Red magnetic ore
- Thread starter Brandt
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It would be good to see a visual picture of the red magnetic ore plus any preliminary assays. For small scale economic extraction the issue would be how to concentrate the gold or precious metal fraction and separating the gangue as cheaply as possible.Once concentration is done sir there are many techniques available to isolate and refine the economic precious metals in your concentrate. My guess is you sir have to crush ore until the release size of the precious metals has been achieved.Then you sir may figure out how to concentrate the precious metals by gravity, water, chemicals,electromagtnetics etc...Thanks for allowing me to share my humble opinion.
Richard36
Well-known member
Brandt said:
Hello Brandt.
I figured that I would post the instructions that I sent to you in a PM so that we could both get some feedback on what I suggested for you to do.
The gold within that ore is most likely micron in size, and therefore, leaching, or smelting to lead are the options that I figure would work best.
I have made comment about those "Red Rocks" in one of my other posts. It is nice to see that someone has found some! What did it assay out at? I found some that assayed out at 3 oz per ton Au, but have read that they can assay out at as high as 30 oz per ton!
Anyway, the processes listed below are what I suggested that Brandt do.
Anyone else have any comments, or suggestions?
Large scale processes I am not all that familiar with, but if it can be striped with The muriatic /clorox method found on this forum, that would be a reasonable option for 5 to 10 gallons of material. The leach could be used to strip the ore untill spent, draw off or filter the leach solution, then follow the procedures for this method to recover your values from solution. That would be the plan of action that I would follow. Try this method with a small amout of leach, such as a quart of solution, and reuse it on fresh ore, untill it is spent, then test a few drops of this solution with a drop or two of stanous Chloride to see if it produces a purple, or black spot . The more gold the solution contains, the darker the spot is.
I have never tried the muriatic/clorox method, only read about it on this forum.
If it works for you, Please let me know. I have some ore that I would like to try it on.
The other option is to use a furnace and about 3oz of lead.
Smelt your ore with a mix of 2 prts borax 1prt sodium carbonate and 1prt ore with the lead. All prts are measurements by weight, not by volume. If you are lucky, you could smelt your ore directly to the lead without any flux. The ore should be at least sugar fine. The lead is to be reused with each batch you smelt, untill it becomes hard, and resistant to being smashed with a hammer. At this point, it is saturated with metals from the ore. This is determined by checking it in between batches after the melt has been poured to a mold, and let cool. The mold should be coated with a very thin coating of motor, or vegtable oil to prevent the lead from welding to the mold as it cools. Turn the mold upsidedown for a couple of minutes to let all the excess oil drain out in order to prevent the possibility of the melt splatering 2200F molten material, which will start fires, and cause serious burns if it splaters on you. Be carefull. At this point, you have the option of cupeling it to recover the precious metals, or dissolving it in Aqua Regia, and following that method to recover the values from solution.
As I said before, I hope one of these two processes work for you.
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
something to consider when leaching ore, base metals such as Iron will dissolve first, I leached some recently and took several leaches to get the iron out, then came copper then finally values, acids changed colors giving somewhat a clue as to metals they were extracting.
guess I am trying to say dont just do one leach and think you have every thing, it may still be there with the mud, testing solutions is a big help lets you have a clue to what is where.
concentrate as best as possible, and a good roast to oxidize the easily oxidizable metals,and drive off anions, I used portions heated in coffee pot with leach then pour off into ceramic pot, @least once a day, I would stir and add lil bit bleach, after couple days of that, would let sit till solution and any powders settled and solution well cleared of any precipitant or turbid look, and then would decant this not disturbing mud, and repeat next leach on ore. the decanted solution heated to drive off free chlorine-oxidizers ,filter, tested and if positive a copper bar to cement values,
guess I am trying to say dont just do one leach and think you have every thing, it may still be there with the mud, testing solutions is a big help lets you have a clue to what is where.
concentrate as best as possible, and a good roast to oxidize the easily oxidizable metals,and drive off anions, I used portions heated in coffee pot with leach then pour off into ceramic pot, @least once a day, I would stir and add lil bit bleach, after couple days of that, would let sit till solution and any powders settled and solution well cleared of any precipitant or turbid look, and then would decant this not disturbing mud, and repeat next leach on ore. the decanted solution heated to drive off free chlorine-oxidizers ,filter, tested and if positive a copper bar to cement values,
Richard36
Well-known member
butcher said:
True, I have experienced similiar problems with doing an Aqua Regia assay on some black sand. The high iron content would use up the aqua regia in short order.
I do not think that Brandt would have this problem with that "Red Rock", Though it contains some iron, it should not be in that high a concentration. Even though I have not saw a photo of his material, I am familiar with what it is. I have some of that type of material in my ore collection, which I am going to take a photo of (as well as a few other ores) and post them under "The Rock Man" sometime here in the next three days,(Hopefully).
