# Unknown results



## maynman1751 (Jan 26, 2012)

I have been recovering gold from pins, connectors, cell phone boards and other similar e-scrap. I'm using the AP method to eliminate base metals and collecting the foils, flakes and resulting powders. I have always rinsed the gold, after filtering, with HCL and then water rinses to clean. Also, anything that had ANY solder was first run in heated HCL. After completing my collection I ran the batch through another round of AP, for two days, just to make sure I was rid of base metals. I used heat and a bubbler. I then filtered and rinsed with boiling water. I put the gold into a beaker, added HCL, but when I added the Cl the solution turned a deep red! I dismissed this as a very pregnant solution (right or wrong!?) and after leaving it on a mild heat overnight, to rid the chlorine, added a teaspoon of SMB. I did get some precipitation but after 24hrs the solution was still 'cloudy' and had changed to a yellow/brown. I added more SMB, let it set with no change. I searched the forum and found several post about reddish solutions possibly being colloidal gold. I tried adding NaCl to a sample and also H2SO4 to another with no result. I then cemented the solution with Cu, rinsed the powder and tried to re-dissolve with HCl/Cl. It immediately returned to the deep red. I put a few drops on a crystal of FeSO4 and tested the resulting solution with SnCl. I have included pics of the solution before cementing with the stannous test and a pic of the sample with the stannous test. Both times the Q-tip was black, but I did notice that the Q-tip bled greenish like Palladium!!!??? Can anybody help me with this? :?


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## AlZabrisky (Jan 26, 2012)

Can someone who is qualified kindly help 
this young man please?

Thank you.

DrAl Zabrisky.


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## lazersteve (Jan 26, 2012)

Dilute a sample of the liquid with 5 parts water and test. Purple is Gold, orange that changes blue-green is Palladium.

DMG is a definitive test for Pd once you suspect it. After DMG has precipitated the yellow Pd salt from the solution your Gold stannous chloride test should be obvious.

Excess oxidizer can prevent precipitation of Gold as will a lack of water in the solution.

Steve


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## maynman1751 (Jan 27, 2012)

I forgot to mention that I did dilute the original solution 3x with water before precipitation. Steve, I diluted the new solution and retested and still got a very dark color. I don't have DMG, is there anything else that will precip. Palladium? What else can be done? Thanks, John.


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## Dr. Poe (Jan 27, 2012)

I believe that you have more palladium than gold. You did get both. I suggest that you clip the blackened cotton and test it with a few grains of soda ash on charcoal with a reducing flame. Dr. Poe


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## maynman1751 (Jan 28, 2012)

I'm relatively new to this 'hobby' and don't have the materials or knowledge to perform the test that you are suggesting. Dr. Poe, I do thank you for your response, however it is too far advanced for my level.


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## Dr. Poe (Jan 28, 2012)

maynman1751 said:


> I'm relatively new to this 'hobby' and don't have the materials or knowledge to perform the test that you are suggesting. Dr. Poe, I do thank you for your response, however it is too far advanced for my level.



Visit a local jeweler and ask for an old charcoal block. Scrap any gold remnants that may be on the block away.
Place a popcorn size sample of baking soda in the hollowed out region.
Place the cotton from the cotton swab into the baking soda.
Light a propane torch.
Aim the blue tip of the flame upon the baking soda and melt the soda.
Let it cool.
Examine the soda ball.
Can you see metallic gold flakes?
If yes, the test is positive for gold.
This test is considered geology 101, first week. Less advanced than the stannous chloride test that you made.
Dr. Poe 8)


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## rusty (Jan 28, 2012)

Dr. Poe said:


> maynman1751 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm relatively new to this 'hobby' and don't have the materials or knowledge to perform the test that you are suggesting. Dr. Poe, I do thank you for your response, however it is too far advanced for my level.
> ...




Dr. Poe would it be possible to substitute BBQ Briquettes for the Jewelers charcoal block.


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## Dr. Poe (Jan 28, 2012)

rusty said:


> Dr. Poe said:
> 
> 
> > maynman1751 said:
> ...



No, Rusty, charcoal briquettes contain a lot of sulfur. Sodium poly sulfide would form, dissolving small gold particles.
Charcoaled lumber will crack. Jeweler's charcoal blocks are pressure treated to insure no cracking. Dr. Poe


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## freechemist (Jan 31, 2012)

Hello maynman1751,

You definitely are in need of DMG. To me the picture of the solution in the beaker looks like a palladium-solution - I don't say it is Pd, only that it looks like, and I think there is no other way, than to test the solution with DMG, in my opiniom the best and most reliable way to have a clear result. - In addition your description of cementing the solution with copper, then redissolving the black powder with HCl/Cl, giving a red solution indicates to me strongly the presence of palladium.

