Silver powder

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UncleBenBen said:
No, don't ban him. Bait him! :twisted:
Then maybe this man can recoup his money. :wink:
HAHA, now thats a good idea !!!
But I believe that he will get paid back. I am a Christian man, and I have seen it many times before....
you dont steal from Gods people (which I are one) and not get into some serious trouble.
I have seen people who have done this, and their business and finances have tumbled.
I dont pray for bad things to happen to anyone, but God takes care of his own. !!!
 
anachronism said:
Don't be too hard on yourself about it Eagle- we've all been there and done it I promise you Sir. I did the same with a forum member years ago with some good gold bearing product. It's one of those bumps in the road on the journey. You're only stupid if you let it happen again the same way!

Jon
Thanks Jon, and you are right. I dont have to be hit over the head with the same hammer to know that it is gonna hurt and leave a bad bump.
No Sir, lesson learned !!
 
g_axelsson said:
Googling "M6 METAL RECOVERY AND REFINING" turns up both a facebook page and a business registry for Texas but there seems to be no activity since summer. Since I'm in Sweden I have a hard time to go any further than this.

If he comes back and doesn't answer on this issue (I can see if he reads my pm) then I will assume he is guilty as charged and ban him.

Göran
Hey Goran,
Did he ever see your pm that you sent him?
Just curious, as I dont expect him to answer. He will probably come back to the forum under
a new member name.
 
Hey Goran, I was searching through some post and I see Michael Montoya does have a newer member name. Look at M6Metal2016.

M6 Metals is his business name. Send him a message their and see if he replies.
 
I've done that now, don't know if it will give any more results though.

Göran
 
The bulk of this topic is basically about getting ripped off.

No Risk, No Reward, so you have to trust people, at least a little, before finding lifelong enemies or bosom buddies.

Finding Good people is the same as refining - you need to process a lot of them them in acid and see if they end up shiny, or just grey sludge :eek:

eaglewings35 said:
Is there a way to get rid of the gelatin?
A chemistry thing is to rip up organic compounds (which gelatin is) with sodium hypochlorite, a.k.a. bleach.

Might be useful info for anyone with waxy or oily materials to process, and considering 'green-er' gold recovery routes - the bleach can be re-used in the gold dissolution step.

Incineration certainly works, is easier, and probably better, just less Green, unless it contains a lot of copper ;)
 
Well, roasting or incinerating does not work. I washed this stuff with HOT boiling water, and hot HCL. All looked good until I put it in the oven to dry it out.... the Bromide (Gelatine) turned black would not go away.
I have been doing some research and I think I found an option. I asked Lazer Steve about this and he seems to think it should work. But I am going to make a electrowinning cell, and as it pulls out the silver, it should break the bond and leave the bromide behind. Another option I read on Wiki is ammonia will dissolve the bromide. But ammonia is nasty stuff, and that is a last resort. We'll see !!!
 
The gelatin layer on film is not bromide, gelatin is a protein based organic emulsion to hold silver bromide ,(and other silver salts called halides), crystals in suspension on the film.

Unless you had a very strong thiosulfate solution or left the film in for a very long time it does not normally strip the gelatin off the film. It simply forms a water soluble complex with the unexposed silver salts to remove them from the gelatin.

The gel is left behind to hold any image bearing, (exposed and developed), silver. Since your film was never developed the thiosulfate will remove all the salts and the exposed silver that has been turned to metallic silver.

Your precipitate should be just the various silver salts, (bromide, chloride mainly), metallic silver and whatever drag out from the metal you used to precipitate with. In your case both iron and copper if I read your posts correctly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatin_silver_process

"The fixer, typically sodium thiosulfate, is able to remove the unexposed silver halide by forming a water-soluble complex with it. And finally, a water wash sometimes preceded by a washing aid removes the fixer from the print, leaving an image composed of silver particles held in the clear gelatin image layer."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatin#Technical_uses

"Gelatin or gelatine (from Latin: gelatus meaning "stiff", "frozen") is a translucent, colorless, brittle (when dry), flavorless food derived from collagen obtained from various animal raw materials. It is commonly used as a gelling agent in food, pharmaceutical drugs, photography, and cosmetic manufacturing."



The gelatin, being an organic protein, can easily be burned off by roasting the precipitate. (If you really have it present, I don't think you do.) You don't need to incinerate, just a low dull red glow is hot enough to carbonize the gelatin, as well as oxidize the silver salts. Do this with the lid off the pan and stir it a bit to expose all the precipitate to the air.

I think you have a mixture of silver, iron and copper. I would start by measuring out an certain amount to test with and put in hot HCL ONLY, no nails!

I think the solution will turn either bright yellow, (iron dissolved), or green, (copper). Repeat this in clean HCL until the solution stays clear and the precipitate is off white and fluffy which will be silver chloride you can convert to metallic silver by either the sugar/lye or battery acid/iron method.
 
On Medical and Industrial x-rays, the silver is very pure. If you don't contaminate it with some other metal, the silver you recover from it should be of a similar purity that could be obtained in a silver cell. Unless you contaminate it, there is no reason to put it through a silver cell.
 
rickbb said:
The gelatin, being an organic protein, can easily be burned off by roasting the precipitate. (If you really have it present, I don't think you do.) You don't need to incinerate, just a low dull red glow is hot enough to carbonize the gelatin, as well as oxidize the silver salts. Do this with the lid off the pan and stir it a bit to expose all the precipitate to the air.
You can't oxidize the silver salts with heat.

Chemically speaking the silver is already oxidized to Ag+ and won't increase the oxidation state.

If you are talking about turning silver halides into silver oxide, I don't think that will happen either as the silver salt is very stable and will boil off before turning into an oxide.

Göran
 
Thanks, I had read that the Ag was being oxidized in the roast while being stirred to expose it air, and was a necessary step. But I guess not everything you read is accurate, regardless of who the source was.

Edit; correct grammar.
 

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