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Richard36
Well-known member
I have just posted a few photos of that "Red Ore", along with a few others under "The Rock Man".
Check them out.
Enjoy!
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome, and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Check them out.
Enjoy!
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome, and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Richard36
Well-known member
This looks alot like what I found.
Good stuff!
Compare the photos.
The following is an explanation of its formation that I posted on my thread, "The Rock Man".
I am pretty sure that it is created by by iron rich precious metal bearing hydrothermal solutions reacting with the calcium content in the surounding rock, which causes the Gold, Silver, and Iron to drop out in high concentration due to the fact that calcium dissolved into hydrthermal solutions will cause all other metals to drop out. Calcium is way high toward the top of the list in the "Electromotive Dissplacement Series" of metals dissolved within an acidic solution, which hydrothermal solutions are. Calcium is also a strong reducing agent, so we have both factors going for us in the creation of this type of ore. This is the exact reason that "Skarn" is the "Holy Grail" of mineral bearing "Rock Types". Pound for pound, it will hold more metallic minerals than any other type of rock. The only other "Rock Type" that even comes close Is "Pegmatite". "Granite Pegmatite", and "Nepheline Syenite Pegmatite" especially, though a great majority of its mineral constituents will be of the nonmetallic variety, and an abundance of them will be "Gemstones" which are abundant within these two Pegmatites.
I hope that this has been helpfull.
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome, and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Good stuff!
Compare the photos.
The following is an explanation of its formation that I posted on my thread, "The Rock Man".
I am pretty sure that it is created by by iron rich precious metal bearing hydrothermal solutions reacting with the calcium content in the surounding rock, which causes the Gold, Silver, and Iron to drop out in high concentration due to the fact that calcium dissolved into hydrthermal solutions will cause all other metals to drop out. Calcium is way high toward the top of the list in the "Electromotive Dissplacement Series" of metals dissolved within an acidic solution, which hydrothermal solutions are. Calcium is also a strong reducing agent, so we have both factors going for us in the creation of this type of ore. This is the exact reason that "Skarn" is the "Holy Grail" of mineral bearing "Rock Types". Pound for pound, it will hold more metallic minerals than any other type of rock. The only other "Rock Type" that even comes close Is "Pegmatite". "Granite Pegmatite", and "Nepheline Syenite Pegmatite" especially, though a great majority of its mineral constituents will be of the nonmetallic variety, and an abundance of them will be "Gemstones" which are abundant within these two Pegmatites.
I hope that this has been helpfull.
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome, and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
I saw the pictures of "rock man", and the suggestion that the ore is a contact metasomatic type from hydrothermal gold bearing solutions.And that the gold is microscopic and calcium is part of the rock type.I am inclined to suggest a fine grind and a rigged up pressure leach for maximum recovery of the gold.In my little and humble experience what we do for such types of ore , when the gold values are high as suggested , is to rig up a pressure/boiling leach with cyanide,nitric/sodium metabisulfite powder. Boiling in triple distilled water for an hour. Filter solution or decant clear solution.Boil of to crust. Metalize in furnace. Refine for gold and silver recovery as the case maybe.Have cane vinegar always on your side, in case of accident drink red cane vinegar before your eyes pop out. whew! Other leaches maybe used, point is to popout the microscopic gold from the ore matrix in to the solution.Normally 150 grams of cyanide and 150 grams of powder are used per gallon of distilled water.The procedure is conducted in a safe secure unpopulated area that is well ventillated. Hope to have contributed something useful to you guys.
Richard36
Well-known member
honesto said:
Hello honesto.
Thanks for the reply, and welcome to the forum!
I am impressed! As far as I can recall, I have made no mention of "Metasomatic Metamorphism" anywhere in my posts. The closest I got was mentioning "Skarn", which is produced in that process from "Carbonatite", or "Marble" in a zone that has been altered by hot "Hydrothermal Solutions", or heat itself (without the presence of water) altering the overlying said "Rock Types", though water is necessary for the enrichment of the overlying rock.
The "White Host Rock" of that ore in my photos is a "Hybrid Rock" consisting of "Gabbro", (which is a "Magmatic Diffrentiation Product" of "Granitic Magma"), and "Carbonatite", (which is a "Magmatic differentiation Product" of "Nepheline Syenite", and which is also a "Magmatic Differentiation Product" of "Granite"). It is not quite "Skarn", though the processes for it to have become "Skarn" were present when it formed, and therefore explains why the largest chunk of the encasing rock has an abundance of other oxides, (and more likely sulfides), [Oxides occure above the "Water Table", and "Sulfides" occure below the "Water Table".] of gray color scattered all through it. Probably not visible in the photo, but they are there.
