PGM's are being found in the United States

[patnor1011]

It takes money to make more money.

You do not know what you have unless properly assayed. How does someone sell something not knowing what they have? You think that you have something for sale, you do not know what it is or how much of it is there. Unless assayed what you want to sell is dream, hope or belief.

I once ran BGA which where I normally expect to get 5g/kg. Because that is what is supposed to be there. No matter how many times I went through that material, it was not there. I got about 1g. Sometimes hope is not enough to get paid.

 

[NobleMetalWorks]

Thank you all for your honest assessments. They are appreciated.

We seem to have gotten a bit off topic, and there are too many posts for me to reply to all of them. I will just mention the points that concern what I believe that I have found. No disrespect intended to anyone. It takes me too long to copy, paste, and type. I have researched PGM's, because that is what I believe that I have found.]

Many people believe they have values in dirt, and most of the time they have nothing worth recovering. Right now I have several samples from different sources that all have pretty shiny silvery particles, but none of them assayed as having any values worth recovering. You might believe anything, but only proper assays will tell the truth. And as others have suggested it's best to have your material assayed by several assayers.

I have not done much research on metallurgy, but I have done some reading of the Hokes PDF. Saying that I have researched nothing makes no sense, because obviously I learned about the PGM salts, and the color change to the water that led me to the possibility that I have found PGM's.

If "water" you have added to your sample, turns color, this does not mean you have PGM's. In order to realize any color in a solution that contains PGMs, you must first be able to dissolve PGMs into a solution, which is not nearly as easy as it might seem. So the color of your solutions, mean nothing at all. This is to say that if you have metallic PGMs as you continue to insist by describing the shiny particles in your material, then you would have to dissolve that metal into solution before the solution would be colored in any way that would lead you to believe you have PGMs in solution. You would do well, after you have learned enough to do so, performing familiarity tests so you know exactly what it is you are talking about. If you plan on doing any refining yourself, you would also do well to precipitate PGMs as salts, to keep on hand as samples so that you know what they actually look like.

You also seem to think that just because you add H2O2 to a solution and it fizzes, that this means you have Platinum. This is NOT the case. Put 3% H2O2 on a cut or scrape and watch it fizz. H2O2 will fizz when introduced to many different minerals, and considering that dirt almost anywhere has many different minerals, your test with H2O2 means nothing, zilch, nada. If you were going to test for Platinum with H2O2, and have already removed all other possible containment with the exception of other PGMs, this is probably how you would do it.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aESn8vBZWt8[/youtube]

I have shown that PGM's are sometimes found as a white powder, and I also have links in this thread showing some of my research.

Do you also realize that Tin, Lead and many other metals also produce salts under the right conditions that are white in color? As a matter of fact, Tin Oxide is shockingly white.

Johnson Matthey has a "Glossary of Terms," and this is the correct usage of the word "sponge" by their standards.

Sponge:A powdered form of a pgm. "Commonly, the form required for manufacture of many pgm-based chemicals and catalysts."

You are taking what has been stated by Johnson Matthey out of context. If you really understood what the term meant, you would realize that when a metal like Platinum is called "sponge" it means it has been dissolved, and precipitated from a solution. Consider this:

"Platinum dissolves in aqua regia, and other platinum metals do not. Platinum metal can then be removed from the aqua regia in a form known as platinum sponge. Platinum sponge is a sponge-like material of black platinum powder. Finally, the powder is heated to very high temperatures and melted to produce the pure metal.

Read more: http://www.chemistryexplained.com/elements/L-P/Platinum.html#ixzz3ozCvxpIF"

Please use the term correctly so as to avoid confusion. When we talk about "Platinum Sponge" we are expressing platinum that has been precipitated from an acid solution.

I have already stated that I possibly have powdered PGM's, so I am unsure of what you are referring to.


Thanks to Lou!
Stillwater Complex

Harold_V, I actually have found someone interested enough to help me find an Assayer. Hopefully I can get that done soon, but it is a new friend, so we'll see. I understand that it may be something other than PGM's, so I am trying to research Assayers. I put in better search terms, and I actually found some this time. Hopefully I will find out the truth soon. It can be rather frustrating to not know. It was found with Chacopyrite which is a Copper indicator.

I also researched after adding Hydrogen Peroxide to some of the materials. I had about half a jar of the PM's with nuggets, and I added the peroxide. It immediately fizzed up, creating a violent reaction. The jar looked totally full as the silver powder and nuggets reacted to the peroxide. It cracked the bottom of the jar.

