AP solution is blue with gold floating on top

[DAVEEDO]

should i give the solution a quick boil to drop all the gold out of the solution? there is a layer of gold floating on the top. if not what should i do to clear up the solution and get all the gold to the bottom of the vessel? thanks for the help in advance

 

[Geo]

use a spray bottle set to mist and spray the top of the solution with water to break the surface tension. this will make everything floating sink to the bottom.

 

[glorycloud]

Umm, are you doing this indoors without a fume hood?? :shock:

 

[DAVEEDO]

no way would i do this indoors the fumes are volitile. i was outside and took this pic in my back hallway. behind the coffee pot is my screen door lol.

 

[DAVEEDO]

use a spray bottle set to mist and spray the top of the solution with water to break the surface tension. this will make everything floating sink to the bottom.

thanks Geo it worked perfectly i got 9 grams of gold powder out of this batch. now how do i go about rincing the powder before i make it into a button?

 

[Geo]

rinse with boiling water first.

decant leaving gold powder in the bottom. (gold is heavy compared to water and will act like its glued down)

add 100 ml of muriatic acid and warm to just below boiling point and then let cool.

decant back down to the powder. keep this acid separated and use it for rinses only until it gets discolored.

follow with two more water rinses the same way. heating and then cooling and decanting.

then add 100 ml of ammonium hydroxide(plain white ammonia from cleaning supplies). gently warm to just below boiling and let cool.swish solution around gently a few times while cooling.

decant into a clean container. you will want to save this solution and concentrate later as it may contain values.

add water to the pot 1/2 full and bring to a gentle boil then let cool.

repeat the last water rinse twice more.

now the powder should be a very light tan color if you did everything correctly and will have high purity gold.

decant the last time down to the powder and gently warm slightly just enough to make the water evaporate. you may cover the pot with a clean paper towel to keep out dirt and dust.

after the powder is completely dry use a dedicated brush to sweep the powder into the prepared melting dish.

these washes and rinses are to remove trace amounts of base metals and any salts, the ammonia dissolves other PM's that we don't want in our gold. the final water rinses is very important to remove salts. if you skip any of these steps your gold may still be pretty but will contain contaminants.

good luck with your melt.

EDIT: i would like to add that i do not recommend this course of action to anyone that is concerned about purity of their gold. where this works for me at the present time it is not to be used as an example of the correct procedure for processing refined gold.the quality of gold processed this way will not be pure gold. were it not for the fact that so many viewers have already read it, i would delete the entire response.

 

[DAVEEDO]

thanks Geo i will start the rinse cycle tomorrow. much appreciated and very clear instructions. ill post pics of my results

 

[Harold_V]

add 100 ml of muriatic acid and warm to just below boiling point and then let cool.

Frankly, I don't think much of your washing procedure. In fact, I'd discourage anyone from its use. Way too much wasted effort, and not nearly as effective as it might otherwise be. I'm curious why you don't take the solution to a boil, and even more curious why you feel it should cool? I'm at a loss to even begin to see a benefit, and the time wasted surely isn't good.

Prolonged boiling yields its own evidence that it works better. Have you given it a go?

Harold

 

[Geo]

actually after the incident where i lost so much of my gold due to steam explosions i have been overly cautious about boiling and really dont want to advise someone to do something im not willing to do.as far as cooling ive noticed that when adding hcl and then water or ammonia and then water fine gold particles will get suspended in the solution and may take some time to settle and cooling gives this time to settle. the procedure i described is what i do and it does work for what i want from my gold as im not after .9999 its just the resale value im trying to get,it does take longer but it insures that im going to get my gold as pure as i can expect it to be with what im working with. im not working with other peoples gold yet and i found a jeweler that will pay me spot on 22K for what i bring him and even though i know my gold is much more pure than that it is an instant transaction.

EDIT: i would like to add that i do not recommend this course of action to anyone that is concerned about purity of their gold. where this works for me at the present time it is not to be used as an example of the correct procedure for processing refined gold.the quality of gold processed this way will not be pure gold. were it not for the fact that so many viewers have already read it, i would delete the entire response.

 

[butcher]

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=325&hilit=gold+washing+proceedures


Studying this has helped me get my gold to shine.

Incinerating oils and scum from your materials (burn off burnable trash in pretreatment steps), before treating your materials with acids,

Can keep these oils from making gold float in later steps of process,

(Also removing trash from incineration can help you precipitate the metal salts, dirty solution will hold these values in solution when you are trying to precipitate them),

Clean glassware is also important, (even finger prints can have oils making gold float).

A spray bottle will usually help to break surface tension and make floaters sink, or a surfactant may be needed (drop dish soap or other product) if oils or a dirty scum layer keeps small gold flakes floating.

Using incineration in your process, and clean glassware will help to eliminate these problems.

 

[Harold_V]

actually after the incident where i lost so much of my gold due to steam explosions i have been overly cautious about boiling and really dont want to advise someone to do something im not willing to do.

That's setting a poor example for those who may wish to learn proper washing techniques. Contrary posts such as yours have a way of leading those with concern down the wrong path, then they wonder why they can't achieve the results achieved by others.

Many of the issues you raised are eliminated simply by taking the solution to a boil (to say nothing of using incineration to eliminate troublesome materials at the outset). An example would be fine gold that tends to resist settling rapidly. Unless it has come from extremely dirty solutions, washing alters its behavior such that it readily settles. Rarely did I wash gold that required a settling period----it was taken to a boil, where it was allowed to boil for a prolonged period of time. To set a time is not wise, for it often is ready to be poured off in a few minutes, or it may require boiling for up to fifteen. Wise practice dictates that it is ended when there is no noticeable change of color with longer boiling. That's a sign that you have removed as much of the contaminant that is readily removed. By that time, the gold will generally settle without issue, and may have already formed large loosely bonded nodules that don't suspend, anyway.

Boiling action is critical to success. It causes a continual flow of solution through the precipitated gold, carrying off contaminants. If you choose to avoid that operation, I see no real reason to wash the gold at all. In fact, if you sell your gold as scrap, even the initial refining process isn't necessary. We refine to improve the quality, and to (hopefully) achieve a reputation of quality. Those who choose to "do it right" have the opportunity to find local buyers of their product who can use it in their manufacturing. Those who don't pursue that avenue will be forever locked in to a position of being nothing more than a scrap merchant. Not a problem if that's one's objective, but for those who have hopes of refining for jewelers (the ultimate gold source, by the way), I can't think of anything that would prevent that from happening any more than putting out a poor quality product.

Steam explosions are caused by drying. I had bumping issues when washing, but only with some batches. Steam explosions can be controlled by slow heating and occasional swirling of the vessel in which the gold is being dried.

I have no issues with anyone who prefers to alter processes, but when they yield compromised results, and they are promoted (as in your post) they should include notice that they do. Can you not see that the new guy in, one who hopes to achieve high purity, would not be happy with what you recommended? He'd have no way of knowing that your process sucks, which it does.

Harold

 

[Dr. Poe]

Try adjusting the pH to just the other side of 7. Dr. Poe :mrgreen:

 

[DAVEEDO]

i am trying to achieve the highest purity with the gold i am refining. so after reading the options above, i will definitely boil the water i use to rinse my gold. one question i have, i did not see an answer to in the previous posts, is should the water be distilled or would the use of regular tap water work for the rinse? thanks guys

 

[philddreamer]

If you you want highest purity, stick to distilled water; but you can use tap water thru your rinses & then use distilled water on your last rinse.

Phil