# DIMETHYLGLIOXIME AS PALLADIUM PRECIPITANT



## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

Next days will arrive my order , for the first time I order DIMETHYLGLIOXIME just 100 grams because is expensive.
I try to find answers to my question on internet and I don't find nothing.
My question is how much DMG is needed to drop palladium ,for example to drop 10 gr of palladium from a solution how much grams DMG dissolved in water is needed?
I ask this question because DMG is expensive is not cheap like SMB(always when I drop gold I use excces) and I do not want to waste my DMG and the question is simple and quick for 10 gr of palladium how much grams of DMG dissolved is needed.


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

anyone?


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

I can not find this information on browser


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 18, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I can not find this information on browser


Patience, there are people from all timezones, most do have things to do and as such are on the forum limited time per day.

To your question, I really can not remember, but it have been answered many times in the forum.
So try to search.


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## Lino1406 (Oct 18, 2022)

For 1g Pd, about 2.5g DMG assuming 2 moles DMG per 1 atom Pd


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

Lino1406 said:


> For 1g Pd, about 2.5g DMG assuming 2 moles DMG per 1 atom Pd


thx I understand with 100 grams I can drop 40 grams palladium I will try to don't waste the dmg


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## Lino1406 (Oct 18, 2022)

For not analytical use consider precipitation with sodium formate


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## kurtak (Oct 18, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> DMG dissolved in water is needed?



DMG does NOT dissolve well *in just* water

It is *very difficult* to get it to dissolve in boiling hot water

It will NOT dissolve in cold water

If you don't know how to properly prepare your DMG - & you try to dissolve it with just water you will most certainly be wasting your DMG

Kurt


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## kurtak (Oct 18, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> thx I understand with 100 grams I can drop 40 grams palladium I will try to don't waste the dmg



I hope you are not plaining to precipitate 40 grams of Pd with DMG

You will need a *VERY LARGE *reaction vessel to precipitate that much Pd using DMG as well as a *very good* filtering set up to get all the acid washed out of the precipitate

Then you still have to reduce the DMG/Pd precipitated yellow salt to actual Pd metal

Hope you are set up properly & know what you are doing on that large of a scale

DMG (generally speaking) is really good for (small) testing to insure you actually have Pd in solution

*NOT so good* for precipitating large amounts (more then a few grams) of Pd --- unless you are well set up to precipitate - filter - & reduce the DMG/Pd precipitate

Kurt


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

Lino1406 said:


> For not analytical use consider precipitation with sodium formate


 me I must drop the palladium from dirty solution with nickel chrom copper because I believe a direct format reduction will don't work and after I will refine palladium to 999 redissolving the DMG/PD salt followed by reduction with sodium formate at pH 2 to get in final 999 pd


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

kurtak said:


> I hope you are not plaining to precipitate 40 grams of Pd with DMG
> 
> You will need a *VERY LARGE *reaction vessel to precipitate that much Pd using DMG as well as a *very good* filtering set up to get all the acid washed out of the precipitate
> 
> ...


I will work in small batches, and I read DMG is not soluble in cold water, and I have good glass fiber filters for fast filtration


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

I use DMG only when I work with dirty solution, when I process pd stuff wich when is dissolved in Nitric acid have a orange colour I process direct with sodium formate becouse the orange colour indicate is not much contamination.


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

kurtak said:


> I hope you are not plaining to precipitate 40 grams of Pd with DMG
> 
> You will need a *VERY LARGE *reaction vessel to precipitate that much Pd using DMG as well as a *very good* filtering set up to get all the acid washed out of the precipitate
> 
> ...


small scale I always test with sncl and never sncl lye black colour indicate palladium


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

kurtak said:


> I hope you are not plaining to precipitate 40 grams of Pd with DMG
> 
> You will need a *VERY LARGE *reaction vessel to precipitate that much Pd using DMG as well as a *very good* filtering set up to get all the acid washed out of the precipitate
> 
> ...


I will process 378 soviet relays contacts from phone centrals wich are silver/pd alloy, I have around 1 kg of material after I cut the top of the relay where are the contacts, I expect minimum 150 gr silver an 30 grams of paladium


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

I hope to get more palladium because I leave the contacts 3 days in nitric acid and are not dissolved yet , the contacts are dissolve hard in boil nitric acid this I believe is possible to contain more palladium


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## orvi (Oct 18, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> Next days will arrive my order , for the first time I order DIMETHYLGLIOXIME just 100 grams because is expensive.
> I try to find answers to my question on internet and I don't find nothing.
> My question is how much DMG is needed to drop palladium ,for example to drop 10 gr of palladium from a solution how much grams DMG dissolved in water is needed?
> I ask this question because DMG is expensive is not cheap like SMB(always when I drop gold I use excces) and I do not want to waste my DMG and the question is simple and quick for 10 gr of palladium how much grams of DMG dissolved is needed.


Easily computed - Pd form complex with two molecules of DMG, so theoretically you need double the molar ammount of Pd to precipitate with DMG. In real life, you need to add over stoichiometry - because DMG is not that stable in solutions containing oxidizers or unreacted nitric. Espetially in enviroment that contain free nitric in significant concentration, DMG degrades rather quickly. And also, complex itself can be dergaded by prolonged exposure to this enviroment and thus precipitations from free nitric solutions or not de-NOxed AR solution are never quantitative. 
Be aware of this fact.
If I use DMG to sccavenge the Pd, I always raise pH past 1, or 2 (even better). This will minimize the free acid present, and thus prolonged life of DMG and Pd(DMG)2 complex in subjected solutions.

I never dissolve DMG in anything, as it is only adding dead volume to the solution. I pulverize the DMG if it is lumpy and bigger crystals. Then I rely on good magnetic or even better mechanical stirring. From nitrate solutions, precipitations are fairly quick as DMG is better soluble in BM solutions than in AR chloride solutions. 
In spent AR solutions, the precipitations take considerably more time. For this purpose, I take 3 molar equivalents of DMG relative to expected Pd content and let is vigorously stir overnight. I filter the suspension in the morning, and then use just a bit of DMG again on that same solution, let it stir for few hours and filter small ammount of the DMG - and measure if there is no more Pd present.

If you have more than dozen of g of Pd to deal with, always go with cementation followed by redissolution of cement + formate reduction to scavenge values. DMG is very wasteful in bigger scale, and also it gets expensive quite quickly.


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## orvi (Oct 18, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I will process 378 soviet relays contacts from phone centrals wich are silver/pd alloy, I have around 1 kg of material after I cut the top of the relay where are the contacts, I expect minimum 150 gr silver an 30 grams of paladium


My advice is to forget the DMG in this point. Ounce of Pd is away from sane ammount for DMG. And with this utterely simple material for Pd recovery and raffination, there is no point in use of DMG. Dissolve, precipitate silver and then continue with formate reduction. Treat the waste as usual. Neat.
Nice haul by the way. I like this material as it is very convenient to work with, and very easy to refine compared to other PGM sources in e-scrap, such as USSR MLCCs.


mythen10 said:


> I hope to get more palladium because I leave the contacts 3 days in nitric acid and are not dissolved yet , the contacts are dissolve hard in boil nitric acid this I believe is possible to contain more palladium


Do you heat the solution to boiling for all that time ? If heat was applied for 3 days and you still have undissolved contacts, it well could be something more noble than Pd. Or more resistant (W for example). Thing is you need fairly strong nitric to dissolve AgPd alloy typically used in these contacts (30Pd70Ag) at sane rate. Or you just depleted nitric, and it is unable to attack the metal at visible rate.