The Hydrogen Peroxide or H2O2 could be reacting to any number of things. It is NOT an indication, unless you have already removed all other possible minerals and/or metals that could also cause fizzing. Fizzing means nothing when you add H2O2 to a sample of material that you have no idea what it contains.

Hi Scott, I was told not to boil the water because it might explode, and if it is PGM materials then there are dangerous fumes associated with doing this. {I want to live, lol!} Otherwise I would have boiled it months ago. I texted a person that has an Engineering degree, and I asked him what he thought might happen if I boiled it. His return message was, "boom." Since then I have let it dry in the sun, and collected the gummy sediment at the bottom of the bottles. It sparkles, but it can take weeks to dry. The water separates from the materials, but it remains wet. I found this to be strange. Some of it looks like silly putty, but it is more of a tan, gray, and pink color until it dries, then a lot of it turns white. Some stays tan/gray in color, but it all sparkles when it is dry. It does not always appear very fantastic until it dries, then is when it really sparkles, especially in the sun, and under fluorescent lighting. While breaking down the ore there was a pink powder that could possibly be Rhodium salts. This would also turn the water pink.

Pink Rhodium Salts

Rhodium, so far as I understand and know, does not occur naturally in it's "salt" form. As a matter of fact, naturally occurring rhodium consists of its one stable isotope, 103Rh.

http://www.chemicool.com/elements/rhodium.html

Iridium also has colorful salts.
Iridium salts are many colors.

My tan/gray powder looks a lot like this. Palladium

and this, Platinum and Rhodium Catalyst, Rhodium Chloride

Yes, Iridium has many different salts associated with it. 34 to be exact. Yet once again naturally occurring iridium is a mixture of two isotopes: 191Ir and 193Ir with natural abundances of 37.3% and 62.7% respectively. Which means you are not going to find naturally occurring Iridium salts that will color your water.

http://www.chemicool.com/elements/iridium.html

I understand that there is a possibility that it is something else. I just did not want PGM's to be discounted, because it is a possibility. I am actually trying to be helpful with what I have discovered in my research. I will not be heart-broken as long as some of the materials are returned to me if it turns out that they are not PGM's. Most of this powder is a beautiful white color. I am still going to try to take it to the Colorado School of Mines. They should know what it is. Wish me luck!

If you really, truly, honestly believe your material has any values in it other than free gold (free gold meaning nuggets) then you should have it properly assayed. However, you might want to express what you are talking about differently. It's not that there is a possibility that it might be something other than what you want to believe it is. It is almost certain it is NOT a possibility. The likely outcome is that your material has no PGMs at all, or no PGMs in recoverable quantities. Be aware of this prior to sending your material off for assay, and consider this when reviewing what an assay will cost you.

Something else in my favor is that I have actually seen small gold nuggets in the mix.

If you have actually found and not just seen small gold nuggets in your mix, that is in your favor so far as the value of gold is concerned. But so far as PGMs are concerned that is probably NOT in your favor. Platinum is most often found with Copper and Nickel, although it is a byproduct of other PMs, it takes a lot of processing to accumulate anything of value. There are really only a few places in the United States where Platinum is found in any quantity. That would be the Stillwater Complex of Montana, and as a by product of copper mining in Texas and Utah.

Thank you all for your time and consideration.
Respectfully and sincerely,
Aphrodite <3

The following links are more evidence that PGM's are found in the United States for those who still do not believe this.

PGM's have been found across the Pacific Coast. I had suggested that the Platinum metals were found in the black sands that you collect while panning for gold. It appears as a smudge on the bottom of the pan. Here is evidence that I just recently found showing that I am correct.

Platinum metals were found in the black sands

Minerals found in Maine. PGM's found in Maine

If you scroll down you will find this, "platinum - Ashland(?), Dallas, Hermon, Rangeley, Salem(?), Union, Warren"

These are in PDF form, but worth noting. Statistics on PGM's being found in the U.S

Worldwide Statistics

Here is a picture of my PM's.

I'm sorry, but when you say "Here is a picture of my PMs" do you understand that PM stands for Precious Metals, and that Precious Metals refer to silver, gold and PGMs? If that was a picture of your PMs, then you would already be rolling in financial bliss, and able to afford proper assays. You would probably hire the talent you needed and would be looking to either expand your operation, or looking to sell out. That is a picture of the material left over from playing around with it, without understanding what you are doing, that is not a picture of your PMs.

Scott

 

[NobleMetalWorks]

Hi Palladium, Jon, and Göran,

Your responses are quite helpful. Thank you!

