# how can I make gold chloride from colloidal gold



## 13ishmael (Sep 18, 2016)

How can I make gold chloride from colloidal gold. I know colloidal gold is really small but is it possible to increase the size of colloidal gold without continuing to increase the solution with gold aggregation


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## Platdigger (Sep 18, 2016)

Have you tried to boil it?


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## goldsilverpro (Sep 18, 2016)

Add a little HCl and a little H2O2 or bleach?


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## Geo (Sep 19, 2016)

Normally, we get questions about how to get a colloid of gold from auric chloride. Colloidal gold is supposed to have some kind of medicinal properties. I can't imagine how it could enter the system. I think you would just have really rich poop.


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## 4metals (Sep 19, 2016)

> I think you would just have really rich poop.



Maybe we can start a thread in "types of PM scrap"!


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## Lino1406 (Sep 19, 2016)

I agree with Geo, we always do the opposite. So maybe it's a matter of language or, If we would know the motive, we may help in other way


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## 13ishmael (Sep 19, 2016)

I have a colloidal gold solution and i am trying to increase its size so that I may get some metallic precipitate from it. As far as I know the only way to do so is to increase the concentration of gold in the solution. I was wondering if anybody had another idea. 
Sorry if I did not word the question correctly thank you


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## Topher_osAUrus (Sep 19, 2016)

Butcher has a few good posts on reclaiming gold that is in a colloidal state.

Gsp suggested adding more oxidizer. Which would dissolve the colloidal gold, then it would need to be precipitated with conventional means.

It may be possible to break the colloid, if you add sulfuric and heat.
Or, you could evaporate to a crust, then redissolve again in AR.

Butcher has good posts, as he was very studious with colloids when the "great dr poe" was here, and blabbering on about colloidal gold and other mumbo jumbo.
http://goldrefiningforum.com/~goldrefi/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=20840
http://goldrefiningforum.com/~goldrefi/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=12496

There are a couple good ones, but not the one I was looking for. I will update after i find it.
Hope this helps
Toph


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## Geo (Sep 19, 2016)

To break the colloid is not too complicated. I add sulfuric acid to my solutions and give it a boil. I don't have amounts or any literature to cite other than Poe and I don't even like mentioning his name. Just add some sulfuric acid to the colloid and cover and boil for a hour. Let the solution cool completely and everything should settle. Either that or evaporate the solution very low to increase the metal content of the solution and do as GSP suggested and add some HCl and a little bleach to dissolve the colloid and then precipitate.


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## 13ishmael (Sep 19, 2016)

So how big will the gold metal big once it is precipitated


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## upcyclist (Sep 19, 2016)

It'll still likely be a fine brown powder. Depending on what made it colloidal, a refine wouldn't be a bad idea. Taking GSP's route gets you on that path, converting and dissolving in one step. If you want to add other gold to it first before refining, then Geo's sulfuric method would work for you. 

Choosing your method often depends on what else you plan do with it next!


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## 13ishmael (Sep 20, 2016)

Will I be able to see the precipitate of the colloidal gold with the naked eye or not?

I made colloidal gold with a gold wire. I used the turkevich method


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## Geo (Sep 20, 2016)

You should be able to see the precipitated gold. It will be a dark powder if it is impure and will be lighter tan the more pure it is. Gold is very heavy and it doesn't take a lot to be seen. A gram of precipitated gold will be hard to see in 500ml of solution until it settles completely but a gram of gold in 100ml of solution is much easier to see so it is subjective to volumes of gold to volumes of solution. Even a small amount of precipitated gold can be seen in a large amount of solution after it settles to the bottom of the container completely.


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## 13ishmael (Sep 20, 2016)

Thanks geo I appreciate it. 
So now I have a 16oz colloidal gold solution. Can you detail in steps what should I do to precipitate at least 2 grams.


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## FrugalRefiner (Sep 20, 2016)

13ishmael said:


> Thanks geo I appreciate it.
> So now I have a 16oz colloidal gold solution. Can you detail in steps what should I do to precipitate at least 2 grams.


You can only precipitate 2 grams if there are 2 grams in solution. I think it is unlikely you have 2 grams of colloidal gold in 16 oz. of solution. Why do you think you have 2 grams of gold in your solution? If you created this solution, did you dissolve 2 grams of gold into it?

Dave


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## 13ishmael (Sep 20, 2016)

FrugalRefiner said:


> 13ishmael said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks geo I appreciate it.
> ...



Yes it is unlikely that I have 2 grams of gold in this colloidal solution, but in this colloidal solution that is 16oz and 50ppm, is there a way in which I can get 2 grams. Something that could aggregate the size without increasing gold concentration, but rather increasing what you have


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## anachronism (Sep 20, 2016)

I'm confused here and maybe it's a language thing however are you asking how to get more gold out of the solution than you put in?


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## upcyclist (Sep 20, 2016)

Doing some rough math (and I may be doing it wrong): 

16 fl. oz = 473mL. 
473mL @ 50PPM = 0.0237mL of gold
0.0237mL gold @ 19.3g/mL = *0.456g gold*


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## Geo (Sep 20, 2016)

13ishmael, you are encroaching on the realm of alchemy. It is not discussed here with any seriousness. You can only get out what you put in. What ever amount of gold is in the colloid is all you can get out. You can not make something from nothing.


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## goldsilverpro (Sep 20, 2016)

13ishmael

I think upcyclist took the math a little too far and performed a little mathematical alchemy on his own. There are only: 
.473 liters X .050 g/liter = .0237g of gold and that's all there ever will be, assuming you're lucky and the manufacturer actually put 50ppm in there.

So, you want to increase the gold 100 fold with some sort of magic? No one in the history of the world has ever been successful in doing something like this, no matter what the alchemy sites tell you. No one has ever been able to convert lead or copper to gold. No one has ever gotten gold out of magic water that showed zero gold when analyzed. There is no free lunch in the real world.

If you want to accept every thing I just said and learn about the real science of real gold recovery, you are welcome to stay. If you decide you're interested in alchemy and want to pursue it on this forum, we don't want you around.


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## 13ishmael (Sep 20, 2016)

:lol:  
Guys I do not wish to delve into alchemy. I found the answer I was looking for. 
You guys are the best. Thanks for all of your help. I really do appreciate it.


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## Marcel (Sep 24, 2016)

If you reduce the amount of water, colloidal gold should form bigger molecules. So either boil it down or better destill it, so you wont loose so much in the process. The suggested methods (adding sulphuric acid and boil) may result in the same effect but I dont think you need the sulphuric acid if the collidale solution is free of base metals and/or their salts.

Btw: Adding gold chloride to the collidale solution and stirring it should also work. The mechanism is to increase the concentration of the particles so they adhere to each other.


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## goldsilverpro (Sep 24, 2016)

13ishmael said:


> So how big will the gold metal big once it is precipitated


50ppm = .05g/liter pure Au. You have .473 liters. Therefore, you have .05 X .473 = 0.0237g Au

For that quantity, I figured that a gold BB of that weight would have a diameter of about 1/20". or .052" or .133cm. If it was much smaller, it would be hard to pick it up between thumb and forefinger without losing it.

V(sphere) = (4/3) X pi X r3
Eq#1 = r3 = (3 X V)/(4 X pi)

V of .0237g Au = .0237/19.32 = .00123cm3

Therefore, from Eq#1 above: r3 = (3 X V)/(4 X pi) = (3 X .00123)/(4 X pi) = .000294cm3
Therefore, from my calculator: the cube root of .000294 = r = .0665cm
Therefore, the diameter = 2r = .0665 X 2 = .133cm = .133/2.54 = .052" = about 1/20"

All the math assumes that the solution actually does contain 50ppm of gold, which, I feel, is somewhat doubtful.


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