New Refiner Looking for buyer.

[Oz]

All very valid points 4metals!

My first impression, given what was said “I'm currently brokering gold, silver and have been for a few years. I did over 12 mill last year and I'm ready to start refining my own metals” was that he just brokered transactions and wished to start buying for himself and refining. Many brokers never spend a dime on material, they just hook a seller up with a buyer and get a percentage as their fee. Many brokers are happy with 1 half of 1% as their fee (depending on the size of the transaction) which would only be $60,000.00 in this case for a years transactions.

Brokering for a while and seeing the money left on the table could be very good incentive to wish to learn refining if that is indeed his background. After all, a broker has the hardest parts down pat as to being a successful refiner, a steady supply of gold at fair prices, and the assay verification process.

 

[Anonymous]

From my observations in the past two plus years I've been a member of GRF, new noobs joining GRF that include his/her email address is usually sincere about staying awhile.

There is no email or any other information on his profile.Only the plain GRF link to send him an eamil through the forum.And his username gives no reference to his company name or his.He was just a trolling through looking for someone to hand feed him free information.We have all seen it thousands of times.Look at how many registered members we have......over 16,118. But 15,395 of those members have 0-9 posts.That means that out of 16,118 members,only 723 have 10 or more posts.This guy was no different than the rest.They come,they ask,we answer,they leave.Thats it.No contributions to speak of,and you can tell this was going to be the same situation,by the "shortness" of his first post.He got right to the point.....fast.

There are professional refiners on the forum who could have done business with this guy, no-one would toss away the potential to process 10 kilo's of scrap a week. But now they won't get the chance to service his account.

He wasn't asking for someone to help him refine,he was asking for someone to tell him where to take his finished product.If he honestly did 12 million dollars last year,he will NOT need any help refining.He can afford the best refining setup on the market.

 

[4metals]

Mic, you're missing the point. There are questions that few members ask because they are not in a position to have to ask. This guy is in a position where his questions had the potential of being different. I wouldn't say that he has gotten the best advice thus far. If he would have he wouldn't be looking to refine himself.

If you refine your own gold you have to sell it to buy more. Today there aren't jewelry manufacturers all over the country as there once were, you have to sell to the majors. The best rate he will get from the majors is maybe 99.5 accountability so he will be discounted 1/2% or $7.00 per ounce. His refining equipment will cost him, he'll have operating expenses, at best his cost to refine will be a half percent as well. (because his quantity is relatively small) So all in he's at 1% plus he will have to wait for his settlement for 5 business days for the refiner to do an assay. The majors will gladly advance you the money for 5% per annum interest which you are paying on the gold they are holding.

If he went to a collector in a big city, he would receive the same 1% rate and walk out with an advance, interest free, for 90% of the value with settlement in 1 week. All without any acid, waste, equipment or worries. Sure there are other things he has to know, like how to know where to get a good fire assay or how to know if the sample was any good but these are questions that are not often asked and represent a different part of the business. An opportunity for all to learn something.

It's discussions like these that expand peoples horizons in this field, these are the inquiries we want to encourage. Sometimes you have to read a new members first question and not react to what he has asked but you have to imagine where can a member in his position take the forum with future questions.

And that's the Hundred Trillion Dollar question.

 

[sggb]

Wow. When I found this site one hour before I posted this thread I thought by what I had read everyone here really wanted to help each other. Now I only posted my volume cause I did not want to be taken as a joke (that didn't work out). I do not know everything about this bussiness and I would like to learn more so for those of you that got offened because I do more volume than you sorry put your big boy pants on and work harder. And for the ones that really want to help others thank you. I will be looking else where for advise andit is ashme cause maybe I could have helped some of you become better.

 

[seawolf]

I hope you will stay around and maybe pass some of your knowledge on to others. You say you broker sales and I think many missed the point that brokers fees on X number of dollars is not the same as selling X number of dollars of any product. Refining can be rewarding even if it's just for the learning process. I for one don't make a lot of money and I don't care how much anyone else makes. If I need more I pull up my boot straps and go after it. Again welcome to GRF read and read more, when you are ready start small and work up. Be safe, work safe.
Mark

 

[Oz]

Sggb,
I can understand that you may have been irked by some of the replies if you are as represented by your post. You should have also noticed that 2 moderators stood up and said “let’s hear more”.

