Personal opinion

[GoIdman]

I am telling you from experience they are. For the amount of money I have spent versus the amount I would’ve been willing to spend to connect with my son blows me away. Not to mention this is pretty cool stuff.

Hi Nick,

There is fun in every activity that you can do with your son, I also have 2 kids, and I started this journey for them, so when they reach that age, when they learn chemistry in school, I can show them how it is done properly, and that how they can even make a living out of it (yes, unfortunately, electronic waste will not run out soon).

As I see it, the biggest problem, with newbies that come to this forum is that, as others already pointed out, is that we do not know who sits on the other end of the screen. Unfortunately, most of the time, YouTube does not help , when it comes to recovery and refining, and some newbies come to this forum when the harm has already been done (because of some videos they have seen with inappropriate/false/bad content), that is why most of the post replies start with "put everything aside and read"(it is not intended to offend anyone).

The purpose is to help each other.

I recently seen some content on YouTube regarding recovery and refining done by some guys from India, handling corrosive acids bear handed, in flip-flops, wearing absolutely no PPE. The biggest problem is that this content will be seen by people that are impatient and want to see the result "yesterday". I know because I was impatient too.

Bottom line, we all have our personalities and expertise on and off the gold refining, and for the best of it, we all come from different countries and backgrounds, with different first languages.

English is not my first language either, if you read something I posted, that you feel is inappropriate, feel free to mention it to me, and correct me if i am wrong, as i always say to my kids "Every day you get out of the bed, is an opportunity to learn something new" It applies to me too.

Welcome, thank you for being part of this, have fun and I wish you get closer to your son, I am pretty sure you have a ton of things you can teach him, and us as well.

Be safe,

Pete

 

[4metals]

The biggest problem is that this content will be seen by people that are impatient and want to see the result "yesterday". I know because I was impatient too.

Good that you mention this. After years of teaching refining, hands on, I cannot tell you how many refiners I have taught who couldn't wait for a reaction to subside and had to tip over the bucket to see the gold on the bottom. More than once they were repaid with a face full of SO₂. Something they never forget. Man that stuff stinks!!!! I called that inability to wait to see results "instant gratification," they couldn't wait to see results.

Refining is a mixture of 3 things, science(chemistry), art, and patience. Figure out the right ratio of each and you will be successful.

 

[Shark]

The past several years my motto has been " I can quit learning when I'm dead". Been to close to that point to many times. I like getting up and looking for something new to learn.

 

[Master Nater]

Master Nater why are you trying to disrupt this thread , apologies have been given and accepted and we have moved onto refining and recovery which is what members want to read.

this has been a long time coming. charlie mike.

 

[kurtak]

sounds like it's about time for my return.......

this guy did not deserve the disrespect you all just shoveled on him.

i'll start off with, you guys have been doing a great job of not being disrespectful for quite a while. there have been a lot of newcomers who have come here, asked honest questions, and have not been gang-bullies like this for quite a while. too bad it doesn't stay that way.

how did you start? oh yes... "First, i'd like to suggest" ... there are much less condescending ways to teaching a man that his capitalization is off. even after he tells you he's using a voice dictation to send his messages.

next, whether you choose to recognize it or not, this forum IS READING. it is active reading with discussion. we all have received your introduction to hokes papers, and it is a great resource, but very out-dated. repeatedly telling people that we should stop doing what we're trying to learn and read, is not promoting anyone to learn anything. it's telling them to "JUST STOP". yes, there are instances where people are a danger to themselves and those around them. this gentleman is not one of those.

