# High grade gold ore in difficult location.



## cuchugold (Oct 28, 2017)

Please post any and all suggestions for recovery/concentration of high grade vein and placer ore (5 oz per Ton and higher), in a very remote and inhospitable location, with no steady water, roads, etc. Only stuff that is available on site is wood if you need a furnace, fish and game for food within 1 mile, but no chance of getting a pipeline for water or fuel. Have made some experiments off location using a modified cupola furnace with several additions of litharge and flour once the charge is liquid. Building a large 10 Ton cupola on location is difficult, but doable. Results aren't good so far. Also any ideas for fluxing the charge which is mainly 65 % quartz and 25% clay, and about 1% coltan.


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## cuchugold (Oct 29, 2017)

To clarify: 
1-The ore cannot be transported out of the site.
2-There are no access roads.
3-A large plant cannot be established on the site.
4-The current solution of smelting the rock is not working because the temperature cannot get high enough to melt the quartz. There is no way to bring or make an oxygen plant on the site.
5-All labor must be manual, or very rudimentary.
6-It is hard to accumulate or build a water deposit, or a mill.
7-Mining this site is a clandestine operation, subject to high personal risks.


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## Platdigger (Oct 29, 2017)

After crushing, about what percentage of that 5/oz per ton would you say is free gold?


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## cuchugold (Oct 29, 2017)

From placer it is 100% free gold. From vein, who knows really?. It would depend on the crushing/milling method. I don't want to crush it with a mortar by hand.


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## snoman701 (Oct 29, 2017)

Arid? 

1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th world environment?

#7, risk of death? Incarceration? 

Cyanide still seems like it would be more reasonable than melting flint, as unless you can find a suitable flux nearby, you will not be able to attain a glass with a low enough viscosity to collect the gold prills.

What other minerals are present nearby? You really need something with a lot of sodium or potassium salt present to get that melting point down.

Do you have constant sunlight or wind for an alternative power solution?



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## cuchugold (Oct 29, 2017)

It's all precambrian rock, and sediments thereof. All sort of stuff somewhere within a few miles, but not really accessible, because it's hard to move around and bring things to the site. Impossible to set a plant or a visible operation. There is rain water and seasonal streams, but without pumps, etc. The placer can be panned, but it's hard work for low volume. All sorts of military and gangs rule the surroundings, but the territory is vast. Really one does not want to attract attention.


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## im1badpup1 (Oct 29, 2017)

Dig a pit a large one take lots of plastic tarpaulin lightweight sheets and catch rainfall when it comes directed to the pit. Dont forget to line the pit with tarp. Have it covered over to prevent evaporation and provide some stealth at least to its storage.
Have a second dry pit dug to store materials youve lugged up there or are using in.
Take a fresnel lens to heat water start fires melt bits of rock with. They easily reach 1300c and more. Thats celcius not farenheit. U can get one off front of a old tv check on youtube what u can do with one.
You could rig a primitive hammer mill up with the right pulley gearing system and a windmill. Or attach to back wheel of a bicycle and pedal it like an exercise bike.
Say like a timber A frame with something like a tree trunk on a rope suspended. A gear system to lighten the weight u have to pull it up and a slip so it drops sharply
A half ton trunk on its end would probably only need to drop a foot or so to crush fist size rocks to nothing.


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## snoman701 (Oct 29, 2017)

cuchugold said:


> It's all precambrian rock, and sediments thereof. All sort of stuff somewhere within a few miles, but not really accessible, because it's hard to move around and bring things to the site. Impossible to set a plant or a visible operation. There is rain water and seasonal streams, but without pumps, etc. The placer can be panned, but it's hard work for low volume. All sorts of military and gangs rule the surroundings, but the territory is vast. Really one does not want to attract attention.



So what do you plan on smelting 10 tons of ore with in regards to fuel? Ever tried to get a small chamber up to 1400 deg F with wood only? It's difficult even when you have good fuel and excellent refractory...and are only heating air. (studio pottery and glass blowing experience, both of which basically require doing what you are trying to do) 

I can see lots of ways you could do guerilla mining and recovery of concentrates, even treatment of concentrates, on a small scale, but when you start talking about crushing ore, smelting, etc you are talking about very visible/attention attracting activities. 

How do you plan on moving your ore? All by hand?


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## cuchugold (Oct 29, 2017)

Thanks for the ideas. I do not have a solution I like yet for the vein gold. The cupola does not melt the quartz below 1700 C, and not with wood. A normal cupola is for converting copper oxide to copper at about 1100 C. My plan is to finish off as much as I can the placer deposits using a rocker and pan. I have not found the big vein yet. I'll keep looking, and blasting rock during storms. The thing is, at some point I have to favor mining what I have already over looking for bigger and better deposits. This is more than good enough.


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## snoman701 (Oct 29, 2017)

Yes, but you don't have copper oxide, you have a very rich ore with high melting temperature minerals that is low in metal.

You need to find a fluxing material that you can move if you want to smelt. The way I have done this in the past for glaze development is to make a spot plate out of clay...just literally a plate with thumbprint depressions. Then I'd put a gram of different minerals in each depression and fire to a known temperature. If I was doing this in the field, I'd take pre-made spot plates, that have etched numbers on them. In each depression, put a different formulation of first, just materials you think may flux well. Feldspar, dolomite, whiting, etc. You can determine your best melt by heating and measuring how far it "spreads". Once you've found your best flux, then you start to mix your ore with flux at different ratios to see what one you can realistically achieve. 

You need a way to get oxygen to the fire. A traditional mexican (I think) pottery burner uses a venturi burner with zero electrical input. So you have your tapered tube, but at the front of it is a piece of pipe. This piece of pipe has a tank of oil hooked up to it as well as an orifice at the small part of the tapered tube. This sprays oil when the oil in the big part of the tapered tube is heated, forcing combustion air through the tapered tube. 

Now, I doubt you've got oil...but even a small wood fire will move a large volume of air. If you have fuel (pit made charcoal) in the cupola, you MIGHT be able to maintain a temperature that will glass the ore and hopefully concentrate values.


I still think you'd be better with cyanide. Read this thread, and consider that your ore is as rich as most e-scrap, without all of the other base metals which confuse the issue for e-scrap. It's easy to get cell voltage and enough flow just using batteries and solar cells, which could be very easily hidden in a tree. 

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=24899


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## snoman701 (Oct 29, 2017)

To add...sluicing could be done away from water source using a ram pump if you have sufficient changes in elevation. No electricity....just uses gravity flow of existing elevation change to pump water long distances. 


