# CRT monitors



## dtectr (Aug 13, 2010)

Based on what I've been able to find, the main hazardous waste from CRT's is the phosphor coating on the inside of the screen (what makes it GLOW) which vents/atomizes when the vacuum is breached. The few videos of U.S. recyclers processing these shows them breaking the seal in a controlled atmosphere then merely vacuuming up the phosphor with a true hepa filtered vac system.

My questions - 
is there a safe use for collected phosphor?
if not, How difficult is it to dispose of?
& is there lead in the glass of those? (none of them seem to be addressing that). i did see here somewhere that some refiners, large scale refineries (i forget the industry) powder the glass & use it as a flux. would that be economically feasible for some of you large scale recyclers/

I'm sure you've all been through this before, but i had some ideas on a set-up, but wanted to check options before i invest more than time.

thanks


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## jimdoc (Aug 13, 2010)

I would say there is lead in the crt glass for sure,to protect
the user from radiation.

http://computer.howstuffworks.com/question678.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathode_ray_tube

Jim


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## pinwheel (Sep 28, 2010)

I am told it is lead oxide and cannot be recovered from the glass, but I think they are lying to me. It has many pounds of lead in them.


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## patnor1011 (Sep 28, 2010)

Hardly lying. Truth is that nobody want to touch that. My friend have several tons of that and he said that the only thing is to wait until somebody will figure out what to do with that glass. He was told that it may be used in construction of highways in a mix with concrete, asphalt or whatever is used for roads. That is basically putting stuff under carpet...


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## jimdoc (Sep 28, 2010)

It is probably recoverable,but not at the cost of recovery.Or without an expensive setup,like the big companies catalytic converter setups.And they aren't going to waste their time with lead,when they can go for the platinum, palladium and rhodium.

Jim


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## pinwheel (Sep 28, 2010)

Here is how it was explained to me by a sales rep from a manufacturing company who sells the equipment to deal with crts.

There are something like 4 plants in the USA that can do this. There will likely never be another plant with positive numbers put into place. The market is all about dead, but alas we still have many crts incoming all over the place.

The closest one to me is in Yuma and you have to pay them $8 each to refine and they are back logged. You also have to get them there.

The lead in the glass is not recoverable so all you end up with is lead oxide glass and that can be used for only one thing... New CRTs.

Now here is the problem. This was all well and good when crts had a market in the states. The flat panels came out and killed that instantly. Then the market moved overseas. Now FPMs are so cheap that the crts overseas are fast becoming obsolete too which means there will be all the lead oxide glass available and no market for it.

So unless you can invent a market and product for it that makes sense, its game over.

This is how I understand the situation as told to me from this person.

I have no way to verify this data except that other minor evidence has not run counter to this.


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## Chumbawamba (Sep 29, 2010)

Wow, good information. I never knew. I always thought the lead was smelted out. What a disappoint.

But I'd still like to know the technical reasons why the lead can't be converted from PbO to Pb.


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## escrap (Sep 29, 2010)

It is recoverable, but jimdoc you are right that it is not cost effective. The money that is put into the equipment and the energy needed is the problem, that is why there is a fee associated with recycling. Currently the Doe Run company out of Boss Mo is doing a lot of this recycling. 

http://doerun.com/WHATWEDO/RECYCLING/tabid/74/language/en-US/Default.aspx. 

They will not except clients that are from two states away due to the large amount of material that they have. Their current charge for accepting this material is 165/ton. We have taken them quite a bit of screens and their operation is very nice. We have stopped dismantling screens and started getting rid of them whole. We currently charge 5.00/monitor and get rid of them for 1.00/monitor. This saves us in time and money. We could really be making a killing if we would take them to the steel yard down the road. The owner of the steel yard stopped in one day and told us he would buy all the monitors from us for 100/ton. Bad thing is that he runs them through his shredder and sends the lead to the landfill.


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## pinwheel (Sep 29, 2010)

Does he have a shredder that is self contained and filtered? Man that must be some dust around those scrap yards with shredders. But it is not a bad idea to convert them to the zorba pile. In small quantities they might get away with this. After all there is lead in the tire weights and such on the cars so any test would show some lead anyway.

Yes lead cannot be recycled economically from the glass and that is why there is a fee. If your fee is only $1 that is pretty good. I could live with that as there is $4-5 of scrap around the tube. Here they charge $8-$12.


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## escrap (Sep 29, 2010)

You know I don't know if he has a dust or filtration system on it. It is a very large shredder that separates out all ferrous and non-ferrous metals so it may. But the dollar fee is for the whole monitor. We use to tear them apart but it is much better for us to just get rid of them whole.


