Non-Chemical Newbie here.. can you take advantage of "phase changing

[toadiesop]

Mayham, I don't know why the suds form with our Liquid Lightning product. But there is A LOT of them huh? :lol: It's a really thick product compared to the ones in Steve's videos. After a few hours of use it had the look consistancy of really old motor oil.

As for disposal I'm guessing it's safe to flush since it IS drain cleaner, but maybe something else happens in the cell procedure that add something harmful to it.

After my rinse I have about 2 gallons of "grey" water that I'm just waiting to filter better on a rainy day. I'm assuming since it's grey, there is still some gold left (and base metals of course)

I got impatient and curiosity got the best of me.... I wanted "proof of concept" I guess (as the Mythbusters call it) and I filtered my cell way too early. I used it for only about 2-3 hours operating time (12-24 hours recommended I think)

I just wanted to go through the other processes (dilution, filtering, wash&weight, smelting, ect) so I just did it early (like you said, only $8 to fill the cell with acid)

I got around 1.5 grams which is about what I expected. Now I KNOW that the cell works and I CAN get the gold back. I know what to expect in all the other processes before the torch and it was just FUN!!

Knowing I had very little gold in the cell was a little easier on the nerves I think. If I knew I had almost an ounce in there, I'd have been a lot more nervous. Now I knew exactly what to expect and now I'm ready to go the distance so to speak.

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[lazersteve]

Mayhem,

The suds are form the buffers in the Liquid Lightning as previously discussed on the forum. You should add 1/8 tsp of glycerin per cup of sulfuric.

Dilution

1) Gently stir to sink all the floating black powder on the surface.

2) Let settle overnight. The liquid should be clear yellow to brown.

3) Carefully pour off the clear liquid into a separate pyrex measuring cup. Be careful not to pour off any black powder. The black powder will be at the bottom of the dish with about 1/4 cup of the liquid when you are done.

4) You should dilute this as in the tutorial. The liquid you poured off is still concentrated and can be reused.

Disposal

1) Let diluted electrolyte settle overnight and refilter out any black powder.

2) Slowly add aluminum foil or scrap iron to drop the base metals in the spent electrolyte. Add until no more base metals drop.

3) Filter and wash the dropped base metals and discard or sell if you have a buyer.

4) Neutralize the filtered electrolyte until pH=7 (neutral) with baking soda or lye.

5) Discard solution.


Smelting

You will need the following equipment to smelt:

Torch (Mapp gas at Lowes, Home Depot, Walmart, etc)
Melting dish, crucible, or cupel
Borax (20 mule team Walmart laundry isle)
Tweezers and Tongs (Channel Locks will work)
Spray Bottle
SS Bucket filled 3/4 full with tap water or Graphite/Cast Iron Mold
Welding Safety Equipment
Well ventilated area

1) Mix the gold powder in a coffee filter with equal amounts of borax as shown in the smelting video. The gold powder should not have any hard chunks or debris in it. The final color of the mix will be an even light brown to light gray.

2) This step keeps the dish from cracking. Gently heat the melting dish to expel any water trapped in the structure of the dish. The torch should be kept on a low flame and distant from the dish at first, moving closer as it heats. The dish will make a creaking noise as it heats.

3) This step keeps the gold from sticking to the dish. With the torch on medium heat, slowly heat the dish. Add a half a spoon of borax to the hot dish. It will turn into a light styrofoam. Heat this further and it will turn into clear glasslike globs. Add more borax an repeat until the bottom of the dish has a small puddle of the clear substance in it.

4) This step will allow the gold BB's to slide around the dish and merge easily. Use the tongs or pliers to tilt and rotate the dish while heating to spread the melted borax puddle around the entire inner surface of the dish. The inner surface of the dish should have a smooth shiny appearance form the layer of borax.

5) Let the dish cool. The borax will crack like a spider web as it cools.

6) Add the gold/borax powder to the COLD dish. Wet with a few squirts of water from the spray bottle. DON'T saturate the gold/borax, just wet it enough to keep the mass together.

7) Put the steel bucket near the heating area. You will quench your gold button with this. If you have a mold you can prepare it for the gold at this stage instead.

8) Heat the dish slowly as before bringing it up to temperature. Start from the lower outside of the dish and work around the outside of the dish from distance at first. As the dish comes up to temperature work your way closer and over the top lip of the dish. Begin heating the gold/borax mix. It will expand as the borax turns into the styrofoam substance. Control the foaming with the force of the torch or your gold will float away in the breeze of the torch! Work around the dish in a circular motion as seen in my Avatar animation. When the borax becomes molten the gold will begin to prill (make BB's) which eventually form a button in the bottom of the dish. Work the prills into the bottom of the dish with the force of the torch.

9) Continue the circular motion around the dish until the entire gold button has pulled away from the edges of the dish and flows freely with the force of the torch (see Avatar animation again).

10a) If pouring into a mold, preheat it with the torch for a short time and the carefully pour the molten gold in.

10b) If making a button turn off the torch. Let the button cool for 5-10 seconds. The button should still be red hot, but not molten. Grab the button with the tweezers and drop it into the steel bucket of water. The button should hold it's shape and not distort when grabbed if properly cooled. It will sizzle and quickly cool.

I hope this helps. Some others on the forum may have some additional tips.

Steve

 

[toadiesop]

Steve, I'm a little confused. Are you talking about a cell?

The part about dropping out base metals with foil??

 

[lazersteve]

Yes,

To drop the poisonous base metals out of the used electrolyte before discarding.

Steve

 

[toadiesop]

okay, thanks.

 

[AuMINIMayhem]

Steve.. you are the man!

Toadiesoap (spelling?).. HA HA!! everything you did is exactly as I encountered (includinbg the impatient "proof of concept") leave it to us impatient engineers to not want to wait for a result.. the only difference is I kept diluting it down and down wound up with about 5 gallons of "purple koolaid" to filter..LOL! My coffee filters (8 of the like the tutorial said) are VERY black (and purple) but alas very little mud in the bottom of them. Im wondering if I can stuff the dried out coffee filters in my crucible and throw them in the kiln (wet them down with some isopropyl or something to keep the ash from flying until the filters are burned off) I figure at 2000f there won't be a whole lot of ash left from the filters. yeah it''s going to be a bit contaminated, but hell it was a first try anyways... many lessons learned, you guys are an amazing resource!

I hope I get a chance to meet you all at some point in the future. (Anyone ever thought of planning a vacation/gathering somewhere where we could have some "so and tell" and/or "shop talk" time ?... just a thought)

TTYL,
Derek