Need Help Refining Small Ring

[Chief]

Howdy folks -

More of a smith/jeweller here than a refiner, but I am at a loss. I've made a wedding band for my wife a while ago out of gold mined from a friend's claim, and gold from a family heirloom. However, the ring is just a hair too rosy (too much copper combined with a little too much zinc to dilute the yellow of the gold, I believe) and I would like to extract the gold to remake the ring. Obviously the gold used is special and has great sentimental value for the both of us.

But I am at a loss. I do not have access to the space required or materials/tools to adequately and safely extract/refine the gold out of this ring. I have done much research on it, and it does not seem feasible in my situation. Of course most jewellers do not extract gold, only reshape it into different jewelry, and a small handful of the refining places I have seen either will not accept it, or have not responded in 3+ months.

Does anyone here know of any business or notable/reputable individual that could extract this gold for me? I am not concerned about the other metals in the alloy of course, those are easily replacable. Any help is much appreciated my friends.

 

[nickvc]

You do have a choice… you could add more gold and add some silver to create a better color / alloy which would guarantee you have that same gold in the ring .
If you send a small amount of metal to be refined the chances of getting your gold back is slim, basically because it’s cost prohibitive to do so or you will pay silly amounts for the service.

 

[goldshark]

If you have the ability to melt your metal, add some Ag to it so you get approximately a 25-30% Au alloy. Get a pyrex measuring cup, add some 30 % nitric,70% DISTILLED water to it. Keep decanting/washing, until solution is clear. Watch a sreetips video on in quarting for more details. Save the nitric for cementing on Copper, then neutralizing solution. This will give you pretty close to .99% Au very simply.

 

[goldshark]

Howdy folks -

More of a smith/jeweller here than a refiner, but I am at a loss. I've made a wedding band for my wife a while ago out of gold mined from a friend's claim, and gold from a family heirloom. However, the ring is just a hair too rosy (too much copper combined with a little too much zinc to dilute the yellow of the gold, I believe) and I would like to extract the gold to remake the ring. Obviously the gold used is special and has great sentimental value for the both of us.

But I am at a loss. I do not have access to the space required or materials/tools to adequately and safely extract/refine the gold out of this ring. I have done much research on it, and it does not seem feasible in my situation. Of course most jewellers do not extract gold, only reshape it into different jewelry, and a small handful of the refining places I have seen either will not accept it, or have not responded in 3+ months.

Does anyone here know of any business or notable/reputable individual that could extract this gold for me? I am not concerned about the other metals in the alloy of course, those are easily replacable. Any help is much appreciated my friends.

I also see you are in Thornton, Co. Try giving Hazen Research in Golden a call. They are on Indiana street, next to the Ball plant. They can do it, just don't know their cost. 303-279-4501.

 

[Chief]

You do have a choice… you could add more gold and add some silver to create a better color / alloy which would guarantee you have that same gold in the ring .
If you send a small amount of metal to be refined the chances of getting your gold back is slim, basically because it’s cost prohibitive to do so or you will pay silly amounts for the service.

That is about what I figured. If it were much more volume, I am sure it would be a different story.

Right now my alloy is 58.3% Au (2g), 29% Cu (.98g), 8% Ag (.27g), and 4.7% Zn (.16) for a band at 3.41g.

My concern is this is approximately 14k, as was selected for the best durability. Would diluting it by adding more Au and Ag (albeit making the color more yellow) make it too malleable?

 

[goldshark]

Tell them you want an inquart and nitric parting. Melt into a single piece in lieu of the fine powder, if that is what you want.

 

[Chief]

I also see you are in Thornton, Co. Try giving Hazen Research in Golden a call. They are on Indiana street, next to the Ball plant. They can do it, just don't know their cost. 303-279-4501.

Awesome information, thank you!

I would love to be able to work with nitric to do all of this in house, but my concerns are for safety of course. Would working with nitric outdoors with a respirator/face shield (sans ventilation hood) and basic PPE such as PVC apron, gloves, etc. be acceptable with minimal risk?

 

[goldshark]

That is about what I figured. If it were much more volume, I am sure it would be a different story.

Right now my alloy is 58.3% Au (2g), 29% Cu (.98g), 8% Ag (.27g), and 4.7% Zn (.16) for a band at 3.41g.

My concern is this is approximately 14k, as was selected for the best durability. Would diluting it by adding more Au and Ag (albeit making the color more yellow) make it too malleable?

Then you would lose the sentimental values.

