# Need feedback on an Idea!!



## Anonymous (Dec 1, 2007)

Hello everyone,

After spending hours last night going through the info I found on the site it came to mind that even though I don’t have the expertise (yet) to add much in the way of helping many of you, there may be one thing I may be able to offer.

After being in IT for many years and running all sorts of projects I’ve become very good at organizing information and creating documents that have been very helpful in the past.

Now if you guys read this post and find that there is already something like what I’m about to describe then please point me to it, if not then chime in with your opinions on the idea.

What I’m proposing is this. When I looked at a lot of the information out there on the site the one thing that I found that was missing was a guide to what to look for. There are pictures and info scattered all through the site but even these are not a complete list as far as I can see. 

I’m imaging a word, PDF or spreadsheet that would be a list of information on all the parts that people will find including and maybe most importantly with a clear picture attached to the description.

With all of us having a varied degree of expertise and knowledge no one person can know all of the stuff we might find (well maybe Steve) and what metals and value it may have. More importantly what it looks like. This would be especially good for newbie’s since they may not have much knowledge of what to look for.

For example, if a list could be created of all the types of electrical components, including pictures, someone could find in a PC such as diodes, transistors, capacitors, switches, power supplies etc… it could really be helpful. It could also contain basic info like what a CD drive or hard drive looks like. Maybe things like what PC’s or cell phones to look for that would be the best to salvage. It could be a great help if there was a master document that showed a picture of what the things looks like and any pertinent information about them. This would not have to be technical data but information like what metals are to be found in it, is it worth processing and maybe hints on how to remove or handle it. After all why should we reinvent the wheel every time a person needs info on something that someone else has already worked with?

As I’ve noticed even less experienced members stumble upon new and interesting finds. If there was a document that each member could add pictures to and info about parts and devices it would make it much easier for all of us to use it as a reference document and help us when where out and about looking at new things to scavenge or buy. It would also be helpful in the sense of telling a person what there looking at inside a device and it could even be a real time saver for some of you gurus as far as explaining things to others especially newbie’s. You could just direct them to this reference list instead of repeating the same thing over and over. 

As new things are found they could be added as needed. To keep the entire thing from getting out of control and keeping some kind of standard to the format I would be willing to volunteer my time by having new items sent to me (just the pictures and info) and then I would add them to the document as needed. This could also help to prevent duplication as well. 

I would need all of you to take pictures of new items and submit the details and this would benefit all of us in the long run. I would start with creating a basic list from items I have and anything I can find on the site to add. Then anyone (especially Steve) who would like to add information about the items could do so by sending me the update to add to the doc. I would then update it and repost the current version to the tutorial section on the site maybe once a week or as needed 

Once the initial list is built it would require very little time on the part of all of you just add anything new and interesting to the list when you find it.

Well that’s the general idea. If anyone has any comments or suggestions please feel free to respond.

Tommy D.

All for one and one for all!! (As the musketeers might say!)


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## OMG (Dec 1, 2007)

Thats a great idea. I'd be willing to help out too.


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## lazersteve (Dec 1, 2007)

Tommy,

Here's a few links that are early attempts at doing just what you mentioned along with some other key information :

Guide to the Forum

Component Ids

Pc Exploded View

Surface Mounted Components

No Distillation Nitric Acid

Concentrating Battery Acid

Ralphs Guide to the Forum

*Various Yield Data Posts*

ISA Card Gold Yields

Slot 1 CPU Gold Yields

Plating Thickness Calculations

HDD Platter Tests

Palladium Pictures

Silver from Mylars


I need to revise my guide to the forum as it's getting outdated. My free time is next to nil now days, so I have neglected some of my earlier projects (  )

The original rough draft of my guide is designed around queries which produce more results as the forum is updated, so what is there should always pull from the latest posts in the forum database. I need to add more queries on the newer topics being discussed like Rhodium, PC parts, and prospecting.

Of course the above links merely scratch the surface of the true depth of the forum. I have several videos and information posts that have not made it to the forum yet. 

Harold and GSP are the true gurus here when it comes to years of hands on refining experience. I have knowledge of electronics, computers, and the refining thereof. Additionally, I have absorbed what I can from the forum.

