# e Bay "Gold Drops"



## tpvdvl

Hi all. Please bear with me, I'm VERY new to this. My experiance level amounts to watching a few youtube videos on refining . Has anyone seen the "Gold Drops" sold on e-Bay? They are supposed to be melted CPU pins and such, you can get them for less than .50 a gram. Has anyone tried to refine these? Can they be refined with a flux or a collecting metal process as opposed to acid method?

Thanks fop any info on this, Todd.


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## patnor1011

Waste of time and fuel.
They are just polished brass.
I did refine some, last one was 50g and I hated every minute of doing that.


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## Geo

no, they can not. most computer pins yield less than 0.1% by weight. that means it takes more than 1 pound of pins to yield 1g of gold. i hope you didnt invest your life savings. this has been a sore spot on the forum because most feel it is un-ethical to fleece people by selling worthless crap and make people think its worth something.i was wondering when people would start showing up here asking what to do with this stuff.


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## martyn111

tpvdvl said:


> Hi all. Please bear with me, I'm VERY new to this. My experiance level amounts to watching a few youtube videos on refining . Has anyone seen the "Gold Drops" sold on e-Bay? They are supposed to be melted CPU pins and such and you can get them got less thn .50 a gram. Has anyone tried to refine these? Can they be refined with a flux or a collecting metal process as opposed to acid method? Thanks fop any info on this, Todd.


 Welcome to the forum. The questions you have just asked can be answered by reading a thread titled 'The best of ebay' which is currantly discussing the exact material you are describing, see the link below http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=7109 If you read through the whole thread you will educate yourself on many of the 'scams' which have recently appeared on ebay, for a speedy answer for your questions though, go to the last 2 pages where you will find the discussion on 'gold drops'.


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## NobleMetalWorks

First, if you figure the actual percentage of the gold content in those melted globs, you will quickly realize that they are often times less than 1% gold.

Many refineries will not pay out on material that is less than 1%. So if you took those globs to your local refiner, had them scan by XRF like NTR does, you will very quickly realize that they are not going to buy your glob, nor do they want to bother attempting to refine it. There is a good reason for this.

In order to extract the gold from your material, you have to part it in an copper, electrolytic cell. It takes far more solution to dissolve copper, than silver, so you have to have far more tanks to electrolytically refine material that requires to be run as a copper proposition.

If you attempted to smelt, you probably wouldn't be able to recover the values.

So because it costs more to refine copper than silver or gold, most refineries don't bother with copper. Once you melt pins all together, what you really have done is devalued whatever gold there might be, because you just made it far more expensive to extract it.

Figure it like this. In a lb of pins there is between, usually, 2-4 grams of gold. There is about 453.5 grams in a lb. If we assume on the high end that there is 4 grams of gold in each lb, that means out of every 453.5 grams only 4 are gold. Take 4 / 453.5 and you get .8% total gold content, on the extreme high side.

So those gold globs are about, guessing mind you, .8% gold. Not even one percent. And that is if the melted glob is a full lb, usually they are grams, or ounces. So lets take this one step further and use the example you stated above and ask ourselves how much is that gram really worth.

1 gram, right now, as I write this is worth $54.57. .8% of 54.57 = 0.43656. So each one of those globs, on the maximum side of it's value is worth about .43 cents.

Is it profitable to buy globs of melted pins? No, without exception, no, it will take far more to refine and extract than the actual value, not counting on what you paid for it. No, it's not a good idea, it's not profitable, you will loose money unless you keep it for enough years that it becomes cost effective to attempt extracting the gold from the alloy.

Scott


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## patnor1011

I got one of better, I guess it was not from pins only or if pins then some very small tiny pins like in laptop. Button weight was 55g and after painful process (melting, making shots, dissolving, dropping, washing, second refining...) I recovered 3,5g of gold. But according to button owner there was some jewelry (I suspect gold filled) included in that gold drop.
If that gold drop is made from pins only I would not touch it - you will spend more on time and chemicals recovering this melted mix of metals than your return will be.
I do have pictures somewhere I will try to find them.