If you want to precipitate gold from your brown solution, use oxalic acid in place of SMB. It will not volatilize, like SO2, especially if heated, and it will not affect dissolved palladium, in other words it drops gold selectively, as long as the mixture shows a strong acid reaction (pH2 or less). 

Regards, freechemist


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## maynman1751 (Feb 1, 2012)

Freechemist: Thank You for your reply. I know that I will need to get DMG sooner or later and now looks like the time. Your knowledge is appreciated. John.


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## frosty (Feb 4, 2012)

Hi, I am using aqua regia, Muriatic acid and Nitric acid, question How can I raise the ph or lower it???? also what should the ph be to precipitate the gold???? :roll: Yes: I did some cirt. boards, the color of the solution is brown, and the ph is .2 

I used urea, filtered then I used sodium Bisulfite for the precipitate but the gold doesn't drop.????? I tested the solution with stannous chloride and it shows brown. ??????? what should do. Thank You


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## Claudie (Feb 4, 2012)

What is Nicte acide? Did you put some Gold bearing material in this solution? If so, what did you put in it? We will need to know more before anyone can offer much help. The help is here, you have came to the right place to learn. The more you can tell us about what you have done, the better your chances are, of getting the help you need.


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## frosty (Feb 4, 2012)

I'm new to this < on the post I've been reading they say words like DMG,and SMG what does it mean.????????


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## Claudie (Feb 4, 2012)

DMG: http://www.goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=9477&p=91337&hilit=freechemist+dmg#p90800


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## Westerngs (Feb 4, 2012)

Frosty:

Are you sure you removed all nitric acid with the urea additions? If so, did you dilute with distilled water about 3-4 times the original volume?

Lastly, you want to use sodium metabisulfite (smb), not sodium sulfite.

Try again and report results.


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## Claudie (Feb 4, 2012)

When you go back and edit a previous post rather than replying to the answers you received, it confuses people like me. :| I would imagine that it will confuse others in the future.


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## butcher (Feb 4, 2012)

Westerngs,
Sodium sulfite will also generate SO2 gas in acidic solution and precipitate the gold.

Very good point, on making sure there was no free nitric in solution.

Partner, sells some DMG test solution's very reasonable.

From the description, (dissolving pins, connectors, cell phone boards and other similar e-scrap. I'm using the AP method to eliminate base metals and collecting the foils, flakes and resulting powders), this solution could be most anything, and testing would be a must.

If this rust red solution was just iron you would not want to waste your time trying to get nothing from it just by guessing what it is.


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## maynman1751 (Feb 5, 2012)

My first baby! Not much, but I'm pretty proud. This is what I finally ended up with from the red solution. I still have to check for Pd. This was an accummilation of small patches of low grade e-scrap. Just learning the ropes before I get into the more valuable materials. Baby steps first! Thanks to all who helped me along the way. John.


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## samuel-a (Feb 5, 2012)

John

Nice work.
The first one is always the best! treasure it


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## Mirza (Sep 21, 2015)

maynman1751 said:


> My first baby! Not much, but I'm pretty proud. This is what I finally ended up with from the red solution. I still have to check for Pd. This was an accummilation of small patches of low grade e-scrap. Just learning the ropes before I get into the more valuable materials. Baby steps first! Thanks to all who helped me along the way. John.




I have exactly the same problem ... how did you do it my friend?   This is my first post))))  i am beginner too


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## g_axelsson (Sep 21, 2015)

Mirza said:


> I have exactly the same problem ... how did you do it my friend?   This is my first post))))  i am beginner too


You start with doing the required reading. Follow the introduction, download Hoke, do some acquaintance experiments, research the processes on the forum before rushing in.

You will find that if you show that you put some work into learning the process many members will help you with the finer details, but if you just want to be fed instructions you will be met by silence.

The forum helps those that helps themselves.

"How did you do it" doesn't show any commitment to study, the forum is full of stories on how we did it. Just search and read.

Göran


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## Mirza (Sep 28, 2015)

g_axelsson said:


> Mirza said:
> 
> 
> > I have exactly the same problem ... how did you do it my friend?   This is my first post))))  i am beginner too
> ...



ok Axelsson thank you)


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