Silver Boards

[nicknitro]

Hi all,

Just looking for some help finding threads on tackleing some old computer boards with a lot of silver plating and silver solder. I have little experience with silver, and from most of the threads I have read it seems like silver is pretty hard to seperate when mixed with other base metals.
I also have little sympathy for the old computer collectors, as with any precious commodity, the less there is the more valueable the rest becomes.

My base plan for attack would be to try and depopulate the boards the best I can. then I would try to identify any ferrous materials in the mix of melted solder / silver, removing large masses. Next , I would take the depopulated boards and any clean solder and place them in a 35% solution of nitric.

There will be lead compounds and probably Tin , mixed with the Silver Nitrate. Will they be filterable after Converting to Silver Chloride with salt?

Then ammonia to convert / "drop out?" Silver Metal.

This process is only going from recollection from other threads of silver refining. And again I'm mostly looking for help finding pertinant threads for dealing with these types of scrap boards.

I have also heard of many threads on silver cells for sterling silver as well. But they allude me when searching. Seems search will pull out newest threads with any mention of the search words.

Any help is appreciated, and thanks in advance. If interested in swaps, the boards are from an early Texas Instruments 99 model, it is complete, no power supply or RF just base unit silver colored. I prefer gold fingers, however the gold to silver value is pretty lopsided so I don't know if it would be worth it to anyone.

Can't wait to hear the replys to this one, LOL, No Lynching please.

Nick

 

[Harold_V]

Will they be filterable after Converting to Silver Chloride with salt?

No. If you dissolve tin in the mix (solder), you can expect the resulting solids to resist filtration. Tin assures you can't. However, you may be able to dissolve the silver chloride with ammonium hydroxide, then siphon the solution away from the remaining solids. All in all, a lot of work for very little value.

Then ammonia to convert / "drop out?" Silver Metal.

Ammonia does not convert or otherwise drop out silver. It is held in solution, but can be recovered as reasonably clean silver chloride by the addition of HCl if I remember correctly.

What troubles me is your expectation of finding considerable silver from boards. Silver is not generally used for boards, but may be found in the solder, albeit at low levels of concentration. Considering its low value, I would expect you'll be wasting your time with boards unless you pursue the more valuable components, possibly even ignoring silver completely.

Due to my lack of experience with e scrap, I may be wrong. You will be far better served by reading advice from those with more experience in processing such material. Lazersteve or GSP would likely be an excellent source of information.

Harold

 

[nicknitro]

Thanks Harold,

I again humble myself with lack of experience with silver refining. The reasonI suspect such a high silver content is from it's age. The TI 99 originally sold for 1200 dollars in like 1986 1985. All the contacts for removeable boards are silver instead of gold, and the board itself is very "lumpy" looking I don't know why assuming (ass u me) a lot of hand soldered components. Plus I have read other threads here, like the one arguing about the value of Nintendo Roms, scrap value/versus collector value. One of the posters mentioned scrapping a commodore 64, and produceing quite a bit of silver from it. I just purchased this Item to get a good knowledge base of computer systems make up. I paid 6 dollars from an online auction, silver at 13 dollars an ounce , if I get a half ounce as expected, plus the learning and silver experience, it was 6 dollars well spent.

I know you dealt mainly with karat jewelery and jewelers scraps harold, but I never underestimate yours or other members knowledge and insight.

I wish I had a camera available to show you what I mean Harold. These boards are really not what you would think of as E-Crap.

Nick

Incidently I have had no value returns from Nintendo Roms.

 

[nicknitro]

P.S . Harold,

Would you be willing to take a look at these boards? If I sent them to you? New experience? I wasn't really looking forward to trying to process them as they seem hard, so If you would like a new project, I would be happy with just an update???

Nick

 

[g_axelsson]

Hi all,
I also have little sympathy for the old computer collectors, as with any precious commodity, the less there is the more valueable the rest becomes.

My base plan for attack would be to try and depopulate the boards the best I can. then I would try to identify any ferrous materials in the mix of melted solder / silver, removing large masses. Next , I would take the depopulated boards and any clean solder and place them in a 35% solution of nitric.

There will be lead compounds and probably Tin , mixed with the Silver Nitrate. Will they be filterable after Converting to Silver Chloride with salt?

Then ammonia to convert / "drop out?" Silver Metal.
Nick

Firstly I don't understand your aversion towards classic computer collectors. You rather go after cents of value in PM:s than tens of dollars in the collecting community? In this case I don't care that much as a TI99 isn't that rare, only worth 20-50 dollars in running condition. You could only buy a gram or two of gold with that.

Secondly, why do you think there is a lot of silver on that board? It was made in a time when most solder contained tin and lead. Have you tested it?
Home computers of that age usually had tin plated fingers to keep price low. Gold plate was more expensive in that time.

Modern cards with lead free solders on the other hand could have as much as 4% silver in the solder. In Europe lead free electronics is usually marked with ROHS, the name of the directive banning lead in electronics.
My advice for separating silver from other base metals in solution is to cement it on copper. Only silver and more noble metals will cement out on the copper leaving base metals in solution. Then you could use a silver cell for final refining if you want really pure silver.

/Göran

 

[nicknitro]

P.P.S.

Harold,

Seems your memory is better than mine at the time, LOL.

Ammonia to put the silver chloride into solution, then Karo syrup to drop into silver metal. I missed a whole step. i will reread silver refining over again.

I Was mainly trying to find links to dealing with mixed PGM's (Silver Based) as this is a circuit board. :roll:

 

[nicknitro]

G axelson,

If you want it, just pay shipping, it is beyond my refining capabilities at the time. I appreciate your help with the cementing on copper advise.

Like I say I am open to a good home, ///i was just hopeing for an equal trade, as I said hard to do with value factor.

