Precipitate tin and copper selectively

[mr.data]

There is a lot of CPU coolers here and my plan is to shred them, put them in a HCl solution and let it dissolve over time.
I will end up with a solution of tin, aluminium and copper if everything goes according plan.
Is there a method to precipitate the tin and copper out of the solution seperately?

 

[anachronism]

There is a lot of CPU coolers here and my plan is to shred them, put them in a HCl solution and let it dissolve over time.
I will end up with a solution of tin, aluminium and copper if everything goes according plan.
Is there a method to precipitate the tin and copper out of the solution seperately?

Hi there. This will be remarkably inefficient and will leave you with less money than you could have got by other means. I wouldn't get liquids involved in this process at all.

 

[Martijn]

There is a lot of CPU coolers here and my plan is to shred them, put them in a HCl solution and let it dissolve over time.
I will end up with a solution of tin, aluminium and copper if everything goes according plan.
Is there a method to precipitate the tin and copper out of the solution seperately?

Copper does not dissolve in HCl without an oxidizer. Are you attempting to get the tin out of a bronze alloy or from solder?
As anachronism said, there will not be much profit in it, it could even be a loss, counting your time as well.
I would sell it as copper 2 and use the time for something profitable.
Look at the price difference between number 1 and 2 copper, and look at the time and materials invested to "refine" one Kg of copper this way.. that's a lot of work for 2 dollars.

 

[mr.data]

Sounds clear. Thanks for pointing that out. I do want to make money from this copper but right now it is aluminium parts coldered on copper parts.
When I sell it this dirty I get about .25C per kg and pure copper sells about 5E per kg.
Would the best way be to just seperate the aluminium and then melt the copper along with the tin?

 

[Yggdrasil]

Sounds clear. Thanks for pointing that out. I do want to make money from this copper but right now it is aluminium parts coldered on copper parts.
When I sell it this dirty I get about .25C per kg and pure copper sells about 5E per kg.
Would the best way be to just seperate the aluminium and then melt the copper along with the tin?

HCl dissolves Aluminum, so separate as good as possible mechanically and then see if a soak in dilute HCl may remove the Al in a sufficient matter.
If not, there might not be much to do about it I'm afraid.

 

[anarxi]

There is a lot of CPU coolers here and my plan is to shred them, put them in a HCl solution and let it dissolve over time.
I will end up with a solution of tin, aluminium and copper if everything goes according plan.
Is there a method to precipitate the tin and copper out of the solution seperately?

there is such a video
it is in Russian
first dissolution in a mixture of sulfuric and nitric acids.
some use electrolyte for lead batteries and ammonium nitrate,
then electrolysis.
i have not tried to do it myself
recovered tin is very difficult to melt.
it must be done without access to oxygen.
tin is usually 3 times more expensive than copper.
it makes sense to bother...

 

[Shark]

Copper soldered to aluminum, separate at the joint and sell them off. Use the time and money saved to look for more materials, hopefully some that has more value. Getting every dollar we can from scrap is always a goal but at some point the profit just doesn't cover the cost, especially if we value any cost of labor. For the experience and learning, yes, and I have done things that weren't profitable just to learn how it is done.

 

[anachronism]

From a purely practical point - how many of us have seen the result of dissolving Aluminium in HCl in quantity? It's a right mess I can promise you.

 

[Yggdrasil]

From a purely practical point - how many of us have seen the result of dissolving Aluminium in HCl in quantity? It's a right mess I can promise you.

It was intended as a test proposal, anyhow it will be just what you don't manage to physically remove.

 

[anachronism]

It was intended as a test proposal, anyhow it will be just what you don't manage to physically remove.

Yeah I get that mate. My understanding of the proposal was to shred them then use liquids. Did I read the OP wrong, because there's no mention in that of physically removing anything at all.

 

[mr.data]

Yeah I get that mate. My understanding of the proposal was to shred them then use liquids. Did I read the OP wrong, because there's no mention in that of physically removing anything at all.

You are indeed right but now it's physical removing and testing. Then calculating and shredding because if I can sell it for 35C per kg it means that I can also buy it for that amount apart from the kgs we have each month.