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## cuchugold (Oct 29, 2017)

At these grades, *IN THEORY*, you have to do gravity concentration, before cyanidation of the tailings IMO. Not really worth your time to do tailings, when there is so much high grade ore. First you pick up the large nuggets, then the smaller, then the dust, then centrifugate, then cyanide, etc. The issue is the plant and visibility. Many operations have been shut down, equipment stolen, miners missing, etc. Nobody really owns this land. The wild west or Alaska were a cocktail party compared to these criminals/military, etc. Right now is a bad time to get down there as the new governor is exterminating the gangs loyal to the old governor, military, etc, etc, etc. 
I repeat: This is a clandestine operation, to be kept small, and private. I move in and out at dawn/dusk, make noise only during storms, etc. Smuggle the gold out using a very safe protocol. You can hear anyone coming since it is perfect solitude. Few can handle this level of freedom. The area is the size of Spain, but only a few thousand people are dispersed throughout the territory. There is gold, diamonds, Uranium, Coltan, etc, etc, etc, In amounts that rival the original deposits of California, Colorado or the Klondike, or wherever. These are the original, oldest rocks on the planet. All valuable minerals are here. Come and get them!.

All international mining corps have lost millions trying to operate here. Chinese, russians, etc, etc. They come and die by malaria, bullet, boredom, or else.

Jimmie Angel (Angel Falls named after he landed on the wrong mountain of gold), spent most of his adventuring life here, before I was born, looking for "the river of gold". Many stories, some true, some myth, but tons of gold on the ground. I'll leave the lesser minerals for others.


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## snoman701 (Oct 29, 2017)

You should read up on the ram pump. One could be concealed very very easily.


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## Deano (Oct 29, 2017)

Technically you have three options.

Somehow get water to the plant to set up a leach operation.

Dry mill the ore and sluice it to get a con which can be packed out, recycling of water can be practiced. Accept that large losses will occur in your processing.

Walk away from the whole operation.


Deano


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## snoman701 (Oct 29, 2017)

Deano said:


> Walk away from the whole operation.



Best option! 

The snakes with scales are the first thing that would have me opting for option three, followed closely by snakes with guns.


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## geedigity (Oct 29, 2017)

It almost sounds like a book or movie is being written here. 

Think about this, the mere traveling to and from your home to the "mining" site sounds like a matter of life and death. Every time you make the trip, your chances of encountering those you don't want to encounter increases.

We talk about safety as it relates to recovery and refining of precious metals. If you ask me, please stop what you are doing. This has the makings of a very bad outcome that pales in comparison to what is routinely stated here on this forum when some member uses chemicals without knowing what they are doing. Your life is worth more than 5 toz per ton. Heck, there are unworked mines with 8 toz per ton that have access to water, power and roads and they sit because it is not economical, That is due reportedly to the fact that the only two smelters left (Arizona and Idaho) are too far away and the price of gold would need to be $3,000 per troy ounce with everything else staying the same.


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## cuchugold (Oct 30, 2017)

Deano said:


> Technically you have three options.
> 
> Somehow get water to the plant to set up a leach operation.
> 
> ...


Straight up!. That's the truth. Thanks for the objective appraisal, Deano.


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## cuchugold (Oct 30, 2017)

geedigity said:


> It almost sounds like a book or movie is being written here.
> 
> Think about this, the mere traveling to and from your home to the "mining" site sounds like a matter of life and death. Every time you make the trip, your chances of encountering those you don't want to encounter increases.
> 
> We talk about safety as it relates to recovery and refining of precious metals. If you ask me, please stop what you are doing. This has the makings of a very bad outcome that pales in comparison to what is routinely stated here on this forum when some member uses chemicals without knowing what they are doing. Your life is worth more than 5 toz per ton. Heck, there are unworked mines with 8 toz per ton that have access to water, power and roads and they sit because it is not economical, That is due reportedly to the fact that the only two smelters left (Arizona and Idaho) are too far away and the price of gold would need to be $3,000 per troy ounce with everything else staying the same.


The novel or movie is not a bad idea, but there are better ones, like Jimmies' life far more interesting, that failed already. As to the safety moving in or out or being there, I feel pretty good about it. Cities are less safe, IMO.


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## cuchugold (Oct 30, 2017)

Typical nuggets I pan, along with lot more fines. I showed them to some amateur and he immediately said: Get a good metal detector!. What an idiot I am!...Any recommendations for best quality and portable size (less than 30 kg in weight)?. These are the bigger size nuggets I find. If I can find the vein that originated them (if it still exits), I'm golden... literally.


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## cuchugold (Oct 30, 2017)

Request made at the metal detector site:
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/gold-prospecting/558814-please-recommend-metal-detector-specific-mining-purpose.html#post5587677
"I have access to a site that produces the small nuggets depicted in the attached photo. There are also plenty of smaller gold particles, that also count.

I wish to detect these in quantity before determining where to dig.

I need a portable detector that is very sensitive and detects as deep as possible, but weighs less than 30 Kg.

I favor sensitivity over discrimination, as there is no trash or other metals present at the mine site.

I'd like the main detector also to work on quartz rock to determine if there are veins of gold deep inside, before I blast the rock.

I also would like to have a separate miniature detector to lower with a rope down a small deep hole (like a drilling core) made to see if near bedrock there is a lot of gold. I have seen some the size of a flashlight.

Thanks to any and all responses, in advance."


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## anachronism (Oct 30, 2017)

cuchugold said:


> All international mining corps have lost millions trying to operate here. Chinese, russians, etc, etc. They come and die by malaria, bullet, boredom, or else.



Well that says it all really. Jog on.


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## cuchugold (Oct 30, 2017)

Mining is a weird business. Only profitable at the low end small scale, and at the huge mega mining scale. Middle size operators just lose money. All these 'corps' tried to operate tip-toeing into the business. They lost.


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## Topher_osAUrus (Oct 30, 2017)

A good PI unit and handheld pinpointer should do well.
I never used a pulse induction unit, so I cannot give comment to what would be the best bang for your buck (although I heard garret has a nice new model). I was very partial to all of my garret units, especially their handheld pinpointer.


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## cuchugold (Oct 30, 2017)

Topher_osAUrus said:


> A good PI unit and handheld pinpointer should do well.
> I never used a pulse induction unit, so I cannot give comment to what would be the best bang for your buck (although I heard garret has a nice new model). I was very partial to all of my garret units, especially their handheld pinpointer.


 Thanks. The top recommended unit, from the detector forum, is rather expensive, Minelab GPZ 7000. It's probably worth it since it appears it can detect up to 17 inches deep. It is more lightweight than I thought. Perhaps I can lease one with a deposit. In the meantime I will go ahead and buy just the pinpointer, and try it out on the field. Maybe in December when most of these people are drunk, and there is a lot of tourists visiting.


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## im1badpup1 (Oct 30, 2017)

The garret pinpointer was or still is the best on the market
DONT get a ctx3030 for small gold trust me ive got one theres better machines for small gold. The ctx is shit hot but not for gold.
Remember a big coil head loses sensitivity but gains depth.
I dont think the minelab pinpointers upto much imho ive one.


