# Micro stripping cell



## bmgold2 (Jan 28, 2014)

Since my quantities of gold bearing materials are very limited and I don't want to end up with a lot of waste to figure out what to do with, I decided to make a miniature version of LaserSteve's sulfuric stripping cell.

What I did was use a small glass candle holder that I got from the Dollar store and a lead cathode that I had made several years ago when I first joined this forum but never used. The cathode was bent over the edge of the square glass container and I added around a half a cup of concentrated sulfuric acid (Liquid Fire drain cleaner).

With my very small pile of gold plated pins and wires I processed them in this micro sized device one by one until I was left with only the ones that didn't have enough non-plated sections left to grip with the alligator clip. These will have to wait until I have enough to buy a piece of copper mesh from Steve.

Each pin only took between a second and maybe a few seconds to completely strip. I am happy I didn't try processing them in AP which would have taken longer and produced much more waste. My sulfuric acid is very dark now but I expect it to clear back up as the gold settles out. It will be a long time before I have enough powder to worry about recovering the gold but now I know the process works and will slowly gather up more material to run through the cell. In the meantime, I only have the half cup of acid to store instead of jars or buckets of used AP.

I used a variable voltage/current power supply I had from a plating project which has a maximum current of 3 amps. For this small cell that was plenty. I didn't try it but I think even a cheap wall wart type power supply would have worked or the normal car battery charger. Doing 1 pin at a time I never went over 1 amp and most only took 10-30 mA for the second or two it was deplating.

I'm not saying everyone should start this small but for the many beginners like me with limited materials to process this seems to work. You wouldn't want to run pounds of pins at a time in such a small cell but for a test device I'm happy with how it turned out. It may be all I ever need unless this becomes more than just a hobby/learning experience.

My candle holder didn't come with a cover so I plan to store my used acid in a jar and the lead cathode in another one with distilled water. You might notice that I had my micro cell in a plastic gold pan just in case anything spilled. It didn't but better safe than sorry. Concentrated sulfuric acid is some scary stuff and now it has a little gold powder in it so I don't want it to get away IF something goes wrong. I know nobody likes being told over and over but BE CAREFUL.

Thanks LaserSteve and everyone on this forum. I can't believe I waited this long to try the stripping cell.


----------



## solar_plasma (Jan 28, 2014)

I believe the temperature could get faster out of control with this tiny amount of sulfuric, maybe a glass thermometer would serve well. Just a thought. I at least feel better having an eye at the termperature.


----------



## FrugalRefiner (Jan 28, 2014)

I like it! Can you give us an idea of the size of your little candle holder? There's nothing there to compare it's size to.

Dave


----------



## bmgold2 (Jan 28, 2014)

Sorry about not mentioning any dimensions. The candle holder is around 2-3/4" (close to 7 cm for the metric readers) square at the top and 3" (~7.5 cm) high.




I haven't used it long enough to raise the temperature any noticeable amount. If I can find a stick-on thermometer that sounds like a good idea especially IF I ever try using a copper mesh basket.

You should be able to see from this picture that the acid did get much darker. I'm still waiting for it to settle out but I'm thinking about ripping another board apart and get a few more pins to run through it before I put it away. Most of what I had were from plastic connectors and took some time to get to the pins but that's where the majority came from. The little plated fingers that made contact with a card (like a credit card) seemed to have the most gold on them but there was only 6 or 8 of those on each board I got to scrap. Some came from an old CD drive also. There's not a lot in each device but they should eventually add up if I keep at it.


----------



## solar_plasma (Jan 28, 2014)

Cut off all silver coloured parts, only use fully goldplated, - that may save some time and make it more effective. I guess you need at least to run 100-200g of this lowgrade stuff (even if close cut) to get a noticable amount of gold. A noticable amount would start with 0,3g from my point of view.


----------



## FrugalRefiner (Jan 28, 2014)

solar_plasma said:


> Cut off all silver coloured parts, only use fully goldplated


Since he's only stripping one pin at a time, leaving the non gold plated portion gives him a place to attach his alligator clip without having to dip the clip into the acid.

Dave


----------



## bmgold2 (Jan 28, 2014)

solar_plasma said:


> Cut off all silver coloured parts, only use fully goldplated, - that may save some time and make it more effective. I guess you need at least to run 100-200g of this lowgrade stuff (even if close cut) to get a noticable amount of gold. A noticable amount would start with 0,3g from my point of view.



I was purposely leaving as much silver colored part on each pin so I had something to grip with the alligator clip. I didn't want to dip the clip in the acid. If/when I switch to a copper mesh basket I can cut the pins down smaller to leave mostly gold plated parts. Looks like I've got a long ways to go before I get any amount of powder. I didn't weigh my pins before running them but I'd guess I ran a gram or two so far. Eventually I'll get enough to try to melt it into a tiny button. So far all of my experiments have been small scale and I don't have enough to try melting yet. I'm assuming that the powder from this cell will still need refined to make sure there isn't any copper or nickel in it.


----------



## pgms4me (Jan 28, 2014)

Good post1 I have been using a 12oz pyrex beaker for my cell,which is nearly the same dimensions(except round of course). I use a fixed 5 volt dc power supply, 2" wide lead strip on one side and it works super. I have done a lot of larger pins and connector pins with this and it takes almost an hour to get warm enough(40 deg. C for me).I let it cool and go do something else for a half hour. i could set a second one up and alternate them,but I have plenty of other things to do.


----------



## sharkhook (Jan 28, 2014)

I am working on a cell now with a dish similar to lasersteves, but the dish is only two cups. It came with a lid from WalMart for just under $4. I have another container that is 4x4 and 5 1/2 inches deep. I have everything ready except the power supply. I do like that micro cell for some of the lower grade pins though. The long ones with just a tip of plating to them should be fairly easy in a cell that small. Any more information on your power supply? Keep us informed, I am very interested in it.

Edit: I like the effort to your experiment!


----------



## bmgold2 (Jan 29, 2014)

The power supply I used is a (HY1503D) like the one on this site:

http://toolboom.com/en/DC-Power-Supply-LCD-display-0-15V-0-3A-HYelec-HY1503D.php

Mine came with a nickel plating class I took. I don't think you really need this type of power supply but I had it so I'm using it. One benefit to this type of regulated power supply is I can set the voltage or the current to whatever I want up to the 3 Amp limit. For my first try with my cell I just set it to 12 volts and the current depended on how much gold was being de-plated. One pin at a time I never seen it go above 1 Amp. I'm sure the power as well as the heat will go up when I do more quantity at a time with a copper mesh basket. 

I did gather up a few more pins to run through this little cell but I haven't done any more yet. I'm waiting until I have more before setting it back up. I put the acid into a sealed jar to keep it from absorbing water from the air although being winter here, there isn't much humidity in the air. I did notice that the small amount of gold (black powder) I got from the small amount of pins run so far did NOT settle out. Shouldn't matter since there isn't much gold in it yet. I'll just keep using it until it gets full or gets diluted and starts dissolving copper before worrying about recovering the gold.


----------



## sharkhook (Jan 29, 2014)

I know this is not a large cell but it has encouraged me to work on mine. After beating my head against a wall all morning, I have a power supply almost ready. Need to pick up a few minor parts tomorrow and should be good for a test run. I happened to remember a power supply for a computer I bought years ago and never used. It turned out to be one that uses the fan for the load resistor. If the test goes well, I have a dozen or so mother boards that need stripping along with 30+ hard drives and floppy drives. I already have almost 500 grams of pins already to go.

edit: If you PM me your info, I will send you a piece of copper mesh for the encouragement.


----------



## bmgold2 (Jan 30, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> I know this is not a large cell but it has encouraged me to work on mine. After beating my head against a wall all morning, I have a power supply almost ready. Need to pick up a few minor parts tomorrow and should be good for a test run. I happened to remember a power supply for a computer I bought years ago and never used. It turned out to be one that uses the fan for the load resistor. If the test goes well, I have a dozen or so mother boards that need stripping along with 30+ hard drives and floppy drives. I already have almost 500 grams of pins already to go.
> 
> edit: If you PM me your info, I will send you a piece of copper mesh for the encouragement.



I ran some more pins through my tiny cell and am still impressed with how quick the gold is removed from the parts. I guess that means there is very little gold on them to start with but I'm really glad I am using this method instead of trying to dissolve the base metals all away from the tiny bit of gold. 

I also put a small, stick-on-thermometer on the outside of my little cell. Doing one pin at a time I can't imagine it is ever going to heat up but it might when I try the mesh basket and more quantity at a time. You might want to use a larger version if you plan to do much quantity quickly. This mini cell is a good way to test the process at least for me. As I said, this might be all I need and I don't plan on building a larger one unless I get a lot more material to process.

Thanks for the offer of the copper mesh but another member already offered me a piece. I'll post more pictures of my mini cell with the basket once I get the mesh and get it built. I am still saving up the pins that don't have enough non-plated parts to grip with the alligator clip so I should have some to test the basket with.


