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I love it when Chris speaks from experience. You can't by that on Ebay folks! 8)
I use the GE hotplate and pyroceram. It's what i'm use to and it works perfect for me even as i seem to be scaling up. I've wanted to try the griddle thing one time just to see and when i built my lab i also wanted to add something but never got to. On the next one i build i want to add a pyroceram stove cook top like on a normal kitchen stove. Haven't found one made of pyroceram yet, but they do make them. They also have other types of glass that is engineered that they use, but i want the name brand. The lid of the stove lifts off and you can cut a hole in the counter top and set it in place like a sink. Build a small containment lip around the whole thing about an inch high or so and use the whole surface for heating, drips, boil overs, or spills.
 
goldsilverpro said:
reign21male,

I've probably written about this 10 times. If people would search the forum before doing or buying anything, they would be a lot safer.

Never, ever, heat most any kitchen Pyrex on a hotplate. The only exception is a thin Pyrex glass coffee carafe. Even then, I would place it inside a CW Pyroceram dish in case it breaks.

The CW dish in your photos doesn't look like pyroceram and I really don't think it is. If it isn't, plan on it breaking, sooner or later. It looks exactly like one I bought a couple of years ago that broke the 2nd or 3rd time I used it. Unless you are 100% sure it is Pyroceram StoveTop, I would definitely stop using it on an electric hotplate (or a gas burner) unless you want a lap full of hot acid. If you're very lucky, you won't get burned and it will only destroy your hotplate.

All Corning Ware is not pyroceram and that that isn't will eventually break when heated directly, guaranteed. It works in a oven but not on a hotplate. Ask me how I know.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corning_ware

All of the older CW pyroceram dishes I've seen have a design painted on them and most are square and white, like many in this eBay link. I see them everywhere in resale shops, flea markets, etc. I prefer the 5 quart deep ones. They're not marked as such but I've never seen CW dishes with any of these design on them that weren't pyroceram. When buying used ones, make sure the inside surface isn't scratched, cracked, chipped, or etched (rough). It should be very smooth all over.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/?_nkw=corning%20ware%20dishes&clk_rvr_id=423144869926

Some of the newer ones have a design and some don't. The newer pyroceram ones are called StoveTop, a CW trademark.
http://www.shopworldkitchen.com/corningware/stovetop-blue-cornflower-casserole-bf-5c-b

Corning Vision ware will also work fine but I don't like the shapes as well. CW stopped making it several years ago.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/?_nkw=vision%20ware%20corning&clk_rvr_id=423152342363

The CW Pyroceram and Vision Ware are the only kitchen type dishes I have ever found that will take direct heat without breaking. Never, ever, use a ceramic insert from a Crock-Pot on direct heat. It will break the first time you do it. Here again, ask me how I know.

Thank for all the info GSP. I was going to add links about that as well. The dish was a temp until my other dishs came. They are marked with the burner symbol and they are stamped pyroceram. I did pick up one tan CW fraying pan and One tan sauce pan.
 
butcher said:
While Geo is helping with the gold, I will hold back advice as much as I can, on that portion as two people may do things a little different I do not wish to confuse you, with my suggestions on that process.



Since Geo has not mentioned the solution, I will say something there.
Save it to add your washes and waste acids from solutions you will be using to get your gold, add that copper back to the barrel to help cement any values you miss, (anything of value that would cement on copper would, when you are finished with the solution and wish to see if solution holds dissolved gold, or possibly any elemental metal gold colloids that will not settle or would not cement out onto copper because they were already reduced to metal but would not settle.

Just incase some gold colloids are in that solution; here is a way I would test it.

Get your stannous chloride made up, take a small sample of the ugly green solution, in a casserole dish on a solid burner hot plate, add about 20ml of this solution to be tested, and add 5mL strong sulfuric acid, evaporate the solution down to salts then lower heat to dry the salt, raise the heat keep the salts crushed now with a propane torch get the powder red hot, if the dry powders fuse and become a syrup lower heat, (so it does not bubble and pop), but keep heating re-crush to powder and heat the powder red hot, in this heating process we drove off H2O then a HNO3, then HCl and finally H2SO4, the chloride powders went to sulfates and then we drove off the sulfate as SO2 gas when they became red hot leaving us with metal oxide powders.

