Non-Chemical Smelting in India

[stella polaris]

Thanks butcher and Stella Polaris.
Coal is really too light in weight. And it gives no ash, and I use it again and again. Every time it glow as before.

Are you sure you are not using spent coke?
One should not be able to use coal more than once, I think??
If so, the glow comes entirely from the LPG not from the coal itself.

Yes, spent coke is light and float. If you are sold that its a pure scam.

One easy test to check the whole thing is to use wooden char coal as a test, in a run. if that is not working then its something else than the fuel. If works then its the fuel you been using..

 

[rickzeien]

Try to locate Coke in your country. It is used in blacksmith's forge and steel mills. It burns very hot and is made to reduce ash and emissions among other things.

Here is an ebay listing so you can see an example. Be sure sure to read the description. I link it here only as an example not as a source. (I am not affiliated)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Foundry-Coke-This-is-NOT-coal-Perfect-for-the-hobby-blacksmith-15-lbs-/183349452248

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[Rotz]

Hello,

I also try a small furnace with coal. Actually I thought using propane when I made the furnace but I just have a small propane tube. This coal is old type standard for house warming. Furnace is very hot when I close top hole half & half. I just try incenerate the chips. It is look nice for this but it couldn't melt the flux at the top of the crucible. All of the crucible was red but just bottom flux melted. I guess my furnace is short and I don't have a good cover. However it can make red everywhere with this coal. I will try with more coal then if I can't melt every place of the cricible I will make new furnace with kaowool.








Best Regards,

 

[Rotz]

I am using just a hair dryer for air from bottom as you can see.

 

[Rotz]

Hello guys again,

I get rid of from coal and I started smelt with puropane and hair dryer. I create a furnace with kaowool(50 mm). It work nice, just I can not adjust properly sometimes, I don't know the true adjustment of the air gas ratio. fire always yellowish and I can smelt gold, copper etc. Experience will develop in time.

I am using 50:50 soda x borax flux and I add 5 gr lead oxide . I can not find flourspar or flour. When I process the ICs or pins it is OK but mixed parts wasn't fluid enough although increase the flux ratio. pyrolised plastics or pcb dusts effect the flux. How I can fix this situation? Many time when I drain the crucible, good fluidal material coming then a lot of part coming as not fluid. I tried long time in furnace but it is same. However metals didn't collect.
At the same method the chips or pins smelt easy. I am thinking add more copper or lead oxide.

Sincerely

 

[kjavanb123]

Anyone who wants to use propane or butane as source of heat to melt or smelt please watch this video it will show you in very plain and simple form how to build a torch that takes gas as fuel and it can melt even steel in my case.

No air blower needed no hair dryer or anything it works based on venturi effect and sucks the air.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eO8NwseRxSA&list=PLxXd0CgIkAPId55oGBeq2Dm1_IQfj5pWK&index=11&t=41s

May God rest his soul.

 

[Rotz]

Dear Kevın,

I am working with 1 bar, he works with 2 bar. I think he wants to provide a good venturi effect so he uses 2 bar. I care the gas amount like everybody. I guess I need to try because oven volume will effect the amount. We can not calculate just pressure May be furnace working time will effect.
I will try thank you.
Sincerely,

 

[Toggle]

You may have to do some tests to find the right flux composition.

 

[Rotz]

You may have to do some tests to find the right flux composition.
[/quote]

I don't want to use flux anymore if possible. I am also talking here about that.
https://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=29432

To update, this is my gas furnace. This e-ore smelted with just soda

 

[kumbirai.mhere]

Ashir

Once you completed the pyrolysis followed by incinerationn of IC chips. You need to use a mill to pulverize them.

They should be as fine as flour. Now this is a method I got from the YT ,link as following;



So once you pulverized the ICs, you sift them through a kitchen sifter. Save the oversized for later.

For fine powder, add water to cover them plus maybe 5 cm above them. Add sodium hydroxide (lye-caustic soda) and use a spoon mix them well.

Let it settle, then pour off the black solution a little, keep adding lye, mix and pour off small amount until it is clearer.

Now you need to add enough lye to make it concentrated lye solution, it makes the pot to heat up and dissolve aluminum or any tin in the mix plus it dissolves silica in the ash.

You let this on low heat for an hour, then slowly add water to it and pour off a little, repat till solution is clear.

This safely concentrate your ash to smaller volume.

Best of luck
KJ

Can you concentrate ashes from activated carbon this way? JUST WONDERING

 

[Yggdrasil]

Can you concentrate ashes from activated carbon this way? JUST WONDERING

NO, there will not be enough difference in the loaded and unloaded parts of the AC.
You will need to ash it completely and then leach it.

Kjavanb's method dissolves unwanted elements in a heterogeneous mass until there is only ash left.
In AC there is only Carbon which is loaded and not loaded and when it is ashed it is supposed to be only a fine ash flour containing nano/micro Gold.

