Extreme amount of Gold plating?!

[reignofonebass]

Not entirely sure why you're doing an acid test. It's gold.

He's trying to determine the thickness of the gold, but it's too thick to react with the copper below. :lol:

I thought I had already covered that but hey I guess if you ask enough people you'll eventually get the answer you want. Regardless of whether it's right or not. :lol:

People don't trust you.

You had said that, but other people told him it was just enig...because that's what everybody thinks any visible gold is.

I'm yet to find an occasion where you are wrong in what you share, you just limit what you share.

For what it's worth. I think he's right. I got about 300g in an AP bath right now. It's breaking off in larger chunks, and also some smaller chunks. The 400ml it's in is littered with Gold right now. I'll send a pic when I get my gloves, suit, and respirator back on before I go into work


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[reignofonebass]

Not entirely sure why you're doing an acid test. It's gold.

He's trying to determine the thickness of the gold, but it's too thick to react with the copper below. :lol:

I thought I had already covered that but hey I guess if you ask enough people you'll eventually get the answer you want. Regardless of whether it's right or not. :lol:

People don't trust you.

You had said that, but other people told him it was just enig...because that's what everybody thinks any visible gold is.

I'm yet to find an occasion where you are wrong in what you share, you just limit what you share.

For what it's worth. I think he's right. I got about 300g in an AP bath right now. It's breaking off in larger chunks, and also some smaller chunks. The 400ml it's in is littered with Gold right now. I'll send a pic when I get my gloves, suit, and respirator back on before I go into work


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Here is a pic of what I pulled off of one of the boards.

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[reignofonebass]

Not entirely sure why you're doing an acid test. It's gold.

He's trying to determine the thickness of the gold, but it's too thick to react with the copper below. :lol:

I thought I had already covered that but hey I guess if you ask enough people you'll eventually get the answer you want. Regardless of whether it's right or not. :lol:

People don't trust you.

You had said that, but other people told him it was just enig...because that's what everybody thinks any visible gold is.

I'm yet to find an occasion where you are wrong in what you share, you just limit what you share.

For what it's worth. I think he's right. I got about 300g in an AP bath right now. It's breaking off in larger chunks, and also some smaller chunks. The 400ml it's in is littered with Gold right now. I'll send a pic when I get my gloves, suit, and respirator back on before I go into work


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Here is a pic of what I pulled off of one of the boards.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And some more pics



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[reignofonebass]

Not entirely sure why you're doing an acid test. It's gold.

He's trying to determine the thickness of the gold, but it's too thick to react with the copper below. :lol:

I thought I had already covered that but hey I guess if you ask enough people you'll eventually get the answer you want. Regardless of whether it's right or not. :lol:

People don't trust you.

You had said that, but other people told him it was just enig...because that's what everybody thinks any visible gold is.

I'm yet to find an occasion where you are wrong in what you share, you just limit what you share.

For what it's worth. I think he's right. I got about 300g in an AP bath right now. It's breaking off in larger chunks, and also some smaller chunks. The 400ml it's in is littered with Gold right now. I'll send a pic when I get my gloves, suit, and respirator back on before I go into work


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Here is a pic of what I pulled off of one of the boards.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And some more pics



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And some more

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[anachronism]

People don't trust you.

You had said that, but other people told him it was just enig...because that's what everybody thinks any visible gold is.

I'm yet to find an occasion where you are wrong in what you share, you just limit what you share.

Well I think I've about heard it all now.

 

[snoman70]

People don't trust you.

You had said that, but other people told him it was just enig...because that's what everybody thinks any visible gold is.

I'm yet to find an occasion where you are wrong in what you share, you just limit what you share.

Well I think I've about heard it all now.

Bahaaa....not even close my friend. Not even close.


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[anachronism]

What does that mean? Please enlighten us all. You've chucked a pretty harsh accusation out there and then come back with a cryptic reply - from multiple accounts I might add, so please explain yourself.

 

[g_axelsson]

Just watched successful engineers ENIG video. So I have the 14kt gold test kit which is not just nitric acid, but nitric and HCO combined. When I drop it on the plating, it takes about 3-4 minutes to start reacting in the manner in the video. .. do I assume this is not ENIG based on these findings?