And also be aware of the fact that not all relays from phone centrals were AgPd. Some are just Ag. Look completely same, but the points are just Ag. Trained eye can spot the difference between Ag and AgPd in these right away (colour tinge of freshly cut metal and typical oxidation patterns of the Ag and AgPd alloys), altough nitric test is much more straightforward and sure (and portable  ). I burned myself few times (not terribly bad, but it was painful to complete refining to only cover the purchase price or even worse) with this material. From that point, I never buy cut contacts from these relays prior to the melt analysis. Too easy for "creative" people to mix in quite %-tage of just Ag types, hard to notice for the buyer in kilo-bag, testing few pieces in place


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

I leave the contacts in solution without heating , Nitric dissolve just the base metals wichbwas around the points , only when I apply heat the points start dissolve but more harder than copper or silver , thei points must be boiled more than 10 minute to dissolve complete , and I am 100% Shure are pd/ag contacts the sncl test is strong black


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## mythen10 (Oct 18, 2022)

orvi said:


> My advice is to forget the DMG in this point. Ounce of Pd is away from sane ammount for DMG. And with this utterely simple material for Pd recovery and raffination, there is no point in use of DMG. Dissolve, precipitate silver and then continue with formate reduction. Treat the waste as usual. Neat.
> Nice haul by the way. I like this material as it is very convenient to work with, and very easy to refine compared to other PGM sources in e-scrap, such as USSR MLCCs.
> 
> Do you heat the solution to boiling for all that time ? If heat was applied for 3 days and you still have undissolved contacts, it well could be something more noble than Pd. Or more resistant (W for example). Thing is you need fairly strong nitric to dissolve AgPd alloy typically used in these contacts (30Pd70Ag) at sane rate. Or you just depleted nitric, and it is unable to attack the metal at visible rate.
> ...


this are the relay and contacts


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## Daniel0007a (Oct 19, 2022)

Used DMG for nickel complexes but it required Alcohol (Rubbing alcohol). It may be a very difficult project reacting free DMG with Pd.


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## orvi (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I leave the contacts in solution without heating , Nitric dissolve just the base metals wichbwas around the points , only when I apply heat the points start dissolve but more harder than copper or silver , thei points must be boiled more than 10 minute to dissolve complete , and I am 100% Shure are pd/ag contacts the sncl test is strong black


I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ? 
By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 19, 2022)

Daniel0007a said:


> Used DMG for nickel complexes but it required Alcohol (Rubbing alcohol). It may be a very difficult project reacting free DMG with Pd.


That is a daily thing done all the time.
But mostly for analytical purposes, if used to precipitate Pd from a solution it begins getting expensive and bulky very fast.
The DMG needs to be dissolved in a solution of NaOH and water.


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ?
> By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


the solution green


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ?
> By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


I cut around 378 relays is impossible to cut close to the points , I spent full 2 days to cut this relays


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ?
> By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


this are pd/ag the sncl is strong black


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ?
> By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


in general I find traces of paladium almost everywhere in soviet electronics from simple pins connectors to the contacts of buttons of a radio


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ?
> By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


this are the contacts and this is the sncl test of solution


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## BlackLabel (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I cut around 378 relays is impossible to cut close to the points , I spent full 2 days to cut this relays


You just need the right cutter.
Reducing the junk will save you time and money.


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ?
> By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


and I hate when people say the black colour of sncl is not possitve for palladium, are people on this forum wich say me black colour is not palladium, I don't have patience with this kind of people


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

the contacts are there from 3 days ago and don't wanna dissolve only if heat it will start dissolve


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

the price of palladium is very high they pay around 60 for 1 gr 999 pd and couple years ago was very low


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

they pay 60 euro per gram of 999 pd


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I do not say you don´t have the right material. I just say from my experience that not all telephone relays contain Pd. As I watch the photo, you are cutting the pieces not very close to the points - that is quite wasteful in terms of used nitric. What colour is your solution ?
> By the way, it is always convenient for me just to "strip" the points from carriers in nitric, decant the points, melt them and sell. I have the same price for 30% as well as 99% Pd. Only sometimes there is need to refine Pd from this easy and clean material.


after this photo what is your opinion about concentration of pd in contacts, the contacts are not full dissolved and sncl test show strong black , it's possible to be Ag70% and Pd30%?


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## orvi (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I cut around 378 relays is impossible to cut close to the points , I spent full 2 days to cut this relays


That is far more time than I expected. But it does not matter at this point. If it is you, who cut the contacts, remember, that close cut contacts from these relays (on thin metal carrier) can have up to 50% PM content. But cutting like this can reduce it even below 25%. That is double the weight, which is mostly copper/nickel/zinc alloy => around 2-4times more nitric is needed to dissolve this, compared to the actual contact point. Evaluate it.


mythen10 said:


> the solution green


That is concerning. You either have low Pd content, or more probably use very dilute acid for points dissolution. With this material, solution should be at least dirty brownish green. And if you dissolve just carriers in dilute cold nitric (practically no Pd leached out of the points), decant, and then dissolve the points in at least 50% nitric for sake of sane dissolution speed, solution should be practically reddish-brown, with no signs of green.

Looking like the vials on the images I posted above. These pictures are actually various types of telephone relays contacts, single point dissolved in bit of 53% nitric acid in each vial. Vials have the total volume of 2 mL. So you can easily judge by the colour how it looks like.



mythen10 said:


> and I hate when people say the black colour of sncl is not possitve for palladium, are people on this forum wich say me black colour is not palladium, I don't have patience with this kind of people


Whenever you test for Pd and result is black, it is unconclusive - because palladium gives green to brownish-green colouration. But I get what you want to say. And it is true that black usually means some PMs in the sample. For future, dilute your sample with dH2O before stannous - it gets you much more conclusive results. 

By the way, it is sufficient to see the colouration - so you do not need to use whole lot of solution. One drop is more than sufficient to see the colour, you do not need to waste the liquid unnecesarily for testing. As it contains your money  Every test costs you the actual PM value, or time necessary to recover it from the spent tests.

I test one or two drops on watchglass. Somebody is more used to white background, so they use white plastic spoon - like 999Dusan in his videos. Somebody use filter paper strip (probably most people here and also generally) like sreetips in his videos. I advise not to use anything coloured as the vessel for testing, as it can be bit misleading for your eyes, espetially with dilute solutions.


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## kurtak (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> this are pd/ag the sncl is strong black



You can not trust a stannous test done on a solution that has silver dissolved in it

Why ?

Because the SnCl will turn the silver nitrate to silver chloride

The AgCl - when exposed to light - the white AgCl will then (quickly) photo change from white *to dark purple or black* thereby giving you a *false* positive stannous test

Therefore - to get a true stannous test result *you first need to* drop the silver as AgCl so that you are doing your stannous testing on a solution that is free of silver

Kurt


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## kurtak (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> after this photo what is your opinion about concentration of pd in contacts, the contacts are not full dissolved and sncl test show strong black , it's possible to be Ag70% and Pd30%?


