Non-Chemical Smelting in India

[ashir]

very very informativ kj!
actually very helpfull! i was busy in family matters. ashes went to 4 kg plus in weight, so shorten lead oxide!
also get a good deal of old cell phones, i am manually seprating ics,
i want see your cupelation setup if you can show it to us or if you can describe it.
direct flame on lead dore bar is looking hard to me
cannot get idea to prepare direct flame setup with oil burner. lpg is avail but can not get a flash back controller system( some types of ragulators are availbale)

 

[ashir]

i want try cryolite as thining flux
and i noted in pictures that you broke glass in pieces , is ik ok to use it small pieces, or crush it more fine

 

[kjavanb123]

i want see your cupelation setup if you can show it to us or if you can describe it.

Hi Ashir,

Following is my cupelation setup. It basically is a pot, filled in half with broken bricks and then filled up with Portland cement.
I use a foot ball to make the curvage on top.


I place the lead dore in the middle of cupel, then I place these paint cans which I use as body of my furnace, they are both lined with kaowool, on top to make heat stay in cupel.


Here is another shot of setup.


I start by high heat at the burner, and dore quickly melts, once molten I ajdust the burner pressure to medium, and this runs for 2-3 hours till all I see it copper which is different than lead when molten.

Hope that helps.

 

[kjavanb123]

i want try cryolite as thining flux
and i noted in pictures that you broke glass in pieces , is ik ok to use it small pieces, or crush it more fine

Both cryolite and feldspar can be used as thinning flux but they also dissolve the graphite so either don't use them or use them when smelting catalytic converters.

Yes part of stock flux is silica sand which sonce I didn't have at time so if you can get fine glass.

 

[ashir]

its awesome! i should avoid cryolite
i see in video( related to start of topi) they use coal and air for cupelation!
its very informative soon i will post my process next

 

[Platdigger]

So Kevin, of the lead that is not absorbed by the cupel but is vaporized.

Some condenses back out in the chimney, and the rest just goes out into the room?

 

[kjavanb123]

So Kevin, of the lead that is not absorbed by the cupel but is vaporized.

Some condenses back out in the chimney, and the rest just goes out into the room?

Hi Plat

According to the forum, 10% of lead is vaporizef and 90% gets absorbed to cupel.

I put a metallic basket which is filled with lye on top of the chimney, hot lead vapors react with lye and some of it deposit inside the chimney wall.

Best regards
KJ

 

[Platdigger]

In a muffle type furnace were the flame is not in the same chamber as the cupel, I could see 10% perhaps.
But were the flame is right on the lead, it must be much higher.

Could you show us this lye/basket arrangement?

I just hope you are not poisoning yourself.

 

[kjavanb123]

In a muffle type furnace were the flame is not in the same chamber as the cupel, I could see 10% perhaps.
But were the flame is right on the lead, it must be much higher.

Could you show us this lye/basket arrangement?

I just hope you are not poisoning yourself.

Hi Plat

This is lye filtering setup per following photo. I need to increase the height since temperature gets hot there to melt the lye.

 

[ashir]

i want try cryolite as thining flux
and i noted in pictures that you broke glass in pieces , is ik ok to use it small pieces, or crush it more fine

Both cryolite and feldspar can be used as thinning flux but they also dissolve the graphite so either don't use them or use them when smelting catalytic converters.

Yes part of stock flux is silica sand which sonce I didn't have at time so if you can get fine glass.

I did first smelting !
Not a good experience but was awesome
Raza shahid( a forum member) send me a gravity drip waste oil burner!
It was nice but it consume too much oil!
Second mistake was using of construction bricks as inner wall of furnance, so they melt somewhere during process.
Third mistake was to run furnance without reserve oil so oil was ended!
Here what i did,
500 gram ic ash
650 g borax
600 g soda ash
500 gram red led oxide( pb3o4)
And smelting was done

It was lead dore bara free crushing
Many suspended bead of lead

It was the slag which i will crush and remelt!
Problem is that slag still stuck inside crucible.
What i should do with it

 

[gaurav_347]

Dear Ashir,

You need to re-smelt the dore along with all the slags collected . Use a coal fired furnace which runs on net coke. It's a high temperature coal. Oil fired furnaces are complicated as per our experience. When you resmelt use extra borax and soda ash/ flux . Check out the furnace made from old oil drums on the first few pages of this thread. They run on coal and are super fast at smelting. It takes roughly 15 mins to finish one smelt. They are compact and can be easily carried around . When you compare the coal vs oil vs gas I would prefer coal and if you have the capital then there is nothing like a induction furnace !

