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Ahmed Lotfy said:
there is many sheets and tables and youtubes for estimations of specific kinds of ceramic CPUs

according to the minimum avarage results from all those sources i can estimita avarage yield of those CPUs as 0.15 gram / CPU as minimum if not more

for Example the Intel pentium CPU some sources says it have 0.49 gram / CPU not only 0.15

but

for my personal experiance

i have read that green fiber CPUs have less than 0.05 grams per CPU , i found it is only arround 0.01 grams / cpu , i dont know if plugging and unplugging of cpus affect on yields becouse of the fraction or not ?!! , and also there is nice valu in monolitic capicitors on thos CPUs, and in the part of Copper as heat sinck
plus the silicon dye ant that may made the total value close to the 0.05 grams gold ( just the grran fibers CPUs )

if you have another information please advice
Click to expand...
I suggest that you do your searches for yield numbers here on the forum and not on youtube, those numbers are only a dream.

You have noticed it yourself, there is very little wear of the surface of cpu pins. Especially with the ZIF sockets used for everything from 486 and onward with pins. You probably got what was there to get.

Göran
 
g_axelsson said:
Ahmed Lotfy said:
there is many sheets and tables and youtubes for estimations of specific kinds of ceramic CPUs

according to the minimum avarage results from all those sources i can estimita avarage yield of those CPUs as 0.15 gram / CPU as minimum if not more

for Example the Intel pentium CPU some sources says it have 0.49 gram / CPU not only 0.15

but

for my personal experiance

i have read that green fiber CPUs have less than 0.05 grams per CPU , i found it is only arround 0.01 grams / cpu , i dont know if plugging and unplugging of cpus affect on yields becouse of the fraction or not ?!! , and also there is nice valu in monolitic capicitors on thos CPUs, and in the part of Copper as heat sinck
plus the silicon dye ant that may made the total value close to the 0.05 grams gold ( just the grran fibers CPUs )

if you have another information please advice
Click to expand...
I suggest that you do your searches for yield numbers here on the forum and not on youtube, those numbers are only a dream.

You have noticed it yourself, there is very little wear of the surface of cpu pins. Especially with the ZIF sockets used for everything from 486 and onward with pins. You probably got what was there to get.

Göran
Click to expand...

But please note if the fraction affect on the very thin plated layer in the green fibers CPUs , the effect of this fraction on the heavy platted thick ;ayer in the ceramic CPUs well be neglectable

please also consider the pure gold wires inside the ceramic CPU not only the pins
 
Ahmed Lotfy said:
g_axelsson said:
Ahmed Lotfy said:
there is many sheets and tables and youtubes for estimations of specific kinds of ceramic CPUs

according to the minimum avarage results from all those sources i can estimita avarage yield of those CPUs as 0.15 gram / CPU as minimum if not more

for Example the Intel pentium CPU some sources says it have 0.49 gram / CPU not only 0.15

but

for my personal experiance

i have read that green fiber CPUs have less than 0.05 grams per CPU , i found it is only arround 0.01 grams / cpu , i dont know if plugging and unplugging of cpus affect on yields becouse of the fraction or not ?!! , and also there is nice valu in monolitic capicitors on thos CPUs, and in the part of Copper as heat sinck
plus the silicon dye ant that may made the total value close to the 0.05 grams gold ( just the grran fibers CPUs )

if you have another information please advice
Click to expand...
I suggest that you do your searches for yield numbers here on the forum and not on youtube, those numbers are only a dream.

You have noticed it yourself, there is very little wear of the surface of cpu pins. Especially with the ZIF sockets used for everything from 486 and onward with pins. You probably got what was there to get.

Göran
Click to expand...

But please note if the fraction affect on the very thin plated layer in the green fibers CPUs , the effect of this fraction on the heavy platted thick ;ayer in the ceramic CPUs well be neglectable

please also consider the pure gold wires inside the ceramic CPU not only the pins
Click to expand...

There are no pure gold wires in ceramic CPU. Nobody on this forum ever seen single one. The only gold bonding wires in CPU are in black fiber CPU in a black substrate in a center of a CPU. Some old green slotted CPU with green square IC mounted in center do have similar substrate with bonding wires. I have never seen any bonding wires in ceramic CPU and never heard of that being true.

This again show that too much of youtube and internet surfing will hurt you, not only financially.

This thread seems like Déjà vu. I asked you to read whole thread again. OP too came with wild numbers from internet, he was pointed to more correct numbers and reported yields on forum and whole matter quietly slipped away. Now you came in, somehow found this old thread and instead of reading though you did exactly the same - using obscure lists with wild numbers you want to believe in even that you yourself got 1/5th of what you found on these lists.
Most of the lists floating around were created by people who are selling cpu on ebay. Grossly inflated and many times just guessed numbers.
Real numbers come hard. To get real numbers cost money, it is very hard to make consistent batches and repeated experiments to fine tune this knowledge. But here you can get real numbers by combing through many hundreds and thousands of posts and make personal notes. It also cost money - time is money.
 
patnor1011 said:
Ahmed Lotfy said:
g_axelsson said:
Ahmed Lotfy said:
there is many sheets and tables and youtubes for estimations of specific kinds of ceramic CPUs

according to the minimum avarage results from all those sources i can estimita avarage yield of those CPUs as 0.15 gram / CPU as minimum if not more

for Example the Intel pentium CPU some sources says it have 0.49 gram / CPU not only 0.15

but

for my personal experiance

i have read that green fiber CPUs have less than 0.05 grams per CPU , i found it is only arround 0.01 grams / cpu , i dont know if plugging and unplugging of cpus affect on yields becouse of the fraction or not ?!! , and also there is nice valu in monolitic capicitors on thos CPUs, and in the part of Copper as heat sinck
plus the silicon dye ant that may made the total value close to the 0.05 grams gold ( just the grran fibers CPUs )

if you have another information please advice
Click to expand...
I suggest that you do your searches for yield numbers here on the forum and not on youtube, those numbers are only a dream.

