# Heating plate



## Aztec (Feb 21, 2016)

Hi I am wondering which one to get... Don't want to spend too much but I don't want to get the cheapest one and it only last for a few weeks...


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## Aztec (Feb 22, 2016)

Also have a other question. I have a friend works in a crematory. He sometimes gives me dental gold that already has been melted after the cremation process. 

So a few months ago I decided to melt it, and I added borax. The borax did clean it up, but I thought it would make it 24k gold. I didn't read enough lol. So now I have about 4-5 ingots of gold that's not 24k gold..

So now I'm here today. I'm buying some of the items, I'm reading trying to learn. I learn today urea is not the best method to use for Neutralizing nitric acid.

On the ingots that I have now, should I melt them smaller or should I do 1 whole ingot at the time when I'm ready for AR?

As far as metel content, I have no idea. When I get them, they are small gold round balls. I could test each one with a gold tester.


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## FrugalRefiner (Feb 22, 2016)

Aztec said:


> On the ingots that I have now, should I melt them smaller or should I do 1 whole ingot at the time when I'm ready for AR?


When you're trying to dissolve metals, the more surface area, the better, as it gives the acid more surface to work on. You can find more information by searching for "cornflake" or "granulate".

Dental gold usually has platinum group metals alloyed with the gold. Inquartation can go a long way toward separating the PGMs from the gold.

Hoke's book covers these subjects well. You'll find links in my signature line below.

Dave


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## nickvc (Feb 23, 2016)

Harold would be the one to tell you the way as he handled lots of dental material.
My advice would be to inquart with silver, there are many posts about this here on the forum, the reason been is that the silver becomes the carrier of any PGMs.
The finest piece of advice I can give you is to read and study before attempting any more recoveries or refining it will save you many headaches and frustration not to mention money and time.


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## Aztec (Mar 4, 2016)

Thanks for the replies!!!

Ok, I read about Inquartation. I'll go and do more reading. 


Also how do I find this Harold, lol?


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## jimdoc (Mar 4, 2016)

Aztec said:


> Also how do I find this Harold, lol?



Harold will find you.


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## nickvc (Mar 4, 2016)

Top right of your screen is the search button, type in what you want to know and add author...? Harold.
We find that politeness and humility pay the best results not barbed replies for pleas for help which have been answered.
We play a straight game here you get what you give, tell us what you think you know and we will tell you whether your right or wrong.
All you need to know is here and free but it takes some effort and time to find it, the choice is yours read and learn or smart mouth!


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## FrugalRefiner (Mar 4, 2016)

nickvc said:


> Top right of your screen is the search button, type in what you want to know and add author...? Harold.


Actually, his username is Harold_V.

Dave


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## nickvc (Mar 4, 2016)

Very polite Dave let's hope the OP gets the message...
If not his visit looks to be very short 8)


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## nickvc (Mar 4, 2016)

Sorry but I'm a great believer in manners and respect.
If you want help please be polite and humble and prove you deserve my or any other members time, the mods nor the members get paid... It's free all the time and only good nature makes us reply, you get the attitude wrong.... It's a long journey to learn what's here and very very expensive to learn and very hard without a helping hand and the knowledge of the members and the forum.
Newbies take note we are not a free all time all problem service, we will help if you follow the simple rules of the forum, read and learn then ask if you get confused or can't figure out a process or a reaction, otherwise keep reading and in time you can take the place of the few of us that bother to reply!


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## Harold_V (Mar 5, 2016)

Aztec said:


> Also how do I find this Harold, lol?


If one has need to converse with me, a PM will generally get my attention. I do not check the threads on the board on a regular basis, although I do check in each day to see that the board has no issues. 

By some twist of fate, I've read your comments. As has been said, I processed a lot of dental material through the years. So much that I managed to accumulate about 75 ounces of palladium and about the same amount of platinum, although some of the platinum came from other sources. 

One of my customers sent me bits that most certainly had come from a crematorium. A questionable way to obtain precious metals, as such material should be returned to the deceased's loved ones. To not do so is theft, plain and simple. You might consider making mention of that fact to your source. Might keep both of you out of jail. 