 

[goldshark]

You could do this outdoors, on a warm day, no problem. I would do it easily in a couple hours, without PPEs, but I have much more experience, I am assuming, then you do.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Then you would lose the sentimental values.

I don't get that, he want to keep the Gold that is in there.
Adding a bit more Gold or Silver will not remove the sentimental value of the Gold that is already there, will it?

 

[Chief]

I don't get that, he want to keep the Gold that is in there.
Adding a bit more Gold or Silver will not remove the sentimental value of the Gold that is already there, will it?

I do not believe so, I am confused on this statement as well.

Adding more gold and silver would be easy given the tools and space I have, I would just be concerned about the pliability of the metal since the copper will be more diluted. If it remains structurally sound and more or less rigid, this is a good option for me.

 

[FrugalRefiner]

The problem with just remelting and adding more gold and silver is the oxides that are formed every time the metal is melted. Copper will oxidize and the silver will absorb oxygen when it is molten. Both can lead to inclusions of oxides and porosity in the final product.

You'll get a better result by refining the gold, then add fresh metals to create a new alloy.

Dave

 

[Shark]

Gold, along with many other metals, is subject to work hardening. Often reheating to remove the temper from it will bring the mailability back to it.

 

[goldshark]

I don't get that, he want to keep the Gold that is in there.
Adding a bit more Gold or Silver will not remove the sentimental value of the Gold that is already there, will it?

My reply was kind of tongue in cheek. I was assuming the Au from the different 2 sources, would hold some kind of actual mystical powers. I don't think it does, but again, I could be wrong. I was just giving you a technique to keep the Au you have, and not dilute it with some other Au that may contain some bad Juju.

 

[Chief]

My reply was kind of tongue in cheek. I was assuming the Au from the different 2 sources, would hold some kind of actual mystical powers. I don't think it does, but again, I could be wrong. I was just giving you a technique to keep the Au you have, and not dilute it with some other Au that may contain some bad Juju.

No worries. I am fine with adding more metal to it, but would just like to make sure the original Au is in there. It's the only thing stopping me from just creating a new ring entirely, which would arguably be so much easier.

 

[Chief]

The problem with just remelting and adding more gold and silver is the oxides that are formed every time the metal is melted. Copper will oxidize and the silver will absorb oxygen when it is molten. Both can lead to inclusions of oxides and porosity in the final product.

You'll get a better result by refining the gold, then add fresh metals to create a new alloy.

Dave

Thank you for this info!

Would these oxides be too much for the addition of borax to extract when melting?

 

[4metals]

Right now my alloy is 58.3% Au (2g), 29% Cu (.98g), 8% Ag (.27g), and 4.7% Zn (.16) for a band at 3.41g.

I agree with Goldshark, in a spacious back yard you could get this done in a few hours by inquarting and parting. Then you are back to 99+% pure gold and the impurities remaining are Silver and Copper, both of which you will be adding to make new alloy.

 

[anachronism]

My reply was kind of tongue in cheek. I was assuming the Au from the different 2 sources, would hold some kind of actual mystical powers. I don't think it does, but again, I could be wrong. I was just giving you a technique to keep the Au you have, and not dilute it with some other Au that may contain some bad Juju.

There is also the fact that chemically refining gold gets rid of any "fingerprint" that would naturally occur for gold that comes from any particular mining source. It's quite literally returned to elemental gold that could have come from anywhere.

 

[Martijn]

There is also the fact that chemically refining gold gets rid of any "fingerprint" that would naturally occur for gold that comes from any particular mining source. It's quite literally returned to elemental gold that could have come from anywhere.

And there is the "my precious" factor, which will weigh much more. Sentimental value. No explanation can take that away.

If you have the ability to melt your metal, add some Ag to it so you get approximately a 25-30% Au alloy. Get a pyrex measuring cup, add some 30 % nitric,70% DISTILLED water to it. Keep decanting/washing, until solution is clear. Watch a sreetips video on in quarting for more details. Save the nitric for cementing on Copper, then neutralizing solution. This will give you pretty close to .99% Au very simply.

I pondered giving this advice, but there are some safety factors to keep in mind.
For this particular case of one time refining, a step by step guidance could be the best option.
The OP must be aware of NO fumes during digestion the toxicity of the metal salts created by the nitric, and we might need to guide him through the waste treatment. But inquarting and parting is very easy indeed.

 

[nickvc]

As the op is a jeweller and probably has access to rolls couldn’t he add copper to his alloy then roll it very thin and then use AP which is easy for most to make ?