----------



## sharkhook (Jan 30, 2014)

I am going to use the container I have with 1 1/2 to 1 3/4 cup of acid. That will leave me a bit of room for a small basket and reduce the chance of a spill or over flow. I don't plan on running a very large basket. I hope to do a gram or two at a time. Like you I am in no rush to produce quantity, just get a basic idea of the overall process. I will try to add some pictures when I get it going. The cold here should be out by this evening and I have to get caught up on some work outside so it may be a few days yet.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 2, 2014)

I got a piece of copper mesh from a forum member who also send some hi grade pins for me to try. Edited to say THANKS Eric (etack) - I didn't want to mention his name until I knew he was OK with it. I quickly folded up a tiny basket for my tiny cell and tested it out to strip more than one pin at a time. This will be especially helpful where there isn't enough non-plated part left to grip with the alligator clip.
















This new basket seems to work real good. I did have to stir or shake the basket some to get all the parts to strip. I also adjusted my power supply setting the current to a maximum of 1 amp and turning the voltage up all the way. That way the current stays at or below 1 amp which should help keep from over heating the acid as well as not maxing out the power supply all the time. I could have just switched to a car battery charger but I already had this power supply ready to go. It was a little slower than it could have been with more power but still way faster than one pin at a time like I had been doing.

The black powder (gold) did settle out of the acid but it took a couple days without moving the container. Now it is all mixed back in since I used it again. There wasn't much but there was some powder on the bottom that I could see with a flashlight through the cleared acid. Now that I ran several small batches with the basket, there should be much more gold in the cell . This is going to take a while to get enough to move on to the next step but I'm getting there.


----------



## solar_plasma (Feb 2, 2014)

> That way the current stays at or below 1 amp which should help keep from over heating to acid



just remember P=I*U


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 2, 2014)

solar_plasma said:


> > That way the current stays at or below 1 amp which should help keep from over heating to acid
> 
> 
> 
> just remember P=I*U



My power supply automatically adjusts the voltage up to the limit of 15 volts to try to keep the current at the 1 amp that I set. It changes pretty fast but I think the voltage started out 6 or 7 volts with the current at 1 amp and then quickly adjusts to the maximum 15 volts as the current goes down. I'll probably get this wrong but I think the resistance must start low and then gets higher as the gold is removed and the base metal is exposed. I watch and when the current gets to zero, I stir the parts and that usually gets it started again until there is no gold left and the current stays at zero. I'm going to guess that this is similar to anodising the base metal. I once worked for a company that anodised aluminum parts but I wasn't directly involved with the anodising process. I think they used sulfuric acid but I doubt it was concentrated acid. In fact I'm sure it wasn't concentrated acid.


----------



## solar_plasma (Feb 2, 2014)

> I'll probably get this wrong but I think the resistance must start low and then gets higher as the gold is removed and the base metal is exposed. I watch and when the current gets to zero, I stir the parts and that usually gets it started again until there is no gold left and the current stays at zero.



That's correct, I would say.

Pmax=1A*15V=15W .... I just wanted to express, that 15W could make a little amount of liquid pretty warm...just to keep in mind, not leaving it alone. 

Nice little setup!


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 2, 2014)

Very Nice! I hope to work on mine later this evening. I am getting there slowly, but getting there. 

For the smaller clips, you can find them at Radio Shack made of copper. A 10 pack here was under $4.


----------



## rickbb (Feb 2, 2014)

Some of those are just plated copper, not solid. FYI


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 2, 2014)

Yes, be sure to get the all copper ones. I had to ask the guy twice just to get him away from the plated ones. He had a funny look on his face when I told him the plated ones didn't play well with acid.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 2, 2014)

solar_plasma said:


> > I'll probably get this wrong but I think the resistance must start low and then gets higher as the gold is removed and the base metal is exposed. I watch and when the current gets to zero, I stir the parts and that usually gets it started again until there is no gold left and the current stays at zero.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



My 1 amp was not when it was at 15 volts but the small amount of pins I ran (several batches plus the hi grade ones) did raise the temperature a little according to the stick-on thermometer on the outside of the cell. I agree that it would heat up pretty fast if used for long periods of time or with many pins at a time. Although I still have more of my low grade pins to process, I haven't done that many at a time and I would never leave this little cell running without watching it. As I keep saying though, I'm still impressed with the whole process. Just seems to use much less acid than the other options to get the gold from these parts especially considering that my parts are very lightly plated. I'm looking forward to recovering the gold from this cell but at the rate I'm going it will be a long time before that happens. I'm having fun so far.

The alligator clips I am using are just the cheap ones which is one reason I did not want to dip them in the acid. The other reason is I just didn't want acid on something I was touching even if I did have gloves on.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 2, 2014)

After thinking about it, I thought I should mention that I am speaking as someone who has very limited quantities of rather low grade pins to process. If you have larger quantities or better grade of materials then another process like AP might be a good option. Even if it takes more acid or a longer time it may be worth it if you don't have to actually watch the cell all the time. A bucket of AP with an air bubbler could work all by itself for days or weeks without much attention needed. Use whatever method works best for your own situation.


----------



## solar_plasma (Feb 2, 2014)

You got it, that's why it is a recommended method for especially low grade....at least when someone feels safe with using conc sulfuric. I amsure you have read about it, but just to be sure: Remember that conc sulfuric can not be filtered, it would burn the paper in a couple of seconds or a few minutes. You will decant it and dillute the last drops of acid by pouring little acid to much water in order to prevent splashing.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 2, 2014)

> ....at least when someone feels safe with using conc sulfuric.



That is the main reason behind my going slow, as well as following this post so closely, (while studying other posts as well). I have made more than enough mistakes by jumping into unknown things when I was young, this stuff requires some study, and understanding. This is my reason for going slowly, and small scale, for the learning. I can worry about having gold in hand later. I have had some of my items for over 10 years, I see no reason to rush into things now. 

And Thanks to everyone for their input.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 2, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> > ....at least when someone feels safe with using conc sulfuric.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



This is also the reason it took me so long to try this. I bought or built all of the parts (including the acid) for this cell except for the copper mesh basket when I first joined this forum back in 2008 and have just now decided to try it. Battery acid is bad enough but concentrated sulfuric acid just plain scares me. Hopefully this fear, or should we call it a healthy respect, will help keep me and others from any accidents with this useful tool. Just because my version is small doesn't make it less dangerous.

I did also read that you can't filter the concentrated sulfuric acid but it doesn't hurt to remind anyone reading this now or later about that fact. I do remember reading one post about using a fiberglass plug in a filter but diluting the acid and powder that can't be decanted off is the way I plan to do it. Add the acid slowly to the water. I think it was around 6 times as much water as you have acid.


----------



## g_axelsson (Feb 2, 2014)

I believe that a separatory funnel is the way to go, it allows the settled gold powder to be easily drained and the rest of the acid is returned to the cell.
I think it can be used to store the acid between runs to minimize moisture absorption between runs and the settled gold is easily drained before usage of the cell.

This is only my belief, but I have put my money where my mouth is and bought one to have when I try the sulfuric cell. 8) 

Göran


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 2, 2014)

g_axelsson said:


> I believe that a separatory funnel is the way to go, it allows the settled gold powder to be easily drained and the rest of the acid is returned to the cell.
> I think it can be used to store the acid between runs to minimize moisture absorption between runs and the settled gold is easily drained before usage of the cell.
> 
> This is only my belief, but I have put my money where my mouth is and bought one to have when I try the sulfuric cell. 8)
> ...



That should work if you can wait long enough for the powder to settle. Mine seems to take a couple days for the thick concentrated acid to clear up. Let us know how it works if/when you try it. You should only need to use the separatory funnel when you are ready to clean out the cell anyway. Somewhere on the forum I read that you don't need to clean it out until it gets real thick with powder.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 3, 2014)

g_axelsson said:


> I believe that a separatory funnel is the way to go, it allows the settled gold powder to be easily drained and the rest of the acid is returned to the cell.
> I think it can be used to store the acid between runs to minimize moisture absorption between runs and the settled gold is easily drained before usage of the cell.
> 
> This is only my belief, but I have put my money where my mouth is and bought one to have when I try the sulfuric cell. 8)
> ...



That is the first time I have seen one, and I like it. Thanks for the heads up on them. A few pictures of when you get it in use would be appreciated much. 



> Hopefully this fear, or should we call it a healthy respect, will help keep me and others from any accidents with this useful tool. Just because my version is small doesn't make it less dangerous.



Lets call it Healthy Respect. 
The use of filters with concentrated sulfuric won't work, by my understanding, (reading).


----------



## solar_plasma (Feb 3, 2014)

AP takes long, produces lots of liquids to handle, but is harvested fastly, sulfuric cell works fast, but takes long time to harvest. So, I like AP the best on thin material with good plating and the cell, if it is with thick pieces of basemetals or poorly plated.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 7, 2014)

Well I finally tried a sulfuric cell today and was very pleased with the results. A small, 1 1/2 cup cell. I didn't get any pictures as I felt I needed to pay more attention to what I was doing other than getting pictures of it. I will try to get some up in the next few days. I used a power supply from a Coleman electric cooler, 13.8 volt and 5.25 amp. I ran an inline 12 volt bulb as well, worked pretty good too. The amps never went over 1.45amp while running a nice plated ring, other than that, it stayed mostly in the 1.2amp or less range. I learned quite a bit, and next run should see some better methods on my part. I just need more to work with so the next day or two should keep me busy breaking down a few materials. Heat was good too, an identical piece of glass had a temperature of 54.2 degrees empty. The cell temperature reached 57.4 at it's highest.  