I have developed some unique workarounds to AR as well which are helpful in today's politically sensitive environment. I am always researching new methods of extracting PMs from all types of scrap. 

I have recently found a new method for PGMs extraction from catalytic's which I'll be revealing soon. It's not my original idea, but I'm expanding on it so that it is suited to the hobbyist. It is much easier than AR and more environmentally friendly.

I have recently applied for a patent on a recovery technique applied to difficult ores in the mining industry. The patent office has received my submission and I have a patent pending number.

I'm still waiting on my special order fused quartz melting dishes to complete my PGM DVD.

That pretty much brings everyone up to date on my current ventures in the refining realm. Hopefully the links I provided will bring things into focus a little better for everyone.

Sorry for the long winded post.

Steve


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## jimdoc (Dec 1, 2007)

One thing I notice when searching for something on the
forum is that with all the discussion's about each subject,
it gets to be alot of material with the way it searchs all the
relevant and most current material. Then it is even difficult 
to find the info in the search results.
I was wondering if it is possible to make a section that could
contain all the formulas and other information that is "set in
stone" or agreed upon by all as important and correct, that
when you search for something it doesn't come up with every
discussion on the topic, just the final important conclusions
and facts?

Am I making sense? Is this possible to maybe mark certain
posts to come up in a different search of say "facts" or 
"formulas" and not come up with everything ever mentioned
about that subject? Or have a certain locked section for
important stuff so that searches would be easier there.

As awesome as this place is it does get overwhelming, and I
can imagine how it must be for the newbies, and also it may
help in keeping down the repeat questions. I know that Steve
is very busy, so I am not asking him to take on any more work
than he already does, but maybe somebody else with the know
how can check it out. I don't have a clue about most computer
and IT stuff or I would try to help out. 
Jim


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## Lou (Dec 1, 2007)

I think it's a good idea. Let me know how/if I can help!



Hey Steve, where are you ordering the quartz dishes from and how much are you paying? (Try vycor by the way, it's cheaper and almost as good). 

I'm doing some osmium and rhenium salts this week and will be reducing them with hydrogen. I can't find any of my quartzware!! So if you have a good source... don't be shy!


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## lazersteve (Dec 1, 2007)

Lou,

I ordered two round 65 mL dishes from Technical Glass Products early last month. They cost me $40.30 each plus shipping. I still haven't seen them. The company said they custom make each dish as it's ordered and to expect at least a three week delay.

Steve


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## Lou (Dec 1, 2007)

Ouch, what are you using them for? I think I've bought tube from them before, but I found a guy that sells quartz tubes for really cheap on ebay. 

You might want to try labx or ebay (occasionally you'll see someone on there who knows quartz from borosilicate).


Lou


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## lazersteve (Dec 1, 2007)

Lou,

I'll be melting my Pd and Pt in them.

I checked ebay and labx, no fused quartz dishes where available at the time. I shopped around quite a bit and this was the best price I could find.

I even considered buying some flat lasers lenses off ebay and attempting to create the concave dishes myself, but I have enough to do without reinventing the melting dish wheel. 

Do you know of any alternate materials which can be used for melting high temperature PGMs aside from the previously mentioned vycor?

I've melted Pd in a magnesite cupel before but I think I lost some metal in the process. It wanted to stick to the cupel instead of forming a nice button. Plus the cupel gave up the ghost after a very short time. 

Steve


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## Harold_V (Dec 1, 2007)

Lou said:


> (Try vycor by the way, it's cheaper and almost as good).



I don't advise it for platinum if a torch is used at the end of the calcining process. I had trouble with the metal fusing to the dish. Didn't have the same problem with palladium, likely because of the oxides created. 

Harold


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## Anonymous (Dec 1, 2007)

To everyone,

Thanks for the feedback. I’m really glad to see that my efforts have met with such good responses.

Just to update all of you I’m already working on the first draft of the document and hope to have a fist draft for all of you to review in a week or two. This first draft will be for the purpose of letting everyone see and comment on the format and usability of the document it will probably be short of having the complete list of items that will be listed the Table of Contents.

