# Lab glassware suggestions?



## glorycloud (Jul 16, 2013)

I have done my fair share of processing and refining of escrap
and like many I never have invested in any decent glassware.
I went the thrift shop route and picked up glass coffee pots, 
crock pots, electric frying pan as a heat source and some big
glass cookie jars from Walmart. 

You get what you pay for in life as they say and I am tired of
having to deal with irregular lips and edges on the glass jars that
I use to drop the gold in or to make poor mans nitric in as it
is a hassle to get the dropped gold back out of the containers.
Same thing with using coffee pots to do the gold washes in.

For a small scale refiner, what type of lab glassware would some 
of you more experienced refiners recommend as a "starter set"?

I appreciate all the suggestions and pictures are always appreciated!! 8)


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## solar_plasma (Jul 16, 2013)

> I appreciate all the suggestions and pictures are always appreciated!!



I have to think twice, what to say, since I just was criticized by a member, that I "seem to be" a fool, who talks because he has to say something. But since you appreciate all suggestions, you just invited the devil.

So, from 17 years of being chem teacher and a short time refining (so, I am not a experienced refiner, but I am experienced using labware), I like to tell you, what I would choose as the first lab ware.

Big beakers (double or trice as big, as your typical fluid volume)
round bottom flasks (I like them, because it is easy to wash powders out of them)

Choose the best quality, it is more hard-wearing against thermal shocks.

funnels (glas, not too small, better too large)
maybe a buchner funnel (saves much time)
a lot of cheap buckets (I like them white and with some kind of spout (I hope spout is the right word) but I guess you have lots of them, when I look at, how long you already are on board

the best form of beakers and flasks depends sometime of, if you want gasses to get off,or if they have to stay in the solution, - but it does seldomly a real difference

all of them can be purchased at for example amazon, - look also at lazersteve's shop


> http://goldrecovery.us/pricing.asp



...hope this was not too much blablaa and hopefully some useful informations


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## niteliteone (Jul 16, 2013)

Glorycloud,
Solar_plasma has given good recommendations here. I will add my preferences that I have learned since I started refining.
A simple beaker set for general reactions and washing would be something like this;
http://www.sciencecompany.com/PYREX-Glass-Beaker-Set-400mL-600mL-1000mL-P16820C645.aspx
Along with a couple of 2000ml beakers should work well for most of what we do here

Also I usually run my fumes through a scrubber set-up using Erlenmeyer and filtering flasks connected in series to trap the fumes and divert them through a simple neutralizing solution. These can easily be bought on ebay as well.
Pic of pdf file as I don’t know how to link it to this post.


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## chlaurite (Jul 16, 2013)

Seconding a Buchner funnel. Single most useful item in your whole kit. It will _not only_ save you *hours* waiting for drip... drip... drip... But you can use a _much_ finer grade of filter paper (like 2.5 micron - Do a liter or two through _that_ solely with gravity, and you might as well just have kids and wait for them to grow up and process your gold _for_ you :wink: ). And I'd suggest going with an all-plastic faucet (or hose) aspirator pump for that - You can only get a vacuum down to 2.3kPa or so (the partial pressure of water at 20C), but it _very_ efficiently scrubs the resulting fumes and has no sensitive metal parts to corrode.

I might also suggest a separatory funnel. Nothing we do really requires them for their primary purpose (separating out one layer of a polar/nonpolar solvent system), but they also work great for removing any quickly-settling (but not too clumpy) sediment with a minimum of the liquid coming along for the ride.

I'd disagree with Solar_Plasma on one point though - I'd say go for quantity over quality on your standard beakers, and just *ALWAYS* use a secondary containment vessel (aka a plastic - PP or HDPE - bucket slightly bigger than your beaker), which for what we play with, you really should do anyway even with the highest quality glassware. As long as you take care with heating (always use a sand/water bath), realistically you'll lose more of them to either unremoveable crud buildup or accidentally tapping them against the sink while cleaning, than you will from any natural failure of their structural integrity. For specialized glassware, yes, go for broke (no pun intended), but beakers, Erlenmeyers, volumetrics, even graduated cylinders, you'll lose more to clumsiness than quality. Well, *I* do, anyway. 

Other than that, a lot of what we do works best and safest in plain-and-simple ol' plastic utility (aka "laundry-detergent") buckets. Don't sell those short! Pretty much invulnerable to acids, bases, impact, temperature, they come with a sturdy air-tight lid (yet one that will pop off under pressure before the whole thing blows up)... You'll go through a hundred 1L beakers before you wear out a single 5 gallon HDPE bucket.

Oh, and good vented splash-proof safety goggles. We all know goggles count as an absolute must, but an extra $20 on a good pair will mean the difference between hating them (and taking more risks without wearing them!) vs not even noticing you have them on.


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## glorycloud (Jul 17, 2013)

All good info. Thanks!


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## rickbb (Jul 17, 2013)

Don't forget the glass stirring rods, never thought I'd use them that much when I ordered them. But now I don't how I got by without them.

Get all sizes of beakers, never seem to have enough. I'd like to get more flasks as well they are very handy.

For the Buchner funnel get a vacuum pump at an auto supply store, the ones techs use to bleed brake systems are way better than what is avaiable in lab supply houses for some reason.


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## Harold_V (Jul 18, 2013)

For typical processing, I used Griffin beakers, always made of borosilicate glass. I chose them because they are easy to clean, can be easily covered with a watch glass, and were not too expensive to use, especially considering I refined for profit. I used the same vessel for washing my gold as was used for precipitation*, so it had to be heat tolerant. They are available in a myriad of sizes, from way too small to up to 4,000 ml. I kept on hand several of each size, starting with the 250 ml and ending with the 4,000 ml. 

