# Disassembly of imagesetter containing Class IIIb laser



## Chuck_Revised (Jan 17, 2008)

I have not began taking the imagesetter apart yet. I'm looking for safety guidelines in regard to the laser and capacitator(s) (if any). The unit has been unplugged for a week and not used in 3 months. I have an operator's manual, but not a service manual. The manufacturer is uncooperative (I wonder why..).

Is the "laser radiation" referred to in the op. manual only generated when power is applied? If so, to confirm my analysis, there is no danger, unless a charge is retained somewhere in the system?

Do capacitators retain charges indefinitely? How do I safely dissipate the charge in a capacitator (with no regard to the usefulness of the cap. for its original purpose)?

As I tear it down, I photograph the parts and circuit boards.

Thanks for your help!


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## lazersteve (Jan 17, 2008)

Chuck,

The laser is safe when the power is removed. 

The only caps that pose a threat to your safety are the large can style electrolytics. They typically are found in the power supply sections of the unit. You can discharge them with a low ohm (10 ohms) value high wattage wire (5 watts >) wound resistor shorted across the positive and negative leads.

Steve


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## SapunovDmitry (Jan 17, 2008)

What type of laser was it?I used to deal with lasers,so maybe i can help.
I hope it's not a dye laser.Because dyes like rodamine or some others are really stinky(not dangerous but stinky),and they are hard to wash off the clothes.


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## Chuck_Revised (Jan 17, 2008)

Steve... thanks! Does a cap retain a charge indefinitely?

Dmitry....

It's a visible red laser, used to expose photographic, silver-based film in an imagesetter for commercial printing purposes. It'll be interesting to take it apart. I'll probably leave the laser assembly alone at first.

It's a 1997 unit costing originally $30,000 and up, so it may have some PMs. The unit weighs approx 160 pounds, mostly metal.

I'll post some photos as I go, probably with some ID questions too.


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## lazersteve (Jan 17, 2008)

The caps can hold a charge for varible lengths of time. Be safe and discharge the larger ones as a habit.

The laser sounds like an old low wattage HeNe variety, or a solid state diode variety, both are pretty common.

Steve


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## macfixer01 (Jan 17, 2008)

Chuck_Revised said:


> Steve... thanks! Does a cap retain a charge indefinitely?
> 
> Dmitry....
> 
> ...




My previous job was working 7 years for Heidelberg and I had a few years before that doing service for graphic arts retailers. Heidelberg had bought out Linotype I guess a year or so before I started with them to get into the postscript imagesetter market. I have also worked on some AGFA imagesetters such as the Accuset and Studioset. There is nothing to worry about with a typical visible HENE laser imagesetter as long as the power is off. The larger capacitors in the power supply perform filtering functions, and they're part of a circuit so charges bleed off quickly after the unit is powered off. You're not likely to find too much in the way of PGM's other than the typical edge connectors and header pins except maybe on the oldest units like the Lino 330.

The big old Linotype-Hell film recorders which were pre-Postscript and operated coupled directly to a drum scanner may be a better bet. I didn't work on them myself, and I don't recall what I was told was contained in the laser tubes on those. I do recall though that they had to be shipped Hazmat. I'm thinking it was rubidium? Those also had a lot of large circuit boards, and a good sized backplane with some wire-wrapped pins. The old Linotype-Hell drum scanners too had a similar complement of boards.

Their vertical drum scanner (Tango) still used photomultiplier tubes but was much more modern electronically, and had little visible gold anywhere. Most of the electronics were contained on one large Maxi board. The newer CCD type Heidelberg scanners such as the Topaz or Nexscan would not have much to offer from a PGM standpoint either.

macfixer01


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## Chuck_Revised (Jan 17, 2008)

Thanks MacFixer! I see where you get your handle. This unit is a Prepress Panther Plus. I just sold a working Agfa StudioSet 2000 (infrared laser, mfd in 1990). I operate a typesetting co. and am getting out of film output. The Panther needs repair and wouldn't eBay, so I'm going to scrap it just to get rid of it.


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## Anonymous (Jan 18, 2008)

Post Deleted


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## SapunovDmitry (Jan 18, 2008)

I fully agree with the previous post. Don't break the 30000 $ toy :wink: .It can be useful for some people,dealing with such stuff.
As for me i've never seen HeNe laser that costs 30K.They are typically 1000-3000$.
Can you post it's photo?