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## Palladium

I have posted warning after warning on my ebay ad about these gold drops thinking people would have to stumble over my ads and be educated. Nope!!!! People still read my ad and send me pm's asking " Can you refine these for me". Sheople are ignorant, and i don't like to call people that, when i tell you not to contact me and you've been scammed and what do you do? You send me an email and then get sassy because i didn't tell you what you wanted to hear. This is about no one in particular, just people in general. The last guy who contacted me bought well over a $1,000 worth in two days. They think "god what a deal" and go crazy buying them before someone else does. The word greed come to mind as a motivator. I actually had one of the scammers contact me and threaten legal action! Yeah, right buddy!!!! Stand in line with the rest of them. They must have gotten the same lawyer Shor did when they contacted me. Let the haters hate.


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## Rodger Hamilton

Little Meadow Creak in Charlotte North Carolina 1799, a 12 year old boy named Conrad Read skipped Sunday school to play along the creak when found something that attracted his attention, he reached down and picked a rock it was unusual and very heavy, he took it home but no one recognized it was gold. The family used it as a door stop for 3 years until a neighbor suggested he take to the jeweler in town who then determined it was gold. But Read not knowing the value of it, the jeweler gave him $3:50 for the 17 (seventeen) lb nugget, at the time, gold was worth $15 per oz so it was really worth $3600.

The above true story in this context, is just a bit of trivia... the jeweler payed him one-tenth of one percent the true value of the nugget. It was one helluva bargain.

The point I am trying to make by telling this story is this... It's human nature... everyone hopes to find that ignorant hooch with absolutely no idea the real value of the item he's trying to sell.

But scammers will often play the part of the clueless to catch those who wish to be someone like the lucky jeweler in the above story... and it works for the scammer.

This is why we find so many folks buying these globs, drops, bars of “so called” melted pins, scrap jewelery and such.

What collectors need to clearly understand is “Provenance”. Once the original material is melted together “out of your sight”, Provenance is destroyed, because now there is no way to prove that the blob has any valuables in it until you again destroy the piece to get the values out.

And there is the catch 22... because now you cannot get your money back when you discover there is so little or no gold in it.


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## g_axelsson

SBrown said:


> Is it profitable to buy globs of melted pins? No, without exception, no, it will take far more to refine and extract than the actual value, not counting on what you paid for it. No, it's not a good idea, it's not profitable, you will loose money unless you keep it for enough years that it becomes cost effective to attempt extracting the gold from the alloy.


I have read about some members on the forum that recovers gold from pins using the AP (acid peroxide) method. If they can recover the gold and make a profit then there at least exist a method to refine it for less than the value of the gold. 

I melted some pins twety years ago in an experiment to refine it. I still have the "drop" and nowadays I'm using it to cement silver. The gold will mix in with the silver but when I run it in a silver cell the gold will be extracted, recovery of the gold for free. 

My original plan to refine the gold "drop" was to run it in a copper cell, but I messed up my process, inexperience and lack of patience were two attributing factors, the amount of zinc probably another.
Though, I haven't given up hope on this route for refining.

But I was starting with a known source, what is the guarantee that there is any gold at all in the "drops" from eBay? At least if you buy pins you would see what you were buying. And the prices on eBay is just rediculous, I'm sorry to tell you this Todd, but you've lost money even before trying to recover and refining the gold.

/Göran


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## mls26cwru

my assumption is that it is just melted bronze anyway... why go through the hassle of harvesting pins... it takes a lot more time to harvest pins than it is worth... even for what they sell them on ebay (at least for the volume the have). harvested pins, when melted together, should not not look anything resembling gold as they have such little gold content per volume.... and since most pins are made from copper and tin i guess that would make them look a lot like, i dunno... bronze? go figure....


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## NobleMetalWorks

if when the pins are melted, they are not done so in a way that could be called homogenous, then the heavier material will try to settle to the bottom when the molten alloy is poured. Refineries pull this off sometimes so that when they do their assay, it reads lower than the actual gold content. If it's being caste into a bar this way, then it would make sense that they would take a picture of the side that looks more gold, than the other.