I am still figuring out on where to increase the profits with the metals and PMs from our e-waste. It also must be scalable but if I don't know much about it then scaling is not yet in the picture

 

[anarxi]

if you just want to remove aluminum from copper, then it is enough to heat it to 700 degrees Celsius and the aluminum will flow off the copper itself.

 

[anachronism]

You are indeed right but now it's physical removing and testing. Then calculating and shredding because if I can sell it for 35C per kg it means that I can also buy it for that amount apart from the kgs we have each month.

I am still figuring out on where to increase the profits with the metals and PMs from our e-waste. It also must be scalable but if I don't know much about it then scaling is not yet in the picture

Oh please believe me I am so much on the same page with you here . We process tonnes of these per month and have tried all kinds of mechanical means to separate including shred and optical sort. That doesnt work because of the fact most have silver looking plating over the copper. We're also trying shred and granulate and density separation shortly.

It's annoying because the value both you and I return for the mixed product is but a fraction of the true worth right?

 

[canedane]

I seel my alu/cobber coolers here https://bradal.dk/prisliste/ and get around 3 Euro/kg. It must be free from iron, and be a quality like the picture.
Henrik

 

[galenrog]

Sounds clear. Thanks for pointing that out. I do want to make money from this copper but right now it is aluminium parts coldered on copper parts.
When I sell it this dirty I get about .25C per kg and pure copper sells about 5E per kg.
Would the best way be to just seperate the aluminium and then melt the copper along with the tin?

What I used to do with mixed metals soldered to one another was get out the propane torch and melt the solder, freeing the separate parts. In your case, I would throw the solder bearing dirty aluminum in one bin, and the solder bearing dirty copper in another. Easy.

Time for more coffee.

 

[mr.data]

Oh please believe me I am so much on the same page with you here . We process tonnes of these per month and have tried all kinds of mechanical means to separate including shred and optical sort. That doesnt work because of the fact most have silver looking plating over the copper. We're also trying shred and granulate and density separation shortly.

It's annoying because the value both you and I return for the mixed product is but a fraction of the true worth right?

That is very interesting! I suppose then that you are after the highest percentages of pure products as well then right?

I know there are a lot of ways to get the desired results with new methods being produced almost every day but when someone develops it, it is either kept secret or patented ASAP. At least that is the perspective I have when trying to find the optimal methods.
With granulation you should theoretically get a high percentage yield on multiple metals but the purity wont be optimal. Now for copper I suppose this wont be a problem but if your after the high value tin I think you need a high purity right?

 

[mr.data]

What I used to do with mixed metals soldered to one another was get out the propane torch and melt the solder, freeing the separate parts. In your case, I would throw the solder bearing dirty aluminum in one bin, and the solder bearing dirty copper in another. Easy.

Time for more coffee.

I have tried with the propane torch and it is indeed possible to separate it that way. Thought about using a heat drum but then I lose the tin. The aluminium I am not that concerned about because the yield is not high enough to spend much time with it

 

[GoIdman]

There is a lot of CPU coolers here and my plan is to shred them, put them in a HCl solution and let it dissolve over time.
I will end up with a solution of tin, aluminium and copper if everything goes according plan.
Is there a method to precipitate the tin and copper out of the solution seperately?

Hi,

Do you have any pictures of the material?

Pete

 

[mr.data]

Hi,

Do you have any pictures of the material?

Pete

Yes, these are the coolers.
The other image shows the tin that is on there.
There is excessive amounts of tin used thats why I think its feasable to recover that as well

 

[Martijn]

I think the 35C per Kilogram is because of the heat transfer liquid that is in these heatsinks that make recovery and most important these days: environmentally friendly waste disposal more difficult than with solid aluminum and copper heatsinks.
Be very carefull and very responsible please!!

Applying melting heat to it may not be your best option.
first concern I would have is> what is in it exactly? Then make a plan about heating or smelting based on those material properties..

Another point; molten (base) metals are great solvents for precious metals and other base metals.
Solubility of copper in molten aluminum is about 5%, but lead and tin can absorb a lot more, so melting one metal and leaving the other intact can be a challenge. you could make an alloy that is harder to separate.

E.g.: when you melt lead with gold, the gold will go in solution at around 300C in stead of its melting temp of about 1000C !!