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## samuel-a (Sep 29, 2010)

patnor1011 said:


> Hardly lying. Truth is that nobody want to touch that. My friend have several tons of that and he said that the only thing is to wait until somebody will figure out what to do with that glass. He was told that it may be used in construction of highways in a mix with concrete, asphalt or whatever is used for roads. That is basically putting stuff under carpet...




i would love to know what you or your friend have to say about this company:
http://www.crt-recycling.co.uk/

do you know them?


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## Harold_V (Sep 29, 2010)

Funny, how what used to be revered is now considered hazardous waste! (Think cut leaded glass, such as in crystal).

Harold


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## EDI Refining (Sep 29, 2010)

escrap said:


> The owner of the steel yard stopped in one day and told us he would buy all the monitors from us for 100/ton. Bad thing is that he runs them through his shredder and sends the lead to the landfill.



This is a CRIME in my opinion. You should report him!


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## pinwheel (Sep 29, 2010)

Even this UK site claims that they do not extract the lead.

"The key objective of our process is the production of a very high quality secondary raw material product in the form of the cleaned glass. This glass can and is used in the remanufacture of CRT televisions."

This is the problem that I was talking about.

I spoke to the Doe Run company. They are charging $200 per ton from Boss Missouri which is I think about $2 a monitor roughly speaking.


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## dtectr (Sep 29, 2010)

the lead smelting industry buys and uses the clean glass (silica & lead) as a flux in smelting & refining. 
The problem would be providing the quantity necessary. Doe Run/Buick Mill is a lead mill in Boss, MO. 
They aren't "recycling", as in for "Reduce or Reuse" as such, but rather using them in smelting raw lead ore. 

This leads me to a point I've brought up several times, which is, why don't several of us form some 
type of a cooperative effort to get the quantities we need?


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## pinwheel (Sep 29, 2010)

No one will want to because its not profitable to do it. If you charge people in the public to dispose of them, you can expect your business to fail on that side of things. It might work with certain corporate clients, but even then I would be still more nervous about charging them.


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## escrap (Sep 29, 2010)

We charge the general public and have not problems at all. But then again we pay for towers and other items. As far as the leaded glass goes dtectr, we have brought them 40,000 lbs before, they still charge for it, however it is a little bit less. 

P3M, he has been reported on several occasions that i know of. But as of right now in the state of Illinois it is not illegal to send it to the landfill. This is right out of public act 95.

Except as may be provided pursuant to subsection (e) of
this Section, and beginning January 1, 2012, no person may
knowingly cause or allow the mixing of a CED, or any other
computer, computer monitor, printer, or television with
municipal waste that is intended for disposal at a landfill.


There is a really big problem here in Illinois because there is just not enough recyclers and Southern counties are starting to develop huge problems. We hope to be there to help landfills comply with this new law.


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## pinman (Sep 29, 2010)

"the lead smelting industry buys and uses the clean glass (silica & lead) as a flux in smelting & refining." 

This is also what I was told by a spokesman at ecs refining.


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## patnor1011 (Sep 29, 2010)

My friend do not have much contacts in england. His place is based in the middle of europe so his main partners are mostly closer based german and dutch companies. When he dismantle crt he can cut screen on two pieces - one (the front of screen) is normal glass only the back part is lead-glass. That one is then cut to granule size and used mostly as component in building roads.


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## escrap (Sep 29, 2010)

This may be true, but I think what it boils down to is supply and demand. The supply is enormous while the demand is not.


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## dtectr (Sep 29, 2010)

patnor1011 said:


> When he dismantle crt he can cut screen on two pieces - one (the front of screen) is normal glass only the back part is lead-glass. That one is then cut to granule size and used mostly as component in building roads.



This is important - _one (the front of screen) is normal glass only the back part is lead-glass_ - can someone verify the accuracy of this? i was wondering about the same thing - two industry methods for processing these involves opening them to remove phosphors. Both seperate on that imaginary line, but both halves are placed in the same container for disposition, so I don't know.

the problem with "road building" use, at least according to EPA, is that lead can leach out of the glass & into groundwater. That's a stretch, I think, but I'm not the scientist.


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## patnor1011 (Sep 29, 2010)

Well I am not an expert too I can only toss in what I learned from my friend and how he does things. According to him the biggest amount of lead or percentage of lead on crt is on back part of glass which is usually thick painted - that paint is actually what we speak about -lead.


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## patnor1011 (Sep 29, 2010)

escrap said:


> This may be true, but I think what it boils down to is supply and demand. The supply is enormous while the demand is not.



Yes. That is why they are storing this glass (broken to small pieces) and wait for solution. Other values are fully recovered and maybe later somebody will figure out how to get rid of that elephant in a room.


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