If you are going to stannous test a nitrate solution that has both Ag & Pd dissolved in it *you need to first drop the silver out *of the solution as AgCl otherwise you will more then likely get a *false *positive stannous test

Read my last post

Kurt


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## orvi (Oct 19, 2022)

kurtak said:


> If you are going to stannous test a nitrate solution that has both Ag & Pd dissolved in it *you need to first drop the silver out *of the solution as AgCl otherwise you will more then likely get a *false *positive stannous test
> 
> Read my last post
> 
> Kurt





mythen10 said:


> and I hate when people say the black colour of sncl is not possitve for palladium, are people on this forum wich say me black colour is not palladium, I don't have patience with this kind of people


I will slightly "refine" this statement with addition - for trained eye, it is possible to evaluate it also directly without dropping the silver first. But for begginers who apparently struggle with this, I will advise to do it as Kurt said - and drop silver first, then test the resulting solution 

If you are testing on watchglass or in the spoon, it is easily done like this:
1. Take like 1-2 drops of your solution onto the watchglass or spoon. Not directly at the center, but bit closer to the edge.
2. Take HCL and use one or two drops to precipitate the silver. Give it a stir with some plastic straw or stick, try not to smar it all over the watchglass or spoon. Wait few seconds or a minute to properly coagulate the silver chloride - it will form quarky precipitate and liquid in the drop clear itself considerably from very milky, to only slightly milky. If this does not happen, use another very small drop of HCL.
3. Tilt the watchglass or spoon very gently, and with help of the plastic straw or stick, "transfer-by smearing with stick or straw" only the liquid from the suspension to the other place onto the watchglass or spoon. Now, you will have one "long" droplet with mainly AgCl suspension on one side and relatively clean liquid on the other side.
4. Drop one drop of stannous test from the side where the "clear" liquid is, allowing the two liquids to meet and create interface.
5. Now, you will cleanly see if there are PMs in your sample.

You are welcome


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## kurtak (Oct 19, 2022)

You might want to read what I posted in this thread about processing this type of telecom points

you don't need to dissolve the Pd points - just the silver points & the base metal bus bars the points are on









Three types of contacts


Folks I've got three types of contacts here on a batch of telecoms equipment that's landed with me today. I may be wrong and I'm happy to take some advice but I think that the dark contacts (corroded) on the right are silver, as they polish up. I think the grey contacts on the left may be...




goldrefiningforum.com





Kurt


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I will slightly "refine" this statement with addition - for trained eye, it is possible to evaluate it also directly without dropping the silver first. But for begginers who apparently struggle with this, I will advise to do it as Kurt said - and drop silver first, then test the resulting solution
> 
> If you are testing on watchglass or in the spoon, it is easily done like this:
> 1. Take like 1-2 drops of your solution onto the watchglass or spoon. Not directly at the center, but bit closer to the edge.
> ...


I will check when I will have time , check this thread FAILED! palladium precipitation with sodium carbonate/formic acid PLS HELP me personally I don't trust KURTAK I believe he lye in his post or don't have any idea about PGM 
What did you see there is a solution wich was boil over and me I use a aluminium foil on the stove, THAT ALLUMINIUM FOIL CEMENTED OUT THERE AROUND 1 GR OF PD AND KURTAK SAY THAT BROWN ORANGE SLUDGE IS NOT PD SALT, AND that is definitely palladium


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

that is definitely pd ,what I can say when somebody say on this forum that orange brown cemented out salt is not palladium


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

and this solution give at test with sncl same colour black and flame test bluis oxide film on wire


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## kurtak (Oct 19, 2022)

Daniel0007a said:


> Used DMG for nickel complexes but it required Alcohol (Rubbing alcohol). It may be a very difficult project reacting free DMG with Pd.



If you are dealing with a nitrate solution that has silver dissolved in it you should *NEVER *add alcohol of any kind to the solution --- that includes adding DMG that has been prepared with alcohol to a silver nitrate solution

When alcohols are added to a silver nitrate solution you are taking a chance of creating silver fulminate - whether by intent *or by accident 

Silver fulminate is a HIGHLY pressure sensitive explosive*

Read what I have posted in this thread (& many other threads)









Preparing DMG


I have tried and failed to fully dissolve DMG. I tried ethanol and isopropyl alcohol. Yesterday I tried sodium hydroxide. I did get a partial dissolution in the sodium hydroxide but there was still a lot of solid white powder left where it did not fully dissolve. I kept adding hydroxide until...




goldrefiningforum.com





Kurt


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

orvi said:


> I will slightly "refine" this statement with addition - for trained eye, it is possible to evaluate it also directly without dropping the silver first. But for begginers who apparently struggle with this, I will advise to do it as Kurt said - and drop silver first, then test the resulting solution
> 
> If you are testing on watchglass or in the spoon, it is easily done like this:
> 1. Take like 1-2 drops of your solution onto the watchglass or spoon. Not directly at the center, but bit closer to the edge.
> ...


and what I process there was 12 gram of 2 types of resistors wire wich I take from the phone central from where are that contacts


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

kurtak said:


> If you are dealing with a nitrate solution that has silver dissolved in it you should *NEVER *add alcohol of any kind to the solution --- that includes adding DMG that has been prepared with alcohol to a silver nitrate solution
> 
> When alcohols are added to a silver nitrate solution you are taking a chance of creating silver fulminate - whether by intent *or by accident
> 
> ...


I will use DMG just with hot water like all normal people


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## mythen10 (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I will use DMG just with hot water like all normal people


hot water will be enough


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## BlackLabel (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10,

YOU are the person in this thread who have NO IDEA what's going on.
Regardless what you are trying to show us or proof us, IT'S RUBBISH!

Your 999 silver buttons are looking like clay.
Your test vessel is a orange lid of a bottle.
Your photos of your tests or solutions are that bad, everybody has to guess in order to help you.

Now you are starting blaming the people who are willing to help you (and to help you needs a lot of patience).

Troll!


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## kurtak (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I will use DMG just with hot water like all normal people



Normal people never prepare their DMG *with just hot water*

They prepare their DMG with water + NaOH as instructed in link I provided titled - Preparing DMG

Kurt


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## MicheleM (Oct 19, 2022)

@mythen10 chill down please, don't be so disrespectful towards the members of this forum, they are helping you for free you should thank them


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I will check when I will have time , check this thread FAILED! palladium precipitation with sodium carbonate/formic acid PLS HELP me personally I don't trust KURTAK I believe he lye in his post or don't have any idea about PGM
> What did you see there is a solution wich was boil over and me I use a aluminium foil on the stove, THAT ALLUMINIUM FOIL CEMENTED OUT THERE AROUND 1 GR OF PD AND KURTAK SAY THAT BROWN ORANGE SLUDGE IS NOT PD SALT, AND that is definitely palladium


You my friend will stop NOW.
Calling experienced people trying to help you liars are not tolerated.
You have been persistent in your claims and has not changed a thing and do not take instructions given, I even doubt you read the advice given.
If you do not shape up, I WILL ban you, and permanently this time.


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## BlackLabel (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10,

You're my daily funny clip show.

Did you ever consider to launch your own channel on YouTube?

Since the African scammers got rare the last days, you're my lighthouse each day.

Thank you!!!


