Help with cementing pgms to copper.

[Sorrycantseeme]

I have a few questions about cementing palladium to copper pipe .
Does palladium in solution cement gram for gram to copper pipe .
My other question is if theres some steel in solution will copper only cement the pgm and leave the steel in solution.

 

[fishaholic5]

My experience is only with Chloride solutions containing Palladium. I can't tell you the ratio's but the more free acid in solution the more Copper will be consumed.
The greater the surface area of the Copper the faster the reaction can occur so I find its easier to use an excess and enough agitation using a bubbler for the Palladium to not stick.
High Copper Chloride levels in Solution will dissolve some of the Palladium. This can be dropped by diluting the solution. It takes a while.
The Iron will stay in solution.

Cheers Wal

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

can i use hcl/h2o2 to put stainless steel & palladium into solution then cement with copper pipe?

 

[Lou]

Sorrycantseeme:


Please don't be sorrycantread.


The member here answered your question already. You need to slow down on creating new subjects/topics on the same topic, your industrial catalyst.


As has already been explained to you, on multiple occasions:

Yes, copper will selectively cement the PGMs to metallic form given enough time and agitation;
The higher the surface area of copper (i.e. powder/turnings) the faster it goes but the more risk from copper left in the product than just scraping it off of copper sheet;
The copper should be used to effect, as the quantity of PGM it can reduce--while easily derived from the basic redox equations and concepts that you can use google to lookup (or try and balance yourself, if you had half a care to do so)--is variable depending on how much free oxidant you use, whether you agitate the solution with a bubbler or a stirrer, so on and so forth.

In essence, I would use the copper until I did not have positive precious metals results. Or better yet, I'd use the copper until shiny, grease free copper doesn't tarnish in contact with the solution.

Hopefully this will be the last time anyone explains anything on the solution side of it until you go to treat the toxic solution.

I understand your situation and need for literal spoonfeeding. Lots of desperation for a lot of people especially right now. I should remind you that regardless of your situation, you shouldn't endanger others or the environment by conducting this recovery operation recklessly.

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

You said copper will cement palladium to a metallic form .
I hope that means I can either melt that metallic form or collect that metallic form to sell .
I have no idea thats why I am asking , if thats true thats awesome.

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

i cemented with copper pipe whats this grey powder?

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

Will someone show me copper cementing palladium , I mean show me a picture of there copper in a bucket and the palladium cement as well . I would really appreciate it.

 

[Lou]

The brown solution of pure Pd turns to a blue solution (or dark green depending on HCl concentration) as copper trades places with the palladium.

In your case, the black-grey powder depositing on your copper is it working.

 

[Yggdrasil]

I got this question by Sorrycantseeme in PM

i had a bubbler running , the pipe gets very black .
I had a xrf analsysis on the grey dried material and it came back 80%
My question is i used a grinder to grind the black stuff off , i thought it was suppose to be shiny grey ,
black is normal when it dries its grey

Processing questions are best posted in the open and there is no reason to post it several times.

I'm not very proficient in cementing, but what I have read is that if you don't have enough agitation
it will stick to the copper, it will then have to be ground/scraped off and you will have more
copper to dissolve in order to clean it.
I hope you haven't used a pipe, because then the inside will be covered in PGMs as well.

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

So as the coppers turns black thats the pgm sticking to the copper .
How can u clean the palladium after ,do you just dissolve copper in hcl .
How dilute can u make the solution when hcl is 31%.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Copper don't dissolve in HCl.
You can use the AP process.
Still better, keep enough agitation so the PGMs don't stick.
There are some other tricks, including adjusting Ph and using heat, but as said before cementing is not my domain.
Did you use a copper pipe?

 

[FrugalRefiner]

So as the coppers turns black thats the pgm sticking to the copper .
How can u clean the palladium after ,do you just dissolve copper in hcl .
How dilute can u make the solution when hcl is 31%.

Sorrycantseeme, using text lingo on the forum is against our rules. Do not use "u" when you mean "you". You can obviously use the correct word when you want to. Many of our members do not speak English as a first language and they have to use translators to read the forum. Things like "u" do not translate well.

I too receive many processing questions via PM. I do not answer them. There is no one to check my answers, and it only benefits one person instead of helping everyone on the forum. I simply encourage them to post their questions on the forum.

Dave

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

Yeah I used copper pipe. I went and got another bubbler and that seems to keep the pipe from getting black .
If copper doesnt dissolve in hcl then why is the copper getting so thin as if its dissolving?

 

[anachronism]

Yeah I used copper pipe. I went and got another bubbler and that seems to keep the pipe from getting black .
If copper doesnt dissolve in hcl then why is the copper getting so thin as if its dissolving?

Because you've probably not just got HCl anymore.

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

So is it best to just use shaved copper pieces from the grinder . The solution still test orange with stannous althoigh yesterday another batch which i used only copper shavings tested clear . I dumped that into my wastestream .

 

[Yggdrasil]

The copper pipe needs to be cut open and flattened, if not the cementation will also happen inside.
The reason the copper pipe is dissolving is the AP process or rather the CuCl2 process as it should be named.
Air from the bubbler oxidizes the copper and HCl dissolves the oxidized copper.

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

I thought the copper would only cement the palladium in solution .
Are you saying that once theres no more palladium in solution , then the copper stops cementing and starts dissolving .
I

 

[kurtak]

Read - ALL - of this thread

:arrow: http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=85&t=22203

It will tell you EVERYTHING you need to know

Kurt

 

[Sorrycantseeme]

Another question is if i have a solution that is palladium & hcl , if i were to add a solution that i cemented from earlier that had excess copper in solution would it cause the solution that im trying to cement now to cement palladium ?

 

[FrugalRefiner]

No. If the copper is already in solution, it has already given up an electron or two when it dissolved. It will no longer cement a precious metal out of solution. For that, you need metallic copper.

Dave