I assume your test acid is nitric acid and HCl.

That test acid is dissolving gold too, so it will not react in the same way as the pure nitric acid successful engineer is using. You can use this test acid but you need a baseline to compare with.
For example using an old computer memory, the fingers are gold plated. And as an ENIG sample you can use any consumer grade board with golden solder pads.

Another way to test plating is to use a pencil eraser, it rubs off the gold and exposes the white nickel below. It takes some experimenting and experience but it is a simple and fast method used in the plating industry. And you need known samples to compare to in this case too.

High grade or low grade depends on the process the person is using, chemical costs, waste amount, how we value our time and so on. The large surface area that are gold covered and the plastic top BGA:s makes these boards good in amount of gold per board at the same time the large boards would be a lot harder to process compared to gold plated fingers.

A large refinery is recovering the copper too so the copper is a bonus. For the home refiner, even if we recover the copper it costs more to dissolve it than we get paid for the copper in the end, so the copper is a cost. Depending on your prices of chemicals, to recover the ENIG gold it might cost more than the gold is worth. In this case, selling the cards looks better all the time.

This type of boards is the sort I'm stockpiling, I don't care about processing it myself at the moment but I want to be paid for the full gold content so some day I will send out tons of boards to someone that pay on assay. I'm not yet there, but sometime in the future.

The difference between enig and gold plate can be seen in this thread. There were a couple of gold covered distances (probably enig) that I first dissolved in the test tube, it only produced a fine powder of gold on the bottom. Compare it to the plated finger and you realize quickly that the plating is a lot thicker.
http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=23737

If you want some easy gold, cherry pick the BGA:s and don't mess with the ENIG.

Göran

 

[reignofonebass]

Just watched successful engineers ENIG video. So I have the 14kt gold test kit which is not just nitric acid, but nitric and HCO combined. When I drop it on the plating, it takes about 3-4 minutes to start reacting in the manner in the video. .. do I assume this is not ENIG based on these findings?

I assume your test acid is nitric acid and HCl.

That test acid is dissolving gold too, so it will not react in the same way as the pure nitric acid successful engineer is using. You can use this test acid but you need a baseline to compare with.
For example using an old computer memory, the fingers are gold plated. And as an ENIG sample you can use any consumer grade board with golden solder pads.

Another way to test plating is to use a pencil eraser, it rubs off the gold and exposes the white nickel below. It takes some experimenting and experience but it is a simple and fast method used in the plating industry. And you need known samples to compare to in this case too.

High grade or low grade depends on the process the person is using, chemical costs, waste amount, how we value our time and so on. The large surface area that are gold covered and the plastic top BGA:s makes these boards good in amount of gold per board at the same time the large boards would be a lot harder to process compared to gold plated fingers.

A large refinery is recovering the copper too so the copper is a bonus. For the home refiner, even if we recover the copper it costs more to dissolve it than we get paid for the copper in the end, so the copper is a cost. Depending on your prices of chemicals, to recover the ENIG gold it might cost more than the gold is worth. In this case, selling the cards looks better all the time.

This type of boards is the sort I'm stockpiling, I don't care about processing it myself at the moment but I want to be paid for the full gold content so some day I will send out tons of boards to someone that pay on assay. I'm not yet there, but sometime in the future.

The difference between enig and gold plate can be seen in this thread. There were a couple of gold covered distances (probably enig) that I first dissolved in the test tube, it only produced a fine powder of gold on the bottom. Compare it to the plated finger and you realize quickly that the plating is a lot thicker.
http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=23737

If you want some easy gold, cherry pick the BGA:s and don't mess with the ENIG.

Göran

What dollar figure would you buy these for?

And I'll take some more pics tonight. Looks like the gold flakes are coming off in the HCI &a Hydrogen peroxide solution in about 1/16 - 1/8th inch pieces..


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[g_axelsson]

I can't give a dollar figure without testing a representative sample or I have to lowball the numbers.

Most of my scrap I get for free, several companies gives me their scrap if I just take it all, the good and the bad parts. I'm refining as a hobby so scrapping computers or sorting cables is fun and I'm not counting my time as a cost. In that case even the iron case from computers are an income.