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## kurtak (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I will check when I will have time , check this thread FAILED! palladium precipitation with sodium carbonate/formic acid PLS HELP me personally I don't trust KURTAK I believe he lye in his post or don't have any idea about PGM
> What did you see there is a solution wich was boil over and me I use a aluminium foil on the stove, THAT ALLUMINIUM FOIL CEMENTED OUT THERE AROUND 1 GR OF PD AND KURTAK SAY THAT BROWN ORANGE SLUDGE IS NOT PD SALT, AND that is definitely palladium


 (in a very sad sort of way)

Thank you for insulting me once again *(as well as everyone else that has tried to help you)*

You came here asking for advice - but when someone tries to help you all you can do is insult them &/or argue with them

I wish you best of luck

If the advice/info you are getting here on GRF is so bad that all you can do is insult &/or argue with those of us trying to help you --- why don't you just leave here & *go back to You Tube ---* *clearly you think that is a better source of info then the info provided here on GRF*

Kurt


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## kurtak (Oct 19, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> You my friend will stop NOW.
> Calling experienced people trying to help you liars are not tolerated.
> You have been persistent in your claims and has not changed a thing and do not take instructions given, I even doubt you read the advice given.
> If you do not shape up, I WILL ban you, and permanently this time.



mythen10 has made it clear that he nether wants or needs the advice provided by GRF members

You Tube is clearly his friend --- IMO - *You Tube is the ONLY friend he needs* 

Kurt


----------



## Daniel0007a (Oct 19, 2022)

However, if you can form a Hot DMG complex with Pd salts this video may be able to HELP.


----------



## orvi (Oct 19, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I will check when I will have time , check this thread FAILED! palladium precipitation with sodium carbonate/formic acid PLS HELP me personally I don't trust KURTAK I believe he lye in his post or don't have any idea about PGM
> What did you see there is a solution wich was boil over and me I use a aluminium foil on the stove, THAT ALLUMINIUM FOIL CEMENTED OUT THERE AROUND 1 GR OF PD AND KURTAK SAY THAT BROWN ORANGE SLUDGE IS NOT PD SALT, AND that is definitely palladium


I am curious who buy your "refined" products  Because *I never saw brown orange palladium. And I assure you I seen quite a bit of Pd.* No Pd I ever seen was any other colour as black or metallic. You can believe in what you want, that is your right and I respect that. But you need to also respect that no sane man here will buy your brownish sludge as palladium.

Saying somebody with clear advices and established name, proofs and experience has no idea about PGMs is straight nonsense. *Because from what you are showing here it is quite obvious that it is you, who does not have a clue what to do with PGMs.*

Yet, you feel like you own the truth. Or feel "defeated" by knowledge... You thought this is the true, because it suit the best for what you want it to be.

I didn´t wanted to say it first, but from the sloppy picture of the contacts - they look quite black in colour. Maybe you live in the world where Pd alloys tarnish to black over time. But I live in the world where silver tarnish over time. Anybody experienced here (enlisting Kurt) must have notice that. But we work with clear evidence here- and this isn´t clear evidence. It need additional proofs, certain, always working, straightforward. Not half-baked opinions which suit what we want to hear. We didn´t see any proof here, no legitimate clue about composition of the material - from wrong coloured solution, to false positive stannous, ending with mysterious orange-brown sludge and metal that goes blue upon heating (which is true for at least 5 metals, and myriad of their alloys). 

*Openly said, I does not care what your material contain. But it is in YOUR INTEREST to squeeze values from it, and you are apparently loosing the game - and yet you insult people which try to help you.*
You are not only person with this attitude to things about precious metals. I meet dozens of people who tried to assure me about whatever miraculous things they have and are willing to sell me. Kilos of rhodium plated metal (which was Al wire), methods of extraction of hidden PGMs in worthless components, perfect methods for extracting Ru from resistors (that will kill not only me, but entire floor in the building, if performed as said...) and so on and so on. I feel like this field attracts vague individuals, believers, scammers, advantage-takers, "non-existent treasure" hunters and many more similar beings.

Be teachable, swallow that fact you simply aren´t one who knows everything, and improve your view about this. When dozen of apparently more sucessful and experienced refiners say you that it simply isn´t true - it very probably isn´t. I also sometimes has problems swallowing my ego, everybody does once upon the time. But studying and experience, education and teaching (yes, I teach lab courses of organic chemistry) made me teachable. Changing opinions isn´t unhealthy practice in science (and this is science), it is necessary.


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

orvi said:


> I am curious who buy your "refined" products  Because *I never saw brown orange palladium. And I assure you I seen quite a bit of Pd.* No Pd I ever seen was any other colour as black or metallic. You can believe in what you want, that is your right and I respect that. But you need to also respect that no sane man here will buy your brownish sludge as palladium.
> 
> Saying somebody with clear advices and established name, proofs and experience has no idea about PGMs is straight nonsense. *Because from what you are showing here it is quite obvious that it is you, who does not have a clue what to do with PGMs.*
> 
> ...


ovi for your knowledge in the cities most of palladium salts have this colour red brick(orange/brown) when you will drop the palladium with chlorine you will get red brick no? and this red brick is not a orange brown colour like same frome the photos? and this is not all PALLADIUM HEXACHLORIDE , PALLADIUM CHLORIDE, AMMONIUM HEXACHLOROPALLADATE , ETC all this salts of pd have the colour red brick (wich is a red brown like my pd from photos ) I HOPE NOW YOU WILL DONT HAVE ANY COMMENTARY.
and I try what you say I dissolve the contact I precipitate silver and I filter it and after I test the solution and the sncl is same black , I dilute the solution and test is black.
A QUICK QUESTION, WHAT IT WAS IN YOUR MIND WHEN YOU SAY IS NOT EXIST RED BRICK PALLADIUM? ALL WE KNOW ABOUT RED BRICK PALLADIUM this from photo definitely is PALLADIUM RED BRICK SALT I BELIEVE IS PALLADIUM CHLORIDE OR HEXACHLORIDE(in solution I was have some HCl acid) SALTS WICH IT WAS CEMENTED OUT ON THE ALLUMINIUM FOIL WICH WAS ON THE STOVE.
that is definitely red brick palladium hahaha or maybe you can't make the difference from colours and for you all forms all palladium are black hehhehe


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

this photos are from sites where they sell this kind of salts firs photo is palladium chloride and second ammonium HEXACHLOROPALLADATE


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

now you can see clearly that precipitate wich was formed on that alluminium it was palladium chloride salts


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

here they sell this salts Ammonium hexachloropalladate(IV) Powder (CAS No.19168-23-1) and here Palladium Chloride


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## MicheleM (Oct 21, 2022)

(Pd salts ) != (Pd)


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

MicheleM said:


> (Pd salts ) != (Pd)


what?


