The SMB drop didn't fully work, what other method can I use?

[jaws]

Okay, so, this is my first post. I have dug through the forum looking for something that would help me out with my situation. I have not come across anything as of yet. So I need a spoon full of either a link or a quick explanation/alternative if you please!

Here is a quick background on myself. I read Hoke’s books, looked on YouTube and read this forum religiously. I fully understand the process, chemical reactions and safety required (at least I like to think I do : -) I have even distilled 92+% fuming nitric acid from Icepacks (AN) and drain cleaner (H2S04) mainly for silver refining and to cook off some of the base metals from some scrap jewelry ETC…. Okay, I’m getting off my topic here.

Unfortunately, Huston, I have a problem! I used HCL/HP to leach the copper out from under lots and lots of fingers. That worked fine no problems there. I also have dissolved the gold in HCL/CL waited 48 hours for the chlorine to evaporate and retrieved it several times with SMB without any issues. I didn't change anything in the process that I have used almost 10 times already.


But something is wrong with my last 2 SMB drops. There is still gold in the solution and it’s still golden yellow tested with Stannous Chloride. It would appear that some (a lot) of the gold didn’t drop out of solution. The SMB didn’t work all the way??!?? I have added more SMB without any change.

What other process can I use to get all of the gold out of the HCL/Bleach solution once SMB was added?

For the love of god PLEASE HELP!

I have not been able to find anything pertaining to this. I read many articals where people say to test the solution after the drop but never how to get the gold out if the SMB drop that didn’t work all the way.

Many THANKS in advance!!!

 

[jaws]

It figures lol, after much more digging I found this simple answer in a nut shell. Just put it on a hot plate to make sure all of the chlorine is completely dissipated.

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=7016&p=62957&hilit=alternative+to+smb#p62957

I'm going to give it a try tonight after work and see what happens.

Although the solution has been sitting for 3 days and I have not looked at it since. So maybe I jumped the gun on this post and the remaining gold might have already precipitated out because of the chlorine dissipation. Anyways if that’s the case I will feel like a complete idiot. HAHA thank god for the internet’s anonymity! Either way I will reply to this post and let everybody know what the outcome is.

However, if anybody who has experienced this issue wants to suggest something else. Please do!!

 

[Geo]

looks like you may have figured it out on your own.let us know how it turned out.

 

[butcher]

Dissolved gases in solution:
Cold solution holds more gas.
Hot solutions will not hold as much dissolved gas.

Chlorine is a gas like oxygen is a gas, cool water holds much more oxygen than very hot water.
The sodium hypochlorite, also called (bleach) or (NaClO) is chlorine gas in solution.

Much of our sodium hypochlorite is made from electrolyzing salt-water brine in a cell, producing chlorine gas and sodium hydroxide a, so our bleach can contain both of these as well as some salt.

When mixing sodium hypochlorite (NaClO) and HCl acid (muriatic) we form(--->) chlorine gas (Cl2), table salt (NaCl) and water (H2O).

NaClO + 2HCl --> Cl2 (g) + NaCl + H2O

(This formed chlorine gas, which oxidizes the gold, so the HCl can form chlorides with the gold).

If you add more Bleach (chlorine) than needed, or do not have enough HCl this extra oxidizer will re-dissolve any gold your SMB is trying to precipitate out of solution, letting it sit will usually dissipate small amounts of chlorine gas more on warmer days,
But as it gets cold outside even small amounts of gas may not dissipate well, and if you used an excess of bleach it may weaken any free acid in solution and not even gas off very well at all without the addition of high heat.

heating sodium chlorite (NaClO) it decomposes to table salt and sodium chlorate:

NaClO ---heat---> NaCl + NaClO3

so here we may form white salts (both water soluble).

 

[jaws]

Thank you for the clarification of the chemical process. I appreciate that!!

I should have realized that something did change in my process... THE DANM WEATHER. it went from 70-90f to 50-60f within the last couple weeks. I rest the solution outside to evaporate the chlorine.

The cold weather has to be the major factor with the gasses not escaping from solution. Well, when I get home tonight hopefully I should see some results as I left the beakers on the hot plate all day. I didn’t get a chance to do it last night.

 

[Joeforbes]

...THE DANM WEATHER. it went from 70-90f to 50-60f within the last couple weeks...

You must be in Wisconsin too eh? haha.

 

[jaws]

California, Bay Area. I'ts been cold lately

 

[philddreamer]

Yeap, I saw you folks way down there have been also "enjoying" some of the pineapple express weather, too!

It's raining cats & dogs up here in WA. state & I'm trying to melt some gold that I want to mail tomorrow.
This weather is for the ducks! :mrgreen:

Take care!

Phil

 

[jimdoc]

This weather is for the ducks!
Phil

We are having "duck weather" on the east coast now also. Its better than the "penguin weather" that probably isn't too far away.

Jim

 

[philddreamer]

:lol: :lol: :lol: I hear you!
We just had a taste of the penguin weather last week; 2 or 3 days of snow & chilly temp's... No mas, por favor!

Phil

 

[jaws]

HHHA! It worked!! The solution boiled down about half way and there are lots of salts/SMB as well as a layer of precipitated dust (hopefully gold) the answer was so simple. Man I feel like an idiot for posting this too early, but hey, I panicked! I figured out my own problem because it was already posted on this awesome forum. But I want to say THANK YOU FOR THE HELP AND REPLIES! I do really appreciate it! You guys are AWESOME!

On a different note, I also did another gold melt tonight and got a 2 gram button out of some old pins and cell phones! Well, I know it's not much, but I'm happy! Melting the gold into a button after the purification process is by far one of the most rewarding treats from this hobby.

Enough of those small batches and a couple hundred years of scrapping I will be RICH lol. I find this to be a excellent and rewarding hobby and if I could find a way to make a living off of it; I certainly would!