You are not prepared to achieve your goal, and, as you quickly discovered, melting gold with flux does not equate to refining gold. While minor changes do occur upon melting, without introduction of chlorine gas, the hopes of purifying gold by heat, alone, is futile. To that end, it is important for you to know and understand that chlorine gas is a killer, to say nothing of the process being beyond the scope of home refining. 

In order for you to prepare for the task that lies before you, it will require of you to do considerable studying, and an investment in some chemicals and lab ware. To that end, you should read Hoke's book until it makes sense to you, then you should start conducting the experiments she so nicely provided, so you become familiar with testing and the necessary procedures you must follow to recover all of the values. 

A word of caution. Testing isn't a luxury---it's ultra critical to the refiner, even well seasoned refiners. It's the only way you can assure yourself of the location of your values. If you pursue refining and do not invest in stannous chloride, DMG, ammonium hydroxide, Schwerter's solution, along with several other chemicals mentioned by Hoke, you will wear out your welcome quickly when you ask questions that make it obvious you have not paid attention to the instructions that have been provided for you.

One thing you may not learn from Hoke, although she does make mention, is that silver will become the carrier for your platinum metals, which will be recovered when the silver used is melted, cast as anode, and parted in a silver cell. That will concentrate the values such that they can then be recovered. 

Harold


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## justinhcase (Mar 5, 2016)

Crematoria operating conditions
The present position in the UK is outlined in the Defra guidance on the Waste Incineration Directive, (WID). at 850c requirement and concludes that this can be achieved by compliance with a) no increase in solid residues, and no increase in the TOC content of these residues, and b) compliance with WID emission limits, in particular that for carbon monoxide (CO). The Environment Agency is already considering this approach for A1 incinerators, as measurement of the residence time in an incinerator secondary combustion chamber is normally only possible at the design stage. Although WID does not apply to crematoria, compliance with the above criteria is seen as a requirement if derogation from the 2 seconds at 850c condition is to be granted.
The upgrading maintains the afterburner temperature at 850oC throughout the cremation cycle, including the period prior to the coffin being introduced to the unit and concluding when the cremation cycle is complete.
I would have thought that was pretty standard as people do not waste fuel with out need.
So it would seem to be a little bit low temperature to be melting any one's dental work, even with out adding flux to the body's of the dearly departed to aid in collection. 
I do not think your friend will thank you for mentioning his donation's in such a public forum, abuse of power and position is a very serious crime and from your explanation I do not think he has acted in a transparent manner with in his organisation or he would not still be employed.


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## Harold_V (Mar 5, 2016)

In the US, higher temperatures are mandated. They are high enough to melt both silver and gold alloys. 

According to Wiki,

Modern cremation process[edit]

The cremation occurs in a crematory that is housed within a crematorium and comprises one or more furnaces. A cremator is an industrial furnace that is able to generate temperatures of 870–980 °C (1,600–1,800 °F) to ensure disintegration of the corpse. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cremation

Harold


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## 4metals (Mar 5, 2016)

Harold said:


> A questionable way to obtain precious metals, as such material should be returned to the deceased's loved ones. To not do so is theft, plain and simple. You might consider making mention of that fact to your source. Might keep both of you out of jail.


This is being done by a good number of refiners in the US today, it is legal but some states have laws stating the undertaker (cremator or whatever) cannot profit from the proceeds. That is gotten around by making donations to the charity of their choosing, equaling the value of the refined metal (less refining charges) in the name of the undertaker (cremator or whatever). Giving obvious tax deductions to same for his or her generosity!


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## Aztec (Mar 12, 2016)

Oh ok I didn't not know that it was illegal. Not worth it.


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## Harold_V (Mar 13, 2016)

Aztec said:


> Oh ok I didn't not know that it was illegal. Not worth it.


Please take note of the comments provided by 4metals. That it is legal, or not, may be open to discussion. 

Regardless of the legality of the issue, I do question the morality. 

Harold


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