Old Prospector Makes Good

[AlaskaLes]

Thanks.
I appreciate the effort.

 

[Nountaineer]

I am out of time to post more today

I will answer your question about fine chopped copper tomorrow - the question about slags may or not be tomorrow but will get answered at some point in this thread

For right now the answers I really need from you are the answers to the 2 questions I asked here ------------


Kurt

It contains platinum group metal besides platinum, possibly, rhodium .It has a bunch of black platinum crystals in the concentrate after removing the magnetite. The gold is disseminated throughout the ore apparently and is not visible @9.37 oz)ton. The super high grade can not be panned without throwing metal out of the pan.

 

[billgold]

You need to answer his other question as well: What flux mixture did you use, including quantities of each flux component? What was the flux percentage compared to the ore percentage?

I have also not seen any indication at all about the temperature you obtained, except that the melt was too thick to properly stir. That implies that your furnace temperature was inadequate.

 

[Nountaineer]

I posted the flux recipe but now need to find it again. It was a couple days ago. One part flour, 10 parts borax, 20 parts silica, 30 parts washing soda. 2 to one ratio. The temperature is the problem. It was light yellow. Bought a 2700+ infrared thermometer but not gotten that far yet

 

[Nountaineer]

You need to answer his other question as well: What flux mixture did you use, including quantities of each flux component? What was the flux percentage compared to the ore percentage?

I have also not seen any indication at all about the temperature you obtained, except that the melt was too thick to properly stir. That implies that your furnace temperature was inadequate.

 

[Nountaineer]

I am out of time to post more today

I will answer your question about fine chopped copper tomorrow - the question about slags may or not be tomorrow but will get answered at some point in this thread

For right now the answers I really need from you are the answers to the 2 questions I asked here ------------


Kurt

Why is it that I keep answering the question and it is not getting posted?

 

[Yggdrasil]

Why is it that I keep answering the question and it is not getting posted?

Kurtak has been granted a small vacation. He will soon be back I hope.

 

[Nountaineer]

Nountaineer - how big is your furnace (what size crucible will fit in it)

Please provide some pictures of your furnace - include close up pics of the burner that fires the furnace

Also (because you are talking PGMs) the furnace does not necessarily need to get hot enough to melt PGMs

When smelting there are things that can be done to lower the melting temp of the PGMs

Kurt

The propane furnace is 10 kg in size. It is Chinese cheap but useable. I have not mastered the drag and drop feature for photos here so can't do it. It has a regulator gauge red line of 20 psi. I have tried firing at about 11 psi and 15 psi with varied air shutter adjustment. I will fire it again when I have more time.

 

[scrappyjoe]

sketchy info at best

after just spending over an hour reading and digesting this , that quote summed it up best .
no straightforeward answers are ever coming ... only more questions .

is this multimillion dollar operation all hinging on the purchase of a $1000 pickup to get some ore to utah ?

doesn't his 85 year old buddy have a 1000 bucks from the 3 months of bulldozing he just finished ?

oh... he was doing that as a volunteer ?

so everyone is illegally placer mining , yet bedridden at the same time ?

where is the "big corporation" in all of this ?

" Sure Joe ! just go ahead and help yourself to whatever , we don't mind that you don't have any credentials or any insurance or anything like that .... we don't care if you get injured on our property and sue us for millions .... we're just really nice guys "

the world needs more nice guys like these

if you can't afford the truck ... you sure as heck can't afford the liabilty insurance ...

as a general contractor some property management companies wouldn't let me change a doorknob without showing them 2 million in liability insurance, and that was 20 years ago.

i just a guy that joined this forum to learn a little about this hobby and hopefully start playing with some gold filled scrap and silver once i collect enough.

i feel i've already gained enough form this site in the past few months to warrant buying a sponsorship.

since then i am fascinated by the number of people that show up , whether from china, kenya , uganada, nevada wherever , with wild unsubstantiated claims of gazillions of dollars in gold .... the stories get better and better ... and the amount of time devoted to them ... i'm guilty as well for reading till the end.

its like watching a trainwreck.

i do think i learned a little about smelting though, so not a total loss of time.

i don't know if it is polite to ask, but what happened to kurtak ?

