Ishor a good refining system...

[Anonymous]

Hi.
I am very new to this forum, but so far it has been a great help.
My plan is to begin purchasing scrap gold jewelry from various places in small to medium amounts. Originally, i wanted to just on sell this jewelry to a refiner, however now i am dabbling with the possibility of refining it myself. Despite what some of the older members of this thread say, (and i have read a lot of their comments), the Shor Simplicity system is a very alluring product. Because i am in Australia, however, i am a little uncertain in regards to the P and H costs associated with buying the chemicals from Shor (can anyone recommend a solution for this.).
The reason i made this thread, however, was to ask a few questions about refining.

I came across this person's post on another website, and it has got me thinking: Costs aside, is the Shor refining system the hands down winner?

I use to work in a metallurgical lab and refined gold from gold nickel/palladium alloys all of the time, however it required a fume hood due to the profuse outgassing of nitric oxide - which can drop you on the spot - however the process was quick and simple. dissolve the alloy in a solution of concentrated nitric/hydrochloric acid aka aqua regia. once dissolved i simply added fine copper powder until the gold precipitated out (the copper displaced the gold, however did not displace the nickel or palladium due to its location on the galvanic/potential chart) the gold will precipitate out as a brown mud, then the acid will continue to dissolve the copper for quite a long time after you see the bulk of the gold precipitate out so you dont have to worry about copper dropping to the bottom of the mix. pore off the bulk of the concentrated acid and dilute with water allowing the precipitate to resettle each time. Pore off again and repeat until the water is clear. allow the precip to dry. if you like to experiment, place the resultant powder in a microwave and watch the powder pop and sputter fusing into extremely fine gold nuggets. its fun!

Firstly, is this a valid method that people use to refine gold?
-i know i will probably get told to read Hoke's book (which i have in parts), and use the 'search' tool (which i have also done), but i want to make sure that this method is applicable to Karat Jewelry.

and lastly, i have a series of questions about the shor system which i sent to a seller. I will paste them below, and hope that you guys will have a go at answering them.

Hello.
I am looking to get started in gold refining and i
would really appreciate it if you could answer a
few questions about your product.
1.) Does this product work with scrap Karat gold
jewelry.ie. a 4gm solid gold ring.
2.) Is there a minimum or maximum Karat gold that
this device can refine?
3.) Is this machine capable of refining mixed lots
of Karat gold. ie 5g of 14k and 6g of 22k? if so,
what changed need to be made to account for the
mixed gold content?
3.) with the supplies included with this machine,
approximately how many grams of gold can be
refined (please specify which Karat)?
4.) is it more efficient to refine small or large
amounts in this machine at a time, and what is
considered the idea amount to refine?
5.)There are far cheaper ways of refining gold
without this device, so what makes it so special
and worth the 800-1000 that it would cost to set
up?
lastly, could you please run through the process
of refining Karat gold jewelry, step by step?
Jake

and before i say goodbye, has anyone got a copy of the (or a) Shor simplicity video that they can somehow send me?

thanks for your help.
Jake.

 

[Harold_V]

Despite what some of the older members of this thread say, (and i have read a lot of their comments), the Shor Simplicity system is a very alluring product.
<snip>
I came across this person's post on another website, and it has got me thinking: Costs aside, is the Shor refining system the hands down winner?

A "hands down" winner is the guy that understands how to refine and does not rely on gadgets to accomplish the task.

If you are hell bent on trying the Shor system, you won't be happy until you have. Perhaps then you might realize that we "older members" are looking out for your best interests.

I wish you good fortune.

Harold

 

[qst42know]

The first method is just wrong. Dropping with copper will leave nickel in solution but palladium will come down with the gold.

The Shor system may work for some situations however when it doesnt you won't get any help from them. The system is costly and so are their mystery chemicals. In the end you won't know anything more about refining as when you started or how to recover from minor problems that will crop up.

Hang on to your wallet and spend some time here learning. You will not find a more helpful knowledgeable group of chemists, professional refiners, or advanced hobbyists anywhere. Many methods are discussed and myths debunked and problems solved. If you put in the time to educate yourself you will gain an understanding of what needs done, how, and why.

Most all chemicals and equipment you will need can be found locally and at a fraction of the cost.

 

[Anonymous]

Thank you both for your prompt replies.
42, is there any particular method that you would recommend for what i want to do (specified above)?
if i have a name for the method, then i can research it in detail and get a bit of background knowledge on the subject.

and Harold, thank you also for your reply. I would have to agree with what you said. I am not 'hell bent' on anything, but was merely considering all of my possibilities. I will take your advise on board.

 

[lazersteve]

Karat scrap should be alloyed down to 6 Kt then the base metals are removed with 35% nitric acid.

I have posted a video of this process on my website in the Gold videos section.

The resulting gold sponge is treated with AR to refine the gold.

Steve

 

[Gold Trail]

just a few months ago i was a newbie here my self. i make a ton of mistakes. i finally, through this forum, and lazersteves website, made sense of this all

HOWEVER, last week, i finally down loaded Hoke's book from the book section on this site.

I even printed the ENTIRE book out

I am over half way through reading this book. If I would have gotten this book, say 6 months ago, i would have a LOT more gold than i do now, becuase i would have screwed so many things up.

Point is, Get the book, READ the book, That is THE BEST DAMN book i've read in a while ( I hate reading, BTW)

and, like Harold V ( I think) said, a baboon could refine gold after reading hoke's book

Ryan

PS, Harold, Steve. GSP and others: there honestly was one point where i thought i would puke if i heard any of you mention that book again to a newbie who managed to mess something up, ect.

I regret not getting it sooner.........

 

[jimdoc]

I say you can never have enough books. Especially when they are about a subject like precious metals, the chemistry involved, safety,
etc...... It can teach you a great hobby, or a great way to make money. I think this forum is worth more than any of my books or ebooks. But I must say if you were only gonna read one, then Hoke's should be the one.
Jim

 

[Harold_V]

just a few months ago i was a newbie here my self. i make a ton of mistakes. i finally, through this forum, and lazersteves website, made sense of this all

HOWEVER, last week, i finally down loaded Hoke's book from the book section on this site.

I even printed the ENTIRE book out

I am over half way through reading this book. If I would have gotten this book, say 6 months ago, i would have a LOT more gold than i do now, becuase i would have screwed so many things up.

Point is, Get the book, READ the book, That is THE BEST DAMN book i've read in a while ( I hate reading, BTW)

and, like Harold V ( I think) said, a baboon could refine gold after reading hoke's book

Ryan

PS, Harold, Steve. GSP and others: there honestly was one point where i thought i would puke if i heard any of you mention that book again to a newbie who managed to mess something up, ect.

I regret not getting it sooner.........

Is this where I'm supposed to say "I told you so"? 8)

It's hard to have readers understand the significance of reading Hoke. It actually doesn't teach you how to refine e scrap-------but once you understand what the book teaches, you can refine pretty much anything you encounter.

Harold

 

[Gold Trail]

Is this where I'm supposed to say "I told you so"? 8)

It's hard to have readers understand the significance of reading Hoke. It actually doesn't teach you how to refine e scrap-------but once you understand what the book teaches, you can refine pretty much anything you encounter.

Harold[/quote]

What can I say I learn the hard way....

as for the e-scrap, all the methods in hoke's book are readily adaptable for any material you come across.

I have printed out many of your's (and other's) posts, and constantly reference them.

thank you and every one else for making this such an enjoyable hobby for me.

Ryan