Gold calculation by micron thickness

[Geo]

some well meaning people use the the wrong terms for things they think they know (such as using micron when it should be micro-inches). its called misinformation. this forum is trying to end that, at least here on the forum, one person on the internet publishes misinformation and then after it passes through so many sources, its considered fact. here, you will find that misinformation is called out whenever possible to seed the correct information.

 

[lazersteve]

So, it is micro inches, not microns. Ok so 1 cable would have .00790675 grams of gold. Got it. So 500 cables would have 3.953375 grams of gold. That's $201.62 per box of 500 cables or 1000 ends. Or about .201 cents each. Or $20.16 worth of gold per 100 ends. The reason I ask is that I've come across 74 boxes. Let's do the math together on this one. 74 boxes x 500 cables = 37000 cables. That's 74000 ends at .2016 cents each = $14918.40 or just shy of 10 oz. Troy ? What do you think Steve? Is it correct ?

John,

Let's check your math:

0.007907 grams per cable x 500 cables per box = 3.9535 grams Au per box.

From your quote above you have 74 boxes of 500 cables:

74 x 3.9535g = 292.559g total at 100% recovery

or in ozT:

292.559g /31.1g = 9.41 ozT

at todays spot of $1590.70:

9.41 ozT x $1590.70 = $14957.20

You will not get 100% of spot or free refining plus there is the matter of shipping. Let's not forget that these items are commonly 'faked' for lack of a better word and you may not have what you think you do.

PM me when you get all of the gold plated contacts free of copper wire and plastic. I'll make you an offer on refining a sample to see what you actually have. If the numbers hold true to the math I'll be happy to refine the entire lot.

Steve

 

[Anonymous]

Thank you Mic. These items were not purchased off the shelf, and thank you for the apology, but there was no offense taken.

There should not have been any offense taken,because I said nothing offensive.Nor did I apologize for what I said.I stand behind what I said.
I really hope that you have as much gold as you think you do,however I am very skepticle to agree with you,when anyone can buy 100 CAT5 - RJ45 plugs,gold plated 50 "microns" thick,for less than $14 on ebay.You should take Steve up on his offer.He will be fair to you,and honest about the yields.

 

[goldsilverpro]

I sent this email to the manufacturer of these cable plugs. When (if) I get a reply, I will post it.

On your site, you say the gold thickness on the RJ45 cable plug is 50 microns, which is absurd. Anyone with knowledge about plating would know this has to be in error. The true thickness is likely 50 microinches (1.25 microns), which is considered fairly thick - the gold plating on pins and circuit board fingers is typically only 30 microinches (.75 microns). A micron is 40 times thicker than a microinch and 50 microns would be 2000 microinches. If your plating was 50 microns thick, the gold value would probably be greater than your selling price of the part. I would suggest that you check this out with your plater and make the correction on your site. It is false advertising to say the plating is 50 microns thick when it's only 1/40 of that.

I have spent a lot of time trying to simplify the math of determining the dollar value of gold plating per square inch and have come up with this.

$/in² = (thickness expressed in inches) X 10.17 X (gold spot in $/tr.oz.)

One microinch is the same as one millionth of an inch or, .000001". 50 microinches = .000050". One micron = .000040". 50 microns = .002000"

Therefore, from the formula above:

50 microinch plating = .000050 X 10.17 X 1605 = $0.816/in²

50 micron plating = .002000 X 10.17 X 1605 = $32.65/in²

Notes:
(1) The factor 10.17 is the number of troy ounces of gold per cubic inch.
(2) For silver, use 5.5 instead of 10.17 and use the silver spot price.
(3) In the formula, the gold spot price/tr.oz. can be expressed in any currency desired.
(4) If you want to work directly in cm² and microns, the formula would be:

$/cm² = (thickness expressed in microns) X .000063 X gold spot in $ (or whatever currency you want to use)

For 50 microns (in $), this would be 50 X .000063 X 1605 = $5.06/cm²

For 1.25 microns (50 microinches), it is 1.25 X .000063 X 1605 = $.126/cm²

 

[Anonymous]

50 microinch plating = .000050 X 10.17 X 1605 = $0.816/in.sq.

$0.816/in.sq. / 64=$.01275 per end x 2 ends/wire = $.0255
$0.0255/wire x 500 wires=$12.75 x 74 cases= $943.50
OR 74000 ends x $0.816 / 64(.125" x .125") = $943.50

 

[jonn]

Thank you Steve, Geo, Gsp, and Mic, you are all very helpful. Mic, if each piece is 1/8" x 1/8" and there are 2 sides and 8 pieces per end then you would not need to divide by 64. The correct formula per end would be divided by 2 or 1/2" per end or 1 full inch per both ends or total cable value. Is this true or did i misunderstand the formula? If true, .816 per cable both ends would be $408.00 per 500 and x 74 would be $30,192.00. Did I do this right??

EDIT: oops, that's 1/2 or .5 per both ends. Or a value of $15,096.00

 

[Anonymous]

I did make a mistake,but I will explain my previous calculation first.The division of 64 comes from the surface area of each connector.You had stated that they were 1/8" x 1/8",which means that there would be 64 pieces per square inch(one side of course).
There is $0.816 per square inch of plating.It takes 64 of your connectors to make 1 square inch.So you would take $0.816 and divide it by 64 which = $0.1275.Multiply that by 2,and that would give you the estimated gold for both sides of 1 connector $0.0255.
You said there are 74 boxes,500 wires in each box,and 2 plugs per wire.
So $0.0255 x 74 x 500 x 2 = $943.50
Here is where I made my mistake.My calculation was for 1 pin per connector.However there are 8 pins in each connector.So we need to take my final estimate,and multiply it by 8 which gives you $7548.That is a lot better than $943.