You can also tell by some of the pictures, just by looking at the background, that the picture has been altered to make things look like they are more gold, when most likely they are very little. When you see a gold colored TV in the background, or a carpet, and table, and everything else different shades of gold, you can generally tell that the picture has been altered.

If you take copper, and alloy it with just a small amount of gold, it does change the look of the copper. If you took that bar and threw it on the floor in front of a group of people and said it was gold, they would believe you without question because psychologically they want to believe. The same goes for ebay auctions of globs of gold. When the seller describes it as virgin, heavy gold plated pins for gold recovery drop it sets the mind on fire with imagination. Gold has that affect on humans. When one person preys and makes a victim of another person because of their desire to believe in something, it's called exploitation. People on ebay selling this garbage are exploiting peoples desires to believe they are able to purchase gold at crazy prices. The more I think about it, the more it disgusts me. Specially when you take into consideration how many desperate people there are.

I heard just about the saddest story on this subject, just today, just hours ago, between my posts on this thread. And I had to be the one to tell her that she was ripped off, and hear an elderly woman sob as she told me her story. As she told me she spent everything she had for xmas, on globs for her grandchildren. She is 92 years of age, and thought she was securing her grandchildren's future college funds, she wanted to do something special because she does not think she will make next xmas. It makes me sick to know there are people who do this type of thing, that contribute to this forum, and think this is okay. If you are one of these people who melt pins into globs so that you can rip people off on ebay, you should be ashamed of yourselves. You should expect no quarter from me, nor anyone else for that matter. You know that what you are doing is wrong, regardless of how honest you think you are being. You know what you are doing is wrong.

Scott


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## goldenchild

mls26cwru said:


> my assumption is that it is just melted bronze anyway... why go through the hassle of harvesting pins... it takes a lot more time to harvest pins than it is worth... even for what they sell them on ebay (at least for the volume the have). harvested pins, when melted together, should not not look anything resembling gold as they have such little gold content per volume.... and since most pins are made from copper and tin i guess that would make them look a lot like, i dunno... bronze? go figure....




I suspect that some of the people making these "drops" may be sourcing their material from ebay itself. This way there is no effort in harvesting pins. It could explain how those auctions we see for gold plated pins get sold for so much. Half of the sales could be from the same people that would buy the gold drops as investment and the other half from people looking to make gold drops. Really messed up if you think about.


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## NobleMetalWorks

You are right, it's really messed up...

And then to think that there are people who purchase material from ebay because they don't have access to anywhere they can purchase scrap. And imagine this is how they make their living. And then imagine the people who are melting pins into globs winning those auctions only to ruin the gold so that it's not cost effective to extract it.

Grrrrr

From this point on I am not going to hold back my thoughts on this type of scam/transaction. People who do this sort of thing need to know that a sizable number of people do not approve at all the way they are conducting themselves. I do not think It's not a good idea to perpetuate this type of behavior.

Scott


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## wehali

Thank you so much for your comments and posts on this subject. I was wondering why those "globs" of pins were selling for so much more than they seem worth. I harvest pins, and indeed it is a very time consuming and labor intensive. I am new to this forum but I can already see that there is a lot of knowledge to be gained here. Keep up the great work.


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## kane333

I was trying to find information on what kind of torch to use to melt these pins because, doing the math, 1 pound of pins unmelted runs in the $60-70 range whereas melting them down into 20 gram globs could potentially bring in over $200 per pound of gold plated pins. After reading this thread, I've decided that I will not be melting these pins. I don't like being scammed and certainly don't want to become a scammer. And trying to sell my pins on Ebay could lead to more of these worthless globs showing up. 

I'm learning alot coming to these forums and reading (member of SMF where I found a link to this forum). I'd still like to know what kind of torch everyone uses to melt and make their buttons etc. ATM, I have a B Tank with a Turbo Torch from my plumbing days, a small propane torch from a local auction, and an acetylene cutting torch setup with only one cutting tip. I've heard mention MAPP? so I'm looking at purchasing a Bernzomatic TS8000BT High Intensity Torch Head from Amazon. Anyone have any better suggestions?

