will Ammonium nitrate make AR?

[wop1969]

While sitting home snowed in today, I made some calls an found a feed store that does not have urea but does sell Ammonium nitrate fertalizer at $17.00 for a 50 Lb bag, I wanted to know if this is a good source (mixed with HCl) for making AR?

Edit: the content is 34-0-0

 

[qst42know]

This has been a addressed several times. Search on the forum (ammonium and nitrate).

http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=3676&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=ammonium+nitrate

 

[Platdigger]

Qst, the link you provided was about making nitric.

I found this post by Goldsilverpro: "I think I read on the web that ammonium nitrate detonates when heated to 800 deg F. That's not normally going to happen but, that's not where the danger is.

Let's say you made A.R. from ammonium nitrate. Now you have ammonium ion in the solution.

You dissolve the gold and drop it out. Now you have heavy metals and ammonium ion in the solution.

Next you do what every good refiner does. You neutralize the acid solution with lye - sodium hydroxide

Now you have all of the requirements for a disaster - ammonia, metal, and sodium hydroxide. Also, the solution is now a little alkaline - another requirement."

 

[jamthe3]

Could all the heavy metals be dropped before neutralizing? If it is good for Nitric and assuming one's using it to dissolve heavy metals also, does the same risk apply? Should the heavy metals be dropped from the nitric made this way before neutralizing also?

John

 

[qst42know]

Qst, the link you provided was about making nitric.

You are right. I should know better than to post in a rush. My apologies.

 

[Platdigger]

Qst, I didn't mean anything by it.
I just happenned to find that post about the AR.
I probably wouldn't have even done the search if it wasn't for your post.
So what I am saying is, your post was good....

jamthe3, as far as nitric with ammonium nitrate, the only problem I know of could be with silver. And then only if you let things dry out.
Randy

 

[qst42know]

I'm glad you found some value in the post but did not answer wop1969's question

 

[wop1969]

Well I am getting steves DVD tomorrow and it will probly answer most the questions I have

This forum is great but it overloads you brain at times and the info becomes confusing but in time I will see it all clearly. Last week making AuCl3 seemed impossible to me but I did it so no worries...

 

[Harold_V]

but it overloads you brain at times and the info becomes confusing

That was true for me when I started refining. It is the reason I keep harping on reading Hoke's book (and the forum) until things start to make sense. It's a huge overload for a mind that is unfamiliar, and yet when things start to make sense, it's amazing how simple everything becomes.

I used to say that I could teach a chimp to refine-----it's that easy, but you must understand what needs to be done, when, and how to do it.

Harold

 

[wop1969]

Harold, you hit the nail on the head with that

 

[qst42know]

wop1969

As near as I can tell, at least for us non-chemists ammonia should be avoided for it's role in forming explosive compounds with dissolved metals (several of them), except where prescribed, such as in the wash stage of precipitated gold to remove faint traces of silver.

 

[wop1969]

I hear that loud and clear!!

I dont want to frag meself :shock:

 

[rustbucketguy]

ammonium nitrate is a good substitute for urea ONLY if you are going to use it as fertilizer. any attempt to mix it with metals will create the possibility of very dangerous reactions. heat it and mix it with metals is extremely dangerous. Straight ammonium nitrate is getting very difficult to find because of its use as an explosive material by terrorists. Fertilizer labeled as 34-0-0 is not automatically ammonium nitrate unless it says so on the label

 

[Irons]

Ammonium Nitrate can be used but I'm not going to post the process here because if it's not done properly, it will generate Chloramines, which could explode.

The Ammonium Ion breaks down when exposed to Chlorine, as in AR. The premise that ammonium ion will form explosive compounds with metals dissolved in AR is false. There is no Ammonium Ion present in AR after a few minutes at most. It's what happens in those few minutes that can get you in trouble.

If you don't know what you're doing, don't do it.