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## cuchugold (Oct 31, 2017)

Just to keep info linked to this thread:
http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=25178&p=278584#p278584


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## cuchugold (Oct 31, 2017)

im1badpup1 said:


> The garret pinpointer was or still is the best on the market
> DONT get a ctx3030 for small gold trust me ive got one theres better machines for small gold. The ctx is crap hot but not for gold.
> Remember a big coil head loses sensitivity but gains depth.
> I dont think the minelab pinpointers upto much imho ive one.


I ordered a Garrett pro from Amazon.
Here are some useful videos:
Super tuning:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVphPxPjcp8
Ground balancing:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOHMxjAT1TI


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## Topher_osAUrus (Oct 31, 2017)

Good choice
I loved my garret pro dearly. I still wish I would have never sold it.
It has an excellent range, numerous times I was digging a hole that felt like it was halfway to china, then found a mercury dime at around 13 inches deep or so. Granted, it was right after a good rain, but I was still quite impressed.

Those are a good price on amazon, I paid 850 plus tax for mine 3 (maybe 4) years ago.

Hope it treats you well.


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## cuchugold (Nov 1, 2017)

Re. gravity, tables, concentrators prior to any leaching.

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=25178&p=278619#p278619

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=23120&p=278633#p278633


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## cuchugold (Nov 3, 2017)

Deano said:


> Technically you have three options.
> 
> Somehow get water to the plant to set up a leach operation.
> 
> ...


Another set of questions for Deano: What is the best type of mill to use?. Can you recommend a relatively quiet way to mill the ore?. (All mills that I know of are extremely loud). I was thinking of an hydraulic mill of some sort to crush the rocks, not hammer them. Attached some pics of the higher grade vein crystal quartz, with gold, sometimes visible and crystallized too.

Also, have you ever used a gravimeter to survey an area?. Thanks in advance.


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## cuchugold (Nov 3, 2017)

This is a pic of a rich placer spot cleanup. Took me 1 hour to shovel and pan fast. There's 7 troy Oz in there. And about 1 Oz left of finer with the black sands (next time I'll determine the exact sizes as per Deano's advice), in my pan tailings (as per fire assay). Very rich spot, but there are richer. You can see the different sizes of "coarse". You can also figure out why I do not want "visitors".


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## g_axelsson (Nov 3, 2017)

That is some amazing finds, even without the gold.  

If you find pieces like that you should sell them on eBay, it would pay a lot better than the gold in itself. But you need to at least reveal the region, the locality is worth as much as the gold for a collector.

The rock crystals could also be worth money for collectors, even if there isn't any gold on them.

I would gladly buy a piece with crystallized gold if you would sell one to me.

I'm a long time mineral collector and I'm glad you share the pictures.

Göran


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## cuchugold (Nov 3, 2017)

Göran: I'll save a nice one for you. But first I have to get enough of the good stuff out, quietly, and safely.

Let's say that the location is in the Orinoco and Caroni river basin.


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## g_axelsson (Nov 3, 2017)

Thanks, that sounds great.

A location at that level is close enough to add value to a mineral specimen.

Göran


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## cuchugold (Nov 3, 2017)

g_axelsson said:


> Thanks, that sounds great.
> 
> A location at that level is close enough to add value to a mineral specimen.
> 
> Göran


I'll gift you the rock, sell the coltan to Lou, and x to y, if I find any ?. lol. :shock:


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## cuchugold (Nov 3, 2017)

One really has to put a perspective on things in the south, and dumb it all way down. Here's a video by someone else. The red rock is "Jasper", a hematite/quartz mixture. Considered a "semi-precious" stone in the Bible, and legendary also in the tales of Alexander the Great, Dante, and others... Of course mining there is illegal...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxhWYzJzW38


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## Deano (Nov 3, 2017)

A gravimeter is used for large scale surveys, unless they are reacting to a very dense deposit they will not give good info regarding small deposits. They are not regarded as suitable for small scale locating of vein structures. They also need to be treated with absolute cotton wool both in transit and use.

For a silent mill you have the options of petrol or battery power.

A gas engine well silenced is probably optimum as a power source but a solar charged battery set up may be suitable if you do not have ambitions of running tons per hour all day.

The actual mill can be either a hammer mill or a set of reducing jaw crushers if absolute silence is needed and you are prepared to operate at small scale with the resultant ore reduced to all minus 1mm via hand screening of the mill product.

Deano


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## cuchugold (Nov 3, 2017)

Thank you Deano. Much appreciated.


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## cuchugold (Nov 5, 2017)

Preliminary shopping list:

Jig: Gas powered 8" x 12" duplex. https://www.911metallurgist.com/equipment/gold-mineral-jig/ . This can be operated with little water.

Table for cons from jig: https://www.911metallurgist.com/equipment/rp4-shaker-table/ . This uses a lot of water. It may not be practical, without some sort of deep well pump, in addition. Requires electricity too, another minus.

Hammer mill: Still looking for a 1 T/hr dry mill, gas powered device. Learned something though, when crushing high grade ore in a lab mill with a 1 mm sieve, the ground dust came out, but it never ended grinding. After opening the mill, found that the coarse gold had formed "nuggets" INSIDE the hammer mill, that could not pass the sieve. A blessing in disguise I think.

Plan is to get all equipment, set up a working small lab in Brazil, test the vein ore, before gradually moving on site the dis-assembled lab and re-assembling it. Cost is going to be less than $15,000 for the equipment, I hope.

Any suggestions for a reliable, gas powered mill, minimum 1 T/hr, are welcome. Comments or suggestions on the other devices too. I have not placed the orders yet.

I'll be working on sieving and determining the size and amounts of the free gold on the < 1mm ground dust, as per Deano's suggestion.

The impossible is looking better every day!.


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## warmgold (Nov 5, 2017)

Hello Cucho, I'm following your adventure too. 
I'm new as gold refiner but not as mineral collector, this is my opinion, hope can help

The vein could still exists, for sure there are many veins carring gold around there
You have to understand how your gold come to your spot. If flakes are big the vein is not far. With far I mean a range of 1+ km. But maybe 200+ km if the gold was placed by glacier or other geological movements. 
There's a lot to consider 
That's the first thing u have to check on geology books of ur territory 

Look for quartz rock, usually white iron stained and cristallized. Watch the territory from high spot, look at the mountains, look for depressions, sediment areas, basament and rocks color change, study the territory to have some clues.But most imporant look for texts about geology of your territory AND texts about mining operations in past on the territory all the informations can help ypu

the gold bought from meteorites, after collision with earth and being buried, was push up usually with the quartz, and these gold spot area are "dispersed" on the earth with no logical position. In millions of years these gold spots were covered by material, then some spots was partially bought to the sun (and usually concentrated in different places) by streams in millions of years, 
maybe the meteorite gold spot is all the area 
Scan with the detector but stay safe.... 

BUT maybe it's worthing for ur safe just grab the placer gold you can on ur spot. 
As you reached the spot, others can....