However “big boy pants” comments or saying it is a shame you are leaving because you could have helped some here to become better, kinda puts you in the category of those you just criticized. Biting the hand that may feed you if I may say so myself.

Most of us have heard from people in South Africa as an example. As a broker I am sure you roll your eyes when you hear the location, but last I checked South Africa mines a fair bit of gold that is sold. To some members here a first post talking about 12mil reads just like South Africa. You as well as many of us have heard it a hundred times or more.

None of us should let preconceptions preclude the possibility that someone is being genuine until they prove by their own words they are just talking game. There are hobbyist and backyard refiners here that have been burned by big talkers, however there are members here that see your annual volume in a day.

If you are genuine in what you do, you will find great value here because some of our very experienced members have spent a lifetime in this field. For that same reason the membership here should be comfortable with the fact that those same experienced members will cry foul if they see something amiss.

Let’s all just talk a bit and get to know each other and in due time things will fall in line.

Dang people get excitable over so little of late.

 

[Anonymous]

SGGB,
Considering I am the one that was probably the most offended,I should be the one to apologize.I was upset with how you wrote the last question,but I am sure I misunderstood the context in which you wrote it.Since you want to learn to refine,you NEED to stay here and let us help you.......or let them help you if you don't want me to help.I understand if you don't.
I have thought deeply about the situation and this entire thread almost all night,and I believe I may have over reacted.It is MOST important that you stay with us(which I am sure you will do),but it is almost as important to me,that you forgive me for being so rude and judgemental.I should have gotten to know you first.
I am honestly sorry.
Now with that being said,there are a lot of members that can assist you with that kind of volume,and help you get set up to run on your own.There are some very good profits to be made,if you can cut out a middleman somewhere.
I have to go but.......................... Welcome to the forum!(the correct way)

 

[Ocean]

SGGB,
Considering I am the one that was probably the most offended,I should be the one to apologize.I was upset with how you wrote the last question,but I am sure I misunderstood the context in which you wrote it.Since you want to learn to refine,you NEED to stay here and let us help you.......or let them help you if you don't want me to help.I understand if you don't.
I have thought deeply about the situation and this entire thread almost all night,and I believe I may have over reacted.It is MOST important that you stay with us(which I am sure you will do),but it is almost as important to me,that you forgive me for being so rude and judgemental.I should have gotten to know you first.
I am honestly sorry.
Now with that being said,there are a lot of members that can assist you with that kind of volume,and help you get set up to run on your own.There are some very good profits to be made,if you can cut out a middleman somewhere.
I have to go but.......................... Welcome to the forum!(the correct way)

Good man, right thing to do there.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks Jack that means a lot,but you know I have to say,if weren't for the moderators,I would not be as humble as I am today(even though I still have a ways to go).I owe them a great deal of thanks for helping mold me into a better person.
One moderator in particular,has put up with more crap from me(years ago) than any other member,he is now one of my (adopted) dads,and we talk frequently.
Another moderator,that lives close to me,is one of the calmest persons I know,and spent countless months teaching me when the forum first opened.
I grew up without a father figure in my life,and 2 mods,and 2 members,have taken that role on very well.I appreciate all of them very much,not only for their work on the forum.......but their work on me.
Ok I am getting too emotional for the forum......gotta head back to the lab.

 

[jeneje]

Being new here, I must say, it is sometimes easy to lose sight of what we as a group are doing. That is refining! Correct me if i am wrong, but as a broker of any goods or services - the broker is a middle person putting buyer and seller together and making a small profit as a fee.

As for the smart remarks - I think they should be left at the keybroad.
Just my opinion.

Ken

 

[patnor1011]

Hope that I did not offended anyone. In my first post I just asked for more info and in second I reacted on another member talking about japanese currency. I offer one of my Zimbabwean notes to sggb as a gift. PM me if you are interested.