I don't want to disrupt this thread so I will start another as I get going better with my own cell.

Thanks to everyone for the help with this.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 8, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> I don't want to disrupt this thread so I will start another as I get going better with my own cell.



I don't see your additions to this thread as disruption and you are welcome to post all the information you want here.

As far as my own cell goes, I have been running more stuff through it. Most of what I am processing has just a tiny bit of plating on the tips of the pieces but I did run some nicer plated pins from an old computer. I did notice that now the acid doesn't clear up anymore even with a couple days to settle out. When I pour the acid back into the cell from the little jar I store it in, the last bit does contain some powder so I can tell it is working. Usually I leave the last bit of acid, with the settled powder, in the storage jar when I run more material but it all gets stirred back up when I pour the acid back in after I finish up for the day.

The next batch of pins I have gathered up to run are some nicely plated connector pins which weigh about 9-1/2 grams so you can see that I'm still not processing large quantities. This batch will be run in many steps since I only put a very small quantity in the little basket at a time. Still, it's much faster than one at a time like I first did.

I plan to take more pictures and try to document the steps I take when I finally clean out this cell and hopefully get my first gold bead. I can't tell how much gold might be in this cell yet but I hope to wait until I'm sure I can get enough gold out of it to hold and see without a magnifying glass.

I'm not in a big rush yet since I still need to get a hotter torch unless it warms up enough to squeeze the last bit of fuel out of my oxy/acetylene torch. The longer I wait, the more gold it should contain because I keep ripping stuff apart and when I get a little pile of pins and connectors, I set up and strip the gold off them. In the process, I'm also getting a pile of steel, a bag of wire, a lot of I.C. chips, and a couple jars with screws (one with steel ones and another for S.S.) and there are still more parts on the boards that need removed like aluminum heat sinks. I expect to get more for the other metals than I get in value of gold but that's fine. I'll have no problem selling the other scrap but the gold is MINE! I won't say I will never sell any gold I get from this hobby but this should be my first bit of self-refined gold and I don't think it will be for sale until I'm gone. Now, if this first try turns out an ounce or more...Well, money talks. I'm hoping/expecting for a gram or more.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 8, 2014)

> I don't see your additions to this thread as disruption and you are welcome to post all the information you want here.



Thanks, very much. 

This has been one of those experiences in life that sticks out in my mind. Watching that gold plate go into solution and the clean pin come back out was a real thrill for me. I have been several years trying to find the right way to accomplish this and now I know. My little cell is sitting, and hasn't settled much yet. I have a few more low grade pins ready, but not quite enough to give the cell a longer test yet. 

A few of the things I need to work on.

(1) I think I will keep my power supply as is for a few pictures then try to put it in some kind of container, just to neaten up some of the clutter.
(2) A better suited containers for anode and cathode storage 
(3) A container for the finished pins must be large enough to hold the unfinished pins.
(4) A larger safety catch bowl for the cell to sit in, in case of accidents. 
(5) A better built basket, although this one did do pretty good.

I am sure there will be other things, as I progress, but I am getting there.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 10, 2014)

After sitting for a few days, I have a noticeable amount of black powder in the bottom. Not a lot, but clearly noticeable sediment. Very encouraging, as I know I am on the right path to learning this procedure. Still gathering materials, in between reading.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 10, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> After sitting for a few days, I have a noticeable amount of black powder in the bottom. Not a lot, but clearly noticeable sediment. Very encouraging, as I know I am on the right path to learning this procedure. Still gathering materials, in between reading.



It sounds like you are doing this about the same as I am. I gather up some pins and connectors and then set up and run my cell every couple days. I'm not running a lot of material since I only get a small amount of pins and other gold plated things out of each circuit board. I'm also taking other parts off the boards at the same time and separating it to eventually go to the junk yard.

I'm getting real tempted to clean up my micro cell just to see what I get from it. I know the acid can be re-concentrated to reuse it but I'm not set up to do that. I'm not real fond of playing with concentrated sulfuric acid. Hot acid I'm not sure I want to tackle. I might just start with fresh acid after I clean up this one and use the dilute acid for something else. I'm only dealing with 1/2 cup and, if I let it settle first, the amount "lost" to clean up shouldn't be much to replace.

I'll probably wait longer and see how much more material I come up with to run but I saw another thread where there was a picture of three little gold beads with a total weight of just under 1/10 gram so my estimate on 1 gram minimum was higher than I actually need to have. Of course more gold is always better but it's been 5 years or so since I started thinking about refining gold and I don't even have that first bead yet and I'm getting anxious to move on to the next step.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 10, 2014)

> It sounds like you are doing this about the same as I am. I gather up some pins and connectors and then set up and run my cell every couple days. I'm not running a lot of material since I only get a small amount of pins and other gold plated things out of each circuit board. I'm also taking other parts off the boards at the same time and separating it to eventually go to the junk yard.



Yes, sounds like we are working along the same lines. My scrap pile is a mess now. I used to just haul everything in one lump. Now I separate about everything. The biggest thing is I had not planned on having a place just for the plastic. Fortunately, it is only a few miles to a recycling center that takes it for free. The down side (not quite the correct term for some good learning) is I spend more time reading, which is the time I used to use to haul the excess waste off.

I have plenty of room in my little cell, so for now, I will gather a few materials, and process small batch's at a time. That should help me to better understand the hands on use of the cell it's self. I still need a dish for melting, so I am not rushing to that part yet, although I am looking forward to it. I have spent some time studying the wash aspect, and will try to follow Harold's methods, as it seems to be the best standard I could find. 

Good Luck!
And Thanks!


----------



## Arlea (Feb 16, 2014)

Very interesting post..... like many here I have been reading and reading..... and a bit of amassing. As I have no real indoor space for this (PA sucks right now) I will be amassing until spring. Hopefully by then I can have enough raw materials to work with. Keep up the great posts and thank you again.

Rob


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 16, 2014)

Yea, PA has been pretty cold recently. Looks like next week we may get above freezing.

Here's an update on what I've been doing with my micro gold stripping cell.

I left the acid settle and poured off most of the concentrated acid and then slowly poured the remaining acid along with the little bit of black powder into some water to dilute it. Then, after that settled, I filtered the powder through a coffee filter. I ended up with a little pile of powder that I scraped out with a plastic spoon.




I was also left with a lot of the powder still stuck on/in the filter but decided to wait until later to recover that. I'm still trying to get that first piece of refined gold and wanted to start with just the easy stuff. I'll recover the rest later.




Wanting to make sure I had some gold when I finish this test, I included some gold from another test of crushed I.C. chips that I had already been cleaning in nitric acid. I didn't think the little bit of powder from the cell would be enough. Might have been a bad idea but that's what I did so far.

After cleaning the powder and the gold from the I.C.'s a couple/few times with nitric acid, I took a picture of my second leaching with SSN. I think my SSN was getting weak from sitting around so long so I did add a couple drops of homemade nitric to the leach to strengthen it. I probably should have just used HCl and bleach but I had the SSN from the Gold Hunter's Test Kit I bought so I used that. It is a much cleaner and much more intense yellow than any of my previous tests. Hopefully I got most if not all of the base metals out.




I'm now on my third leach of the same material and the color is a weaker yellow but still tests very positive for gold. I am only using 2 or 3 mL for each test and the leach is getting old so it hasn't gotten it all in one batch. Each batch was left for a day or longer and heated every once in a while with a small heat gun. I've done that before with the little sample vial but each time I hold it over another container just in case it breaks. The heat gun is very small (350 Watts) and I don't hold it real close. Just enough to get the reaction going. Don't try that with a regular jar. They will crack. As they say, don't ask me how I know that. I'm sure a regular jar could be heated in a hot water bath though.




I debated about using the KD-3 indicator/precipitant from the test kit I bought but since I don't know what it is and it seems to drop about anything in the solution, I decided to order a little bit of SMB off of Ebay for this test instead of risking messing up this test with an unknown substance. It should be here next week. In the meantime, I'll continue to leach the material and then rinse the remains a couple times with water and then wait for the SMB to drop the gold.

I still haven't gotten the MAPP gas torch to melt it anyway.

P.S. I've been re-reading Hoke's book starting from the beginning and not skipping any of it. Everyone here was right, even the parts you don't think you need (like the platinum section) has some good information in it. I should have cut my filter down to fit the funnel better so I could have washed it out better and maybe gotten more powder out of it the first time. I can't wait to see what else I missed by skipping around while reading that book. Notice in my picture above of the leach bottles that they are sitting on the book I printed and bound myself from a PDF found on this forum. That took some time but was well worth doing. I've been reading it before I go to sleep each night. I'm reading slowly this time so as much of the information as possible sinks in.


----------



## solar_plasma (Feb 16, 2014)

You can avoid losing gold to the filters until reprocessing those, if you only decant or syphone instead. Weigh the beaker before using it and write its weight onto the white window, then you can just let dry in there and weigh it. If the beaker is extremely clean, without having been touched inside and without scratches, you can easily get the powder out of it. If not, it is still better to redissolve it there with the next batch, than from incinerated filters.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 16, 2014)

solar_plasma said:


> You can avoid losing gold to the filters until reprocessing those, if you only decant or syphone instead. Weigh the beaker before using it and write its weight onto the white window, then you can just let dry in there and weigh it. If the beaker is extremely clean, without having been touched inside and without scratches, you can easily get the powder out of it. If not, it is still better to redissolve it there with the next batch, than from incinerated filters.



