# I just found you guys on the net and would like your opinion



## chipperchop (May 28, 2008)

I just found you guys on the net and would like your opinion of people of your educational level on this subject..

So we acquired some sulfide ore.. stats are as follows and dont know what to do for the next step
sell , set up production, capital needed, creditable refineries that can deal with PGM?

how or who do we take this to production?
or sell to ?
in what state/form ?

Thanks
Chip


Type: Hand-picked secondary crushed sulfide ore
Amount: 500 tn (+/-)
Contents: Platinum Group Metals = Pt/Pd/Rh// Au/Ag

Preliminary Bench Test Assay (minimum) Recovery Results:

Au (Gold) 28.2 troy oz/tn
Pt (Platinum) 48.0 troy oz/tn
Pd (Palladium) 41.8 troy oz/tn
Rh (Rhodium) 57.9 troy oz/tn


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## Rag and Bone (May 29, 2008)

Sell. And retire to the beaches of Jupiter. First-Class. With Moon-Bitches.


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## Noxx (May 29, 2008)

chipperchop said:


> (minimum) Recovery Results:
> Au (Gold) 28.2 troy oz/tn
> Pt (Platinum) 48.0 troy oz/tn
> Pd (Palladium) 41.8 troy oz/tn
> Rh (Rhodium) 57.9 troy oz/tn



What !? :shock: lol


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## Lou (May 29, 2008)

Who did your assay?

That much rhodium automatically pushes me toward incredulity.


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

No really do you have any knowledge on creditable refineries/ buyers on ore of this nature ?

If so let me know we would be willing to pay a finders fee for finding us the connection that makes this come to fruition.

also we have a large place gold mine that we will be taking into production this year and or selling.
1.4m Provable and 2.5 Probable 
equating to provable 700,000 tr/oz 
that is on 2 of our 38 mining claims 

we are the investors 
we are not set up to do the processing if anyone has any connections let us know


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

we have a assay by johnson and associates we have one by georiga tech, we have one by the independent 3rd party over seas that I can not recall the name of - we have 2 more coming in from Ledoux and 

But do inform us why you come to such conclusion of incredulity. we are open to understanding why. and in particular from party's that deal with these minerals on a daily basis like you guys.

Thanks 
Chip


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## Harold_V (May 29, 2008)

chipperchop said:


> But do inform us why you come to such conclusion of incredulity.


My humble opinion only. I have no credentials. 

The platinum group of metals are not known for high grade deposits, particularly in the US. 

Something for you to consider: Gold that runs 1 oz/ton is considered high grade ore. Mines in operation today are commonly processing ores that range well under ¼ oz./ton. 

If you had a quantity of ore that yielded anywhere near the numbers you have quoted, you wouldn't have to seek help-----it would have come to you-----long ago. 

Me thinks I smell a rat. 

On the subject of hard to believe-------there is a planet about 50 light years from Earth that is reputed to be a huge diamond (2,300 miles in diameter), likely the core of a star at one time. 

Ask for details if you're interested. 

Harold


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

Harold_V said:


> If you had a quantity of ore that yielded anywhere near the numbers you have quoted, you wouldn't have to seek help-----it would have come to you-----long ago.
> 
> Harold



I appreciate your comments and that is not the first time we have heard that from an educated mind like yours but that is also why we have requested to get the additional 3 assays done on the ore.
if you have some one that is credible we would be willing to sample to them to get feedback.

we do not want to keep pulling the product as we have 5 samples out now getting assayed

but if you can come up with someone that you think is above the rest please let us know 


Thanks 
Chip


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

ps we just got those assays done on the product recently as well as requesting the new ones - the ore has now been transfered to our secure facility locally and we are now ready to move on it...


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## Oz (May 29, 2008)

How did you get your samples? Point being that it would not be the first time someone put something in a sample that wasn’t originally there so you may be excited and buy. Only later finding out that somehow after you bought the source of the ore it did not assay the same. Having said that, there are others on here that can tell you how to get proper samples for you to have assayed.

Out of curiosity what did you pay per ton for this ore?


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

I went down and got the samples - i did not know what I was doing but grabbed some off the sparkling floor some off the top of the pile some down 50 feet towards the end of the pile and some deep in the middle with a shovel ...

