well, hey there long88, i too am a newbie here, been reding the forums and gathering eqiupment and facts and of course pm's to process for about six months, read hokes book, then re-read it, filled a notebook with notes and was still saying HUH? alot, so i just bought lazersteves video, and plan to keep breaking apart old electronics till i fully understand the chemical parts of all of this, i have no interest in opening my own refinery, and have no plans to get rich doing it, i just want to be able to show my grandchildren a small gold bar( say..... 50 lbs or so) and say.. yup..... i made that! but good luck with the refinery, welcome to the forum.