Processing mobile phone parts
- Thread starter Zolotov
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kernels
Well-known member
Zolotov said:
Good luck, looking forward to hearing your results.
at what cost?shmandi said:
this is an electrolytic cell that I can make at home. not a rocket science, if you ask me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9J4hcbX0R0
you don't even need electricity for the motor, just use a wind generator
Where to start...
Scale do affect recovery rate. There is always losses in every process, amount of gold held back in a filter for example is the same if you are filtering 0.1 or 10 liters. Improper incineration and then AR treatment locks up some gold in any carbon left. Gold locked inside components can be hard to get for a hobby refiner.
The big guys smelt the material and create copper bars, in the process most of the precious metals are collected and recovered in the copper electrolysis step. That way they can get a more complete recovery than someone working in the backyard.
Why not mixing materials... because it's impossible to get a complete separation of it afterwards. If the processing is the same after incineration then there is no problem with mixing it, but if there is different base metals or processing methods then mixing creates more job or even higher losses.
And that electrolysis cell... maybe not rocket science but they still managed to make a big mistake... any contamination that doesn't dissolve would form an anode sludge at the bottom or in an anode bag, putting a stirrer without bagging the anodes will have the contamination suspended in the solution and it can mechanically be included in the finished product, lowering the purity. Then measuring 99.99% purity with XRF... I don't trust it.
Göran
Scale do affect recovery rate. There is always losses in every process, amount of gold held back in a filter for example is the same if you are filtering 0.1 or 10 liters. Improper incineration and then AR treatment locks up some gold in any carbon left. Gold locked inside components can be hard to get for a hobby refiner.
The big guys smelt the material and create copper bars, in the process most of the precious metals are collected and recovered in the copper electrolysis step. That way they can get a more complete recovery than someone working in the backyard.
Why not mixing materials... because it's impossible to get a complete separation of it afterwards. If the processing is the same after incineration then there is no problem with mixing it, but if there is different base metals or processing methods then mixing creates more job or even higher losses.
And that electrolysis cell... maybe not rocket science but they still managed to make a big mistake... any contamination that doesn't dissolve would form an anode sludge at the bottom or in an anode bag, putting a stirrer without bagging the anodes will have the contamination suspended in the solution and it can mechanically be included in the finished product, lowering the purity. Then measuring 99.99% purity with XRF... I don't trust it.
Göran
No, it is not a rocket science. But even rocket you can make at home.
If you do the process that industry does manually, you will get very old before you get any result. And your profit will be negative.
You need to separate metallic and non metalic parts. You need to separate ferrous and other metals. Then you can start recovery and refining is the last step.
The way I read you, you would just toss everything in AR. Yes, hard way is also a way to learn...
If you do the process that industry does manually, you will get very old before you get any result. And your profit will be negative.
You need to separate metallic and non metalic parts. You need to separate ferrous and other metals. Then you can start recovery and refining is the last step.
The way I read you, you would just toss everything in AR. Yes, hard way is also a way to learn...
patnor1011
Well-known member
In the video you got "inspiration" from they process inquarted gold not cell phones. Big difference. Aqua Regia is stuff to be used on purifying dirty gold powder, processing rest of inquarted karat gold after nitric digestion of silver, perhaps ceramic cpu and cpu pins but certainly not on anything you do have on your pictures.
Maybe your problem is language barrier? Where are you from? I think that there may be experienced members here from your country which may be able to guide you or explain basics to you.
Maybe your problem is language barrier? Where are you from? I think that there may be experienced members here from your country which may be able to guide you or explain basics to you.
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Well Pat, whatever his inspiration, he clearly knows more than most of us.
kernels
Well-known member
shmandi said:
Quote of the day :lol:
rickbb
Well-known member
anachronism said:
Makes one wonder why he's here asking questions at all.
Topher_osAUrus
Well-known member
kernels said:
:lol:
Yes....yes it is. But, isn't it better to learn via reading about the processes, and seeing the issues that others have encountered by doing the same thing that you propose? It may take some time to go over and read everything here on the forum in regards to escrap in AR.. But, that time you will spend doing that is EXPONENTIALLY less than the time you will kill by just "dumping it all together and let 'her rip!" then trying to figure out "where's my gold?!?".
Nobody here is trying to be condescending, on the contrary, we are all trying to help you not do foolish things that we have all done!
g_axelsson said:
Thanks!
By any chance, do you know the name of the process in the academic world? Because I was trying to google "copper electrolysis" and can't find anything except extracting or purifying copper.
