# subzero...,power nitric acid substitute



## jpnuke33 (Feb 28, 2011)

has anyone heard of this item and if so, will it preform as well as,say, true 70% liquid nitric acid?


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## jimdoc (Feb 28, 2011)

Just do a search on the forum for subzero and shor.
You will get the answers to help you save some money.

Jim


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## aurotech (Mar 1, 2011)

seeing the comments it seems refiners are SUREly SORE with SHOR


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## rkbassin (Mar 1, 2011)

Hello jpnuke33 i purchased the kit from shor and it was all messed up. Direction were different from what they sent to whats on the web site. Ive tried to contact them for 2 weeks and no response. So yea the subzero works for nitric acid but dont go by there direction. The directions sent said use 1 whole LB. to half gal. of muratic dont do that its more like 2 tablespoons to 1 quart of hcl hope this helps.


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## Anonymous (Mar 1, 2011)

A gentleman I knew overseas had purchased Subzero from Shor some time ago,and it had to have an MSDS attached for customs,or homeland security,or something.Of course my friend read me the msds and it contained 16% Sodium nitrate in the form of pellets.The exact same composition that Hi-Yield sells at many nurserys and hardware stores.A while back another gentleman I knew in orlando had purchased some before I met him,I told him to call them and tell them he needed an msds,and they were not in any mood to give him one.
Their original precipitant(and yes that is the actual name they sell it under) is 100% sodium metabisulphite.They recently started selling a "odorless" precipitant,and I am very curious about that one.


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## nickvc (Mar 1, 2011)

mic said:


> A gentleman I knew overseas had purchased Subzero from Shor some time ago,and it had to have an MSDS attached for customs,or homeland security,or something.Of course my friend read me the msds and it contained 16% Sodium nitrate in the form of pellets.The exact same composition that Hi-Yield sells at many nurserys and hardware stores.A while back another gentleman I knew in orlando had purchased some before I met him,I told him to call them and tell them he needed an msds,and they were not in any mood to give him one.
> Their original precipitant(and yes that is the actual name they sell it under) is 100% sodium metabisulphite.They recently started selling a "odorless" precipitant,and I am very curious about that one.



Could be ascorbic acid that's fairly odourless but expensive!


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## Jimmi_p (Mar 9, 2011)

Maybe It's oxalic acid. I haven't used it for gold yet but never noticed to much of a smell using it on wood. Of course thats just a guess. any one know if oxalic has a foul smell when used as a precipitant? 
Oh yeah, Not that it needs to be said but something doesn't have to smell bad to be bad for you. Take carbon monoxide for instance. Always work in a fume hood or be outside. Also use proper personal protective equipment. Most people here already know this but it still needs to be said for those that don't.

Jimmi_p


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## winkgoldminer (Jul 7, 2011)

im having a problem pricipitating gold i followed the inst ishore gave me and it didnt make any brown mud when i put the storm precip in that was gold when i melted it i think its iron ore anyway if someone could help i would be very thankfull


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## Harold_V (Jul 7, 2011)

Nowhere near enough information to be able to help. 

However, if I understand what you said, you have tried to recover gold from ore. Is that correct?

Harold


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## whoknew62 (Jan 21, 2012)

Regarding the SubZero question. I am no expert, however. If I had to make an educated guess, I would say it is sodium nitrate. (Fertelizer). I have been trying to find affordable sources for all the chemicals needed for refining gold from HGP, RGP etc. One site , while also a sales company for these type products, gives the formular to make your own 70% pure nitric acid. I do not have it handy, but it calls for sodium nitrate added to exactly what that "SHURE" sites formular is. Shure just wont tell you what the "Magic nitric powder" is. Its Fertilizer. (My guess again.) Sodium Nitrate.
I've not been able to locate sodium nitrate in volume yet. But I have found Ammonium Nitrate at my new local hardware store. $27.00 for 50 pounds. (I am researching a bit more to see if this can be substituted for the sodium nitrate. One you-tube video suggest it can be substituted.)
Not a bad mark up for the "magic powder" if I am correct. What do they get again? $10.00 a pound? Thats $500.00 bucks, Vs $27.00 for 50 Lbs.
Good luck


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## james122964 (Jan 29, 2012)

I have used ammonium nitrate that I got from some old instant cold sprain pads. It releases a lot of ammonia and the reaction starts deceptively slow then gets out of hand real quick.

Jim


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## butcher (Jan 29, 2012)

Nitric acid can be made from ammonium nitrate, the problem is if it is not done right it is very dangerous when heated, so I do not recommend its use, too much room for mistakes and someone getting HURT BAD. (ammonium nitrate is not something to take lightly, look at what it did in oklahoma).

Sodium nitrate or potassium nitrate if you can not find locally see if you can order it, here in USA I had no trouble buying it online, and having it shipped to me.
I cannot remember the name of the company I bought some from but mason seeds comes to mind, (who knows that may not even be a company, knowing my memory).


Dudadiesel sells sodium nitrate.

Quick search I pulled these up:

http://store.windcrestorganics.com/Sodium-Nitrate-p/s-allganic.htm

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy-ab&hl=en&rlz=1R2RNQN_enUS457&source=hp&q=sodium+nitrate+fertilizer+buy&oq=sodium+nitrate+fertilizer+&aq=1v&aqi=g-v10&aql=&gs_sm=c&gs_upl=17157l17907l0l22375l5l4l0l0l0l3l1359l4796l7-4l4l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=2d53be3b9c6e0b93&biw=1024&bih=583


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## Thinksilver (Feb 7, 2012)

Sodium nitrate available from DudaDiesel.com at $17 for 10 lbs


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## Don in Mindanao (May 10, 2013)

Greetings from the Philippines. I am an American living in the Philippines. I just signed up and was reading comments on subzero nitric acid substitute. I have done some research homework and thought you may like a resource and some facts. I hope i am not breaking the rules to quote Wikipedia. Nitric acid is made from sulfuric acid (H2SO4) treated with Potassium Nitrate (KNO3) as the reaction takes place the Potassium becomes potassium Sulfate (KSO4)(precipitated) and filtered, and Nitric Acid (HNO3). It makes sense to me if you take Hydrochloric Acid (HCl) and add Sodium Nitrate (NaNO3) that a similar reaction would take place and the result would be Hydrochloric Acid (HCl) would become Nitric Acid (HNO3) and Sodium Nitrate (NaNO3) would become Sodium Chloride (NaCl)(precipitated). so in my opinion the component of subzero could very well be Sodium Nitrate. as cited by Wikipedia Sulfuric Acid to Nitric Acid is just one of several ways to make Nitric Acid. The precipitated sulfate and salt would be insoluble in their respective acids. I hope this may clear up the questions on what SubZero could be since what it actually is may be considered a secret ingredient. Thank you for being on the internet....


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## Geo (May 10, 2013)

Don in Mindanao, its really no secret that sub zero is in fact sodium nitrate. you should study more on some of the older post. hcl and sodium nitrate is the two components of "poor man's AR". even though NO2 gas is formed while metals are dissolved, it does not create nitric acid in the way sulfuric acid would as its contaminated with hcl.

good luck and happy studying.


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## solar_plasma (May 10, 2013)

> Hydrochloric Acid (HCl) would become Nitric Acid (HNO3) and Sodium Nitrate (NaNO3) would become Sodium Chloride (NaCl)(precipitated)



For the record: No element can become another element in a chemical reaction and in this universe NO3- will never ever "become" Cl-


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