Aug 17, 2017)

Why does Jake remind me of the guy who tested a bullet proof vest by having his girlfriend shoot him while he was wearing it? Youtube is so full of genius'.


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## galenrog (Aug 17, 2017)

It has nothing to do with hate, and everything to do with doing it correctly and safely. 

Sorry, Jake, but your video does not pass on either front.

If you want to learn how to do things safely and correctly, this is the place for you. Leave your ego at the login screen. It will waiting when you log out.


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## Topher_osAUrus (Aug 17, 2017)

jake phelps said:


> It DOES test darn near pure. No environment etc. was affected any more then when u start ur car in the am. Your right... no 1 should do this at home and theres a reason... not only is it dangerous if your not me but there is no way many could do it with the time and resources I didnt invest into it. (Not to mention It is my method) stop hating
> 
> [THREAD CLOSED]



Your method eh?
Pretty sure displacement reactions have been around for longer than the earth has been round..

And your other video, where you have to "hurry" because of the NO2 gasses formed.. You know what nitrocellulose is?
...you know how its made?

Your house is becoming a tinderbox soaked in accelerant.

Hating? No, far from it.. We here actually respect the science, those that dont, quickly find that she is a cruel unforgiving mistress. So that "hate" you think you are picking up, is more concern for your well being.

I would be willing to bet your "pure" silver is barely purer than the 90% you started with.
How are you testing it?
Are you just basing it off weight? Because with your practices, probably 10 grams is lost in the shuffle.

....I cant believe gsp hasnt replied to this sad silver recovery.


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## Topher_osAUrus (Aug 17, 2017)

jimdoc said:


> Why does Jake remind me of the guy who tested a bullet proof vest by having his girlfriend shoot him while he was wearing it? Youtube is so full of genius'.



Ah, the "hold my beer and watch this" scientific approach.
A classic.


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## 4metals (Aug 17, 2017)

> It DOES test darn near pure.


How many nines is "darn near"? Just curious.


> not only is it dangerous if your not me


Does this mean it isn't dangerous for you? Are you immune to the ill's that would befall anyone else using your process in the bathroom sink? 


> there is no way many could do it with the time and resources I didnt invest into it


So you're saying that if you put next to no money into the procedure, then the environmental and safety issues shouldn't be of any concern?


> (Not to mention It is my method)


This is true, it is your method because you chose to ignore a few minor details which would have improved your process. But Hey! it is your procedure!


> stop hating


If we were hating, we would have very little concern for your obvious lack of concern for your own safety or the impact your process has on your health and the environment. I think it is quite the opposite.


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## upcyclist (Aug 17, 2017)

I'm not sure if we'll see you here again, but if you do return, consider this: Safe practices will also make you more efficient. You'll use less acid, pay more attention to your procedures, etc.

You started out with about 30g of .900 silver coinage. That means you should have finished with 27g of silver. You ended up with about 20g, or a 26% loss. Don't you want to minimize those losses, for no other reason than to make more money? Then by all means, stick around and learn.


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## jimdoc (Aug 17, 2017)

upcyclist said:


> Then by all means, stick around and learn.



I don't think I could stand the presence of this Youtube genius here.
I can't believe I watched as much of his video as I did.
Do you really think he would last long here anyway?


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## upcyclist (Aug 17, 2017)

jimdoc said:


> upcyclist said:
> 
> 
> > Do you really think he would last long here anyway?


Not really--but it's worth a shot to attempt to save his girlfriend and neighbors from his mad science


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## jimdoc (Aug 17, 2017)

upcyclist said:


> jimdoc said:
> 
> 
> > upcyclist said:
> ...



And all the people on Youtube that stumble across his "tutorial".

He thinks we are jealous haters, and has probably already dismissed our comments.


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## jake phelps (Aug 17, 2017)

You started out with about 30g of .900 silver coinage. That means you should have finished with 27g of silver. You ended up with about 20g, or a 26% loss. Don't you want to minimize those losses, for no other reason than to make more money? Then by all means, stick around and learn.

yes! finally!... buggs the crap out of me! Thought was because... just the rag tag operation... trying to minimize that... by changing very little... if possible...


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## Topher_osAUrus (Aug 17, 2017)

jake phelps said:


> yes! finally!... buggs the crap out of me! Thought was because... just the rag tag operation... trying to minimize that... by changing very little... if possible...



A lot needs to be changed.

Your losses come from silver chloride during dilution.
Melting it causes volatization of more silver.

It also may not have all cemented out of solution on your "helix coil". I usually let mine cement a few hours, clean up that bit of silver. Then let the rest cement for a couple days. (the last part is what will have the pgms, if any)

Your flux you are using, if it has a nitrate in it, you could be oxidizing some silver and getting it caught in the slag as well.

You also dumped silver down the drain, there is some.


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## upcyclist (Aug 17, 2017)

jake phelps said:


> You started out with about 30g of .900 silver coinage. That means you should have finished with 27g of silver. You ended up with about 20g, or a 26% loss. Don't you want to minimize those losses, for no other reason than to make more money? Then by all means, stick around and learn.
> 
> yes! finally!... buggs the crap out of me! Thought was because... just the rag tag operation... trying to minimize that... by changing very little... if possible...


You have the basic reactions down for cementing on copper, but there are some tweaks you'll need to do. You also have some major safety issues to look at--like moving all of your operations out of your living space, with the exception of the stamping, which was ironically the only thing you did outdoors.

Some of your silver was also left behind in your filter paper and on your gloves--instead of trying to pick up globs of silver cement, you can just let the silver dry in the filter paper, then put it all in the crucible. The flux (all you need is a pinch of boric acid, really) will take care of the filter paper. Letting it dry also keeps some of the silver from flying off your crucible when you superheat the water that was there.

