Best Prices for Chemicals

[viacin]

Does anyone have a list of websites for low priced U.S.A. chemical supliers? I'm sure this is a common question, but I didn't see any suplier lists in the search results. Sticky's list is good, but the nitric acid supliers (what I'm really looking for) are mainly UK, not selling it anymore (it would seem), or expensive. Where do you guys (and gals) buy your chemicals?

Looking for nitric acid right now, but hydrochloric acid will be needed soon as well.

 

[slowerbear]

Does anyone have a list of websites for low priced U.S.A. chemical supliers? I'm sure this is a common question, but I didn't see any suplier lists in the search results. Sticky's list is good, but the nitric acid supliers (what I'm really looking for) are mainly UK, not selling it anymore (it would seem), or expensive. Where do you guys (and gals) buy your chemicals?

Looking for nitric acid right now, but hydrochloric acid will be needed soon as well.

High Valley Chemical/Appx. $82.00 delivered cross country for 2.5L in glass bottle.

 

[Husker]

I buy hydrochloric at Ace Hardware. Seems cheaper usually than Lowes or other box stores. Last Muriatic acid I bought was $3.29/gallon (sale). I bought 16 gallons at that time. I also buy concentrate sulphuric gallons there, for about $16. The normal price is $22, but I buy them by the case, pre-paid (talk to the store manager).

As for nitric, I use sodium nitrate and sulphuric or sodium nitrate and muriatic (for poor mans AR). The 60% nitric made with sodium nitrate and conc sulphuric works out to less than $20 a gallon (after removing the salts) and has worked wonderful in my opinion.

Certainly not as cheap as the tech stuff that GSP and Harold talk about getting for $3-$4 a gallon, but since I have no good source for 55 gallon lots of nitric like the big boys do, my home made stuff will have to do.

$82 for 2.5 L is simply a highway theft.

H.

 

[viacin]

you're kidding, you can get these acids at the home improvement stores? I almost live at Home Depot and never noticed them. Of corse, I've never looked for them either. I assume they would be in the cleaning supplies?

I've found 1 lb of sodium nitrate on ebay for about $10 total, but not sure how much this makes or at what precentage nitric acid. I need to read the cold process for making nitric acid again.

 

[Anonymous]

Not that it is all that cheap either but you can get stump remover at lowes
4 buck a 1lb bottle, it is KNO3

 

[maltfoudy]

should be able to find the acid in the paint department, also known as deck wash.

 

[Husker]

Muriatic is 31% HCL. It is pretty dam cheap. Used as cleaner for concrete and also used for pool cleaning.

Conc sulphuric is sold for drain cleaning. It usually comes in a plastic bottle, that is in a clear plastic bag (dam dangerous stuff). Most of your box hardware stores (lowes, menards, home depot) will only have 1QT bottles of sulphuric. However, I have found 1 gallons at ACE. Called Roto. It is 97% conc and works pretty darn good.

Another souce for sulphuric is battery acid (can get it in 5 gallon lots) from Napa or others (auto zone?) It is not conc, so you will have to boil out the water. But it is pretty cheap in this form, and 37% or so (if I remember correctly). However, I pay a little more for someone else to concentrate it, so I have one less dangerous step to do myself. And by buying in the case, I have dropped my cost down for a gallon to about what a quart goes for at Lowes.

Jim.

 

[viacin]

Thanks husker for the help!

so for homemade nitric I'll need sodium nitrate + sulfuric acid (drain cleaner)

and for AR, I'll need homemade nitric + hydrochloric (concrete/pool cleaner)

is the hydrochloric concentrated enough at that rate to make AR?

 

[Husker]

muriatic works fine to make AR.

A "poor mans" AR can be made by making a concentrated boiling water and sodium nitrate solution, and mixing that into muriatic. do a search for poor mans ar and you should easily find the recipe.

Jim.

 

[viacin]

ty jim, I appreciate the help. This is one of my favorite posts, mainly becasue it saved me some cash Next time I need chemicals, it's off to ACE for me, not cole-palmer.

 

[viacin]

Thinking that it would be cheaper to buy just one bottle of 35% nitric acid than buy the equiptment and chemicals to make my own, I started looking on google. I can't find it for less than $70.71 for 2.5L. Am I on a fruitless quest, or can it be found cheaper? I'm looking for 1-2L of 35% Any help?