More questions from a newbie. What is better to gather? Gold Plated or Gold Filled jewelry? Also, what are the karats used to make Gold Plated or Gold Filled Jewelry?


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## goldsilverpro

kane333 said:


> More questions from a newbie. What is better to gather? Gold Plated or Gold Filled jewelry? Also, what are the karats used to make Gold Plated or Gold Filled Jewelry?



Gold filled, FOR SURE. Plated costume jewelry might run about .08%, on average, but it can vary a lot. Gold filled usually runs from 1% to 5%, with the average about 2%. That's 25 times more than plated. However, these are averages. Actual values could vary a lot from these figures.


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## niteliteone

kane333 said:


> I was trying to find information on what kind of torch to use to melt these pins because, doing the math, 1 pound of pins unmelted runs in the $60-70 range whereas melting them down into 20 gram globs could potentially bring in over $200 per pound of gold plated pins. After reading this thread, I've decided that I will not be melting these pins. I don't like being scammed and certainly don't want to become a scammer. And trying to sell my pins on Ebay could lead to more of these worthless globs showing up.
> 
> I'm learning alot coming to these forums and reading (member of SMF where I found a link to this forum). I'd still like to know what kind of torch everyone uses to melt and make their buttons etc. ATM, I have a B Tank with a Turbo Torch from my plumbing days, a small propane torch from a local auction, and an acetylene cutting torch setup with only one cutting tip. I've heard mention MAPP? so I'm looking at purchasing a Bernzomatic TS8000BT High Intensity Torch Head from Amazon. Anyone have any better suggestions?
> 
> More questions from a newbie. What is better to gather? Gold Plated or Gold Filled jewelry? Also, what are the karats used to make Gold Plated or Gold Filled Jewelry?



Hello and welcome to the forum,
To answer your question about which type of torch to use for melting.
Some people here have had good luck with the MAPP torches but I prefer the oxy\acet with a cutting tip. Would also work with a rosebud tip. 
For me I would probably blow my gold and silver all over the place with MAPP or the rosebud tip.

Gold plated jewelry is a great item to process as long as you get it free. Usually costs more to ship it than you will recover from it. So buyer beware.


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## Nijiman

Life is a learning process. When I first started out I thought I would collect as much as I could so that when I did my first run at refining I would be able to actually have some gold and silver. Like many others I went to ebay and looked and there they were, the pretty pictures of these gold drops bars up for aution. Not knowing any better (being ignorant, or not wanting to believe people would scam me) I bid and won 150 gram gold drop bar (4 little chunks). They arrived and I set them asside, about a month later I decided to remelt them and pour some corn flakes so the refining would go better. I quickly discovered my pretty little bars were just lightly gold plated epoxy. Did I feel like a dumb ass? You bet. But I learned some valuable lessons, first most of what you see on ebay is overpriced crapola, second I learned that there are people who make thier living scamming people on ebay and whats really bad is that ebay allows them to get away with it. Buyer protection my ass. We live and we learn. In this forum I have found the voices of experienceand my advice to anyone starting out is this; before you go buying up the world on ebay, read, read Hoke, then watch the freely available videos at gold n scrap or those put out by lasersteve. You will be glad you did. Second go slow like many other things this is a learning process and you will screw up occasionally (it happens) read the forums mucho grande words of wisdom and experience to be had.


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## Jpgetthagold

Hello , I am new to this forum, I am on my second round of trying to process another batch of scrap computers, the first time I had a small amount of computers and a few cell phones and a couple lap tops, I made so many mistakes, I managed to save a small portion and some one recently gave me about 11 computers that I am cleaning now, this time I am researching procedures and I want to do it right this time. I plan on doing this for a long time, it's not about getting rich it's about acquiring gold for the future. Plus I want to recycle other metals also. I became overwhelmed yesterday watch ing all the techniques online and I was also contemplating buying the bars on eBay, then I'm like , if they took the time to harvest all those pins, and shelter them, why went they just keeping the gold, because they prey on newbies like me, anyway right before I joined there was a post about read this book first before asking questions, I can't find it, can someone help me link up on that book. 
Thanks


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## Jmk88

They do not contain any gold whatsoever quite a few members here have bought and tested - also on YouTube. Not even 0.01 of gold in them bars.