Nice. That had been my understanding, but was unclear if I had the understanding correct. 

Looking good there also, bmgold, I haven't made it that far yet. I ran 5 more rings through mine (two were pretty worn on the plating) and a very few more lightly plated, low grade pins. I am getting a bit "itchy" myself to see how the next steps work out here. Still haven't made any pictures though.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 20, 2014)

I'm starting to worry I might mess this first small batch of refined gold up since I have never had any success with it before but as far as I can tell I'm doing everything as right as I can this time.

I have all the gold I plan to dissolved into my leach solution just waiting for the SMB to get here. It should be here today or tomorrow at the latest. It took 3 little batches of SSN leach (with a couple drops of poorman's nitric in each batch) to get everything in solution. I rinsed the last batch a couple times with hot water and then made up a small batch of AR for a 4th leach. That one tested negative for gold so I assume I got it all. I dumped that batch into another jar with some more I.C. chips that has been soaking for a while now. That way, just in case I missed some, I'll catch it next time. It also had more free nitric left in that one that I didn't want in this first batch. 

I went out yesterday and picked up a new torch from the local Lowes store.




I've only tested this torch out using propane to avoid wasting the more expensive MAPP gas that came with it. I think this torch should be plenty hot enough for the small quantities of gold or silver I am likely to be dealing with any time soon. I had another MAPP gas torch before and this new one makes it look pretty low powered. This one is also adjustable so you don't have to use it full blast. The torch body gets ice cold when used so I'm sure it is using a lot of fuel but I was able to get a cupel glowing hot and coated with some 20 mule team borax in just a couple minutes or so.

Hopefully, in a day or two, I should have that first bead of self-refined gold I have been dreaming of for the last 5 years or so. I won't be real surprised if something goes wrong (like I blow the gold powder all over the place) but I'm trying real hard to make sure nothing goes wrong this time.

I should have another update on this very soon, good or bad. I'm not afraid to share my mistakes. I also started over again reading the Hoke book from beginning to end. This time I have been high-lighting things I think are important to make it easier to find that information later. I've also added a few notes in the margins of the book to help me understand it better.


----------



## gold4mike (Feb 20, 2014)

That's the same torch I use (now have two) and it works fine. I use the mini firebrick furnace I got from LazerSteve a couple of years ago along with a clay melting dish and it works great for as much as two ounces.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 20, 2014)

gold4mike said:


> That's the same torch I use (now have two) and it works fine. I use the mini firebrick furnace I got from LazerSteve a couple of years ago along with a clay melting dish and it works great for as much as two ounces.



Thanks for the confirmation that this torch should work fine. Two ounces is more than I ever expect to have so I expect this torch will be all I ever need unless I get the right nitric to try silver. Even then, I'd just have to melt in smaller batches.

I didn't get the SMB in the mail today so it should be here tomorrow. Just as a test to see if the torch would melt gold, I cut a little piece off of a 14K scrap ring bigger than I expect to get from this first batch and melted it into a little bead. That worked fine and didn't take very long. I had one of Steve's mini firebrick furnaces when I first joined this forum but it is gone now so I used a little ceramic wool insulation to keep from loosing too much of the heat.

I saved the little bead of 14K gold to compare with the bead I hope to get soon from my refined gold. The 14K isn't as nice as I hope to get but right now, any gold will do for a first try. It should be pretty good though I hope. I keep wondering if I should incinerate the powder I hope to get and refine it a second time just to be sure but I doubt I have enough patience to do that this time. I really want to see that first bit of gold. The 14K doesn't count since I didn't refine it, just melted it.


----------



## gold4mike (Feb 21, 2014)

You can always dissolve it again later and refine it further, it will just take a little longer to dissolve if it's not in powder form when you do it.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 21, 2014)

Well, I did it!

Nothing really to brag about but it's the first one so it will have to do.

I got the SMB today and poured my gold solution into a jar along with about an equal amount of fresh water and then sprinkled a little bit of the SMB into it. I didn't attempt to measure anything since I don't have a good scale and I didn't know how much gold I was going to have anyway. At first it didn't do anything and then all at once the solution got dark. Soon I seen one clump of powder in the bottom and some other dust. After it settled for a little bit (maybe an hour) I tested the solution and got a negative test for gold so I expect it all dropped out. I scooped out the biggest clump and just left the rest in there for now.

Here's a picture of the still wet powder in a spoon.




I didn't take a picture of it dry but I rinsed it in some water one time (impatient) and then sucked as much water off as I could with a pipette and then force dried it carefully with the mini heat gun.

Next, I went out and fired up the new torch to melt the gold in another cupel. This time I went real slow to avoid any chance of blowing the powder out of the cupel. The first melting I got several buttons of gold so I pushed them close together and remelted them into one bead. One very tiny bead but I wasn't expecting much. As close as I can guess, using the very cheap scale I have, the bead weighs somewhere around 25-30 milligrams. Not much for the time it took me but there is still a little gold stuck in the filter I used and a tiny bit still in the jar I precipitated it in.

It's a start. Here's the best picture I could get of the little bead. I can't tell even with a magnifying glass if it has a pipe but I'm guessing it doesn't. Next one should be much better.




This tiny bead was not just from the micro gold stripping cell. It also includes a little bit of gold that came from some I.C. chips since I knew I wouldn't get much from the small amount of low grade pins I stripped. If I would have had more material to run in the cell I would have gotten a better idea of exactly how the cell worked out but at least I now know that I can do it. I should have spent more time cleaning the precipitated powder from this first attempt but I was impatient just to see some gold. Now all I have to do is get some more material to process. I dropped the tiny bead into a snuffer bottle that I have some more gold stored in. It's the biggest piece in the bottle. I might still try to save this bead in a coin holder. I haven't decided yet but probably will just save it even if it is tiny.


----------



## FrugalRefiner (Feb 21, 2014)

Outstanding!

OK, it's little, and the purity is definitely lacking, but I know it's been a long time coming. Congratulations!

Dave


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 21, 2014)

FrugalRefiner said:


> Outstanding!
> 
> OK, it's little, and the purity is definitely lacking, but I know it's been a long time coming. Congratulations!
> 
> Dave



Thanks Dave,

There is still a little borax on the bead and the picture didn't turn out real good. The purity is less than I wanted but I just really wanted/needed to see that first bit of gold. I first joined this forum (as bmgold) back on December 30th, 2008 so only a little over 5 years to get under a tenth of a gram of gold. Of course I took a few year break from trying to refine in that 5 year time.

I'm slow AND impatient. Not the best combination of traits but, I've been told, it's not uncommon.


----------



## pgms4me (Feb 21, 2014)

Congradulations. I am excited for you. I recovered and refined my first gold bead from electronics parts(cpu pins) before i joined the forum near the same time you joined. My first one  was slightly over a gram. It was a great experience. Unfortunatly , I had to back off recovery for a year due to a heart attack. I have been back recycling and have a lot I hope to process,but now where i am located I dont have the proper space to do i,t so I am waiting until I can relocate. I sell the stuff I am not going to bother with on ebay,and use that to help get more scrap. Dont lose that first bead. Mine is somewhere in a box that was missplaced when I had to move. I guess I will have to make another to replace it . I used to be impatient ,but thankfully learned to overcome it. Thank you for mentioning the torch. I needed the info You and Dave posted to help with my decision. I have been using the 4000 model and it is a pain because it is not adjustable. i found the ts 8000 at Home depot. they want 49.95 and i didnt get it because I just wanted the torch and not the mapp gas. Cant find it anywhere by itself at any less cost ,so I will bite the bullet and get one. regards Donn


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 21, 2014)

Very Nice! Tiny, not perfect? You took trash and made a gold bead, that is the important thing. What you also accomplished is confidence in your ability, and gained knowledge. That is a major step in the right direction in any field. Congratulations!


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 22, 2014)

pgms4me said:


> Thank you for mentioning the torch. I needed the info You and Dave posted to help with my decision. I have been using the 4000 model and it is a pain because it is not adjustable. i found the ts 8000 at Home depot. they want 49.95 and i didnt get it because I just wanted the torch and not the mapp gas. Cant find it anywhere by itself at any less cost ,so I will bite the bullet and get one. regards Donn



Yes, the adjustable feature of the TS8000 torch is a very nice feature to have. $49.95 isn't a bad price for the torch. I just paid $54.99 for mine at Lowes. That did include one Mapp Gas bottle but I used the cheaper propane for my little melted bead.



sharkhook said:


> Very Nice! Tiny, not perfect? You took trash and made a gold bead, that is the important thing. What you also accomplished is confidence in your ability, and gained knowledge. That is a major step in the right direction in any field. Congratulations!



Thanks Sharkhook, very good point. I got a little piece of gold out of trash. Just as important is, like you said, I now have the confidence that I CAN do it. Up until now I wasn't sure I could turn the precipitated powder back into metal.