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

MicheleM said:


> (Pd salts ) != (Pd)


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

MicheleM said:


> (Pd salts ) != (Pd)


please read all thread before posting a comment, you don't know about you talk


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> ovi for your knowledge in the cities most of palladium salts have this colour red brick(orange/brown) when you will drop the palladium with chlorine you will get red brick no? and this red brick is not a orange brown colour like same frome the photos? and this is not all PALLADIUM HEXACHLORIDE , PALLADIUM CHLORIDE, AMMONIUM HEXACHLOROPALLADATE , ETC all this salts of pd have the colour red brick (wich is a red brown like my pd from photos ) I HOPE NOW YOU WILL DONT HAVE ANY COMMENTARY.
> and I try what you say I dissolve the contact I precipitate silver and I filter it and after I test the solution and the sncl is same black , I dilute the solution and test is black.
> A QUICK QUESTION, WHAT IT WAS IN YOUR MIND WHEN YOU SAY IS NOT EXIST RED BRICK PALLADIUM? ALL WE KNOW ABOUT RED BRICK PALLADIUM this from photo definitely is PALLADIUM RED BRICK SALT I BELIEVE IS PALLADIUM CHLORIDE OR HEXACHLORIDE(in solution I was have some HCl acid) SALTS WICH IT WAS CEMENTED OUT ON THE ALLUMINIUM FOIL WICH WAS ON THE STOVE.
> that is definitely red brick palladium hahaha or maybe you can't make the difference from colours and for you all forms all palladium are black hehhehe


If your Stannous are still black after diluting then you have to dilute more.
Stannous for Pd is greenish brown until it get too saturated to see the color, same as with Gold, it is violet until kit becomes black due to too high concentration.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> please read all thread before posting a comment, you don't know about you talk


I have warned you, bee careful now!!!!


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

orvi said:


> . But you need to also respect that no sane man here will buy your brownish sludge as palladium.


ovi , me I don't say I wanna sell that brownish sludge of palladium, me I say that sludge is o form of palladium wich was precipitated out on the alluminium foil I don't say I wanna sell that BECOUSE that is a salt I can refine or I can melt(wich will don't be pure)
Again you have difficulty in understanding English? PLS use Google translator definitely it will hope you to understand


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> I have warned you, bee careful now!!!!


here people don't understand English? or I don't know what is happening me I talk about a stuff and come someone and talk another stuff


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> I have warned you, bee careful now!!!!


I don't use obscene words and I don't wanna make this , I just explain becouse me I talk about a stuff and come someone who don't read the thread an say things wich don't have any sense with the subject


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> ovi , me I don't say I wanna sell that brownish sludge of palladium, me I say that sludge is o form of palladium wich was precipitated out on the alluminium foil I don't say I wanna sell that BECOUSE that is a salt I can refine or I can melt(wich will don't be pure)
> Again you have difficulty in understanding English? PLS use Google translator definitely it will hope you to understand


Orvis post is quite clear and to the point, your posts on the other hand are hard to understand.
I think it might benefit us all if you run it trough a translator first.
It will straighten the language, minimizing the risk of misunderstanding and removing the profanities.
Edit for spelling.


----------



## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> ovi for your knowledge in the cities most of palladium salts have this colour red brick(orange/brown) when you will drop the palladium with chlorine you will get red brick no? and this red brick is not a orange brown colour like same frome the photos? and this is not all PALLADIUM HEXACHLORIDE , PALLADIUM CHLORIDE, AMMONIUM HEXACHLOROPALLADATE , ETC all this salts of pd have the colour red brick (wich is a red brown like my pd from photos ) I HOPE NOW YOU WILL DONT HAVE ANY COMMENTARY.
> and I try what you say I dissolve the contact I precipitate silver and I filter it and after I test the solution and the sncl is same black , I dilute the solution and test is black.
> A QUICK QUESTION, WHAT IT WAS IN YOUR MIND WHEN YOU SAY IS NOT EXIST RED BRICK PALLADIUM? ALL WE KNOW ABOUT RED BRICK PALLADIUM this from photo definitely is PALLADIUM RED BRICK SALT I BELIEVE IS PALLADIUM CHLORIDE OR HEXACHLORIDE(in solution I was have some HCl acid) SALTS WICH IT WAS CEMENTED OUT ON THE ALLUMINIUM FOIL WICH WAS ON THE STOVE.
> that is definitely red brick palladium hahaha or maybe you can't make the difference from colours and for you all forms all palladium are black hehhehe


Why do you ask questions and ask for help when you don't listen to the advice given?
In stead you blame people for lying and being incompetent when ever they point at your misconceptions.
It might benefit this forum and yourself, if you spent more time studying not only the refining of PMs but also the posts you reply to and your answers to them.


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> If your Stannous are still black after diluting then you have to dilute more.
> Stannous for Pd is greenish brown until it get too saturated to see the color, same as with Gold, it is violet until kit becomes black due to too high concentration.


I dilute agai but because the solution is blue I just see a dark colour


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I dilute agai but because the solution is blue I just see a dark colour


The solution of dissolved Palladium Nitrates should be reddish brown.
Blue is Copper nitrate, green is Nickel Nitrate and Purple is Chromium Nitrate.
So again, dilute it some more and see what the Stannous give you.


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## MicheleM (Oct 21, 2022)

@mythen10 if you want, when I have time, I can translate your comments, that are quite difficult to understand.

Non si capisce una acca di quello che scrivi


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> please read all thread before posting a comment, you don't know about you talk


You can probably address Michele in Italian since he is from Italy . If I'm not mistaken that is.
Edited for clarity.


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> The solution of dissolved Palladium Nitrates should be reddish brown.
> Blue is Copper nitrate, green is Nickel Nitrate and Purple is Chromium Nitrate.
> So again, dilute it some more and see what the Stannous give you.


I still black and on YouTube Dusan999 say black colour indicate palladium in solution


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> You can probably address Michele in Italian since he is from Italy . If I'm not mistaken that is.
> Edited for clarity.


look This is dusan999  and make test for palladium and sncl show black and he say that solution contain palladium


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

my test is same


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I still black and on YouTube Dusan999 say black colour indicate palladium in solution


Youtube in general are not considered a trustworthy source of anything.
There are good sources like Sreetips, Owltech and more, they are by the way members here.
I don't think Dusan belongs to the group called trustworthy sources.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> my test is same


Dilute until you can get a distinguishable colour.


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

maybe DUSAN999 is a lyer


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> look This is dusan999  and make test for palladium and sncl show black and he say that solution contain palladium



One safe test for Pd, not relying on Stannous is DMG, that is actually its main use.
Dissolve DMG in Sodium Hydroxide solution and test.
Search the forum for Preparing DMG solution.


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

a the old man SREETIPS he deal with big amount of gold


Yggdrasil said:


> One safe test for Pd, not relying on Stannous is DMG, that is actually its main use.
> Dissolve DMG in Sodium Hydroxide solution and test.
> Search the forum for Preparing DMG solution.


when I will get the DMG I will test


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> maybe DUSAN999 is a lyer


No, I don't think it's quite that bad, but he lives from clicks and likes on his videos, not his refining


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> a the old man SREETIPS he deal with big amount of gold
> 
> when I will get the DMG I will test


Just be prepared to be disappointed, reality are not always what we want it to be


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> No, I don't think it's quite that bad, but he lives from clicks and likes on his videos, not his refining


maybe because he is friend with a lot of scrapers from internet in special with ewaste Ben that guy from Australia


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

no finish with this thread I will use DMG in Noah for a better test , this thread is closed. tdam.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> no finish with this thread I will use DMG in Noah for a better test , this thread is closed. tdam.


Well it is not up to you to close a thread, mate.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> no finish with this thread I will use DMG in Noah for a better test , this thread is closed. tdam.


I guess you meant NaOH, right?


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

right now I test again in dilute solution and the colour is a dark greenish brown colour when I add slowly and after it become darker and darker


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## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

MicheleM said:


> (Pd salts ) != (Pd)


He's no programmer.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> right now I test again in dilute solution and the colour is a dark greenish brown colour when I add slowly and after it become darker and darker


The tests are much more readable on paper or cotton buds.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

BlackLabel said:


> He's no programmer.


