# Processes



## trooper123 (Jun 17, 2007)

I need someone to kinda point me in the right direction. This is what I seem to understand -- 

HCI is used mainly for pins (still not sure on the definition of "pins". Some seem to elude to only cpu pins). This can be used at room temp or heated.

AP is for fingers. No heat.

If HCI only eats the base metals why can't/aren't both processes used for boards?

If AP DOES dessovle gold -- why use it ??

I have "kinda" gleemed the answers to these but I would like to hear the pros and cons from you who are accomplished at this.

And as a side question, Do you reccomend removing ALL components from PCB. If so -- how? I have an older cell phone board with lots of gold traces but a TON of SM's ?


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## trooper123 (Jun 18, 2007)

ooooo crickets not good


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## toadiesop (Jun 18, 2007)

I'm a Nn00b too, but take a stab at it from what I've learned here and from my own experience/experiments. :lol: 

AP can be used for pins, fingers and CPU's. It's better if you separate your batches since each material takes different amounts of time to be DONE.

The easiest way to do pins in my opinion is in a cell with a copper mesh "basket" as your anode. (check lazersteve's excellent tutorial)


If you do not have or care to use a cell, yes these too can be done in AP.

Fingers and CPUs work EXCELLENT in AP as well.

AP at room temp AP will dissolve very little gold if any. Once heated you can dissolve a little more, but it's not a problem since you can "drop" it back out of solution with Sodium Metabisulfite. You will never actually "lose" gold.

Yes, you are correct that AP will work on boards, but the fact is, it's just not worth it. It's not even close to being cost effective if you are talking about PC Motherboards. I believe it takes 1 gallon of HCl to dissolve 1 POUND of copper. Most of the time there isn't much gold on circuit boards as we like to think.  When you're dealing with motherboards and other PCBs, after you get all the obvious gold plated pins, chips and connectors what you're left with is a lot of copper, lead, tin, some silver and VERY little other precious metals (Platinum, Rhodium, Palladium, ect). 

And yes, you'd want to remove all the surface mounted components so that takes precious time as well. Something best suited for a rainy day when you have nothing of higher value you could be working on.

Never throw anything away until you know you've gotten every last bit of metal you care to get out of it, but it seems to me you're not even close to be worrying about those other things. 

Just concentrate on pins, fingers and cpus for now and the rest will follow.

Plus. I'm not sure what you mean by "cell phone board", and I'm thinking you mean you have ONE SINGLE cell phone board.

Like the circuit board from an actual phone (2 inches by 4 inches maybe?). Or do you mean HUGE mainframe boards for cell phone equipment?

If it's the smaller board from an actual phone you would need HUNDREDS of them before it would be worth it. If I remember correctly there's around 5-10 CENTS worth of gold on each board and that's being generous. 

I'm no expert (yet 8) ) but I hope that helps some.


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## lazersteve (Jun 18, 2007)

Trooper, 

Sorry about the slow response. I've been busy building a pc lab for a school. Now lets look at your questions:



trooper said:


> HCI is used mainly for pins (still not sure on the definition of "pins". Some seem to elude to only cpu pins). This can be used at room temp or heated.



I noticed you spelled the acid HCI, it's HCl (little L). :wink: Pins are found in headers, connectors, jacks, jumpers, cpus, etc. They are basically any gold plated base metal (copper, zinc, nickel, steel) in the shape of a needle or tube. Here is a photo of many types of 'pins':

[img::]http://www.goldrecovery.us/images/pinsasst.jpg[/img]

[img::]http://www.goldrecovery.us/images/pinsasst2.jpg[/img]

Typically when the pin is in plastic it's called a header or jumper block. 

Heat is not required for this reaction, but produces much faster results.



trooper said:


> If HCI only eats the base metals why can't/aren't both processes used for boards?



You can use this for fingers, but it's not as fast as some of the other methods. 



trooper said:


> If AP DOES dessovle gold -- why use it ??



It works on the fingers quicker than the straight HCl. It dissolves gold very slowly especially if not heated. 



trooper said:


> Do you reccomend removing ALL components from PCB. If so -- how? I have an older cell phone board with lots of gold traces but a TON of SM's ?



Here's a post that deals with boards:

Processing Boards

Read thru the thread, there is some good stuff in this one.

Steve


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## toadiesop (Jun 18, 2007)

Heh. Me and Steve we're typing at the same time.

Hope I did okay.  


And I'm drooling over those pics Steve. :lol: 

What are those long "needles" in that bag used for? Really nice stuff!


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## lazersteve (Jun 18, 2007)

Toadie, 

This was just a few tidbits I grabbed for the photo op. I've got mountains of this kind of scrap. 8) 

The long needles are 5000 gold filled pins for some sort of jewelry display. I bought them about a year and a half ago from a very nice lady in Austrialia who had troubles getting rid of them. She couldn't believe I wanted all 5000!!! She was selling them on ebay in lots of 10-20 if I remember correctly.

What do you think of these 'pins':

[img::]http://www.goldrecovery.us/images/spool.jpg[/img]

It's over 10# of gold plated pin wire *before* it gets cut into pins. Manufacturers scrap as GSP has dubbed it. I got this stuff from a very close friend of mine in California (Hi Bill!!!  ).

Steve


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## toadiesop (Jun 18, 2007)

nice!!!


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## trooper123 (Jun 18, 2007)

yes the forum is a wealth spring of info !!! good stuff -- THANKS !!!


(writes "heat gun" on list)


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## lazersteve (Jun 18, 2007)

Damn!

My wife just saw this photo and snagged the twenty spot!!!  


:lol: :lol: :lol: 

Steve


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## toadiesop (Jun 18, 2007)

:lol: 

I would have snagged the wire! :twisted: 

:lol:


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## Charlena (Jun 24, 2007)

You got those jumper plug pin outs off so neatly?
Give it up Steve! I gotta know....lol


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## aflacglobal (Jun 24, 2007)

Hell , I wanted both. lol

Great photos there steve.


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## mike.fortin (Jun 24, 2007)

lazersteve said:


> Damn!
> 
> My wife just saw this photo and snagged the twenty spot!!!
> 
> ...



Steve--now we know why you dont sell any of your gold.  Mike.


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## lazersteve (Jun 24, 2007)

Charlena said:


> You got those jumper plug pin outs off so neatly?
> Give it up Steve! I gotta know....lol



The secret to getting the 'jumpers' off cleanly and in one piece is 1 part heat gun, 1 part needle nose pliers, and 1 part timing. 

When I pull headers which you call jumpers, actually 'jumper blocks' is a better term, I use my heat gun, a set of long handled needle nose pliers, and a steady count. I time the heating cycle until the header will rock left to right between the nose of the pliers when gently tapped. When the header rocks freely as I tap it, it's ready to snatch out. On the longer blocks you have to move down the header in sections to get it all out nicely. That's why they are all curved. :wink: 

Steve


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## Charlena (Jun 24, 2007)

lazersteve said:


> The secret to getting the 'jumpers' off cleanly and in one piece is 1 part heat gun, 1 part needle nose pliers, and 1 part timing.
> 
> Steve



THANK YOU!
Hugs!


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## Palladium (May 6, 2008)




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