RAMZAN mubarak to you and your family!

Regards,
Gaurav

 

[ashir]

Dear Ashir,

You need to re-smelt the dore along with all the slags collected . Use a coal fired furnace which runs on net coke. It's a high temperature coal. Oil fired furnaces are complicated as per our experience. When you resmelt use extra borax and soda ash/ flux . Check out the furnace made from old oil drums on the first few pages of this thread. They run on coal and are super fast at smelting. It takes roughly 15 mins to finish one smelt. They are compact and can be easily carried around . When you compare the coal vs oil vs gas I would prefer coal and if you have the capital then there is nothing like a induction furnace !

RAMZAN mubarak to you and your family!

Regards,
Gaurav

Thanks gaurave and kher mubarak
Can i resmelt dore in same crucible , there is still some stucked material inside crucible, and i am going to use coal as i was thinking to us it as secondary option.
after or during the FAST there is nearly impossible to do physical work! So i am trying to wait few days so body become useto of 16 hours long Fast!
Thanks again. I will post my pics

 

[ashir]

Can not get any coke here. I have to order it
Want use coal instead. Will this work

 

[gaurav_347]

No it wont work . You need to use high temperature coke. It's called "net coke" at least here in India. This coke can raise temperatures high enough to melt copper and even iron ! do some research what it is called there. if there are furnace operators in your area they might help you out with your requirement.

 

[ashir]

No it wont work . You need to use high temperature coke. It's called "net coke" at least here in India. This coke can raise temperatures high enough to melt copper and even iron ! do some research what it is called there. if there are furnace operators in your area they might help you out with your requirement.

I was thinking if i find a furnance operator then i will go him and do smelting. Here is ni concept of furnance ! One person told me that it called " pathar ka koela" ( stone coal) too much mines here of black coal stone! I have to order it from karachi !!!

 

[ashir]

Dear Ashir,

You need to re-smelt the dore along with all the slags collected . Use a coal fired furnace which runs on net coke. It's a high temperature coal. Oil fired furnaces are complicated as per our experience. When you resmelt use extra borax and soda ash/ flux . Check out the furnace made from old oil drums on the first few pages of this thread. They run on coal and are super fast at smelting. It takes roughly 15 mins to finish one smelt. They are compact and can be easily carried around . When you compare the coal vs oil vs gas I would prefer coal and if you have the capital then there is nothing like a induction furnace !

RAMZAN mubarak to you and your family!

Regards,
Gaurav

I get this from a city, the provider also not know its name but he told that it gives a lot heat and can be use for months!
But it did not work. It took hours to go red and nothing else!
All night , can not burn this coal!
Can not find any supplier of net coke!
No one experienced with furnance a in my area!
I am thinking to re work on waste oil as it brings me near to what i need for smelting !

 

[ashir]

Gaurave
There is no such name i find on google" net coke " in india.
Its net coke i find, too much confusion,
No name like net coke that you mention
Its met coke
Pet coke

 

[anachronism]

Gaurave
There is no such name i find on google" net coke " in india.
Its net coke i find, too much confusion,
No name like net coke that you mention
Its met coke
Pet coke

Bottom line here. You need coke not coal.

 

[butcher]

Coke is made by burning coal without air, a process very similar to making charcoal from wood.

 

[ashir]

Sorry for can not follow your instructions.
No such thing i find in my area even near me Its one inform me a city where i can find factories that offer smelting on your demand with your own material and crucibles. And they do as you want.
In Ramzan i can not travell 7 hours
After Eid i am thinking to go there and chek thier setups and thier smelting experience. Thanks every one to be so helpfull on every step