 

[Yggdrasil]

after just spending over an hour reading and digesting this , that quote summed it up best .
no straightforeward answers are ever coming ... only more questions .

is this multimillion dollar operation all hinging on the purchase of a $1000 pickup to get some ore to utah ?

doesn't his 85 year old buddy have a 1000 bucks from the 3 months of bulldozing he just finished ?

oh... he was doing that as a volunteer ?

so everyone is illegally placer mining , yet bedridden at the same time ?

where is the "big corporation" in all of this ?

" Sure Joe ! just go ahead and help yourself to whatever , we don't mind that you don't have any credentials or any insurance or anything like that .... we don't care if you get injured on our property and sue us for millions .... we're just really nice guys "

the world needs more nice guys like these

if you can't afford the truck ... you sure as heck can't afford the liabilty insurance ...

as a general contractor some property management companies wouldn't let me change a doorknob without showing them 2 million in liability insurance, and that was 20 years ago.

i just a guy that joined this forum to learn a little about this hobby and hopefully start playing with some gold filled scrap and silver once i collect enough.

i feel i've already gained enough form this site in the past few months to warrant buying a sponsorship.

since then i am fascinated by the number of people that show up , whether from china, kenya , uganada, nevada wherever , with wild unsubstantiated claims of gazillions of dollars in gold .... the stories get better and better ... and the amount of time devoted to them ... i'm guilty as well for reading till the end.

its like watching a trainwreck.

i do think i learned a little about smelting though, so not a total loss of time.

i don't know if it is polite to ask, but what happened to kurtak ?

He ignored a few warnings and was shown the naughty corner for a week.
He’ll be back I hope.

 

[Nountaineer]

after just spending over an hour reading and digesting this , that quote summed it up best .
no straightforeward answers are ever coming ... only more questions .

is this multimillion dollar operation all hinging on the purchase of a $1000 pickup to get some ore to utah ?

doesn't his 85 year old buddy have a 1000 bucks from the 3 months of bulldozing he just finished ?

oh... he was doing that as a volunteer ?

so everyone is illegally placer mining , yet bedridden at the same time ?

where is the "big corporation" in all of this ?

" Sure Joe ! just go ahead and help yourself to whatever , we don't mind that you don't have any credentials or any insurance or anything like that .... we don't care if you get injured on our property and sue us for millions .... we're just really nice guys "

the world needs more nice guys like these

if you can't afford the truck ... you sure as heck can't afford the liabilty insurance ...

as a general contractor some property management companies wouldn't let me change a doorknob without showing them 2 million in liability insurance, and that was 20 years ago.

i just a guy that joined this forum to learn a little about this hobby and hopefully start playing with some gold filled scrap and silver once i collect enough.

i feel i've already gained enough form this site in the past few months to warrant buying a sponsorship.

since then i am fascinated by the number of people that show up , whether from china, kenya , uganada, nevada wherever , with wild unsubstantiated claims of gazillions of dollars in gold .... the stories get better and better ... and the amount of time devoted to them ... i'm guilty as well for reading till the end.

its like watching a trainwreck.

i do think i learned a little about smelting though, so not a total loss of time.

i don't know if it is polite to ask, but what happened to kurtak ?

It would be helpful if you can read the other responses/answers before requesting information that has been responded to already. Your assumptions may not be accurate.

 

[scrappyjoe]

ok.

so anyway , i just went back to the beginning to double check. this started a month ago with the second sentance stating a rich lode of silver .

but a month later we still don't have the ore in utah ... or anybody anybody even getting a kilo of it

i would have wheelbarrowed it to utah by now ....

I am in Arizona and already own a rich silver deposit here

 

[Yggdrasil]

If you have some info or question to this quote of yours, please add it or I will delete it as a double post

 

[Nountaineer]

Are you faulting me or them? How big is your wheel barrow, what do you charge per trip to Utah with it. Does it come with a spare tire?

 

[scrappyjoe]

i'm sorry, not trying to offend you. it might all be true . simply stating the obvious that the story is so full of holes that you shouldn't be surprised that people are skeptical

 

[scrappyjoe]

just stating for the record that i for one am skeptical.

 

[goldshark]

i'm sorry, not trying to offend you. it might all be true . simply stating the obvious that the story is so full of holes that you shouldn't be surprised that people are skeptical

It is funny how some people will ask questions. When we respond that we need more information to answer the question, and ask them a specific question we need to answer that question, we receive basically a blank cow stare look, in writing form, then the elusive evasive," why is my question not being answered" reply, This is directed to all posters who do this. It is rude to the forum responders, who are trying to help, with very good knowledge, for free. Almost all the technical information given here, would cost the person asking for help, many hundred of $, if you had to go to a lab which specializes in finding the solutions to their problems. Most of these people are not even Supporting Members. There are givers and takers in this world. Takers who take only, do not contribute to making this a better world.