However I found this document:
http://www.ct.ufrgs.br/ntcm/graduacao/ENG06631/5-b_copper.pdf
"Ag, Au and Pt are more noble than copper and therefore will not dissolve
anodically. They will be found as metals in the anode slime;"
I do not understand fully what does it talk about, but looks like the document is on subject.
That document is spot on, and should be enough for building a copper refining cell. If you don't understand it you are lacking basic knowledge and you need to study more. "Electrorefining of copper" is the right scientific and engineering term.
Producing high enough copper quality by smelting isn't easy, you need to remove iron, zinc and other contamination first before the copper is good enough to be run in a cell without fouling the electrolyte too fast. This is a process that works best at a larger scale. The copper refinery close to me is running the copper smelter with batch sizes of hundreds of tons per melt.
There are some members that is refining electronics by smelting and a number of threads is discussing that. Use the forum search and study a lot more.
It is also considered good tone here on the forum to at least tell us where in the world you are from. You can do it in the user control panel. Rules, regulations, chemical names and availability differs between different geographical regions.
Göran
Producing high enough copper quality by smelting isn't easy, you need to remove iron, zinc and other contamination first before the copper is good enough to be run in a cell without fouling the electrolyte too fast. This is a process that works best at a larger scale. The copper refinery close to me is running the copper smelter with batch sizes of hundreds of tons per melt.
There are some members that is refining electronics by smelting and a number of threads is discussing that. Use the forum search and study a lot more.
It is also considered good tone here on the forum to at least tell us where in the world you are from. You can do it in the user control panel. Rules, regulations, chemical names and availability differs between different geographical regions.
Göran
I separated the ashes in ferrous (right) and non-ferrous (left) with the magnet.
and I panned it, but didn't find any visible gold wires.
I wonder if it would be better to pass the ashes through HCl to remove the tin (and iron if some of it is still present) before trying AR ?
and I panned it, but didn't find any visible gold wires.
I wonder if it would be better to pass the ashes through HCl to remove the tin (and iron if some of it is still present) before trying AR ?
Just remember to test your solutions. Some of your pd can go into hcl, and even some gold if there is enough oxygen or oxidizer present.
patnor1011
Well-known member
In order to recover bonding wires efficiently you need to incinerate and grind material to flour consistency. Your material is too coarse, wires are likely still trapped inside.
You do it opposite way. You need to incinerate, grind and sieve material first. Then separate ferrous metal parts which should be just wires and pieces of metal shielding/heatspreaders and not whole pieces of not crushed IC.
Do yourself a favor, read through my thread, read it all, and only then try it. You will then see how it has to be done instead of shooting in the dark.
You do it opposite way. You need to incinerate, grind and sieve material first. Then separate ferrous metal parts which should be just wires and pieces of metal shielding/heatspreaders and not whole pieces of not crushed IC.
Do yourself a favor, read through my thread, read it all, and only then try it. You will then see how it has to be done instead of shooting in the dark.
As far as I know in 4kg of Pcb you can get around 7g or a litle more
I think that is overly optimistic.
Some one with number might give you some heads up on this.
Most if not all, the values are inside the ICs and other components not the PCBs
Martijn
Well-known member
Before you incinerate you have to pyrolyze without oxygen, burn the released toxic gases completely and when everything is reduced to carbon, incinerate.
The way you did it only takes gold up in smoke and shortens your lifespan if those gases are inhaled.
Stop and study. There are no shortcuts here.
Suggest your idea before you try it.
As said, treat different components separately to recover the5 precious metals. Then refine to separate the values.
Edited: I just realized i replied to a five year old post...
Senn, you sure do get things confused.
Last edited:
100% coreect
100% coreect
These items we shall need for gold recovery from gold fingers.
- Nitric Acid (HNO3)
- Hydrochloric Acid (HCl)
- Sodium Metabisulfite (SMB)
- Urea
- Filter Paper
Dissolving:
Take gold fingers in bucket or beaker. Add HCl until gold fingers dip. If 1 liter HCl use then adds 250 ml water. Now add some nitric acid. Don’t add a large quantity of nitric acid. Only 50 to 100 ml nitric acid use every time. Add nitric acid until all metals of gold fingers dissolve. Leave the solution for four hours and give some shake after every hour.Precipitation:
After four hours filter the solution with filter paper or fabric.Wash well. After washing, add urea to neutralize nitric acid in our gold solution. If you don’t use. You will face trouble for precipitation of gold. Add urea until reaction and then give a twist to the solution. Take about 20-gram SMB for 1 kg gold fingers. Dissolve SMB(sodium metabisulfite) in 1-liter water. Then add SMB solution to the gold (royal water)solution. Leave it overnight