I do not know if this is right or unacceptable but I was trying to be non biased


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

we have obtained it through one of our other deals involving 300m pot ash / oil lease deal so we are actually not into the ore too much- without looking at the financial's I would say approx 50-100m


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## Harold_V (May 29, 2008)

I just noticed you are from Utah. I, too, hail from the state, although I've been gone for more than a dozen years. Salt Lake Valley, in fact. You?

Seems to me you have a good source of information right in your back yard. Surely, you've heard of Johnson-Matthey? West on 21st South, if memory serves. 

They are refiners, and may not be able to deal with your ore, but assuming you're on the level, they certainly could provide a recommendation of the proper smelter that could handle the material. 

A word of advice. 

Do NOT trust anything but a fire assay. Regardless of the BS that is promoted these days, if it will fire assay, it will, likewise, produce. 

Harold


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

Harold_V said:


> I just noticed you are from Utah. I, too, hail from the state, although I've been gone for more than a dozen years. Salt Lake Valley, in fact. You?
> 
> Seems to me you have a good source of information right in your back yard. Surely, you've heard of Johnson-Matthey? West on 21st South, if memory serves.
> 
> ...



Yep SLC Valley 
That is funny I found them online tonight and asked my partners about johnson matthey and one of them said that they are influence by the qween and the EU and they are convinced that there are no PT metals coming out of the USA - this is word of mouth but yes I would like to submit it to them or get a recommendation from them.

one of our partners goes way back in the old timer mining industry and is very paranoid of JM 

Yes we have been approached about fire, chemical, nuclear ect...

Thanks for the info ill let you know how it goes


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## chipperchop (May 29, 2008)

here are some little guys [/img]


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## Harold_V (May 29, 2008)

I'm from Midvale, but lived in Taylorsville for several years. My last address was on Creek Road, the old unincorporated Union area. That's where I processed precious metals. 

While I'm not implying anything about you, I recall all too well when Utah was recognized as the fraud capital of the investment world. Don't know where they stand today. 

Interesting that one of your partners is suspicious of JM-----I have dealt with a few major refiners and have precious little to say about them that might be construed as positive. I found that each of them is dishonest in one way or another. Surprisingly, if you were to do a search on this forum for comments I made previously, JM is one that I suspected of being more upstanding. 

It stands to reason that everyone that has dealt with precious metals has, at some point in time, been well worked over by others. It seems that humans in general are unwilling to play fair when a dollar is involved. 

JM and their concept of the Pt metals not being available in quantity isn't based on their attitude. It's based on what is known by science at this point in time. The US continent is not known for platinum deposits-----although they are to be found in small quantities in many locations. You likely know that Kennecott produces the pt group metals, albeit in very small quantities, dwarfed by their gold and silver production. 

I processed some sand from the southern desert and detected gold, palladium and platinum. Problem is, you could work yourself into oblivion and not make any money. 

I have serious doubts about the report you posted. I am particularly troubled by the huge amount of rhodium you claim. I'll be watching to see how this thing shakes out. 

Harold


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## goldsilverpro (May 29, 2008)

The last time I saw huge assay numbers like that was in a con involving the fines from a gravel operation in Arizona. Some suckers from my home town had put money into it. There was no way I could talk them out of it. Greed often overcomes logic in these situations. 

I agree with Harold. The smell of a rat is overpowering. The odds of this being real are slim to none. I think there has to be some aspect of this that you're failing to see. Concern yourself with the possible negatives instead of the positives. Is there any possible way sleight of hand could have been used - think back? Did you personally box up the samples and send them to the assayers? Did the samples ever leave your sight? Did your group grind the samples or, did the assayer do it? Is the rock indigenous to that area? If there are shenanigans, they likely involve the samples.

Con men use the Hitler approach. If you make the lie big enough, people (investors) will believe it.


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## Anonymous (May 29, 2008)

all of them precious metals and no silver?

Nearly one million dollars per ton? Wow.


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## JustinNH (May 29, 2008)

Are you sure those numbers are oz and not grams? 
Thats some very rich ore...


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## Gotrek (May 30, 2008)

That surprised me as well as most assay's are done in Grams per ton not ounces per ton.


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## goldsilverpro (May 30, 2008)

I would disagree. Every ore assay I have ever seen was in tr.oz./ton. Most every ore assay starts by weighing out 29.166 grams of sample (or, some fraction of this weight). This weight is called an "assay ton". It was chosen to eliminate a need for calculations at the end of the assay. There are 29,166 tr.oz in a ton. Therefore, the number of milligrams in the final gold bead weight represents the gold in tr.oz./ton. For example, if the final gold bead weight was .0013 grams, the assay would be 1.3 tr.oz./ton. If the bead weight was .000035, the assay is .035 tr.oz./ton. They even have special "assay ton" metal weights.

http://www.assaying.org/AssayTon.htm


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## Gotrek (May 30, 2008)

Maybe it's a canadian thing. (Doubt it you're probably right) the Samples I've had assayed have been in grams per ton but the quantity of metal was low.