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## Chuck_Revised (Jan 18, 2008)

It's not a HENE laser, for sure; the HENE use a different kind of film then I did. The $30,000 was a guess in 1997 prices. This unit was on the leading edge of technology in 1997 (but no more!).

I haven't torn it down yet... probably tomorrow. I'll post pics then. Right now it's just a box from the outside. But I'm not intending on breaking the laser, just disassembling the unit for scrap purposes.

Thanks for your suggestions! Can I find holographic and CNC hobbyists on eBay? Or would you have more specific ideas?


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## Anonymous (Jan 18, 2008)

Chuck Revised PM me.

Copy with quotation marks into google "holographic forum" same here "cnc forum" then from what you learn from these searches you may have found yourself a new hobby to go along with refining precious metals.


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## macfixer01 (Jan 18, 2008)

Chuck_Revised said:


> It's not a HENE laser, for sure; the HENE use a different kind of film then I did. The $30,000 was a guess in 1997 prices. This unit was on the leading edge of technology in 1997 (but no more!).
> 
> I haven't torn it down yet... probably tomorrow. I'll post pics then. Right now it's just a box from the outside. But I'm not intending on breaking the laser, just disassembling the unit for scrap purposes.
> 
> Thanks for your suggestions! Can I find holographic and CNC hobbyists on eBay? Or would you have more specific ideas?




Chuck,
For low end capstan imagesetters (even some drum imagesetters like the Herkules and Signasetter), helium-neon lasers were common. Otherwise it's probably an IR laser diode. Still no great shakes compared to what's available today. I see much higher wattage laser diodes for sale on Ebay all the time.

macfixer01


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## SapunovDmitry (Jan 19, 2008)

It can be ruby laser as well. And the price is ok for that one.
You were speaking about capacitors?
There are some huge ones in laser for flash lamp operation.
Does it have a water cooling?
If yes it is probably not a HeNe.
If you post the image i will say what it costs for sure.


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## lazersteve (Jan 19, 2008)

If it's a powerful enough ruby laser (YAG - Yttium Aluminum Garnet) it's has many uses. These lasers are found in many industrial marking systems.

The bank of capacitors from the booster pack are 4-6" tall and a 1-2" across. The booster pack in one of these lasers can kill you if you get zapped by it.

You can tell a YAG laser by the flash lamp cavitiy and a set of Galvos (motorized palno mirrors for directing the beam) on the exit end. 

Another feature of the powerful YAGs is the Q-Switch unit located behind the flash lamp assembly where the laser rod is housed.

Steve


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## macfixer01 (Jan 19, 2008)

SapunovDmitry said:


> It can be ruby laser as well. And the price is ok for that one.
> You were speaking about capacitors?
> There are some huge ones in laser for flash lamp operation.
> Does it have a water cooling?
> ...




Guys, imagesetters create an image on photographic film, we're not talking about etching metal here. Think milliwatts! I have never seen or heard of an imagesetter using a ruby or yag laser. That's not to say there may not be some ancient hulk out there that used one.

Some of the early platesetters like the Gutenberg (for imaging directly to aluminum printing plates) used more powerful lasers. But present computer to plate (CTP) systems are using semiconductor lasers like the violet laser Prosetter and Supersetter. It's only effecting the coating on the surface though, not burning the metal.

macfixer01


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## SapunovDmitry (Jan 19, 2008)

Well.....  It's another option. And i fully agree because i've never dealt with holographic lasers.I've just made a guess.
But we are talking of something that we haven't seen.
As for me, i am eager to see some photo and everything will be clear then.


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## lazersteve (Jan 19, 2008)

Macfixer,

I have to agree, YAGs are for heavy duty laser etching, not light duty, so it's unlikely the laser is a YAG. 

If he could provide a photo or some spcifications of the laser that would narrow down which laser type it is.

I think Demitry (and myself) was looking at the price and matching it to a particular type of laser. It's hard to imagine a piece of equipment that cost $30K using a relativly cheap HeNe or an ultra expensive YAG. 

I strongly suspect the laser is a diode variety.

Steve


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## Chuck_Revised (Jan 19, 2008)

Here's one photo of the interior of the imagesetter. The laser itself is mounted on a heavy steel "carriage". The ICB in front on the right provides power to the laser. You can see the connector to the ICB from the laser above the ICB and to the right. If this post works, I'll post more photos.