Watch out and stay safe  

Morris


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## cuchugold (Nov 5, 2017)

Thanks warmgold. Look at some of the placer nuggets I posted. They are not too big, but often times, are not weathered, they look still like crystalline, so that makes me think one or more big, big veins, are close. I have found some smaller veins, maybe that's all there is, but I have to think there is a big one out there, because some nuggets are large. I hope the metal detectors will help me in the exploring. The thing is that that time spent exploring is time not spent mining, and time is a very limited resource!. There's much more quartz than veins of gold, that's for sure.


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## cosmetal (Nov 5, 2017)

Cuchugold

Can you get some pics of your placer nuggets that aren't so fuzzy? I would love some detailed pics showing more detail of their geometry.

Tks!  

James


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## cuchugold (Nov 5, 2017)

My phone is a blackberry!. Those are zoom ins. I'll try next time around. I don't carry the nuggets with me.


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## cosmetal (Nov 5, 2017)

*"Table for cons from jig: https://www.911metallurgist.com/equipment/rp4-shaker-table/ . This uses a lot of water. It may not be practical, without some sort of deep well pump, in addition. Requires electricity too, another minus."*

Looks like a good table to be used in your lab environment. But, in the "wild", I would have serious doubts about it's stability unless you're planning on pouring a concrete slab, or using bedrock, at your mining site. From it's propaganda (aka sales) sheet: *"All RP4 shaker tables operate best when firmly secured to a dense solid mounting base. Wooden stands will set up harmonics and vibrations. Dense concrete or solid bedrock is preferred or a heavy braced steel table sitting on concrete."*

I would really like to try this table with some incinerated and pulverized ICs! 8) 

James


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## cuchugold (Nov 5, 2017)

Thanks cosmetal. I have seen that. All tables seem to use a lot of water to clean up, compared to a jig. So really, at this point it looks that the solution will be to carry the concentrates out of the site, and only have the mill and the jig, powered by gas. I must really think more about this, since the concentrates are a lot less than the volume processed by the jig. So really the table, does not have to be running all the time, using water, but only between jig cleanups. A small electric plant is not out of the question. Yet I'm inclined to put the least amount of equipment in there.


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## warmgold (Nov 5, 2017)

cuchugold said:


> Thanks warmgold. Look at some of the placer nuggets I posted. They are not too big, but often times, are not weathered, they look still like crystalline, so that makes me think one or more big, big veins, are close. I have found some smaller veins, maybe that's all there is, but I have to think there is a big one out there, because some nuggets are large. I hope the metal detectors will help me in the exploring. The thing is that that time spent exploring is time not spent mining, and time is a very limited resource!. There's much more quartz than veins of gold, that's for sure.




If you found some gold veins you are inside the gold spot and the bigger vein(s) can be near. 
Look for iron stains on the rocks, on the quartz. Not every quartz vein in a gold spot area carring gold, usually gold is found inside the fractures of quartz veins, as an intrusion, compressed as a film and sometimes concentrated in nuggets
Look at the direction of the gold quartz vein and try to follow is path underground(remember that in millions of years the place is changed a lot)SOMETIMES it can leads to others veins

ANYWAY don't think it's easy job to dig in a quartz vein :twisted: 

If you find a good spot for placer gold, work there, you will collect gold instantly instead of rock extraction...and a gold specimen on quartz usually is more valuable then the gold itself of the specimen


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## cuchugold (Nov 5, 2017)

This is where the buck stops: To properly and efficiently mine a placer, the best or one of the best ways is to mine it all, basically with Hydraulicking (spelling?). This creates a massive footprint, makes a lot of noise and etc. Some spots are richer, others are poorer, and on average you get what you surveyed, give or take. You generally need a relatively large team, and a visible operation.

Now, if you mine a vein, and you only process the mineralized spots, you are 100% consistent. You know you are going to get X, after a certain amount of hours. So it is less noisy, less destructive, and more consistenly profitable (less risk).

Having said that, I'm not leaving behind any rich placer spots that I can detect. Yet the whole placer, at this point in time is an impossible task for me. The yield per Ton in the vein is consistently much higher than the average placer spots. So 1 Ton of vein material can be 5 or more times richer than an average 1 Ton of placer. Also to mine a prime placer spot, you may need to dig 3 or 4 times more material to move it out of the way.

The critical optimal path is maximizing the weight of gold in Oz mined per Ton of material physically moved by yours truly, or per unit of time.

I welcome the discussion and your opinions, as usual.


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## cuchugold (Nov 5, 2017)

cuchugold said:


> Preliminary shopping list:


911 does not sell gas-powered jigs or mills. Only electric.


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## Deano (Nov 5, 2017)

In regard to a suitable jig for running milled ore, you are looking at a twin hutch 12" end tyre jig for 1 ton per hour, the greater the jig area the less tonnage per area is put over the jig and the better the recovery of fine gold.

A 18" twin hutch jig is better than a 12" for 1 ton milled ore per hour

This is the simplest and more importantly the lightest jig for your project.

The screen should be 1/8" or preferably 3/32" punched stainless steel plate and the ragging should be at least 1" bed depth of the punchings from the screen, often run as 1 - 2" bed depth.

This is a lot of punchings to run through when looking for nuggets, that is why you put a simple sluice in the feed launder.

What you are looking for is a metal punching works which will sell you not only the screen but also the punchings which they usually sell as scrap to a recycler.

The punchings go oversize when punched and will not fit back in the punched holes.

Make sure that the screen is installed with the smooth side up, bed spacer plates are usually around 4" apart.

You are going to be running the jig as a primary recovery device so you want to get minimal losses from your feed.

This means setting the stroke length at 1" and the stroke rate at around 100 strokes per minute.

By using the stainless pellets you will minimise the quantity of cons produced by this primary jig.

Hutch water is supplied in quantities such that when the jig is operating you can put your hand flat on the top of the ragging and feel your hand being sucked down through the ragging. If you do not feel your hand being sucked down then you are running too much hutch water. If your hand is really ripped down then you do not have enough hutch water and despite using the stainless pellets you will get an excessive quantity of cons.

Feed water flow rate should be just enough to carry the coarsest ore particles over the jig bed when operating.

You will probably be moderately horrified at the amount of water needed to operate even this size jig, you will usually practice water recycling with the tailings being placed in a large hole and the clean water overflow recycled to the jig.

There are what seems like a million versions of tables available with a similar wide spread of performances.

For basic clean up you have difficulty going past a Wilfley, the small clean up units are usually frame mounted and are thus free standing, no bolting down required.

Slowly fed with cons from a jig, a Wilfley will give clean separation down to 10 micron gold particle sizes assuming that the original mill product is well sized, probably particle size all less than 150 microns.

Deano


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## cuchugold (Nov 6, 2017)

Thanks again Deano!. I'm writing all these tips down.

Can you suggest manufacturers for gas-powered jigs and mills?. I could probably make them with time, since they are horribly overpriced, and electric, but I have less time these days.