In response to jimdoc I see where your going with your idea of a special area for important info, yes you where making sense.

I think that could be a good idea but it may have some control problems getting everyone to add to that section without it becoming overwhelming in itself or becoming messy and hard to use. Even in this and many other threads I’ve noticed that people get off the subject and have somewhat of a private conversation on other subjects.

For these and other reason I hope that creating a document that people can download and print will help control the information overload. Having one person maintain and keep the format standardized is much cleaner. Think of this and other documents I’m considering putting together (Yield tables, Chemical info sheets and some others) as an organized and quick reference to all of the knowledge everyone has contributed to the site. Who knows if this works out maybe all the members who contribute can have access to the documents to sell on ebay.

As far as the concerns of being able to search the information in the document it should be very easy to create a table of contents that is linked to the appropriate section so finding the information with one click on the subject should be fairly easy. I can do this with PDF, Word or Excel. I’ve written many training manuals and technical documents in my career in IT so this should be fairly easy. It’s the gathering and organizing of the info that will take a little time and it will be an ongoing process as more info becomes available. The ultimate goal I’m reaching for is to create a easy to use, simply explained reference guide. I’m not going to create something as complex and technical as the GOLD REFINING FORUM HANBOOK VOL 1.pdf. 

One last thing, anyone who wants to help can do so in the following ways.
1)	Take pictures of things you have that are not on the forum and add some info about them, (I.E. what metals did you find in them, are they worth processing and any helpful hints as to where you found them (in what device or place) then send them to me so I can add them to the document.
2)	When the first couple of drafts are posted, download them, look them over and give me any feedback you can (as they say the only dumb question is the one not asked).
3)	Keep your eyes open for other links or sites that you may come across that have pictures or info that could be helpful and send the links to me so I can see what I can use.
4)	Feel free to email or PM me on any other questions or ideas you may have in regards to this subject. (I can be reached directly at [email protected])


Have a great day and keep the PM flowing! 

Tommy D.


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## aflacglobal (Dec 1, 2007)

> I’m not going to create something as complex and technical as the GOLD REFINING FORUM HANBOOK VOL 1.pdf.



Yes, i'm guilty of not finishing my work to.
I have more irons in the fire than i can handle now. 
I tried to keep up with some of the earlier forum post for the forum handbook. It was suposed to be multi-volumed, butttttttttt, I kind of keep getting side tracked. I think it would be a great idea to continue to compile the information in some type format. :wink: 

Steve, Does that idea have anything to do with Barrick ?
Or is it for something to do with electronic scrap gold processing ?


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## lazersteve (Dec 2, 2007)

Ralph said:


> Steve, Does that idea have anything to do with Barrick ?



The patent application is related to the mining industry. I feel Barrick could benefit from it's use. 

Steve


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## aflacglobal (Dec 2, 2007)

Have you submitted it to them yet ? They have a place on their website for just that type of thing.
They also have that thing going on with the unlock the value thing right now, have you checked it out yet ?


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## Noxx (Dec 2, 2007)

TAD,
if the PDF is too large, or if you want, I can host it on the server instead of in the forum. And I could also make it password protected so only those registered here could download it...


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## Platdigger (Dec 3, 2007)

lazersteve said:


> Ralph said:
> 
> 
> > Steve, Does that idea have anything to do with Barrick ?
> ...



What patent is that Steve? 
I think I missed were you said this.
Randy


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

Steve, 

I've been on the phone with Barrick most of the morning about the unlock the value program. It seems that they want me to pull my submittal from the program and resubmit it thru a different department. These folks have a weird Corp. structure. :roll: They want me to submit it thru their International research division. Something about the scientific judging part, go figure. Any way their are 41 submitters so far for the value program. 

My point is ? I know the people to get you started with it if you want them to take a look at your idea. It as taken me a couple of months to wade thru their corp bull crap to get that far. Might save you some time. Just a thought.


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## lazersteve (Dec 3, 2007)

Ralph,

My proposal was accepted by Barrick without any problems last week. My biggest delay was getting my Patent Application numbers back and even that went pretty smooth. 

