Purchased gold processing facility at an auction?

[alxseg]

Hi everybody,

I'm new here and was looking for some help. So the company I work for bought this property at auction because it was abandoned and the owner had not paid property taxes...I know what you're thinking... the reason it was abandoned was that the owner got entangled in major legal problems regarding a business partner of his being charged with major tax fraud. So, as far as we know, it was not abandoned because of anything chemically dangerous. So we knew the facility was some sort of chemical plant but since it was an auction we could not enter the property until we bought it...I know, risky but fun right? Anyway, we buy it for a fraction of what it's appraised at and from what we've found it looks like they were processing gold/silver on some level. What we have to decide now is what to do with this place, and I'm hoping somebody here could help. There are 3 buildings with various equipment in and around them. Much of it seems to work, although much of it needs some maintenance at least.

Here is a video I made that shows most of everything.

http://youtu.be/-cgJ9OoOnfg

So we have a couple of questions if anybody could help us that would be fantastic.

1. Was this in fact being used to process gold/silver? If not, what?
2. Are the processes that were used still viable? Is this something that could function today and run as a business?
3. An explanation of the different pieces would be great. What exactly was being done by the various machines shown?

I've tried calling the old owner but I'm not sure if he's in prison or what his fate was. Much of the equipment is pretty old so we have to decide whether to pursue this as a business opportunity or to just try to sell the machinery and re-purpose the land. Thoughts?

Appreciate any input anybody could offer. Thanks.

 

[ericrm]

it ok keep the bulding but GIVE ME MY DRUG BACK :mrgreen:

 

[NobleMetalWorks]

You might be able to check with your local hall of records for the county, and/or city. I am not sure where you are, but somewhere, someone has records of the business that was at that address. A business license had to be issued, and then renewed and taxed. Specially if it was producing any wastes that were dangerous, or stored waste which is what it looks like they did in the big poly tanks.

Once you get the business information, you can tell what type of business he was running, and who the people were that were involved in the business. Then you can call them directly, or google more information once you have the company name, owner and address, etc.

Scott

 

[NobleMetalWorks]

Another thought...

If you check his Dun's and Bradstreet for that address:

http://www.dnb.com/

You might be able to get the information on the business that way, also you may be able to find out who his trade partners were, or people he was doing business with they should be listed, if the business is. Once you find out who his trade partners are, then you can contact them, ask them what type of business they are into, then find out if they are interested or have anyone else in their own network who might be interested in the builder and/or equipment.

Scott

 

[alxseg]

Thanks for the advice Scott. I do have some old records with phone numbers on them, unfortunately all the numbers are no longer in service. I was hoping somebody has worked in a similar facility and knew some of the equipment we had so we could get some kind of input on what was going on here. We found old magazines (late 80's) that were all about gold/silver prospecting so we're fairly confident they were doing some of that there we just don't know much more than that.

I'll keep digging, thanks.

 

[qst42know]

What are the sacks of chemicals on the pallet at 51 seconds in the video ?

 

[Dr. Poe]

This obviously was a gold processing refinery geared to process free milling gold. A small cyanide plant was for tailings. They probably ran out of ore. Some parts are missing, like the grind circuit. It probably had ball, rod, jaw and other pulverizers prior to the owner running out of money. The copper sulfate tank supposes that the ore was a copper base. Much is salable, but I can't think of anyone that would relocate to El Paso. A smart person might be able to convert the plant to work scrap or to buy ore to process. :|

 

[Westerngs]

This looks like it was very close to the old Asarco smelter on Paisano road,is that so?

If so, some of the folks still at Asarco might be able to help you. I think they still have a small crew at the smelter just to keep the place in shape.

Also, some of the people at the Phelps Dodge (now Freeport McMoran?) plant on the south side of El Paso near Western Playland (North Loop road?) may remember what was being processed here. Most people in this business know each other and what they do, especially if they are in the same town.

 

[alxseg]

What are the sacks of chemicals on the pallet at 51 seconds in the video ?

They're 50 lb bags that say Solar Sea and Land on the side. If I remember correct they contain some kind of salt.