It seems all the coarse from vein stays, turning to nuggets, in front of the the mill 1 mm screen output. Do you think a sluice is still needed for the < 1 mm jig feed ?. I can see its use for sure in an non screened placer feed, to avoid cleaning of the raggings, as you described. For now, I have decided to focus on the vein feed from the mill. I will sieve and pan the hand picked placer spots manually for nuggets, feeding the pan "tailings" in the mill, for a < 1mm feed to the jig all across.


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## cuchugold (Nov 6, 2017)

im1badpup1 said:


> Dig a pit a large one take lots of plastic tarpaulin lightweight sheets and catch rainfall when it comes directed to the pit. Dont forget to line the pit with tarp. Have it covered over to prevent evaporation and provide some stealth at least to its storage.
> Have a second dry pit dug to store materials youve lugged up there or are using in.
> Take a fresnel lens to heat water start fires melt bits of rock with. They easily reach 1300c and more. Thats celcius not farenheit. U can get one off front of a old tv check on youtube what u can do with one.
> You could rig a primitive hammer mill up with the right pulley gearing system and a windmill. Or attach to back wheel of a bicycle and pedal it like an exercise bike.
> ...


 I saw the fresnel in youtube. The hot spot is small, but it's hot enough to fluidize quartz. Any ideas how to melt larger quantities?. Maybe heat a graphite crucicle and see how much the heat propagates?. The primitive hammer mill idea looks good too. Like a giant mortar. It could take a while to crush 10 tons of rocks though. I can bring a small 80 cc gas motor on the site, or a small motorcycle, with some difficulty. I could use a basket of large rocks as the weight, instead of a wood trunk, with a piece of steel as the crushing contact surface.

I must admit that melting the rocks, silently and peacefully, and collecting the wages in a gold button, sounds to me like Nirvana. Maybe there is a way. I usually sleep during the day, and work the sieves/pan at night when it is cooler.


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## cuchugold (Nov 6, 2017)

This guy has done something very close, in a small scale:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svAPyyUJUCo

How can I make the fireball much bigger, and with a side discharge for the melted quartz?. (the gold will just drop to the bottom of the natural quartz made crucible):
1-Insulation.
2-More heat packed in (as in a wood/coal furnace surrounding).
3-More sun, more mirrors, more lenses.
4-Magic ideas?.
5-Other?. 
6-A line of fireballs, with a feeding point at one end, and a discharge for the glass on the other?.

I think this line of thought can be pursued, and yield a solution, eventually. An elegant one cosmetal?.  :G


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## cosmetal (Nov 6, 2017)

cuchugold said:


> This guy has done something very close, in a small scale:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svAPyyUJUCo
> 
> How can I make the fireball much bigger, and with a side discharge for the melted quartz?. (the gold will just drop to the bottom of the natural quartz made crucible):
> ...



Sexy? Yes.  

Elegant? No.  

Why? Time is money . . . too slow and also too unpredictable. Your mining location is in a rainforest, yes?

James


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## cuchugold (Nov 6, 2017)

cosmetal said:


> Why? Time is money . . . too slow and also too unpredictable. Your mining location is in a rainforest, yes?
> 
> James


There is plenty of sun, when it's not raining.

Parabolic vs fresnel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVFGJ_lZtoQ

A lot of experimenting will be necessary, I think. Tightly insulated, coal furnace, with a shallow quartz rock made crucible in the middle, and several mirror/ lenses focused on the top, with a discharge for glass on the side. At the end of the day, one hammers the crucible and retrieves the button/nugget/blob.

Any ideas?.

Maybe add a graphite rod in the middle to increase the heat downwards and melt more quartz. I'm just writing as I think. Have no shame to chime in, please. Brainstorming.


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## 4metals (Nov 6, 2017)

Personally I don't believe you can ever count on Mother nature co-operating. When you are operating in a situation where you have very defined windows to get tasks completed, I am a firm believer in bringing the tools and equipment with me to get the job done. 

Last year I visited the colony settlement in Williamsburg Virginia where the original settlers came bent on manufacturing glass because they had all of the raw materials right where they needed them. So they brought in experienced glass makers and built the kiln and collected the raw materials and made glass. Trouble is they needed a consistent wind to get the temperature boost in their kiln for it to function properly. Bottom line was they failed, the wind let them down! OK the indians also scalped a few of them too....... kind of like what you're dealing with! 

Solar power is great, when the sun shines! Years ago I made a solar oven with my son as a science fair project he wanted to do. We made an oven with a chamber with a size of about an 18" cube. Boy did that get hot! And we did cook a lot of food in it over the summer that followed. But here's the thing...... you're having a bunch of guests for Thanksgiving dinner and the plan is to cook the turkey in the solar oven. Maybe if you live in the desert where it's always sunny but just when you have a table full of guests counting on a nice turkey dinner you have an overcast day, you're SOL! The moral of the story, to me, is you can't count on Mother nature.

Maybe if this was a "normal" mining gig where it was more predictable a solar Fresnel lens could provide the answer. If you could wait for the right time when all of the stars are aligned to give you the conditions you need, but in your situation, sort of like a Dan Brown adventure suspense novel, I would need to be sure it can be done when I need it done in a process I can count on.


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## cuchugold (Nov 6, 2017)

4metals said:


> Solar power is great, when the sun shines! Years ago I made a solar oven with my son as a science fair project he wanted to do. We made an oven with a chamber with a size of about an 18" cube. Boy did that get hot!



Fair enough. You have fresnel / mirror / solar experience!. Let's solve the problem for the simplest case: 1-the sun is shining.

Those fresnels and mirrors, seem to heat the spot to level within minutes. It's not like the furnace needs time to warm up (but'it's already at 1100 C + because of the coal), so half way there. We only need another 700 C to reach 1800 C, and that quartz becomes like water, and the gold drops.

Let's focus on how it can be done, positive situation. Unless it works well in the shop, I'm not bringing it to the field.

The world changes fast, yesterday I did not know what a fresnel was...


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## im1badpup1 (Nov 6, 2017)

A fresnel lens is impractical on any scale more than a few grams. But it would be a good benefit to a small furnace helping to add more heat quickly. I think it was mentioned at beginning of the thread there was an issue with getting a high enough temperature in a small furnace. The fresnel lens might just make all the difference. If your doing tens of kilos a time forget it.

The problem is about the power output of a fresnel. Itl only be half a kilowatt or so. All that energy is focused into a tiny area. Its why i thought it might be enough to push the temperature up in a small furnace to work for you but scaling up is impractical. 
It might heat rocks or rock faces and weaken them to shatter when waters thrown on though? Ive no idea how effective it might be.


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## cuchugold (Nov 6, 2017)

im1badpup1 said:


> A fresnel lens is impractical on any scale more than a few grams. But it would be a good benefit to a small furnace helping to add more heat quickly. I think it was mentioned at beginning of the thread there was an issue with getting a high enough temperature in a small furnace. The fresnel lens might just make all the difference.