Now boiling these powder oxides in 10ml HCl, then add a tiny bit of water let powder settle and decant, and continue to rinse the powders with water till clear, if any powders are left it did not dissolve in HCl, they may contain value (if there were powders left lets see if they contain gold) if powders left now add a 10ml HCl and about 2ml bleach heat till fumes vapor off chlorine gas, dilute with a little water, dip a Qtip into the liquid, drop a drop of stannous chloride onto the Qtip, if it turns purple we will need get the gold out of this solution, if no gold was in this solution then we can add a piece of steel to the liquid to cement out copper and other metals, decant liquid from the copper, and neutralize the liquid with NaOH sodium hydroxide (lye) (caustic soda) to precipitate base metal oxides (raise pH to 9), till the solution is a clear salt water, decant this slat water from the metal oxides/hydroxides, dry these powders and the copper powders now solution and powders are safe to dispose of, dry powders in trash and clear salt water is safe for a sewer ( I like to keep my dry copper powders for other purposes).

“You don’t ask a easy task do ya buddy.”

Jason you are right, I do not try to make it easy, and sometimes the tasks are difficult, but if I did not feel you were man enough to handle them I would not suggest them, refining as you wll soon learn is not an easy task, not as easy as it seems it would be to you at this point, but it is worth it, and I think you can handle it, just be patient and take it easy, learning takes time and sometimes lessons are not easy, but then purity in our gold is worth it, and the education I feel is even worth more than the gold.


Thanks Butcher. So far since I cant finish Geo's process. Until I can get a cutting torch. I made up so stannous chloride. Dissolved so 10k and tested it.
Is it suppose to be that dark?
 

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Here is a later picture of it. After it dried. And the secomd Qtip was teh green blue solution. The grey solution went clear when tested.
 

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Geo said:
when you are cementing, the cemented metal will be a powder in the bottom of the container. it will be colored but clear if undisturbed. when you stir it, the cemented metal will mix with the solution and color it grey. it sounds to me as if the cementation is complete. remove all the copper from the solution and rinse the pieces back into the solution. let the solution settle completely until it is clear again. draw off the clear fluid from the cemented powder. siphon or use a bulb type syringe to draw off the liquid. if you tilt the vessel and the powder swirls up, you can prop the container up on an object that will let the powder settle to one side.this will make it easier to remove the final bit. dont try to remove all the fluid as it will draw some of the powder up with it, so stop just at the powder. add clean water and heat. let the powder settle and repeat the prior process to remove the rinse water. the powder should be added to what ever metal you had left from before. do not do any more chemical processes with the material until you have consolidated all the metal.by now you have many different acids and salts in the mix. you must remove all the acids and as much salt as possible before you can continue to process this material.if you dont, you will be making the same mess you started with all over again.

when you have all the metal together, melt it together. use a five gallon bucket with a metal pan in the bucket. fill the bucket with water. melt the metal and pour as small a stream as you can slowly into the water. this will "cornflake" it. move the metal to a glass container you can heat.add hcl and heat. let the metal stay in the hot acid for several hours making sure the acid does not evaporate dry.after the few hours is over,add a few drops of concentrated sulfuric acid (it doesnt take much to drop the small amount of lead there) after this, remove from the heat and rinse. dry the metal and weigh it. there is no way to calculate how much metal is gold and how much is something else. add enough silver to ensure the Karat is 6K or lower. even if you must assume the entire weight of the material is gold and add according to that.

melt the material together and stir with a graphite rod. pour material into a five gallon bucket of water with a metal pan in the bucket. remove the metal and dry. you may weigh the material so you can weigh the recovered silver later and at least give you an idea of what it will take next time.

now the material is ready to dissolve in nitric acid. if you were successful in removing the tin and lead, the solution will be green and the gold will be a solid left whole in the bottom of the vessel.

