# Philips PE 4150/01 Power Supply for Electrolytic Cell?



## Anonymous (Mar 6, 2008)

Hi!

I'm new to the whole gold recovery scene (as you can probably tell), and am setting up a cell system. I have four power supplies that could work: 5v @ 60a, 5v @ 45a, 12v @ 40a, 12v @ 25a. There are also more power supplies available at my local scrap yard, varying from 3v to 48v, and from about 5a to 100a. 

The units that I have are made by Philips, and the one that I think is most likely (the 5v @ 60a one) carries the model number PE 4150/01. It has two 15-pin connectors, and a note that says "FOR CONNECTIONS SEE MANUAL", but I haven't been able to find any pinouts for it. I should be able to figure it out by reverse engineering the unit, but before I do that - Does anyone know the pinout for a Philips PE series 3u power supply, and am I going the wrong direction with the one that I chose?

One last thing - I tried to watch Steve's videos on cell construction, but I only got video, no audio. Other embedded media players work just fine, I even tried saving the video off of the web page and using various media players, but I'm still getting no audio. Has anyone else experienced this?

Thanks!


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## lazersteve (Mar 6, 2008)

Welcome to the forum,

Concerning the power supply , I would open up the unit (while it is not powered up of course) and trace the lines down to the board. Typically, the voltages of the lines will be silk screened onto the pcb near the solder points on the component side.

As for the video I'm not sure why that is. I've had a few complaints on the issue, but every time I test them they work fine for me. Can you be more specific via PM concerning your computer configuration (OS, Media palyer version, ISP hook up , etc,) and I'll look into it.

Steve


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## meng2k7 (Mar 6, 2008)

hi steve! 

im starting to build my own stripping cell, first i used 12v 40a power supply, running fine with some saltwater as electrolyte, what is the best recipe of electrolyte can i use?

also i have a 36v 40a power supply, can i use this for my cell? what is the advantage of using [email protected] power supply?

thank you very much steve!


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## lazersteve (Mar 6, 2008)

The voltage should be keep low (6V or less) with the sulfuric cell. Amps is what does the work. Just be sure your connecting leads and wires can handle the current you push.

Steve


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## meng2k7 (Mar 6, 2008)

ok, thank you very much for the advice,how about the fumes from sulfuric cell? 

can i have a complete recipe for sulfuric cell?


tomorrow i'll edit the picture and post here.


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## lazersteve (Mar 7, 2008)

Check my website for the complete construction details:

http://www.goldrecovery.us

Steve


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## Anonymous (Mar 13, 2008)

Well, unfortunately, there's nothing helpful screened onto the PCB, so I started doing a good, old-fashioned reverse engineering on the power supply. It consists of two boards, the first containing the bridge rectifier, a step up transformer, and related AC -> DC hardware. That board supplies ~350VDC via three wires (+, -, GND) to the secondary board. The secondary board then steps the DC voltage down and does the regulation and all. I removed it totally from its original casing, and am putting it in a new box, hopefully with all the features I'll need that the original was missing. I plan on adding: an on/off/timed switch, status light (On/Off/Standby), an auto-off timer, probably either a rotary switch or multi-posistion rocker switch to limit amperage (I won't need 60A most of the time), and an ammeter. If anyone has access to this series of power supplies, they seem to have great potential for electrolytic PM recovery. I'll make the pinouts and modifications that I made available as soon as I'm sure that I have it right . Also - If anyone is interested in one of these power supplies, I'd be happy to pick up one at my local scrapyard and ship it to you for just the cost of the unit + shipping. They weigh about 2-4lbs depending on the model, and the scrapyard will most likely charge $5-10 per unit.

One final question: So long as my anode, cathode, wiring, etc can handle it, is there any reason why I shouldn't try it at 5V, 30-60A? Most plans I see for cells call for a 5-15a power supply, normally a 6v battery charger. I'd be using a larger cell to limit arcing and such, but is there a point when the amperage just doesn't matter anymore, or a sweet zone to try for? Thanks in advance!


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## lazersteve (Mar 13, 2008)

You'll find the cell and the number of items you put in it at the same time, will determine the amps drawn. The amperage of the supply merely indicates the maximum amps the supply can deliver at a rated voltage.

Steve


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## Anonymous (Mar 13, 2008)

I was thinking that was the way it worked, but I wasn't sure. I also managed to bend a square-U-shaped piece of steel into the shape needed for the cathode so I don't have to deal with making the 90-Deg joints, I just need to bend the support/negative contact over the edge. This has been a lot more fun so far than expected .

Thanks for the awesome videos, Steve!


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## Anonymous (Mar 15, 2008)

I'm having trouble deciding the duty cycle for the power supply so that the electrolyte solution doesn't heat up too much... Is there a rule of thumb here or do you just have to play it by ear and figure out what works? I assume it would be different for every batch, which is why I'm using a programmable timer.


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## lazersteve (Mar 15, 2008)

Typically DC supplies run either on or off. Duty cycle is the ratio of on time to off time. Duty cycle is usually associated with pulsating square waves or sin waves that are being chopped.

If you are asking how long can you run the DC supply before you have to turn it off due to heating, then I would say as long as you can touch the side of the dish with your gloved hand you are ok. The dish cools a little between swapping of the parts so heating has never been a problem for me. If you plan on scaling up the cell to a tumbler arrangement you will need to look into the duty cycle question more. GSP has lots of hands on knowledge in this area.

Steve


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## Palladium (Mar 16, 2008)

http://www.trionetics.com/an002.pdf


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