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## lazylightning (May 30, 2008)

Every time I try to give this guy some advice, my Internet Explorer closes. This morning when I opened the site Norton caught a downloader virus and after a minute it caught another something, but obviously the virus turned off the message itself before I could read it. Now I got a virus and I can nolonger automatically enter this site.


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## lazylightning (May 30, 2008)

Call it paranoia but I've seen moments when paranoia is just a pro- optimistic denial of the obvious, and I'm having dejavu


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## Shecker (May 30, 2008)

This looks exactly like an ore that I am developing. Very high values in Rh and Ru, but very low values in Pt and none in Pd. My ore is a chloride based material which makes for some interesting confusion over extraction methods. In dealing with the sulfate salts the best way I have found is to follow the advice of a metallurgist I know: Sulfates to leach chlorides and chlorides to leach sulfates.

Incidentally, Harold_V, several years ago I read a USGS report (cannot remember which one) that stated that while America lacks platinum and palladium ores, it is in fact blessed in ores of the other platinum group metals -- particularly ruthenium. The problem is recognizing them and finding markets for them. I am working with a fabricator of high purity salts to develop a market for my material, but it has taken four years to get it this far.

I have another ore body that was assayed by Kennecott in Salt Lake City at gold, 35 oz/ton, platinum, 42 oz/ton, palladium 12 oz/ton, rhodium 6 oz/ton, and iridium 578 oz/ton. Such deposits do in fact exist. The deposit I am currently developing averages 200-225 oz/ton pt, a similar amount of rhodium, and 500-750 oz/ton ruthenium. But the nature of these deposits makes them highly complex, otherwise we would all be rich.

Randy in Gunnison


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## goldsilverpro (May 30, 2008)

The tr.oz./ton thing is probably just in the U.S., where they use a short ton and are not on the metric system.

All of these big numbers are making me light headed. The dollar value of anything is only what you can sell it for.


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## lazylightning (May 30, 2008)

I've heard of more concentrated ores, but usually in much smaller deposits.

I'd recheck that pile of ore with a tomcat instead of a shovel, if someones salting it they could go through alot of trouble to bilk hundreds of millions of dollars. Then get your own ball mill and do your own little tests without the knowledge of partners, wives or anyone that could possibly be recruited


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## lazylightning (May 30, 2008)

For that kind of money highly trained proffesional intelligence types could easily be involved in luring and steering.

For that kind of money, obviously it's more profitable to extract it yourself to at least some degree, so setting up a small simple lab to see if you can get any out yourself would seem advisable. It's not a difficult science to learn. Just isolate your lab from anybody connected to the deal.


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## lazylightning (May 30, 2008)

so no matter how many times I check the arrow to automatically log me in, I have to manually type it in again. That began just today and my comp was attack just when I opened this site and was autologged in this morning. I open other sites and forums that I was always autologged onto and I have no problem. I auto-log in as usual. Why this site only? Is this new post somehow connected? Maybe there is someone trying to steer this gentleman and has arrange some cyber attack on this site? Is anybody else having this problem or is it an unrelated coincidence?


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## Shecker (May 30, 2008)

The only person who salted my deposit is God.  

Randy in Gunnison


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## Irons (May 30, 2008)

lazylightning said:


> so no matter how many times I check the arrow to automatically log me in, I have to manually type it in again. That began just today and my comp was attack just when I opened this site and was autologged in this morning. I open other sites and forums that I was always autologged onto and I have no problem. I auto-log in as usual. Why this site only? Is this new post somehow connected? Maybe there is someone trying to steer this gentleman and has arrange some cyber attack on this site? Is anybody else having this problem or is it an unrelated coincidence?



They own the Stillwater mine as well.

http://www.nornik.ru/en/


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## jimdoc (May 30, 2008)

lazylightning,
I have been getting a trojan horse warning the last few days on this
forum, I click heal and hope it is fixed on the warning popup. It happens
when I first log on then return to the main forum page from any of the other pages.
Jim


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## lazersteve (May 30, 2008)

lazylighning,

This has been going on for a while on and off. Just use the address http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/index.php instead of the main page.



