Renstilskens wacky questions.

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Thank you all for your concern.. ..and after reading all ur advices I have stop my expirements until I am better educated. I have also continued to survey the areas I have worked in for any damage. And will continue todo so. Thanks once again for taking the time to inform me on the proper procedures. On how todo things. I truly do appreciate it. Sid. Just finished hoke's book. But need to read it again. Which is what i am doing now. To get a better understanding. I will keep all informed of my progress . Really well I do have torches. I am a ceritifed welder.. I seen the buetain torch. That should be good enough. But I am a little confused on which flux to get their are so many out their. Premix fluxes verse regular flux. Is borax flux the I should use for the bone dish.?
B/c I still have that silver cement . I can try to melt that and get the hang of it with that. I am setting up a an area on my property. For an out door lab set up and torching area.. It is away from the house . The wife yelled at me.. When I told her what you guys said. No I have been regulated to a small corner . And sectioned off. The area is all stone floor and four foot wall on three sides.. I should have went their from the beginning .
 
Renstilsken, I'm beginning to like you. 8)
Renstilsken said:
Thank you all for your concern.. ..and after reading all ur advices I have stop my expirements until I am better educated. I have also continued to survey the areas I have worked in for any damage. And will continue todo so. Thanks once again for taking the time to inform me on the proper procedures. On how todo things. I truly do appreciate it. Sid.
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There are many here that will feel their efforts were worthwhile. Many new folks come here with misinformation they've heard elsewhere, and when we tell them they're wrong, they get upset and leave, either by their choice or by ours. It's especially rewarding when we can help someone take a step back, protect themselves and those around them, and learn a better way.

Just finished hoke's book. But need to read it again. Which is what i am doing now. To get a better understanding. I will keep all informed of my progress .
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I've read it at least a half dozen times, and I learn more every time. Maybe that just means I'm slow on the uptake, but there is just so much to learn. As you read the forum, more and more of what Hoke teaches begins to make sense.

Really well I do have torches. I am a ceritifed welder.. I seen the buetain torch. That should be good enough. But I am a little confused on which flux to get their are so many out their. Premix fluxes verse regular flux. Is borax flux the I should use for the bone dish.?
B/c I still have that silver cement . I can try to melt that and get the hang of it with that.
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Butane isn't the hottest gas around, but with oxygen it should do fine.

I often see confusion about fluxes. For melting, all you need is to coat the inside of your dish with borax. It will give it a smooth coating that will help your metal to flow into a pool. The premixed fluxes you mentioned are usually used when smelting, which is a much different process.

I am setting up a an area on my property. For an out door lab set up and torching area.. It is away from the house . The wife yelled at me.. When I told her what you guys said. No I have been regulated to a small corner . And sectioned off. The area is all stone floor and four foot wall on three sides.. I should have went their from the beginning .
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Behind every great man, is his woman. I'm glad she yelled at you. You will all be better off for listening to her.

Welcome to the forum.

Dave
 
Lol..I guess so.. Ok so I am gonna practice my melting .. And up on the differences between smelting and melting. Until then I will check in on Monday . And tell ya how I am progressing.. Thanks for all your help guys..
 
Here is a question. Do you ever neutralize the muriatic acid before you precipitate gold with baking soda or after you precipitate gold. Or never and why..
 
Renstilsken said:
Here is a question. Do you ever neutralize the muriatic acid before you precipitate gold with baking soda or after you precipitate gold.
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Here is an answer. No. And I believe there was a post in just the last 3 days that explains why acid is needed for SMB to create SO2.

The library section of dealing with waste will also tell you how to responsibly handle your waste after precipitating gold. I.e.: not killing every life form around you.
 
Hello fellas how is everything.. ? Ok so now I have a out side set up. And have been processing and refining silver now for the last week.. And I love it.. So shinny. But my question have todo with gold ..do I separate the different color golds . Like rose gold and yellow gold. Or it does t matter. And what bout the diamonds . Like in rings and earrings.. Will the acid damage them..
 
