what the H*ll did I just do???

[ThePierCer]

ok guys, i think i need some help. I had 5lbs of silver plated copper wire. I soaked it in my Nitric for about 15 min, and all that was left was bare copper wire. The solution was a deep rich white color. Then for some unknown reason, I added a little more nitric. Then for an even more unknown reason, I added some hot water to the left over salt from making the Nitric, and added that to the mix. It started fuming like crazy….. real deep red or rust color. Now I thought I recognized that from Steves video, so it went immediately outside, where it’s 20 F. About an hour later, there was a VERY milky liquid on the bottom, and a green layer on the top. I poured off the green layer into another container. I wasn’t sure what happened, so I figured I’d add the salt and see what happened. Within a minute there was a THICK layer of white “cottage cheese” ON TOP of the liquid…..

There wasn’t anything visible to filter, that’s why I skipped that step and just added the salt. By the way, the salt was natural rock salt I brought home from the salt flats when I was in Utah. I ground it up and removed any impurities.

This was my first attempt ever with Nitric, and I am fully prepared to re-refine everything. This was just a test. I just want to know what the h*ll I did?

 

[Noxx]

If you got orange/brown fumes, I think you solution released Nitrous Oxide gases (NOx). This happens when you make Aqua Regia but I'm not sure how you ended up with this gas... Maybe Steve will have a clue...

 

[ThePierCer]

i have no idea either...... i doesn't make sence to me..... thats why i'm here .... the best damn gold refining site on the internet.... lol

 

[Noxx]

Thanks and don't forget to talk to your friends about this website !

 

[lazersteve]

Hello,
I have an answer for you.

The fumes where NOx (NO and NO2) as Noxx stated, you were very wise to get the reaction outside.

The first stage was what you expected, the silver dissolved into the nitric, good job.

The second stage was the now bare copper wire dissolvng into the solution. This started pushing the silver out of the solution.

The remaining reaction products are just copper nitrates and sulfates, silver and it's compounds (Nitrates and Sulfates from the sulfuric acid you used to make the nitric). The copper initially began to drop the silver out of the solution.

Here's what you should have done:

Cut the wire into short segments.

Boil the wire in hydrochloric acid to remove the copper and leave the silver behind.

Wash then melt the silver.

Redissolve the silver with fresh nitric.

Steve

To fix your mistake boil the whole lot on distilled H20 and filter, this should remove the copper compounds into the liquid and leave a mixture of sliver compounds as a sludge in the filter. The liquid may still contain some silver nitrate.

 

[ThePierCer]

thanks again Steve. I have about 1/4 of a QT of sludge, so it's gonna take a few filters to fet it all out.

I'm sure there was a better way to deal with the copper, I just wanted to disolve the silver and extract it. I didn't know once the solution was saturated the disolved copper would push out the silver. I wounder how much I lost? The solution turned milky after about the first lb of wire. Then I did 4 more lbs. The wire was bare, so the silver had to so into the solution. right? I spilled a little bit of the real milky liquid on my bench, so i guess that was some loss.

 

[ThePierCer]

I checked on my solution this morning the liquid "Aqua" colored (not water colored) with a white skim on the top. I have to work today, so i'm going to let it sit till tonight before i boil and filter it.

I have another 5 lb I want to refing, but am quite timid about boiling HLC. Would it be much of a problem if I continued to use the Nitric, but under much more controled conditions? Smaller batched, quicker dip, ect.

I think I caused to reaction the first time when I foolishly added the salts left over from the Sulfuric Acid/Sodium Nitrate mix.

Since the copper dropped the Silver, is ther still a need to add salt? Or just a little to make sure it's all out? And what do I use to drop the copper? I know Aluminum drops Copper from AR, will it do the same for Nitric?
I want to make copper bullion also, so having the dropped copper will give me a nice start.

 

[lazersteve]

Piercer hopefully you have learned a valuable lesson from dumping everything together. Look before you leap. I think you may be able to get by with letting the cut wire soak at room temp HCl for a few days or more to strip the copper out. Then you can go after the silver with your nitric after filtering off the blue-green solution.

Steve

 

[PRECIOUS METALS]

hey steve where can i buy nitric

and if i make my own with 1qt consentrated sulfuric 1/2 cup of sodiom nitrate.
and let it sit over night,

how strong is it, and can i bottle it

 

[Noxx]

You can can make your own this way. But don't expect having nitric acid of more than 40%... I will put a tutorial soon.