The guy in the video melts glass, without any other heat source, without insulation, with the glass bead on top of a piece of cooling iron,... without breaking a sweat.

He ignites (without knowing himself) Aluminum, making a lance torch that punches through the ceramic... without pure oxygen!.

10 Ton is a tall order, let's try for 10 Kg. If one can feed 10 Kg every few minutes, and discharge glass to one side, the gold will eventually overflow.


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## cuchugold (Nov 6, 2017)

Backing off a little. This is what's on the table:

1-The conventional solution comprise of a gas powered mill and jig. (recommendations for a manufacturer or distributor of reliable equipment are welcomed). And transporting the cons off the mining site for further enrichment and smelting. With settings as per Deano's suggestions. Cyanidation of tailings unlikely. A test leach to determine how much is left behind.

2-Experiment with increasing the temperature of the coal fired cupola, using solar methods. 

3-Exploring with metal detectors, both the placer, and the veins, and continuation of sieving/panning the placer by hand.

Please keep posting!.


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## Findm-Keepm (Nov 6, 2017)

4metals said:


> Last year I visited the colony settlement in Williamsburg Virginia where the original settlers came bent on manufacturing glass because they had all of the raw materials right where they needed them. So they brought in experienced glass makers and built the kiln and collected the raw materials and made glass. Trouble is they needed a consistent wind to get the temperature boost in their kiln for it to function properly. Bottom line was they failed, the wind let them down! OK the indians also scalped a few of them too....... kind of like what you're dealing with!



Dunno what you source of this info is, but it's wrong. The first glass making operation in 1608 failed because 1) starvation hit the colony, and 2) tobacco proved more lucrative for the Virginia Company, so much so, that they brought over the first slaves to farm the tobacco, and abandoned the glass making effort. Shipping tobacco back to England made more money than did glass, a product already made in England.

There was a second glass making effort in 1619 at the same site - and it would have been a success, if not for an Indian uprising, lack of better sand, and the destruction of the glasshouse - it BLEW down. :shock: 

"The Italians proved difficult for the English to work with, and there were other difficulties. First the glasshouse blew down and then the Indian uprising of 1622 put a stop to everything for the time being. Finally, Captain Norton died, and the Italians "fell extremely sick." George Sandys, resident treasurer for the Company, took over the project upon Norton's death, but fared little better in getting results. He repaired the furnace and the crew set to work in earnest in the spring of 1623, but without success."

https://www.nps.gov/jame/learn/historyculture/glassmaking-at-jamestown.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_glassmaking_in_the_United_States

According to the University of VA, no glass _making_ effort was present in Virginia after 1624, until 2006, one year before the 400th anniversary of Jamestown - and never in Williamsburg. I've got 2006 and 2007 green glass commemorative "blobs" or paper weights, made at the new Jamestown site. Even now, some of the raw materials are present, but not used, as it's labor intensive to use them.


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## im1badpup1 (Nov 6, 2017)

Why cant you get the coal fire hot enough use the same principals as a blacksmiths forge. Intermittently blow air through with bellows or a fan. The finer the coal is divided the easier it is. It should reach almost 2000c.


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## cosmetal (Nov 6, 2017)

im1badpup1 said:


> Why cant you get the coal fire hot enough use the same principals as a blacksmiths forge. Intermittently blow air through with bellows or a fan. The finer the coal is divided the easier it is. It should reach almost 2000c.



Ever been around a coal fired blacksmith forge? They stink! Literally . . . the burning coal smells like hell! At least to me. 

I always used a propane furnace when doing my blacksmithing. I will admit, though, a coal fire will get hotter than the propane.  

No need to worry about any sound giving your location away. Your "bad guys" will just follow your smell! :shock: 

James


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## cosmetal (Nov 6, 2017)

Why not stick to the basics? Tried and true, simple methods. 

Get a mule. . . :!: :idea: :!: 

It will help to haul your equipment in and then use it to power a simple, weighted mechanical drop hammer. Crush your ore like the old ones did. Keep your mule fed and watered and it will probably not make a lot of noise. Don't get a donkey - too noisy.

Dress like a local indigent native. If someone sees you, your mule is part of your disguise.

You said to brainstorm . . .I am. And I'm not kidding.

Simplicity and elegance always . . . 

James


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## cuchugold (Nov 7, 2017)

Thanks for the ideas. A modern mule is a dirt motorbike. 

Are you describing a mortar mill, cosmetal ?. I've seen some locations abandoned by the english 200 years ago, using those, near old British Guyana. You can maybe crush 3 tons per day, if that.

I'm not worried about people 'seeing me'. I'm nearly invisible for the last mile, and very hard to see for 5 miles. And there's nobody around looking.

The fresnel would have to be about 40-50 square meters to catch enough solar power. This idea is archived for now. Not feasible at the moment.


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## cuchugold (Nov 8, 2017)

This is to give you an idea of what the virgin terrain looks like. Snapshots from video by an acquaintance of mine doing some sight seeing. My site is dozens of miles away. This particular vertical drop is about 900 meters. I can't wait to get back in there. :shock:


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## cuchugold (Nov 8, 2017)

More: Jimmie landed / crashed on this mountain, and survived. Very nostalgic and romantic, if you ask me. So much pre-cambrian rock... :G


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## Platdigger (Nov 8, 2017)

Beautiful!


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## Platdigger (Nov 8, 2017)

At least now we know what part of the world you are talking about.


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## cuchugold (Nov 9, 2017)

Platdigger said:


> At least now we know what part of the world you are talking about.


The place is breathtaking. Paradise lost. Stunning. I posted the approximate location in the first page:
"Jimmie Angel (Angel Falls named after he landed on the wrong mountain of gold), spent most of his adventuring life here, before I was born, looking for "the river of gold". Many stories, some true, some myth, but tons of gold on the ground. I'll leave the lesser minerals for others."


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## Placer Paul (Nov 12, 2017)

First off congrats on having the gumption for even prospecting in such a harsh and dangerous environment. Hats off to you for brainstorming ways to get it done. Safety first if you have a wife, kids, family etc..but if not then I would feel a little more like taking some extra chances for a large deposit like that, that's for sure.

I'm a mechanical placer miner and I often mine alone or just with one laborer and we are around Grizzly bear quite often. We have one local big boar that hangs around our camp. To me that feels pretty dangerous and it's always in the back of my mind. But in comparison to where you are it seems trivial in comparison lol.

You say you are blasting when there are storms. How often is there thunder storms that allow you to blast and if so you would have to have your blast holes all drilled ahead of time and explosives in place to time the blasting with the storms etc. Is that what you are doing? Can you give some kind of an idea of what the terrain is like where you are trying to set up your processing area? If you can grind the ore down could you use a dry wash sluice to separate the free gold from the ground ore? You would still need electric power of some sort though for a blower for the dry washer. 