----------



## butcher (Feb 22, 2014)

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0019CQL60/ref=asc_df_B0019CQL602985071?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&tag=nextagus0039487-20&linkCode=asn&creative=395093&creativeASIN=B0019CQL60

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BERNZOMATIC-TS4000T-Torch-Brazing-/321328078695?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ad0a55f67

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BERNZOMATIC-TS8000-TORCH-WITH-ULTRA-SWIRL-HIGH-INTENSITY-FLAME-/201041196343?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ecefd3537


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 22, 2014)

I have been busier than the proverbial one legged man in a contest the past few days, but I did pick up 6 or 7 more plated rings to work with. I will try to get some pictures of my cell and post them. I am out of ready pins, so the rings will have to do for now. I still need a torch, but that has been covered pretty good, so I know what to look for. I am out of acetylene, and I need a small portable kit anyway. Then I will be putting my power supply together, complete with amp and volt needles. 

Again, congratulations on that first button.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 22, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> I am out of acetylene, and I need a small portable kit anyway. Then I will be putting my power supply together, complete with amp and volt needles.
> 
> Again, congratulations on that first button.



Thanks to everyone again, it is nothing to brag about but it does feel good to finally get a little piece of gold from my efforts of scrapping junk.

As for the small portable torch, I wouldn't recommend getting one of the little oxygen/mapp gas torches that use the disposable tanks. They do work good (for very small jobs) but that $10 or so little tank of oxygen only lasts about 10 or 15 minutes. Now, a bit larger but still refillable set up might not be such a bad idea depending on how much you use it. I don't use my oxy/acetylene torches very often but when I need them I'm glad I have them. Both tanks need filled now but, once filled, I get several years out of them before I have to fill them again. Like I said, I don't use them very often. They are not real portable and a smaller set would be nice but the difference in price to fill the tanks was not a lot between the smaller and larger tanks. The real cost was buying the tanks in the first place.

Keep us posted on how you set up your power supply. I know I'd be interested in how you rig it up.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 22, 2014)

I mainly need a new torch for soldering and removing solder on copper pipe and plumbing. Since I am needing it, I am going to step up from the manual type to a the electronic one with Mapp. I have used those little oxygen tanks and they never hold enough to complete anything I have tried them on. I'm not even sure why they make them.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 23, 2014)

OK, I finally got a few pictures. I tried to video parts of running 8 rings in the cell, one at a time. I didn't know the cameras auto shut off worked even when videoing, so that is out. I still have the same acid originally used and it did not work quite as well, I think it has absorbed to much moisture. That is OK too, as I planned to start washing what I have when these rings were done and the powders have settled. I didn't show the basket since I didn't use it here. The bowl is holding 1 1/2 cups of Sulfuric Acid, it is dirty looking from use and hasn't cleared completely from the last use a few days ago.




This is the complete cell with the bowl I sit it in for safety efforts.




And the power supply I am using. When the light goes out, the gold is gone from the rings. On small batch's of pins, the light seldom comes on. I remove the basket of pins when the foaming stops, after stirring the pins a few times. It takes 1 amp for the light to come on and it goes off in the neighborhood of .85 amps, give or take .05 amp. It is a power supply for a Coleman Electric Cooler, and rated at 13.8 volt and 5.25 amp. When using a meter, I have never had it use over 1.45 amp, and the bulb will slowly dim as the process is finishing. Even on the hardest use I have tried, it quickly drops down to just over 1 amp, then slowly drops until it stops.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 23, 2014)

Looks pretty good sharkhook,

I look forward to finding out how much gold you get from your cell. I'd guess the 8 rings probably have more gold on them than the total amount of material I ran through my cell the first time. I have been collecting more stuff to run through my cell but now that I finally got my first tiny piece of gold and know that I can do it, I'm not in as big of a hurry to run them until I've got enough to be worth setting it back up. I'll also have to add a little more acid to make up for the acid I diluted and filtered to get the powder out for my first button before I run any more parts.

I just checked my jar of used acid and it is still too dark to see light through even with a flashlight. There is a tiny bit of powder on the bottom of the jar but not enough to worry about yet. I don't know if it is caused from the brand of acid I used (Liquid Fire) or if it is normal for the acid to remain dark like this. It was dark right out of the bottle. The diluted acid is a clear, light-green color. There is also a little bit of powder on the bottom of that jar that made it through my filter. Next time I will avoid the filter completely at least until the gold is in solution. I'll also spend more time cleaning the precipitated powder to get a little higher purity button. Might even process it a second time. I did examine the cupel I used to melt my gold in and can see a few more tiny beads left in it. It's hard to get all of it to combine together when it was such a small amount to start with.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 23, 2014)

I am not sure the exact amount, but I think it was around 100 grams of low grade pins, maybe another 10-20 grams of mid grade pins. Plus 20 or so of the ends from HDMI cables and 12-14 or so rings in total in the cell now. What ever it comes out to in the end, it is more than I had before trying it. I am pleased with it, it seems small enough to be convenient but big enough to work at the rate I tend to gather materials to work with for now.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 24, 2014)

I was searching this site and ran across a post by samuel-a where he says:



> I was sitting in my lab and looking at my plastic buttle of conc' H2SO4, when i bought it, it was white, after several monthes it got very dark inside, that was the moment i remembered someone here on the forum mentioned that conc' H2SO4 strip the plastics off its elemental composing atoms, only to be left with black carbon, which gives this dark color.



My bottle of concentrated sulfuric acid that I used is at least 3 or 4 years old and who knows how long it sat on the shelf at the hardware. This might just be why my acid was so dark even before I used it.

Has anyone else used Liquid Fire brand sulfuric acid and was their new acid dark and thick? Now I'm wondering if I should find a new bottle (?washed out bleach bottle or plastic soda pop bottle?) and transfer my acid to a fresh bottle. Will it eventually "eat" the bottle and spill out? I'd hate to pick it up one day and have the bottom drop out or something. If nothing else, I think I will find a bucket and put that bottle in the bucket just in case.

Edit: I just checked the MSDS and didn't find anything about it reacting to plastic and I can't imagine that they would sell it in a bottle that could be destroyed with the contents especially when the contents are concentrated acid.

It listed the contents as Sulfuric Acid and Rodine 31A (ACID INHIBITOR ADDITIVE) and the APPEARANCE AND ODOR: Dark Amber Liquid with slight pungent odor so the color is normal.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 24, 2014)

Check for flower vases. I found one that holds my sulfuric bottle easily. I keep it sitting inside the vase. Might be something better out there, but that is what I had on hand.


----------



## FrugalRefiner (Feb 24, 2014)

bmgold2 said:


> I can't imagine that they would sell it in a bottle that could be destroyed with the contents especially when the contents are concentrated acid.


I wouldn't rely on that assumption. You're probably fairly safe with sulfuric and hydrochloric in the heavy plastic bottles they came in, but you should always store them in secondary containers as you've mentioned. Nitric, on the other hand, is really hard on most plastics and I've seen concentrated nitric sold in plastic.

Soda bottles usually aren't a good choice. If you want to put the acid in a new (used) bottle, be sure to check the bottom for the code and be sure it's compatible with your acid. The thicker the better.

Dave


----------



## butcher (Feb 24, 2014)

Many times packaging is not made for long term storage, Manufactures believe you are purchasing the chemicals for use and will not be storing it long term, although they pick packaging that will safely hold the chemical for a fair period of time, most plastics can and will degrade over time sunlight can also take its toll, I have had nitric acid glass bottles hat the lids decay over time, if it has been stored for a long time and the bottle still holds acid I would put it in a newer bottle (same type as used before) or one compatible with solution, containment for storing acids and other liquid chemical solutions is just good procedures as well as proper storage for all of your chemicals, many chemicals should not be stored in the same location, if you have not studied safe storage of your chemicals I suggest you do so, A Google search can give many details of safely storing labatory chemicals, as well as other safety procedures.


----------



## Geo (Feb 25, 2014)

I post this as an observation and not as a recommendation. Concentrated sulfuric acid that has a carbon colloid contamination can be cleared by doing this process : WARNING Heating concentrated sulfuric acid is very dangerous and should only be done after studying and understanding the dangers involved. Dilute the sulfuric acid by adding the acid SLOWLY to an equal amount of water. Use a glass vessel that can withstand the high temperatures created when diluting the acid. Once the acid is diluted, place the container on low heat and cover loosely. Be prepared to spend some time. when the volume of solution reaches the volume of sulfuric acid used, turn off the heat and let it cool. The carbon will congeal and settle leaving the solution clear with a light yellow tint. 

By covering the container, it will double the evaporation time but the safety factor pays off in the long run. You can also use the cover as an indicator of when the solution is concentrated. when condensation stops forming on the glass, it should work for a stripping cell. Of coarse measure your acid to know your starting volume but remember, when sulfuric acid reaches a concentration of 98%, it will start evolving sulfuric fumes that is very harmful to your long term health. by heating slowly and by stopping the evaporation short, you can still use the acid for a stripping cell.