Do you have knowledge of "Petrology", and "Mineral Vein Environments"?
If so, I would much enjoy conversing with you on those topics.
Any further info that you could share with me and others on processing ores would be greatly appreciated as well.
Thanks for your input.
I hope to hear from you again.
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome, and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Richard36
Well-known member
Rhodium said:
Hello Rhodium.
Thanks for the reply!
To make this as simple as possible,
Once the water is gone, any metals that are left as a metallic vapor, and or native metals, chemically combine with the oxygen from the air to produce "Metallic Oxides", as is the case for converting lead into "Litharge" in the "Scorification Process" of the lead button obtained in doing a "Fire Assay".
While "Water" is present, "Sulfur Gas" from the magma combines with the Water to produce "Sulfuric Acid", and the dissolved metals combine with the sulfur from the Sulfuric Acid, and/or the Sulfur Gas, (as is done by dropping the Gold from spent Aqua Regia by bubbling "Sulfur Dioxide Gas" through the solution to precipitate the Gold as Gold Sulfide), and precipitate out of solution at the "Melting/Solidifing Temperature" of each individual sulfide, as pressure, and temperature decrease.
Therefore, it is possible to determine if a deposit formed above, or below the "Water Table" by the minerals that it contains, as well as the Temperature at which the minerals formed. Determining the deposits "Formation Temperature" is alot easier with "Sulfides", than with "Oxides", but can be done as well.
I suppose the next question will be what minerals to look for that indicate the solidifing temps for Gold, Silver, and Platinum, Right? lol!
I do have that info, but would have to go through my books to look it up.
Most minerals that contain metals have a "Melting/Solidifing Temp" close to that of the metal it contains, so if you know what the metals "Melting/Solidifing Temp" is, you can figure out the "Formation Temp" of the deposit in question.
When Hunting Ores, this is valuable info.
Thanks for the response.
It lead me to disscuss far more than you asked.
I like it, alot!
Questions, comments, and suggestions are allways welcome, and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Richard36
Well-known member
lol!Rhodium said:
Hired for what, finding mineral deposits?
When do we go?!?
Thanks again Rhodium.
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.
Sincerely, Rick.
Richard36
Well-known member
Brandt said:
Hello Brandt.
Thanks for the PDF.
I thought that I should post this info here as well.
Here are some books I suggest that you, and others get to study with, as well as look up and read in concerning anything that I have posted about "Minerals and Geology".
National Audubon Society
Field Guide to North American Rocks and Minerals. To order by phone, (800) - 733 - 3000
ISBN 0-394-50269-8
Simon & Schuster's guide to
Rocks and Minerals http://www.SimonSays.com
ISBN 0-671-24417-5
Dorling Kindersley Handbooks
Rocks and minerals http://www.dk.com
ISBN 1-56458-061-x
REBO PRODUCTIONS
Minerals Encyclopaedia http://www.rebo-publishers.com [email protected]
ISBN 184 0134 046
ISBN 1-84053-163-0
David & Charles
Minerals & Gemstones of the World
ISBN 0-7153-0197-7
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome, and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Richard36
Well-known member
Rhodium said:
Hello Rhodium.
Thanks!
Maybe someone here will see the light, and ask me to do such a thing.
I can, and do find deposits, my issue is with equipment, and facilities.
If anyone here has access to those two things, I would be interested in helping them find a good deposit, and working it together, if not the one that I have allready found. (1.17 tn Au, 3.51 tn Ag)
Just a thought, and I am open to disscussion on that topic.
Thanks again.
Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.
Sincerely; Rick.
Richard36
Well-known member
Brandt said:
Hello Brandt,
The lighter colored coarser material in the photo is "Rhyolite".
It is a magmatic differentiation product of granite formed in volcanic mountain ranges.
It can form at depth as a diferentiation product from granitic magma, or as compacted ash fields from ancient "Pyroclastic Flows" created by "Explosive Volcanic Events".
The small white feldspar crystals in your samples indicate that it formed at depth.
This type of rock proves that you are in a region that has been subjected to the neccessary heat energy to dissolve metals, and minerals at depth, and redeposit them close to the surface in "Epithermal", and "Hypothermal Vein Systems", which in turn produce "Elluvial Bench Placers", which in turn weather away with erosion cased by rainfall in to "Alluvial Stream Placer" deposits of Native Metals, and Heavy Minerals.
If you have not found the outcrop bearing that red material, You should work up stream looking as you go for any light colored, whitish rock as being the host rock for the red material containing the values.
That is the plan of action that I would follow.
Sincerely; Rick; a.k.a. "The Rock Man".