 

[kumbirai.mhere]

NO, there will not be enough difference in the loaded and unloaded parts of the AC.
You will need to ash it completely and then leach it.

Kjavanb's method dissolves unwanted elements in a heterogeneous mass until there is only ash left.
In AC there is only Carbon which is loaded and not loaded and when it is ashed it is supposed to be only a fine ash flour containing nano/micro Gold.

Okay I see. Is there no way to reduce this fine ash flour? I heard from someone who digest them with hot sulphuric acid first and then nitric acid and there was a big weight reduction. However the gold results was not satisfactory. Is it feasible to reduce the amount of activated carbon ashes with boiling with sulphuric acid first and then nitric acid?

 

[kumbirai.mhere]

On another note what fluxes and their ratios should I use to smelt ashes from activated carbon. I am aware of cyanide leaching and aqua regia but I prefer smelting because it's quite cheaper plus afraid of preg-robbing as my ashing technique are not spot on. I would rather grind the slag and leach afterwards if I get some losses. So right now can you advice on fluxes and their respective ratios specifically for carbon ashes according to their chemistry

 

[Yggdrasil]

Okay I see. Is there no way to reduce this fine ash flour? I heard from someone who digest them with hot sulphuric acid first and then nitric acid and there was a big weight reduction. However the gold results was not satisfactory. Is it feasible to reduce the amount of activated carbon ashes with boiling with sulphuric acid first and then nitric acid?

No, boiling in Sulfuric acid is considered wet ashing and do the same as ashing with burning, but is an order of magnitude more dangerous.
There is no need for wet ashing in refining, everthing we do, can be done without this.
If the weight and volume decrease by Sulfuric and Nitric in normal temperatures it is because base metals are dissolved and thus reduces the weight.
When the initial ashing is incomplete a wet ashing can reduce the amounts of Carbon in the ash, but it is better done by completing the initial ashing.

 

[Yggdrasil]

On another note what fluxes and their ratios should I use to smelt ashes from activated carbon. I am aware of cyanide leaching and aqua regia but I prefer smelting because it's quite cheaper plus afraid of preg-robbing as my ashing technique are not spot on. I would rather grind the slag and leach afterwards if I get some losses. So right now can you advice on fluxes and their respective ratios specifically for carbon ashes according to their chemistry

I'm no smelting specialist, but smelting it with some Borax and Sodium Carbonate with some decent collector metal should do the trick.
How do you plan to treat the button after smelting?
If you fear that it has to much carbon left add some Nitrate or Nitre maybe?
I hope some of our smelting specialists can chime in?

 

[kumbirai.mhere]

I'm no smelting specialist, but smelting it with some Borax and Sodium Carbonate with some decent collector metal should do the trick.
How do you plan to treat the button after smelting?
If you fear that it has to much carbon left add some Nitrate or Nitre maybe?
I hope some of our smelting specialists can chime in?

I will digest the button with nitric acid

Waiting for them to chime in

 

[Yggdrasil]

I will digest the button with nitric acid

Waiting for them to chime in

What kind of collector metal are you planning to use?

 

[kumbirai.mhere]

What kind of collector metal are you planning to use?

Copper. It's cheaper than silver and far less toxic than lead

 

[orvi]

On another note what fluxes and their ratios should I use to smelt ashes from activated carbon. I am aware of cyanide leaching and aqua regia but I prefer smelting because it's quite cheaper plus afraid of preg-robbing as my ashing technique are not spot on. I would rather grind the slag and leach afterwards if I get some losses. So right now can you advice on fluxes and their respective ratios specifically for carbon ashes according to their chemistry

Be careful about incinerating activated carbon with adsorbed cyanides - from very obvious reasons.

Stick to pyrometallurgy, from my personal experience, leaching slags and ceramics or other solid inorganic residues just produce hard to resolve mess. I would re-smelt ground up slag another time with some additional collector metal such as lead or preferrably bismuth. Then cupel the collector away.

In some cases it is smart to obviate hydrometallurgic treatment. It can easily spiral out of control, gaining volumes far too quickly, with significant adsorption losses.

 

[kumbirai.mhere]

Be careful about incinerating activated carbon with adsorbed cyanides - from very obvious reasons.

Stick to pyrometallurgy, from my personal experience, leaching slags and ceramics or other solid inorganic residues just produce hard to resolve mess. I would re-smelt ground up slag another time with some additional collector metal such as lead or preferrably bismuth. Then cupel the collector away.

In some cases it is smart to obviate hydrometallurgic treatment. It can easily spiral out of control, gaining volumes far too quickly, with significant adsorption losses.

Would you help me with fluxes ratios specifically for activated carbon ashes or it's similar to the one mentioned earlier on computer components?