AP Direct Clarificatoon Request - 2 Items

[ShielaMartin780]

I have researched the AP method extensively and have been successfully utilizing it; however, I have two questions that I have been unable to find a definitive answer on:

1) Too much H2O2 can cause gold to dissolve into the AP solution, so an air bubbler is suggested. To speed things up, shoild I run the my air bubbler the entire time, or just once the solution heavily darkens and it needs to have oxygen added to bring it back to its emerald green color? If the air bubbler is run the whole time, can it cause the gold to dissolve into the solution? Logically it seems like running it the whole time would cause this, as the air bubbler adds O2 in place of the peroxide.... and too much peroxide = too much oxygen = dissolving gold.

2) Will heating the AP solution speed up the process, or not a material amount, and/or irs a bad idea due to ________?

Everything is done safely on my end and I have had numerous successful AP runs + have saved my solution and continue to successfully reuse it.

Thank you!

 

[Yggdrasil]

I have researched the AP method extensively and have been successfully utilizing it; however, I have two questions that I have been unable to find a definitive answer on:

1) Too much H2O2 can cause gold to dissolve into the AP solution, so an air bubbler is suggested. To speed things up, shoild I run the my air bubbler the entire time, or just once the solution heavily darkens and it needs to have oxygen added to bring it back to its emerald green color? If the air bubbler is run the whole time, can it cause the gold to dissolve into the solution? Logically it seems like running it the whole time would cause this, as the air bubbler adds O2 in place of the peroxide.... and too much peroxide = too much oxygen = dissolving gold.

2) Will heating the AP solution speed up the process, or not a material amount, and/or irs a bad idea due to ________?

Everything is done safely on my end and I have had numerous successful AP runs + have saved my solution and continue to successfully reuse it.

Thank you!

Welcome to us.
Well the AP name is kind of misleading since you do not need Peroxide at all.
HCl and some Copper and air bubbling is all that is needed.
If you find some green Copper it will start faster.
This leach is actually a Cuprous Chloride etch.
The reason for the naming is that in the beginning one used weak Peroxide as source for the Oxygen in stead of bubbling air through it.
And the name kind of stuck.

And yes some heat will make it faster.

Here are some links to study:

We ask our new members to do 3 things.
1. Read C.M. Hokes book on refining jewelers scrap, it gives an easy introduction to the most important chemistry regarding refining.
It is free here on the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=19798
2. Then read the safety section of the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/library-index-thread.22351/post-233795
3. And then read about "Dealing with waste" in the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/library-index-thread.22351/post-233794

Suggested reading:
https://goldrefiningforum.com/forums/the-library.101/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/when-in-doubt-cement-it-out.30236/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threa...le-read-this-before-you-post-about-ore.35743/

Video section: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threa...our-visual-learning-members.35185/post-379931

List of abbreviations: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/a-glossary-of-common-terms.21242/post-219169

Forum rules is here.
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/gold-refining-forum-rules.31182/

 

[ShielaMartin780]

Welcome to us.
Well the AP name is kind of misleading since you do not need Peroxide at all.
HCl and some Copper and air bubbling is all that is needed.
If you find some green Copper it will start faster.
This leach is actually a Cuprous Chloride etch.
The reason for the naming is that in the beginning one used weak Peroxide as source for the Oxygen in stead of bubbling air through it.
And the name kind of stuck.

And yes some heat will make it faster.

Here are some links to study:

We ask our new members to do 3 things.
1. Read C.M. Hokes book on refining jewelers scrap, it gives an easy introduction to the most important chemistry regarding refining.
It is free here on the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=19798
2. Then read the safety section of the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/library-index-thread.22351/post-233795
3. And then read about "Dealing with waste" in the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/library-index-thread.22351/post-233794

Suggested reading:
https://goldrefiningforum.com/forums/the-library.101/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/when-in-doubt-cement-it-out.30236/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threa...le-read-this-before-you-post-about-ore.35743/

Video section: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threa...our-visual-learning-members.35185/post-379931

List of abbreviations: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/a-glossary-of-common-terms.21242/post-219169

Forum rules is here.
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/gold-refining-forum-rules.31182/

Thank you for the response. I am aware that Peroxide is not actually needed and haven't used it since my 1st batch quite a while ago. However, I have just used my air bubbler intermittently since then to get the solution back to emerald green - in my question I was asking if constant bubbling would dissolve the gold into the solution? I've never run my bubbler the entire time due to not having/being able to find clarity on this particular item.

Thanks again

 

[adam mizer]

Thank you for the response. I am aware that Peroxide is not actually needed and haven't used it since my 1st batch quite a while ago. However, I have just used my air bubbler intermittently since then to get the solution back to emerald green - in my question I was asking if constant bubbling would dissolve the gold into the solution? I've never run my bubbler the entire time due to not having/being able to find clarity on this particular item.

Thanks again

Many years ago I started and did not use air bubbler for my first batch or two.
Also I used peroxide 3%.
Then I soon found out to use air all the time and just HCl.
Also if peroxide is/was used and after time much copper in solution the gold will precipitate out in its powder form.
It is then collected in filters, powder and foils.
The air is needed to oxidize the copper layer under the gold foils and the HCl will dissolve the layer of oxidized copper and nickel.
Its a slow reaction but works very well.

It is stated that gold will dissolve in HCl and an oxidizer.
That tells me some gold will dissolve.
It is a very slow process.
I always no matter what filter the solution when done, personally a couple times.
Losses are very minimal.

This leads also to, after storage of AP solution and waste handling.
You can still filter solution after much time of storage.
Possibly a small amount of what was fine gold powder has finally sat and stuck on the bottom of the bucket can be retrieved.
Use iron bar stock to get your copper and lower reactive metals.
Process copper in electrolytic cell and get some tiny amount of precious slimes.
its a long cycle of process but very interesting to follow.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Thank you for the response. I am aware that Peroxide is not actually needed and haven't used it since my 1st batch quite a while ago. However, I have just used my air bubbler intermittently since then to get the solution back to emerald green - in my question I was asking if constant bubbling would dissolve the gold into the solution? I've never run my bubbler the entire time due to not having/being able to find clarity on this particular item.

Thanks again

No the bubbling will not dissolve Gold.
But should be on all the time to rejuvinate the solution.

 

[adam mizer]

All HCl requires is an oxidizer to dissolve gold. The oxygen in the air is sufficient. The air dissolves into the HCl, and the gold can dissolve.

Dave

No the bubbling will not dissolve Gold.
But should be on all the time to rejuvinate the solution.

Ygg,
Yes apparently HCl and air can dissolve gold. How much? Most likely a very slow process.
See Frugals post above.
Also searches on the internet explain it.