"how in the world." (repeatedly) your emotions have absolutely no place in teaching. would you use the same terms in teaching your children how to read? of course not. it doesn't promote learning, only the BULLYING that so many people have noted to a few of the moderators on here, over the years. feel free to run a search in the library and look it up. (how does that suggestion go over with you, whether well-intended or not?)

as always, martjin (mr. safety) - feels the need to step in and to pile on more webster's dictionary. how very condescending. just save it until you have an original idea on how to help.

while i believe shark's piling on was well-intended, the guy doesn't need 3 of you jumping in. to anyone trying to learn here, you're like a gang. i dare you to go back and look at all the posts where people feel attacked. you'll notice a common theme.

thank God 4metals is here. as always, a gentleman. the rest of you could learn a lot from him, not just about refining. about civility. kudos, sir.

don't mind MY critiquing. it's "just something that needs to be done."

"no it wasn't"? so you're acknowledging that you're just a bully that likes piling on when a guy's already getting beaten down, all for TRYING TO LEARN?

i've got news for you... there was already a "pause" before ygg and 'mr safety' decided to jump on him. just like they always do. you sure didn't need to jump on the pile to "cause a pause."

what goes on here against people who are just trying to learn, is sad.

i can see why you chose the moniker you did. and it has nothing to do with refining.

this has been a long time coming. charlie mike.

Talk about being a bully - you Master Nater are one of the biggest bullies on this forum (IMO)

And why do I say that ?

Because not so much as once - in any one of the many threads that you have replied to - have you ever posted ANYTHING to help a member (usually a "new" member) answer a question they have about refining &/or provide information to help them solve a refining problem they are having

Rather - in EVERY thread you have posted a reply to it has been to interject your woke, DEI, social justice/reform ideology on this forum - targeting in particular ether the moderators of this forum &/or those of us that have been LONG TIME members here dedicating our YEARS of experience for the sole purpose of helping "new" member to solve problems they come to us with &/or answer questions they may have before they dive in --- AND we do this - at our own sacrifice to our time - WITH NO EXPECTION of something in return

Therefor (IMO) because you have never so much as once provided ANY info to actually help a member to solve their problem &/or answer their question - but instead only interject your woke, DEI, social justice/reform ideology you have in fact been bullying this forum (repeatedly) by disrupting threads from there intended purpose of tying to solve a refining problem &/or answering a refining question - with the thread soon devolving into a thread about personal "feelings" &/or social justice issues rather then staying on track of the refining problem/question at hand

I personally - as a LONG TIME contributor to this forum - in trying to help "new" members solve their refining problems &/or answer their refining questions am VERY offended - even to the point of feeling BULLIED by YOUR views of social justice/reform ideology

This is a precious metals refining discussion forum & NOT a social justice/reform discission forum

You Master Bater are VERY lucky that I am not one of the forums moderators because If I was I would have ban you long ago for taking threads completely off the rails from trying to solve refining problems &/or answering refining question & allowing them to devolve into threads about (at least your sense) of social justice/injustice

In every case (at least that I am aware of) wherein a new member "may at first" feel they are being bullied - ends with that new member gaining a greater knowledge about refining & learning why they had a problem in the first place --- & that is because the questions/answer those of us with more experience ask/give at the "start" of a thread are NOT meant to be "bully" questions/answers - but rather are asked/answered to get to the bottom of the problem/question in the effort to help a new members

This thread is no exception (to your BS) & is in fact a good example of how you try to run a thread off the rails

With your social justice BS - you dam near caused this new member to leave the forum which in turn would have caused him to miss out on the HUGE amount of refining info this forum has to provide to him --- thank god to absolutely no help on your part - BUT - LOTS of help/effort on our part he has decided to stick around

He is now starting to see & understand that our first questions/answers were not meant to be bullying &/or disrespect him - but meant to help us so we can help him

I expect now (no thanks to you Master Nater) that he (NickBrown) will soon become a "good" student of refining - even to the point of soon becoming a "good" contributor in helping teach new upcoming members

My final word here - YOU - Master Nater - dam near "chased away" (& its not the first you have done this) what appears to be a good future refiner with your woke, DEI, social justice/reform ideology BS --- & if you ask me - that makes you the one here that is a BULLY

Kurt

 

[FrugalRefiner]

in EVERY thread you have posted a reply to it has been to interject your woke, DEI, social justice/reform ideology on this forum...