 

[acpeacemaker]

Hey, I would like to apologize for some of my sarcasim. I didn't mean any harm by it so please take it as a grain of salt. However, I came I across your post the way you didn't intend on it being and I think that's my fault. I do pose caution to you though in this since. In your first post saying how much your doing annually is one thing. However, if starting to refine and if its at home. I would be more cautious on telling the world how much your doing by mass. People with no morals or values troll threads all the time looking for their next victim. I wasn't offended by the volume thing though. I'm a hobbyist and that's all. Painting is my true passion. This pic is a glimpse of a $10,000. painting that I'm still working on with about another month of labor left. I was taught from my father which is world renowned as well as famous. He's won three duck stamps in the past few months for a clue. Anyways, I hope you do stick around. If you read a lot on this forum. You will find out quickly it has some very intelligent, wise, and caring individuals. Take Care, Andrew

 

[jeneje]

I must say, the painting is awesome nice work

Ken 8)

 

[acpeacemaker]

I must say, the painting is awesome nice work

Ken 8)

Hey, Thank you for compliment I'm glad you like it. -Andrew

 

[HAuCl4]

12 M a year isn't what it used to be. Get your calculator out and see that's a couple of standard 400 oz bars per month... Easy to refine in a spare toilet. Cut the guy some slack... I'd like to know the details of his buying/selling operation.

It may seem like a lot of money, but it isn't a lot of metal for sure!.

 

[Barren Realms 007]

He has been on in the last couple of days. Let's hope he will open up with some information. It can be a 2 way street. We can help him and he might be nice enough to open up and share his knowledge with the forum.

 

[4metals]

Considering the way he was dumped on, if he does come back it will probably be with a different identity. Can you blame him?

 

[Barren Realms 007]

Considering the way he was dumped on, if he does come back it will probably be with a different identity. Can you blame him?

I wouldn't blame him a bit if he did.

A little patience and understanding sometimes is necessary to give some new users a chance to see how the forum operates and to get thier true point or intention across rather than going off half cocked and just blowing someone out of the water and completely offending them.

 

[Anonymous]

so for those of you that got offened because I do more volume than you sorry put your big boy pants on and work harder.

Oz,this simply confirms what I shared with you earlier,and makes me second guess the sincere apology.

andit is ashme cause maybe I could have helped some of you become better.

Like I said before.

I will be looking else where for advise

Translation= He WILL be back real soon(hopefully after he learns to spell better,and use punctuation).

As for the last 2 posts,there was no cause,and nothing to be gained, for them to have been posted.All it did was throw gas on a flame,that had all but been extinguished.Most everyone apologized for what they said,that should have been the end of it,and considering he has been on since then,he didn't go anywhere.

Harold taught me a long time ago that,when a situation has died down,the best thing anyone can do is LEAVE IT ALONE,otherwise it can take on a life of it's own and get worse.That is all you and 4metals did here.There was no reason for the last 2 posts to be posted.

I wouldn't blame him a bit if he did.

A little patience and understanding sometimes is necessary to give some new users a chance to see how the forum operates and to get thier true point or intention across rather than going off half cocked and just blowing someone out of the water and completely offending them.

Frank,this is where you and I part ways!Do not call me again.
I will make sure you recieve the remainder of what I owe you.Tell don he can just sell the memory to his regular guy.
.

 

[Barren Realms 007]

so for those of you that got offened because I do more volume than you sorry put your big boy pants on and work harder.

Oz,this simply confirms what I shared with you earlier,and makes me second guess the sincere apology.

andit is ashme cause maybe I could have helped some of you become better.

Like I said before.

I will be looking else where for advise

Translation= He WILL be back real soon(hopefully after he learns to spell better,and use punctuation).

As for the last 2 posts,there was no cause,and nothing to be gained, for them to have been posted.All it did was throw gas on a flame,that had all but been extinguished.Most everyone apologized for what they said,that should have been the end of it,and considering he has been on since then,he didn't go anywhere.

Harold taught me a long time ago that,when a situation has died down,the best thing anyone can do is LEAVE IT ALONE,otherwise it can take on a life of it's own and get worse.That is all you and 4metals did here.There was no reason for the last 2 posts to be posted.

I wouldn't blame him a bit if he did.

A little patience and understanding sometimes is necessary to give some new users a chance to see how the forum operates and to get thier true point or intention across rather than going off half cocked and just blowing someone out of the water and completely offending them.

Frank,this is where you and I part ways!Do not call me again.
I will make sure you recieve the remainder of what I owe you.Tell don he can just sell the memory to his regular guy.
.

Sorry you feel that way. It was not ment towards you directly it was just a statement in general. I have done it before as most have at one point on the forum.