Steve


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## Scott2357 (May 30, 2008)

Steve,

That link does it too. The virus is HTML_IFRAME.OK


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## JustinNH (May 30, 2008)

Shecker said:


> The only person who salted my deposit is God.
> 
> Randy in Gunnison



haha :wink:


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

They own the Stillwater mine as well. 

http://www.nornik.ru/en/

Do you think it's these guys? I doubt it, though they might be in Utah too. I must say, scams are not in their style though


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

they are a really big operation, and scammin someone for a measly 500 million is not at all their profile. Potanin - the owner was smart enough to break ties with Berezovsky as Abromovich had done many years before. Potanin sponsors an "adult" cartoon channel here that has lots of people riled up.


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

So I found the reference and saw something interesting at http://www.nornik.ru/our_products/stillwater_mining_company/

You can notice that since 2003 when Potanin bought 55% of the stocks of Stillwater, the amount of Pt and Pd has decreased


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

defecit in official production quantities being an important tool to guarantee higher prices, can work hand in hand with actual covert increases in production that are easily absorbed and left unnoticed on the market due to the large demand and materialization of massive Indian and Chinese economies


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

Ooops, that virus didnt let me post again, it's mad ;D

So as I tried to write before:

Those tricky devils! I know about Russian science and industry, and they could have easily increased production, even when nobody else could. That would have reflected poorly on world prices though, if it would be published. So perhaps they're doing the right thing.


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

Most important is that the original people ther all get to keep their jobs, have good pay and a nice working atmosphere.


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

I'm sure they will be very careful not to piss anyone off, because they're a Russian company that bought out a US company, though a Japanese or some other company might not go out of their way to make the most humane type of relations.


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## Irons (May 31, 2008)

lazylightning said:


> I'm sure they will be very careful not to piss anyone off, because they're a Russian company that bought out a US company, though a Japanese or some other company might not go out of their way to make the most humane type of relations.



I wonder if the workers at the Stillwater mine have learned old Soviet work ethic:

We pretend to work and they pretend to pay us. 8)


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## lazylightning (May 31, 2008)

Irons said:


> lazylightning said:
> 
> 
> > I'm sure they will be very careful not to piss anyone off, because they're a Russian company that bought out a US company, though a Japanese or some other company might not go out of their way to make the most humane type of relations.
> ...



Ah, I see you don't know about old Soviet work ethics in precious metals mines. It's like this: "We pretend we're just pretending to work so they don't get suspicious" 

I knew a guy who's dad worked as the night guard in a nugget rich mine up in Yakutia. He had some stories to tell. Only later when the Soviet Union fell apart dit it become possible to actually do something with it though


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## butcher (May 31, 2008)

This looks to me to be a pyrite, gold in small amounts is usually associated with pyrites, sulfide ore, the amounts you are suggesting are almost unheard of, (too good to be true), and if that high of value I don’t think it would resemble Iron pyrite, also you would need to assay from more than one portion or section of body of ore. Not just one chunk of rich looking ore, several assay differing points of the mine, it would be a loosing battle to buy a mine and invest time and money on one small piece of rich looking ore, while tons of ore from the mine are almost worthless, I would be very cautious with this, as long as there have been miners and investors there has been seeding and swindling,


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## markqf1 (Jun 1, 2008)

I agree with butcher, it looks like pyrite.
I don't mean to jump onboard with all of the naysayers but, I would certainly walk very slowly with this one. If I were convinced of the values in this ore , I think that I would be looking for the rim of a meteorite crater or maybe even the remnants of a space ship from another world.  

Then on the other hand, .... I would be interested in a small sample to do some testing myself. If your interested, pm me.

Mark


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## Irons (Jun 1, 2008)

markqf1 said:


> I agree with butcher, it looks like pyrite.
> I don't mean to jump onboard with all of the naysayers but, I would certainly walk very slowly with this one. If I were convinced of the values in this ore , I think that I would be looking for the rim of a meteorite crater or maybe even the remnants of a space ship from another world.
> 
> Then on the other hand, .... I would be interested in a small sample to do some testing myself. If your interested, pm me.
> ...



All you have to do is dig out the Rhodium shielding and haul it to the refinery.


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## lazylightning (Jun 2, 2008)

Oh, it's a mine? I must have misread the first few posts. I thought he said it is 500 tons of already mined ore that they have moved to a storage area.