----------



## nickvc (Feb 25, 2014)

Geo said:


> I post this as an observation and not as a recommendation. Concentrated sulfuric acid that has a carbon colloid contamination can be cleared by doing this process : WARNING Heating concentrated sulfuric acid is very dangerous and should only be done after studying and understanding the dangers involved. Dilute the sulfuric acid by adding the acid SLOWLY to an equal amount of water. Use a glass vessel that can withstand the high temperatures created when diluting the acid. Once the acid is diluted, place the container on low heat and cover loosely. Be prepared to spend some time. when the volume of solution reaches the volume of sulfuric acid used, turn off the heat and let it cool. The carbon will congeal and settle leaving the solution clear with a light yellow tint.
> 
> By covering the container, it will double the evaporation time but the safety factor pays off in the long run. You can also use the cover as an indicator of when the solution is concentrated. when condensation stops forming on the glass, it should work for a stripping cell. Of coarse measure your acid to know your starting volume but remember, when sulfuric acid reaches a concentration of 98%, it will start evolving sulfuric fumes that is very harmful to your long term health. by heating slowly and by stopping the evaporation short, you can still use the acid for a stripping cell.



Better still buy it concentrated if at all possible, hot concentrated sulphuric is one nasty acid!


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 25, 2014)

Thanks guys, I am still debating on which way to go with the acid as I am spending more of my time studying the next steps for cleaning up the sediment. I have concentrated sulfuric acid before and it worked although I was as nervous as a long tailed cat in a rocking chair shop. I am working toward the charman plug idea but then again still not sure i have everything needed for that step. A decent funnel, with the ability to handle the sulfuric is what I need now.

EDIT: spelling correction


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 25, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> Thanks guys, I am still debating on which way to go with the acid as I am spending more of my time studying the next steps for cleaning up the sediment. I have concentrated sulfuric acid before and it worked although I was as nervous as a long tailed cat in a rocking chair shop. I am working toward the charman plug idea but then again still not sure i have everything needed for that step. A decent funnel, with the ability to handle the sulfuric is what I need now.
> 
> EDIT: spelling correction



I just used a regular plastic funnel when I filtered my dilute acid along with a coffee filter. I got a lot of gold powder stuck in that filter but the funnel held up fine. The one I used came with an electroplating kit but I'm pretty sure a dollar store plastic kitchen funnel would work. I'll bet it would work with the concentrated acid too but I've never tried it.

The charmin plug would work for the diluted acid but the fiberglass plug should work with the concentrated acid. Check out this thread - http://goldrefiningforum.com/~goldrefi/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=16388 

Might need to vacuum filter it, I never tried it yet but even if you diluted the acid first, it should save getting the gold stuck in the filter since you can just process the fiberglass and when done, reuse it again.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 25, 2014)

That is a great post and I have read it several times. But, one more time helped, Thanks. I was forgetting the dilution part. We are looking at some bad weather the next few days, so it will have to wait a bit, but I will be trying it soon.


----------



## bmgold2 (Feb 26, 2014)

I tried the fiberglass plug using some insulation and my little plastic funnel to filter the concentrated acid from my micro cell. It worked fine with the concentrated acid but, since most of the gold powder had already been removed, I didn't get enough to bother with yet. Then I re-filtered the diluted acid that still had a little powder in it that the coffee filter missed through the same fiberglass plug and it caught that little bit of fine powder as well as diluted the little bit of concentrated acid left in the plug. I don't have a vacuum filter so just let gravity do the work. The concentrated acid was kind of slow but not too bad. I'd say this is the way to do it if you want to reuse the acid without evaporating the excess water off it. Should be much easier to deal with the little bit of fiberglass instead of the coffee filter and it looks like it did a better job.

My dark colored concentrated acid is still dark so I expect that it is going to stay that way unless I dilute it and evaporate off the water but I just don't want to deal with hot sulfuric acid yet. Maybe someday but it just sounds more dangerous than I am set up to deal with at the moment. It is still kept separate just in case.


----------



## sharkhook (Feb 26, 2014)

I had a funnel I had forgot about, it is plastic, but I put a drop of sulfuric on it and it seems to be holding up just fine. The nice part is it will easily hold the entire contents of my little cell, and then some. It is fairly windy outside now, so I will wait until the weather clears then try it with the fiberglass. I am pretty sure it will work, (to many on the forum have to much success to believe it wouldn't work). I tired an experiment with HCl/CL to get a feel for it, but my stannous had gone bad, so I am making a new batch just for this. Even then I picked up some good first hand experience with the test. I now have the stuff to make up the Poor man's AR, so I may go that route. If nothing else it will be some new experience that could be helpful later on. 

And for anyone who is new at this that may be reading this, go slow when mixing the HCL and CL. It will fizz and even pop and spatter if you get in a hurry, just *don't* rush it. I didn't have the spattering, but then I went very slow, and it will fizz pretty strongly. I would do a very small amount, I used three teaspoons of HCL and slowly added 1/2 teaspoon of Clorox for my testing. Just be extra careful with any of this stuff, it can be very bad if you have an accident.


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 3, 2014)

This may not be the right place to post this since this 2nd gold bead wasn't from the gold stripping cell but I thought I'd keep both of my beads so far in the same thread.




Again, it's not the best picture but it was the best one of the group that I took. I already put the tiny bead in a coin holder so that made it even harder to get the picture.

This bead is maybe 1/10th the size of my first one. As close as I can come, it is around 20 mg. but much purer than my first one. I can't tell for sure if it has a pipe or if what I can see (not in the picture) is just a pocket from the borax. The color is much brighter and the original powder was a lighter color.

This is proof that you can start with very small amounts for a test and still end up with a bead of gold. There are still some even smaller beads left in my melting cupel that didn't join with this bead. I'll either dump them out and reprocess them next batch or just leave them there and hope they get caught with the next bead.

Now all I need to do is move up to larger batches so I can get a bigger piece of gold. Maybe when it warms up a little more.


----------



## Geo (Mar 3, 2014)

Add a little baking soda to your flux next time. i found that using the lens from high grade optics also thins the flux. LENS? what am i talking about? well, the lens in high grade optics is actually made from flourspar = flourite. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorite

grind or mill the lens to dust. DO NOT BREATH THIS DUST! mix the powdered glass with the baking soda. This is hard on the crucible but it will thin the flux so that even the tiny prills of gold will come together in a process called "Coalescence" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coalescence_(chemistry)


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 3, 2014)

Geo said:


> Add a little baking soda to your flux next time. i found that using the lens from high grade optics also thins the flux. LENS? what am i talking about? well, the lens in high grade optics is actually made from flourspar = flourite. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorite
> 
> grind or mill the lens to dust. DO NOT BREATH THIS DUST! mix the powdered glass with the baking soda. This is hard on the crucible but it will thin the flux so that even the tiny prills of gold will come together in a process called "Coalescence" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coalescence_(chemistry)



Baking soda I have. Sodium carbonate (washing soda) I have. High grade optics I don't have. I did find a few companies that sell fluorite (pottery supply places) for $3 or $4 a pound but haven't been able to find out the shipping cost yet.

What kind of high grade optics are you talking about? Anything easy and cheap to find?

Being hard on the crucible isn't an issue since I have only been using cupels so far and they are usually a one or two shot deal. I only have a few new ones left though so I will probably have to get a real melting dish eventually. My actual plan is just to start working with slightly larger quantities of gold before I melt and hope that the larger bead will collect all the gold. I am having fun and gaining confidence by processing and melting small amounts of gold. It's hard to tell from my two pictures of my first 2 beads but the second one is much better. I can't say for sure that it is pure (.999) yet but it must be getting closer.


----------



## Geo (Mar 3, 2014)

Recycling usually generates a lot of non metals. Expensive (when new) optical lens from cameras, telescopes or microscopes, lens from micro imaging readers. It may or may not be easy to determine from appearance but by crushing all the lens that you find should ensure that you have some in the mix. I dont think that optical glass thats not fluorspar will hinder the thinning of the flux.


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 3, 2014)

Geo said:


> Recycling usually generates a lot of non metals. Expensive (when new) optical lens from cameras, telescopes or microscopes, lens from micro imaging readers. It may or may not be easy to determine from appearance but by crushing all the lens that you find should ensure that you have some in the mix. I dont think that optical glass thats not fluorspar will hinder the thinning of the flux.



Thanks Geo,

I'll keep my eye out for cheap or free stuff. I'm a *bit* of a pack rat and have many hobbies. I'd have a hard time crushing up good lenses but maybe I'll run across some scratched up ones. I'll bet a pound of the fluorite would last me a long time so that might be my best bet.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 4, 2014)

I built a quick stand for filtering my cell acid. Not to fancy but it worked well enough. I noticed more pins fell from my basket, but that is OK, this time. The removed acid had no sediment that I could see, so the charman plug seemed to work quite well. 










EDIT: Forgot the pictures.


----------



## necromancer (Mar 4, 2014)

Geo said:


> LENS? what am i talking about? well, the lens in high grade optics is actually made from flourspar = flourite. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorite



can you post a photo of this lens + what the lens came out of please



i love recycling  its as free as free can get


----------



## Geo (Mar 5, 2014)

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=fluorite+lens&FORM=HDRSC2

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=microfilm+reader+lens&go=&qs=n&form=QBIR&pq=microfilm+reader+lens&sc=0-17&sp=-1&sk=

http://www.bing.com/images/results.aspx?q=projector+lens&x=0&y=0&form=MSNH14&refig=116c7346a4644b709a6f68f8148bd91a&pq=projector+lens&sc=8-14&sp=-1&qs=n&sk=


----------



## necromancer (Mar 5, 2014)

Thank You Geo


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 5, 2014)

A bit weak, and may have some copper in it still. But I got this far today.




And the (fresh made) stannous test.




