Aqua Regia attempt

[Ad8chd]

This is my first coast, let me preface by saying that I know how I did it was wrong. At least I know that now… and as soon as I’m done making this post, I plan to go straight down to the tutorial section and do some studying. Anyway, I have some material in which I suspected gold, getting chemicals is kind of tough where I’m at so I made nitric acid, hydrochloric acid, and with these, obviously made the aqua Regia. Apparently, I was supposed to cover my material in HCL and drip the nitric, that’s not what I did. I just mixed them three parts of HCL and one part of nitric so obviously now it’s obvious anyway, way too much nitric acid. Also, let me say that I was instructed by ChatGPT on this one, he’s real good at analogue electronics, not so much I don’t think for this. so I let it do it thing for like pride four hours or something, then I boiled it for like 10 minutes, which I was under the impression when there was no more fumes coming out of it, all the nitric acid was gone, which I guess is not the case, but anyway, when I first started dripping the SMB solution. There was some incredibly dark, rich brown colored clouds, that kind of dissipated, and then I started seeing real particles floating around. I kept adding the reducing agent there was no more action then I let it sit for a couple hours cause it was all poofy in there, when I came back, there was nothing in there. Everything that happened after that I already know was stupid so like I understand if you guys wanna take a couple quick shots at me I deserve it but just understand that I know it was dumb. Anyway advice from ChatGPT. I added some hydrochloric acid to apparently try to get rid of the nitric acid. Everything went clear, then I boiled it for a while more and slowly, but surely it started snowing in there again and then I had a big fat blob after pouring it through a filter, I’m gonna put a picture up so you guys can tell me if it was even really gold or not, then I went to try to melt some and it was turning black, so my good buddy and mentor in this project, good old chat, told me that I needed to wash it with sulfuric acid and then rinse it and then it would melt fine. I made a solution of sulfuric and started adding it before. I knew it. Everything that I had just disappeared. Then I got frustrated and I just started dumping everything that I had on the one container because I feel like if it is gold, it couldn’t have gone anywhere. It’s got to still be there. I just have to figure out how to untangle it. yeah that’s the way it went down if anybody’s got any ideas, I would love to hear them. Thank you in advance, and, like I said, only take a couple shots at me because my pride is already hurting

 

[adam mizer]

It appears your on the right track.
But did you neutralize the overused free nitric before smb?
Also while you cook you should just add nitric in small amounts, something to get used to. Just keep adding small amounts ML's until you notice at a point there is no vapor.
Theres a couple ways to neutralize.
Condense down the solution quite a bit (first) then an addition of HCL and you should notice nitric vapors coming out.
Or add sulfamic acid crystals, should not take much. Sulfamic crystals can be purchased at Home Depot I believe.

 

[adam mizer]

It would help to write in paragraphs and break up the long texts to make reading much more easy to understand.

 

[FrugalRefiner]

See When In Doubt, Cement It Out.

Dave

 

[Yggdrasil]

