Mixed Black PGM Powders

[Lou]

Most of the stuff that comes in like that is a zinc cement product that is high in nickel, cobalt, copper, and other base metals.


It's always better to have it assayed first. The trick will be to find someone to give you credit on the Rh. Most refiners don't consider it a payable item unless in quantity (because they themselves don't get paid on it unless there's several ounces in what they send out to JM/Heraeus).

What is it from and how much of it is there?

 

[kadriver]

Most of the stuff that comes in like that is a zinc cement product that is high in nickel, cobalt, copper, and other base metals.

Lou, is this true with mixed black derived from automotive catalytic converters leached with HCl/Cl, then the leach cemented with zinc?

 

[Lou]

I was mostly referring to the zinc cement product from spent AR solutions from karat refineries. Sometimes Pd and Pt jewelry (or dental) inadvertently get melted with the gold scrap and dissolved. After companies like ARA (or insert other karat refiner, there's dozens) precipitate the gold they are left with a raff that has PGM content. Also a similar feed from plating operations.

I don't know about auto converters because there is a lot of range. 99.9% of people handling them get them smelted because aqueous processing isn't appropriate at 1000 ppm Pt.


From what I have seen of converters, it's usually iron.

 

[Noxx]

I don't know about auto converters because there is a lot of range. 99.9% of people handling them get them smelted because aqueous processing isn't appropriate at 1000 ppm Pt.

It is true; even a very large cats buyer around here (PMR) does not refine the material. They simply assay then send their lots to a large mining company who probably has an arc furnace...

 

[Lou]

Probably Vale.

Yes. Not many processing PGMs.

Even doing a couple hundred ounce lot is small in the scheme of things...hence I consider my operation boutique.

 

[Noxx]

So I'm better off collecting the mixed PGMs black powder then separate it to their respective salts.

 

[kadriver]

I'll be doing the process outlined in this thread to refine the palladium recovered from my silver cell slimes.

I need to review carefully before I shoot the video because its been a long time since I've done it.

Part one of the video is uploading and I'll post it later today (be sure and watch because I have a delayed, runaway reacion, boil-over mishap in part one of this video for all to learn from).

kadriver

 

[goldenpuncture]

nice doscussion! i want clearify my informations even i get this info from forum. when black pgms dropped by zinc, when dissolve in AR then there will be a yellowish brown powder left behind, pt and pd dissolved in AR and this yellowish brown powder is RH. ( RH(I)) ... if so then how to refine it! ?

 

[nickvc]

nice doscussion! i want clearify my informations even i get this info from forum. when black pgms dropped by zinc, when dissolve in AR then there will be a yellowish brown powder left behind, pt and pd dissolved in AR and this yellowish brown powder is RH. ( RH(I)) ... if so then how to refine it! ?

Unless you have large amounts and even more importantly the correct lab set up I would avoid PGM refining it’s dangers outweigh its value in my opinion.

 

[goldenpuncture]

may be not a proper set up but its pretty safe and at least very safe according to my area. yes i hav'nt large amount as i practice last month with only 2 kg honeycomb. now i am working on 30 kg, collecting black zinc percipitated . so i can reprocess large amount at once. got some fumes in start and as i was succeeded then i arrange gas masks, make a fume hood, buy new gloves. though its still not pretty safe but its batter to work with pgms, sorry can not make fotos but i want learn to test this yellowish brown powder for rhodium. with stannous chloride! need help

 

[Platdigger]

Well first, to do any testing with stanus you will need to put that powder into solution.
Try small amounts to see if an acid will dissolve it.
May take hot sulfuric. If not, you can always do a fusion.

 

[Raza shahid]

Hello gyz i am new here i think i need some help. I am doing with mlcc and i precipitated black pgm powder from Al, but when i tried to dissolved. Black pgm powder in aqua regia it did not disolve. The solution is greensh yellow in color with black powder in it..

 

[FrugalRefiner]

I am doing with mlcc

What do you mean by "doing with mlcc"? I understand you're doing something with mlccs, but what? are you smelting, using nitric acid, hydrochloric acid, something else? Are you crushing them, leaching them whole, hot acid, cold acid, stirring,...

and i precipitated black pgm powder from Al,

Aluminum is one of the most reactive metals, and will cement everything below it on the reactivity series, not just pgms.

Please provide some more details on how you got to this point.

Dave

 

[Raza shahid]

I am tryng to recover n refine pd salt from mlcc. Firstly surface elemination with hcl then sponge the liquid n treat the solid with aquaregia 32% hcl n nitric acid 1:3 then add Al in solution n soon i see black ppt of pgm now i have to disolve the black ppt in acid. so if u can help me. I appreciate it

 

[ashir]

your phenomena is totally wrong. you can not use aqua reigia on mlccs. as you will loose silver and might be dump the whole acid with base metals. you can not get any value from mlccs without crushing them. be calm, study more, try to post pictures...! if you are from pakistan then pm me!

 

[ashir]

ok guyz. here what happenings to me.leach honeycombs with hcl/cl mathod. drop the black pgms with zinc. wash well and dry pgms. use nitric to remove pd. drop pd with DMG. then the remaining black powder was dissolved in hcl/hydrogen peroxide. still can not dissolve all black powder but got a redish yellow solution with 2 treatment with AP. evaporate it and use concentrated ammonium chloride solution. but nothing comes out. i use zinc to reget the black pgms from AP solution but it gives brown rusty type particals. now i try to process the remaining black powder from AP mathod that was not dissolve. i use hcl/hydrogen peoxide. no heat. after all night it still not dissolve in AP. try to heat it but nothing happens. any sugges? any help,?

 

[Platdigger]

So, how much pd were you able to separate from these powders with nitric? Were these pre cats?

 

[ashir]

not assure about quantity, as pd salt is not pure and i have troubles to get ammonium hydroxide. so i have to wait till i get nh4oh. and about cats, these are mix, petrole vhicles in pakistan( mostly made by japan) and china made cats. should i try to dissolve remaining black pgm with concentrated h2so4 ? and one more try to zinc percipated gryish powder with AP? thanks for response!

 

[Platdigger]

You could try the sulfuric, but also you could do a bisulfate fusion on a sample of these powders.
Also I would think the cats from Japan will be much better than the ones from China.

 

[ashir]

thanks platdigger!!! here what i did next, add hcl to brownish powder and got a fine black powder... sorry wind was angry last night and the sulfuric treatment to insolubleblack poder. it was concentrated h2so4. color show there was no rhodium and if it was then very little. now i will test rh with stanous chloride. any further suggessions! ????