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## markqf1 (Jun 2, 2008)

I stand corrected.
You read the first few posts correctly.
Mmmm, ... where would someone get such rich ore?


Mark


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## Harold_V (Jun 2, 2008)

The answer to that is pretty simple. You wouldn't. Regardless of how much people would like to dream, or regardless of how stupid some may think people were that went before us, to expect that such a high grade ore went unrecognized is absurd. 

The likelihood that anyone finds an ore deposit that rivals the one claimed borders on the impossible, at least here in the US. We simply are not known for the production of the platinum group of metals. 

I'm open to anything I can be shown to prove the opposite. 

Harold

edit: corrected typo


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## istari9 (Jun 3, 2008)

Harold Lets go looking for the sky diamond you have spoken of!!! 
We could get rich!


Ray


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## Irons (Jun 3, 2008)

istari9 said:


> Harold Lets go looking for the sky diamond you have spoken of!!!
> We could get rich!
> 
> 
> Ray



When I collect enough Rhodium to provide radiation shielding for the starship, I'll let you know.


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## chipperchop (Jun 3, 2008)

I will let you know when all the assays come back. 

Sounds like there are some doubts that it "looks" like Pyrite. I just meet a guy out here in utah (thanks to you guys) and just grabbed a hand full of dirt and stuffed it in a ziplock and he had some kind of 4inch long adjustable magnifying glass tool. and he said there is high concentration gold in there and showed me some big chunks, also silver and said he would have to send it in to see the PMG.

the silver was not on the assay we posted - because we did not have it tested for.

as for it being salted I don't believe so I watched the company bring int in and dump in our warehouse and the tractors moving siring and dumping it into large piles


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## markqf1 (Jun 3, 2008)

Good luck and keep us posted of the results.

Mark


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## JustinNH (Jun 3, 2008)

Yeah, definately interested in how this plays out...


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## Froggy (Jun 23, 2008)

Hey, wheres my one ton sample? The last sample shipment I recieved was from the moon and it just wound up being rock,, Geez! NO CHEESE! And I was looking to make a delicious swiss fondu'.......


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## Seamus (Jun 28, 2008)

I would like to know what planet you got that meteorite from. They don't call it precious metals or RARE earth metals for nothing. If it was that easy to find, I would have put a claim on that meteor myself. Keep your claim top secret. In fact, hide it from the government. They are looking for easy street themselves.
Do you know how many coma's are needed to assay a ton at that rate.


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## Shecker (Jun 29, 2008)

There is a guy way up in Northern Canada who believed there was diamonds in that country. He searched for 30 some years, but now Canada is marketing it's own diamonds with lazar etched polar bears on them. Persistence pays off. And platinum group, like gold, is where you find it.
That which has not been serious sought in America will not be found in America. I once meant the brother of the finder of the Stillwater Complex.
He sent tends of thousands of dollars on assays that said zero, zero, and more zeros, and years of his life before he interested Prof. Hollingsworth of the University of Montana to examine the material under a scanning electron microscope. The Prof found a pt-rh-as mineral, named it for himself and the rush was on. But all assays up to that point from multiple labs showed nothing but zeros. Now of course they show values.

The material shown does indeed like like pyrite -- but pyrite is one of the main sulphide carriers of precious metals. To be precise it looks more like an arsenide and they are well known carriers of pgm's, particularly when cubic in shape. Normal arsenopyrite is dipyramidal in shape.
No such thing in Utah? I know where there is a 30 miles long structure in Utah that carries gold and pgm's (most ruthenium) We did a fire assay on this material and recovered a huge black feathery bead. Why am I not working this deposit? Let us just say that government officials are extremely anti-mining and I don't have the resources to challenge them in court.

Pgm's must be searched for to be found. I even known where pgm's are eroding out of the sedimentary rock in which they were originally deposited. Why am I not working that -- too many other things to do.
I am working two pgm bearing mineral sources here in Colorado (although one of these from the South American platina belt). I ain't even going to say how I have access to tons of old Spanish pgm bearing material that they couldn't smelt and just throw it away.

Randy in Gunnison


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## markqf1 (Jun 29, 2008)

From what I'ved Learned, Fire assay's of pgm materials are unreliable for several reasons, which I couldn't begin to explain here.
Certain collecters are needed for certain things, gold being the best for pgm's.
According to a post Lou made on a different thread, practically all of the gold is fully recoverable.


I agree, If you don't look for it, you won't find it.

Mark


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