This is my first coast, let me preface by saying that I know how I did it was wrong. At least I know that now… and as soon as I’m done making this post, I plan to go straight down to the tutorial section and do some studying. Anyway, I have some material in which I suspected gold, getting chemicals is kind of tough where I’m at so I made nitric acid, hydrochloric acid, and with these, obviously made the aqua Regia. Apparently, I was supposed to cover my material in HCL and drip the nitric, that’s not what I did. I just mixed them three parts of HCL and one part of nitric so obviously now it’s obvious anyway, way too much nitric acid. Also, let me say that I was instructed by ChatGPT on this one, (Chat GPT and Youtube videos are going the get you maimed and or killed) he’s real good at analogue electronics, not so much I don’t think for this. so I let it do it thing for like pride four hours or something, then I boiled it for like 10 minutes, which I was under the impression when there was no more fumes coming out of it, all the nitric acid was gone, (It justy means there is no more material to react with the Nitric.) which I guess is not the case, but anyway, when I first started dripping the SMB solution. There was some incredibly dark, rich brown colored clouds, that kind of dissipated, (It redissolves by the surplus of Nitric) and then I started seeing real particles floating around. I kept adding the reducing agent there was no more action then I let it sit for a couple hours cause it was all poofy in there, when I came back, there was nothing in there. Everything that happened after that I already know was stupid so like I understand if you guys wanna take a couple quick shots at me I deserve it but just understand that I know it was dumb. Anyway advice from ChatGPT. ( I rest my case) added some hydrochloric acid to apparently try to get rid of the nitric acid. HCl will not get rid of Nitric Everything went clear, then I boiled it for a while more and slowly, but surely it started snowing in there again and then I had a big fat blob after pouring it through a filter, I’m gonna put a picture up so you guys can tell me if it was even really gold or not, then I went to try to melt some and it was turning black, so my good buddy and mentor in this project, good old chat, told me that I needed to wash it with sulfuric acid and then rinse it and then it would melt fine. I made a solution of sulfuric and started adding it before. I knew it. Everything that I had just disappeared. Then I got frustrated and I just started dumping everything that I had on the one container because I feel like if it is gold,(Wrong move) it couldn’t have gone anywhere.(Correct the Gold do not go anywhere unless you throw it away) It’s got to still be there. I just have to figure out how to untangle it. yeah that’s the way it went down if anybody’s got any ideas, I would love to hear them. Thank you in advance, and, like I said, only take a couple shots at me because my pride is already hurting

Comments in Bold inside quote.
But first:
Please do use spacing line shift commas and punctuation!!!!
It is very hard to read these solid blocks of text.

Edit to add: As Dave said, the way out is cementing.

 

[Shark]

And don't rely on AI. It isn't all that intelligent.

(Yggdrasil beat me to it)

 

[Ad8chd]

It appears your on the right track.
But did you neutralize the overused free nitric before smb?
Also while you cook you should just add nitric in small amounts, something to get used to. Just keep adding small amounts ML's until you notice at a point there is no vapor.
Theres a couple ways to neutralize.
Condense down the solution quite a bit (first) then an addition of HCL and you should notice nitric vapors coming out.
Or add sulfamic acid crystals, should not take much. Sulfamic crystals can be purchased at Home Depot I believe.

Thanks for the reply. No, I didn’t neutralize before. Or after…
I really doubt I’m anywhere near the right track, because my last move was to get mad and dump it all in one bottle, so now there’s sulfuric acid in the mix, and I’ve no clue how much of anything is in there.
What kind of product is sulfamic acid? They look at me funny when I ask at the store… here is the pic that was supposed to be in the post, this forum and my phone aren’t really getting along…

 

[adam mizer]

Interesting.
This looks like a drop but not SMB drop.
You need more reading and study.

Get some stannous for testing.
Search.... you will find tin dissolved in HCL at some ratio.
I have nice small tin shot, I just add some tin shot to hcl. Small amount and it takes a couple hours to dissolve.
Most likely I use too much but it works very well.

Study and do some research.
I mentioned Home Depot has the sulfamic acid crystals. Can't remember but it maybe a cleaning product.

• Removes rust, mineral deposits, grout and mortar haze
• Soluble powder mix
• Suitable for quarry, slate, granite, ceramic and porcelain

 

[Shark]

Sulfamic acid is a tile and grout cleaner that can be found at Lowe's or Home Depot if your in the U.S.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Interesting.
This looks like a drop but not SMB drop.
You need more reading and study.

Get some stannous for testing.
Search.... you will find tin dissolved in HCL at some ratio.
I have nice small tin shot, I just add some tin shot to hcl. Small amount and it takes a couple hours to dissolve.
Most likely I use too much but it works very well.

Study and do some research.
I mentioned Home Depot has the sulfamic acid crystals. Can't remember but it maybe a cleaning product.