Sorry for the wait in the updated. My brothers shop cuuting torch is not a option anymore. However my wifes friend bought me a bernzomatic oxygen kit for my bday. It takes a bit of time to get it to work right, but for 50.00 bucks not bad. I had to do the pours at two different times it was really hard to get the mess hot enough to melt and get it out of the crucible. There is more shots then what is in this picture. about twice to 3 times that amout. How do I clean my crucible? It made it really hard to get a good melt. I was thinking once cleaned I would redo the melt. Question with the HLC will it get rid of the iron or steel that is in it? I ran a magnetic over the shots. And it some of it was magnetic. Thanks and Merry Christmas everyone.
 

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I think you need a new crucible. It looks like you used way too much borax. That dish is a mess. Go to Lazersteves site and order a couple new ones. They're pretty inexpensive and you need a clean dish to melt properly. Read up on the proper seasoning of your melting dish. Just a thin glaze is all that is needed.
Also it looks like you have way too much crud in with your shot.
 
i think thats all the solids left from the earlier process. try melting it with a mix of borax, sodium carbonate and charcoal. that will reduce any oxidized metal back to elemental form. stir with your graphite or carbon rod to mix it well. do you have a cone mold? if not, a piece of angle iron with a flat plate welded to the end or a boxed piece of steel will work. use a candle to soot the metal and pour the mix into a corner. all the metal will puddle in the bottom and the slag will float on top. when it cools, you can tap it with a hammer and the slag will break off. that will give you clean metal to work with again.
 
Thanks geo. I have some Chapman's flux. It has all three. I did boil some nitric acid in the crucible. It removed a good bit as far as steel or cone shape I don't. I saw a iron cone shape mold once when I was a kid. It was in a wielding shop. I think I can shape some galvanized steel into a box shape. Either way once I clean or get a clean crucible. I will begin the HLC bath with my shots. To remove the tin and then in quart. I will post pictures or results.
 
I don't think soots much does it? I think someone said to use a candle?....Hold it over the candle and the Black soot should coat everything needed....If I'm right... Your torch might soot if you have a lean flame...not enough O2...

BS.
Glad you/we can get all this help....
 
O.k I tried the flux and I managed to get a little more of the mess out. It's not clean! However I did get some more gold and silver out of it. Whic is always a plus. I have decided to put the crucible a side until I get some money together and get a really cutting torch. So i'm ordering another crucible and once I get it I will Start my boil the melts in HCL.
Merry Christmas
 
O.k I didnt have enough HLC acid to boil for hours. I did manage to boil it for 1hr. That took 1 qt. I did add a little 93% sulphic acid to it. Do I need to order more HLC or can I use something cheaper? Anyone know where I can get this set up from this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGjd7xxTuZw. I would like to make my on HLC.
 

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O.K I see the rust which means still other metals. I ordered another qt of HCL I hope that will be enough. I would still like to get a chem set with a back flow and regulator. Does anyone know where i can get one. or a easier way to make HCL? Or a cheap sub for the HCL?
 
reign21male said:
O.K I see the rust which means still other metals. I ordered another qt of HCL I hope that will be enough. I would still like to get a chem set with a back flow and regulator. Does anyone know where i can get one. or a easier way to make HCL? Or a cheap sub for the HCL?

do you live outside the US? muriatic acid from any hardware or home improvement store will carry it. it is also used as deck cleaner and cement/concrete etchant/cleaner.some pool supply stores carry it as pool cleaner.
 
Geo said:
reign21male said:
O.K I see the rust which means still other metals. I ordered another qt of HCL I hope that will be enough. I would still like to get a chem set with a back flow and regulator. Does anyone know where i can get one. or a easier way to make HCL? Or a cheap sub for the HCL?

do you live outside the US? muriatic acid from any hardware or home improvement store will carry it. it is also used as deck cleaner and cement/concrete etchant/cleaner.some pool supply stores carry it as pool cleaner.
Nice thanks geo. I live in Maryland so that will be a easier and cheaper option. Now I don't have to wait so long to get my chemicals. Thank you
 
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