Non-Chemical Copper mesh for cell

[nivrnb]

This is my cell construction, having trouble finding a cover for the cell. I just had a quick question about the copper mesh for the cell. I am using some shielding from some wire I don't have the thinkness measurements, but it will support a pretty good weight. My question is the wire mesh to thin? I have extra of the mesh if the acid eats it away to quickly. I may have to double it up.

I made some forms for the anodes, that I will post later when I make.









Thanks for any input
nivrnb

 

[Geo]

check out lazersteves cell videos at www.goldrecovery.us it should help you out with your cell. i gave a description with pictures of a mesh basket that will help you out in the general tab.

 

[nivrnb]

Geo,

Thanks for the information; I have seen Lazersteve's videos. I am trying to make mine like his. If my screen doesn't work, I will buy some from his site along with other materials. Like the glass stirrer to move that material around.

Thanks again
nivrnb

 

[Acid_Bath76]

If you're forced to use the thin copper mesh, there are some variables you might be able to control to extend it's life. From what I've read here, if you keep the solution cold, the H2SO4 isn't going to digest the copper. .. .as quickly. If you're using it for extended periods, you're probably going to have to replace it sooner. Lazersteve does his cell a certain way, and it works really well. I think I tried to reinvent the wheel with this project the first time around. I'm not going to go into it, other than to say that I now wear an additional rubber apron and face shield. Anyhow, are you able to remove the mesh easily after every deplating with it hanging over the entire edge like that? Or are you using it for larger objects? If you're trying to deplate a large object, why not just dip it in via an alligator clip? I'm just trying to understand why you would want to lay a whole sheet like that over the lip of the container. A little copper mesh basket would work well too. Just dip it in, deplate the contents within the basket, and remove. I've also heard others speak of avoiding sharp corners. For some reason those edges seem to corrode faster. Anyhow, good luck with the cell. I'm curious to see how it handles!
I have a feeling though, that you might be having to clean some copper out of your powders when you harvest the cell

 

[nivrnb]

Acid_Bath76,

You said, "I think I tried to reinvent the wheel with this project the first time around. I'm not going to go into it, other than to say that I now wear an additional rubber apron and face shield." Now I understand the meaning of you name Acid_Bath76. I hope nothing serious happened.

You asked, are you able to remove the mesh easily after every deplating with it hanging over the entire edge like that? Or are you using it for larger objects? I plan on trying to deplate pins that are half/half first to see how it works. Then move on to higher grade pins. Yes I plan on moving on to using an aligator clip for all other pins, I have the time and will just do one at a time, Submerging only the very tip of the clip for each part.

You said, "I'm just trying to understand why you would want to lay a whole sheet like that over the lip of the container." I was just copying Lazersteve's cell, plus I have a lot of small pins as show in the picture below.

"I'm curious to see how it handles!" Me to!!!!! but I am doing like dry runs to see how it will work like as you can see in the photos below the small pins are coming thru the mesh, so that would mean I would have to pull these pins out with tweezers. More of a chance for an accident, I should as suggested earlier in a post to use the AP method.

 

[Geo]

that mesh will work ok for those pins. if a stray pin or two(or ten) were to fall off or through the mesh it will be ok until the end of your run.you can pick them out of the powder with tweezers. i usually have a few dozen get away from me before i get done. they wont hurt anything laying on the bottom of the cell as long as there's not enough to make contact with the cathode and the mesh at the same time. ill give you a heads up and a warning, never put your cell in a container with water or ice in it. adding water either as liquid or ice to hot sulfuric acid can cause the water to flash boil and blow hot acid every where. hot sulfuric acid will cause a bad chemical burn besides the thermal burn. using a mesh basket as big as the one you have will pull alot of amps if you load it with a moderate amount of pins. that will cause the acid to heat rapidly so you may only be able to do one basket every hour or hour and a half to give the acid time to cool down. still that's alot faster than AP bath. i have two cells and run them alternately to give each time to cool. also when you pull the basket out of the acid have another container close at hand with water in it to put the basket in for a rinse container, it can be plastic as long as its the durable kind and not the 5 for a dollar brand, :lol: alot of you gold will collect in this container. after you rinse have another contain you can dump your used pins into that also contains water. keeping the pins in water will prevent oxidation, somewhat, till you can see if they stripped good or need another bath. make sure your basket is dry before you put it back into the cell.

 

[nivrnb]

Geo,

Thank you for your safety and expertise with the cell. You can never be too careful; I work with electricity and treat every wire as if it was live. I am no where near ready to operate this device, and have to learn more. This weekend or next I am going to make and lead. I seen lazersteve place the anode into the glass of distilled water when not in use to keep down corrosion. I've seen on the net about a dry bag, basically a zip lock with desiccant inside and was wondering if you have ever tried that method?

I will make the copper mesh half the size that it is now to keep the acid cool, I have heard of someone putting the cell into ice water. This for me would be risky.

You said. "another container close at hand with water in it to put the basket in for a rinse container, it can be plastic as long as its the durable kind and not the 5 for a dollar brand, a lot of you gold will collect in this container." Should this container have distilled water in it? And then dump the used pins into tap water. Got it Baking Soda Water, for first rinse.

"make sure your basket is dry before you put it back into the cell." I plan on making two to three baskets, so that I can let the first basket dry, and place the dry one in. This is so that the acid does not become contaminated and lose its concentration?

Again thanks I hope to be able one day to give some useful advice.

 

[nickvc]

Again thanks I hope to be able one day to give some useful advice.