You have noticed it yourself, there is very little wear of the surface of cpu pins. Especially with the ZIF sockets used for everything from 486 and onward with pins. You probably got what was there to get.

Göran
Click to expand...

But please note if the fraction affect on the very thin plated layer in the green fibers CPUs , the effect of this fraction on the heavy platted thick ;ayer in the ceramic CPUs well be neglectable

please also consider the pure gold wires inside the ceramic CPU not only the pins
Click to expand...

There are no pure gold wires in ceramic CPU. Nobody on this forum ever seen single one. The only gold bonding wires in CPU are in black fiber CPU in a black substrate in a center of a CPU. Some old green slotted CPU with green square IC mounted in center do have similar substrate with bonding wires. I have never seen any bonding wires in ceramic CPU and never heard of that being true.

This again show that too much of youtube and internet surfing will hurt you, not only financially.
Click to expand...
please have a look

this is old laptop CPU

what is the metal which those wires made off ? the total weight of those wires may be less than 0.25 gram

in the ceramic cpu under the golden platted plate in the middle of the lower side of cpu you well see shorter wires arround the silicon Dye also very thin wires

it weems to be gold

is it something else ? so which metal it is ?
 

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Everyone here process ceramic CPU by breaking it in several parts. CPU which do contain black epoxy are easily identified and whoever spend some time on forum knows this epoxy should be processed further. But this is no excuse to inflate potential yield because gold from this epoxy is actually reported in a total yield. By saying this I mean that you cant simply say that "0.7g reported yield will be 0.15 because of wires inside".
 
patnor1011 said:
There are no pure gold wires in ceramic CPU. Nobody on this forum ever seen single one. The only gold bonding wires in CPU are in black fiber CPU in a black substrate in a center of a CPU. Some old green slotted CPU with green square IC mounted in center do have similar substrate with bonding wires. I have never seen any bonding wires in ceramic CPU and never heard of that being true.
Click to expand...


patnor1011


I have been milling this over in my mind since you first posted this response and was wondering if you could better clarify the part I highlighted in deep blue.

What I mean, is are you saying you have never seen any ceramic CPU's with PURE gold bonding wires(which connect from substrate to silicon die)?

I don't mean any disrespect in asking you this question,I'm just confused and stumped at your response.
Thank you in advance if you are willing to clarify this for me.



p.s I hope I got the quotes to work right,I only wanted the above quoted.



modtheworld44
 
patnor1011 said:
I have never seen any bonding wires in ceramic CPU and never heard of that being true.
Click to expand...

I've always wondered about this. If there aren't any bonding wires, then how does the electric get from the pins on the bottom, to the IC on top? It would just be completely ceramic between the two sections. (I never broke any apart)
 
As far as I understand it connection is made by some printed paste or something like that. Not with gold bonding wires.
 
patnor1011 said:
As far as I understand it connection is made by some printed paste or something like that. Not with gold bonding wires.
Click to expand...

Interesting. I'll have to find more information about this later, thank you.
 
I think it was Lou who stated the bonding wires in ceramic cpu's were molybdenum. Very old post and I didn't book mark it as I was looking into something different.
 
Done.

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/search.php?keywords=+processing+101+of+ceramic+CPU%27s+
 
A standard ceramic CPU is made of several layers of ceramics bonded together. between the layers (while the ceramics is still unfired, also called green) is screen printed conductors of molybdenum. The ceramic body is then fired and the molybdenum that is exposed is then gold plated. On the bottom or side, pins are brazed or soldered and in the cavity bond wires are used to connect landing pads on the die with the exposed gold plated conductors. For bonding wires aluminum or gold can be used.

Inside the ceramic body is the molybdenum conductors and the only gold is the exposed gold and the gold under the die.

To use gold inside the ceramic body would be problematic. Thermal expansion and contraction will break conductors over time unless it expands with the same rate as the ceramic body. Molybdenum is the solution on this problem and it is cheaper that gold.

Göran
 
The only ones I've studied are the older side-braze packages. There were 3 layers of alumina ceramic. The ceramic is made by blending alumina powder with about 5% glass powder (called glass frit). The green ceramic is fired above the melting point of the glass. The glass melts and bonds all the alumina particles together. The glass also bonds the 3 alumina layers together. The internal conductive traces are made by silk screening molybdenum-manganese paste (containing a glass frit, I think) onto the ceramic and then firing it. If I remember right, tungsten was used for traces in later years.
 
Thanks guys, that is similar to what I read, but since I only half read something that wasn't tied to my research, it only half stuck. I would love to see a video on the process of making a ceramic CPU, that would be very interesting.
 

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