Hmm which language is this?


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## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> Hmm which language is this?


It's used in many programming languages.
! stands for NOT
= stands for EQUAL
So != is NOT EQUAL (not the same).

More programming operators:








What is an operator in programming?


Learn what an operator, a character that represents a specific mathematical or logical action or process, is in programming. Explore different types of operators.




www.techtarget.com


----------



## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

BlackLabel said:


> It's used in many programming languages.
> ! stands for NOT
> = stands for EQUAL
> So != is NOT EQUAL (not the same).
> ...


Many years since I dabbled in programming, and it was only for a short time.


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## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

Some people may read it as "chicken"…


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> Many years since I dabbled in programming, and it was only for a short time.


I don't understand why anyone don't use python to make a bot wich will acces automatically YouTube links changing the IP EVERY time , and in this way to make mone from automatically visuallisations


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I don't understand why anyone don't use python to make a bot wich will acces automatically YouTube links changing the IP EVERY time , and in this way to make mone from automatically visuallisations


in this way to make money from visuallisations


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> in this way to make money from visuallisations


Google probably has counter measures. And if you are caught, you are out and receives big fines.
This is actual scamming and cheating.


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> Google probably has counter measures. And if you are caught, you are out and receives big fines.
> This is actual scamming and cheating.


is not illegal and is impossible to detect


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> is not illegal and is impossible to detect





Yggdrasil said:


> Google probably has counter measures. And if you are caught, you are out and receives big fines.
> This is actual scamming and cheating.


wrong , this is mining


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

you can use a bot to automate a software like fancy( who will split your screen in thousands of screen wich will work in same time) to access a favourite link changing IP every time in any time intervals and make millions of visuallisations on YouTube channel and you will be paid. THIS IS MINING


----------



## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> is not illegal and is impossible to detect


I’m positive it is illegal, but if it is not it is at least dishonest and a bad thing to do.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> wrong , this is mining


No this is NOT mining. Mining is when you use processor capacity to calculate the equations neccessary to claim a part if a Crypto coin.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> you can use a bot to automate a software like fancy( who will split your screen in thousands of screen wich will work in same time) to access a favourite link changing IP every time in any time intervals and make millions of visuallisations on YouTube channel and you will be paid. THIS IS MINING


This is stealing from the advertisers and Youtube.


----------



## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> you can use a bot to automate a software like fancy( who will split your screen in thousands of screen wich will work in same time) to access a favourite link changing IP every time in any time intervals and make millions of visuallisations on YouTube channel and you will be paid. THIS IS MINING


Absolutely NO mining, this is direct theft, and I’m pretty sure it will lead to jail if you are caught.


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## justinhcase (Oct 21, 2022)

DMG can be used as a precipitant, but it is not a very good one.
The very thing that makes it such a good test makes it impractical for any real recovery, because of the large amount of material you produce with a relatively small amount of Pd it is very easy to see.
It is useful when you have slight Pd impurity in a silver solution.
In that situation, Pd is about the only precipitant that will allow you to drop out the Pd and leave the silver in solution for conventional cementing.


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## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> you can use a bot to automate a software like fancy( who will split your screen in thousands of screen wich will work in same time) to access a favourite link changing IP every time in any time intervals and make millions of visuallisations on YouTube channel and you will be paid. THIS IS MINING


THIS IS FRAUD!!!
Please try to earn your money the honest way.


----------



## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

@mythen10 

I am sure, it makes no sense, talking to you about it, so I would like to ask you not to discuss your "mining plans" further here.
This is parasitic behavior and fraud, nothing else.


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## kurtak (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> look This is dusan999  and make test for palladium and sncl show black and he say that solution contain palladium



Note; - this is NOT a reply to mythen10 (as he is not really interested in listening &/or learning) rather it is a reply to the dusan999 video 

One of the worst videos on stannous testing I have ever seen

I have watched a few other videos by dusan999 - & just like this video it shows beyond any reasonable doubt that dusan999 has no real clue as to how to go about doing a real stannous test

Therefore the stannous testing that dusan999 can not be trusted

First of all - a "reaction" with stannous in & of its self does not prove that PMs (Precious Metals) are in solution

That is because you can in fact get what is know as a *false* positive (reaction) with stannous - I & others have posted about this *many times*

False positives can be the result of other (base) metals in solution - *just one example* is if you have molybdenum in solution which will give you a false positive that looks very much like Pt

Other chemicals (such as to much SMB) will give you a false positive (*one* more example)

Things dusan999 is doing (or not doing) that make his stannous testing results *completely unreliable*

1) he is not filtering his solutions *completely free of solids* (his solutions are very cloudy)

2) because the solutions are cloudy - the stannous *could very well be reacting* with whatever is making the solution cloudy giving the impression of a positive reaction when in fact it's a false positive

3) then - with a nitrate solution (after first filtering the solution to clean/clear) - where you suspect silver - the silver needs to be precipitated out *before* doing the stannous test or you are likely to get a false positive as a resulted of the silver chloride (created by the stannous) photo changing from white to purple/black

4) so - in other words - you have to *first drop* out the silver with salt or HCl - then do your stannous test on a clean/clear solution that has had the silver chloride removed from it - or you are likely to get a false positive

In other words - dusan999 clearly does not have true & full understanding of stannous testing - he ------

1) apparently believes (like many out there in the world of You Tube) that any reaction - whatsoever - proves PMs in solution - & that is because -----

2) he believes stannous will give a result for only PMs that are in solution - & therefore ------

3) does not understand that other things in solution - such as solids - other metals - &/or chemicals - can give a result/reaction that is *in fact a false positive*

Therefore - his stannous testing *can not be trusted !!!!*

Kurt


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

kurtak said:


> Note; - this is NOT a reply to mythen10 (as he is not really interested in listening &/or learning) rather it is a reply to the dusan999 video
> 
> One of the worst videos on stannous testing I have ever seen
> 
> ...


initially I was trust dusan999, I was believe is a credible person because is friend with the owner of this forum, But after all of this I believe maybe is a lyer or don't have much experience in refining like people from here.


----------



## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> initially I was trust dusan999, I was believe is a credible person because is friend with the owner of this forum, But after all of this I believe maybe is a lyer or don't have much experience in refining like people from here.


@mythen10 
You're rude again!
Dusan is a nice guy.
Unfortunately, sometimes he does not work very precisely. That doesn't make him a liar.
It seems you're thinking in binary (black or white, yes or no - nothing in between).

I hope, some day, you will reach the state, you do expect from all others.


----------



## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> initially I was trust dusan999, I was believe is a credible person because is friend with the owner of this forum, But after all of this I believe maybe is a lyer or don't have much experience in refining like people from here.


How do you know he is a friend of the owner of this forum?
I don’t know who owns this forum, I know some of the people in here from the forum.
I’m just curious.


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> How do you know he is a friend of the owner of this forum?
> I don’t know who owns this forum, I know some of the people in here from the forum.
> I’m just curious.


the owner of this forum is EWASTE BEN


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

ewaste Ben from Australia  they say on internet is the king of street scraping from Australia


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## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> the owner of this forum is EWASTE BEN


The owner of your brain is an idiot because he thinks he owns a brain.