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## Chuck_Revised (Jan 19, 2008)

In the first photo in the center is a large lense! About 4" in diameter.


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## Chuck_Revised (Jan 19, 2008)

These are pics of the power supply board. The first is of the left side, note the 2 caps about 2" tall on left. Directly above them (circled in red) is a gold-appearing structure, maybe a heat sink? Could that be gold plate? It sure doesn't look like brass...

The second pic is the right side of the power supply. Are the circled items the brown caps that contain tantalum (sp)?

All comments appreciated! Now time for lunch, then back to work.


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## Chuck_Revised (Jan 19, 2008)

Sorry, the titles are transposed on the pics. Right should be left, etc. DUH!


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## macfixer01 (Jan 19, 2008)

Chuck_Revised said:


> Here's one photo of the interior of the imagesetter. The laser itself is mounted on a heavy steel "carriage". The ICB in front on the right provides power to the laser. You can see the connector to the ICB from the laser above the ICB and to the right. If this post works, I'll post more photos.




Chuck,
I'm not familiar with this particular brand of imagesetter. It could be a semiconductor laser, but they're usually part of a larger module containing the heatsink, shutter, neutral density filters, focus assembly, and collimator. It looks to me like there is a small HENE laser tube at the center right, comparable to what Ultre uses in their 15 and 12 inch engines, which the AGFA studioset is based on. At the center left appears to be the spinner motor which spins a multi-sided mirror at very high RPM's to scan the laser beam the width of the film. There is normally a Theta lens which compensates for the effects of parallax at the ends of the scan lines, so the image density on the film (or RC paper) doesn't taper off at the edges.

macfixer01


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## eagle2 (Jan 20, 2008)

All you have to do is look at the voltage rating of the two larger caps. They are just the input caps for the AC input voltage side. If the machine ran on 120vac, the rating is about 200volts. 

All the rest looks like low voltage circuitry, perhaps only the laser needed a high voltage circuit. 

The aluminum heat sink above the caps is only anodized yellow paint. 

Lots of copper to scrap, but I think the only gold you may find is in the ends of the ribbon cables.

Al


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## woofard (Mar 8, 2008)

Hey Steve or any other laser printer person:

The original reply you wrote says that the laser (radiation) on a laser printer is safe when powerless. 

Is this true on allmost all models? 

So, disassembly of the laser unit is completely safe with all wires disconected??? (I see alot of gold contacts in there)


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## Anonymous (Mar 8, 2008)

woofard said:


> Hey Steve or any other laser printer person:
> 
> The original reply you wrote says that the laser (radiation) on a laser printer is safe when powerless.


This is true. 



woofard said:


> Is this true on allmost all models?


All



woofard said:


> So, disassembly of the laser unit is completely safe with all wires disconected??? (I see alot of gold contacts in there)


I assume you powered the unit down before looking at all this wonderful gold

Some larger laser equipment could contain some large capacitors that could bite ya. Discharge first.

See Microwave Oven post on capacitors.


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## macfixer01 (Mar 8, 2008)

gustavus said:


> woofard said:
> 
> 
> > Hey Steve or any other laser printer person:
> ...





This is true for a typical office laser printer or other imaging device using a semiconductor laser. For industrial equipment that uses a high power optically pumped laser (such as a ruby or yag laser), voltages can possibly be stored even with the power disconnected.

macfixer01


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## woofard (Mar 9, 2008)

Thank you very much for setting me straight! I'll quit searching the net now for symptoms of radiation sickness... 

These are older color laserjets, and some really old regular laser HP's that weigh alot. I guess all the warning stickers and user manuals scared me... the optics are hooked to a circuit board, but there are no caps larger than 3/4" high, and the diameter of a pencil eraser. I could see the gold connectors leading into the unit before I took the lid off of the laser lens compartment. 

Those warning labels might as well say "whatever you do - don't look in here...it's a big secret" What a tease...makes me want to look even more!


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## CheerfulChuck (Oct 15, 2015)

Hi! I am the poster formerly known as Chuck_Revised.

Regarding the imagesetter, I contacted an independent imagesetting parts and repair dealer about the electronic parts of the Panther Plus. He purchased nearly all the boards and I think the lense for $250, which was great with me. I'd purchased the imagesetter for $1000 and used it for 18 months prior to its breakdown. This all occurred in 2008.

Just thought I'd finish the story. :lol:


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