Things which may be of interest to members
- Thread starter Deano
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Hi I'm going to do an unconventional stunt this time.
I'll post a PDF document since it have pictures and text together and I felt it would behave better in a PDF.
Anyways I hope someone has some views and information regarding the content in the PDF.
Regards Per-Ove
I'll post a PDF document since it have pictures and text together and I felt it would behave better in a PDF.
Anyways I hope someone has some views and information regarding the content in the PDF.
Regards Per-Ove
PeterM
Well-known member
Filter through a tight filter, or wash into a porcelain spoon dry, or extract most of the liquid with a small piece of tissue paper, then dry, anneal then scope it... then show me.... if it's gold it will be Crystalline.
The Ore owner has prepared a electrolytic cell with tin cathode as per recommendation from “Extraction of Gold Ore" 1905, Dickey
The funny thing is that when he adds approximate a ml leach to the spoon and then more or less the same with Stannous. Both crystal clear. This black precipitate collects in a point in the bottom. Deano has already said that Hypochlorite leach do not fare well with stannous due to high amount of oxidiser and salt.
But it still is a bit cool how the powder just emerges out of nothing.
The funny thing is that when he adds approximate a ml leach to the spoon and then more or less the same with Stannous. Both crystal clear. This black precipitate collects in a point in the bottom. Deano has already said that Hypochlorite leach do not fare well with stannous due to high amount of oxidiser and salt.
But it still is a bit cool how the powder just emerges out of nothing.
Hi Per, I didnt realise you posted images of the spoon tests, anyway, attached are images of the the spoon test particles (reduced/precipitated by the stannous) as seen through the microscope at 100x, DF, no filters. Sorry for the late posting. The cubic crystals are salt from the hypo leach. Testing is still on going as you know
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A wonderful thread by Deano ( many thanks to you ), more to read from him. However, I had a set of questions for clarity and understanding, but I also have another thread lined up for reading so do I post these questions straight up or will it be better to ask after going through this thread below?
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/further-things-which-may-be-of-interest-to-members.22978/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/further-things-which-may-be-of-interest-to-members.22978/
- Joined
- Mar 11, 2023
- Messages
- 266
Hello again,
Some questions I had after going through this thread,
1, I've found a carbon felt with the following features, please let me know if these would be good enough for this:
3, Speaking of volatilization, is it only gold in chloride from that may evaporate or are we considering its metallic form here as well?
4, (This is for my understanding and anyone going through it) I really like the recirculating cell, but like Deano has mentioned here that undisturbed activated pica carbon would also be a good adsorbent for loading, how if the same was used inside the perforated PVC pipe instead of the carbon felt wrapping? It stays undisturbed and even if attrition does so take place, the miniscule particles may stay within the pipe given it was wrapped by another material or fabric? This is if we entirely substitute the idea of electrowinning.
5, For all of the mentioned techniques and processes, the use of AAS or AA was found very common. These units aren't an easy buy specially for the small scale home refiners. Is it possible to work without these?
More questions for later, for now thanks all for your time on this one
Some questions I had after going through this thread,
1, I've found a carbon felt with the following features, please let me know if these would be good enough for this:
- A blanket-like carbon felt made by pre-oxidation and carbonization of a polyacrylonitrile-based flat felt.
- Soft texture, light weight, small heat, good heat insulation, easy to cut, easy to operate.
- Corrosion resistance, high temperature density and high leakage.
- High life and energy saving.
- Used in vacuum furnace, induction furnace thermal insulation energy storage , experimental conductive electrode gas adsorption material, filtering and removing stains.
- Technical indicators:
- Carbon content: 98% or more
- Moisture absorption rate: 2%
- Use environment: air 350 ° C
- Vacuum 1800 ° C
- Inert gas 2650 ° C
- Specific resistance: (Ω.mm2/m)
- Horizontal: 8.2-11.1x10 cubic
- Vertical: 11.8-16.8X10 cubic
- Application areas:
- 1. Can be used as a flame retardant material in the thermal insulation industry;
- 2. As a porous material, it can be used as a catalyst carrier in the chemical industry;
- 3. Can be used as a corrosion-resistant material for the inner liner or outer protective layer of composite materials.
- 4. It can be widely used as a conductive, absorbing and absorbing material in aviation, batteries, electrodes (such as electrode tubes, electrode rods, etc.); currently, applications related to conductive concrete are also rapidly developing.
