Wanted Looking for a tilting gas melting furnace used

[Calvin Mysinger]

Greetings. First time poster here.
Does anyone know of a good place to buy a good used natural gas remotely controlled tipping metal melting furnace? We are looking for a furnace:
1) That we can control the pour from a safe distance,
2) that will melt 50-80lbs of impure gold and silver, per batch- (a #16 or #20 size crucible?),
3) one that tips and pours, either by electric motor or hydraulic remotely, and
4) sits high enough to pour molten metal directly into a 42" tall water shot barrel, and
5) is priced under $30,000.

All the gas furnaces we've seen are much larger and far more money, - or - they sit flat on the floor and you have to either hand-crank them to pour- or -hand-lift the full hot crucible out in order to pour.
*We can't use an electric furnace as we are smelting contaminated impure gold and silver. Anyone?
Thanking you in advance, Calvin

 

[Yggdrasil]

Greetings. First time poster here.
Does anyone know of a good place to buy a good used natural gas tipping metal melting furnace? I am looking for something that will melt 50-60lbs of 80%-92.5% pure silver per batch- (a #16 or #20 size crucible?), that tips and pours, either by electric motor or hydraulic, and sits high enough to pour molten metal directly into a 42" tall water shot barrel, priced under $30,000. All of the ones I've seen are much larger and far out of our budget, - or they sit flat on the floor and you have to hand crank them and hand lift the full crucible out to pour. Anyone? Thanks! Calvin

I will delete your other post as we do not allow double postings in this forum.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Greetings. First time poster here.
Does anyone know of a good place to buy a good used natural gas tipping metal melting furnace? I am looking for something that will melt 50-60lbs of 80%-92.5% pure silver per batch- (a #16 or #20 size crucible?), that tips and pours, either by electric motor or hydraulic, and sits high enough to pour molten metal directly into a 42" tall water shot barrel, priced under $30,000. All of the ones I've seen are much larger and far out of our budget, - or they sit flat on the floor and you have to hand crank them and hand lift the full crucible out to pour. Anyone? Thanks! Calvin

Welcome to us by the way.

Here is something to read including the forum rules

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Suggested reading: The Library

https://goldrefiningforum.com/threads/gold-refining-forum-rules.31182/
Edit for spelling

 

[4metals]

These crucible furnaces are gas and reasonable.
https://www.johnsongas.com/crucible-furnaces/These crucible furnaces will require 2 men to pour. to lift the crucible and put it in a pouring cradle. Actually quite doable for the size you are looking at.

And if you want electric vcella kilns has a TL16 that is about the right size. They are electric resistance heat so from cold it takes about 2 hours to heat up. But they are affordable.
http://www.vcella-kilns.com/products.html

 

[snoman701]

And note, the 2 hours that 4metals quotes is just for the kiln to heat up, not 60-70 lbs of silver.

At one time many years ago, Lou had one that was extra to his needs....but he's also cleaned house since then and may have gotten rid of it. Send him a private message on the forum.

 

[4metals]

I have clients who had a need to melt about 800 oz of Silver at a time, their first choice would be an induction furnace, quick heat up and low melt time. But the $30,000 price tag made them reconsider.
Also if you have to pay a tech to come diagnose and repair an Inductotherm furnace, be prepared for sticker shock.

These vncella products are easily re-buildable and basically bullet proof, yes they takes 2 hours to get hot but once hot they will melt that charge in 30-45 minutes. So they turn it on with a timer so it's hot when they arrive. They can and do melt 5 or 6 melts a day and have been for some time.

It all comes down to how much you have to melt and how often and how much you have to spend. But the best decisions are made when you consider all of the options.

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

These crucible furnaces are gas and reasonable.
https://www.johnsongas.com/crucible-furnaces/These crucible furnaces will require 2 men to pour. to lift the crucible and put it in a pouring cradle. Actually quite doable for the size you are looking at.

And if you want electric vcella kilns has a TL16 that is about the right size. They are electric resistance heat so from cold it takes about 2 hours to heat up. But they are affordable.
http://www.vcella-kilns.com/products.html

Thanks! But we already have several gas metal melting furnaces, but because our workers cannot pour a melt from a safe distance, and instead two workers have to remove the 2500 degree, 77 pound crucible from the furnace in order to pour it, our Workmans Comp liability insurance runs us an extra $10,450 per year - (and gets higher every year). The insurance savings will go a long way to pay for a remotely operated furnace where we can control the pour from 15 - 20 feet away and it should also greatly lessen the risk to our workers. *We are smelting impure silver and gold so electric furnaces are not an option for us.
I do, however, appreciate your contribution just the same. Calvin

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

I have clients who had a need to melt about 800 oz of Silver at a time, their first choice would be an induction furnace, quick heat up and low melt time. But the $30,000 price tag made them reconsider.
Also if you have to pay a tech to come diagnose and repair an Inductotherm furnace, be prepared for sticker shock.

