Should be 'unfilterable' , but 'unfiltrable' is close enough.g_axelsson said:
You use the apostrophe ( ' ) correctly, while many natural English speakers do not, so please do not feel too bad
My results of specific types of IC chips, flatpacks and BGA
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You use the apostrophe ( ' ) correctly, while many natural English speakers do not, so please do not feel too bad
Tzoax
Well-known member
I just started to prepare material for next simmer HCl boiling and as soon as i added fresh (20%) HCl the solution colored green like in the picture in matter of seconds.
Since there was lot of copper in material (mostly from copper wires attached to solder balls), green color of solution should be copper (II) chloride. After incineration copper oxide turned into copper (II) chloride almost instantly after addition of fresh HCl. So i was thinking that since there is already formed copper (II) chloride solution, i could just give it some time to most of the copper goes into solution, just like regular copper (II) chloride procedure. I am not in hurry, i just want to make this test without mistakes. I will give it one week with occasional stirring, then i will filter the material, incinerate and weight it.
Since there was lot of copper in material (mostly from copper wires attached to solder balls), green color of solution should be copper (II) chloride. After incineration copper oxide turned into copper (II) chloride almost instantly after addition of fresh HCl. So i was thinking that since there is already formed copper (II) chloride solution, i could just give it some time to most of the copper goes into solution, just like regular copper (II) chloride procedure. I am not in hurry, i just want to make this test without mistakes. I will give it one week with occasional stirring, then i will filter the material, incinerate and weight it.
Tzoax
Well-known member
Closer look.
richard2013
Well-known member
Tzoax,
Add air
Add air
Tzoax
Well-known member
Thank you Richard, i added some air. This is results after one week in A/P:
The material is lighter by 9.3%.
This time i didn't incinerated the material, i decanted the solution, washed with water, and decanted it again. Then i dried the material.
And this is list of weight reduced after each step:
43.6% -weight reduced after first treatment (HCl simmer boiling/incineration)
14.6% -weight reduced after second treatment (HCl simmer boiling/incineration)
9.3% -weight reduced after third treatment (1 week in A/P /dried)
32.5 -remaining material
I am considering to bring this test to the end today, to process it with AR. After these 3 treatments the majority of tin and other base metals should be removed.
But on the other hand...there is about 1/3 of starting material left, i am afraid that there is still much of tin left that could cause problems later in AR.
What do you suggest?
The material is lighter by 9.3%.
This time i didn't incinerated the material, i decanted the solution, washed with water, and decanted it again. Then i dried the material.
And this is list of weight reduced after each step:
43.6% -weight reduced after first treatment (HCl simmer boiling/incineration)
14.6% -weight reduced after second treatment (HCl simmer boiling/incineration)
9.3% -weight reduced after third treatment (1 week in A/P /dried)
32.5 -remaining material
I am considering to bring this test to the end today, to process it with AR. After these 3 treatments the majority of tin and other base metals should be removed.
But on the other hand...there is about 1/3 of starting material left, i am afraid that there is still much of tin left that could cause problems later in AR.
What do you suggest?
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i think I would take a small small sample and and some plain nitric to it... if there is any tin left, you will know pretty quick... if it dissolves the sample, the resulting colors should give you a decent clue as to what is left.
Another idea is to run a couple of hot water boils to remove and lead chloride... I was working on this same problem and that seemed to remove a decent amount of material. I have since put this project on the back shelf since I had a bunch of personal matters to attend to and havent had much free time.
Another idea is to run a couple of hot water boils to remove and lead chloride... I was working on this same problem and that seemed to remove a decent amount of material. I have since put this project on the back shelf since I had a bunch of personal matters to attend to and havent had much free time.
patnor1011
Well-known member
If you still do have 1/3rd of starting material then most of it is simply tin. You started with something containing over 90% of tin therefore unless you get to less than 10% then majority of what you do have there will always be just tin.
richard2013
Well-known member
Tzoax if the area you are into will allow you to smelting, that's the fastest way, considering the acid spent of removing tin, that we can compare to the smelting lost if reasonable.
After oxidizing Tin and lead in smelting and use silver as collector, you can proceed with the inquartation, and recover silver lastly.
After oxidizing Tin and lead in smelting and use silver as collector, you can proceed with the inquartation, and recover silver lastly.
Tzoax
Well-known member
Thank you all for help and good advices. I just want to let you know that I am bringing this test to the end and everything is fine. I have a nice yellow gold chloride solution. There is no trace of green(blue) color of copper II chloride in solution. Also, there was no problem with filtering. I still have a very little of silver chloride white cloud in it, I will leave it to settle and decant it. I took a pictures and I will post them in the morning. Then I will drop the gold powder, wash it and weight it. So, tomorrow I will have results.
Alex
Alex
Tzoax
Well-known member
Processing with AR:
Residue:
I am waiting silver chloride to settle.
Today i will have results.
Residue:
I am waiting silver chloride to settle.
Today i will have results.
kernels
Well-known member
Looking forward very much to hearing your results
Tzoax
Well-known member
Me too Hein. I just started to drop gold. Everything is fine. I will give it some time to settle, then i will wash it and weight it. This is a bottom view picture after one minute after adding SMB.kernels said:
One minute old gold, that's fresh.
Seems like the incineration turned the tin into something easier to filter. No need to add too much time and chemicals to dissolve everything when you can filter it off instead.
Göran
Seems like the incineration turned the tin into something easier to filter. No need to add too much time and chemicals to dissolve everything when you can filter it off instead.
