# sulfuric acid and sodium chloride



## markqf1 (Jan 22, 2008)

Has anyone had any experience with this process?
www.springerlink.com/content/u86602111231x520/


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## lazersteve (Jan 22, 2008)

Yes,

I purchased the article for $30 several months ago.

I've since tested the process on cats and successfully extracted Platinum and Palladium. I have not confirmed Rhodium extraction yet. 

I have emailed the author several times trying to get his precipitation techniques, but he has not responded. He does not cover precipitation in the article.

I have since begun developing my own precipitation routes for this method. I will share my results when they are finalized and confirmed by a second party.

*Anyone have a quick test for Rhodium in sulfate solutions combined with Pd and Pt?*

Steve


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## Lino1406 (Jan 22, 2008)

Maybe this:
After you precipitate Pt and Pd,
Add Na acetate for buffering
Add conc. NaNO2 for getting
the Rh-NO2 soluble complex;
At this point NH4OH should
give the unsoluble complex
expected color yell. brownish.
I'd appreciate back input


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## markqf1 (Jan 22, 2008)

Science at its best.
Thanks ,guys.


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## Lou (Jan 23, 2008)

Pity you bought it Steve, if it was published in any trade journal I could've got it for you free of charge.


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## Irons (Jan 23, 2008)

http://www.columbia.edu/~scb2001/tools/acetate/acetate.html


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## Anonymous (Feb 7, 2008)

So I take it this method won't work for gold? It seems too easy.


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## Lino1406 (Feb 7, 2008)

Won't work for gold


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## Froggy (Feb 8, 2008)

I'm liking those extraction rates! I will be keeping an eye out for more post on this thread,,,, Steve,Lou, Irons, can I move in your garage? Or next door? :lol: It would make things much more simple... Frog


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## Froggy (Feb 16, 2008)

Any news on this steve? Lou can you find any published iodide complex solutions that are not in an autoclave? Thx, Frog


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## markqf1 (Feb 16, 2008)

Frog,
What makes iodine stand out among the halides?
Is it more pgm friendly?


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## Anonymous (Feb 16, 2008)

works better than clorine and cost less than bromine, used to also be readily available.


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## Lou (Feb 16, 2008)

It does not cost less than bromine. That is not true. Bromine costs me about 3,3 cents a gram. If you can get iodine for 5 cents a gram, please tell me, because I am sure that I can make more money off of reselling iodine for it's usual price, a dollar per gram, than ever I could from refining.


I'll look into the iodine stuff Froggy. Off to literature land I go.


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## Froggy (Feb 16, 2008)

Spoke with the guy at advanced analytical, he likes resintech.com resins,, said Dow sucks. The bulliten I posted on resins called for bromide, ahhhh the choices!!!!! Decisions, decisions ..... I cant believe there are so many different ways to do this,how much I have read,and how i still dont know what the optimal solution is for what I want to do... Frog


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## lazersteve (Feb 17, 2008)

Frog,

I'm still in the very small scale testing stage with the sulfuric acid/halogen method. I've asked Lou via PM for some ideas on testing and precipitating the Rh from the solution.

I did run an new experiment with the cat that I had hit with the MAPP torch. I used hot HCl-Cl using 10% bleach, I was shocked to find that the pregnant solution contained only Pt and no Pd. I think the Pd was converted to an insoluble black powder when I initially added the HCl to the roasted cat. It all floated up thru the vanes in the honeycomb as soon as I added the HCl. I collected this black powder for more tests. I don't think it's carbon due to the lack of any visible carbon after roasting. Any ideas? I'll be dropping the Pt from the solution in a day or so.

I'm also going to run the honeycomb again to see if it gives a second yield.

I still like Lou's halogen gas extraction idea best.

Steve


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## Anonymous (Feb 17, 2008)

Lou, your right on the price. Been awhile since I used iodine for anything.
The other reason is bromine is a liquid at room temp and if I am not mistaken also evaporates at room temp.


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## Lou (Feb 17, 2008)

Oh heck yeah it does, very volatile. But it beats the hell out of chlorine for convenience in use (chlorine cylinders cost a lot, so does the regulator) since I can warm the bromine in a flask to give more pressure and volume, and is absolutely legal to own as a private individual unlike iodine. 


If I get to it this weekend, I should have some very nice pictures of a monstrous bromine synthesis. I'll show you all how to make bromine at home, safely, and cheaply.

By the way, if you want bromide, try the pool supply. It's 14 dollars a pound, so you're paying through the teeth, but you'll get some. Ebay it's usually half of that, and if you really want a lot of it, I have a friend that I think has 100lbs of it for $5/lb or something like that.

Lou

PS-Steve, I'm going to be looking into some off the shelf type stuff for rhodium testing. If I can't find anything suitable, I will look around and see what I can't find of my own chemicals.


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## Froggy (Feb 17, 2008)

http://cgi.ebay.com/Thermo-ARL-MDL-3410-ICP-Mass-Spectrometer_W0QQitemZ270211619813QQihZ017QQcategoryZ67038QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem theres acouple of them around, wish someone here on the forum had one and took pity on us fools!


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## Lou (Feb 17, 2008)

Sorry, but just because the thing powers up does not mean it works!!!!! Also, what do they mean by powers up? What if there are parts missing, the mirrors scratched? Does it come with the computer that has all of the software for analysis installed? No, I think not.

The seller doesn't seem to have much knowledge of the unit so they are not in a position to determine if it's even still functional. It might be attractively priced (believe me when I saw the price, I was very excited--til I read the description) but if it were defective in any way, the cost of fixing it could be well over 3 or 4 times the cost of the unit at 9K. 'Cause then you have to pay 400 dollars an hour, plus travel, lodging, expenses, and meals for a trained specialist to come service it. I've seen and had experiences there (for instance, one PE fellow loved to talk politics and the environment--fine by me, but don't do it on your PAID time!).


And the biggest turn off; "Return Policy Details: All items sold are "as is, where is". Description given as guide and should only be used for reference."


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## Froggy (Feb 17, 2008)

I am active in a 501(3c) charity, I emailed and asked them (several listings) if it doesnt sell if they would want a write off! I will send it to you if I get one..... Hey , doesnt hurt to ask...


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## Lou (Feb 17, 2008)

I'll keep my fingers crossed.


I've been wanting to compile a list of platinum and PGM contain lab apparatus for you all here. Looking through the laboratory, I've seen ounces of platinum...in electrodes, in foils, in crucibles, in wires, in combustion boats, surface tensiometers etc.


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## Froggy (Feb 17, 2008)

Sounds like I need to enroll at several of the junior colleges in chemistry for a day! :lol:


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## markqf1 (Feb 18, 2008)

Be sure to rent an expedition for the ride to and from.


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## Anonymous (Feb 22, 2008)

Steve,

Are you leaching your honeycomb whole? I was under the impression that it all had to be crushed up real fine to expose all the pgm's. Maybe I misunderstood when you said "It all floated up thru the vanes in the honeycomb as soon as I added the HCl." I'm still trying to learn all I can about this and would love to see your dvd about pgm's. Please let me know when it comes out.

Thanks,

Richard


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## lazersteve (Feb 22, 2008)

I've leached honeycombs whole and crushed, I had better results with the whole ones. The crushed ones tend to bunch together and protect the material from the acid. The whole ones let the liquid pass thru and get to the surface metals. I think the crushed material will have high yields, but I haven't done enough to know for sure.

Steve


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## markqf1 (Feb 24, 2008)

Steve,
I think the key is to keep the crushed material agitated and suspended.
I'm working on it.

Mark


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