This has been some journey, with more to come, I am sure. Thanks, everyone involved.


----------



## niteliteone (Mar 6, 2014)

Good job 8) 
Color doesn't look bad at all especially considering your experience working with a de-plating cell


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 6, 2014)

Looks good so far. Hopefully you get more gold than I did from my first try with this gold stripping cell.

One thing I did that wasn't quite right was to use a glass peanut butter jar to precipitate my gold in. The problem was the jar wasn't smooth at the bottom of the sides. The gold powder tended to stick to the glass instead of all settling to the bottom. I did get most of it but that jar still has a little bit of powder in it. I reused that jar to decant other washing liquids into to catch any fine powder that got poured off. There isn't much and I'll eventually get it but I got some real beakers off of Ebay to use now. I'm still only doing small tests so the beakers are small (50 mL, 100 mL, and 250 mL for only $8). Each one now has something in it except for the largest one. I really should move up to processing larger amounts but these small tests are allowing me to test out the different processes without risking a lot of gold. They just don't result in very much gold to melt.

Keep us posted on what you end up with from you efforts.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 6, 2014)

What is in the jar (flower vase) is about 50 percent water from rinsing the filter. It isn't as big as it looks as it is holding about ten cups of combined water and concentrates. After settling over night there is a very fine, very thin layer of white sediment on the bottom. I am still deciding on which way to go with it, but will be doing a second refine on it, most likely I will use a small amount of AR for the second run. I just need to get some good washing for the first drop done. Still trying to hold back the urge to rush it, but it is to far along to hurry up and miss any steps at this point. I did do something I haven't been able to find anything on the forum about, so here goes. While waiting for the powders to dissolve, I stirred it using broken pieces of plates with gold leaf, some were fairly thick and took some time to come off. I now have some extra room for my storage area, but still have quite a few more plates and glasses. The rinse from the plates is part of the extra rinse water I added in when the filter was clean.


----------



## FrugalRefiner (Mar 6, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> I did do something I haven't been able to find anything on the forum about, so here goes. While waiting for the powders to dissolve, I stirred it using broken pieces of plates with gold leaf, some were fairly thick and took some time to come off. I now have some extra room for my storage area, but still have quite a few more plates and glasses. The rinse from the plates is part of the extra rinse water I added in when the filter was clean.


You've probably lost a tiny bit of your gold. The broken pieces of plates will absorb some liquid, along with whatever might have been dissolved in it. Probably only a tiny amount, but be aware that when the plates are broken, they expose unglazed areas of the plate, and these areas will be a little porous. If you take a piece of the plate and put a drop of water on it, you'll probably see it darken in color due to the wate soaking into the plate. Like I said, it won't be much, but you'll probably want to avoid doing that in the future.

Dave


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 6, 2014)

Thanks, FrugalRefiner, I didn't think about that. I knew it, just didn't think of it. The whole process of recovery and refining has been a real treat for me so far. I know there is still a lot to learn, but I do enjoy it and will keep after it. I hope I can only get better at with time and understanding.


----------



## FrugalRefiner (Mar 6, 2014)

If I ever thought I had learned everything there was to know about recovery and refining, I would probably get bored very quickly and lose interest. Learning something new every day keeps it fresh and exciting. 

Dave


----------



## g_axelsson (Mar 7, 2014)

FrugalRefiner said:


> The broken pieces of plates will absorb some liquid, along with whatever might have been dissolved in it.


To minimize the losses to absorption, put the broken plates in water for a while before washing off the gold. This was one of my first advices I wrote on the forum.

Göran


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 7, 2014)

g_axelsson said:


> FrugalRefiner said:
> 
> 
> > The broken pieces of plates will absorb some liquid, along with whatever might have been dissolved in it.
> ...



I may try that before to long. I have 80 plus pounds of dish's left. All marked 18 to 23 Karat and heavily plated, as in large covered surface area. I only kept the ones with 10 or more square inches of plating. Most were free, but a few I paid 10 cents for. Might be enough to make it worth doing them by there self.


----------



## joubjonn (Mar 7, 2014)

i have tried doing plates in HCl/Cl before, it just turned into a huge pain in the butt for me. you either have to have a nice big bath for them or break them into a million pieces and after searching the forum i found that plates usually have very little gold plated, to the point that unless you have a big operation going with hundred or thousands of pounds and two-three rinse tanks i don't think it's worth messing with. just my two cents, give it a go, maybe you will have better luck then i did.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 7, 2014)

joubjonn said:


> i have tried doing plates in HCl/Cl before, it just turned into a huge pain in the butt for me. you either have to have a nice big bath for them or break them into a million pieces and after searching the forum i found that plates usually have very little gold plated, to the point that unless you have a big operation going with hundred or thousands of pounds and two-three rinse tanks i don't think it's worth messing with. just my two cents, give it a go, maybe you will have better luck then i did.



I can already see it being a real pain just from what I have done already. But I do have another few weeks off to play around. Luckily today I am watching a slow drop from my current adventure. That should keep me busy another day or two. I do think working up more boards would be better from a profit stand point, but I am trying to learn as much as I can right now, while putting bits of the pieces into small scale practice. I have sold several of the plates to collectors over the years, and have some that others are interested in, so those will be sold off. Most of them I gathered up in the early 90's when the "fever" hit me bad, luckily I put very, very little into any of them. And what I did spend has been recovered from the sales of only a very few and with a nice profit to boot.


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 9, 2014)

I just tried my micro stripping cell again using a computer power supply since I broke my good one. It seems to work but without having a meter, it was harder to tell for sure when it was done stripping. It also slowed the fan down each time when I first dipped the basket of parts in the acid. That only lasted for a second or so before it speeded back up. I'm not sure how much current this power supply can put out.

I think the thing to do is put a 12 volt light bulb (like a turn signal bulb) in series with one of the wires going to the cell as a visual indicator and also a protection in case of a short circuit. I didn't try that yet so I'm not sure it will work. It might cut the voltage down? If all else fails, I could hook up a meter to measure the current. I think my cheap meter can be set for 10 amp maximum which should be plenty for this cell. I'd hate to blow out my meter too, I think it might bypass the fuse to get the higher current level but I could be wrong.

Anyway, it does still work with the computer power supply so I can keep running my parts through it again. I still don't have a lot of pins and connectors so I probably won't be in any hurry to clean it up this time now that I know I can do it.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 9, 2014)

If the fan slows down when you use the power, you have a good power supply. The fan is inline, it replaces the need for the added resistor to keep it working. My meter is one that is one of those that clamps around one wire, and reads the amp or voltage depending on how it is set. Is there a label on the side of the power supply? It will tell you the amps per wire. The wire color can vary from different manufactures. I am doing my first wash now getting it ready to do the second refine later. Here is a video of the wiring a PSU into a lab type power supply. It is the best I have found and what I used with mine. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2oSFpKh_Uw


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 9, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> Is there a label on the side of the power supply? It will tell you the amps per wire.



Why didn't I think of that? There's a sticker right on the side showing all the wires, their voltage, and their current. Looks like I got 11 Amps at 12 volts and about the same or a little more at 3.3 volts so I'll bet this *would* work for a silver cell also.


----------



## niteliteone (Mar 9, 2014)

bmgold2 said:


> sharkhook said:
> 
> 
> > Is there a label on the side of the power supply? It will tell you the amps per wire.
> ...


Kadriver has a whole thread dedicated to using the computer power supply with his silver cell.
About 2 years ago


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 9, 2014)

Kadivers post was a help. But I got confused with the variations from different manufacturers of the units. That is when I looked around for more help with mine. 

bmgold2, be sure that amperage is for each wire, or all of them combined. 11 amps sounds pretty high for each wire. But, it could be right.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 9, 2014)

I need to thank kadriver anyway, again. I just watched one of his videos and spotted a mistake I made from watching it. That one will cost me a tiny bit of gold from my tiny bit. But I think I know how to recover it later. That won't happen again. Ready to start the second refine, I just need to think on it a bit and do some math.


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 10, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> Kadivers post was a help. But I got confused with the variations from different manufacturers of the units. That is when I looked around for more help with mine.
> 
> bmgold2, be sure that amperage is for each wire, or all of them combined. 11 amps sounds pretty high for each wire. But, it could be right.



I'm not real sure. I used the yellow (+12 Volt) wire and the black (common) wire to run my cell. Here's the sticker on the power supply.




Since I was only running one thing at a time, I only used one of the yellow wires. Maybe I should have combined all of the yellows together? Either way, it worked. My old power supply was only 3 amp maximum and, with the tiny basket I use on this micro stripping cell, I never maxed it out.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 10, 2014)

I think 11 amp is more than enough for the small cells. Mine has never went over 1.45 amp. I am going to try the 3.3 volt on mine and combine 2 to 3 wires just to be sure the amps are there is they are needed. I have a dimmer switch I am going to put on it so I can adjust the amps and see how that works as well. It should keep the amps from going to high. I don't know how well it work, but I can always start over, I have several PSU's to play with.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 10, 2014)

And the second refine. I used Poormans AR and thinking of using copperas to drop it. This is not filtered.


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 10, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> And the second refine. I used Poormans AR and thinking of using copperas to drop it. This is not filtered.



