michaelhorning5
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Alright two batches going 2 pt hcl 1 pt h202 how long for base.metals to fully.dissolve and.will this mixture lose the ability.to dissolve base metals if its already dissolved so.much??
hcl h202 method ?'s first time refining
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jimdoc
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michaelhorning5 said:
Why did you start without knowing the next steps?
Jim
michaelhorning5
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I know the next steps just not the details of.this step like whether ill need to make more solution im dissolvin about 500g of total mayerial in about 700-800 ml of solution and how long the dissolving takes
jimdoc
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michaelhorning5 said:
What material?
You need patience with this process it could take weeks.
Jim
michaelhorning5
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Cpu. Pins, clad bars, some. 10-14k jewelry scrap i tested it and the other batch has a lower than 10 k gold i think its electroplated jewelry and some gold.plated coins
michaelhorning5
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Quite a bit of copper maybe some tin but i was wondering if the acid will lose its "punch" ya know
jimdoc
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michaelhorning5 said:
You need to put all that away in a safe place, and do more studying. You are just making a mess at this point. You should not mix material, there are different methods for each type of material.
Jim
michaelhorning5
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Its all in the solution already
michaelhorning5
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The solution wont dissolve the base metals if i leave them i know not to heat it because the gold.will dissolve
jimdoc
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michaelhorning5 said:
Put it in a safe spot and study. You can take out the 10-14K scrap because that won't work. Just separate all the solids from the liquid and put them in a safe place. There is no finish to what you started at this point. You need more studying here on the forum. Where did you get your instructions up to this point?
Jim
michaelhorning5
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Did a little research on.google i broke.apart the 10 and 14 k they were plated sorry didn't. Mention that so the acid could get to.the middle but it seems to be working ik that the gold wont get dissolved but will.precip as black powder because of the copper.in the solution
jimdoc
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michaelhorning5 said:
As long as your having fun. You aren't doing this in your kitchen are you?
Jim
michaelhorning5
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No of course not already had a little bad run in with nitric not enough.ventilation caught some fumes and got a.lil woozy but the h202/hcl will dissolve the base metals correct no solid gold just plated stuff i think a cpl pins were solid gold theyre just sitting at the bottom.shining also the whole.solution of one container turned black is this.because of the copper bats
michaelhorning5.
The advice to put this up and study was excellent advice, as at this point you are making more of a mess than you are going to do any good, you have enough base metals in solution to replace base metals in solution, have you studied how to deal with waste? You are lucky if that nitric indecent did not damage your lungs, trouble is with some of these chemicals you may not know how much damage your doing to your body for some time years later, if not how will you keep from poisoning yourself or others around you? The copper chloride leach you are using is a fairly easy method to use, but even the easy processes must be understood, study the forum and Laser Steve's web site, he has an document that will help to explain it, also do a study on Google and read about the reactivity series of metals study how that works, also do a study on displacement chemical reactions, these will give you a better understanding of what you are seeing now, your solution at this point may not be a copper chloride leach (what some call acid peroxide) at this point your solution could be zinc chloride for all I know, as the metals higher in the reactivity series will replace the copper from solution.
I suggest also you read Hokes book before you decide to process anything this book and the safety thread and dealing with waste should be understood before you even think about using acids, otherwise in my opinion someone trying this without understanding might as well just throw gold in the trash, because without the basic understanding that is all they will do anyway, and if they just threw their gold in the trash to begin with it would be safer for all of us.
Once you read Hokes book go back and do the getting acquainted experiments in the book, these give you and understanding of how things work, after that I suggest starting on a very simple material, like close cut memory fingers, these will also help to teach you the basics, and with only copper and gold the material will not introduce many of the problems other metals do, with this material you will practice what you are learning, you will have to study several processes to get your gold button melted from these, but it will give you some experience, for the more complicated processes.
Normally the copper chloride leach can be reconditioned and you can keep dissolving more copper, but the material you have now your solution, if it is what I think it is, is no longer copper chloride, but most likely some other very reactive metal chloride solution.
You need to understand this is not just something you read a little and will know how to do, it takes an awful lot of study and understanding, all of this is not simple, their are many principles you will need to learn before you begin, and even after you have been doing it for years you will still have an awful lot of studying to do, you will never learn it all, but if you do not begin learning before you begin processing you will just be wasting a lot of gold, and it will actually take you longer to learn, that is if you do not kill yourself first with some chemical reaction or some deadly gas you had no idea you created.