How much ore do you want to crush/grind down, process in a day? Not sure if where you are you can dig yourself a little hidden semi sound proof work area but if you are you could dig yourself an L shaped tunnel into the side of a cliff as long as it's stable enough. If you work on the inside of the L around the corner, not much of the noise you make will exit that L shaped tunnel cause the sound waves will more hit the other wall and stay in the tunnel. It will dissipate and be a very muffled sound on the outside of it. And if you can hang some heavy cloth or burlap or whatever over the exit hole then that too will dampen the sounds. It's a bit involved but just a thought. 
If the ore was very rich and you didn't need to grind down a lot of it in a day there are also 18 volt hand held ore crushers available but you would first have to pound down bigger chunks into smaller pieces. Time consuming but it takes up very little space and you could do it underneath some stuff to make it quiet. If your trying to do a vast amount in a day then it won't work though. Again though you would need a little generator to power things with batteries go dead etc.

I own a Whites Gold Master detector and it works well for finding pretty small nuggets. I use it to go over my trommel tailings once and a while and to go over new layers I'm cutting in my pay layers in the cut to see if there are any larger nuggets. It won't detect as deep as a very expensive Minelab but for $900 CND it was a very good investment. It will also cancel out hot rocks and cold stones if you set it up to ground you are working.

Are the locals or the government not interested in getting at the gold in the area you are at or is it an unknown gold producing spot to them?


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## cuchugold (Nov 12, 2017)

*You say you are blasting when there are storms. How often is there thunder storms that allow you to blast and if so you would have to have your blast holes all drilled ahead of time and explosives in place to time the blasting with the storms etc. Is that what you are doing? * In the raining season there are storms every day, often in the afternoon or evening. All holes drilled ahead of time, and charges in place, linked with primacord. I just wait for the storm to arm the electric blasting cap, and when the thunder hits, bang. The placer site is away from the current vein site, which I think is not the main vein, in the vein site I mainly cut rock with little noise and small charges. In the placer I 'soften' the spots with bigger charges.

*Can you give some kind of an idea of what the terrain is like where you are trying to set up your processing area? If you can grind the ore down could you use a dry wash sluice to separate the free gold from the ground ore? You would still need electric power of some sort though for a blower for the dry washer. *The placer is like an old river beach. The vein site is in inclined terrain. Dry or wet I need power of some type. Doing this by hand is good exercise, but slow. The best solution so far, would still have me bringing fuel to the site regularly, which would be time spent not mining.

*How much ore do you want to crush/grind down, process in a day? Not sure if where you are you can dig yourself a little hidden semi sound proof work area but if you are you could dig yourself an L shaped tunnel into the side of a cliff as long as it's stable enough. If you work on the inside of the L around the corner, not much of the noise you make will exit that L shaped tunnel cause the sound waves will more hit the other wall and stay in the tunnel. It will dissipate and be a very muffled sound on the outside of it. And if you can hang some heavy cloth or burlap or whatever over the exit hole then that too will dampen the sounds. It's a bit involved but just a thought. *Good ideas. If I can do 1 T per hour, I'll achieve my goals. Easier said than done for a single person.

*If the ore was very rich and you didn't need to grind down a lot of it in a day there are also 18 volt hand held ore crushers available but you would first have to pound down bigger chunks into smaller pieces. Time consuming but it takes up very little space and you could do it underneath some stuff to make it quiet. If your trying to do a vast amount in a day then it won't work though. Again though you would need a little generator to power things with batteries go dead etc.*Summarizes well the current situation. Sledge hammer and mortar, now.

*I own a Whites Gold Master detector and it works well for finding pretty small nuggets. I use it to go over my trommel tailings once and a while and to go over new layers I'm cutting in my pay layers in the cut to see if there are any larger nuggets. It won't detect as deep as a very expensive Minelab but for $900 CND it was a very good investment. It will also cancel out hot rocks and cold stones if you set it up to ground you are working.*Thanks. I'm going to scan the whole placer surface, and mark the best spots. I'm thinking also that a cheaper unit will do the job. I have no experience with detectors, so spending smart and small for now.

*Are the locals or the government not interested in getting at the gold in the area you are at or is it an unknown gold producing spot to them?*I always enjoy a good joke. :lol: This is another universe. Hard to believe what happens even if you come and live here. Nowhere else, in history, a small band of criminals, have plundered and destroyed a country in this scale.

Edit to add: Your situation with bears / (boar?) looks more immediately dangerous to me than mine. Maybe you could run a trip wire with an alarm around your working area, or just hunt the most offending ones. I can't imagine panning with a bear breathing down my neck!. :?. Luckily there are no big dangerous critters in my surroundings.

Edit 2: This thread will probably read extremely adventurous, glamorous, exotic, and enticing, to the newcomers. The harsh reality is that 99.9% of the time prospecting and mining this location, or any other, involves shoveling dirt, hammering rocks, lifting heavy bags, sieving and panning. Hardly what any sensible person would consider glamorous, or an "easy job". You have to really love it to persist.


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## Placer Paul (Nov 12, 2017)

*The placer is like an old river beach. The vein site is in inclined terrain. Dry or wet I need power of some type. Doing this by hand is good exercise, but slow. The best solution so far, would still have me bringing fuel to the site regularly, which would be time spent not mining.*
You had mentioned that you had no steady water so if a traditional water ran sluice wouldn't work, then a dry wash sluice may be able to separate your free gold from the ground ore pretty effectively. If you can ignore this guys non sense with the voice and props he shows how the dry washer works: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oinXbQnoyY

*Summarizes well the current situation. Sledge hammer and mortar, now. *Are you familiar with a Falcon MD20? It could help you find concentrations in the ore vein nicely. I have used one a lot and love it. This video also shows the gal using an 18 volt ore pulverizer. It's a bit of a step up from mortal/pestal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n26_pXViY3g

*Thanks. I'm going to scan the whole placer surface, and mark the best spots. I'm thinking also that a cheaper unit will do the job. I have no experience with detectors, so spending smart and small for now.*The Whites Gold Master also shows and allows you to track black sands which a lot of time can increase your chances of locating how the placer gold is running in an old river channel. Another good gold detector is the Gold Bug II but it isn't as good as the Whites GMT in hot rocks/soil conditions.

*Your situation with bears / (boar?) looks more immediately dangerous to me than mine. Maybe you could run a trip wire with an alarm around your working area, or just hunt the most offending ones. I can't imagine panning with a bear breathing down my neck!. :?. Luckily there are no big dangerous critters in my surroundings.* "boar" is just the name for male bear. Not like boar like a pig type boar. The big male Grizzly are very territorial over other Grizzlies so the one that is around my claim has probably been there a long time and he knows he runs the area cause he keeps his distance from me and my neighbor mining even though he comes close enough so we see him. He chased a Moose through my claim in 2016. And the claim is being logged so I'll be able to see in all directions for a far distance next season so it will make it a lot safer for having any unexpected run ins with him. 