• Removes rust, mineral deposits, grout and mortar haze
• Soluble powder mix
• Suitable for quarry, slate, granite, ceramic and porcelain

It is used as grout cleaner

 

[Yggdrasil]

Thanks for the reply. No, I didn’t neutralize before. Or after…
I really doubt I’m anywhere near the right track, because my last move was to get mad and dump it all in one bottle, so now there’s sulfuric acid in the mix, and I’ve no clue how much of anything is in there.
What kind of product is sulfamic acid? They look at me funny when I ask at the store… View attachment 64148here is the pic that was supposed to be in the post, this forum and my phone aren’t really getting along…

What is your feed stock?

 

[adam mizer]

Can you also show a picture of the solution in the sulfuric acid.
You can cement it out as FrugalRefiner stated above in a post, however even before you make such a nice embodiment as Frugal you could use copper or zinc and even others.

Check the reactivity charts and see if you have other highly reactive metal on hand and start adding in slowly.
You don't want some intense reaction out of control so add reactive metal in pieces at a time.
Keep doing this and soon you will see your metals less reactive will start to cement out.
Complete this cementing process.
And test with stannous.

Filter and wash.
Save all waste in a bucket as you will have to process the waste. Check waste tutorials. Also you can check if your area can collect this waste at no expense to you. Some areas have a drop off.

Then you are ready to start all over again with AR and test stannous and now you know just to drip in nitric a few mils at a time. Before you drop you can neutralize the nitric.
However with method of few mils nitric at a time you will find you will be able to go straight to SMB and get a good drop.
Test the solution again with stannous to make sure the gold has all dropped out.

 

[Ad8chd]

What is your feed stock?

My buddies got an old mine on a chunk of land he just got, and there’s like 6 or 8 abandoned ones on the same hill

 

[Yggdrasil]

My buddies got an old mine on a chunk of land he just got, and there’s like 6 or 8 abandoned ones on the same hill

That do not help much.
But what you are saying is that your material for this AR attempt was placer Gold?

 

[Ad8chd]

Can you also show a picture of the solution in the sulfuric acid.
You can cement it out as FrugalRefiner stated above in a post, however even before you make such a nice embodiment as Frugal you could use copper or zinc and even others.

Check the reactivity charts and see if you have other highly reactive metal on hand and start adding in slowly.
You don't want some intense reaction out of control so add reactive metal in pieces at a time.
Keep doing this and soon you will see your metals less reactive will start to cement out.
Complete this cementing process.
And test with stannous.

Filter and wash.
Save all waste in a bucket as you will have to process the waste. Check waste tutorials. Also you can check if your area can collect this waste at no expense to you. Some areas have a drop off.

Then you are ready to start all over again with AR and test stannous and now you know just to drip in nitric a few mils at a time. Before you drop you can neutralize the nitric.
However with method of few mils nitric at a time you will find you will be able to go straight to SMB and get a good drop.
Test the solution again with stannous to make sure the gold has all dropped out.

Hell yeah, thanks man, what are you guys meaning when you say cement? I feel like I’ve seen it already used like two or three different ways.

I understand the chemistry between the nitric and hydrochloric acid and then the gold, I kind of get it anyway I don’t like know the math or nothing but I understand what’s happening on a broad scale.

and I understand that SMB is to reduce gold ions back to where they belong, what am I looking at with the sulfonic acid? What’s the end game with that? And then you’re talking about toss another piece of metal in with it like I got a whole bunch of copper, that’ll help get rid of the acid or something?I’m just trying to wrap my brain on this

 

[Ad8chd]

That do not help much.
But what you are saying is that your material for this AR attempt was placer Goldim

In in California, in the sierras. Gold country.

And I don’t even really understand completely what exactly is placer gold, this stuff came out of a bunch of rocks that I brought from underground, quartz and surrounding mineralized rock

 

[Yggdrasil]

Hell yeah, thanks man, what are you guys meaning when you say cement? I feel like I’ve seen it already used like two or three different ways.

