# Metal mesh catylitic



## qst42know (Nov 1, 2008)

Has anyone here run into these yet. Made of a woven metal mesh and rolled into a cylinder. I would guess any PMs present could be fully recovered.


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## Platdigger (Nov 1, 2008)

What is this from?
Randy


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## qst42know (Nov 1, 2008)

It is from a Kawasaki engine made to run indoors on propane. A floor buffer. I haven't done any testing for content yet other than heating to red and applying raw propane it does catalyze.


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## DNIndustry (Nov 26, 2008)

I would say platinum...Coleman just came out with a propane heater that uses Pt to catalyze propane. Saw it walmart.


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## Lino1406 (Nov 29, 2008)

Platinized titanium


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## Lou (Nov 29, 2008)

If it is platinized titanium then he should just leave it alone, as platinized Ti is quite a find! Very useful to many people who do electrochemistry.

He said he'd gotten this out of a catalytic converter, correct?


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## lazersteve (Nov 29, 2008)

Lou,

I have some titanium rods that I would like to plate with platinum. 

Can I just make some chloroplatinic acid and electroplate the rods to be used in my electrolysis devices?

Steve


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## qst42know (Nov 29, 2008)

I dissolve a piece about the size of half a postage stamp in HCL and homemade nitric. Heated until all that would dissolve did. The mesh is non-magnetic I have been fooled by iron compounds before. The solution is dark green. SnCl test is a faint brown. The green is un-reacted solution the blue is somewhere in between. Is there a more definitive test?


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## Lou (Nov 29, 2008)

Sadly Steve, no you cannot. I have tried several times to do just that and it has been a crapshoot. Occasionally I get an adherent plating of platinum black, and then I anneal it in a hydrogen flame and it works OK for a few days then it starts flaking.

In fact, I got so frustrated with it, I sent about $500 worth of Pt and CP4 grade titanium that I plasma cut up into strips to Tim Williams (also the fellow who built the induction furnace).
Here are some pertinent links from his site:
http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms/Chem_Chlorate3.html
http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms/Chem_Bromate.html
http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms/Chem_Titanium.html

He had initial success with his limited setup. I also gave him some ammonium bifluoride and other chemicals to use as an etchants for preparing the surface. That seemed to help. I can also send you some bifluoride if you'd like, of course it is free.

He struggled with an acidic bath for quite a while but failed to achieve any kind of consistency let alone a durable anode. He did make perchlorate with it.

In the end, I figured I'd just give up on an easy platinum plate and do it via the classical technique by the use of ''P-salt'' (the industry name) which is cis-dinitrodiammine platinum (II) of the formula [Pt(NO2)2(NH3)2]

If you want to do it Steve, this is what you must do:

Obtain or make K2PtCl4 (which incidentally, you may still have--I believe I sent you a bottle of this?). If you need help making it, I will advise you of what to do. 

You can do this practically one pot if you start from K2PtCl4 instead of K2PtCl6 which obviously is in the wrong valence.

My procedure:
42.0g of finely pulverised potassium platinum (II) chloride is added to 27.0g of fine sodium (or K) nitrite. This is stirred and chilled whereupon sodium chloride will crystallise out. This may be filtered if desired, but it isn't detrimental to the reaction. You now have a solution of K2Pt(NO2)4. This ice-cold, greenish yellow solution is then reacted with a stoichiometric quantity of concentrated aqueous ammonia. More dilute ammonia (15% w/w) can be used but at the expense of a longer reaction and more water to evaporate. The green colouration will disappear and you will note a light straw yellow colour indicating the successful reaction and shortly thereafter your complex will precipitate as whitish needles. This is then filtered and washed with cold distilled water; this filtrate is added back to the left over supernatant. That supernatant is then concentrated, preferably with a rotavapor, chilled ice-cold and then a second crystallization initiated with a seed crystal of the first product crop.

This complex can be dissolved in ammonia water and used to plate an adherent, durable coat of platinum onto properly treated substrates. Treating your titanium anode-to-be requires an extensive degreasing followed by conc. warm HCl dip, then dH2O dip, then sulfuric/ammonium bifluoride dip, then dip in conc. hot lye and off to the plating bath with it.

As an aside, be sure to exercise caution with the dry complex, it is mildly sensitive to shock or grinding and can violently deflagrate upon heating past ~200 or so C.


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## lazersteve (Nov 29, 2008)

Lou,

I'm interested in trying this out.

I'll need some of the biflouride. If you need my address again PM me.

I still have all the Pt salts you mentioned.

Steve


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## qst42know (Nov 29, 2008)

Does anyone know anything about base metal catalysts? 

I have found some snippet's while browsing regarding base metal cats. Some articles you have to pay for and some patents not specifically for this material. 

Anyone here up to date on this branch of science?


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## lazersteve (Nov 29, 2008)

Gst,

Yes, there are many base metal catalyst, both compounds and metals (i.e: Raney Nickel, several copper compounds, Lewis Acids, etc. ). 

They are used extensively in organic reactions.

Steve


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## qst42know (Nov 29, 2008)

Some of the browsing seemed to indicate use in reducing internal combustion byproducts. 

How little pm does SnCl detect. The brown is very faint but there.


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