...but instead only interject your woke, DEI, social justice/reform ideology...

...with your woke, DEI, social justice/reform ideology BS...

Kurt, please leave the political rhetoric out of your posts. It wasn't necessary to make your point (especially 3 times in one post), and detracts from the value of your post.

Dave

 

[Master Nater]

i find it incredibly ironic, that a bunch of gold refiners have such a difficult time following THE GOLDEN RULE.

treat others the way you wish to be treated.

i challenge you to go back and re-read every one of these mysterious posts that you think i'm being 'mean' in. START FROM THE BEGINNING. i'm a big believer in escalation of force. i start out with civility, which escalates to a warning. and then i do not hold back when you begin attacking me.

let's take this thread for instance...

"sounds like it's about time for my return.......

this guy did not deserve the disrespect you all just shoveled on him."

and what was the clique's response? more attacking. very righteous. tell me how I am the one driving people off...

 

[4metals]

What you do not realize is there already was a discussion underway amongst moderators about this very issue long before you felt your input was needed. And worse, after your second post, where you spoke your peace, the thread was back on track helping the OP. Your renewed posts did precious little to help the purpose of the thread and only succeeded in re-kindling aggressive feelings. In the end you have only succeeded in damaging members perception of you.

The mods here do a lot that no one see's to keep the forum running smooth, do not think you are the only person on this entire forum who recognizes these issues.

 

[haveagojoe]

Back to the topic in hand, I just learned that it only takes 0.161g of copper to precipitate 1g of gold. I had been planning to precipitate my next batch of dissolved gold foils with copper powder from my electrolytic cell but since I'm expecting less than 10g of gold I think it might be too difficult to get the copper powder quantity right and not overdo it. Perhaps a piece of bare copper wire would be better in this case? Slower, but if I keep testing with stannous I can hopefully pull it out before it starts contaminating the gold. Or maybe the usual SMB would be more forgiving...

I will be dissolving with bleach in HCl.

 

[4metals]

Back to the topic in hand, I just learned that it only takes 0.161g of copper to precipitate 1g of gold. I had been planning to precipitate my next batch of dissolved gold foils with copper powder from my electrolytic cell but since I'm expecting less than 10g of gold I think it might be too difficult to get the copper powder quantity right and not overdo it. Perhaps a piece of bare copper wire would be better in this case? Slower, but if I keep testing with stannous I can hopefully pull it out before it starts contaminating the gold. Or maybe the usual SMB would be more forgiving...

I will be dissolving with bleach in HCl.

The truth is this is not really back to the matter at hand, this should be a topic for another thread so at some point in the future someone could search precipitation with copper and find a thread specifically about that topic. We all complain how hard it is to search when there are so many threads but keeping threads on topic makes that easier if we all learn to do it.

So please, a new thread.

 

[Master Nater]

What you do not realize is there already was a discussion underway amongst moderators about this very issue long before you felt your input was needed. And worse, after your second post, where you spoke your peace, the thread was back on track helping the OP. Your renewed posts did precious little to help the purpose of the thread and only succeeded in re-kindling aggressive feelings. In the end you have only succeeded in damaging members perception of you.

The mods here do a lot that no one see's to keep the forum running smooth, do not think you are the only person on this entire forum who recognizes these issues.

are you speaking to me, or kurt?

if me, i have let it go, 3 times, but i keep getting replied to/attacked by the moderators. so i'm replying/defending myself.

edit - add for additional explination

 

[4metals]

attacked by the moderators. so i'm replying/defending myself.

Nobody attacked you but you cannot let it lie. This is all a distraction to refining discussions which, I assume, we are ultimately all here for. As a result I am going to lock this thread, If @NickBrown has more questions he can start another thread in the beginners section and we can help him complete his and his son's project and move on with their refining journey. If you, @Master Nater feel you can contribute to Mr Browns future threads in a useful and technical manner (as in chemistry content and not as the self appointed forum conscience) then you are welcome to contribute.