E scrap isn’t really worth processing unless you have a e waste company or you directly refine for one.

You need 10000 pre 2015 laptops to obtain 10 ounces; pro rata adaption can be used to calculate. However some items contain more than others so that’s an average.

Hate to burst your bubble but if you’re grabbing ten laptops here, ten laptops there, a phone here and a phone there, you’re heading for a huge disappointment. I don’t want to say it’s not worth it but that’s what almost everyone will say, unless you have access to high amounts of this sort of material.


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## Shark

Jpgetthagold said:


> anyway right before I joined there was a post about read this book first before asking questions, I can't find it, can someone help me link up on that book.
> Thanks



There are two versions of C.M. Hoke's book A printable version and a screen readable version. They can be found at the bottom of Frugelrefiner's signature or they can be found at the following links.

Printer friendly version

Printer Friendly Copy of Hoke's Book

Screen readable version

Screen Readable Copy of Hoke's Book

The book doesn't deal with eWaste directly, but on refining gold with sections on a few other precious metals. Well worth the read and nice to have on hand as a reference at times.


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## silversaddle1

Jmk88 said:


> They do not contain any gold whatsoever quite a few members here have bought and tested - also on YouTube. Not even 0.01 of gold in them bars.
> 
> E scrap isn’t really worth processing unless you have a e waste company or you directly refine for one.
> 
> *You need 10000 pre 2015 laptops to obtain 10 ounces*; pro rata adaption can be used to calculate. However some items contain more than others so that’s an average.
> 
> Hate to burst your bubble but if you’re grabbing ten laptops here, ten laptops there, a phone here and a phone there, you’re heading for a huge disappointment. I don’t want to say it’s not worth it but that’s what almost everyone will say, unless you have access to high amounts of this sort of material.



Say an average laptop weighs 4-5 pounds @ .90 cents a pound for laptops...... 40,000 pounds x .90 cents.....= $36,000.00. Why would you even bother trying to refine? Somthing ain't right with that number.


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## Jmk88

Well... if that’s what you’re paying then no.

It’s only worth considering e waste as a scrap model if you are taking huge huge amounts. It’s a bit like mining I’m told... it only becomes viable if the quantity of waste is substantial.

I think the poor chap posting above has watched a YouTube video and misjudged. YouTube can be a good source but generally not the actual refining videos... more chemistry processes and techniques which normally have no mention to gold or are not directly linked to it.

I have multiple contacts in the industry and even then scrap is still extremely hard to come by. I haven’t processed e waste before and probably wouldn’t bother as my house is not big enough to store it all!


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## patnor1011

Jmk88 said:


> They do not contain any gold whatsoever quite a few members here have bought and tested - also on YouTube. Not even 0.01 of gold in them bars.
> 
> E scrap isn’t really worth processing unless you have a e waste company or you directly refine for one.
> 
> You need 10000 pre 2015 laptops to obtain 10 ounces; pro rata adaption can be used to calculate. However some items contain more than others so that’s an average.
> 
> Hate to burst your bubble but if you’re grabbing ten laptops here, ten laptops there, a phone here and a phone there, you’re heading for a huge disappointment. I don’t want to say it’s not worth it but that’s what almost everyone will say, unless you have access to high amounts of this sort of material.



That number could be close. 
I personally harvested goldplated pins from about 2000 laptops. It took a lot of time and result was dissappointing in a sense that if you compare result to time spent - let us just not go there lol. 
To be precise there was 23 grams of gold in 14 kilograms of fully plated pins and 3 grams of gold in partially plated pins - I do not remember exatly but it was 6 or 9 kilograms of them. So that make about 26 grams of gold from 2000 laptop pins. 
Not counting other stuff from laptops which I sold or processed separately. By other stuff I mean: fingers from ram sticks and cards, battery terminals from batteries and battery motherboard connectors, shielding from pcmcia connectors, cpu's, solder and all of the IC chips...


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