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eaglewings35

Well-known member
Joined
May 27, 2010
Messages
205
Hey guys,
I have asked one of the experts, Manuel, and am awaiting his reply but I thought I would put it here to see if any others have experienced this problem.
Any way, I have been stripping green industrial X-Ray film in a sodium thiosulfate solution to the point of saturation.
The next step is adding HCl to convert the suspended silver to silver chloride.
Now I add iron (nails) to convert the silver chloride to silver metal ( grey concrete color).
I then (after it has all converted) I do several HCl washes, to get rid of the iron.
Next I do many boiling water rinses. Then I put it in the oven to dry it.
Okay, so far, all is going as planned.
When I pull it out of the oven, it has turned black. When you try and melt it, it smokes and smells bad. Also, the melted silver is really ugly, and has a thick black layer that is hard to get rid of.
It is Lazer Steve's, and my thoughts that this is the protein emulsion from the film.
Does anyone know how to get rid of this emulsion so it doesn't cause these problems?

Thanks to all !!!
Kerry
 
eaglewings35 said:
Hey guys,
I have asked one of the experts, Manuel, and am awaiting his reply but I thought I would put it here to see if any others have experienced this problem.
Any way, I have been stripping green industrial X-Ray film in a sodium thiosulfate solution to the point of saturation.
The next step is adding HCl to convert the suspended silver to silver chloride.
Now I add iron (nails) to convert the silver chloride to silver metal ( grey concrete color).You will need a tumbler to keep it agitated,I use a small 60L cement mixer.if you do not agitate enough you will only convert a small amount of AgCl to Ag
I then (after it has all converted) I do several HCl washes, to get rid of the iron.I would melt and let the flux do the work AgCl will vaporize if heated and once produced is near impossible to separate from your elemental silver
Next I do many boiling water rinses. Then I put it in the oven to dry it.
Okay, so far, all is going as planned.
When I pull it out of the oven, it has turned black. When you try and melt it, it smokes and smells bad.Do not inhale any of it,it is very bad for you!! Also, the melted silver is really ugly, and has a thick black layer that is hard to get rid of.
It is Lazer Steve's, and my thoughts that this is the protein emulsion from the film.
Does anyone know how to get rid of this emulsion so it doesn't cause these problems?Photographic emulsion is not a true emulsion, but a suspension of solid particles silver halide in a fluid gelatin in solution.Gelatin should denature with heat.dirty metal should be digested,that is our primary method of separation.if you do not get it right the first time ,try ,try,try again

Thanks to all !!!
Kerry
Click to expand...
 
Is there a way to get rid of the gelatin? That is my problem.
I don't have a setup to do any digestion or dissolving. (Plus no nitric or access to nitric)
There has to be a way to either eliminate, neutralize, solidify, remove, or dissolve the gelatin.
I've read the bleach would attack to gelatin, but what would that do to my process?
When would I add the bleach?
This has gotten my goat, because I should have very clean pure silver, but instead I have
a major problem.
I sent some to Lazer Steve, and he had to melt it, and remelt it several times, and it still
wasn't as pure as it should have been.
Has any others experienced this problem?
 
eaglewings35 said:
Is there a way to get rid of the gelatin? That is my problem.
I don't have a setup to do any digestion or dissolving. (Plus no nitric or access to nitric)
There has to be a way to either eliminate, neutralize, solidify, remove, or dissolve the gelatin.
I've read the bleach would attack to gelatin, but what would that do to my process?
When would I add the bleach?
This has gotten my goat, because I should have very clean pure silver, but instead I have
a major problem.
I sent some to Lazer Steve, and he had to melt it, and remelt it several times, and it still
wasn't as pure as it should have been.
Has any others experienced this problem?
Click to expand...
how do you expect to brake rocks without the most basic hammer?
Even a silver cell will need nitric unless you want to buy all your silver nitrate.
You can maintain your electrolyte by crystallization once you have enough for your cell,but even this will need replenishment once in a while.
And your silver will produce some very dirty electrolyte.
Have you thought of sending it to a refiner who is equipped to process properly?
 
justinhcase said:
eaglewings35 said:
Is there a way to get rid of the gelatin? That is my problem.
I don't have a setup to do any digestion or dissolving. (Plus no nitric or access to nitric)
There has to be a way to either eliminate, neutralize, solidify, remove, or dissolve the gelatin.
I've read the bleach would attack to gelatin, but what would that do to my process?
When would I add the bleach?
This has gotten my goat, because I should have very clean pure silver, but instead I have
a major problem.
I sent some to Lazer Steve, and he had to melt it, and remelt it several times, and it still
wasn't as pure as it should have been.
Has any others experienced this problem?
Click to expand...
how do you expect to brake rocks without the most basic hammer?
Even a silver cell will need nitric unless you want to buy all your silver nitrate.
You can maintain your electrolyte by crystallization once you have enough for your cell,but even this will need replenishment once in a while.
And your silver will produce some very dirty electrolyte.
Have you thought of sending it to a refiner who is equipped to process properly?
Click to expand...
Yes, I have thought about it, but I'm a little hesitant.
I sent some karat gold and some gold filled stuff to Michael Montoya (a member on here),
and once he got it, he cut off communication, and never sent me anything back.
I would like to hear from someone who would be interested in doing this for me.
I have 893.1 grams of this silver (28.71 t oz)
 