The accepted way to refine karat scrap is to inquart it with silver, in other words you need to make an alloy up of your scrap gold and silver that is 25% Au and melt it and cornflake it in water, then put the cornflake into your beaker cover well with distilled water and heat and slowly add nitric, a watch glass is a good idea, when reaction slows add a little more nitric do this at high heat and cool when you get no further reaction when you add more nitric, decant and rinse the solids and add rinse to the other nitric acid which you can now cent with copper to recover your silver, it will also carry any PGMs so the silver may need to be put through a cell at some point. The remaining solids cover well with HCl and again heat and slowly add nitric, use a watch glass for this as any fumes can carry loses of gold, only slowly add small increments of nitric and only add more when all reaction stops, if after you last addition of nitric you have no reaction add a little more HCl and if you get a reaction add a little more, when that stops reacting add a further small increment of nitric, no reaction you should have dissolved all your gold, add a little sulphamic and stir into the solution if you get a fizzing add a little more until it stops, cool and filter and precipitate with the chemical of choice.
The colour of the gold or karat does not matter if you inquart which is why we recommend this process.
Hope this helps.
 
The method Nick posted is for karat gold but not for gold with diamonds. While the acids do not hurt the diamonds, the melting will, so they are processed in AR as they are received. There are multiple threads about chemical diamond removal on the forum if you search.
 
Thanks nic..that's sounds a little complicated.. I have todo more reading on it..thanks four metals. For the pointed reference .. To the library.. I think that is more of what I need right now..yeah don't wanna damage the diamonds..they are of good quality. Been collecting items like for a while.. I wanna do it right when I do it.
But on another note .. I though when you preformed the nitric acid process on the silver alloys. It removes all the impurities..I have just been doing this .. Then filtering it , or cleaning it with distilled water then , preceptitating it with a pure copper bar.. Then once it is cemented . I wash it again with distilled water. Then been melting it into one ounce bars.is this silver not pure enough. I thought it was.
 
In theory the silver should be pure because the copper will only drop mercury and other precious metals beneath it on the electromotive series chart. So if there are none of those metals the copper only drops silver. That is the chemistry of it. But often in refining the mechanics of a process often complicate things.

So in reality, small pieces of copper that flake off of your scrap copper will contaminate the silver. You can minimize this by using solid slabs of copper and when it gets thin remelt it and use a thicker slab, or you can use fine powdered copper and slowly add just enough to drop the silver so no excess copper remains undissolved.
 
Wow I never thought of that ..thanks four metals..fine copper powered..I am gonna order some of that.. It sounds a lot faster, and less messy to use.. I was using copper bars and five gallon bucket ..with air pump to agitate it. To flake off like you said. Thanks for the tip..I will let you know how it works out
 
Renstilsken,
I just have to say that I think you are making a fine forum member here, and I am glad to see you getting past that rough start.
 
This is a video posted by a member from India who was using copper powder to drop silver, it is fast and drops pure silver until you over add the copper. An easy way to prevent that is to add copper until testing indicates you are almost done, then stop adding copper and remove your silver which is high purity. Then add copper powder to recover the last of the silver and a little extra copper won't matter, just re-refine that silver with the next batch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UgWpz7Rhf8
 
4metals said:
This is a video posted by a member from India who was using copper powder to drop silver, it is fast and drops pure silver until you over add the copper. An easy way to prevent that is to add copper until testing indicates you are almost done, then stop adding copper and remove your silver which is high purity. Then add copper powder to recover the last of the silver and a little extra copper won't matter, just re-refine that silver with the next batch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UgWpz7Rhf8
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How viable of an option is cemented copper, from a stock pot?
 
Topher_osAUrus said:
How viable of an option is cemented copper, from a stock pot?
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If you've used iron to cement the copper, remember that iron will cement everything below it on the reactivity series. If the only thing in your stock pot solution was copper, it might be OK, but that's not likely. It depends on your feedstock.

Dave
 
These are the photo's I dug out that he posted of his equipment, pretty simple! Unfortunately I can't remember the OP's name to find the original thread.

Silver cementing 1.jpg

Silver cementing 2.jpg
 
Why thank you butcher.. Like I said I am hear to learn..but back to chemistry.. Is it worth refining silver plated items..I recently bought bout five pounds of it. And am wonder if it was worth it. Now that I think bout it.what other metals might be in it. Does anyone know. Just wondering. Gonna watch video now that , 4metals put up..thanks again for the video 4 metals
 
Wow.....those Arabs are paid..did you guys see that..they had big money in that tub..couple hundred grand easy..now that is a pay day ..
 
Ok.. So I can use and item above any other item to precipitate whatever is underneath it. On this electromotive chart ..hmm very interesting..
 
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