I do have a rock that needs identifying. Thank you Palladium for the link!

It seems that a few people do not understand my situation. I have taken more advice than you know. Obviously I have been researching Assayers, and Refineries. If I had not been doing this, then I would not have found one. I have mentioned time after time that I am not equipped to work with acids, and Göran is correct, it is not easy to work with PGM's. After Lou mentioned that I should learn to fire assay for PGM's. I researched it. I even learned how to make a gas furnace using a bucket, and insulation, but I do not have the money to put into this. I need to sell some of my materials to continue with this project no matter how you look at it. That is what I am trying to do. I mentioned in my previous post that I have found a friend that is willing to help me with this. Hopefully that works out.

Prior to spending any money on any equipment, or learning how to fire assay, you should have your material assayed by a professional. PERIOD. To properly assay you need a few things that do cost money, and then you need to be able to practice until you understand how to properly conduct a fire assay. Specially if you are assaying for Pt.

It states right here that they will process, "Platinum or palladium powders and solutions," and "Platinum sponge."

Materials Processed

Northwest Refineries takes a portion of the profits instead of charging for an Assay. Because of this their payout is a lot less from what I have seen with other Refineries, but it may be worth it in the long run. I have to start somewhere. I could use the money, and any amount that I receive is more than I have now. I have plenty of Ore, and material. I also have figured out that I need to send my materials to more than one Refinery for accuracy. I can switch companies if I feel like one of them is taking advantage, and I will not hesitate to file complaints if I need to. I can get the Assays from different companies, so that I will understand if I am being "ripped off." The assays should be close, and without wide variations of the content. I understand that there is ultimately a "charge" for these services.

Settlement

This is the problem when someone like you comes to this forum, and refuses to listen to explanations and/or logic. Read what you posted, specially this "Platinum or Palladium powders and solutions and "Platinum sponge". Fact is, you cannot have "Platinum sponge" because you did not dissolve Platinum into an acid solution, and then precipitate it. You have an unknown material, with unknown components that have not ever been assayed. Do you understand? Northern Refineries are not going to process your ore based on what you believe it might contain. They will not process your ore or concentrates unless you know for CERTAIN that there are PGMs involved, and even at that, they will most likely want an assay of some sort. It's different when you are sending Pd or Pt powders, solutions or sponge. All of those are NOT naturally occurring, except perhaps if you accumulated powder as fine metallic grain that was recovered from a major mining operation.

I stated that they do not "charge" for an Assay. I did not say that it was a "free" Assay, and it would be of the materials, not the ore.
On this page they talk about taking some of the "gold" for assaying, and at the bottom of the page they state that they do not charge for refining. Their "Assay" is part of their refining process. Refining

The salts are already in the sediment. I did not get them from anything, but the ore. The pink salts are obvious, even when panning. My water turned pink. The weak acids have no effect on PGM's, all they do is soften the ore enough for me to crush it, that's all, and I have not used that much of it, because I do not like the odor. I crush the Ore down to a fine powder before panning it so that I can collect the micro metals in the sediment, then I collect it with my bulb syringe, and let it dry in the sun. Previously I had only collected the water with the sediment in it. The water takes months to dry, so I started separating it instead, it saves time. It also takes time for the water in my jars to settle and clear, sometimes days, sometimes a week. I then use a bulb syringe to extract the water, so that the sediment is left at the bottom to dry. I was using bottles, but a lot of material sticks to the sides, so now I use glass containers. Everything dries quicker this way, and I do not lose as much of my materials. The sediment is sticky and gummy, and even though the water separates from it, it still retains moisture. It starts out looking a light pink and tan/gray color, but changes as it dries to white or light gray with sparkles. Some of it only sparkles in the sun, or under a fluorescent light, but the metals can be seen under a magnifying glass either way.

You do not have any PGM "salts" in your sediment as you have not dissolved, nor precipitated any metal from an acidic solution. Stop using these terms incorrectly, it confuses what exactly it is you are doing. When I see the word "salt" on this forum, I immediately think of metals that have been precipitated from a solution, and require conversion to their metallic forms. Using these terms incorrectly will cause others to understand what you are communicating in the wrong way. You may have other types of mineral salts, but not PGM salts.

Salts are heavier than liquids. I have been drying out some of the materials since July or August. (The materials in the water.) The sediment by itself dries quicker, but it still can take a week, or more, depending on how much is collected. That is where the salts are, and that is how I got my materials. It is a long process, which requires lots of patience. Very time consuming. The process took months to figure out, and perfect, but it works.