$82 for 2.5 L is simply a highway theft.
H.

http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/Nitric-Acid-White-Fuming-500ml-p471.html

$428 for 500ml, 99.5% pure. That hurts so bad, I teared up.

 

[Noxx]

No no don't buy that.

The cold method is cheap and effective to make nitric acid for base metals dissolution.

 

[JustinNH]

I buy hydrochloric at Ace Hardware. Seems cheaper usually than Lowes or other box stores. Last Muriatic acid I bought was $3.29/gallon (sale). I bought 16 gallons at that time. I also buy concentrate sulphuric gallons there, for about $16. The normal price is $22, but I buy them by the case, pre-paid (talk to the store manager).

As for nitric, I use sodium nitrate and sulphuric or sodium nitrate and muriatic (for poor mans AR). The 60% nitric made with sodium nitrate and conc sulphuric works out to less than $20 a gallon (after removing the salts) and has worked wonderful in my opinion.

Certainly not as cheap as the tech stuff that GSP and Harold talk about getting for $3-$4 a gallon, but since I have no good source for 55 gallon lots of nitric like the big boys do, my home made stuff will have to do.

$82 for 2.5 L is simply a highway theft.

H.

EXACTLY what he said

 

[JustinNH]

Thinking that it would be cheaper to buy just one bottle of 35% nitric acid than buy the equiptment and chemicals to make my own, I started looking on google. I can't find it for less than $70.71 for 2.5L. Am I on a fruitless quest, or can it be found cheaper? I'm looking for 1-2L of 35% Any help?

$82 for 2.5 L is simply a highway theft.
H.

http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/Nitric-Acid-White-Fuming-500ml-p471.html

$428 for 500ml, 99.5% pure. That hurts so bad, I teared up.

Holy crap thats alot of money! You would have to get 1/2 an ounce of gold just to pay for the nitric! I think Im going to tear up too

btw, I like your signiture quote, Viacin.

 

[goldsilverpro]

There may be exceptions, but any time you see nitric packaged in 2.5 liter (they used to be called 5 pint) jugs, you know it's reagent grade. Reagent grade normally sells for as much as 20 times more than industrial grade. There is no standard refining process that I know of that requires reagent grade.

 

[viacin]

Ok, you've sold me. But wait... "8} Pour or siphon off the liquid nitric acid while cold". How concentrated is this nitric acid? How do you measure the concentration, a hydrometer? Please forgive my ignorance, I'm sure that's simple chemistry.

Jim, Where do you get your sodium nitrate from? I found a pound for $10 on ebay.

Certainly not as cheap as the tech stuff that GSP and Harold talk about getting for $3-$4 a gallon, but since I have no good source for 55 gallon lots of nitric like the big boys do, my home made stuff will have to do.

I searched around but didn't find the related posts. I'de like to know more bout this tech stuff for $3/gal

Ty justin. I found it in one of my favorite books, "wealth without risk."

 

[butcher]

with a little studying most chemicals needed, can be made from cheaper sources like fertilizers, or found in grocery stores , hardware store, ect.

nitric acid can de bought try action mining or my local mining supply (Expensive)(only for High purity do I buy),but shpping cost alot, with study and safe practices it can be made poor mans, or distilled to almost as high grade as 67%easily , even higher Grade % with more work.
here are a few supplys and my source: borax(for flux) 20 mule team soap Grocery store,sodium metabisulfite wine making supply farm coop store, urea fertilyzer, nitrate fertilizer, KNO3 stump remover garden center , copperas ferrous sufate make it Iron transformer plates and sulfuric acid or buy at garden store, oxalic acid wood bleach or rust remover hardware or auto store, sulfuric acid hardware or napa auto store (can concentrate new battery acid to (98%), HCl Hydrochloric acid get mine at store that sell concrete block also hardware store,sodium chlorate (weed killer), lime hardware., soda ash washing soda soap groceries, sodium hydroxide drian cleaner ect, sodium bisulfate pool store, high percentage hydrogen peroxide pool suppys, 3% H2O2 wallmart ect,sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) gro store,sulfur garden supply, (95% tin solder) hardware, silicon sand or crushed glass(flux) make , ammonium chloride make, stannous ghloride make,pure zink Roofing section hardware or moss remover, clorox bleach,ammonia(ammonium hydroxide) grocery store,NaCO3 washing soda(sodium carbonate groceries soap),