These vncella products are easily re-buildable and basically bullet proof, yes they takes 2 hours to get hot but once hot they will melt that charge in 30-45 minutes. So they turn it on with a timer so it's hot when they arrive. They can and do melt 5 or 6 melts a day and have been for some time.

It all comes down to how much you have to melt and how often and how much you have to spend. But the best decisions are made when you consider all of the options.

Thanks, but we smelt impure gold and silver so an electric furnace won't do. Thank you for your time. Calvin

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

I will delete your other post as we do not allow double postings in this forum.

Sorry, I won't do that again. Calvin

 

[snoman701]

How often are you making the melt?

 

[4metals]

We are smelting impure silver and gold so electric furnaces are not an option for us.

You also mention 2500° temperature requirement. Gold only needs 1950° to melt and most of its alloys less. And Silver even lower. Not that I’m hung up on electric furnaces and they only get to 2300°, but they do melt gold and silver very effectively and the larger models employ a crank to pour the tilt, which could easily be replaced with an electric winch for remote operation.

If all you are doing is making shot why do you need 2500°?

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

You also mention 2500° temperature requirement. Gold only needs 1950° to melt and most of its alloys less. And Silver even lower. Not that I’m hung up on electric furnaces and they only get to 2300°, but they do melt gold and silver very effectively and the larger models employ a crank to pour the tilt, which could easily be replaced with an electric winch for remote operation.

I work for a precious metals smelter and refiner and oversee the smelting department. We often smelt impure, dirty mixed metals and it requires at least 2500 degrees to slag off contaminants which often contain magnetics. We have several much larger Baker T-225 and T-460 hydraulic tip and pour gas furnaces for large jobs and many induction furnaces for pure metals but are looking for a smaller gas fired one for small jobs. Thanks!

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

How often are you making the melt?

We typically run 16 pours per 8hr shift x 6 days/wk . The smelting jobs run much longer but once the furnaces are hot we can pour solid metals pretty quickly. Thanks!

 

[4metals]

McEngvan makes a center pour tilting furnace but gas furnaces claim a max temp of 2400°. If I remember the smallest tilting mifco furnace is smaller than a #20 (possibly a 16?) and then it jumps to a #30. And from there they get much larger.

We have some interesting threads on the forum on smelting and fluxing that you may enjoy.

Welcome to the forum.

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

McEngvan makes a center pour tilting furnace but gas furnaces claim a max temp of 2400°. If I remember the smallest tilting mifco furnace is smaller than a #20 (possibly a 16?) and then it jumps to a #30. And from there they get much larger.

We have some interesting threads on the forum on smelting and fluxing that you may enjoy.

Welcome to the forum.

Thank you so much. I'll give them a call in the morning. I appreciate your help. Calvin

 

[snoman701]

If you are running that many per day, you need to get induction as it will speed up your melt time considerably and increase your throughput.

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

If you are running that many per day, you need to get induction as it will speed up your melt time considerably and increase your throughput.

Thanks! We have numerous induction furnaces already but we can't use those for smelting. We use our electric furnaces to melt solid dirt-free and iron-free metals. We use gas furnaces to smelt contaminated material but all of our gas furnaces are far too large for small jobs, of which we get a lot of. Right now, all of our small gas furnaces do not tip and pour remotely from a safe distance and require two men in fire suits to remove the hot crucible in order to pour. Our insurance company is insisting that we do away with all furnaces that cannot be operated from a safe distance like our big furnaces that have the tipping controls 30 feet away. Thanks again, Calvin

 

[4metals]

Calvin,

I completely agree with using gas for smelting. I used one of these for years smelting smaller jobs


And after many spills and re-builds (re-linings) it still works well. An induction furnace, lasting after all of the flux splashing and spills that this gas furnace survived, would not be able to claim the same thing.

 

[Calvin Mysinger]

Calvin,

I completely agree with using gas for smelting. I used one of these for years smelting smaller jobs
View attachment 61129

And after many spills and re-builds (re-linings) it still works well. An induction furnace, lasting after all of the flux splashing and spills that this gas furnace survived, would not be able to claim the same thing.

Yes, that looks about the right size. What brand is it? I wonder if they make them with remote controls so you can tip it from a distance? Our Workman's Comp insurance underwriter is insisting that we do away with all our furnaces that require workers pouring melts to be within 'harms way'. Our big furnaces have 30'+ long hydraulic lines with the tipping joysticks on a stand. They are just too big for small jobs. One this size would be perfect. Thanks! Calvin

 

[4metals]

Yes, that looks about the right size. What brand is it? I wonder if they make them with remote controls so you can tip it from a distance?.

That is a MIFCO McEngelvan. The crank is on the right side but I am sure you could either add a remote controlled drive to crank for you from a distance or possibly MIFCO can supply it that way.

The crank is on the side so while it is warm there I never experienced the fear that your insurance underwriters surely have. I hope they understand you will still have to walk up to a hot furnace to open it to add material, flux or an oxygen sparge tube.

I just love getting dressed up in the tin man heat suits!