I have been working on all of this since the end of May.


Thank you for your Interest, time, and consideration.
Respectfully and sincerely,
Aphrodite <3

If you have been working on this since May, and have yet to recover any values, there is something seriously wrong about the way you are going about this. If you really have gold "nuggets" as you have suggested, then you should recover those values right away as it would be very easy to do. Use THAT money to fund a proper assay so you know exactly what your material has in it. This would be the proper way of "bootstrapping" your efforts and can be done right away if what you have lead us to believe is true.

Scott

 

[Justincase]

It would be interesting to find out what kind of land we are talking about.
If you can not afford any of the most basic need's for research how have you come into the ownership of mineral right's?
What is your personal position?have you a home that is isolated or some other way of life?
You sound to have maturity but such thing's are hard to gauge at a distance.
The dirt is less than half the story I have found.

 

[jphayesjr]

I have found both Platinum, Rhodium and Palladium. In Washington, the palladium in payable quanities.

I found a 20 g Rh-Au nugget last year, and yes, refined and the buttons were most gratifying. 90% was metal in a 4 to 2 proportion. The gold mostly was in the matrix, some had alloyed with the Rh, with other PGM minor percentage content, some Ag, Fe, Al. the Rh in a lump with protruding disk or fin shaped projections. I also found a 4 lb agglomeration of Rh-Pd-Pt-Au-Ag with small traces of cobalt, Fe, Ar, Fe. The PGMs are out there waiting to be found, just not as ubiquitously in the form of gold and silver nuggets. This lump of metals and rock has 3 cm "flower petal" clusters, and is shockingly cool to the touch, and massive. And, yes, lots of sparkly. Don't be discouraged, do perform real research.

 

[jphayesjr]

I found a 20 g Rh-Au nugget last year, and yes, refined and the buttons were most gratifying. 90% was metal in a 4 to 2 proportion. The gold mostly was in the matrix, some had alloyed with the Rh, with other PGM minor percentage content, some Ag, Fe, Al. the Rh in a lump with protruding disk or fin shaped projections. I also found a 4 lb agglomeration of Rh-Pd-Pt-Au-Ag with small traces of cobalt, Fe, Ar, Fe. The PGMs are out there waiting to be found, just not as ubiquitously in the form of gold and silver nuggets. This lump of metals and rock has 3 cm "flower petal" clusters, and is shockingly cool to the touch, and massive. And, yes, lots of sparkly. Don't be discouraged, do perform real research.

If you're aiming at commercial production and have an accepted claim to the mineral rights, which, in the USA is not automatically obtained when you purchase land, pay for professional assays from disinterested ethical professionals. Otherwise, read the classics such as Hoke, also become familiar with Beilstein's Manuals, look at Youtube projects members suggest in this Forum, and keep an open mind about how you can assay and extract and concentrate using methods newer than the 1890s and 1940s. There are newer technologies, in many ways, faster, safer, more efficient. Be sure to use PPE-- PGMs are highly toxic, so are chemicals used in refining and testing. Hope you realize your dream.

 

[Yggdrasil]

I found a 20 g Rh-Au nugget last year, and yes, refined and the buttons were most gratifying. 90% was metal in a 4 to 2 proportion. The gold mostly was in the matrix, some had alloyed with the Rh, with other PGM minor percentage content, some Ag, Fe, Al. the Rh in a lump with protruding disk or fin shaped projections. I also found a 4 lb agglomeration of Rh-Pd-Pt-Au-Ag with small traces of cobalt, Fe, Ar, Fe. The PGMs are out there waiting to be found, just not as ubiquitously in the form of gold and silver nuggets. This lump of metals and rock has 3 cm "flower petal" clusters, and is shockingly cool to the touch, and massive. And, yes, lots of sparkly. Don't be discouraged, do perform real research.

I think the natural Gold Rhodium alloy is called Rhodite. It is very rare and would probably payed much more as it was, due to that fact.

 

[jphayesjr]

I think the natural Gold Rhodium alloy is called Rhodite. It is very rare and would probably payed much more as it was, due to that fact.

Given the fact it was so heavily weathered, it did not appraise out as a collectable. Had I desired to sell it and my rights to the area, then sure, tons of cash, but a pittance compared to the ultimate values obtainable. I am eager to find more like the one I just found last week. Will post a photo of last week's find soon. Hopefully, subsequent finds will be in a condition such as you mention. Yes, rhodite aka rhodian gold. Excellent call, Minedat.org has good page.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Depends completely on looks and not weathering.
All the surrounding "craps"can be dissolved.