The one time I've paid for scrap I paid a dollar a kilo for 100 kilo of graphic cards and other expansion cards.

I recommend that you look at boardsort or another company buying cards to get a feeling of what values are in scrap boards generally.

I would probably base a valuation on the amount of BGA:s and not on the visible gold. It's pretty but it would take a lot of time and money to get it out.

Göran

 

[snoman701]

What dollar figure would you buy these for?

And I'll take some more pics tonight. Looks like the gold flakes are coming off in the HCI &a Hydrogen peroxide solution in about 1/16 - 1/8th inch pieces..


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When I buy these, I buy them as the whole unit, in the aluminum case. I pay 0.30/lb for the entire unit. I then scrap the aluminum back out for about 0.33 / lb. I usually break even.

If I were to find some of these in the clean boards, my price ranges between 0.30/lb and 5.00/lb depending on who I'm buying from.

Most likely, I'd be paying around $3.00 / lb cash. If check, I could probably do a bit more, but I am limited on my weekly allowance. Boardsort will pay telecom on them which is around $4.00 / lb, check.

Now...if I could find some of the technicians that are uninstalling them, most would be very happy to sell me the entire units for 0.30/lb, as the yards are only paying them 0.09/lb.

Frankly, 100's of lbs a week of boards is a lot of takeapart. Those things are buried behind a billion screws. I am fast, but takeapart gets old. I've always got a pile of it going.

I lowball all my buys, and have to really want something before I'll pay more. Frankly, most of what I buy is 0.30/lb...I've just learned what hidden values are. All I have to spend is my weekly allowance. I'll pile the boards up until I have a bunch, then I'll toll them out.

 

[reignofonebass]

What dollar figure would you buy these for?

And I'll take some more pics tonight. Looks like the gold flakes are coming off in the HCI &a Hydrogen peroxide solution in about 1/16 - 1/8th inch pieces..


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When I buy these, I buy them as the whole unit, in the aluminum case. I pay 0.30/lb for the entire unit. I then scrap the aluminum back out for about 0.33 / lb. I usually break even.

If I were to find some of these in the clean boards, my price ranges between 0.30/lb and 5.00/lb depending on who I'm buying from.

Most likely, I'd be paying around $3.00 / lb cash. If check, I could probably do a bit more, but I am limited on my weekly allowance. Boardsort will pay telecom on them which is around $4.00 / lb, check.

Now...if I could find some of the technicians that are uninstalling them, most would be very happy to sell me the entire units for 0.30/lb, as the yards are only paying them 0.09/lb.

Frankly, 100's of lbs a week of boards is a lot of takeapart. Those things are buried behind a billion screws. I am fast, but takeapart gets old. I've always got a pile of it going.

I lowball all my buys, and have to really want something before I'll pay more. Frankly, most of what I buy is 0.30/lb...I've just learned what hidden values are. All I have to spend is my weekly allowance. I'll pile the boards up until I have a bunch, then I'll toll them out.

I understand that, and yes, I get these out of the box and they are about 300 screws to get apart.

Honestly, I love tinkering. I love learning new things. Chemistry is something I've always been interested in so this is right down my alley.

I've been separating aluminum / boards / copper.

One thing I can't identify is the modules themselves which appear to have a lot of silver. It's not aluminum because it's too heavy. And I know it isn't steel. It's shinier than polished aluminum.. may be a lot more cash there?


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[snoman701]

Post a picture. Is it magnetic?

Likely silver or nickel plated steel.

Jon is probably right, these are silver plated on the inside. I don't actually have the radio cards...I had all the other modules in the rack, but not the radio cards. Theoretically, cleaning silver off from aluminum is really easy...you just dip in nitric acid. The aluminum is non-reactive, or at least reacts very slowly, so the silver is dissolved into silver nitrate. Problem is, the million and one screws to get all of the plated crap off. With silver only being worth 0.50/g, I can't see those million screws being worth the few grams I'd get.

It has been rumored that there is solid silver in some of these though. Jon?? We may not trust you, but we are curious if you have you have an opinion. lol

So are you a tower climber, or just a tech guy? I'm still trying to figure out how to meet these guys around here!

