# Here's something fun.



## Palladium (Nov 6, 2009)

I been playing with some things here on the forum to help me keep up with data better. It's hard to keep track off it all sometimes. :idea: Here's a neat little trick i use for searching pictures. 

Enter this shortcut in your browser and the change the last field of numbers. >http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/download/file.php?id=855

There is some interesting pictures out there. If you find something good please post the link.


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## Palladium (Nov 6, 2009)

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/download/file.php?id=001


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## butcher (Nov 7, 2009)

beutiful, whats a brouser


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## Noxx (Nov 8, 2009)

Hey, I bought those crucibles a long time ago !


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## Claudie (May 31, 2013)

That is pretty cool, but there are no descriptions for the photos. :|


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## AndyWilliams (May 31, 2013)

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/download/file.php?id=752


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## samuel-a (Jun 1, 2013)

Check this out


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## goldsilverpro (Jun 1, 2013)

Excellent, Sam. Can't get simpler than that. Never thought of doing it that way.


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## mjgraham (Jun 1, 2013)

Yea Sam that is awesome, you can click the photo and go to the page. Some pretty amazing photos in the forum.


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## Gold (Jun 2, 2013)

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fgoldschrott.lefora.com%2F


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## Gold (Jun 3, 2013)

Ever wonder what happens to your gold at the refinery? :mrgreen: 





[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnGihZ1s2pw[/youtube]


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## griptheweasel (Jun 3, 2013)

Ah, the Harlem Shake even found its way to the Gold Refining Forum. No place is safe from it!


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## macfixer01 (Jun 4, 2013)

AndyWilliams said:


> http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/download/file.php?id=752




These look like the "gold plated marbles" I've been seeing everywhere on EBay?


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## Palladium (Jun 4, 2013)

If i'm not mistaken i believe that was a picture of some stainless steel balls that had been used in some type of barrel plating media. I believe the stainless steel balls were layered with alternating thicknesses of silver and gold. It's been a few years back i think though.


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## Claudie (Jun 4, 2013)

Palladium said:


> If i'm not mistaken i believe that was a picture of some stainless steel balls that had been used in some type of barrel plating media. I believe the stainless steel balls were layered with alternating thicknesses of silver and gold. It's been a few years back i think though.



What a relief it is to hear what they are, I thought they may have been eye balls :shock:


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## Palladium (Jun 4, 2013)

Got it ! http://goldrefiningforum.com/~goldrefi/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=1415&start=20#p12169

And here is the wisdom of Chris about the media balls.


The balls are used as conductive media, in barrel (a tumbler) plating of small parts that are not 100% metallic. They assure that all metallic portions of the parts will eventually make electrical contact and all will plate evenly.

Based on the assay, the balls started out much smaller than they are now. They are used over and over until they get too fat to work properly. Therefore, there are, most probably, 100's of cycle layers, each with Cu/Ni/Au layers. The same with the silver ones.

Each refining deal is different, depending on the metals involved, their thicknesses, variation in the sub-layers, and the ball material, itself. I have run many 100's of batches of barrel ball media, barrel danglers, and plating rack nodules, all of which have these same multiple layers of various metals. When dissolving, certain metal combinations require a lot of ingenuity. The big refiners would simply melt them with extra copper (to lower the melting point) and ship the bars. We little guys often have to think harder than the big guys.

You will be much better off if you can work a way to just dissolve the plating, and not the steel. It would keep things much simpler, create much less waste, and use much less acid. It will take 45 gallons of AR to dissolve everything. You might be able to use only 1 to 5 gallons of acid, if you could use nitric to dissolve only the plating, but not the steel.

On the silver balls, you almost have to use nitric. Aqua regia would gum up the works with silver chloride.

I would first experiment with using just nitric on the balls, a few balls at a time. If the gold is of typical thickness, it will be porous and will allow the nitric to penetrate the gold pores and dissolve the Cu/Ni. On the silver balls, the silver will also be dissolved.

Stainless Steel Balls. This will work fine if the balls are of stainless steel, which is not attacked by nitric. Just make up a 50/50, nitric/water mixture and put it the hot plate. This is the first thing you should try, on a few balls. Assume they're stainless. You will soon know.

If of mild steel, nitric is touchy. If too weak, it will attack the steel. If too strong, the attack on the plated metals will be slow. Also, temperature plays a big part in this.

Here's what I would try first, with mild steel balls:

(1) Add a few clean balls to a small beaker. Cover with full strength technical or reagent grade nitric acid. Watch for a reaction. The best thing that could happen is that the nitric would eat all of the plating, leaving the gold flakes and steel untouched. A little heat can be applied to speed things up. If it's going too slow or, if nothing dissolves, go to step (2).

(2) Add 1%, by volume, of water to the nitric, stir, and repeat step (1). If that doesn't work, add another 1% of water. Repeat until you can dissolve all the plating layers.

Notes:
1 - Mild Steel - If it goes fast, especially in production, it may overheat and attack the steel. You may have to cool it a little.
2 - Mild Steel - I would guess that the mild steel will be attacked with about 5% to 8% water added.
3 - Mild Steel - There are 3 crucial variables - nitric, water, and temperature. Odds are good that a certain combination of these will dissolve the Cu and Ni and leave the Au and Fe behind.
4 - All Types of Balls - The gold flakes are separated from the steel by washing.
5 - Silver - In the case of silver, dilute the solution about 50/50 and drop out the silver with copper.
6 - All Types of Balls - Nitric may not work, but it's very much worth a try. If it doesn't work, use AR.
7 - All Types of Balls - If nitric does work, in production I would probably drill a lot of small holes in a small bucket and dunk the balls into a larger bucket that contains a few inches of acid.
8 - All Types of Balls - You might be able to whack a ball with a hammer or squeeze it with a vise, to see the layers. Nickel is fairly brittle.

Notes on Aqua Regia: In the total dissolving of everything, Fe, when finally exposed, will tend to go first and Au will go last. I have found that, if about 10% of the steel is still left undissolved but exposed, none of the gold will be dissolved. Test the solution for gold, anyway! This is partially predictable by the electromotive series.


After all this is said and done, the best way, in this particular combination of metals, would be to dissolve all the plating with a cyanide mixture or electrolytic cyanide, leaving all of the steel behind. The nickel might be a small problem, but could be solved with additives. The gold is then dropped with zinc dust. I'm not even suggesting the use of cyanide. That great privilege was pretty much taken away from us a long time ago.


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