Göran
Tzoax
Well-known member
g_axelsson said:One minute old gold, that's fresh.
Seems like the incineration turned the tin into something easier to filter. No need to add too much time and chemicals to dissolve everything when you can filter it off instead.
Göran
Yes, next time i will keep that on mind. And i was surprised how fast gold dropped and how clean it was.
Phew...i'm done.
I will weight it and i will post result. But first i must to rest a bit, this is most interesting part so give me some time to enjoy in it, i will take some coffee.
First of all i am satisfied i managed to get the gold out of this type of material without troubles. I think i will save this little ones from now on, i like how this gold looks. For this test i used 133.6g of solder balls and all the gold in the picture is from that......i will continue with details and results after break.
Alex
Tzoax
Well-known member
This is result:
Out of 133.6g of solder balls i refined 0.19g of gold.
That means there is about 1.42g for one kilogram of solder balls.
And to add that this was my first time processing it, i was replacing this material a lot of times from one jar to incineration pan and so on... so i am sure i lost some of the gold in this long way of processing it. Also, when i put gold powder on the scales a few drops of gold powder found its way outside of scales (it could be seen on the picture). So, i could say there should be more gold than this.
So, i will surely save solder balls from now on. I think it's great source of gold and the yield is not bad.
Thank you all for great advices and help.
Alex
Out of 133.6g of solder balls i refined 0.19g of gold.
That means there is about 1.42g for one kilogram of solder balls.
And to add that this was my first time processing it, i was replacing this material a lot of times from one jar to incineration pan and so on... so i am sure i lost some of the gold in this long way of processing it. Also, when i put gold powder on the scales a few drops of gold powder found its way outside of scales (it could be seen on the picture). So, i could say there should be more gold than this.
So, i will surely save solder balls from now on. I think it's great source of gold and the yield is not bad.
Thank you all for great advices and help.
Alex
patnor1011
Well-known member
Sample I got xrayed was 2,2g/kg but that was just tin balls not a piece of copper traces. All melted together. I still have quite a lot of it. :wink:
Topher_osAUrus
Well-known member
g_axelsson said:
I can't say I know what it turns the tin in to, but I can attest that it is much better to filter.
With all the metastannic trapped foils I had, a good incineration and a few (plus+) HCl leaches, there still ended up being gray sludge at the bottom of the beaker. Further leaches of HCl did nothing to reduce the volume. The first batch I did, I went to AR with the grey sludge after 5 or 6 hcl leaches, all of the gold easily dissolved, and it seemed the sludge was in no way effected and remained on the bottom of the beaker.
With the batch that I am doing now, I am about at the point of being finished with HCl.(hopefully...) This time though, I was going to try a hot sulfuric leach on a small sample to see if I could remove more of the sludge pre AR, just because I believe it would be better to have no sludge at all. Even though the remainder gave me no troubles on the previous run.
It took several rinses of said sludge to get the rinses clear. But, now I am fairly confident that little to no gold remains trapped in the sludge itself.
Excellent work Alex. It takes a patient man to recover gold from such a mess!
So I'm late to the party....but I've been watching.
If you add lead chloride to molten lead it will force oxidation of all of the tin, leaving you with just lead, and I'd assume gold.
Impressive either way! Good job!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
If you add lead chloride to molten lead it will force oxidation of all of the tin, leaving you with just lead, and I'd assume gold.
Impressive either way! Good job!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Tzoax
Well-known member
Thank you all for support.
Considering all of the facts, i think i will repeat this test with changing some of the things.
This first test was primary aimed for me to personally make sure there is gold, to calculate is it worth recovering and will i be able to process it.
So, i saw with my own eyes there is gold, that yield is above 1g of gold per kilogram and even if it took me much of time i successfully recovered it at the end.
Now, i started to prepare solder balls for next test. I have lots of bare laptop boards, motherboards, graphics, RAMs etc that still have some of the solder balls still soldered on them (on the places where was BGA chips). I also have flip chips, and small BGA chips of all kind, i am using little knife for taking them off, it took me about few seconds to take off solder balls from one of the BGA chip/place on board where it was soldered.
And now since i am familiar with the process, i will process it much quicker and cleaner than first time. I learned a few things from this test and i know how to make another to be a better one - hopefully with better yields at the end.
Alex
Considering all of the facts, i think i will repeat this test with changing some of the things.
This first test was primary aimed for me to personally make sure there is gold, to calculate is it worth recovering and will i be able to process it.
So, i saw with my own eyes there is gold, that yield is above 1g of gold per kilogram and even if it took me much of time i successfully recovered it at the end.
Now, i started to prepare solder balls for next test. I have lots of bare laptop boards, motherboards, graphics, RAMs etc that still have some of the solder balls still soldered on them (on the places where was BGA chips). I also have flip chips, and small BGA chips of all kind, i am using little knife for taking them off, it took me about few seconds to take off solder balls from one of the BGA chip/place on board where it was soldered.
And now since i am familiar with the process, i will process it much quicker and cleaner than first time. I learned a few things from this test and i know how to make another to be a better one - hopefully with better yields at the end.
Alex
patnor1011
Well-known member
Heat gun or hot sand bath will be much faster solution to recover tin than a knife. I was doing it with knife first too but after some time I moved to heat as I needed to scale up and make it all faster. Knife is ok for few pieces but your hands will be falling off after few hundreds and "production" will go down fast.