Believe it or not you are contributing in a very positive way to the forum by posting pictures and commentary of how your proceeding with your cell, showing step by step photos and getting comments from more experienced members and adapting your design as required saves us all the time and effort to explain the why's and why nots of the whole set up to newbies. Pictures allow the less advanced members to actually see what is involved from start to finish and any pitfalls can be shown so keep posting.
I'm pleased your taking the advice about concentrated sulphuric seriously it really is a nasty acid which is perhaps the most dangerous most members use, also remember it's extremely hungry for water and will suck it out of the air if left uncovered. Always seal your sulphuric when not in use or constant heating to drive off the water will be necessary.

 

[nivrnb]

NickVC,

Thanks for the encouragement! Yes, these chemicals are dangerous, it is not if an accident will occur but when, when it comes, how prepared were you are for that accident. I used to work for SafetyKleen and saw some accidents. Yes, I want to document the whole experiance and share it. When all is said and done I want to post to the Gallery.

I have to get that cover for the cell, I purchased this one at Salvation Army, thinking I could find a cover. Wrong, I keep looking but might have to break down and buy a new one.

nivrnb

 

[Barren Realms 007]

NickVC,

Thanks for the encouragement! Yes, these chemicals are dangerous, it is not if an accident will occur but when, when it comes, how prepared were you are for that accident. I used to work for SafetyKleen and saw some accidents. Yes, I want to document the whole experiance and share it. When all is said and done I want to post to the Gallery.

I have to get that cover for the cell, I purchased this one at Salvation Army, thinking I could find a cover. Wrong, I keep looking but might have to break down and buy a new one.

nivrnb

You can take some celophane wrap and put over your container to keep the water out. Be sure and put a drop of acid on it before you put it over your container to see if the acid will effect the wrap. I have mentioned a couple of times that I have put my cell in an ice bath when I am doing a lot of material. But you need to be careful when doing this.

 

[seawolf]

One other item to keep handy is a box of baking soda; if you get a splash of the acid on you blot it off with a dry paper towel put some of the baking soda over the splash area and add a few drops of water then wash with lots of tap water.
If you have to buy another container with a lid Lasersteve sells them as does Wal-Mart. the container you now have will work good for a rinse container for the first rinse of the basket and pins. If the new container is the same size and shape where the lids will interchange when it comes time to empty the cell the rinse container can be poured into another container. Then the bulk of the acid siphoned into the rinse container. Then the acid and powder from the cell can be added to the rinse water to start the washing process.
Mark

 

[Geo]

never put your basket into a rinse with water and baking soda. acids and bases do not mix well, you will get a nasty boil over. your rinses can both be tap water because at this stage your gold is contaminated already. besides gold the cell will strip nickle when the acid heats up and copper when it gets hot. remember that this step is not refining but reclaiming your gold the refining part will happen when you have the powder dry and incinerated. at that point to refine you will need to digest the gold and precipitate at least twice to make it pure.

 

[seawolf]

To be more clear: I said to have the baking soda on hand for splashes of acid on the body or surrounding surfaces to neutralize the acid splash, not for rinse of baskets or pins.
Mark

 

[nivrnb]

[/quote]

You can take some celophane wrap and put over your container to keep the water out. Be sure and put a drop of acid on it before you put it over your container to see if the acid will effect the wrap. I have mentioned a couple of times that I have put my cell in an ice bath when I am doing a lot of material. But you need to be careful when doing this.[/quote]

Barren Realms 007,

Thank you for the celophane Idea, I will give it a try if I don't find a lid. The ice bath is a great idea, you must a factory going. I believe I've seen some of your photos of it on the fourm. I hope I run into those problems in the future. :mrgreen:

nivrnb

 

[nivrnb]

Mark,

Thanks for helping me saves z money, that will work getting a new dish and using the old one for the wash. Yes, I remeber seeing the acid siphoned off in Lasersteve's video using the tubing and the hemostat.

nivrnb

 

[Geo]

again i cant stress it enough to be very careful having water around concentrated sulfuric acid. as an experiment to show you what can happen, when you get your chemicals together, take a small glass container and place a glass thermometer in it then add a few milliliters of concentrated sulfuric in it and then add tap water a drop at a time and after each drop look at the thermometer. you will notice the temperature rise quickly. this is called an exothermic reaction.now think of what it would be like if you multiply that by a factor of a thousand or more. just be careful, no amount of gold is worth your sight not to mention your life.

after being shown the error of my ways (thank you bswartzwelder), i would like to note that the above advice should be reversed. it should be to add acid to water and not add water to acid. though the quantities are small, it could give readers the wrong information about how to dilute acid.

 

[nivrnb]

Geo,

Yes, most certainly I will take every precaution. I do not plan on having the cell operation for some time. I cannot stress that I am in no hurry, when I beleive I have it ready, I will post more photos before I even put the acid into it. To get everyones approval of the setup. Then I have to get my girlfriends approval. :shock: She could pull the plug at anytime.

nivrnb

 

[Geo]

if she smells the fumes from that cell you will be in trouble.

 

[Barren Realms 007]

Geo,

Yes, most certainly I will take every precaution. I do not plan on having the cell operation for some time. I cannot stress that I am in no hurry, when I beleive I have it ready, I will post more photos before I even put the acid into it. To get everyones approval of the setup. Then I have to get my girlfriends approval. :shock: She could pull the plug at anytime.

nivrnb

Get the job done and melted and show her the bar and then see what she says. Just don't let her hold it for long, they tend not to want to give it back. It can be just as mezmerizing experience for the opposite sex as it can be for you. No telling what you might get away with while she is holding it.... :twisted:

 

[Geo]

ill start on this batch tonight it will take two cells and most of the night to complete it all.