poor mans aqua regia

[prospector pete]

as far as im aware , its the same as normal aqua regia except you use bleach instead of nitric.
i make my mix , 2/3 hcl and 1/3 household bleach .

No that’s not poor mans AR, to make poormans you use Hcl and a nitrate instead of nitric.

well actually bleach or nitrate can be used.....
iuse bleach and never have any probs. there are also lots of videos of people using bleach

 

[FrugalRefiner]

Pete, yes HCl and bleach can be used to dissolve gold. So can HCl and H₂O₂, HCl and chlorate, etc., but they are not poor man's AR. It's like calling a chicken sandwich a hamburger. You can eat them both and they'll both fill your belly, but only the hamburger is a hamburger. Only HCl and a nitrate source is poor man's AR. We try hard to keep the information on this site accurate, despite what you may see on youtube.

Dave

 

[Alondro]

Add the Sodium Nitrate in increments, not all at once.

If you get Sodium Nitrate prills, it's better to dissolve them in a little hot water first. They have a polymer anti-caking coating that makes them dissolve very slowly.

The other day, I dissolved .22 oz of low carat Gold in poor man's AR a couple of 24/40 erlenmyer flasks connected with silicone tubing. One was the digestor, the other had a frit bubbler in a solution of Sodium Carbonate and Hydrogen Peroxide as a NOx scrubber. It converted the NOx to Sodium Nitrate. Most of the NOx reacted at the frit. The few bubbles that reached the surface reacted with the Oxygen given off by the Hydrogen Peroxide, turning Red than disappearing as the NOx was converted to Nitric Acid and absorbed by the solution.

There were almost no fumes emitted.

Ooo! Now that looks like an ever better method for re-capturing the NO2 than simply reforming nitric acid. Thinking about it, making the neutral sodium nitrate should push the reaction equilibrium even further towards making more nitrate.

What amounts of peroxide (at which concentration) and sodium carbonate do you use per liter of water?

 

[FrugalRefiner]

Alondro, if you're directing your question to Irons, you may be waiting for an answer. When responding / quoting old posts, it is useful to move your cursor over the member's name or avatar. You can see when they joined, and when they last visited. In this case, Irons hasn't been here since Sept. 26, 2016.

I miss our old friend.

Dave

 

[Alondro]

Alondro, if you're directing your question to Irons, you may be waiting for an answer. When responding / quoting old posts, it is useful to move your cursor over the member's name or avatar. You can see when they joined, and when they last visited. In this case, Irons hasn't been here since Sept. 26, 2016.

I miss our old friend.

Dave

Ah, well it looks like from the rest of the thread I basically need to dissolve as much sodium carbonate as possible into the peroxide and use the solution until bubbles of NO2 start to make it to the surface, at which point it's saturated with sodium nitrate.

 

[FrugalRefiner]

It's OK to ask questions, and I'm glad you're studying through old threads. Someone else may provide an answer. Just didn't want you to be waiting for an answer from a particular member.

Dave

 

[Racoon]

Pete, yes HCl and bleach can be used to dissolve gold. So can HCl and H₂O₂, HCl and chlorate, etc., but they are not poor man's AR. It's like calling a chicken sandwich a hamburger. You can eat them both and they'll both fill your belly, but only the hamburger is a hamburger. Only HCl and a nitrate source is poor man's AR. We try hard to keep the information on this site accurate, despite what you may see on youtube.

Dave

Bleach will drop gold, but it won’t drop all the gold. One of the people on you tube tried it and less than half was dropped.

 

[orvi]

Bleach will drop gold, but it won’t drop all the gold. One of the people on you tube tried it and less than half was dropped.

Bleach is hypochlorite. In acidic media, it evolves chlorine, which is strong oxidizing agent. Hypochlorite alone is strong oxidizer, and I doubt it could reduce elemental gold from solution.

 

[Yggdrasil]

As far as I know, bleach do not drop gold.
But added in sufficient amount it may increase the ph enough to drop all salts as hydroxides.
But it is not gold, silver or copper.
It is just a other salt, a hydroxide of said metal.

 

[waampoi]

Sodium Carbonate because it's quite soluble(220g/l @20deg C.), inexpensive and available in the grocery store as Washing Soda. It reacts with the Nitric Acid to produce Sodium Nitrate and Carbon Dioxide. The Hydrogen peroxide reacts with the NOx to produce Nitric Acid.

Keeping it cool is no problem this time of year. Even if there is a little contamination from Chlorine, the resulting Sodium Nitrate is still usable for making Poor Man's AR.

It's better than breathing NOx and Chlorine.

A frit is just a fancy, expensive and chemical resistant aquarium stone.

I would prefer using Potassium Carbonate to get Potassium Nitrate but the Carbonate is more expensive than the Nitrate. If you burn wood, the ashes can be leached to get Potassium Carbonate.

can I have more detail on leaching ashes?