# Seller scams on ebay?



## im1badpup1 (Jan 2, 2018)

Hi ive noticed recently i seem to be getting a lot of second highest bid items. That is ive not won the item. The winning bidder hasnt paid and its then been offered to me at the top price ive bid before been outbid on.
Had this happen half a dozen times in 3 weeks.
I suggest if it happens to you refuse and say youll take the lowest bid you offered before been hiked up by the non payer (usually a new ebayer who then deletes account) you can look at the bid history to know whose bids how much n when.
I think the sellers jacking his prices up bidding on fake accounts knowing roughly where to draw the line.
I havnt had this happen in all the years ebays been running till recently, and every ones been in that small grey area of its close to the actual value of the item where if the seller had to buy his own item back hed lose out on a re auction.
Im seeing more of this profiteering with the postage as well eg buying multiple items to be told they dont combine postage to a point im asking before every purchase about combining postage for multiple items and every single ones answering yesss no problem. But if i buy first without asking its a problem to almost all of them.
At least what people are advertising is correct for what im actually receiving so far lol


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## silversaddle1 (Jan 2, 2018)

On Ebay, if you are selling stuff by auction, you can send "second chance" offers to buyers if you have more than 1 of the same item. I have made this offer a few times myself and have also bought some items this way. If the offers are coming directly from ebay, it's not a scam, just a chance for you to get something you bid on. Look at it this way, if you won the auction for the highest amount you bid, why wouldn't you then go ahead and take advantage of the second chance offer? You are getting the same thing for the amount you were willing to pay. Make sure if you do take the offer, you go thru ebay to do it

From EBAY:.

If you're not able to complete the sale with the winning bidder of an auction, or if you have duplicate items for sale, you can send a Second Chance Offer to anyone who bid on your listing (except for the winning bidder). If you have more than one duplicate item for sale, you can send more than one Second Chance Offer.

When you send a Second Chance Offer, you give the bidder the chance to buy the item at a Buy It Now price equal to their last bid amount. It's up to the buyer to decide whether to accept the offer.

When to use a Second Chance Offer
In general, you can make a Second Chance Offer if your listing meets these criteria:

The listing is in auction-style format.

At least one of your non-winning bidders accepts Second Chance Offers.

Any of these situations apply:

You only have one item to sell and the reserve price (if applicable) was not met.

You only have one item to sell and the winning bidder did not pay. (You must cancel the original transaction before starting the Second Chance Offer process.)

You have additional duplicate items to sell. (You must cancel all transactions that you will not be able to honor before starting the Second Chance Offer process.)


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## glorycloud (Jan 2, 2018)

If I read the OP's post correctly, it sounds like shill bidding to me and probably not second chance offers. 8)


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## im1badpup1 (Jan 3, 2018)

Yes thats what it appears to be, shill bidding. It doesnt help genuine sellers cos folks will do like me, back off from how high theyre willing to bid.
The way i see it to avoid it is bid lower, if someone else wins good luck theyd probably have won anyway and shill bidders are welcome to buy their own lot back n lose out.

Ive had the 2nd chance items from the seller having duplicates before. But never because the winning bidder hasnt paid as long as i can remember. But suddenly has happened about 6 times in my last 50 purchases. In fact most my purchases are buy it now so for actual auctions its been a sudden frequent event. I didnt think much about it until One seller messaged me saying it was a new account had bidded won then deleted themselves without paying n i started to wonder about the others. It might even be somebody been vindictive towards certain sellers or targeting specific category of sales. I went n looked earlier and can see a few auctions id watched but not bidded in others have won but the auctions are relisted now as if the winning bidders not paid up.

Ive never been a seller so have no idea how frequent non payment for winning bids is, does ebay have trolls bidding n winning every auction for a laugh periodically or a seller entire listings be targeted?

At the end of the day only i can make myself pay too much for something so i cant complain about that, but im curious about whats going on.


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## anachronism (Jan 3, 2018)

Another way to look at it is that if you're getting the product at the price you were happy to bid and pay then is there really a problem ?


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## im1badpup1 (Jan 3, 2018)

No its not a problem it works better for me by several % been aware this may be happening and bid accordingly. Theyre losing out as i now know their profit margins theyre working too.


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## shmandi (Jan 3, 2018)

Things like this happen often. Seller has another account or some friend is bidding for him. 
On the other hand I get very often winner not paying and after unpaid case close, I used to offer to next higher bidder. After few times no response on second chance offer I stopped doing that and I just relist item.


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## snoman701 (Jan 3, 2018)

Ebay takes a lot of work to shill anymore.

Used to be, Dad could place a reserve bid on something for me, or vice versa. I list almost everything auction style, and suggesting that the occasional non-performing item getting a last minute reserve bid is somehow "wrong" is just silly to me. There were however a lot of sellers that the shills were beyond obvious...and they'd go back and forth. 

Then, in about 2008 I think, Dad listed a bunch of steam engines via consignment for a friend of theirs. I wanted some of it, but it was pretty obscure stuff, and difficult to assign value...so rather than the sellers son buying it short of public auction, I just said list it and i'll bid. So, waiting until the last minute, as you are supposed to, I clicked bid, and eBay said something to the effect of you are within "six degrees of separation to the seller" and I wasn't allowed to bid. 

The end of the easy shill. 

Second chance offers were a big phishing scam for a long time. This is back when you could tell who was bidding. I miss being able to look at the competing bidders. But these scams really put a hurt on second chance offers. When they first came out, I had a product I was manufacturing and listing. I'd list auction style, then let the sellers go at it...then decide what it was worth for me to manufacture the item. It wasn't uncommon to sell 10 items from one listing. Then the scams came along and suddenly people became wary. 

Now it's all a mystery. Nobody knows who's behind the curtain pulling the strings and placing the bids. But I really highly doubt there's much scamming going on. Plus...it's as it was said, if you don't want it for that price, stop bidding.


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## im1badpup1 (Jan 3, 2018)

Do you get messed around much as a seller with buy it now prices selling vintage rare obselete pcb parts and similar, the kind of stuff we get when buying gold recovery items? Im sorting through stuff like data converters proms eproms 68000l ceramic gold caps, some older white gold cap ceramic chips all still functional worth 50x gold content, even more. Was going to list it on ebay for fixed prices. Sign and picture the pieces i sell so they cant swop pieces n claim a refund unless my piece has broken, eg during transit.

Them bits are more than paying for everything else when they sell


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## g_axelsson (Jan 3, 2018)

I've sold quite a lot of CPU:s a year or two ago and I had a problem with a couple of sales. I don't have exact numbers, but maybe around 1-2% of uninsured packages got lost and the buyer used the paypal money back guarantee even though I gave them the choice of paying more for an insured package but few ever did. On more expensive packages (>$50) I always sent with tracking and never had a problem, not even with Italy.

When selling a lot the losses can be seen as an additional cost of doing business and it is manageable. The big problem is when you just sell a few object and have bad luck, that can really hurt.

My biggest loss was actually when someone was bidding up an object and never went through with the buy. It never sold at the same price again. Maybe people thought it was I who was shill bidding and avoided the auction the second time.It was rarely the runner up that won the second time around.

Göran


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## snoman701 (Jan 4, 2018)

g_axelsson said:


> My biggest loss was actually when someone was bidding up an object and never went through with the buy. It never sold at the same price again. Maybe people thought it was I who was shill bidding and avoided the auction the second time.It was rarely the runner up that won the second time around.
> 
> Göran



I learned that one the hard way. Always wait a month before selling again.


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## silversaddle1 (Jan 4, 2018)

I sell quite a bit of CPU's and RAM on E-Bay. I always use the Buy It Now option and allow offers. Most are sold as-is, used, no returns. I have only had one buyer try to return some RAM. In his first e-mail he said it was the wrong stuff for his computer and wanted a refund. Sorry, no returns. So then he filed a claim with EBAY saying the items were damaged when he got them. I called Ebay and explained what was up, they looked up his e-mail to me, then they cancelled his claim and banned him for attempted fraud. Other than that, smooth sailing! Ebay can really be a good thing.


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## snoman701 (Jan 4, 2018)

I miss back in the day when it was wide open. You could search completed auctions to determine who was bidding and lost, then solicit them to bid on your (identical) item. 

Ebay called it inappropriate use of messaging system and solicitation, I called it targetting your customer group.

For some obscure items, it can make the difference between a $10 sale and a $1000 sale. Always have to have at least two people that want it!


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## jimdoc (Jan 4, 2018)

Ebay looks out for Ebay..............anything else doesn't really matter to them (even common sense).


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## im1badpup1 (Jan 7, 2018)

Thanks for the replies. Theres many interesting and valid points been made.
I was a bit erroneous saying ppl bidding up their own items is a scam to be fair. It just looked weird and made me wonder what was going on. Im one of them people where soon as something looks out of place i think somethings up, eg im about to be ripped off by paying for something and perhaps not receive it.

Im starting to sell on ebay so peoples experience n advice given worth its weight in gold, literally. Il keep postage as signed for delivery and a no returns policy unless prebuying arrangement or agreement of the sale is in place. It seems to be the best hassle free option from what you guys are saying


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## flyfisherman (Jan 8, 2018)

OP said something about profiteering on multiple packages postage. To me it does not make sence. Just how do dishonest seller could make extra money on this scheme? If he/she do combined shipping, when there is no problem. If refuse and ship in multiple packages, when buyer will get few packages instead of one. But if for example seller recieve money for multiple packeges shipping and send just one - this is a big no no, all buyer need to do is make the call to eBay and seller will be in big trouble.


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## jimdoc (Jan 8, 2018)

Ebay now takes a cut of the shipping, so I don't think they care about making more money.
I don't know how Ebay taking a percentage from the shipping price is even legal, or tolerated.


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## snoman701 (Jan 8, 2018)

It's tolerated because they can get away with it, and it's legal because they write it up in the rules.

It was put in place because so many import sellers were selling something for a penny, then charging 25 bucks to ship something that fit in a flat rate box. 

Not that it's much different now. I can still order electronics parts directly from China for less than I can order it from a US distributor, with shipping.


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## user 12009 (Feb 4, 2018)

> Not that it's much different now. I can still order electronics parts directly from China for less than I can order it from a US distributor, with shipping.



With China, I am sure the government is giving shipping discounts or some form of kickback. There are so many auctions that end very low. The sellers must make money somehow or they would stop.

I just did a search: 
all things starting with letter A
sold items
cost between .01¢ and .10¢
free shipping

This is how many hits I got buying world wide 18,479 and then I added North America only and got 1336 hits.

But then I dug deeper (I usually only want to buy from Americans) In those 1336 there was one item that was listed 19 times and sold between one cent and six cents with free shipping. I looked to see the seller. Yep, he was in Marina Del Rey, CA I know the area, pretty rich area to live in and loose money on all auctions. Then I looked at the auction description, everything ships from Hong Kong. So some Chinese company got a U.S, address and gets around the World Wide mix. When I hunt for things I always try to use Item Location North America. 

OK, rant over.


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## scrappappy (Feb 16, 2018)

I've been with ebay for a long time as both a buyer and a seller and the majority of the scams I've dealt with were when I've been a seller.

I've had buyers claim that something isn't as described and then they return a totally different item that is all beat up and usually not even authentic. I've even sent ebay the before and after photos, showing the item that was returned isn't even close to what was sent out. Each time they've said they can't confirm what was sent to the buyer because they were never in possession of the item. Case closed and buyer gets a free trade up for their old junk. Scammers have really taken advantage of the buyer protection rules because ebay would much rather have a buyer than a seller when it really comes down to it. It really is ruining ebay from a seller perspective, because they always side with the buyer regardless of the circumstances and the scammers know it and seem to be growing by the day. I know a guy that even opened his own local auction house and left a huge clientele on ebay because they never side with the sellers, ever.

Rant over.


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