 

[Southfork]

The propane furnace is 10 kg in size. It is Chinese cheap but useable. I have not mastered the drag and drop feature for photos here so can't do it. It has a regulator gauge red line of 20 psi. I have tried firing at about 11 psi and 15 psi with varied air shutter adjustment. I will fire it again when I have more time.

I wonder if a propane furnace will even get hot enough to smelt your ore?

 

[goldshark]

I wonder if a propane furnace will even get hot enough to smelt your ore?

What many people keep failing to realize, is that you don't have to get the furnace hot enough to melt the PGMs in the smelt phase, only when it has been refined , and you wish to cast it into a bar, or some other shape. Here is the reason why;
A proper flux, collector metal, and furnace temp work to perform in the following manner.
The proper flux and collector work to convert the slag into basically a thick, water like medium if you will. The proper flux also convert certain metal combinations in to a metallic form, where previously it was in a mixture of any combinations of minerals containing sulfides, oxides, carbonates, sulphates, etc. CONVERTS TO PURE METALS, it doesn't have to liquify or melt them. Lead is acting like Mercury collecting Gold in a Gold pan. The Gold does not have to be molten for the Mercury to absorb it.
If proper furnace temperature is around 2100F, with proper flux combination, and collector metal, The Collector metal attaches to the converted metallic component, and through specific gravity, will sink to the bottom of the crucible. THE FURNACE ONLY NEEDS TO BE HOT ENOUGH TO PROPERLY MELT THE FLUXES ONLY! Do I need to repeat this?
This is then poured into the cone mold, where the button sinks to the bottom of the mold in a button of the collector metals, and any PMs.
The button is then dealt with through cupellation. The" Prill" of PMs, is then dealt with, usually chemically, due to it's greatly reduced content and size. This also reduces your production of hazardous waste, then if you tried to reduce raw ore with acids.
I hope this adequately explains why you don't have to use such a high temperature for the smelt/assay phase. If you doubt this, please reread until it sinks in. This has been covered significantly in many threads. If interested in assaying or smelting, please read the library section, there is a very good book on assaying in it. This is getting to the point where the Moderators should point out that section, when it comes to this section, as readily as they point to Hokes book.

 

[Southfork]

What many people keep failing to realize, is that you don't have to get the furnace hot enough to melt the PGMs in the smelt phase, only when it has been refined , and you wish to cast it into a bar, or some other shape. Here is the reason why;
A proper flux, collector metal, and furnace temp work to perform in the following manner.
The proper flux and collector work to convert the slag into basically a thick, water like medium if you will. The proper flux also convert certain metal combinations in to a metallic form, where previously it was in a mixture of any combinations of minerals containing sulfides, oxides, carbonates, sulphates, etc. CONVERTS TO PURE METALS, it doesn't have to liquify or melt them. Lead is acting like Mercury collecting Gold in a Gold pan. The Gold does not have to be molten for the Mercury to absorb it.
If proper furnace temperature is around 2100F, with proper flux combination, and collector metal, The Collector metal attaches to the converted metallic component, and through specific gravity, will sink to the bottom of the crucible. THE FURNACE ONLY NEEDS TO BE HOT ENOUGH TO PROPERLY MELT THE FLUXES ONLY! Do I need to repeat this?
This is then poured into the cone mold, where the button sinks to the bottom of the mold in a button of the collector metals, and any PMs.
The button is then dealt with through cupellation. The" Prill" of PMs, is then dealt with, usually chemically, due to it's greatly reduced content and size. This also reduces your production of hazardous waste, then if you tried to reduce raw ore with acids.
I hope this adequately explains why you don't have to use such a high temperature for the smelt/assay phase. If you doubt this, please reread until it sinks in. This has been covered significantly in many threads. If interested in assaying or smelting, please read the library section, there is a very good book on assaying in it. This is getting to the point where the Moderators should point out that section, when it comes to this section, as readily as they point to Hokes book.

I was talking too Mountaineer about his furnace I'm not having a problem with smelting or melting chill out. Our gold is on the way to town from todays smelt.