This obviously was a gold processing refinery geared to process free milling gold. A small cyanide plant was for tailings. They probably ran out of ore. Some parts are missing, like the grind circuit. It probably had ball, rod, jaw and other pulverizers prior to the owner running out of money. The copper sulfate tank supposes that the ore was a copper base. Much is salable, but I can't think of anyone that would relocate to El Paso. A smart person might be able to convert the plant to work scrap or to buy ore to process. :|

Thank you for the info. This helps a bunch. We did find small balls lying around the property, so I imagine they had a ball mill that they took with them. Our research indicates that the property hadn't been in use for some time, at least 5 years but maybe up to 10. We also found a decent amount of crime involved, where an old owner supposedly stole a bunch of material and left town, and the last owner before us was found guilty of tax fraud of over $100 million. We do have money to invest into the property, but we wouldn't know where to start, which is why I'm trying to get more details as to if we should just sell off the equipment or try to bring everything to life again. They obviously put a lot of money into it, so there's the draw to start it up again.

This looks like it was very close to the old Asarco smelter on Paisano road,is that so?

If so, some of the folks still at Asarco might be able to help you. I think they still have a small crew at the smelter just to keep the place in shape.

Also, some of the people at the Phelps Dodge (now Freeport McMoran?) plant on the south side of El Paso near Western Playland (North Loop road?) may remember what was being processed here. Most people in this business know each other and what they do, especially if they are in the same town.

No it's actually off Montana on the east part of town. I'll see if I can find any contacts at the old Phelps Dodge place, thanks for the lead!

Does anybody know what this machine does in particular?

 

[publius]

I would be willing to bet money that is the "power supply" for an induction furnace. It would bring the frequency of the AC up in a water cooled coil to begin the melting of metal.

 

[alxseg]

I would be willing to bet money that is the "power supply" for an induction furnace. It would bring the frequency of the AC up in a water cooled coil to begin the melting of metal.

Thank you, that seems right. Is this type of machine still used today? Are they expensive? This one was in a building by itself with some gas masks hanging around, some more pics.







Could somebody be so kind as to walk through the basic process of processing free milling gold? At this property there was a ball mill, there's this induction furnace, there's a building with shaker tables, there's another building with 3 mesh belt conveyor furnaces in a row. Outside the shaker tables there's 8 large mixing funnel deals, the kind you see on cement trucks. Outside there's 2 ponds, with various pumps flowing through the outside and in the shaker table building.

Just an overview would be great. I'm assuming that they break up the ore, then the shaker tables filter out the gold, and the mesh belt furnaces melt it down into ingots or whatnot...?

If this is asking too much does anybody could somebody recommend something we could read that would detail this process?

Appreciate the help.
Also, I'm not sure if I've made this clear but if anybody is interested in running this place we are hiring :lol:

 

[Harold_V]

I would be willing to bet money that is the "power supply" for an induction furnace. It would bring the frequency of the AC up in a water cooled coil to begin the melting of metal.

That's precisely what it is. Looks like a 250 kw Inductotherm. The question then becomes, is it solid state, or does it have a motor/generator? A unit that size requires a cooling tower to operate, and may require in excess of ten gallons/minute circulation for cooling.

From viewing pictures posted, I can't help but wonder if I'm seeing water cooled capacitors. Does the machine have a KVAR meter?

Thank you, that seems right. Is this type of machine still used today? Are they expensive?

Yes, they are still used, and extensively, although if that model is motor/generator, it is badly outmoded. They run with only about 50% efficiency, while solid state units are much better, hovering around the 99% area. Also, if the items I suspect are capacitors are, and they're made earlier than the mid 70's, pretty good chance they contain PCB's. You haven't lived until you've had to deal with the disposal of that stuff.
In regards to the more modern units, yes, they are expensive, but that doesn't help much for the older units. Because of the potential for PCB's and their lower efficiency, they are not in great demand. There is a market for them, however.

That unit is way too large for use unless you intend to melt, literally, hundreds of pounds. My 50 kw Ajax is capable of melting up to 200 pounds. The problem comes from not having a high enough frequency, however. If that one is greater than 3,000 Hz, might be just fine. The greater the power capacity, the faster it can melt. High frequency is required for melting small items, however, but a heel (a large piece) can be used to get the heat up, at which time you can add fine bits without issue. Fed small items alone, it's very likely that they would not melt, although they would get heated to some degree.

Hope this helps.