I understand the chemistry between the nitric and hydrochloric acid and then the gold, I kind of get it anyway I don’t like know the math or nothing but I understand what’s happening on a broad scale.

and I understand that SMB is to reduce gold ions back to where they belong, what am I looking at with the sulfonic acid? What’s the end game with that? And then you’re talking about toss another piece of metal in with it like I got a whole bunch of copper, that’ll help get rid of the acid or something?I’m just trying to wrap my brain on this

Not all natural Gold, ie placer Gold, is possible to dissolve in AR.
If it has too much Silver the Silver Chloride will stop the rest from dissolving.
Sulfamic Acid id to decompose the Nitric and the NOx formed by AR.
Neutralizing is incorrect as in chemical terms that means to bring something to a pH of 7 which is Neutral pH.
Cementing is to add a slab of metal more reactive then the metals you want to cement.
Like Copper which will only cement out the precious metals plus Mercury if it is there.
Zinc or Aluminum can be used but will drop all metals so it will not improve much

 

[Yggdrasil]

In in California, in the sierras. Gold country.

And I don’t even really understand completely what exactly is placer gold, this stuff came out of a bunch of rocks that I brought from underground, quartz and surrounding mineralized rock

Placer Gold is the nuggets found in rivers and streams or other places on the loose.
Well then I will urge you to stop now.
Then go and get a proper assay.
No one uses AR on ore, if they plan to live long at least.
It is down right dangerous and way too expensive.

Now, go get an assay.

 

[Yggdrasil]

In in California, in the sierras. Gold country.

And I don’t even really understand completely what exactly is placer gold, this stuff came out of a bunch of rocks that I brought from underground, quartz and surrounding mineralized rock

And study this please:
We ask our new members to do 3 things.
1. Read C.M. Hokes book on refining jewelers scrap, it gives an easy introduction to the most important chemistry regarding refining.
It is free here on the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=19798
2. Then read the safety section of the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/forums/safety.47/
3. And then read about "Dealing with waste" in the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/dealing-with-waste.10539/

Suggested reading:
https://goldrefiningforum.com/forums/the-library.101/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/when-in-doubt-cement-it-out.30236/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threa...le-read-this-before-you-post-about-ore.33333/


Forum rules is here.
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/gold-refining-forum-rules.31182/

 

[Ad8chd]

Interesting.
This looks like a drop but not SMB drop.
You need more reading and study.

Get some stannous for testing.
Search.... you will find tin dissolved in HCL at some ratio.
I have nice small tin shot, I just add some tin shot to hcl. Small amount and it takes a couple hours to dissolve.
Most likely I use too much but it works very well.

Study and do some research.
I mentioned Home Depot has the sulfamic acid crystals. Can't remember but it maybe a cleaning product.

• Removes rust, mineral deposits, grout and mortar haze
• Soluble powder mix
• Suitable for quarry, slate, granite, ceramic and porcelain

Thanks, I appreciate you taking the time to help me out. Couple quick questions.
You said it looks like a drop but not a SMB drop? Could you Explain it to me like I’m five years old please? I’m assuming when you guys say drop, you mean precipitation?
Is Stannous tin & HCL?

And study this please:
We ask our new members to do 3 things.
1. Read C.M. Hokes book on refining jewelers scrap, it gives an easy introduction to the most important chemistry regarding refining.
It is free here on the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=19798
2. Then read the safety section of the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/forums/safety.47/
3. And then read about "Dealing with waste" in the forum: https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/dealing-with-waste.10539/

Suggested reading:
https://goldrefiningforum.com/forums/the-library.101/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/when-in-doubt-cement-it-out.30236/
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threa...le-read-this-before-you-post-about-ore.33333/


Forum rules is here.
https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/gold-refining-forum-rules.31182/

awesome thank you very much, I’ll head over for some of our reading reading. right now. The majority of the material that I use like I had a bunch of heavies from panning it out or whatever but I read something that gold can come in pyrite which I didn’t know that, and I kept tossing all my pie right out because my buddy and his buddy were making fun of me for keeping it called me a fool cause it’s fools goal or whatever but like some of the chunks just seem way heavier than the rest of them and like they kept ended up in the bottom of my hand, so I’m like what the hell man it’s shiny and shit. I’m gonna keep it you know more than way more than what it took to make them a little blobs of gold stuff or whatever if that’s what it was…