So put up your solution as was suggested and begin doing this the right way, or decide to throw away your gold, it is about as simple as that, this stuff is not as simple as you think it is, or as simple as it sounds, when you just read about it.
This is about the best advice I can give you at this point to help you begin to learn to recover and refine precious metals, I would hate to see you wasting your time, your values, and possibly hurt yourself or others.
I say welcome to the forum, and go back and start at the beginning; you will actually be closer to the goal by doing it right from the beginning, not by jumping in before you understand anything about what you are getting yourself into (which at this point is just troubles).
The advice to put this up and study was excellent advice, as at this point you are making more of a mess than you are going to do any good, you have enough base metals in solution to replace base metals in solution, have you studied how to deal with waste? You are lucky if that nitric indecent did not damage your lungs, trouble is with some of these chemicals you may not know how much damage your doing to your body for some time years later, if not how will you keep from poisoning yourself or others around you? The copper chloride leach you are using is a fairly easy method to use, but even the easy processes must be understood, study the forum and Laser Steve's web site, he has an document that will help to explain it, also do a study on Google and read about the reactivity series of metals study how that works, also do a study on displacement chemical reactions, these will give you a better understanding of what you are seeing now, your solution at this point may not be a copper chloride leach (what some call acid peroxide) at this point your solution could be zinc chloride for all I know, as the metals higher in the reactivity series will replace the copper from solution.
I suggest also you read Hokes book before you decide to process anything this book and the safety thread and dealing with waste should be understood before you even think about using acids, otherwise in my opinion someone trying this without understanding might as well just throw gold in the trash, because without the basic understanding that is all they will do anyway, and if they just threw their gold in the trash to begin with it would be safer for all of us.
Once you read Hokes book go back and do the getting acquainted experiments in the book, these give you and understanding of how things work, after that I suggest starting on a very simple material, like close cut memory fingers, these will also help to teach you the basics, and with only copper and gold the material will not introduce many of the problems other metals do, with this material you will practice what you are learning, you will have to study several processes to get your gold button melted from these, but it will give you some experience, for the more complicated processes.
Normally the copper chloride leach can be reconditioned and you can keep dissolving more copper, but the material you have now your solution, if it is what I think it is, is no longer copper chloride, but most likely some other very reactive metal chloride solution.
You need to understand this is not just something you read a little and will know how to do, it takes an awful lot of study and understanding, all of this is not simple, their are many principles you will need to learn before you begin, and even after you have been doing it for years you will still have an awful lot of studying to do, you will never learn it all, but if you do not begin learning before you begin processing you will just be wasting a lot of gold, and it will actually take you longer to learn, that is if you do not kill yourself first with some chemical reaction or some deadly gas you had no idea you created.
So put up your solution as was suggested and begin doing this the right way, or decide to throw away your gold, it is about as simple as that, this stuff is not as simple as you think it is, or as simple as it sounds, when you just read about it.
This is about the best advice I can give you at this point to help you begin to learn to recover and refine precious metals, I would hate to see you wasting your time, your values, and possibly hurt yourself or others.
I say welcome to the forum, and go back and start at the beginning; you will actually be closer to the goal by doing it right from the beginning, not by jumping in before you understand anything about what you are getting yourself into (which at this point is just troubles).
michaelhorning5
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Base metal replacing the base metal like a metal biproduct that resulted from the base metal reacting with the copper or.other metals that.may be there correct?
study what I suggested reactivity series of metals, and displacement chemical reactions.
Butcher, wise words.
The problem with nitric acid, and other chemicals is they can kill you and others,or damage your lungs that may not be aware of till later.
Although I am new to this forum, I am not new to chemistry and these reactions can be extremely dangerous if you are not aware.
From my limited view, the info is good, but cannot cover nor discuss every possibility and it does not take a huge leap to imagine problems from some unknown substance that may get into the reaction. More so with a large batch.
Learn, patience, God bless, ejd
The problem with nitric acid, and other chemicals is they can kill you and others,or damage your lungs that may not be aware of till later.
Although I am new to this forum, I am not new to chemistry and these reactions can be extremely dangerous if you are not aware.
From my limited view, the info is good, but cannot cover nor discuss every possibility and it does not take a huge leap to imagine problems from some unknown substance that may get into the reaction. More so with a large batch.
Learn, patience, God bless, ejd
