Liquid "wood bleach" = 30% hydrogen peroxide (H2O2)

[Chumbawamba]

I'm sure this has been mentioned somewhere already, but I found today in an ACE Hardware store some Jasco Wood Bleach. This is a two part solution (in two separate bottles). Part 1 contains a solution of ~40% sodium hydroxide--not really useful for anything(?) Part 2 contains ~30% hydrogen peroxide. I paid too much for it ($25 for a gallon) but I've had trouble finding any high concentrate H2O2. I've tried all the suggestions I've read on the forum, including beauty supply and pool supply stores. Neither of the ones in my town have it. I was talking to a friend today and he said the beauty supply places stopped carrying it because of some yahoos on the east coast that wanted to build bombs with it and blow up some military bases. So of course the government uses this as an excuse to ban all legitimate uses as well. Thanks.

The bottle I found was Jasco Wood Bleaching Solution #2. Solution #1 was there as well, but I wasn't interested in dilute NaOH (I found a pound of NaOH "drain cleaner" granules at Lowes for $13). I found an MSDS online. It apparently now goes by the name Klean-Strip Wood Bleach A & B.

http://www.wmbarr.com/product.aspx?catid=72&prodid=151

B is the H2O2 bottle. Here's the MSDS (linked to from the above):

http://www.wmbarr.com/ProductFiles/WB19B.pdf

"25-30%" H2O2 in a "95-100%" H2O2 solution (i.e. ~30%).

The bottle I got was old and dusty, and it seemed like the only one left. The ACE where I bought it was a blast from the past. It was a tiny little hardware store in an old building with products crammed from floor to ceiling. It was run by this nice old Asian lady.

I'll check around at larger chains to see if they have the Klean-Strip product. I imagine it'll be in the paint department. Solution B (or #2) is what you want.

 

[Anonymous]

25 bucks for a gallons of 30 percents, thats real good, considering a 1 pint bottle of 3 percent cost about .75.
so you could get 30 gallons if diluted to 3 percent, 8 pints per gallon = 180.00 bucks buying it at the store.

Jim

 

[AKDan]

I paid 120.00 for 5gal/50% in Anchorage Alaska. With the markup that you usually have to pay there for shipping it is hard to believe that it can't be had for 2/3 that price here in the lower 48.

 

[tlcarrig]

If you will Google Baquacil, you will find many pool supply places that sell it on the internet. Some even have free shipping for certain sized orders. It usually runs in the neighborhood of $20/gal. There is a Baquacil "Ultra" shock but I havent checked to see what's in it.

 

[LeftyTheBandit]

Baquacil is stated as being 27% stabilized H2O2. Does this mean it has additives to make it act differently?

 

[Chumbawamba]

Hi Terry.

After another google search I realized that there were many pool supply businesses in my area. I just didn't look far enough.

I went to one of those places yesterday and found Baquacil. I paid $17.99/gal (I got two gallons).

The information on the product says it has "27% Hydrogen Peroxide" and "Water", without mention of anything else, so I imagine it is 27% H2O2.

Be sure to read the labeling as there are apparently other forms of "Baquacil" on the market, at least according to a 1993 MSDS I found for the product, which had a completely different composition. I just requested an MSDS for the H2O2 Baquacil (and chided the company for not having them available on their website) so I'll report if anything comes back worthy of reporting.

 

[erogers36]

I have found 35% H2O2 at the Nature health food store.
it is food grade at a cost of 16.99 for 32oz.

Oxy - tech by Eagle Enterprise

 

[Irons]

Hi Terry.

After another google search I realized that there were many pool supply businesses in my area. I just didn't look far enough.

I went to one of those places yesterday and found Baquacil. I paid $17.99/gal (I got two gallons).

The information on the product says it has "27% Hydrogen Peroxide" and "Water", without mention of anything else, so I imagine it is 27% H2O2.

Be sure to read the labeling as there are apparently other forms of "Baquacil" on the market, at least according to a 1993 MSDS I found for the product, which had a completely different composition. I just requested an MSDS for the H2O2 Baquacil (and chided the company for not having them available on their website) so I'll report if anything comes back worthy of reporting.

The 27% Baquacil works well. I still have some left from a case I bought a couple of years ago and it's still potent. Whatever the stabilizer they use, it works very well.

 

[Lou]

The stabiliser is likely phosphoric acid.


Lou

 

[JohnW]

This stuff mixed with NaOH is pretty good to reduce AgCl to Silver. The best thing is that the waste produced is water and table salt.

 

[Oz]

Why are you adding H2O2 when converting silver chloride to silver oxide? I just use NaOH and it is always satisfactory.

If it is because you are worried about waste disposal of a strong base solution after your reaction, just add HCl to the waste solution until a neutral pH (cheaper than strong H2O2) and you will have your sodium chloride and water.

 

[JohnW]

To get clean Silver metal, and no hazardous waste.

 

[Oz]

John,

Are you saying that by adding H2O2 to silver chloride and NaOH you are getting silver metal instead of silver oxide? I am not a chemist but I guess perhaps with hydrogen being a reductant it is possible. I also find it odd that you are neutralizing NaOH with H2O2 as it is also considered a base. It would be nice if one of our chemists could weigh in on these.

Assuming you are getting metallic silver and you are neutralizing your NaOH for the moment, I think you will find that HCl is cheaper than H2O2 and will definitely give you sodium chloride (salt water) when you neutralize NaOH with it. The silver oxide that is produced by reduction in NaOH can be further reduced safely on a hotplate as it decomposes at 280C (586F) to elemental silver, or you could reduce it by the Karo Syrup method.

 

[JohnW]

Hi OZ.

Please check attached document where several processes are described and one is selected, by none other than Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory. Many more details are in the paper, and maybe other processes are more suitable to other people depending on conditions, materials at hand, etc.

 

[Oz]

Well thanks for putting that document up for us, any day one learns something new is a good day. Now to satisfy my curiosity I will have to try it.

I still think that the HCl will prove cheaper than H2O2 in order to give a safe waste product. I understand that they were trying to keep the the sodium chloride waste result down as they were considering it a hazardous waste in their application. However there are many safe applications to consume sodium chloride in an environmentally sound manner that are already in practice in the Northeast such as melting snow and ice. None the less I will try it when it is convenient just to have another option.

Thank you

 

[tlcarrig]

Chumbawamba, what brand of NaOH drain cleaner did you find at Lowe's that does NOT have Al chips in it? Most in grocery stores have Al chips in them and NaOH is so hygroscopic that I can't pick them out before the NaOH turns to liquid.

 

[AKDan]

Rooto has no aluminum chips.

 

[Platinum]

Did you finally get moved to G.A. Terry ?

 

[Oz]

I know Rooto sells a 98% sulfuric drain cleaner, do they also distribute NaOH?

 

[AKDan]

Yes, Ace Hardware sells it in 1lb containers. Looking at the container I don't see any part number or other identifier on the label to help with tracking it down though. It is simply labeled 100% lye.