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## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

BlackLabel said:


> The owner of your brain is an idiot because he thinks he owns a brain.


watch your language
seriously ewaste Ben is the owner he say this, in one movie he say he own this forum goldrefiningforum


----------



## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

BlackLabel said:


> The owner of your brain is an idiot because he thinks he owns a brain.


Please BlackLabel name calling is not tolerated in this forum, so please stop.


----------



## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> ewaste Ben from Australia  they say on internet is the king of street scraping from Australia


The owner group of this forum is a group who owns and manages a lot of forums.
I was expecting the owner to be from USA.
Are you sure he is truthful about this?


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> The owner group of this forum is a group who owns and manages a lot of forums.
> I was expecting the owner to be from USA.
> Are you sure he is truthful about this?


yes I look to lot of videos from ewaste Ben channel from YouTube and in one video (I don't remember exactly wich video have around 500) he say ,, HE IS THE OWNER OF THIS FORUM,, AND SAY ALSO HAVE A EBAY ACCOUNT where he sell tools for scraping and refine


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> The owner group of this forum is a group who owns and manages a lot of forums.
> I was expecting the owner to be from USA.
> Are you sure he is truthful about this?





mythen10 said:


> yes I look to lot of videos from ewaste Ben channel from YouTube and in one video (I don't remember exactly wich video have around 500) he say ,, HE IS THE OWNER OF THIS FORUM,, AND SAY ALSO HAVE A EBAY ACCOUNT where he sell tools for scraping and refine


this is the reason I have account here because in one day I remember what ewaste Ben say he have a forum and I say I will make a account here


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> this is the reason I have account here because in one day I remember what ewaste Ben say he have a forum and I say I will make a account here


but his tools from eBay are little pricey


----------



## mythen10 (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> but his tools from eBay are little pricey


he sell videocameras also for make movies on YouTube


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## BlackLabel (Oct 21, 2022)

@mythen10 

It confuses me, how confused you are.
Do you have a link to eWaste Bens eBay auctions?

He is recommending some things you can purchase on Amazon. If you buy something he did recommend, he earns a provision.
This is called "affiliate links".
And no, he is NOT the owner of Amazon!


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## FrugalRefiner (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> yes I look to lot of videos from ewaste Ben channel from YouTube and in one video (I don't remember exactly wich video have around 500) he say ,, HE IS THE OWNER OF THIS FORUM,, AND SAY ALSO HAVE A EBAY ACCOUNT where he sell tools for scraping and refine


mythen10, ewaste Ben is NOT the owner of this forum.

Dave


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## justinhcase (Oct 21, 2022)

I think you will find https://xenforo.com/ has retained all rights.
It says so if you look right at the bottom of your screen in teeny weeny little text.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 21, 2022)

justinhcase said:


> I think you will find https://xenforo.com/ has retained all rights.
> It says so if you look right at the bottom of your screen in teeny weeny little text.


Hi Justin, I’m a little confused now, are you talking about the owner of the forum or something else?


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## FrugalRefiner (Oct 21, 2022)

justinhcase said:


> I think you will find https://xenforo.com/ has retained all rights.
> It says so if you look right at the bottom of your screen in teeny weeny little text.


Xenforo is the developer of the software we use now. It used to be phpBB, but the new owners switched the forum to the Xenforo software when they took over.

Dave


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## justinhcase (Oct 21, 2022)

FrugalRefiner said:


> Xenforo is the developer of the software we use now. It used to be phpBB, but the new owners switched the forum to the Xenforo software when they took over.
> 
> Dave


Under the provision agreement, who is it who retains the ultimate copyright on the content?
Xenforo supports a phenomenal number of similar groups, I took it that they farmed them to produce copyrightable material and advertising space.
Never really looked into it but the management seemed to have changed quite a few times since I have been a member.
Never had much insight into the upper workings of the group.


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## FrugalRefiner (Oct 21, 2022)

The forum has only ever had two owners. It was created by Jean-Nicolas Allaire February 24, 2007. He sold the forum to Group Builder October 13, 2021.

Dave


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## Ultrax (Oct 21, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> Next days will arrive my order , for the first time I order DIMETHYLGLIOXIME just 100 grams because is expensive.


Is it expensive? I'm just curious about a comparison, can you please tell me how much DMG 100 g costs in your country? In Ukraine price is $9 for can with HQ DMG 100g from Indian supplier.


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## justinhcase (Oct 21, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> Is it expensive? I'm just curious about a comparison, can you please tell me how much DMG 100 g costs in your country? In Ukraine price is $9 for can with HQ DMG 100g from Indian supplier.


I used to get mine from a chap in Ozyorsk, Chelyabinsk Oblast, it was also known as Chelyabinsk-65.
But since the hostility has begun I do not think he will send me anymore.
I paid about £25 for 250g.
Hope I do not run out any time soon.


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## mythen10 (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> Is it expensive? I'm just curious about a comparison, can you please tell me how much DMG 100 g costs in your country? In Ukraine price is $9 for can with HQ DMG 100g from Indian supplier





Ultrax said:


> Is it expensive? I'm just curious about a comparison, can you please tell me how much DMG 100 g costs in your country? In Ukraine price is $9 for can with HQ DMG 100g from Indian supplier.


I don't believe Ukraine is a poor country, the life level is very low in Ukraine this is the reason they could join European Union just after 20 years(this say a EU official member), hhhhhh the Ukrainian don't have money to buy food and they buy DMG with 9 euro only shipping from India for 100 gr package is around 20 euro,
I know Ukrainian people and I don't know why they must be always with one step before another people(9 euro hhhhh) but I perfect understand they come from poor places.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 22, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I don't believe Ukraine is a poor country, the life level is very low in Ukraine this is the reason they could join European Union just after 20 years(this say a EU official member), hhhhhh the Ukrainian don't have money to buy food and they buy DMG with 9 euro only shipping from India for 100 gr package is around 20 euro,
> I know Ukrainian people and I don't know why they must be always with one step before another people(9 euro hhhhh) but I perfect understand they come from poor places.


Ukraine is at war with Russia after Russia invaded them this spring.
They were at that time quite ok regarding wealth and development.
If my understanding is correct.
They are NOT a part of EU.

Your lack of knowledge baffles me sometimes.
It is almost a neighboring country, to Italy so you should know better.


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## Ultrax (Oct 22, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> I don't believe Ukraine is a poor country, the life level is very low in Ukraine this is the reason they could join European Union just after 20 years(this say a EU official member), hhhhhh the Ukrainian don't have money to buy food and they buy DMG with 9 euro only shipping from India for 100 gr package is around 20 euro, I know Ukrainian people and I don't know why they must be always with one step before another people(9 euro hhhhh) but I perfect understand they come from poor places.



Chemicals' price is a strange criterion to define the poverty level of the country, isn't it? In India, DMG costs less than $1. We have a different tax structure  We are the largest country in the European part of Eurasia continent. How long any other European country can resist Russia? 2 days or less?  So the problem of our "poverty" is a cruel bloody war. If we fall, the Russians will be on the Atlantic coast in a week 
We have a huge modern economy, but unfortunately also have a high level of corruption and not very effective ex-USSR-born managers  before Zelensky, of course. I really hope that this situation will change soon.