 

[jonn]

Thank you Mic, you are half way there. You need to multiply by 16 not 8. Which would give you the same number as Steve , just multiply your answer times 2. It will give the same result.

 

[Anonymous]

Maybe I am wrong.I don't think that I am,but it is entirely possible.I will just bow out,and keep an eye on this thread.Good luck John,I really do hope you have the amount that you think.

 

[goldsilverpro]

Other reasons I am totally convinced that the gold is not 50 microns thick. Gold of that thickness is almost impossible to plate with uniformity, using standard baths. Also, it would probably take at least 5 hours in the plating tank. Also, any plating over about 50 microinches would be a total waste of money in that application. 50 micron plating would be in realm of electroforming and would require special equipment and solutions. No company is going to go through all of that just to plate something as mundane as cable ends. Even the highest reliability military plating is much thinner than 50 microns. Look at this link that describes official MIL-G 45204C military gold plating callouts. The thickest on the list is 200 microinches (5 microns) and that thickness is extremely rare.

http://www.artisanplating.com/articles/platingthick.html

 

[jonn]

Thank you GSP. I'm good with the 50 micro inch plating, and I thank you for all your help and information. If it were in microns, it would certainly look different, I agree. I gave some a nitric bath and the foils look similar to finger foils. You said in your thread above that finger foils are 30 micro inch, if memory serves. That makes sense now. Still not a bad find. I will certainly realize a profit and at the end of the day, that's really all that matters. I'm thinking that the best process on these would be to clip all ends, incinerate, ball mill, melt a sample and check copper percentage. Take the rest and add sufficient copper to equal 98% + and send to the electrorefining tank. Any opinions?

 

[goldsilverpro]

Thank you GSP. I'm good with the 50 micro inch plating, and I thank you for all your help and information. If it were in microns, it would certainly look different, I agree. I gave some a nitric bath and the foils look similar to finger foils. You said in your thread above that finger foils are 30 micro inch, if memory serves. That makes sense now. Still not a bad find. I will certainly realize a profit and at the end of the day, that's really all that matters. I'm thinking that the best process on these would be to clip all ends, incinerate, ball mill, melt a sample and check copper percentage. Take the rest and add sufficient copper to equal 98% + and send to the electrorefining tank. Any opinions?

That's another reason I didn't think of. Nitric acid is mainly able to penetrate to the copper through the porosity in the gold. On average, the porosity is non-existent at about 100 microinches (2.5 microns) for most types of deposits. If you got foils, it can't be 50 microns thick.

 

[jonn]

It seems all the websites have changed their lingo to 50 micro inch now. I will be sending a sample out for assay and keep you all posted. Thanks again folks. Jonn

 

[rickdozier]

I was reading up on this thread and was wondering if the gold content was what was expected.

 

[offtrailhiker]

Here is an online calculator for figuring total Au weight of sheet or wire, it works for plating so long as you know how many micro inches the plating is.

http://www.saltlakemetals.com/SWCalcAu.htm

There are also calculators for Ag, Pd, Pt and Rh

Scott

Unfortunately, the page is no longer available.

 

[offtrailhiker]

Maybe it's me,but that sounds like a huge number for cat5 connectors.Can you post a picture of the label that states "50 micron gold plate thickness"?Can you also give us the manufacturers name?

The 50 micron is real. The math is getting a little wierd.

 

[offtrailhiker]

For your item:

0.3175 cm x 0.3175 cm x 0.005cm = 0.00050403125 cc

19.3g/cc x 0.00050403125 cc = 0.00972780313 g =~ 0.0097 grams each

100 x 0.0097 g = 0.97 grams per 50 double sided items.

16/50 = 0.32

0.32 x 0.97 = 0.3104 g per cable

At todays spot each gram is :
$1593.60 / 31.1 = $51.24

$51.24 per gram x 0.3104 grams = Estimated value is $15.90 worth of Au in the cable ends at today spot.

Perhaps all sides of the item are not plated the same thickness? Perhaps only the contacting edges are plated at 50 microns?

Steve

Yes. It is only the contacting edge. Too bad no one that actually processed a kg of the connectors chimed in. I haven't, btw. It's likely around 1-2g/kg according to a source or two. I was snooping around to get confirmation.
This thread is so much fun!

 

[offtrailhiker]

I was reading up on this thread and was wondering if the gold content was what was expected.

Yeah that would be nice to know wouldn't it?

 

[niks neims]

I tried once to process Rj45 male connectors/plugs

what I did was: with utility shears (?) cut off the end-part of each plastic connector just where gold plated plates are, I prepared about 5 kg of cut of ends like that (I think it took a couple of thousand individual connectors & countless hours), and processed in AP, i think i got about 1g of gold,

conclusion - it is not worth the work to cut them off cables;

 

[offtrailhiker]

I tried once to process Rj45 male connectors/plugs

what I did was: with utility shears (?) cut off the end-part of each plastic connector just where gold plated plates are, I prepared about 5 kg of cut of ends like that (I think it took a couple of thousand individual connectors & countless hours), and processed in AP, i think i got about 1g of gold,

conclusion - it is not worth the work to cut them off cables;

Thank you for that.