Nothing agaist vintage computer collectors, I still remember my first 8088 laptop by Bondwell. It was heavy as hell, but more reliable than todays GPU based computers. LOL.

Nick

 

[g_axelsson]

I tried to find the posting about silver in a commodore 64 but I can't find it. I would like to see some solid gain figures before I believe it is any larger amount of silver in that computer.
I have sold a couple of 64:s and I usually get 60-80 dollars for them in decent condition.

I have collected a few modern PC main boards that I'm going to try recover silver from the solders. Just for fun and to learn the technique so I understand your goal. But I think you could have started with a better source of scrap than a TI99.

But don't take my word for it. Now when you have your scrap, process it and report back the result. I might be wrong.

I appreciate the offer for a trade, I've been searching for a good deal on a running TI99 for a couple of years. I would have sent you a couple of ROHS cards in trade but there is a small obstacle called an ocean between us and the postage would be higher than the value of a non working TI99. And then it is the matter of TV standards, NTSC versus PAL....



/Göran

 

[nicknitro]

G axellson,

A site called Vintage computing has a working unit with all accesories for like 15 bucks plus shipping. http://marketplace.vintage-computer.com/index.php the guy selling the items is Erik Klein, and he is very nice, shipped mine out in a dell computer box with very nice packaging, and even took a loss on the shipping as he stated 3 dollars less in the auction. I tried to re compensate, but he told me he had it covered. Great Guy. Check out the site.


Nick

 

[nicknitro]

I was wrong again LOL.


OMG
Active Member


Joined: 22 Oct 2007
Posts: 245
Location: Kelowna
Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 2:59 pm Post subject:

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I wonder what you guys would say if I told you I tore apart my old pong game. It was full of silver!

 

[nicknitro]

Old Nintendo games

 

[Harold_V]

Harold,
Would you be willing to take a look at these boards? If I sent them to you? New experience? I wasn't really looking forward to trying to process them as they seem hard, so If you would like a new project, I would be happy with just an update???

I don't know that I'd be able to do much with them, Nick, but it would be interesting to see a picture of them if you can work it out.

When I sold the refining business, I let almost everything go. I have enough that I could make a small setup, including a few chemicals, but all my things are in storage with rare exception, so right now I'm pretty much unable to do much. We're living in the shop while we build our house, so even space is somewhat limited.

One thing I know for certain. I miss my fume hood in ways that are hard to understand. So many functions were carried out because I had the hood---functions that weren't necessarily connected to refining.

I have enough asbestos board left to build another hood. I'm giving it some thought. It would not be intended for refining, so filtration wouldn't be necessary. To me, if a hood isn't capable of dealing with flames, it wouldn't serve my needs. Thus the talk of asbestos.

Harold

 

[Juan Manuel Arcos Frank]

Nicknitro:

Yeahhhhh!!!!!....I totally agree with you....women are the most powerful money reducing agent known to man.

About silver you are in the right boat but in the wrong river...silver is better found in photoprocess solutions,batteries,mirrors,X ray,lithographic films,spent oxidation catalysts and the like.At least you have many tonns of boards you will get enough silver for bussiness.

Best Regards.
Manuel

 

[nicknitro]

Hi again all,

Thank you Juan.

It seems I will just hold on to these items then. Wait until there is more call for this computer. I guess it all depends on the popularity. Like baseball cards in 1990's. Where are all the local card shops now? LOL.

Thanks again Guys,

Nick

 

[butcher]

Tin
Sn---HCL dissloves.
Sn-- HNO3 somewhat dissolves but makes a slime--problems filtering.
Sn-- H2SO4 hot dilute dissolves.

Lead
Pb--Hcl slow but will dissolve (cool insoluble)-(boiling hot slightly soluble).
Pb--HNO3 conc, attacks but pasivates white salt (water soluble ) so dilute best.
Pb--H2SO4 dilute will not dissolve makes insoluble white salt.

Solder
lead tin solder-- HCL will dissolve brushing helps.
lead tin solder-- HNO3 will disolve but tin make slime(trouble to filter)
lead tin solder H2SO4 dilute may dissolve somewhat but lead sulfate insoluble and passivate it.

Silver
Ag--Hcl will not dissolve passivates(very little will dissolve in aqua regia passivates the gold if high content).
Ag--HNO3 easily dissolves to colorless solution.
Ag--silver will disslolve in hot conentrated to silver sulfate
Ag--will dissolve in ammonia ( but CAUTION do not let dry can form explosion hazard) I keep silver and ammonia seperate.

silver chloride, and lead chloride can be seperated by there solubility's, both are insoluble cold water, but lead chloride is slightly soluble in boiling hot water , and silver chloride is not soluble even in hot water.

knowing what will dissolve in which acid, and the solubilitys, can be a great help in this field.

 

[nicknitro]

Hey Butcher,

Been a while,

Hey would you be interested in these boards? Maybe Shipping, and an update on your results good or bad? You've helped me out quite a bit in the past.

Nick

 

[butcher]

thanks Nick, not been doing much recovery or refining lately. just hangin around.

 

[nicknitro]

Jeesh,

It seems vintage computers are like trying to give away a retro virus, at least to refine them lol. Oh well, I guess I will just hold on to them till the right moment.

How come the lull in refining Butcher? Seems like the perfect time to be selling, or have you already tapped your supplies, and it is hard to find more with all the TV refiners today? I personally don't believe they would give you a fair spot price on M.C. Hammer's Gold Toilet, but hey they are a fast turn-around. LOL

Atleast you still help people out. That is very noble.

Nick

 

[DNIndustry]

Heck I found a ton of White ceramic Intel 4040's the other day in a flight computer. tried to find a place to move em, but to much work.

 

[g_axelsson]

I can help you, I have sent you a PM.