Edit to add: Alternately, after rinsing your cemented silver extremely well in the beaker and letting it settle ("rinse, repeat"), you could put it in a drying dish. Then from the dish to the crucible, never using any filter paper.


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## butcher (Aug 18, 2017)

Jake Phelps, 

Take down the videos, they are dangerous and most anyone besides a twelve year old with a science class dropout would know better than to watch it unless they were wanting entertainment of what not to do.

You have an excellent opportunity here as a new member of the forum to gain the education and understanding of precious metals, hidden from most men all through the history of recovery and refining of metals (especially the more valuable metals).

The crap everyone here is giving you is warranted, as what your doing now is extremely dangerous, to you and others, and your being defensive (I can understand) but it is only to try and wake you up, and actually help you.

Ego is a terrible thing it will put us in danger and then defend its own destruction of yourself (the ego poses to defend) let it go understand what an opportunity you have now, put away the acid for now realize you may not know it all, and take hold of an education that kings throughout history fought to have in their courts.

These guys and gals on the forum are great people willing to help you, but they also expect you to do your own homework (this is a vast field and no one person has all of the answers but together we make a team, there are several here that are scientist, professionals in the recovery and refining fields, miners, jewelers, (you name it). and some hobbyist that have spent years gaining a very good working knowledge many of whom may be able to teach the professionals new tricks.

You can gain the knowledge and understanding of not just some high school chemistry experiment of displacement reactions, you can actually become a working professional in the field, and do it safely...

Then your videos could be what they should have been or something you could actually be proud of and the forum could be proud of, not out of Ego, but because they would actually help others and you.

PUT up the ego and the chip on your shoulder and think it over. 
If you decide it is something you really wish to do, as this is something that takes a lot to learn not everyone has what it takes, thousands may try it much like you did but most will not put in, what it takes to get a real reward back, the few who do are rewarded with not only truly refined metals and something they love to do, but an education that kings killed to get.

Put up the acids,(store them safely outside of your home) note: acids and chemicals can become extremely dangerous if stored the wrong way, certain chemicals should never be stored together...

Begin reading the safety section, and dealing with waste (do not pour anything more down the drain or in the ground, these acids and toxic metals can leach to everyone's water supply no matter how deep your well, city's drink what the town above them flushes. many of these chemicals could give the water treatment plants problems or worse harm people.

Jake sorry to have to say this, but you do not know nothing yet, about metals or acids or recovery and refining, you are dumb a a stick in that area, but you may be smarter than I am in many other areas, so think about it maybe we can do what this forum is all about.

Helping each other.
Before we can learn to do it right we all have to see where we are doing it wrong otherwise we can not or will not advance.

GSP is a professional in refining silver and other metals, and when it comes to silver, reading his posts will knock your socks off with what you could learn from him, many many members here have things they can help you with that will blow your mind when it comes to the metals,

Do not let a stupid Ego knock you out of the treasure map of understanding, take care of yourself, and educate yourself. forget the fools gold, learn where the real gold is...

I think we all need to back off.
And let Jake think about it, give him a chance to see if it his ego, or what is right, that he wishes to listen to, and decide if he truly wishes to learn this skill.


Think about it Jake.


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## g_axelsson (Aug 18, 2017)

After watching that video through I can only call it cringe-worthy. A lot of details have been pointed out by other members already and I will not rehash those points. But I noticed a couple of points that no one have mentioned yet. Written not just for you, but for anyone else watching that video.

- By not using chlorine free water you convert a lot of silver into silver chloride, adding to the losses. Someone mentioned it when you diluted the nitrate solution but you also create silver chloride while dissolving the coins and that ends up with the other crap that didn't dissolve.
It also creates silver chloride with your cemented silver and that went to the melting dish. Silver chloride creates toxic fumes when melting and you did it in your bedroom? :shock: 

- The purity of the silver cement is not that great, when starting to melt the flame turns green. That is from copper still in the water when it boils.

- When shaking the copper coil the first time the silver floats to the surface... Why? Simple, there is still nitric acid that digests the silver that just cemented. So the cementation is giving off NOx gases in the same room you are sitting in.

- When filtering off the cemented silver it keeps bubbling, it still is dissolving slowly! Your filtrate is probably containing a lot of your silver.

The purity is probably better than 98% but not 999/1000. By cutting the cementation short when approximately 75% of the silver had cemented and having an excess of nitric still there you took out the first part of the cementation process which is more pure. The tail end of cementation is usually a lot more contaminated than the first part. This cost you a lot of silver.
Any refiner worth of the name could get almost all of the silver at a lot higher purity. It's all here on the forum.
You don't need to polish a pure silver bar.

Stick around and learn how to properly do this, who knows, you might like to learn some new tricks. But loose that attitude, it will get you banned in a whiff and then you have lost the huge amount of information that is here and the help available to anyone that sincerely wants it.

This thread is not closed unless a moderator says so.

Göran


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## Sharding757 (Mar 16, 2018)

Stumbled onto this thread while researching silver processes as "Complete silver refining process". I knew right when the lady held up the bottle of nitric to simply turn off the video. Been researching for quite some time now in the forum. Still having not done anything other than memory chips, but I could tell that safety was not at the forefront here in the video. This could spell disaster for someone that found the forum and lacked common sense just to find the link to this video and hurt themselves or others. Here this thread lies in wait for it's next "newbie" victim right in the Tutorial section where beginners look. May I suggest that the thread be relabeled, "how N O T to refine silver". Like I said, I'm still doing my own reading, learning and scavenging of materials to process prior to really going forward with anything other than "Gold fingers". So I still know very little, however even I find it odd (as a beginner) that it is still here. Just my 2 cents.


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