*This thread will probably read extremely adventurous, glamorous, exotic, and enticing, to the newcomers. The harsh reality is that 99.9% of the time prospecting and mining this location, or any other, involves shoveling dirt, hammering rocks, lifting heavy bags, sieving and panning. Hardly what any sensible person would consider glamorous, or an "easy job". You have to really love it to persist. *Lol yup I have friends that want to come up to the claim cause they think the mining is glamorous etc but they don't see the long hours and hard work, and how being in a remote area away from everything quickly takes the glamour out of the equation.


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## Platdigger (Nov 12, 2017)

As an "of course" for a dry washer you could just use a battery or even hand powered puffer. Could even build your own.


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## Placer Paul (Nov 13, 2017)

Thought this prospecting tool may be useful for you so I uploaded a video I made in 2016 of what it's like using the Falcon MD 20 on gold bearing ore. Here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skeOEpcVjXo&feature=youtu.be


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## cuchugold (Nov 13, 2017)

Thanks a lot for the links and tips Platdigger and Placerpaul. 
Placerpaul: You mention you often work alone or at most with one helper. How do you move the dirt from the selected cut to the wash plant?. This is my biggest challenge, to process more I have to move and clean/sieve more before any sluice, jig, or other.


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## Placer Paul (Nov 13, 2017)

cuchugold said:


> Thanks a lot for the links and tips Platdigger and Placerpaul.
> Placerpaul: You mention you often work alone or at most with one helper. How do you move the dirt from the selected cut to the wash plant?. This is my biggest challenge, to process more I have to move and clean/sieve more before any sluice, jig, or other.


I have a crawler dumper called a Morooka for moving pay gravel around and a conveyor that moves tailings away from the trommel. I've got two years left on my exploration permit then if the ground proves up to pay well enough I'll increase the permit to a production mining permit where I can process more material. At that point I would increase the size of my equipment to either a dump truck or a larger Volvo type earth mover.


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## cuchugold (Nov 13, 2017)

Thanks Paul. So I guess there is not enough water for hydraulic mining or it is against some enviromental law?


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## Placer Paul (Nov 13, 2017)

cuchugold said:


> Thanks Paul. So I guess there is not enough water for hydraulic mining or it is against some enviromental law?


Yes we are not allowed to hydraulic mine in the Cariboo area in BC. The old timers did in the old days in some areas though. The government is getting more and more strict with water usage here in BC. Most of us mining in the Cariboo area are using recirculating settling ponds where we re use the water going through our wash plants. I have a lot of clay and silt on my claim so I have a shallow trench connecting the two ponds. The water from the trommel sluice goes into one pond where it has some time to settle and that pond is connected via a shallow water trench that flows to the other pond that I pump out from. If the water levels drop after awhile I top them up from water from the creek. 
The clay silt is so bad in some areas that miners need to use an anionic flocculant to help dissipate the silt particles. The silt can clog up a sluice run pretty badly.


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## cuchugold (Nov 14, 2017)

Thanks a lot Paul. I guess each location has its limitations, and we all have to play the cards we are dealt, and make the most of what we have in front.


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## cuchugold (Dec 28, 2017)

Back from the site after using the metal detector. It just works!. Record haul in record time. I met with the kid that recommended the metal detector, and gave him $500. I explained him what I wanted to do, crushing rocks, milling, gravity recovery, melting rock, fuel supply to the mine, etc, etc, etc. He looked at me point blank and said: Why don't you crush the whole mountain with dynamite and use the metal detector on the rubble?. I looked at him, and said: I'd need a ton of dynamite. He said: Aren't you the explosives guy?. 

Sometimes it's so simple. We are all wired to think complex, when simple is best. Every time I meet with this kid, I come out way smarter...


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## rickbb (Dec 28, 2017)

This post is a heck of a good read. Just what I needed on a boring Thursday morning at work.
:wink:


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## nickvc (Dec 28, 2017)

I think 8n the situation you are in that the kid has the right idea, grab as much as you can in the simplest way and move on before trouble finds you, you may well leave much more than you collect but it sounds a lot safer than trying to work the site continually.


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## cuchugold (Dec 28, 2017)

nickvc said:


> I think 8n the situation you are in that the kid has the right idea, grab as much as you can in the simplest way and move on before trouble finds you, you may well leave much more than you collect but it sounds a lot safer than trying to work the site continually.


 It's amazing how a simple, fresh, viewpoint can shift one's whole train of thought. 24 hrs earlier I was all stressed out about how I was going to recover the coltan from the black sands, after the table concentrates, etc, etc, Air lift them, etc, etc. ( that I had not installed yet!). And now I'm working on the optimal spacing between barren holes, so that the rocks blasted can still be small enough for the metal detector to scan for nuggets... :lol:


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## cuchugold (Dec 30, 2017)

Good device, but noisy as hell:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whjOM3OA7yQ


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## cuchugold (Dec 30, 2017)

I like this guy's technique to clean up the "butter" at the end of a cleanup (videos 5 and 6). Videos 1-4 are his setup of cleanup sluice for concentrates.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IG2UyQywhOg

He mentions he recirculates the last bit of concentrates, when he can't get any more gold out, back to his next sluice run. Not a bad idea at all.


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## Twobrothers (Dec 30, 2017)

https://youtu.be/G74hmf_7KpM?t=7m12s

Hmm.


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## Twobrothers (Dec 30, 2017)

http://runrun.es/rr-es-plus/252775/...struccion-se-traslada-a-minas-de-bolivar.html

Hm.


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## Twobrothers (Dec 30, 2017)

https://youtu.be/G74hmf_7KpM?t=1m12s

yep.


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## Twobrothers (Dec 30, 2017)

It been an entertaining and interesting read and quite an exercise in mental masturbation but this isn't for real.


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## cuchugold (Dec 31, 2017)

That mine is MINE. 

Dile a Mamaduro y su pandilla que nunca me encontraran y a la mina tampoco.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCK9p1RiiOU


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## cuchugold (Jan 17, 2018)

Two buckets working better than a popular device:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7Pzl9KU

Very fine series of videos in this youtube channel. Learning something new everyday. :G


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## Platdigger (Jan 17, 2018)

Haha, yea that is great. Arts 2 bucket method.


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## cuchugold (Jan 21, 2018)

Platdigger said:


> Haha, yea that is great. Arts 2 bucket method.


Trying to catch superfines in clay and silt slimes with a sluice/goldcube or mostly anything else out there is more than futile, painful. I suspect that if the clay portion is a relatively small % of the original ore, then it is best to wash it away at the start, before any sluice, table, or anything. The big problem is when the original ore is 90%+ clay. No idea how to handle that in a simple manner.


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## cuchugold (Jan 26, 2018)

And then... someone came along... with a revolutionary improvement, or idea...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8u2_yaBApw

oops, posted wrong video link. This is the one I meant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aameYZ__1Sg

good series. :G


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