you have 893.1 grams of a questionable alloy which needs a lot of work.
If you need a refiner it is much like dating.
You have to go out looking and kiss a fair number before you find some one who will treat you well.
I am sorry to hear you have been let down.one bad egg spoils the hole omelet for every one.
But the older more established firms can be trusted on the hole.The problem lies when people offer to generous a rate.
If you leave an honest refiner some meat on the bone they will look after you.
Who in there right mind would upset a client who can be expected to bring you regular worth while business.
Some people are of the mind that if a client tries cuts you too deep that they deserve to be taken.
That is the justification most con men use to get out of bed in the morning,they see there marks as greedy so are absolved of any wrong doing them self's.
I have spoken to deluded prats who have convinced them self's they are the hand of Karma her self righting the injustice of the world one at a time.when in actual fact they where class A sociopaths ripping the heart out of every day people.
 
Yes, I have thought about it, but I'm a little hesitant.
I sent some karat gold and some gold filled stuff to Michael Montoya (a member on here),
and once he got it, he cut off communication, and never sent me anything back.

when?
did you raise the problem with a monitor??
Such information may save a fellow member from making the same mistake!
Do not handle the situation aggressively but do seek help from other members who may have some weight.
If noting else it will mark him for further close observation and help stop further dishonesty.
 
Palladium said:
I would like to know more about this story also.
Click to expand...
Well here it is.... his handle was mmon2616, he was having a hard time understanding some
of the instructions that were being given to him. So I reached out to him and offered him some help privately. We struck a friendship and began doing some processing as a business.
Yep, big mistake !!!! We both live in Texas, so we went to getting some business` to trust us.
Well, he had a friend that wanted in, strictly as a "silent, financial" partner. Well, Michael all the sudden turned on me. I bowed out and left it to them. Well I got a call some months later from Michael, saying that he was sorry, and his partner had abandoned him and took alot of the equipment that he had bought, and he said he was in need of money. He had a melting kiln and offered it to me for $100. I took the bait, and sent him $100 in silver. He said " if you have any gold to process I will gladly do it for you, just to help you out. Well, not having any nitric, and him having all that was needed, I sent him some karat gold, some gold filled, and plated stuff.
I started feeling a bit off, but I went against my gut feelings and sent it anyway. He got it because I sent it where he had to sign for it. That was the last I heard from him.he disconnected his phone, and blocked me from his Facebook. I called his girlfriend, she said she was in a fight with him, them she blocked me. So I definitely have "STUPID" written across my forehead. If you see anyone saying they are into processing silver from Fixer, on a large scale, it will probably be him. He changed his member name, but it is still close to the old one, mmon2616. I will find him and post it here for all to see and beware.
 
Okay I found Michael Montoya`s New member name. His business name is M6 Metals. (From Houston area)
His forum name now is MA62016. Beware of this crook!!!!
 
It's a bit uncertain but going over the posts for both mmon2616 and MA62016 I can't see any similarities in where it's been posted from. Both users have posted from totally different places in USA.

MA62016 was posting from halfway across USA and I can't find anything that links him to mmon2616 except a bit similar forum handle.

On the other side, doing some more search I found M6MR&R who is posting from the same area and signs his post with Michael. Last time seen on the forum a year ago. This seems to be his current handle.

So unless you can put forward any other proof that MA62016 is a part in this conflict I will say that he is innocent and wrongly accused.

I'm going to send M6MR&R a pm to hear what he has to say about this, but I don't expect any answer soon since it's been a year since he visited the forum.

Göran
 
Goran,
By all means, if I am incorrect in that being his handle, I will most sincerely apologize.
Like you, I don't suspect he will answer. But it is worth a try.
 
Googling "M6 METAL RECOVERY AND REFINING" turns up both a facebook page and a business registry for Texas but there seems to be no activity since summer. Since I'm in Sweden I have a hard time to go any further than this.

If he comes back and doesn't answer on this issue (I can see if he reads my pm) then I will assume he is guilty as charged and ban him.

Göran
 
Don't be too hard on yourself about it Eagle- we've all been there and done it I promise you Sir. I did the same with a forum member years ago with some good gold bearing product. It's one of those bumps in the road on the journey. You're only stupid if you let it happen again the same way!

Jon
 
When I first started I had contact with an American Dealer through my coin contacts.
He very kindly let me have a large lump of eighteen karat alloy for spot so I could have some thing to work on.
Turned out to be eight karat,very big ouch.
Raised the matter with him still believing he was an honest trader and got the "You Deserve What You Get" speech.I have a special place above my desk for momentous to remind me just how stupid I can be some times.Like the Israelis .Never Forget ,Never Forgive.
It is an expensive education,but a good one.
 

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