Watch glasses to fit each size are necessary. Glass stirring rods are necessary. 

For precipitation, I used beakers that have seen no service, or have been used exclusively for precipitation. The vessel chosen for precipitation should be scratch free, to avoid gold adhering doggedly to the container. 

For re-refining, where I typically had about 18 ounces of gold per vessel, I also used 6" diameter glass cylinders. They are not capable of being heated, but function very well when precipitating with SO2, as they are small in diameter and deep, allowing ample time for the SO2 to be absorbed by the solution. *The gold from these cylinders was transferred to a 4,000 ml beaker to be washed. I washed two lots at one time that way. Because the gold had been previously refined, there was little in the way of contamination removed, so the volume appeared to not be a problem. 

A porcelain spoon is nice to have, as are plastic policemen, assuming they are still available. I used them to scrape gold from the sides of the vessels after precipitation. Their use prevents scratching. A couple acid dippers are always handy. I had them in two sizes. 

I used Erlenmeyer flasks ONLY for filtration with Buchner funnels. I did not like using any vessel that presented problems with cleaning, or handling, such as round bottom flasks. YMMV (your mileage may vary), of course. 

Glass graduates are very nice---but there is a graduate made of acid resisting plastic that most likely would be a better choice. I had several, both glass and plastic, along with a few graduated cylinders, for precise measurements of small volumes. 

Doing any titration? Burrettes are required, along with a stand. 

Harold


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## glorycloud (Jul 18, 2013)

Great information - greatly appreciated I am certain by more that just me. 8)


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## Harold_V (Jul 19, 2013)

One more tip---this one worth it's weight in gold.

Do NOT use common cleanser to clean your glassware. To my knowledge, there's only one that will serve without doing damage to the surface of your expensive labware, and it's *Bon Ami*. 

I used it exclusively, for all the years I refined.

Harold

NO----I do not have stock, or any other interest in Bon Ami----I just respect it's qualities.


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## Palladium (Jul 19, 2013)

I have found that the assortment that works best for me is 2 -4000ml Griffin beakers, 4 -2000ml Griffins, and i couldn't tell you how many 1,000ml beakers. I also have a smaller assortment of beakers from 20ml up to 1,000ml i use for measuring, testing, or running sample lots. I have no flask except for my buchner and really can't think of any reason i would use them in production. The only other flask i have is for catching scrubber juice before the vacuum pump. Now remember for each person and according to the type of processing you do it will vary as far as feed stock and type of glassware you need for that feed stock. Gold filled refining requires more volume in ml per batch than karat refining does. My work horse is the 4,000ml beakers for the first digestion and then i transfer that to the 2,000ml beakers for precipitation because on the first run you solution will be voluminous. After the first precipitation in the 2,000ml beakers the materials are then redissolved in the 2,000ml beakers and then transferred to the 1,000ml beakers for the 2nd precipitation because the volume is smaller on the 2nd run. They are then precipitated out on the 2nd run in the 1,000ml beakers where they are wash, cleaned, and dried. The reason i do this is because i run separate lots and must have accountability for the customers gold. If you don't have to have individual accountability for your lots then you can use larger beakers for larger lots. By doing it this way i can run multiple lots in sequence without ever delaying or backing up production. Basically an assembly line for gold refining. A good buchner funnel and a vacuum pump to me are a must. Not that gravity filtration doesn't work, but i need production and i'm to lazy to wait on gravity. :mrgreen:


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## niteliteone (Jul 19, 2013)

Harold_V said:


> One more tip---this one worth it's weight in gold.
> 
> Do NOT use common cleanser to clean your glassware. To my knowledge, there's only one that will serve without doing damage to the surface of your expensive labware, and it's *Bon Ami*.
> 
> ...



Which flavor of Bon Ami do you use ???
I was shopping online and found at least 3 flavors and one even listed Feldspar. 
Isn't that a grit that can scratch glass???


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## Palladium (Jul 19, 2013)

niteliteone said:


> Harold_V said:
> 
> 
> > One more tip---this one worth it's weight in gold.
> ...



When i sell my teaching skills as a consultant one of the things i include in their kits is Bon Ami. I was shopping at Wal-Mart last year and just happened to look over and there it was on the shelf. I think it was like a $1 a can or something, i can't remember, but it wasn't much. I bought a whole case of like 24 cans.


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## Harold_V (Jul 19, 2013)

niteliteone said:


> Which flavor of Bon Ami do you use ???
> I was shopping online and found at least 3 flavors and one even listed Feldspar.
> Isn't that a grit that can scratch glass???



I wasn't aware of any other products. However, the one I used is the powder cleanser, and, yes, it contains limestone and feldspar. My experiences indicated to my satisfaction that glass is not scratched. If you have any doubts, do a test before applying to a costly beaker. 

Note that on the container their logo is a chic and a half eggshell, with the words "Hasn't scratched yet".

Harold


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## Harold_V (Jul 19, 2013)

Palladium said:


> i run separate lots and must have accountability for the customers gold.


While that sounds like breaking all the rules, that's exactly the business model I had, which served me perfectly well for the entire duration of my refining years. It was particularly valuable for the customer with little gold, who, to me, was just as important as those with more. You never know when the little guy grows---and his memory of not receiving fair treatment will be long remembered. 

Harold


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## Palladium (Jul 19, 2013)

Where do you think i learned it. :mrgreen:


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## glorycloud (Jul 19, 2013)

Again, great counsel - thanks!


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