- 5. It can be used as adsorbent material for decontamination of gas and ; gas industry such as desulfurization and denitrification; and carbon fiber felt has high temperature resistance, which can be used for high temperature removal in heavy polluting industries such as plants and sulfuric acid plants. Pollution industry; s such as oil absorption;
- Colour: black
- Material: Carbon felt
- size:5*200*300mm
- Package Contents:
- 2 * Carbon Fiber Welding Blanket
3, Speaking of volatilization, is it only gold in chloride from that may evaporate or are we considering its metallic form here as well?
4, (This is for my understanding and anyone going through it) I really like the recirculating cell, but like Deano has mentioned here that undisturbed activated pica carbon would also be a good adsorbent for loading, how if the same was used inside the perforated PVC pipe instead of the carbon felt wrapping? It stays undisturbed and even if attrition does so take place, the miniscule particles may stay within the pipe given it was wrapped by another material or fabric? This is if we entirely substitute the idea of electrowinning.
5, For all of the mentioned techniques and processes, the use of AAS or AA was found very common. These units aren't an easy buy specially for the small scale home refiners. Is it possible to work without these?
More questions for later, for now thanks all for your time on this one
The carbon felt I used was sold as sound insulating material but appeared to be similar to other types sold for other uses.
I suspect that most is very similar material with a marketing slant for whichever market the sellers were targeting.
The felt I used came in a range of thicknesses, 5 to 10mm were the ones most used depending on price and required flow rate.
If I am going to use a carbon part in a process where the part is wetted by a gold solution I always put the part in a gold solution of known tenor and check the gold tenor after 30 minutes or so to see if any adsorption has occurred.
Usually what I find is that gold adsorption is minimal at most, certainly not levels which would concern someone using the part in a processing route.
It appears that people do not understand the difference between industrial carbon and activated carbon and the word carbon is enough to make unwarranted assumptions about gold adsorption.
It is easy to do testing to find out the level of gold adsorption on any material but is really only possible if you own or have cheap access to an AA or similar.
If you are serious about doing larger scale gold recycling then an AA is virtually a necessity as you can instantly see what gold levels are in your liquors and you can then adjust your chemical inputs to suit.
For most gold work you are looking at a "bare bones" model AA, you do not need all of the options beloved by the designers of these units.
What you do need is an AA model with background correction to compensate for base metals and organics in solution.
Most models have background correction as standard but a surprising number do not, always check.
There are cheapish models available from some manufacturers, secondhand is always an option.
You can purchase carbon and resin cylinders for removal of metals from liquid flows through these cylinders.
Any activated carbon used in these cylinders is usually pre-attritioned on a screen to minimise gold losses on the fines.
You will still need to ash the loaded resin for the gold recovery step.
Gold volatilising is really dependent on the surface area of the gold you are heating.
If you have the gold present at near atomic size particles it will volatilise at much lower temperatures than quoted in the literature.
My suspicion is that the volatilisation of gold chlorides mainly gets prominence due to the high surface area of such chlorides especially when disintegration of the chloride complex occurs at temperature.
Deano
I suspect that most is very similar material with a marketing slant for whichever market the sellers were targeting.
The felt I used came in a range of thicknesses, 5 to 10mm were the ones most used depending on price and required flow rate.
If I am going to use a carbon part in a process where the part is wetted by a gold solution I always put the part in a gold solution of known tenor and check the gold tenor after 30 minutes or so to see if any adsorption has occurred.
Usually what I find is that gold adsorption is minimal at most, certainly not levels which would concern someone using the part in a processing route.
It appears that people do not understand the difference between industrial carbon and activated carbon and the word carbon is enough to make unwarranted assumptions about gold adsorption.
It is easy to do testing to find out the level of gold adsorption on any material but is really only possible if you own or have cheap access to an AA or similar.
If you are serious about doing larger scale gold recycling then an AA is virtually a necessity as you can instantly see what gold levels are in your liquors and you can then adjust your chemical inputs to suit.
For most gold work you are looking at a "bare bones" model AA, you do not need all of the options beloved by the designers of these units.
What you do need is an AA model with background correction to compensate for base metals and organics in solution.
Most models have background correction as standard but a surprising number do not, always check.
There are cheapish models available from some manufacturers, secondhand is always an option.
You can purchase carbon and resin cylinders for removal of metals from liquid flows through these cylinders.
Any activated carbon used in these cylinders is usually pre-attritioned on a screen to minimise gold losses on the fines.
You will still need to ash the loaded resin for the gold recovery step.
Gold volatilising is really dependent on the surface area of the gold you are heating.
If you have the gold present at near atomic size particles it will volatilise at much lower temperatures than quoted in the literature.
My suspicion is that the volatilisation of gold chlorides mainly gets prominence due to the high surface area of such chlorides especially when disintegration of the chloride complex occurs at temperature.
Deano