Steve


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

Seeing as how you have some protection in place may i ask what your approach to the situtation was for the problem at Barrick ?


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## lazersteve (Dec 3, 2007)

Ralph,

I'm sure you'll understand if I wait until after Phase I in January to disclose that information. I'll be glad to let everyone know after the proposal entry deadline for the contest.

Steve


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

:wink:


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## lazersteve (Dec 3, 2007)

Ralph,

[edit deleted]

Your idea has merit, but is much too complex for my tastes. I have devised a method that I can test and demonstrate for Barrick with little or no outside assistance from any other individual(s). 

[edit deleted]

My idea is completely original and in no way uses anything you mentioned in any of your emails. 

[edit deleted]

Steve


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

Oh, no problem steve. I just have to make sure brother. Please don't take offense to my asking. I think the world of you and respect your knowledge 110 %. That's why i value your view. 

So, are you still willing to look at it ?  

I'm not submitting until the day before. I still need more time. :roll: 

Thanks, Steve. :wink:


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

Oh, and good luck Steve. :wink: 
May the best duck win. :shock:


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## lazersteve (Dec 3, 2007)

Ralph,

I just read thru your previous post a little better. 

Let me put your mind to rest with these facts:

My Patent and Barrick Solution *does not* mention or utilize:

 EMF
 Diatoms
 Micro Organisms
 Eletrolytic Techniques
 RF
 Shattering
 Genetically engineered organisms
 Induction Heating
 Shaped Waveforms

Hopefully this puts your mind at rest. You and everyone here will see my idea and the truth will be known come January.

Steve


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## loco (Dec 3, 2007)

so january when you expect to have patent items all taken care of? or is that the release of your new dvd? and for couriousity sake with your new idea on processing converters, in the dvd when it's finished do you plan on covering the method you mentioned useing AR or the new idea or both?


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

Actually i found a new direction to take after doing some more research in the beginning. I just trashed the Diatoms completely. I found an even better approach. 

Please don't hate me.


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## loco (Dec 3, 2007)

the K.I.S.S. method is my friend!!! LOL


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

Yes, believe it or not that's what i finally opted for.
Simple in design, complex in nature.

Well, i do try . :?


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## lazersteve (Dec 3, 2007)

loco said:


> so january when you expect to have patent items all taken care of? or is that the release of your new dvd? and for couriousity sake with your new idea on processing converters, in the dvd when it's finished do you plan on covering the method you mentioned useing AR or the new idea or both?



Loco,

The patent has nothing to do with the PGM DVD. 

I'm considering adding a segment to the PGM DVD with an overview of the new method, but it will delay the DVD yet again. Currently the DVD covers only the use of Muriatic, Nitric, and AR for PGM recovery and processing. I've done some math on the new method and it looks promising. The ingredients are easily accessible, cheap, and relatively safe. The big down fall to the new method is that I have never used it myself. This fact alone may keep it off the DVD.

I still have a few segments to film and then I can finish up the editing and final production. I'm shooting for pre-Christmas now.

Steve


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## lazersteve (Dec 3, 2007)

Ralph said:


> Please don't hate me.



Ralph,

No harm, no foul.

I'm pretty even headed and it takes more than a simple misunderstanding to rile me. 

It's all good.

Steve


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## aflacglobal (Dec 3, 2007)

You are the man Steve. Thanks for understanding. I guess i'm so use to having to watch my back. This is the one place i try and keep honest.
Dam, now the voices are starting again.

What's that :?: 

Used Hamster for sale.
Cheap :!: 
Comes with setup package. Wheel not included. 
Hamster may have issues. :shock: :shock: :shock:


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## Noxx (Dec 4, 2007)

Ha Ha :lol:


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## arthur kierski (Feb 19, 2008)

iwould like to know if someone has some notion of how much platinum,palladium and rhodium in catalitic converters?


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## goldenjack (Mar 31, 2008)

"My free time is next to nil now days" Man i know that feeling I got three kids and work 65 hours a week the only reason I am on the computer is i am to wound up to go to bed. I don't know how you do it steve to go to work and make videos and make lots of gold and work on the web site ect. my hats off to you .


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