the list goes on and on, you learn to read the lables on almost everything ,and search and study most chemicals we can use can be in everyday products under your kitchen counter or in the barn, if not with these new fangled computers or better yet an old fashion book (those things with pages ) you can easily find the recipee on how to make it, use common sense and studying it well, tools can easily be made or bought at second hand, make your furnace, electric or propane easily, kitchen utinsils can work good and cheap, hot plate, camp stove, alcohol lamp, coffee pots (can heat on hot plate just dont change temperature fast), Glass ware NOT FOR HEAT plckle jars, measure cups ect, canning jars, poly type hose, teflon tape,turkey baster bulb, safety glasses gloves, ect.ect.

OOPs there I go again ranting on without commas and periods....

 

[viacin]

How concentrated is this nitric acid?

Found the answer. Makes ~160 mL ~50% HNO3. There are two cold processes by lasersteve on the form, I was reading the one without that information. :roll:

I still have to figure out how to check the precentages myself.

Butcher,
you're right, Action Mining does sell nitric...

"NITRIC ACID
Reg: $52.10USD

NITRIC ACID, REAGENT GRADE, 2.5L, 7 LB BOTTLE 68-70% - TRUCK ONLY (MINIMUM FREIGHT CHARGE IS APPROX. $150-250 + HAZ CHG OF $20 + RESIDENTIAL DELIVERY CHG OF $76, IF APPLICABLE). CALL FOR EXACT QUOTE."

That's $246-$346 Shipping And Handling for a 2.5L bottle!!!!!! They Are INSANE! :shock:

they do have good prices on their Sodium Nitrate though. $1.45 a lb if you buy 100lb bulk
http://actionmining.com/cgi-bin/online/storepro.php

 

[lazersteve]

The formula for Weight-to-Weight percentage for the cold nitric acid reaction is :

(Grams HNO3 / (Grams HNO3 + Grams Water)) x 100% = % Concentration

or simply

(Grams HNO3 / Grams Solution) x 100% = % Concentration

To estimate the percent concentration divide the calculated theoretical weight of nitric produced by the total weight of the final solution.

This is the theoretical value and does not include impurities into the calculations.

Using the basic formula that produces two moles of nitric acid with total of 100 mL of water you have

(126 g / (126 g + 100 g)) x 100% =% concentration
(126 g / 226 g) x 100%
0.5575 x 100% = 55.75%

Using a specific gravity chart for nitric acid you could also estimate the percent concentration by comparing the calculated density (mass/ volume) of the resulting solution to a known value in the chart.

Steve

 

[viacin]

Ty Steve. You simplified it very well.

So, figuring the molar mass of nitric acid = 1+14+(16*3)=63. Then the amount of nitrate ion in one mole of nitric acid =14+16*3=62. So, there are 62 g nitric ion in 63 g nitric acid. So by cross multiplication you can figure how many g there are in 100 g nitric acid. (62x100) /63 = about 98.4g nitrate ions per 100g of 100% HNO3.

So, calculating the percent HNO3 by mass per 1000ml. HNO3 is 1.42g/ml density. 1.42 x 1000 = 1420 g/1000ml. 1000/100 = 10. 10x 98.4 = 984g per 1000ml of 100%, or 98.4% actual nitric acid, or 1.6% impurities.

So, increasing your formula by a factor of 10, twenty moles of nitric in 1000ml would look like:

630g/(630g+1000g)x100%x98.4% =
(630g/1630g) x 100% x 98.4% =
.3865 x 100% x 98.4% = 38.03% (ok, what did I do wrong?)

Something doesn't look right, what did I miss?

But working backwards here...if I followed your cold process perfectly and lost nothing, and if I wanted 800 ml of nitirc acid at 55% I would add 500 ml of water, 850g of NaNO3, and 280 ml of H2SO4.

my lack of knowledge on the subject forces me to assume I'm wrong.