Harold

 

[Dr. Poe]

All prospecting supply stores have books about finding and processing placer gold. My favorite is: A & B Prospecting supplies in Mesa, Arizona. They have an on line site. :|

 

[alxseg]

Yes, they are still used, and extensively, although if that model is motor/generator, it is badly outmoded. They run with only about 50% efficiency, while solid state units are much better, hovering around the 99% area. Also, if the items I suspect are capacitors are, and they're made earlier than the mid 70's, pretty good chance they contain PCB's. You haven't lived until you've had to deal with the disposal of that stuff.
In regards to the more modern units, yes, they are expensive, but that doesn't help much for the older units. Because of the potential for PCB's and their lower efficiency, they are not in great demand. There is a market for them, however.

That unit is way too large for use unless you intend to melt, literally, hundreds of pounds. My 50 kw Ajax is capable of melting up to 200 pounds. The problem comes from not having a high enough frequency, however. If that one is greater than 3,000 Hz, might be just fine. The greater the power capacity, the faster it can melt. High frequency is required for melting small items, however, but a heel (a large piece) can be used to get the heat up, at which time you can add fine bits without issue. Fed small items alone, it's very likely that they would not melt, although they would get heated to some degree.

Hope this helps.

Harold

Thank you so much Harold. There was a large Caterpillar generator attached to this building as well as an A/C unit that seemed to be connected directly to the machine. The generator isn't attached anymore but is still there, not sure why they removed it. So everything you said seems to be in line with what we found there. I'm not sure if it has a KVAR meter, I'll have to look into that next time I'm there.

All prospecting supply stores have books about finding and processing placer gold. My favorite is: A & B Prospecting supplies in Mesa, Arizona. They have an on line site. :|

Thank you!

What websites do you all use for buying/selling of large pieces of equipment like this or similar?

Some more pictures of various machinery.

Anybody know what this thing is?


Pic2


Thoughts on what was going on here? This is next to the 3 conveyor belt furnaces.

 

[alxseg]

More pics...






Outside.





There's 7 of these.

 

[Palladium]

http://www.goldmachinery.com/

 

[alxseg]

Are these type of furnaces still used? We have 3 of them, all in a line, one feeding another. They're all from the 80's but they turn on and seem like will work with some refurbishing. I know new ones can be pricey, what about the old ones? Am I right in thinking that you would put gold particles in the trays, run them through the furnaces, and they'd come out the other end in bar form?

Thanks.

 

[goldsilverpro]

I doubt if they are melting furnaces. They look like conveyorized annealing (etc.) furnaces but I can't see what they would be used for in working ores. We had a similar one in a silver coin minting operation at a place I worked for. To reduce silver ingots to the right thickness, it takes many passes though a set of rolls. After 3-5 passes, the silver strips would become work hardened and brittle and were prone to splitting. The long strips were cut into lengths and passed through several heat zones in the annealing furnace. The rolling and annealing was repeated until the right thickness was achieved.

Are there any rolling mills and/or blanking/coining presses among the equipment?

 

[alxseg]

I doubt if they are melting furnaces. They look like conveyorized annealing (etc.) furnaces but I can't see what they would be used for in working ores. We had a similar one in a silver coin minting operation at a place I worked for. To reduce silver ingots to the right thickness, it takes many passes though a set of rolls. After 3-5 passes, the silver strips would become work hardened and brittle and were prone to splitting. The long strips were cut into lengths and passed through several heat zones in the annealing furnace. The rolling and annealing was repeated until the right thickness was achieved.

Are there any rolling mills and/or blanking/coining presses among the equipment?

There wasn't anything like that there. Right next to the furnaces are the large plastic tubs that I posted earlier. On the other side of the furnaces, with the output very close to one end of the furnace line, was a mouse-trap like setup with a couple of gold wheels, shaker tables, and various pumps and tubs.

I wish I had a better picture but this was at one end of the furnace line. It's a cart with many of these very heavy plates that fit perfectly into the furnaces on the belt.


Here you see the mouse trap setup on the right, setup very closely to what I imagine would be the input of the furnace line.


Another shot of the mouse trap setup.


Here's a still from the video to show you more, with what I believe would be the output/end of the furnace line. Where I'm standing as I take this video there's a large garage door entrance which is directly in front of the truck entrance in front of the property. So it seems like this was either the beginning or the end of a process, setup for easy delivery or removal via truck.