FYI: Ukraine's economy in 1991 was larger and richer than France's. On our territory, we have 25% of the most fertile lands on the Earth and had before 1994 the second nuclear weapon potential on the Earth (large than the US). Our territory is richer in minerals than South Africa.

We refused nuclear weapons in 1994, and how do you think why Russia attacked us? I mean real reasons, especially considering that 88% of Russian territory is uninhabited due to permafrost?


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## Ultrax (Oct 22, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> They are NOT a part of EU.


We are an official candidate for the EU, as far as I know. And by the way, our second motherland is Canada. More than 10% of Canadians are from Ukraine in the past


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## mythen10 (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> Chemicals' price is a strange criterion to define the poverty level of the country, isn't it? In India, DMG costs less than $1. We have a different tax structure  We are the largest country in the European part of Eurasia continent. How long any other European country can resist Russia? 2 days or less?  So the problem of our "poverty" is a cruel bloody war. If we fall, the Russians will be on the Atlantic coast in a week
> We have a huge modern economy, but unfortunately also have a high level of corruption and not very effective ex-USSR-born managers  before Zelensky, of course. I really hope that this situation will change soon.
> 
> FYI: Ukraine's economy in 1991 was large and richer than France's. On our territory, we have 25% of the most fertile lands on the Earth and had before 1994 the second nuclear weapon potential on the Earth (large than the US). Our territory is richer in minerals than South Africa.
> ...


Ukraine - Russia is a fake war please stop, and Ukraine is a country where mostly men people are ballerinas and gays, do you have a actor president where do you leave , Ukraine is a shame  look this girl have 13 years old and is Ukrainian and she ask people for money in new York she begging for money from 10 years age this is normal? Ukrainian people have a problem , this is the reason they start a imaginary war to get 
help clothes,money etc.


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## mythen10 (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> We are official candidate to EU as far as I know.


Ukrainian must work for money don't asking for help to another countrys


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 22, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> Ukrainian must work for money don't asking for help to another countrys


This is it, you are out. I will ban you shortly


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## mythen10 (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> We are official candidate to EU as far as I know.


are African countries which are more poore than Ukraine they need real help not Ukrainian people who can work and have water ,in Africa a lot of people don't have clothes and water and now Ukraine ask for help everywhere the country leadership are steal the money with this fake war about you talking, you don't have any shame?


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## mythen10 (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> We are an official candidate for the EU, as far as I know. And by the way, our second motherland is Canada. More than 10% of Canadians are from Ukraine in the past


67,000 children in Sub-Saharan Africa may die hungry look here and this is Ukraine Best Places to Visit in Ukraine According to CNN


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## orvi (Oct 22, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> ovi for your knowledge in the cities most of palladium salts have this colour red brick(orange/brown) when you will drop the palladium with chlorine you will get red brick no? and this red brick is not a orange brown colour like same frome the photos? and this is not all PALLADIUM HEXACHLORIDE , PALLADIUM CHLORIDE, AMMONIUM HEXACHLOROPALLADATE , ETC all this salts of pd have the colour red brick (wich is a red brown like my pd from photos ) I HOPE NOW YOU WILL DONT HAVE ANY COMMENTARY.
> and I try what you say I dissolve the contact I precipitate silver and I filter it and after I test the solution and the sncl is same black , I dilute the solution and test is black.
> A QUICK QUESTION, WHAT IT WAS IN YOUR MIND WHEN YOU SAY IS NOT EXIST RED BRICK PALLADIUM? ALL WE KNOW ABOUT RED BRICK PALLADIUM this from photo definitely is PALLADIUM RED BRICK SALT I BELIEVE IS PALLADIUM CHLORIDE OR HEXACHLORIDE(in solution I was have some HCl acid) SALTS WICH IT WAS CEMENTED OUT ON THE ALLUMINIUM FOIL WICH WAS ON THE STOVE.
> that is definitely red brick palladium hahaha or maybe you can't make the difference from colours and for you all forms all palladium are black hehhehe


We need to get things straight. Palladium and palladium salts are two different things. And yes, you are right, most of the palladium salts, tetrachloropalladates hexachloropalladates etc. are nicely coloured to all kinds of red. But not on aluminium surface  You can try to immerse aluminium foil or flat sheet Al into that solution, and it will erupt like mad and produce loads of greyish black precipitate of the more noble metals. Pd will certainly drop out on that aluminium foil or scoop immediately forming black surface layer. That is the thing why I do not believe the sludge is actually palladium compound. Or maybe yes, but i never saw compound of noble metal, which will stay intact on Al.


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## orvi (Oct 22, 2022)

This thread is going way far from what should be discussed here. No more responses from me here


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## MicheleM (Oct 22, 2022)

Yggdrasil said:


> This is it, you are out. I will ban you shortly


He should be banned forever. he is disrespectful towards everyone and everything.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 22, 2022)

orvi said:


> We need to get things straight. Palladium and palladium salts are two different things. And yes, you are right, most of the palladium salts, tetrachloropalladates hexachloropalladates etc. are nicely coloured to all kinds of red. But not on aluminium surface  You can try to immerse aluminium foil or flat sheet Al into that solution, and it will erupt like mad and produce loads of greyish black precipitate of the more noble metals. Pd will certainly drop out on that aluminium foil or scoop immediately forming black surface layer. That is the thing why I do not believe the sludge is actually palladium compound. Or maybe yes, but i never saw compound of noble metal, which will stay intact on Al.


Mythen10 has been banned, so he can't reply to this.


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## Ultrax (Oct 22, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> Ukrainian must work for money don't asking for help to another countrys


I personally don't need your money at all  Our weapons are not enough against Russia, so if NATO and US will not help to stop the Russian monster, then the Russians will come to kill and rape your people. And believe me, they will be crueler with your nation, because most of us have relatives with Russian roots, but you are not. It's really strange, that you don't understand that


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## Ultrax (Oct 22, 2022)

mythen10 said:


> Ukraine - Russia is a fake war please stop, and Ukraine is a country where mostly men people are ballerinas and gays, do you have a actor president where do you leave , Ukraine is a shame  look this girl have 13 years old and is Ukrainian and she ask people for money in new York she begging for money from 10 years age this is normal? Ukrainian people have a problem , this is the reason they start a imaginary war to get
> help clothes,money etc.



There are wonderful words written in the thirties of the 20th century by the Czech journalist, peace prize winner (post mortem), Julius Fučík: "Beware of the indifferent people because with their tacit consent that all evil on Earth is committed".


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> There are wonderful words written in the thirties of the 20th century by the Czech journalist, peace prize winner, Julius Fučík: "Beware of the indifferent people because with their tacit consent that all evil on Earth is committed".


Mythen was banned earlier, so he can't reply.


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## Ultrax (Oct 22, 2022)

I feel sorry for him. Evil people are often results of childhood trauma.


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## Yggdrasil (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> I feel sorry for him. Evil people are often results of childhood trauma.


I think he was mislead by people he trusted and then could not let go.
Anyway let us not discuss people that can not defend themselves.


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## justinhcase (Oct 22, 2022)

Ultrax said:


> I feel sorry for him. Evil people are often results of childhood trauma.


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## Shakey1 (Oct 23, 2022)

Hi, just a noob's 2 cents worth as I was following this topic until it went off the rails. I am so happy to hear that 10% of Ukrainian's now call my country home, I know that we have about 4 families in our apartment building alone but I also believe that most would rather be at home with their extended family and friends.


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