I really look forward to seeing what you get out of this. Is your copperas homemade? I'd like to try that just to see if I could drop the gold with something I made myself. The only problem I can see would be a little iron contamination but that should be easy enough to get back out of the gold powder in your washings. 

If you read this in time, could you try to take a picture of the powder before and after washing it? I'd like to see the difference in color. If not, just a picture of the resulting gold will do.

I just burnt the filter that I had originally used on my first try of my cell along with some I.C. chips that had visible gold wires. It won't be a very good test to see the yields of separate items but I hope it results in a little larger bead when I'm done. I'm not rushing this process so I hope to get fairly good quality on my next attempt. At least it has warmed up above freezing here so I can hopefully get a little more done. Still doing small scale testing so I don't have any idea how much gold I might get but I'm hoping for 1/2 a gram or more. We'll see. I'm sure the gold wires look like more than they really are but I'm hoping the filter from the gold stripping cell will add a little to my final result. I also have a little gold powder from a previous attempt that I didn't clean up yet since it wasn't enough to bother with.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 10, 2014)

I will try to get pictures as I go. My camera is acting up, and I haven't used it enough to be to familiar with it. I won't be using home made copperas, but I have some nice clean ones I bought. Still trying to decide on that as I have the SMB as well. My thinking is a drop with a different precipitant as well as a different solvent may remove something missed in the first refine and washing. The first drop didn't look very dark over all, but there were dark specks mixed in the powders. I lost a good bit in washing, but have found how to reduce that so maybe the loss this time won't be as bad,(I hope). I could see several tiny yellow specks in the first drop as well, that was a good feeling. Hope to see more this time, but if not, oh well, the gold is still there.


----------



## pgms4me (Mar 10, 2014)

HI every one. Some things to be aware of. If you use the computer power supply for the microcell it should be ok using one black and one yellow (12v), or instead of yellow the red(5v), But if your ammeter goes over 3 amps you should double up on the wires. Those individual wires are only meant to cary about 2 amps each. That is why on some of those connectors you see several of the same colors.They are needed to supply the max current for its intended use. If you use these on a larger cell under more or less continuos use, I would reccomend 4 blacks and 4 yellows,this would supply 10 amps without heating the wires. FYI, I have never needed to use the yellow(12v) wires on my cells, The red(5v) wires work fine for me


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 10, 2014)

pgms4me said:


> HI every one. Some things to be aware of. If you use the computer power supply for the microcell it should be ok using one black and one yellow (12v), or instead of yellow the red(5v), But if your ammeter goes over 3 amps you should double up on the wires. Those individual wires are only meant to cary about 2 amps each. That is why on some of those connectors you see several of the same colors.They are needed to supply the max current for its intended use. If you use these on a larger cell under more or less continuos use, I would reccomend 4 blacks and 4 yellows,this would supply 10 amps without heating the wires. FYI, I have never needed to use the yellow(12v) wires on my cells, The red(5v) wires work fine for me



Thanks, that is good info. It will help with a later project I want to try. Right now I plan to use the power supply from the electric cooler a bit longer for my cell.

I have a super fine brown powder dropping very quick now. Will try to do the washing tomorrow, if the rain holds off. This process went very quick compared to the other and hit no snags so far. I did use SMB, not sure why I decided to do it though. I added half the amount of SMB I calculated, based on guessing the weight of the powders, and the solution went clear, added the rest boom, instant brown. Quick settling now.


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 11, 2014)

I set my tiny cell back up and finished running all the material I had saved up. I tried the 5 volt wire and it worked but went back to using 12 volts because it seemed to work faster. I still don't know how much current I was using but, judging by my first tests of this cell using a power supply with volt and amp meters, I don't expect it was more than 3 amps at the most.

I really like this little stripping cell but, if you had much material to process, this one is just too small. My basket only holds a small pinch of pins and connectors at a time. This has worked fine for me but I'm really just experimenting and learning. I tear apart a few things and get some gold plated parts and then process them when I feel like it. Then it could be a while before I get another small batch of material to run through it. If you want to make money from doing this, my tiny version is not for you. If you just want to test the process out on a very small scale, then this size stripping cell might work for you. One advantage to it is that it only requires about 1/2 a cup of acid to set up. The disadvantage, besides the small size, is that it can heat up much faster than the larger version if you use it to strip a lot of parts in one sitting. That has never been a problem for me since I rarely have that many pins to do at a time.

I'm still hoping that between the gold from this cell and the other experiments (currently I.C. chips) I might someday get a gram of gold out of my scrap parts. I know, this sounds like I'm dreaming. Imagine getting THAT MUCH gold from garbage.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 11, 2014)

The powders have settled out and I see a few tiny gold specks. Not sure I can get them caught in the pictures, but will try. The powder is defiantly lighter in color and I can no longer see the black specks at all. All are slightly lighter than the first drop. I will try to wash them later this evening. 

I agree bmgold, the small cell is great for small amounts of materials. Mine is about right for the amounts I work with and is big enough to do a single piece of jewelry at a time. If I lost all the gold powders I have at this point, I would still be very happy. (hope that don't happen)I know how to get more! And from trash too. I have 2 pounds of IC and flat packs already off the boards. I think those may be the next educational trip for me. At least when this batch is finished.


----------



## rewalston (Mar 11, 2014)

Hey guys I have seen that you are using computer power supplies for your cells. I've attached a PDF that I downloaded off Instructables.com that I plan on using when I have the materials to build it. I believe that it will work for the gold cell as well as for the silver cell. Within the PDF are links to get parts that you are unable to obtain from re-purposing recycled components. I hope you like it.

Rusty


----------



## bmgold2 (Mar 11, 2014)

Thanks Rusty,

I don't know that I'll build my power supply exactly like what was shown but I got a lot of good ideas from that file. I hadn't even thought of adding a USB port but it makes sense that a computer power supply could easily power one to charge your phone or camera although you might not want them plugged in beside a running gold stripping or silver cell. I've got many more hobbies besides gold refining and can think of many uses for a good bench power supply.

It sure did make use of a lot of recycled materials to build it. I like it.


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 11, 2014)

That is a very nice setup. A bit more than I need right now, but have considered trying to build one later. There is a video on youtube somewhere of that same build. It does look even better in the video. Also look for a video about how to not build a lab power supply. Very nice piece that can be made and just plugs into the power supply. Kind of like an adapter. Not very difficult to build, I think.


----------



## Palladium (Mar 11, 2014)

http://www.nulltime.com/zincplating/shop_setup/plating_barrel/how_its_made/index.html

http://goldrefiningforum.com/~goldrefi/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=5092


----------



## Twright747 (Mar 13, 2014)

I just joined the forum and after searching the web i finely found what i been looking for real people to learn from thanks for sharing with me i do believe i'm gonna try now thanks


----------



## sharkhook (Mar 14, 2014)

Twright747 said:


> I just joined the forum and after searching the web i finely found what i been looking for real people to learn from thanks for sharing with me i do believe i'm gonna try now thanks



I would suggest reading a bit more first. There are many good posts on this subject on the forum. I am new at it, and this was my first experience with it. It isn't that hard, but there things you need to watch for, heat, fumes,gloves etc. Refining the recovered material is a different subject. A beast of another nature, so to speak. That is even more study, but it is all here on the forum. My first few weeks were heavily loaded with reading. I would bet I have read more on recovery and refining than I have read about everything else combined since I joined this sight. I did hit a few problems along the way with this, but from reading all I could find, I only had to ask a few questions, and I managed to work my way through those problems. I still haven't finished my final washing due to being a bit sick the last few days, and today has been my first trip outside, but I have some very pretty, pale brown powders to look at, and a few tiny golden specks, and that makes it worth while for me. 

Good Luck, and I hope you find your gold.

Edit: being sick was *not* from my refining adventures.


----------



## necromancer (Mar 14, 2014)

sharkhook said:


> Twright747 said:
> 
> 
> > I just joined the forum and after searching the web i finely found what i been looking for real people to learn from thanks for sharing with me i do believe i'm gonna try now thanks
> ...



yes, lots of great people here !! also lots of people that work or have worked in the recovery & refining industry. take your time do some reading & you will be on your way before you know it !!


----------



## davidrey (Jul 13, 2014)

I followed your model but the lead piece im using is getting dissolved when i connect it, will it be better to use titanium instead lead?


----------



## FrugalRefiner (Jul 13, 2014)

Are you sure you're making the connections right? The lead should be your cathode.

Dave


----------



## butcher (Jul 14, 2014)

FrugalRefiner is right on check the polarity.
Is your powersupply DC? 
An AC power supply will oxidize and reduce at both electrodes.

A faulty DC power supply can produce an AC ripple current, or even an AC current with bad or shorted rectifier diodes.


----------



## Shark (Jul 14, 2014)

I can hardly believe this post is still going. It gives me a good feeling to see it helping and encouraging others. 

davidrey:
What type of power supply are using?
I am pretty confident that FrugalRefiner and butcher are correct in the polarity as well, they both definitely have more experience at it than I do. If you can, post a picture of your setup, I would like to see other first time setups along with bmgold2's and mine. Pictures go along ways in helping new people at times, and helps to spot areas the more experienced can help you with. 

Good Luck!
Let us know how it works out for you.


----------



## Palladium (Jul 14, 2014)

Just a thought but what is the source of the lead? It could be tin.


----------