 

[reignofonebass]

Post a picture. Is it magnetic?

Likely silver or nickel plated steel.

Jon is probably right, these are silver plated on the inside. I don't actually have the radio cards...I had all the other modules in the rack, but not the radio cards. Theoretically, cleaning silver off from aluminum is really easy...you just dip in nitric acid. The aluminum is non-reactive, or at least reacts very slowly, so the silver is dissolved into silver nitrate. Problem is, the million and one screws to get all of the plated crap off. With silver only being worth 0.50/g, I can't see those million screws being worth the few grams I'd get.

It has been rumored that there is solid silver in some of these though. Jon?? We may not trust you, but we are curious if you have you have an opinion. lol

So are you a tower climber, or just a tech guy? I'm still trying to figure out how to meet these guys around here!

I wish I had access to nitric acid. Can't buy it anywhere... would make my life much easier and I don't want to deal with agency's watching my every move lol

I manage all the guys who do the work on the tower and in the shelter. Used to be a site engineer before I was promoted.

I'll send a pic when I get home


I'm including part numbers in the pics attached here. I have been able to find any documents indicating the specs on the plating for these boards. If anyone has resources I don't. Please let me know!

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[eastky2]

Are you using a bubbler in the AP or just a bucket containing AP and stirring or shaking the bucket every so often?

Gold foils will hold together or breakup into small pieces depending on the amount of agitation of the liquid.

Little or no agitation the gold will come off in large pieces. Takes longer for the foils to release from the base metals. A lot of agitation and the foils will come off in smaller pieces and will release quicker.

 

[eastky2]

What does that mean? Please enlighten us all. You've chucked a pretty harsh accusation out there and then come back with a cryptic reply - from multiple accounts I might add, so please explain yourself.

Jon I don't think he meant any harm. I think you might of misunderstood the way he put his reply.

Putting all bickering aside. Even though I find you abrasive in some of your replies to people I do read all your post.

I will say that you have learned the gold recovery from ewaste very well.

I will say if you replied to a post and told someone to pass on trying to recover the gold from something you know what your talking about. If I come across the same thing I will pass it on.

All through this forum there are nuggets that people seem to pass on. I read all the post here. Just because someone doesn't have a lot of post on here doesn't mean they don't throw out a nugget every once in awhile.

Jon I want you to know the most important thing I have gained from you here on the forum is the following statement. When the people in the USA realize how much metals that are really in ewaste.

Now people can go and search for that phrase. Thanks Jon

 

[reignofonebass]

Are you using a bubbler in the AP or just a bucket containing AP and stirring or shaking the bucket every so often?

Gold foils will hold together or breakup into small pieces depending on the amount of agitation of the liquid.

Little or no agitation the gold will come off in large pieces. Takes longer for the foils to release from the base metals. A lot of agitation and the foils will come off in smaller pieces and will release quicker.

No bubbler, just stirring every day.


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[anachronism]

Thanks East. I hear you. I get a bit tetchy when my integrity is apparently questioned. I'm a lot of things but I'm not dishonest. 8)

Jon

 

[snoman701]

What does that mean? Please enlighten us all. You've chucked a pretty harsh accusation out there and then come back with a cryptic reply - from multiple accounts I might add, so please explain yourself.

Oh Jon...you are much too sensitive today. Please see both of my posts:

That was my point...I trust Anachronism's posts when it comes to thickness and value of the boards. I do believe them to be of value, greater than consumer great equipment.

I'm yet to find an occasion where you are wrong in what you share, you just limit what you share.

Seriously Jon...no insults intended. I find your nuggets of information to be invaluable. I was honestly confused as to how so many people kept saying ENIG after you pointed out that you deal in tons of these boards, and that the coating is not ENIG. That motivated my sarcastic comment...when you posted so clearly that these are of value, and others kept calling them ENIG.

I have a tremendous amount of respect for your abrasive personality...please remember that any time you may feel that I have rubbed you the wrong way.

 

[anachronism]

Although it might be one of Butcher's "kiss my *** moments" I'm not sensitive more protective. :lol:

Thanks for the explanation though I do appreciate it, and I will find a way to return the "favour" :twisted: